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Bad Officiating - Discuss (1 Viewer)

WheelsUp said:
Jayrod, appreciate your story. Good luck in your officiating career.

But....

These are seasoned professionals who are paid to be as such and have been in the NFL for many years. No disrespect to you what so ever as I'm sure you try your best, but these guys are not in a learning curve. This is the NFL.
Not entirely.  Every year brings new rules, new emphases and new foul tolerance guidelines.  They only recently moved the Umpire back behind the offense full time.  Every year there are tweaks to the mechanics as well which us fans have no idea about.

And like I said at the beginning of my rambling statement, you never get used to the unexpected.  You also are dealing with human beings.

How do NFL offensive linemen commit false starts?  I mean it's the NFL right, how can they do that after years of playing football?  How do NFL coaches mismanage the clock at the end of games?  It's the NFL right?  Even at the top, people make basic mistakes that make us wonder how they could possibly do it, but everyone does it, so there must be something there.  Something in human nature that causes mental lapses or poor judgement or something and officials are no exception.

 
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davearm said:
It was also right for the official on the field to let the play continue.  You can't undo blowing the whistle if/when you should not have.
I'm not totally on board with this....I realize once they kill the play it is over....and it this case it would have resulted in no points for DEN....but I don't think officials should use replay as a fallback crutch and not call something they see because they "think" replay will end up fixing it.....even though I think that happens...the mentality of "let the play continue" which they already do on fumbles quite a bit.....can sometimes get you trouble.....

this situation is a perfect example......replay did not have a good enough angle (which I still can't believe) to "bail" this official out for swallowing his whistle on the play when he chose not to call what he saw....

and from one of the views I saw from behind the trailing official.....he probably saw it....it sure as heck seemed like many on the Saints sideline saw it....

if officials are making calls/not making calls thinking "replay will get it right" so I'll just pass on the call.....I think that is a bad mentality to have when officiating any sport...

I still can't believe in today's NFL there is not a camera angle shooting straight down every sideline in every game on every play......if this is a playoff game or super bowl....we would have zoomed in angles to where we could see the trainers fingerprints on the tape around the players shoes.....

no camera angle down the line is really the question the NFL needs to answer too on this one....

 
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IMO, it's really a simple problem to fix: instruct the refs to throw fewer flags. NO ONE likes them. You are doing the game a disservice. Limit flags to egregious play-altering penalties not nonsense touches of the facemask or scraping of a receiver's arm.

And while you're at it, the competition committee needs to start REDUCING the rule book, not adding pages to it. Let's start by trimming some of these archaic formation rules, illegal man downfield, etc. 

The fewer flags thrown the less a chance of a bad one. People can live with a missed flag, but it's the bad ones that drive fans crazy.

 
I'm not totally on board with this....I realize once they kill the play it is over....and it this case it would have resulted in no points for DEN....but I don't think officials should use replay as a fallback crutch and not call something they see because they "think" replay will end up fixing it.....even though I think that happens...the mentality of "let the play continue" which they already do on fumbles quite a bit.....can sometimes get you trouble.....

this situation is a perfect example......replay did not have a good enough angle (which I still can't believe) to "bail" this official out for swallowing his whistle on the play when he chose not to call what he saw....

and from one of the views I saw from behind the trailing official.....he probably saw it....it sure as heck seemed like many on the Saints sideline saw it....

if officials are making calls/not making calls thinking "replay will get it right" so I'll just pass on the call.....I think that is a bad mentality to have when officiating any sport...

