There's a lot of good players on the Steelers team, just because they win a superbowl doesn't mean every player on the steelers now becomes an elite player. In Roethlisberger's case, tonights performance clearly shows he had the luxery of playing on a really good football team where even on his worst of days the team could still pull it out and win the superbowl. Not sure how many other QB's you can say that for. Still for what it's worth, I'm not trying to dog Big Ben, but I can't imagine Big Ben still being considered an elite QB right now.
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Big Ben and his 22.6 QB Rating? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter GRIDIRON ASSASSIN
- Start date
C
CrossEyed
Guest
So you're saying the SB is the first game you watched this post-season?
tombonneau
Footballguy
Of course Big Ben was a huge reason for the Steelers reg. season success. Just look at their record without him for proof.
But his play in the SB was atrocious and Big Ben's Brigade really can't defend that performance.
Even his own coaching staff lost faith in him after that 2nd pick.
I told my Steeler buddy friend on the drive after that pick, get ready for 3 straight runs, and sure enough that's what they got, even on like 3rd and 6 they did one of those inside draws.
But Pitt is positioned well for the future. If they can win a SB with a QB having a 22.6 rating, they'll be ok for the next few years.
But his play in the SB was atrocious and Big Ben's Brigade really can't defend that performance.
Even his own coaching staff lost faith in him after that 2nd pick.
I told my Steeler buddy friend on the drive after that pick, get ready for 3 straight runs, and sure enough that's what they got, even on like 3rd and 6 they did one of those inside draws.
But Pitt is positioned well for the future. If they can win a SB with a QB having a 22.6 rating, they'll be ok for the next few years.
C
CrossEyed
Guest
How many teams would like to have a 23-year old QB with Ben's tools and the post-season experience he now has?
C
CrossEyed
Guest
Matt Lienart doesn't have 26 NFL games under his belt with a career passer rating of 98.3, 34 TDs and 20 INTs and a YPA of 8.9I really don't understand why nobody wants to give this guy any credit.
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
Everbody wants to give him credit. I actually really liked him until a few homers started proclaiming him to be better than Manning and 2nd only to Brady. That's when you start hoping he struggles just so you can say "I told you so". Ben is a good QB, but he's not one of the best yet.
SoFresh&SoClean
Footballguy
Why do people act like YPA is important?
The Jerk
Footballguy
I agree 100%. Don't even consider comparing him to Brady, who could have been 3 for 3 as MVP of the SB. The Herndon interception was frightfully reminiscent of both the Jets and Patriots game last year. And unless my math is wrong, I think he's now got 10 TDs and 8 Ints all time in the playoffs, or close to that.As a Steeler fan, I'm hoping this could be the best of both worlds. Steelers win the Super Bowl, and Ben figures to not get as big a head as might have happened if he played another great game. It still could happen, but it seems much less likely now. He figures to get fewer endorsements and is less likely to command a higher salary if renegotiation occurs because of his performance in the SB. I'm probably going way too far here, but that was my first reaction.
knowledge dropper
Footballguy
Exactly.Only a complete nerd would be on a message board defending his team's honor on the night they won their first Super Bowl in a generation.You're in a pretty bad mood for someone whose team just won the super bowl.Go drink something for chrissakes.I dont give a #### who managed the game. We got one for the thumb. And if one more person says that Indy would be there if not for Ben, Im going to rip your ####ing head off and #### down your neck. Just like you Cinci #####ies would be there if Plamer didnt go down.
Honestly. If the Lions were to win the Super Bowl, I would be partying like there's no tomorrow... and there probably wouldn't be, because a Lions title is a sure sign of the apocalypse.
Surely you have something better to do than act like a complete tool on an internet message board.
