Anyone not like Eddie Lacy? (1 Viewer)

[tdmills]

The toe is a HUGE problem.GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

RT @AlbertBreer As for Eddie Lacy, his medicals -- specifically toe surgery & torn pec -- wound up raising concerns w clubs on durability.

The most concerning thing about this, as a Packer fan, is that it means we are heavily relying on the views of our medical staff. And let's face it -- the Packers have a terrible track record the last 4-5 years of players getting injured and missing boatloads of games. Sure, you could write it off to bad luck, but man, some of the injuries linger for longer than anticipated, other guys have injuries that....suddenly become worse than expected or take a different course of treatment weeks, months down the road. I'm too lazy to go back & make a list, but Packer fans should have a similar recollection.

Toe surgery for a RB....just makes me think of former Titans RB Chris Brown. Lots of talent, but dude was constantly hurt and seemed to have turf toe for 4 years straight.

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

RT @AlbertBreer As for Eddie Lacy, his medicals -- specifically toe surgery & torn pec -- wound up raising concerns w clubs on durability.

The most concerning thing about this, as a Packer fan, is that it means we are heavily relying on the views of our medical staff. And let's face it -- the Packers have a terrible track record the last 4-5 years of players getting injured and missing boatloads of games. Sure, you could write it off to bad luck, but man, some of the injuries linger for longer than anticipated, other guys have injuries that....suddenly become worse than expected or take a different course of treatment weeks, months down the road. I'm too lazy to go back & make a list, but Packer fans should have a similar recollection.

Toe surgery for a RB....just makes me think of former Titans RB Chris Brown. Lots of talent, but dude was constantly hurt and seemed to have turf toe for 4 years straight.

good point. mike neal stands out as a prominent miss in this category.

 

[football fan]

The toe is a HUGE problem.GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

As a Packer fan, I have trouble buying the bolded above because Green Bay had nothing at RB last year but a few sleepers, and some RB depth was needed in Green Bay, no matter what RB they chose in the second round. Thompson is all about value and best player available, and then he traded up, and I knew he had a special player in mind. When the pick was Franklin, I was initially surprised, but as I thought about it Franklin was excellent value at that point in the draft, and in today's NFL depth is just common sense, not just a concern for a specific player. If Green Bay wants to be physical and run the ball this year two good RBs make a lot of sense in the real Life NFL.

Don't get me wrong the fused toe is a concern, but the question is, how much of a concern.

Some people appear to have a vested interest in Lacy dropping in their fantasy drafts, where I am just looking for good information.

 

[BlitzPickup]

RT @AlbertBreer As for Eddie Lacy, his medicals -- specifically toe surgery & torn pec -- wound up raising concerns w clubs on durability.

The most concerning thing about this, as a Packer fan, is that it means we are heavily relying on the views of our medical staff. And let's face it -- the Packers have a terrible track record the last 4-5 years of players getting injured and missing boatloads of games. Sure, you could write it off to bad luck, but man, some of the injuries linger for longer than anticipated, other guys have injuries that....suddenly become worse than expected or take a different course of treatment weeks, months down the road. I'm too lazy to go back & make a list, but Packer fans should have a similar recollection.

Toe surgery for a RB....just makes me think of former Titans RB Chris Brown. Lots of talent, but dude was constantly hurt and seemed to have turf toe for 4 years straight.

good point. mike neal stands out as a prominent miss in this category.

Lacy will go down as a bust with injury issues similar to Chris Wells. Franklin is the RB to target late in drafts.

 

[Concept Coop]

The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Should I be selling Lynch? His team drafted Turbin in the fourth last year, and Michael in the 2nd this year. Or AP after Gerhart? There is some concern, sure. But drafting a RB in the 4th, in itself, means next to nothing about the starter.

 

[tdmills]

The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Should I be selling Lynch? His team drafted Turbin in the fourth last year, and Michael in the 2nd this year. Or AP after Gerhart? There is some concern, sure. But drafting a RB in the 4th, in itself, means next to nothing about the starter.

The bolded contradicts itself and please don't pull out one sentence like it was the main part of my post. He fell in the draft and the NFL passed on him in favor of 3 other RBs, which is a concern. His injury history has come out, concern. Drafting a talented RB in the 4th, concern.

 

[Concept Coop]

The bolded contradicts itself and please don't pull out one sentence like it was the main part of my post. He fell in the draft and the NFL passed on him in favor of 3 other RBs, which is a concern. His injury history has come out, concern. Drafting a talented RB in the 4th, concern.

The bolded does not contradict itself. There is concern, but not because they drafted a backup RB in the 4th round. And I was only addressing one part of your post. But I can quote the whole thing next time, if you'd like.