I still can't believe in today's NFL there is not a camera angle shooting straight down every sideline in every game on every play......if this is a playoff game or super bowl....we would have zoomed in angles to where we could see the trainers fingerprints on the tape around the players shoes.....

no camera angle down the line is really the question the NFL needs to answer too on this one....
You're probably closer to it than me, but I'd be very surprised if officials aren't specifically instructed and trained to allow plays to continue if they're uncertain, precisely because mistakes in one direction can be corrected via replay but mistakes in the other direction can't be changed.

 
and one of the problems on the DEN/NOS play was that the play ended up going in the direction where there were no referees in real good position to officiate the play.....they were "trailing" this play instead of having the action "come to them" like most offensive plays are designed to be officiated.....this is also the case on pick 6's and fumble returns.....the action is going away from all the officials and they are chasing and reffing instead of having the action come to them.....even the white hat and the umpire lined up behind the PK don't have the speed to keep up with these guys when the action reverses direction......the guy on the side who ruled/not ruled on this play was trailing and running (which is never good for vision....your vision bounces, etc)....he may not have had a good look at the split second the side of the players foot touched or didn't touch the white line.....on a normal play there is usually an official trailing the play on the sideline and another official on the sideline who is having the play coming at them.....you have two sets of eyes watching the sideline, not just one guy on a dead sprint 30 yards or more behind the player....the closest guy on the sideline probably didn't have a great look so he passed.....thinking replay would bail him out if he "missed" it......and then the replay angle ended up being worthless.....

 
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You're probably closer to it than me, but I'd be very surprised if officials aren't specifically instructed and trained to allow plays to continue if they're uncertain, precisely because mistakes in one direction can be corrected via replay but mistakes in the other direction can't be changed.
Yeah i think this is why they have implemented some of the language they have in their rulings and why things like....."clear recovery" are allowed to help.....on a fumble that may get taken to house by the defense..... if there ends up being no fumble and no whistle to stop the action, it's no harm no foul.....offense keeps the ball at the spot they were down...but if they kill it, and it was a fumble, no TD, but at least the defense gets the ball at the spot they picked it up....so on fumbles I can see them letting them continue to play, although when that happens you are maybe allowing action to continue which really shouldn't have and then somebody could end up getting hurt for no reason during that time....but I guess teams know that so it is what is is....

in high school...(no replay)....if its a fumble, we throw our bean bag at the spot.....if we don't think it's a fumble we don't throw it.... period end of story.....

 
Somebody explain to me why that sometimes an OLineman can get flagged for a false start if he so much as twitced his calf muscle but sometimes the entire line will be set then very abruptly everybody and their mother starts \ looking around and pointing and adjusting and no call. QBs get away with murder nowadays too., screaming and kicking their legs up.

I guess Ive always felt bad for those 6'4", 300 lbers having to squat down without budging.

 
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Here's a different perspective, in case any of you give a crap:

I am a small college FB official.  This was my first year in college after 6 years of HS.  The jump from HS to college was incredible.  My first game, the entire first quarter was a blur.  Remembering my assignments, the proper signals and communicating was one thing that I got much better at throughout the season.

What you never get used to is the unexpected actions of the people involved.  And the higher the level, the faster and more surprising they are.  No matter how many games you watch on film, no matter how many special situations and odd scenarios you think through in tests and meetings, you will still be caught of guard at least once every game.

Situations like when a kick returner decides to kick the bouncing kickoff out of bounds; or when a DB randomly runs up to hit a WR on the backside of the play; or when your TE is covered up by the WR and then runs a route into the backfield and catches a pass; or when two players on the punt return team are wearing the same number; or when the QB runs 20 yards downfield and takes his helmet off to yell an official after he threw an INT.  These are all situations that stunned me this year even though I've been doing it for 7 years, spent tons of time in the rulebook and in meetings watching film and discussing situations with other officials.  Only one of them did I get it right this year.  Out of 10 HS and 9 college games this year, I probably only missed 7-8 fouls that should have been called and called 2-3 that shouldn't have been.  I did nothing to thoroughly embarrass myself, but I was just lucky.  There were a lot of plays when I failed to watch the right player or didn't get into the right position to the see the play or simply had a mental lapse that didn't lead to anything.  Probably happens 5 times/game at least.