SoloMatisse
Footballguy
You guys looking at the rating before the actual performance need to tighten up. Sure, the guy had a miserable rating. 2 INTS, no TDs and an ice cold start will do that. Doesnt matter. Big Ben did what the majority of other QBs in this league cant do.....in fact, what 90% of other QBs cant do, including Manning and the other statue QBs who cant move in the pocket and arent good athletes.....he made plays when he had to and got the job done when he needed to. The rollout all the way to the far left, under control, staying poised, checking the scrimmage marker, then hurling the ball 50yds DOWN AND ACROSS the field was an absolute brilliant play that you will not see a lesser QB make......Brady could make that play, McNabb, and few else. Ben is an elite QB. Screw the rating. Im a Pats fan, so I really have no bias here in the case other than the Brady drop, but Im telling you even on a day when most will consider his performance horrible, Roethlisberger scrambled for 1st downs, moved the chains, kept his head up and remained poised throughout, scored a TD with his legs, and gave his team a chance to win. He was a part of a good team win, which is all a man needs to be. He doesnt have to be the entire story. The guy is cool as a cucumber and a playmaker with unreal size, mobility, and cannon for an arm, and unbelievable poise far beyond his years. "Bad" game and all, the man got it done and is now to be considered amongst the game's elites for many years to come. JMHO, of course.
Steel City
Footballguy
Didn't read the tread.
With that said, who cares what his rating was.
Pittsburgh Steelers
Super Bowl Champions 2005/2006
It's a great day to be a Steelers fan.
With that said, who cares what his rating was.
Pittsburgh Steelers
Super Bowl Champions 2005/2006
It's a great day to be a Steelers fan.
Spartans Rule
Footballguy
I think most of us watched the performance before we looked at the rating. It was hideous. He threw the ball poorly and made bad decisions. I don't need any stats to tell me that.
SoloMatisse
Footballguy
Simply put.....not everyone gets IT.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Ben played worse than he ushualy does in this game. But his passer rating is not really indicative of his performance.
His 1st interception was a shot deep to the end zone. It ended up being similar to a punt for the Steelers. Hurts his passer rating but in actuality it wasn't a damaging play for them.
His TD run does not help his passer rating at all but it sure helped the Steelers win. I agree it was a very close call as far as if it broke the plane of the end zone or not but the points counted.
He made some good plays to keep drives going by running the ball and converting 1st downs.
I don't think I have ever seen Ben play as poorly as he did in this game but that has more to do with how well he has played overall in other games than anything else.
Some people seem to be saying that Ben sucks and did not deserve to win this game. If that is the case then why wasn't Seattle good enough to take advantage of his poor play and get the victory?
What if Ben plays as well as he normaly does next time the Steelers get to a Super Bowl? Scary huh?
His 1st interception was a shot deep to the end zone. It ended up being similar to a punt for the Steelers. Hurts his passer rating but in actuality it wasn't a damaging play for them.
His TD run does not help his passer rating at all but it sure helped the Steelers win. I agree it was a very close call as far as if it broke the plane of the end zone or not but the points counted.
He made some good plays to keep drives going by running the ball and converting 1st downs.
I don't think I have ever seen Ben play as poorly as he did in this game but that has more to do with how well he has played overall in other games than anything else.
Some people seem to be saying that Ben sucks and did not deserve to win this game. If that is the case then why wasn't Seattle good enough to take advantage of his poor play and get the victory?
What if Ben plays as well as he normaly does next time the Steelers get to a Super Bowl? Scary huh?
nerangers
Footballguy
Reading this thread I was thinking some of the same things. The big passing play to Ward got them in scoring position. His rushing TD helped the team (although I still do not think the ball crossed the line, but would have next play
). He was trying to force plays then just letting them play out like he did during the regular season and playoffs. I think the Steelers got a real gem when they drafted Big Ben. He might end up like a Troy Aikman....and he is now in the HOF. Don't criticize the kid because some Homers ranked him with Brady and Manning. Five years from now he could be that great (who knows, we all thought this of Brady after his first Super Bowl, one time wonder). Big Ben is only in his second year and got the Super Bowl Ring out of the way.Manning might end up like Marino, minus actually getting to the big game! Maybe the Colts just need to be moved to the NFC. 
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I agree. What about his shotput toss for a first down on their first touchdown drive? And his great concentration to stay behind the line of scrimmage on the long pass to Ward a few plays later? Most QB's would have scrambed for five yards there leading to a punt but he knew he had time and made a play. And, of course, his touchdown run and run near the end of the game for a crucial first down were huge, too. Roethlisberger didn't have that good of a game overall, but to say he played horrible because his passer rating was so bad is not telling the whole story, IMO.