 

[fruity pebbles]

other thing thatt concerns me is even after 3 backs were drafted, the pack still backed into lacy. didnt seem like they were fully sold on him. they traded down when they could have had him at 55. they traded up for franklin. i dont think they see them as 1 and 2. best guy will get the carries

 

[Concept Coop]

other thing thatt concerns me is even after 3 backs were drafted, the pack still backed into lacy. didnt seem like they were fully sold on him. they traded down when they could have had him at 55. they traded up for franklin. i dont think they see them as 1 and 2. best guy will get the carries

The best guy will get carries. But I think they've made it pretty clear who they think that is, at least. The concern with Lacy was medical. If we're concerned, Franklin is going to be a very cheap handcuff.

ETA: I agree that Lacy's draft positions is a concern. I am not in the camp that thinks his situation makes up for his draft spot. You're right - he did fall past a lot of teams who could have used a RB, including the Rams 4 times, and the Packers twice. That's whay GB got a 1st round talent at the end of the 2nd. I just don't think that means Franklin is a threat, unless Lacy is hurt.

 

[MDSkinner]

The bolded contradicts itself and please don't pull out one sentence like it was the main part of my post. He fell in the draft and the NFL passed on him in favor of 3 other RBs, which is a concern. His injury history has come out, concern. Drafting a talented RB in the 4th, concern.

The bolded does not contradict itself. There is concern, but not because they drafted a backup RB in the 4th round. And I was only addressing one part of your post. But I can quote the whole thing next time, if you'd like.

To me, I think the concern is that there is no guarantee that Lacy is the starter at this point. Two pretty talented RB's were drafted, and neither has played a down in the NFL so I would imagine if the 4th rounder shows up and plays well in training camp that he will get some carries in the same way that the 2nd rounder would. To me that is the biggest concern. But I may be completely wrong on this. Maybe it is a given that Lacy is the man from day 1. I just don't see the fact that he was picked 60 spots earlier necessitates that.

 

[Concept Coop]

The bolded contradicts itself and please don't pull out one sentence like it was the main part of my post. He fell in the draft and the NFL passed on him in favor of 3 other RBs, which is a concern. His injury history has come out, concern. Drafting a talented RB in the 4th, concern.

The bolded does not contradict itself. There is concern, but not because they drafted a backup RB in the 4th round. And I was only addressing one part of your post. But I can quote the whole thing next time, if you'd like.

To me, I think the concern is that there is no guarantee that Lacy is the starter at this point. Two pretty talented RB's were drafted, and neither has played a down in the NFL so I would imagine if the 4th rounder shows up and plays well in training camp that he will get some carries in the same way that the 2nd rounder would. To me that is the biggest concern. But I may be completely wrong on this. Maybe it is a given that Lacy is the man from day 1. I just don't see the fact that he was picked 60 spots earlier necessitates that.

I agree, but that is a pretty universal concern for rookies. If I were extremely high on Franklin, I think I'd have more concern. But I think Lacy is the more talented player by a solid margin. I think it comes down to his health and, potentially, work ethic. If Lacy is healthy, I think he's the guy.

 

[football fan]

The toe is a HUGE problem.GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Now days with ACL tears and other similar injuries, can a toe injury by itself be that much of a concern?

What about today's medical technology?

I know a toe injury can be serious, but how often are they serious where a player's career is definitely shorten?

During the NFL draft Mike Mayock stated that Lacy's injury concerns were only border line.

Lacy medical issues were not hidden secrets, so what gives?

There are other players with some questions on their medical. Players who tore ACLs ect,, but do I see an issue of these situations on these forums?

So, I have to wonder the extent of Lacy's toe injury.

 

[tdmills]

The bolded contradicts itself and please don't pull out one sentence like it was the main part of my post. He fell in the draft and the NFL passed on him in favor of 3 other RBs, which is a concern. His injury history has come out, concern. Drafting a talented RB in the 4th, concern.

The bolded does not contradict itself. There is concern, but not because they drafted a backup RB in the 4th round. And I was only addressing one part of your post. But I can quote the whole thing next time, if you'd like.

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

 

[football fan]

other thing thatt concerns me is even after 3 backs were drafted, the pack still backed into lacy. didnt seem like they were fully sold on him. they traded down when they could have had him at 55. they traded up for franklin. i dont think they see them as 1 and 2. best guy will get the carries

Ted Thompson traded down several times during this draft, and he has a history of trading down to gain more picks in past drafts, so what is the concern here?

Green Bay made about ten or eleven picks in this draft, so why is trading up to the fourth round when someone has a bunch of later picks to get a good player in the fourth round a guaranteed concern over a player drafted earlier?

Could it not be possible that Ted traded down just far enough in the second round to get one of his top RB prospects in this draft?

My main point is I just can't see this situation as a guaranteed huge concern for Lacy. A concern yes, but the question is how big of a concern.

 

[Concept Coop]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

 

[tdmills]

The toe is a HUGE problem.

GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Now days with ACL tears and other similar injuries, can a toe injury by itself be that much of a concern?