The amount of focus required to officiate is insane.  I do HS basketball and it is even more difficult due to the sheer volume of activity, but you also get more of a pass in basketball.  In football, a bad call or no call can stick with you for the entire season.  It can cost you any chance at working a playoff game and even get you fired.  But to concentrate on your job every single play without fail is a tall order for anyone.  The key to being really good is to 1) be in the right spot looking at the right thing on every play 2) knowing what to look for 3) knowing when to hold off on penalties that are technically there and 4) communicating with everyone else.  Doing all of that on every play is crazy difficult when you never know exactly what the players will do on a given play.  Throw in a coach yelling in your ear and it can get overwhelming real quick.

And yes, there is accountability and discipline.  Not just due to public pressure, either.  Once you reach the D2 level of football and above, every single play is critiqued by an evaluator.  And those critiques are all added up to get your grade for the year.  And that grade determines your ability to work post-season games and even get invited back the following year.  If a call is egregious enough or awful enough, those firings and suspensions can, and do, happen.  Coaches can submit complaints and film to the evaluators and coordinators if they are really upset about something and sometimes it gets results.  The pressure on officials is very intense and the higher up you go, the greater the pressure.  Officials defend each other, because they have to.  Coaches, fans and players are all critics despite pretty much none of them ever even attempting to do the job.

So I get you can disagree with some calls.  But the guys at the NFL level are incredible at this.  They aren't getting worse, but there are two factors that contribute to that belief.  One is that the level of analysis and review for the spectators has risen extensively with the improvements in technology and you can just see more as a fan now than ever before.  The second is that the rules are more complex and subject to more interpretation and judgement than ever before.  With more weight placed on the officials and more scrutiny of their decisions, no wonder people think they are getting worse.

Sure there is room for improvement and sure there are some officials that maybe aren't good enough be working the games they are working, but the profession as a whole isn't some black eye on the league.  It is like any other profession in the world and the only thing I ask is that you treat it like that and not as if these people are superhumans.  A lot of times, they are better at their jobs than the teams and coaches they officiate, but no one cheers them when they do a good job, just boo them when they did a bad job and even sometimes when they were 100% correct, but the people thought they did a bad job.

For me personally, this is the hardest thing; when you know for certain that you got a call right, but the players, coaches and fans are all yelling at you and treating you like you are an idiot.  It is really difficult to just take it when people are just being jerks and they're the ones who are wrong.  Officiating is tough enough as it is, to add jerkoffs just yelling to yell and there is no wonder there is an officiating shortage at the HS and youth sports level.
From a HS offical with over 20 yrs, you are right on.  Contrary to what people think, we work our asses off to do the best job we can, study rules, go to clinics, etc.., all for a measly $100 a nite (no mileage) for a game when you leave home at 4:30 pm and get home at midnite.  It's not about the money (obviously), you could tend bar for those hours and make 3-4x the money.  It's cause you love the game and want to be part of it and enjoy the guys you work with and doing the best job you can.  Kenney Chesney's "Boys of Fall" video says it all.....!

 
From a HS offical with over 20 yrs, you are right on.  Contrary to what people think, we work our asses off to do the best job we can, study rules, go to clinics, etc.., all for a measly $100 a nite (no mileage) for a game when you leave home at 4:30 pm and get home at midnite.  It's not about the money (obviously), you could tend bar for those hours and make 3-4x the money.  It's cause you love the game and want to be part of it and enjoy the guys you work with and doing the best job you can.  Kenney Chesney's "Boys of Fall" video says it all.....!
$100...?....what state do you live in....here in CO we only get about $58....

 
Walking Boot said:
Weird one for me today, I was up in the nosebleeds at the Rams game and caught a ref screw up no one else seemed to notice. In the second quarter, at about the 8 minute mark, Dolphins got a first down. The chain gang moved the sticks (on the 'far' side of the field, the official 10 yard chain). On the 'near' side, the stickman with the unofficial marker just moved down 9 yards and put down the orange line marker on the side line. 