Franknbeans
Footballguy
I agree Ben was horrible and I'm a Steelers fan. Cowher said at half time that Ben had to settle down but apparently he didn't get the message. That said, he did do enough to put his team in a position to win this game. Given that his play is the major reason why they got to the Super Bowl in the first place, I think it was only fitting that his teammates picked him up and delivered the trophy.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
A strange thing has happened.Although I always had much respect for Ghost Rider, we never seemed to agree on anything.
Over the course of the last month or so, we agree on EVERYTHING.
C
CrossEyed
Guest
Ben finished the post-season with a 101.7 passer rating, best in the league, completed over 62% of his passes and thew 7 TDs to 3 INTs. Those suggesting that he wasn't a huge part of the Steelers winning SB XL don't understand that you have to actually get there before you can win it. Without Ben, the Steelers wouldn't have even been there.
Fumbleweed
Footballguy
Roethlisberger is 23.....that was a lot of pressure to deal with in only his second season.
He was below average yesterday for an NFL QB, but he had a marvelous postseason overall. I just think young QBs should be cut some slack. Brady wasn't all that great in the Pats' first Super Bowl win. The defense and running game won that game for them.
Like someone said, he was due for a bad game after so many good ones. They're all human. Even of the best of them......
He was below average yesterday for an NFL QB, but he had a marvelous postseason overall. I just think young QBs should be cut some slack. Brady wasn't all that great in the Pats' first Super Bowl win. The defense and running game won that game for them.
Like someone said, he was due for a bad game after so many good ones. They're all human. Even of the best of them......
pigskinliquors
Dr. Parrothead
I would argue it one of those stats that most accurately depicts how good a qb is. This year's leaders in order:1) Big Ben2) Manning3) Bulger4) Green5) Delhomme6) Brady7) Hasselback8) PalmerLooks like a pretty good list of qb's to me
marinolives13
Footballguy
I think the Steelers got a real gem when they drafted Big Ben. He might end up like a Troy Aikman....and he is now in the HOF. Don't criticize the kid because some Homers ranked him with Brady and Manning. Five years from now he could be that great (who knows, we all thought this of Brady after his first Super Bowl, one time wonder). Big Ben is only in his second year and got the Super Bowl Ring out of the way.
Manning might end up like Marino, minus actually getting to the big game! Maybe the Colts just need to be moved to the NFC.
First of all: Congrats to the Steelers! BIg Ben is good, but not great! Manning shouldn't be compared to Marino, because Marino never had Edgerrin James! They tried to get him a running back
, but Lorenzo Hampton, Ron Davenport, Sammie smith,bobby humphrey, bernee parmelee, kareem abdul jabbar, and cecil collins just sucked, 
drank too much,delivered to many packages, or 
got arrested for breaking in an apartment. Second, the Colts would have lost to the Seahawks too! Manning needs to realize that if he just gives the ball the james a little more then he might have played in this super bowl! 
Manning might end up like Marino, minus actually getting to the big game! Maybe the Colts just need to be moved to the NFC.
First of all: Congrats to the Steelers! BIg Ben is good, but not great! Manning shouldn't be compared to Marino, because Marino never had Edgerrin James! They tried to get him a running back
, but Lorenzo Hampton, Ron Davenport, Sammie smith,bobby humphrey, bernee parmelee, kareem abdul jabbar, and cecil collins just sucked, drank too much,delivered to many packages, or got arrested for breaking in an apartment. Second, the Colts would have lost to the Seahawks too! Manning needs to realize that if he just gives the ball the james a little more then he might have played in this super bowl! 
redCashion
Footballguy
I keep seeing mention that Ben had the lowest QB rating by a winning team, but I'm thinking that it is so bad it might rank close to the bottom for ALL starting QBs in a Superbowl win or loss. Anyone see a list like that?
stevetrash
Footballguy
one thing that doesn't show up in the stat sheets everyone here likes to spend so much time reading: his bigtime block on ARE's TD pass.
The Juggernaut
The Man. The Myth
Anyone else see all the talk about the "new ball every play in the first half" during the 20 hours of pre game show? I think it was Aikman who said throwing a ball right out of the package is a lot like throwing a wet ball. He went on to say that this would probably affect Ben with his bad thumb more that Matt who is used to playing in wet weather. As poorly as Ben threw the ball last night, I wonder if the new balls did have some impact on him. That first INT looked horribly underthrown, like it might have slipped on release. Anyone else agree?