What about today's medical technology?

I know a toe injury can be serious, but how often are they serious where a player's career is definitely shorten?

During the NFL draft Mike Mayock stated that Lacy's injury concerns were only border line.

Lacy medical issues were not hidden secrets, so what gives?

There are other players with some questions on their medical. Players who tore ACLs ect,, but do I see an issue of these situations on these forums?

So, I have to wonder the extent of Lacy's toe injury.

I agree with technology it shouldn't be the biggest issue. However, the Steelers took him off of their board due to the toe injury http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000165051/article/eddie-lacys-toe-injury-reportedly-turned-off-steelers

 

[humpback]

other thing thatt concerns me is even after 3 backs were drafted, the pack still backed into lacy. didnt seem like they were fully sold on him. they traded down when they could have had him at 55. they traded up for franklin. i dont think they see them as 1 and 2. best guy will get the carries

The best guy will get carries. But I think they've made it pretty clear who they think that is, at least. The concern with Lacy was medical. If we're concerned, Franklin is going to be a very cheap handcuff.

ETA: I agree that Lacy's draft positions is a concern. I am not in the camp that thinks his situation makes up for his draft spot. You're right - he did fall past a lot of teams who could have used a RB, including the Rams 4 times, and the Packers twice. That's whay GB got a 1st round talent at the end of the 2nd. I just don't think that means Franklin is a threat, unless Lacy is hurt.

I don't think he's going to be very cheap myself.

 

[Gawain]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

It's crazy, but the last 4th round backs to have real fantasy impact were Marion Barber and Brandon Jacobs who were both drafted in 2005. It's kinda crazy to think about how high we all get on these rookies, just to have most of them flame out fairly spectacularly.

 

[football fan]

The toe is a HUGE problem.

GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Now days with ACL tears and other similar injuries, can a toe injury by itself be that much of a concern?

What about today's medical technology?

I know a toe injury can be serious, but how often are they serious where a player's career is definitely shorten?

During the NFL draft Mike Mayock stated that Lacy's injury concerns were only border line.

Lacy medical issues were not hidden secrets, so what gives?

There are other players with some questions on their medical. Players who tore ACLs ect,, but do I see an issue of these situations on these forums?

So, I have to wonder the extent of Lacy's toe injury.

I agree with technology it shouldn't be the biggest issue. However, the Steelers took him off of their board due to the toe injury http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000165051/article/eddie-lacys-toe-injury-reportedly-turned-off-steelers

Yea, I read that article when it first came out, and as a Packer homer I know how good a GM Thompson is, so I am not yet writing off Lacy.

In a draft with no star RBs, one or two teams taking a player off their draft board causes a concern, but every teams take players off their draft boards, and in the era of specialization in the NFL, I am fact gathering because I haven't yet written Lacy off as having great ff potential. Now if some facts come out that definitely prove Lacy's situation is bad, then I drop him down.

I am not yet making a position on this discussion yet, I want to hear the whole story.

 

[Concept Coop]

I don't think he's going to be very cheap myself.

I'll be curious to see where he goes. But he's a late 4th round draft pick, to a team who drafted their "three down back", using their own words, the day before. 2nd round rookie pick, at best, in my opinion. But we'll see.

 

[tdmills]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

 

[tdmills]

The toe is a HUGE problem.

GB and Lacy owners may have to wait until 2014

Again, he had the toe problem and then went out and had an exceptional year. How is that a HUGE problem?

It's a problem because it wasn't a one year thing. His toe has been a continual problem every year. In fact, Lacy was only fully healthy the last few games of 2012. Then he got hurt again. The NFL saw a pattern and in turn, drafted other RBs in front of him.

Please don't let the Green and Gold get in the way of rational thinking. This isn't _______ FBG user's opinion, the NFL passed on him for Bernard, Bell, Ball. The Packers drafted another RB in the 4th, it shows that GB had a concern as well.

Now days with ACL tears and other similar injuries, can a toe injury by itself be that much of a concern?

What about today's medical technology?

I know a toe injury can be serious, but how often are they serious where a player's career is definitely shorten?

During the NFL draft Mike Mayock stated that Lacy's injury concerns were only border line.

Lacy medical issues were not hidden secrets, so what gives?

There are other players with some questions on their medical. Players who tore ACLs ect,, but do I see an issue of these situations on these forums?

So, I have to wonder the extent of Lacy's toe injury.

I agree with technology it shouldn't be the biggest issue. However, the Steelers took him off of their board due to the toe injury http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000165051/article/eddie-lacys-toe-injury-reportedly-turned-off-steelers

Yea, I read that article when it first came out, and as a Packer homer I know how good a GM Thompson is, so I am not yet writing off Lacy.