Sure enough, first play is to the near side and the runner is tackled after a nine yard gain. Ref looked at the unofficial marker and gave them the first down.

How does the official crew not speak up? 

Can't post the game log on mobile, but it's in there: 1st & 10, nine yard gain, first down. 
You are right.  They did screw that up, and even worse, the gain in question was a reception over the middle.  No reason they should have screwed that up unless the far side official just didn't verify what the near sideline official was saying.  Often times, the white hat (ref) will look to the side opposite the chains for determining if it is a first down or not because they can look across the field and make a quick determination.  Looks like the near official (HL in first half) went off of the marker on his side instead of looking across, indicated 1st down and everyone just went with it.  They basically awarded the first down based on an incorrect, unofficial marker.

The TV graphics even show 2nd & 1 on the next play with the yellow line showing the 1st down line and everything, but the on-field markers are set at 1st & 10.  Then the next run gets 2 yds and the TV crew then shows 2nd & 9, but the on-field markers are at 2nd & 8.  Then Tannehill runs for 9 yards and gets another first down and they are correct from there.

The crew got lucky in that it didn't effect the game at all, but that is a screw up by the sideline officials and the chain crew.  I can see how it happens, but it shouldn't.  Good catch.  I'm sure it will get caught in the film review by someone and multiple officials will get an IC (incorrect call) grade on that play.

 
I only happened to notice because I was explaining to my friend that this year the NFL is trying to speed up the game by reducing measurements, what they're doing now is backing up the ball on a first down to the last yard marker. So if the runner gains 10.25 yards and is down at the 43 1/4 line between two hashes, they'll just move the ball backwards the 1/4 and even it up to the hash at the 43. Two or three plays later, sure enough, first down, they move the ball to the hash, the gangs move, and the near guy sets up in the wrong spot. Saw him doing it as it happened. "That's only nine yards," I said to my buddy and pointed it out. That very play, nine yard gain for a first down.
They've actually been doing that for a few years now.  The idea is to always spot it on one side of a hash mark or the other.  We do it in college and some umpires will do it in HS as well.  It is much easier and a half yard here or there throughout the game should net out.

What gets messed up a lot is when the ball/yard marker is on the 2nd or 3rd hash between the 5 yard lines (what we call "big lines").  Penalties get marked off incorrectly and first downs are awarded/denied often in that area at all levels.  That's why a lot of kick returns and long runs out of bounds get spotted on those "big lines" to make everything simpler.

 
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Sure there is room for improvement and sure there are some officials that maybe aren't good enough be working the games they are working, but the profession as a whole isn't some black eye on the league.  It is like any other profession in the world and the only thing I ask is that you treat it like that and not as if these people are superhumans.  A lot of times, they are better at their jobs than the teams and coaches they officiate, but no one cheers them when they do a good job, just boo them when they did a bad job and even sometimes when they were 100% correct, but the people thought they did a bad job.
First, good post and I appreciate the perspective from the zebra side of things. 

That said, the NFL's ongoing effort to avoid lawsuits & pay lipservice has resulted in some rapidly changing and dramatic rules changes that seemingly have everyone befuddled, including the zebras. 

  • What's a catch? 
  • What constitutes illegal hands to the face?
  • What is PI? 
  • What's a legal tackle? Go high or go low?
  • What's incidental and what's intentional? 
So while I don't entirely blame the zebras for botching these calls time and time again since the rules target keeps moving, I also don't let them off the hook when they completely blow the call. Especially when the play goes to review (if review-able) and the folks at the replay viewing party ALSO blow the call, and/or if it directly impacts the outcome of the game. 

There have also been outright incompetent calls made, or equally egregious non-calls. To suggest that officiating is just a hard job and we should give the zebras a break because it's hard is ludicrous - these are guys making over $100K a year for a part time job, and no offense intended, but I hold them to a significantly higher standard than a high school or low level college coach making $85 a game + mileage. 

