American held hostage by al Qaeda appeals to Obama... (1 Viewer)

[Jules Winnfield]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Me, based on the information available to me at the moment.

So what would it take for you to want to get a US POW released by the Taliban under these terms? I am letting you create your own hypothetical and add the necessary information you think is missing in this case.

What POW?

 

[Todd Andrews]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

 

[MaxThreshold]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

 

[Todd Andrews]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Would have you have done the deal, MaxKooK, or would you have left him with the Taliban?

 

[MaxThreshold]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

 

[timschochet]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

 

[jon_mx]

It just took two idiots and a small boat to kill 17 sailors on the USS Cole.

 

[MaxThreshold]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Would have you have done the deal, MaxKooK, or would you have left him with the Taliban?

Not sure what you're getting at, Todd. It's pretty easy to figure out who isn't for this deal - EVERYONE vs you and Tim.

 

[Todd Andrews]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

So we take the emotions of the families of dead US soldiers into account when determining whether to negotiate the release of a US POW when we dont like that POW or what he believes or think he deserted? Did I characterize your position correctly?

 

[Soonerman]

It just took two idiots and a small boat to kill 17 sailors on the USS Cole.

But they don't even have small boats any more. I have it on great authority that their infrastructure has been destroyed.

 

[MaxThreshold]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

So we take the emotions of the families of dead US soldiers into account when determining whether to negotiate the release of a US POW when we dont like that POW or what he believes or think he deserted? Did I characterize your position correctly?

but he's not a POW. He's a deserter. He went LOOKING for the Taliban.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

I believe the soldiers that served with him and not you. You have such a hard on for Obama and your Taliban brothers and sisters

 

[Todd Andrews]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Would have you have done the deal, MaxKooK, or would you have left him with the Taliban?

Not sure what you're getting at, Todd. It's pretty easy to figure out who isn't for this deal - EVERYONE vs you and Tim.

That isnt true at all. And I just want you on the record in favor of leaving US soldiers in Taliban captivity.

 

[MaxThreshold]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Would have you have done the deal, MaxKooK, or would you have left him with the Taliban?

Not sure what you're getting at, Todd. It's pretty easy to figure out who isn't for this deal - EVERYONE vs you and Tim.

That isnt true at all. And I just want you on the record in favor of leaving US soldiers in Taliban captivity.

What US Soldiers are/were in Taliban captivity?

 

[jon_mx]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

What don't we know? We may not be 100 percent certain he was a deserter, but the facts seem to strongly suggested it. What we do know is the most transparent Administration in the history of the world knows the facts, but are intentionally avoiding that discussion.

 

[timschochet]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

Max, you and others keep bringing this up. I understand your anger that 6 soldiers died, especially if it turns out that this guy did indeed desert from his post. But I dont see how it has any bearing on the trade, whether the soldier deserted or not, he was still a POW. Its one thing to believe that we traded too much of value to get him back; I disagree. But you seem to be arguing that, because he deserted and 6 other guys died, we just should have left him to rot. Is that really your position?

 

[Jules Winnfield]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

 

[timschochet]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

 

[Todd Andrews]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

 

[MaxThreshold]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

Max, you and others keep bringing this up. I understand your anger that 6 soldiers died, especially if it turns out that this guy did indeed desert from his post. But I dont see how it has any bearing on the trade, whether the soldier deserted or not, he was still a POW. Its one thing to believe that we traded too much of value to get him back; I disagree. But you seem to be arguing that, because he deserted and 6 other guys died, we just should have left him to rot. Is that really your position?

That's where the disconnect is with you and Todd. I'm saying that He WASN'T a US Soldier the moment he walked off base looking for the Taliban.

 

[Todd Andrews]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

What don't we know? We may not be 100 percent certain he was a deserter, but the facts seem to strongly suggested it. What we do know is the most transparent Administration in the history of the world knows the facts, but are intentionally avoiding that discussion.

Exactly. So are you in favor of the deal or not?

 

[MaxThreshold]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

I just want to get you on record that you're a Taliban sympathizer. Let's affirm that right here, right now. Just say it.

 

[timschochet]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

Max, you and others keep bringing this up. I understand your anger that 6 soldiers died, especially if it turns out that this guy did indeed desert from his post. But I dont see how it has any bearing on the trade, whether the soldier deserted or not, he was still a POW. Its one thing to believe that we traded too much of value to get him back; I disagree. But you seem to be arguing that, because he deserted and 6 other guys died, we just should have left him to rot. Is that really your position?

That's where the disconnect is with you and Todd. I'm saying that He WASN'T a US Soldier the moment he walked off base looking for the Taliban.

Ah. Well then I disagree with you. So does the Army.

 

[Mister Martie]

This thread is a complete trainwreck.

 

[jon_mx]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

What don't we know? We may not be 100 percent certain he was a deserter, but the facts seem to strongly suggested it. What we do know is the most transparent Administration in the history of the world knows the facts, but are intentionally avoiding that discussion.