In a draft with no star RBs, one or two teams taking a player off their draft board causes a concern, but every teams take players off their draft boards, and in the era of specialization in the NFL, I am fact gathering because I haven't yet written Lacy off as having great ff potential. Now if some facts come out that definitely prove Lacy's situation is bad, then I drop him down.

I am not yet making a position on this discussion yet, I want to hear the whole story.

I don't disagree. I think from a pure NFL perspective, GB did an amazing job grabbing two guys at a position of need. I personally felt that Starks/Harris were trash. I'd hang onto Alex Green because he wasn't 100% last year.

However, in FF I would now rate Le'veon Bell ahead of Lacy. Due to Bell having no competition.

 

[humpback]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

It's crazy, but the last 4th round backs to have real fantasy impact were Marion Barber and Brandon Jacobs who were both drafted in 2005. It's kinda crazy to think about how high we all get on these rookies, just to have most of them flame out fairly spectacularly.

I agree that most are going to flame out, but you should probably look beyond just the 4th round. The odds certainly aren't good, but plenty of very good fantasy RBs have been drafted in the 4th round or later (or went undrafted).

 

[Concept Coop]

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

Every prospect has a 'cons' section. Despite that, Lacy was called a 1st round talent by some very bright football minds; Pollian, Waldman, McShay, Mayock, Kiper, even the former scout who wrote the article, first alerting us of his pro-day concerns.

I don't understand how a late 4th round pick sounds like competition to anyone. That was my point in replying to you originally. If you disagree, that's fine. We'll see. But the NFL has constantly used 4th round picks on depth, and as the poster above pointed out, the last 4th rounders to matter were both selected in 2005.

 

[tdmills]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

Haha, it sounds like I copied Bloom's article. I promise I didn't!

 

[humpback]

I don't think he's going to be very cheap myself.

I'll be curious to see where he goes. But he's a late 4th round draft pick, to a team who drafted their "three down back", using their own words, the day before. 2nd round rookie pick, at best, in my opinion. But we'll see.

FWIW, the rankings on here have him at #10 (there is one outlier that has him at #3). He'll almost certainly be a 2nd round pick IMO, and depending on where you're drafting, you may have to trade up to get him.

 

[football fan]

"There is some concern, sure." What is the concern then? Some people had Franklin above Lacy in their rankings. It's possible he outplays Lacy, hence concern. Is it a huge concern? No, but it is one. No sense in getting chippy

The concern is draft position. The concern is the fact that RB needy teams passed on him, for, what we were told, and what looked like, lesser options. The concern is health/pro-day.

I just don't think Franklin has anything to do with Lacy's value. Lacy's either good enough and healthy enough, or he's not. Franklin's a backup level player, drafted in the 4th, where backup level players are drafted. I think the Packers drafted him as depth.

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

How does competition guarantee lack of confidence? Don't all NFL use competition to improve players or their player depth? That is an assumption, I am looking for facts.

Fact is despite all of those red flags, Lacy was still considered a top RB prospect in this year's draft.

He is a great swing for the fences player, but he does carry a lot of risk.

 

[Concept Coop]

FWIW, the rankings on here have him at #10 (there is one outlier that has him at #3). He'll almost certainly be a 2nd round pick IMO, and depending on where you're drafting, you may have to trade up to get him.

I'd like to see where his ADP ends up. For me, he's a hard guy to get excited about. I don't think many non-Lacy owners are going to be lining up to draft a late 4th round NFL pick with a late 1st-mid 2nd round rookie pick.

 

[humpback]

Every prospect has a 'cons' section. Despite that, Lacy was called a 1st round talent by some very bright football minds; Pollian, Waldman, McShay, Mayock, Kiper, even the former scout who wrote the article, first alerting us of his pro-day concerns.

I don't understand how a late 4th round pick sounds like competition to anyone. That was my point in replying to you originally. If you disagree, that's fine. We'll see. But the NFL has constantly used 4th round picks on depth, and as the poster above pointed out, the last 4th rounders to matter were both selected in 2005.

Again, why only look at 4th rounders? Just last year we had Miller in the 4th, Ballard in the 5th, Morris in the 6th, and B. Brown and D. Richardson in the 7th.

 

[tdmills]

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

Every prospect has a 'cons' section. Despite that, Lacy was called a 1st round talent by some very bright football minds; Pollian, Waldman, McShay, Mayock, Kiper, even the former scout who wrote the article, first alerting us of his pro-day concerns.

I don't understand how a late 4th round pick sounds like competition to anyone. That was my point in replying to you originally. If you disagree, that's fine. We'll see. But the NFL has constantly used 4th round picks on depth, and as the poster above pointed out, the last 4th rounders to matter were both selected in 2005.

Why is 4th round your cutoff?