Some complaints are totally legitimate, and as fans we have every right to call them out for it.  Many of us have or have had hard jobs with intense fast-paced environments - sure, we're not on national television, but we get taken to task when we blow it, and yes, sometimes we get disciplined for it or even fired. No one gives a crap that it's a hard job. Even a hard job can be performed at a high level, and criticism is sometimes entirely deserved. 

For me personally, this is the hardest thing; when you know for certain that you got a call right, but the players, coaches and fans are all yelling at you and treating you like you are an idiot.  It is really difficult to just take it when people are just being jerks and they're the ones who are wrong.  Officiating is tough enough as it is, to add jerkoffs just yelling to yell and there is no wonder there is an officiating shortage at the HS and youth sports level.
Agreed - there's no excusing bad behavior. Sometimes competition brings out the worst in people. And unfortunately, small % of the population that are total  :censored:  are the loudest and stand out the most for their actions.  I can't imagine what it's like to have to incur that wrath on a weekly basis over a game. I've always liked the expression, "sports don't build character, they reveal it." 

 
$100...?....what state do you live in....here in CO we only get about $58....
Minnesota.  Most of our contracts (5 man) are for $450 - $500.  So some games are less.  Range $90-$100 per person per game.  No mileage until Section/State games.  $58 seems really low for the time commitment, equipment, travel, etc..  Maybe you've got a surplus of officials there, it's getting pretty thin in MN and they have started programs to increase recruitment of young officials and mentoring.

 
Spotting of the ball TWICE botched. Just ridiculous that the NFL will not use the technology available to decide these moments.

I'm sure it has been discussed herein already, but the super-imposed yellow "line to gain" has proven to be just as (if not more) accurate as the dudes with the sticks and chains. Clearly that first down was made on both 3rd and 4th downs last night... just make the mall from the booth (a booth, any booth).

Chip technology (in the ball) has to be a serious consideration here as well.

 
The refs pretty much decided the outcome of last night's game. Sad.
Maybe, maybe not. Saw a pretty interesting take on this from Reddit, credit to u/auneakeffect for the post, as I think it puts perspective on the impact of those admittedly bad calls. Not sure I agree with the point that the refs actually helped the Texans by taking away 4 points, but a reminder that bad officiating runs both ways and sometimes nets out in the wash. Doesn't excuse bad refereeing, but still. 

Lets give Hopkins the TD (even though he stepped out of bounds) that gives them 4 more points

Texans 24
Raiders 27

Lets give Texans the first down and lets assume they get a TD

Texans 31
Raiders 27

Lets give Crabtree the blown PI call in the endzone giving us 4 tries to get a TD at the 1 yard line

Texans 31
Raiders 34

Lets take AWAY the uncatchable PI that texans got in the endzone and assume they get the FG

Texans 27
Raiders 34

Lets pretend none of that stuff happened and it was tied with 1 minute to go

Raiders in FG range with a HOF kicker
Raiders win by 3

Raiders win regardless of how the calls go. The refs actually helped the Texans more by taking away a net worth of 4 points from us after it was all said and done (we still won by 7)

 
Maybe, maybe not. Saw a pretty interesting take on this from Reddit, credit to u/auneakeffect for the post, as I think it puts perspective on the impact of those admittedly bad calls. Not sure I agree with the point that the refs actually helped the Texans by taking away 4 points, but a reminder that bad officiating runs both ways and sometimes nets out in the wash. Doesn't excuse bad refereeing, but still. 
Not sure what blown Crabtree PI that guy is talking about, but I am guessing it was the play right before they called PI on Bouye on Crabtree. They ended up getting a FG on that drive anyways, so it would not be +7 for them it would be +4 like he accounted for the Hopkins one.

Also, in his scenario it's kind of silly to give the Raiders 27 points already, considering if the Texans got the 1st down like they should have, they would have taken off much more time from the clock and the Texans would have had a chance to drive for the win in the final few minutes at the very worst.