Exactly. So are you in favor of the deal or not?

Not given the facts we have at hand. This guy is potentially a trader.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

Kook? What color turban do you wear? And I answered the question up above. No, we shouldn't have gone after him. He left the grounds as a deserter. He is the LAST thing we haul out when/if we leave Afghanistan

 

[MaxThreshold]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

What don't we know? We may not be 100 percent certain he was a deserter, but the facts seem to strongly suggested it. What we do know is the most transparent Administration in the history of the world knows the facts, but are intentionally avoiding that discussion.

Exactly. So are you in favor of the deal or not?

Not given the facts we have at hand. This guy is potentially a trader.

What kind of trader? Spice? Rugs? Widgets?

 

[Todd Andrews]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

In this case, yes, since he deserted. But let's talk about your undying devotion to Obama that's making you overlook these dead soldiers. These dead soldiers that died LOOKING FOR HIM.

Let's talk about that.

Max, you and others keep bringing this up. I understand your anger that 6 soldiers died, especially if it turns out that this guy did indeed desert from his post. But I dont see how it has any bearing on the trade, whether the soldier deserted or not, he was still a POW. Its one thing to believe that we traded too much of value to get him back; I disagree. But you seem to be arguing that, because he deserted and 6 other guys died, we just should have left him to rot. Is that really your position?

That's where the disconnect is with you and Todd. I'm saying that He WASN'T a US Soldier the moment he walked off base looking for the Taliban.

While I think it is very possible, maybe even likely, that he deserted, you obviously have irrefutable evidence of that event. Would you please share that with us, the government and the media?

 

[Jules Winnfield]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

And you really just called them dead soldiers?

 

[Pots]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Me, based on the information available to me at the moment.

Agreed.

This.

 

[jon_mx]

The truth is I think I've been pushed into giving an opinion on this issue which is stronger than I intended, based on my almost instinctual resistance to what has been argued on the other side. Can we at least all agree on this point: we haven't been given all the facts yet. Like the Snowden NSA story, this is one of those instances in which what we don't know, yet, may exceed that which we do. This is NOT an argument for conspiracy; just an acknowledgment that the situation is still unfolding. It's probably better in these situations to withhold judgment, but somehow I've never had the wisdom to do so. Though the same can be said for most of my detractors in this thread.

What don't we know? We may not be 100 percent certain he was a deserter, but the facts seem to strongly suggested it. What we do know is the most transparent Administration in the history of the world knows the facts, but are intentionally avoiding that discussion.

Exactly. So are you in favor of the deal or not?

Not given the facts we have at hand. This guy is potentially a trader.

What kind of trader? Spice? Rugs? Widgets?

Trader Joe.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

How many hellbent wackos did it take to fly a jet into tower 1 of the World Trade Center?

I guess it depends on one's definition of "security". Did the terrorists on 9/11 ever pose a security risk for this nation?

 

[Todd Andrews]

So which of you think we shouldnt have done the deal and should leave US POWs with the Taliban?

Them

So the USA should make decisions about US POWs based upon the emotions of the families of dead soldiers?

Really. Just dead soldiers? You are a Taliban sympathizer just like Tim. Both of you just don't like America

You didnt answer my question, KooK.

I just want to get you on record that you're a Taliban sympathizer. Let's affirm that right here, right now. Just say it.

I would have sent 10 million US soldiers to Afghanistan and not stopped til there were no living Taliban/Al Qaeda fighters over the age of 16. You and the other KooKs abandoned the fight against the Taliban and Al Qaeda in Afghanistan to send too few US resources to Iraq with Rumsfeld's "light footprint". I dont really pay much attention to foreign policy arguments from pacifist warlosers like you.

 

[MaxThreshold]

While I think it is very possible, maybe even likely, that he deserted, you obviously have irrefutable evidence of that event. Would you please share that with us, the government and the media?

You apparently have a reading issue - as in not reading what you don't like. This thread is FILLED with links and first-hand accounts of his fellow soldiers. I can't make you read them if it doesn't fit your narrative, but they are there for you to read.

 

[Soonerman]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

 

[Mario Kart]

Something isn't right about this. It just smells.

Bush's presidency, people claimed, was dirty and backhanded. And, you can probably say that about every presidency however this kind of talk surrounded Bush W. and, from what I can recall, not much (there was some) surrounded Clinton. Can't speak for Bush 1 or Reagan as I was too young but this kind of dirty talk or backhandedness happened with Bush.

I'd be quite surprised that in 20+ years when we will know more about Obama's presidency that we don't find out that his White House was much more dirty than Bush. That is saying a lot but many of the moves under Obama have just been wrong. We'll find out Bush was a bit dirty, maybe Chaney moreso, but I think we'll find out Obama was just plain filthy.

 

[MaxThreshold]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

Apparently, he saw a video that inspired him.

 

[Todd Andrews]

While I think it is very possible, maybe even likely, that he deserted, you obviously have irrefutable evidence of that event. Would you please share that with us, the government and the media?