-Lamar Miller 4th rounder, has the starting job in Miami

-Ahmad Bradshaw 6th round

-Arian Foster undrafted

-Alfred Morris 6th round

-Darren Sproles 4th round

-Michael Turner 5th round

-BJGE undrafted

-Pierre Thomas undrafted

-Fred Jackson undrafted

-Daryl Richardson 7th round(didn't they draft Pead in the 2nd and Richardson was for depth)

-Michael Bush 4th round

-Peyton Hillis 7th round

-Chris Ivory undrafted

-L. Blount undrafted

-Ryan Grant undrafted

All of these guys have been effective/starters/or have FF potential. I'm not saying Lacy doesn't, just it's muddied.

 

[Concept Coop]

Why is 4th round your cutoff?

-Lamar Miller 4th rounder, has the starting job in Miami

-Ahmad Bradshaw 6th round

-Arian Foster undrafted

-Alfred Morris 6th round

-Darren Sproles 4th round

-Michael Turner 5th round

-BJGE undrafted

-Pierre Thomas undrafted

-Fred Jackson undrafted

-Daryl Richardson 7th round(didn't they draft Pead in the 2nd and Richardson was for depth)

-Michael Bush 4th round

-Peyton Hillis 7th round

-Chris Ivory undrafted

-L. Blount undrafted

-Ryan Grant undrafted

All of these guys have been effective/starters/or have FF potential. I'm not saying Lacy doesn't, just it's muddied.

Exceptions to every rule, sure. But I am talking about the level of investment. A 4th round draft pick does not indicate anything but depth, investment wise. Gerhart, Rurbin, Pierce, Michael, Choice, Davis, etc. I'm no more worried about Franklin than I am about Michael or Davis as a Lynch and Charles owner.

 

[humpback]

FWIW, the rankings on here have him at #10 (there is one outlier that has him at #3). He'll almost certainly be a 2nd round pick IMO, and depending on where you're drafting, you may have to trade up to get him.

I'd like to see where his ADP ends up. For me, he's a hard guy to get excited about. I don't think many non-Lacy owners are going to be lining up to draft a late 4th round NFL pick with a late 1st-mid 2nd round rookie pick.

He probably will just by default. He was the 7th RB taken, and could easily go ahead of two who were drafted higher than him.

 

[werdnoynek]

FWIW, the rankings on here have him at #10 (there is one outlier that has him at #3). He'll almost certainly be a 2nd round pick IMO, and depending on where you're drafting, you may have to trade up to get him.

I'd like to see where his ADP ends up. For me, he's a hard guy to get excited about. I don't think many non-Lacy owners are going to be lining up to draft a late 4th round NFL pick with a late 1st-mid 2nd round rookie pick.

He probably will just by default. He was the 7th RB taken, and could easily go ahead of two who were drafted higher than him.

With Lacy, Bernard, Lattimore and Ball already rostered, Franklin was the 2nd RB taken in a draft that started yesterday after Bell. Stacy was next.

ETA: PPR

 

[tdmills]

Why is 4th round your cutoff?

-Lamar Miller 4th rounder, has the starting job in Miami

-Ahmad Bradshaw 6th round

-Arian Foster undrafted

-Alfred Morris 6th round

-Darren Sproles 4th round

-Michael Turner 5th round

-BJGE undrafted

-Pierre Thomas undrafted

-Fred Jackson undrafted

-Daryl Richardson 7th round(didn't they draft Pead in the 2nd and Richardson was for depth)

-Michael Bush 4th round

-Peyton Hillis 7th round

-Chris Ivory undrafted

-L. Blount undrafted

-Ryan Grant undrafted

All of these guys have been effective/starters/or have FF potential. I'm not saying Lacy doesn't, just it's muddied.

Exceptions to every rule, sure. But I am talking about the level of investment. A 4th round draft pick does not indicate anything but depth, investment wise. Gerhart, Rurbin, Pierce, Michael, Choice, Davis, etc. I'm no more worried about Franklin than I am about Michael or Davis as a Lynch and Charles owner.

You said you don't see how a 4th rounder can be competition. The above not only shows that they can create competition, but in many cases win the starting job.

 

[Concept Coop]

You said you don't see how a 4th rounder can be competition. The above not only shows that they can create competition, but in many cases win the starting job.

That's not what I said at all. I am not talking about the players - take them out of it. I am talking about the investment, and what a 4th round pick means. Franklin COULD be the best back on the roster this time next year. But it will be despite his cost of acquisition. The use of a 4th round pick, in itself, means nothing. The Chiefs didn’t draft Davis to threaten Charles. The Seahawks didn’t draft Turbin or Michael to threaten Lynch. Davis, Turbin, and Michael could all end up doing that, eventually. But that doesn’t mean their teams drafted them with said expectations.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and one of the best ever. That doesn’t mean Eli Manning needs to be worried after his team drafted a QB in the 4th.

 

[Ksquared]

You said you don't see how a 4th rounder can be competition. The above not only shows that they can create competition, but in many cases win the starting job.