IMO, the refs had a big outcome on who won the game. Not saying they're favoring the Raiders as I know they have definitely had their fair share of games in the past being on the other side of this, but the refs being the talking point of games is happening way too often now.

 
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The blown spot was one of the most obvious and egregious mistakes made by the officiating crew that I can remember. And that it went to replay and we got to see it in slow motion 11 times, only to have them come back and announce that the blown call stood with such obvious evidence to the contrary is mind boggling. 

All the other questionable plays in that game I can let go - this one had some stank on it. Watched it again this AM on my DVR and I'm still baffled as to how they could replay that and uphold the horrific spot. 

 
The refs didn't decide the game, they just swung the win probability 20% in one teams favour via incompetence. 

The only thing that talks is $. Stop spending it on NFL and maybe they will do something. Until then....business as usual. 

I am in on this strategy. Now about 300 million to go...

 
Spotting of the ball TWICE botched. Just ridiculous that the NFL will not use the technology available to decide these moments.

I'm sure it has been discussed herein already, but the super-imposed yellow "line to gain" has proven to be just as (if not more) accurate as the dudes with the sticks and chains. Clearly that first down was made on both 3rd and 4th downs last night... just make the mall from the booth (a booth, any booth).

Chip technology (in the ball) has to be a serious consideration here as well.


I 100% agree. NFL already has the chips (I believe inside the shoulder pads/helmets?) for sound bytes...

Place a chip, or some type of technology to the entire shape of ball and the field...

Batter's box in baseball also

 
Timing the measurement of forward progress with when the ball is dead would be very difficult to do by microchip.  The reason being is that you can't determine exactly when the ball is dead except by knowing 3 things simultaneously:  who has full possession of the ball (if anyone), was there some body part besides the foot or hand touching the ground and was there contact by the defender.  How in the world can a microchip in the ball determine all that to know exactly when to count the play dead?  And if you can't know that, how can you trust the spot of the ball?  Players extend the ball after they are down, continue to slide, roll or crawl forward on almost every play as it is to try and fool the official.  Imagine if they knew the chip was reading the forward progress?

Also, you can't use the sound of the whistle or any other signal by the officials, because contrary to popular belief, the whistle does not end the play.  The play is ended when the ball becomes dead by definition (see above).  Officials are trained to hold off on blowing the whistle until the status of the ball is known with absolute certainty to avoid an inadvertent whistle during a loose ball.  As a result, there is often a full second delay between the ball being dead and the whistle being blown and sometimes can be longer.  Also, using some sort of button to count the runner down could also be "off" due to the official not knowing for sure if the ball was secured.

I personally think the system we have in place is the best we can do.  Let the guys on the field make their best guess and when it is close or questionable let the replay officials take a look.  That should work for 99.9% of plays.  I didn't get to see the Oak-Hou game so I'm not sure what happened there, but it sounds bad.  I think maybe having line-to-gain camera angles (one on each side) could help so we can always have a viewpoint straight down that line on each play.  

One recent change we have made in college (not sure if the NFL does this or not) is to have the sideline officials move to the LTG immediately after the snap on 3rd or 4th and short (<5 yds) so they can let the ball come to them instead of moving with it trying to determine the forward progress.  I did it all season and loved it and think it makes seeing if the ball carrier got the first down or not much easier.  However, you do lose a bit of orientation from the line of scrimmage when you are moving, so there is a potential trade off on increased risk of making a bad call or missing something while you are moving.

 
The blown spot was one of the most obvious and egregious mistakes made by the officiating crew that I can remember. And that it went to replay and we got to see it in slow motion 11 times, only to have them come back and announce that the blown call stood with such obvious evidence to the contrary is mind boggling. 

All the other questionable plays in that game I can let go - this one had some stank on it. Watched it again this AM on my DVR and I'm still baffled as to how they could replay that and uphold the horrific spot. 
Mind boggling?  That the "home team" got the call to make the Raider touting Mexican fan base happy is mind boggling?