You apparently have a reading issue - as in not reading what you don't like. This thread is FILLED with links and first-hand accounts of his fellow soldiers. I can't make you read them if it doesn't fit your narrative, but they are there for you to read.

Ive read them all and there is a lot of factual gray area. You realize he was promoted in absentia, right? Im not suggesting that means he didnt desert, but we dont know whether he actually deserted, or what actually happened.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

This thread is a complete trainwreck.

I'm not sure I agree or disagree with anything in the thread, even the stuff I wrote.

 

[timschochet]

Max, in every war we've ever fought, there have been deserters. There have been soldiers who have fled their posts and ran from the scene of battle. Many, many of these have been captured by the enemy and have become POWs. From Andersonville to the German Stalags to the Vietnamese camps, our government has NEVER regarded desertion as a reason not to regard a soldier as a POW. It's a crime, and there is strict punishment, but it doesn't abrogate your rights as a member of the American military. To think that we would do so here, in the face of our entire history, is absurd.

 

[jon_mx]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

She is parsing her words. We need the details if what happened that day. The White House knows and is not disclosing.

 

[MaxThreshold]

Max, in every war we've ever fought, there have been deserters. There have been soldiers who have fled their posts and ran from the scene of battle. Many, many of these have been captured by the enemy and have become POWs. From Andersonville to the German Stalags to the Vietnamese camps, our government has NEVER regarded desertion as a reason not to regard a soldier as a POW. It's a crime, and there is strict punishment, but it doesn't abrogate your rights as a member of the American military. To think that we would do so here, in the face of our entire history, is absurd.

We shouldn't be making deals for deserters. He was low priority, if anything. And certainly not worth 5 of the baddest of the bad.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Even if he wasn't a deserter, this is a dubious exchange at best.

The fact that he appears to have been a deserter makes it a potential disaster. If we get hit by the Taliban any time soon, and any of those five guys are involved, that is gonna be a huge black mark on Obama's legacy.

 

[dozer]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Feel better? I wish they were dead. But, you seem to think they’ve been texting around the world like teenagers at a family reunion keeping all their guys in line. They are bad guys. The enemy. I don’t feel good about them at all. But I don’t think these five guys are going to reign down anything new on us.

Glad you got to use your caps lock key though.

 

[MaxThreshold]

These guys have been kicking around a soccer ball in a caged area the size of my basement for a decade and a half. I doubt they are going to jump back into leadership roles. There are no shortages of evil geniuses.

This is an INCREDIBLY naive statement. You're basically ignoring all previous history with these guys for what? To make yourself feel better?

Feel better? I wish they were dead. But, you seem to think they’ve been texting around the world like teenagers at a family reunion keeping all their guys in line. They are bad guys. The enemy. I don’t feel good about them at all. But I don’t think these five guys are going to reign down anything new on us.

Glad you got to use your caps lock key though.

Dude, these guys don't go into retirement. There is a reason they've been locked up all these years.

 

[flapgreen]

Sounds like a terrible idea.

 

[matuski]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

She is parsing her words. We need the details if what happened that day. The White House knows and is not disclosing.

HE WON'T SHOW US HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHAT IS HE HIDING FROM US?

 

[MaxThreshold]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

She is parsing her words. We need the details if what happened that day. The White House knows and is not disclosing.

HE WON'T SHOW US HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHAT IS HE HIDING FROM US?

Wrong thread. Let's stay focused.

 

[jon_mx]

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

She is parsing her words. We need the details if what happened that day. The White House knows and is not disclosing.

HE WON'T SHOW US HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHAT IS HE HIDING FROM US?

Max, are you suggesting that if a soldier deserts his post, he is no longer to be considered an American and anything that happens to him thereafter is to be ignored?

According to Susan Rice, he served with honor and distinction. I look forward to him getting a medal or something.

She is parsing her words. We need the details if what happened that day. The White House knows and is not disclosing.

HE WON'T SHOW US HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE WHAT IS HE HIDING FROM US?

If you are going to preach transparency, and our government should be transparent, you should not be coy with your answers. Just tell the people the facts and be done with it.

 

[Kal El]

Max, in every war we've ever fought, there have been deserters. There have been soldiers who have fled their posts and ran from the scene of battle. Many, many of these have been captured by the enemy and have become POWs. From Andersonville to the German Stalags to the Vietnamese camps, our government has NEVER regarded desertion as a reason not to regard a soldier as a POW. It's a crime, and there is strict punishment, but it doesn't abrogate your rights as a member of the American military. To think that we would do so here, in the face of our entire history, is absurd.

I think there's a pretty substantial difference between a soldier who loses whatever courage he might have had and fled in an effort of self-preservation and with what Bergdahl is accused by his compatriots of doing. Again, all we have are the words of his fellow servicemen. But more importantly, 5 dangerous men are once again free to wreak havoc in the region, and don't repeat that their infrastructure is destroyed, because it's evidently not.