That's not what I said at all. I am not talking about the players - take them out of it. I am talking about the investment, and what a 4th round pick means. Franklin COULD be the best back on the roster this time next year. But it will be despite his cost of acquisition. The use of a 4th round pick, in itself, means nothing. The Chiefs didn’t draft Davis to threaten Charles. The Seahawks didn’t draft Turbin or Michael to threaten Lynch. Davis, Turbin, and Michael could all end up doing that, eventually. But that doesn’t mean their teams drafted them with said expectations.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and one of the best ever. That doesn’t mean Eli Manning needs to be worried after his team drafted a QB in the 4th.

Do you understand the difference between backing up an established player with a 4th round or later pick and doing the same to a draft pick that has not played a down in the NFL yet? You are comparing apples to oranges. You know what you have in Charles, Lynch, etc - the whole point is no one including GB knows what Lacy will be able to do thus making Franklin a possible gem.

 

[Concept Coop]

Do you understand the difference between backing up an established player with a 4th round or later pick and doing the same to a draft pick that has not played a down in the NFL yet? You are comparing apples to oranges. You know what you have in Charles, Lynch, etc - the whole point is no one including GB knows what Lacy will be able to do thus making Franklin a possible gem.

I'm trying to take the players out of it and just talk about the investment. I'm not arguing against Franklin being a possible gem. I'll be trying to hedge my Lacy bet where I can. The fact that the Packers drafted Franklin doesn't mean that they did so to cut into Lacy's numbers, though. Franklin could end up being that good, and, or, Lacy could end up not being good enough. But, the use of a 4th round pick, in a vacuum, doesn't mean much. NFL teams draft backups in the 4th round all the time.

 

[tdmills]

1 round off, but another example. Shane Vereen was a 2nd round pick, Steven Ridley was a 3rd round pick. Ridley has been the starter. Looking at the picks only, that doesn't look like the case.

 

[Concept Coop]

1 round off, but another example. Shane Vereen was a 2nd round pick, Steven Ridley was a 3rd round pick. Ridley has been the starter. Looking at the picks only, that doesn't look like the case.

It's a solid example. But we're talking about the Patriots, who have a history of using a RBBC, and Packers, who don't, and told us Lacy was a 3 down back.

I could be wrong, and we'll see. Just my opinion.

 

[BigJim®]

You said you don't see how a 4th rounder can be competition. The above not only shows that they can create competition, but in many cases win the starting job.

That's not what I said at all. I am not talking about the players - take them out of it. I am talking about the investment, and what a 4th round pick means. Franklin COULD be the best back on the roster this time next year. But it will be despite his cost of acquisition. The use of a 4th round pick, in itself, means nothing. The Chiefs didn’t draft Davis to threaten Charles. The Seahawks didn’t draft Turbin or Michael to threaten Lynch. Davis, Turbin, and Michael could all end up doing that, eventually. But that doesn’t mean their teams drafted them with said expectations.

Tom Brady was a 6th round pick and one of the best ever. That doesn’t mean Eli Manning needs to be worried after his team drafted a QB in the 4th.

I agree with you that Lacy has upper hand vs. Franklin, but JMHO I think you are looking at it wrong if you think of it in terms of a team drafting guys "to threaten" other guys. Teams target talent throughout the draft, considering the value of where they can obtain it. I'd think GMs absolutely hope talent drafted in any round translates to eventual starter capability, whether through competition or injury. I doubt any NFL GM thinks "I'll draft this guy in the 4th to be a bench warmer for his career." Your mention of Tom Brady is a good one, as I doubt New England drafted Brady with the expectation he'd "threaten Bledsoe." Yet that's exactly what happened when talent crossed paths with opportunity. Unlike comparisons you've made to Brady-Bledsoe and Manning-Nassib, I don't think Franklin's opportunity necessarily requires injury to an entrenched starter.

 

[Concept Coop]

I agree with you that Lacy has upper hand vs. Franklin, but JMHO I think you are looking at it wrong if you think of it in terms of a team drafting guys "to threaten" other guys. Teams target talent throughout the draft, considering the value of where they can obtain it. I'd think GMs absolutely hope talent drafted in any round translates to eventual starter capability, whether through competition or injury. I doubt any NFL GM thinks "I'll draft this guy in the 4th to be a bench warmer for his career." Your mention of Tom Brady is a good one, as I doubt New England drafted Brady with the expectation he'd "threaten Bledsoe." Yet that's exactly what happened when talent crossed paths with opportunity. Unlike comparisons you've made to Brady-Bledsoe and Manning-Nassib, I don't think Franklin's opportunity necessarily requires injury to an entrenched starter.

Good post, and I'd agree. I just don't think the fact that GB drafted a RB in the 4th says anything about how they view Lacy. I don't agree with, "They drafted Franklin because they think X about Lacy."