Don't look too deep into the abyss.

 
Mind boggling?  That the "home team" got the call to make the Raider touting Mexican fan base happy is mind boggling?

Don't look too deep into the abyss.
I'm not quite ready to assume that the entire game is rigged. 

And to me the crowd looked pretty evenly split among Raiders & Texans fans. 

 
I'm not quite ready to assume that the entire game is rigged. 

And to me the crowd looked pretty evenly split among Raiders & Texans fans. 
I won't say rigged but "orchestrated" comes to mind.  Like you saw last night, Houston may have converted that 1st down 2 or 3 times - but clearly converted on 4th down.  That call can't get blown on replay, can it?

 
I won't say rigged but "orchestrated" comes to mind.  Like you saw last night, Houston may have converted that 1st down 2 or 3 times - but clearly converted on 4th down.  That call can't get blown on replay, can it?
After watching the real time & replay several times, I cannot fathom how they missed that, no. 

It was glaringly obvious that he not only made the 1st down, but blew past it by a healthy distance. Everyone in the room I was in was shocked, and the Raiders fans present were saying how weird it was to see the other team get screwed for a change. 

 
Not an NFL game, but an Illinois HS playoff game is getting a lot of run this morning on Mike & Mike.

Fenwick HS led by 3, but were flagged for intentional grounding on the final play of the game while running out the clock.

As a result of the penalty, the officiating crew mistakenly allowed Plainfield one untimed down, which they used to kick the tying FG.  By rule, the game should have ended despite the penalty.  Naturally, Plainfield won in OT.

Apparently Fenwick is in court this morning asking a judge to reverse the outcome and award them the win.

Sounds like the same officiating error that flipped the Oklahoma State - Central Michigan game earlier this year.

 
Not an NFL game, but an Illinois HS playoff game is getting a lot of run this morning on Mike & Mike.

Fenwick HS led by 3, but were flagged for intentional grounding on the final play of the game while running out the clock.

As a result of the penalty, the officiating crew mistakenly allowed Plainfield one untimed down, which they used to kick the tying FG.  By rule, the game should have ended despite the penalty.  Naturally, Plainfield won in OT.

Apparently Fenwick is in court this morning asking a judge to reverse the outcome and award them the win.

Sounds like the same officiating error that flipped the Oklahoma State - Central Michigan game earlier this year.
This is exactly what I thought when I heard about the issue.  How can you not have covered this rule if you were paying attention to the news at all as an official?  Especially if you are a crew of 5 working a state semifinal game.  Usually the guys at that level live and breathe football and should be well aware of all of the press that the OSU game got and would have thought through the HS rules of end of half penalty enforcement.  Both my HS and college crews did just that and no crew I'm on will ever mess this up in the future.  I'm sure there are plenty of other things I'll screw up at some point, but not this one.

 
It still makes me laugh when all the conspiracy theorists come out and think that some type of memorandum comes down from the NFL offices and is passed down to the officials saying something like "hey attention all guys on the Mexico game officiating crew....this game is in Mexico and we know a lot of the Mexican fan like the Raiders so hey if there is ever any chance to maybe have things go the Raiders way.....please go ahead and make that happen....."

sorry but stuff like this does not happen...its actually pretty insulting to question the integrity of the crew like that.....if stuff like that actually happpened most every official would quit immediately......

Integrity is the foundation that officiating is built on......they do the best they can....and they do make mistakes.....but they in no way want to intentionally influence the outcome of a game......

 
It still makes me laugh when all the conspiracy theorists come out and think that some type of memorandum comes down from the NFL offices and is passed down to the officials saying something like "hey attention all guys on the Mexico game officiating crew....this game is in Mexico and we know a lot of the Mexican fan like the Raiders so hey if there is ever any chance to maybe have things go the Raiders way.....please go ahead and make that happen....."

sorry but stuff like this does not happen...its actually pretty insulting to question the integrity of the crew like that.....if stuff like that actually happpened most every official would quit immediately......