Also, what the hell's the point of the new ball every play? Why does the NFL mess with game conditions like this in it's biggest game?
Also, what the hell's the point of the new ball every play? Why does the NFL mess with game conditions like this in it's biggest game?
Last edited by a moderator:
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Pristine balls, pristine fields. pewwwth!! Have them line up in the dirt or on an old cinder field and let them tear into each other while the ball they use has one broken lace and a couple of dog bite impressions on it. We played under these conditions as kids playing pick up games and the better team still always won.
The Hank
Footballguy
Yea, and the past 3 playoff games were not big at all
Statistics really do not matter when it comes to Superbowl victory because a #6 seed won for the first time in NFL history, and Hasselbeck had 200+ yards with no trophy or ring to show for it, SA had a nice game, but it was a pretty quiet 90 yds if i say so myself. Yea Big Ben had a bad game, but thats why they say football is a team sport, and Superbowl XL exemplifies that statement.Grow up and post elsewhere if you are going to post senseless jargon.
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm with Mike Greenberg 100% when he said the best pass thrown for either team was by Randel El.
I really thought Roethlisberger was hurt. I wouldn't be surprised at all if we find out he broke his thumb again on the first series. Zero zip on the ball and he was floating the passes terribly. Even on the play where he made the long completion stopping short of the line of scrimmage, it was an ugly pass.
He absolutely did not look like himself.
J
I really thought Roethlisberger was hurt. I wouldn't be surprised at all if we find out he broke his thumb again on the first series. Zero zip on the ball and he was floating the passes terribly. Even on the play where he made the long completion stopping short of the line of scrimmage, it was an ugly pass.
He absolutely did not look like himself.
J
Workhorse
Footballguy
I disagree. The best pass of the night was thrown by Hasselbeck on the ball to Stevens about 25 yards down the middle of the field that was dropped. That throw was pretty incredible --- Right in between 2 defenders.Ward was so wide open on that play, it didn't really matter who threw it.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
I think it was the ref's fault that he dropped it, too!
That drop was a huge play... one of the many mistakes made by the Seahawks that's getting completely overlooked today.
So 34 TD's and 20 INTs in 26 games makes him an elite QB. And no one giving him credit?? I said he's a good QB with a very bright future, but I disagreed with the notion that he's an elite QB with Manning and Brady. Not sure where you are getting the idea that no one is giving him credit when the vast majority are on your side with Big Ben being a very good QB.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
GREAT sig !!!!I think it was the ref's fault that he dropped it, too!
That drop was a huge play... one of the many mistakes made by the Seahawks that's getting completely overlooked today.
Thanks CE.That is exactly what's wrong with this type of discussion.
The guy asked if Manning had ever had that kind of poor performance. And the response is does he have a ring?
Too many people for whatever reason are unable to see the bigger picture and want to unfairly label players for things they can't control. If Pittsburgh had lost, Roethlisberger would have turned in an all time choke performance. Since they won, everything is cool and nobody talks much about it outside of the fanatics on a message board. His performance is judged and evaluated purely on the basis of how the other players played by many folks.
J
C
CrossEyed
Guest
The goal is to win, no? Ben may have not played his greatest game, but he did make the plays he needed to make to contribute to the victory. That's really the only thing that matters.
SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
SWWWWWWWWWWWEEEEEEEEET!!! GO BIG BEN!Agree .......... they won dispite him but all we will hear for the next 5 months is BIG BEN
Sonny Lubick Blowup Doll
Footballguy
I dislike QB ratings. And unfortunately, they seem to be talked about more and more.
SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
I'll take the "drunken arm" over the "busted knee". Good luck next year Carson...hope that knee brace holds up!!!
SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
PARTY ON BIG BEN!! A well-earned victory for you it was!!! WOO HOOOO!!
SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
Yeah, I hope the Steelers try to trade him in the off-season for one of them Manning boys...NOT!!
Koya
Footballguy
Ben played great this year and fantastic leading to the Super Bowl.
Ben choked it up big time, had a couple good plays and a bunch of bad ones - with a couple awful awful plays in between. It also reminds you of the breaks - i.e. the almost sure interception broken up by Hines Ward on a terrible pass against Denver - most teams need to get a SB win.