 

[BigJim®]

I agree with you that Lacy has upper hand vs. Franklin, but JMHO I think you are looking at it wrong if you think of it in terms of a team drafting guys "to threaten" other guys. Teams target talent throughout the draft, considering the value of where they can obtain it. I'd think GMs absolutely hope talent drafted in any round translates to eventual starter capability, whether through competition or injury. I doubt any NFL GM thinks "I'll draft this guy in the 4th to be a bench warmer for his career." Your mention of Tom Brady is a good one, as I doubt New England drafted Brady with the expectation he'd "threaten Bledsoe." Yet that's exactly what happened when talent crossed paths with opportunity. Unlike comparisons you've made to Brady-Bledsoe and Manning-Nassib, I don't think Franklin's opportunity necessarily requires injury to an entrenched starter.

Good post, and I'd agree. I just don't think the fact that GB drafted a RB in the 4th says anything about how they view Lacy. I don't agree with, "They drafted Franklin because they think X about Lacy."

I think that's logical, but the reality is we just don't know. Let's say they went into the draft planning to select 2 RBs to enable legit competition for a bellcow RB, and had Lacy/Franklin on virtually the same tier. Common sense dictates they'll take each where it is value to take them, and almost everyone had Lacy as a late 1st/early 2nd draftee. Even if they liked Franklin a bit better than Lacy, they weren't going to take him in the 2nd where it would be horrible value, and where they'd lose Lacy. Even if they were not targetting any other RB and loved Franklin, they would not have drafted him until they felt they needed to. Where a guy is drafted is typically reflective not only of his value to the team, but also his perceived value to the rest of the league.

 

[Concept Coop]

I think that's logical, but the reality is we just don't know. Let's say they went into the draft planning to select 2 RBs to enable legit competition for a bellcow RB, and had Lacy/Franklin on virtually the same tier. Common sense dictates they'll take each where it is value to take them, and almost everyone had Lacy as a late 1st/early 2nd draftee. Even if they liked Franklin a bit better than Lacy, they weren't going to take him in the 2nd where it would be horrible value, and where they'd lose Lacy. Even if they were not targetting any other RB and loved Franklin, they would not have drafted him until they felt they needed to. Where a guy is drafted is typically reflective not only of his value to the team, but also his perceived value to the rest of the league.

I guess that could be the case. But the odds that they like Franklin more than Lacy are pretty close to 0 in my opinion. I think we're reaching for reasons to like Franklin or not like Lacy, at that point.

 

[Ksquared]

Sometimes I think we forget how our own drafts work. The shark move is to identify players that are out of whack with their ADP. I have no idea what GB's board looked like, but it could easily be that both RB were rated closely but everyone knew Lacy would be drafted sooner. So GB picks Lacy and another round goes by and Franklin is still there. Since GB traded up to pick Franklin, I have a feeling they rated him a lot higher than the 4th round pick they used. The point I am trying to make is to not tie the round picked to the player too closely when two of the same position are picked by the same team. The team may have rated them similarly but knew one was going to be drafted later.

 

[Time Kibitzer]

The concern is bigger than health/pro day.

All of the concerns about Lacy:

-Health. He's never sustained this in his career. From turf toe to hamstring to teams taking him off their boards.

-Motivation. He didn't perform well at his pro day, but some felt the biggest concern was work ethic/motivation. To be an every down back, you have to be in great shape, he wasn't.

-Inflated stats due to situation. Some felt he wasn't as good as his numbers dictated. Not Lacy's fault, just like it's not Timmy Chang's fault.

-Overall athleticism. This came into question when he broad jumps 9'7, short shuttles 4.44, vertical 32.5, and 40 yard dash between 4.58-4.62.

-Packers drafted Franklin in the 4th round. It shows they needed depth, yes. But also that they may want to force competition, which doesn't evoke confidence in just Lacy. 4th round picks and later can be NFL starters at RB too. Franklin ran a 4.49 at the combine and may take over 3rd down duties.

The main issue is that what was going to be an awesome landing spot for Lacy, now looks muddied. Lacy may be 1st/2nd down guy with Franklin on 3rd downs. Or it could be an even split. Either way, GB doesn't give a ton of touches to it's RBs(even near the GL). So if they all don't go to one RB, it really hurts their FF value.

Every prospect has a 'cons' section. Despite that, Lacy was called a 1st round talent by some very bright football minds; Pollian, Waldman, McShay, Mayock, Kiper, even the former scout who wrote the article, first alerting us of his pro-day concerns.

I don't understand how a late 4th round pick sounds like competition to anyone. That was my point in replying to you originally. If you disagree, that's fine. We'll see. But the NFL has constantly used 4th round picks on depth, and as the poster above pointed out, the last 4th rounders to matter were both selected in 2005.

Why is 4th round your cutoff?