Integrity is the foundation that officiating is built on......they do the best they can....and they do make mistakes.....but they in no way want to intentionally influence the outcome of a game......
Tim Donaghy says hi.  :thumbup:

 
Yeah I knew somebody would bring up the ONE bad apple in a HUGE barrel....plus to think that the NFL offices would would make such things public (like to a whole crew of officials) is just insane....Timmy boy was on his own....

 
Yeah I knew somebody would bring up the ONE bad apple in a HUGE barrel....plus to think that the NFL offices would would make such things public (like to a whole crew of officials) is just insane....Timmy boy was on his own....
Maybe so, but you can't make the blanket statement that officials are never corrupt. 

One guy got caught. That's not proof that there was just one guy, its proof of corruption. 

I'm not saying anything about the commentary in this thread one way or another, I'm just saying. 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
its proof of corruption.
Its nothing more than proof of one NBA official that was corrupt. Equating that guy's corruption to other refs in the NFL is wrong. 

 
Its nothing more than proof of one NBA official that was corrupt. Equating that guy's corruption to other refs in the NFL is wrong. 
Why, because it's a different sport?  Hmm

Donaghy was absolute proof of corruption in sports. He was an official - he was corrupt. 

The NBA then came out and said "we got him!" and made him "the bad guy" because that's good PR. And voila! The widespread corruption of the NBA was cleaned up overnight, because they got the one bad guy. 

History shows if there's one corrupt official there are likely others. And if there's corruption in one sport, there is likely corruption in every sport to some degree.. 

you're certainly welcome to disagree. 

its in part why I hate all of the non-reviewable judgement call rules in the NFL.  Pass interference is clearly defined. Make it reviewable. Same with holding and every other judgement call. Coaches should be able to review anything. They can have he same # of reviews and not slow the game at all. 

I ain't saying all NFL refs are corrupt - I actually tend to believe they're not for the most part. And I don't think there are some massive conspiracies going with whole crews of refs. I'm in agreement with @Stinkin Ref on that one - that's tinfoil hat crazy talk.  

Im not a ref hater - as a baseball fan I'm always blown away by how incredible the umps are calling plays in real time. It's truly amazing how many close calls they get right. I appreciate the refs for the difficult job they do. 

But I do feel that if opportunity exists to shave points or sway the outcome of a game it some way, some ref/ump at some point will be tempted into abusing the system.  Not sure there's a simple or graceful solution, but it seems like the most outrage comes from blown calls that aren't reviewable. 

So make them reviewable and help protect the refs from accusations of corruption. Win-win. 

 
Because by dropping blanket accusations on "some" you're doing it to all. That's not how we work around these parts. You don't get to drop accusations on all professional referees because one was found in the wrong. I choose not to live in that society. I would hope that you would too.

 
Because by dropping blanket accusations on "some" you're doing it to all. That's not how we work around these parts. You don't get to drop accusations on all professional referees because one was found in the wrong. I choose not to live in that society. I would hope that you would too.
I would love to live in a world without any corruption or greed.  Wishing it away doesn't change the fact that it exists. 

I'm not dropping blanket accusations, I'm trying to think of ways to make it so officials are beyond reproach. 

Maybe I'm bitter & jaded. I'll concede that possibility. 

 
There is no reasonable person who can defend this officiating.
The only people who defend officiating are the people who benefited from the bad call.
Like politics and religion, predicting someone's opinion on officiating/sports is as easy as just looking to where their beliefs/needs are.
It is never about if its write or wrong, tis about, did it help me.

Officiating is terrible, defending it makes those look just as terrible.

 
Officiating is terrible, defending it makes those look just as terrible.
I disagree. I think expectations are so far off the charts that hyperbole rules the day. The constant barrage of instant replay has led to notion that the refs suck and that's the reality. I think they're being unfairly judged and held to impossible standards. 

 

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