Anyone who says Ben played anything close to well, managing the game, etc. is lying to themselves at the least. He was putrid in the biggest game.
I would also put him as the best young QB in the league now that Palmer's future has some doubt. I do not, however, think that title will last once Palmer is back and perhaps some other QBs round into form.
Great year for Ben. Horrible day - but he is lucky, it won't matter.
Ben choked it up big time, had a couple good plays and a bunch of bad ones - with a couple awful awful plays in between. It also reminds you of the breaks - i.e. the almost sure interception broken up by Hines Ward on a terrible pass against Denver - most teams need to get a SB win.
Anyone who says Ben played anything close to well, managing the game, etc. is lying to themselves at the least. He was putrid in the biggest game.
I would also put him as the best young QB in the league now that Palmer's future has some doubt. I do not, however, think that title will last once Palmer is back and perhaps some other QBs round into form.
Great year for Ben. Horrible day - but he is lucky, it won't matter.
SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
Yeah, because his 98.6 passer rating in the regular season and 124.8 rating in the 3 playoff games wasn't at all impressive.
Doug Drinen
Moderator
I only have postseason stats back to 1975, but here are the QB ratings of all super bowl QBs (minimum 10 attempts) from 1975--2005. First winners, then losers:
Code:
Phil Simms 1986 150.9Joe Montana 1989 147.6Jim Plunkett 1980 145.0Troy Aikman 1992 140.7Steve Young 1994 134.8Doug Williams 1987 127.9Joe Montana 1984 127.2Terry Bradshaw 1975 122.5Terry Bradshaw 1978 119.2Joe Montana 1988 115.2Ken Stabler 1976 111.7Tom Brady 2004 110.2Troy Aikman 1995 108.8Brett Favre 1996 107.9Jim McMahon 1985 104.2Roger Staubach 1977 102.6Terry Bradshaw 1979 101.9Tom Brady 2003 100.5Joe Montana 1981 100.0Kurt Warner 1999 99.7John Elway 1998 99.2Jim Plunkett 1983 97.4Jeff Hostetler 1990 93.5Mark Rypien 1991 92.0Tom Brady 2001 86.2Trent Dilfer 2000 80.9Brad Johnson 2002 79.9Troy Aikman 1993 77.2Joe Theismann 1982 75.1John Elway 1997 51.9Ben Roethlisberger 2005 22.6Jake Delhomme 2003 113.6Roger Staubach 1978 100.4Ken Anderson 1981 95.2Brett Favre 1997 91.0John Elway 1986 83.6Jim Kelly 1990 81.5Steve McNair 1999 80.1Kurt Warner 2001 78.3Roger Staubach 1975 77.8Donovan McNabb 2004 75.4Vince Ferragamo 1979 70.8Matt Hasselbeck 2005 67.8Jim Kelly 1993 67.1Dan Marino 1984 66.9Frank Reich 1992 60.4Steve Grogan 1985 57.2Stan Humphries 1994 56.1Fran Tarkenton 1976 52.7Neil O'Donnell 1995 51.3David Woodley 1982 50.0Ron Jaworski 1980 49.3Rich Gannon 2002 48.9Norris Weese 1977 47.9Chris Chandler 1998 47.2Drew Bledsoe 1996 46.6Boomer Esiason 1988 46.1Joe Theismann 1983 45.3Jim Kelly 1991 44.8John Elway 1987 36.8John Elway 1989 19.4Kerry Collins 2000 7.1Craig Morton 1977 0.0SYMPHONY X
Footballguy
Isn't it ironic? Ben wears the number 7 because his favorite QB growing up was Johnny Elway.
Ben is being compared mostly to Elway as far as his skillset as a QB goes.
And Elway has the second-worst QB rating as the winning QB of a SB team.
If you draw the parallels, I believe BIG BEN has a BIG BRIGHT future ahead of him.
Ben is being compared mostly to Elway as far as his skillset as a QB goes.
And Elway has the second-worst QB rating as the winning QB of a SB team.
If you draw the parallels, I believe BIG BEN has a BIG BRIGHT future ahead of him.
The Football Freak
Footballguy
Wow, so only three players, win or lose, have every had a worse QB rating. Wow...