-Lamar Miller 4th rounder, has the starting job in Miami

-Ahmad Bradshaw 6th round

-Arian Foster undrafted

-Alfred Morris 6th round

-Darren Sproles 4th round

-Michael Turner 5th round

-BJGE undrafted

-Pierre Thomas undrafted

-Fred Jackson undrafted

-Daryl Richardson 7th round(didn't they draft Pead in the 2nd and Richardson was for depth)

-Michael Bush 4th round

-Peyton Hillis 7th round

-Chris Ivory undrafted

-L. Blount undrafted

-Ryan Grant undrafted

All of these guys have been effective/starters/or have FF potential. I'm not saying Lacy doesn't, just it's muddied.

I think this list shows just how unlikely it really is that a RB selected after round 4 goes on to have a good fantasy career. The only ones listed there that actually started on their teams for multiple seasons are Arian Foster, Ahmad Bradshaw, Michael Turner, Benjarvus Green-Ellis, Fred Jackson, Peyton Hillis. That's only 6 backs going back 10 years, and 4 of them (Bradshaw/BJGE/Jackson/Hillis) were mediocre even during their limited "primes", only Hillis had a season had a RB1 season putting up top 12 RB numbers.

I'm sure you'd then point out to Alfred Morris, Lamar Miller, and Daryl Richardson from last year's draft, but chances are 1-2 of them will bust outright as well.

So really, only Foster and Turner were talented enough to hold down the RB position for their respective teams for a considerable amount of time. The others held down the RB position for their teams for a couple seasons before their team's drafted/acquired a more talented RB. In Franklin's case, I simply think the more talented RB was selected in the same draft that he was selected in. So barring Lacy being out due to injury, I'm not expecting Franklin to offer much.

 

[humpback]

I think this list shows just how unlikely it really is that a RB selected after round 4 goes on to have a good fantasy career. The only ones listed there that actually started on their teams for multiple seasons are Arian Foster, Ahmad Bradshaw, Michael Turner, Benjarvus Green-Ellis, Fred Jackson, Peyton Hillis. That's only 6 backs going back 10 years, and 4 of them (Bradshaw/BJGE/Jackson/Hillis) were mediocre even during their limited "primes", only Hillis had a season had a RB1 season putting up top 12 RB numbers.

I'm sure you'd then point out to Alfred Morris, Lamar Miller, and Daryl Richardson from last year's draft, but chances are 1-2 of them will bust outright as well.

So really, only Foster and Turner were talented enough to hold down the RB position for their respective teams for a considerable amount of time. The others held down the RB position for their teams for a couple seasons before their team's drafted/acquired a more talented RB. In Franklin's case, I simply think the more talented RB was selected in the same draft that he was selected in. So barring Lacy being out due to injury, I'm not expecting Franklin to offer much.

Pead, L. James, Ryan Williams, S. Vereen, M. Leshoure, D. Thomas, T. Gerhart, B. Tate, M. Hardesty, L. McCoy, Forte, Rice, C. Henry, B. Leonard, B. Jackson, L. White, MJD, JJ Arrington, E. Shelton, T. Bell, Julius Jones, and Greg Jones are all of the RBs drafted in the 2nd round going back to 2004.

 

[BigJim®]

I think that's logical, but the reality is we just don't know. Let's say they went into the draft planning to select 2 RBs to enable legit competition for a bellcow RB, and had Lacy/Franklin on virtually the same tier. Common sense dictates they'll take each where it is value to take them, and almost everyone had Lacy as a late 1st/early 2nd draftee. Even if they liked Franklin a bit better than Lacy, they weren't going to take him in the 2nd where it would be horrible value, and where they'd lose Lacy. Even if they were not targetting any other RB and loved Franklin, they would not have drafted him until they felt they needed to. Where a guy is drafted is typically reflective not only of his value to the team, but also his perceived value to the rest of the league.

I guess that could be the case. But the odds that they like Franklin more than Lacy are pretty close to 0 in my opinion. I think we're reaching for reasons to like Franklin or not like Lacy, at that point.

For the record, I'm not pro-Franklin and would be tickled pink if Lacy made it to my 1.7 rookie pick. Just pointing out that when a team takes 2 players at the same position, you should assume they planned taking both, and order of selection would have considered the timing required to get both.

 

[SWC]

i think that they will use them like thunder and litening and bam watch out brohans it is going to be a good year as the pack grounds and pounds and then when you are looking for another run bam right over the top with a double flea flicker pass for a 108 yard touchdown to randall the touchdown robber cobber and you can take that right to the bank becaue charlie is cooking brohanville brats this fall bam

 

[ConnSKINS26]

i think that they will use them like thunder and litening and bam watch out brohans it is going to be a good year as the pack grounds and pounds and then when you are looking for another run bam right over the top with a double flea flicker pass for a 108 yard touchdown to randall the touchdown robber cobber and you can take that right to the bank becaue charlie is cooking brohanville brats this fall bam

Glad to see you back around, brohan.