Bradshaw takes on the Mannings (1 Viewer)

[Frenchy Fuqua]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Steinberg says not likely:Link

One concern the Saints don't have, at least from the viewpoint of Leinart's agent, Leigh Steinberg, is Leinart trying to avoid being taken by a franchise whose future beyond 2006 is in doubt, much as Eli Manning did with the San Diego Chargers in 2004 when he, in effect, forced a trade to the Giants.

"That's not going to happen with Matt Leinart," Steinberg said. "New Orleans is a classic city with a wonderful heritage, which I am sure will rebuild.

"What we know of Sean Payton is very positive, and the Saints are a team with some pretty terrific offensive weapons. If New Orleans is interested in Matt, then I am sure Matt will be interested in them."

 

[Jason Wood]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Jeff George pulled the powerplay, as well.Another example of how winning obviates all else. Elway was [rightfully so] villified for his move, but because he was so successful in Denver, over time people no longer looked at him as a selfish guy unwilling to go where he was supposed to.

 

[Hurons]

Bradshaw's quote sums it all up rather well for me.

"My daddy taught me that a long time ago, that you fight your own battles. The only way to shut everybody up is to win."

To each his own.

Until Peyton wins the Super Bowl, I'm afraid he better get used to it.

Peyton is making HUGE jack and potentially at the cost of the team. When you put yourself in that type of a leadership position, then you better prepare yourself for the naysayers if you're not successful.

Without getting into semantics about "successful".. It's clear that if Peyton doesn't win the SB, then he'll continue to hear about it from the media, fans, haters, etc.

So, again.. Winning takes care of everything, just like Terry said.

btw, I can't think of a better person (besides Terry) to speak on this subject considering the amount of flack he took in his first years as the Steelers QB. He was bashed. He won. Now he's a HOFer. I'm sure Peyton would love to follow his path, but until he does, he'll be open to criticism.

It goes with the territory.

Whether it's fair or not, deserved or not, Manning is going to have that label until he wins a Super Bowl. If you were to ask me to bet, I would say he absolutely WILL win at least one SB and when he does, all this talk will vanish away.

As I mentioned in another thread recently, Elway and Marino are classic examples of this. Once Elway won back-to-back Super Bowls, the criticism fell way, way, WAY down and only the most ardent Elway haters moved on to the "well he never won a SB without Terrell Davis." Marino, on the other hand, never won the SB and thus is burdened by that stigma for eternity.

I's fair and deserved.

 

[ICON211]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Thats what I mean. It rarely happens. Almost every player coming out of college plays for the team that drafted them unless the team willingly trades them. Most guys view playing in the NFL as a privelege not a right and are happy to go play for who drafts them.

 

[Joe Bryant]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Thats what I mean. It rarely happens. Almost every player coming out of college plays for the team that drafted them unless the team willingly trades them. Most guys view playing in the NFL as a privelege not a right and are happy to go play for who drafts them.

Hi icon,I think what's rare is the guy having enough money to realistically call the bluff. Eli was already relatively rich.

Already rich #1 NFL picks are pretty rare.

J

 

[Buckychudd]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Thats what I mean. It rarely happens. Almost every player coming out of college plays for the team that drafted them unless the team willingly trades them. Most guys view playing in the NFL as a privelege not a right and are happy to go play for who drafts them.

Hi icon,I think what's rare is the guy having enough money to realistically call the bluff. Eli was already relatively rich.

Already rich #1 NFL picks are pretty rare.

J

.....and Elway had the Baseball threat.

 

[Joe Bryant]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Thats what I mean. It rarely happens. Almost every player coming out of college plays for the team that drafted them unless the team willingly trades them. Most guys view playing in the NFL as a privelege not a right and are happy to go play for who drafts them.

Hi icon,I think what's rare is the guy having enough money to realistically call the bluff. Eli was already relatively rich.

Already rich #1 NFL picks are pretty rare.

J

.....and Elway had the Baseball threat.

Bucky. It's all about other options. It's all about the answer to "What else are you going to do?"The phrase I kept hearing around here was "Eli's Mom already has a big house".

J

 

[Green Apple Splatter]

What other player other than Eli gets to choose which team he plays for coming out of college?

Hi Icon,The answer is any player that is going to be a top pick and has the money already to call the bluff and make good on a threat to hold out and not play.

I think John Elway was the last one.

Matt Leinart or Reggie Bush could do exactly the same thing. It's GM's "golden rule". When you have the gold (and in this case gold plus talent) you make the rules.

It's reality.

J

Thats what I mean. It rarely happens. Almost every player coming out of college plays for the team that drafted them unless the team willingly trades them. Most guys view playing in the NFL as a privelege not a right and are happy to go play for who drafts them.

Hi icon,I think what's rare is the guy having enough money to realistically call the bluff. Eli was already relatively rich.

Already rich #1 NFL picks are pretty rare.

J

.....and Elway had the Baseball threat.

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it. Elway wasn't that good at baseball. If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

 

[houndirish]

This will make great Jerry Springer stuff. I understand both sides. Bradshaw says what he thinks and he's paid to express his opinion. I agree with him that Peyton Manning shouldn't have said what he said for the reasons we're seeing here.

As a father, I can also relate 100% to Archie Manning as it would be tough to hear people rip your son with glee. That's part of why they make the huge dollars in that you have to accept that's how it is and put up with it.

J

Based on the 2005 playoff performances of Eli and Peyton, you can't blame people for ripping them. Archie should shut up and hang out at the senior center more often. Him jumping to their defense every time makes them look like little boys.Like Archie doesn't know that Eli and Peyton have to step up to the plate and deal with adversity if they don't win. Welcome to the NFL.

Is it really fair to rip Eli on his playoff track record at this point? The guy just finished his second year. IIRC a guy who doing excellent in his 2nd playoff stint (Roethlisberger) didn't look so hot the first time around.Eli was also one of the few Giants who didn't get involved in fingerpointing after the loss and instead spoke out about his own poor performance. I'm not advocating Peyton's behavior, although I do think it's being blown out of proportion, but spare me the "Manning's need to quit whining" bit. Eli sucked versus Carolina but he still met the media and took his lumps afterwards.

 

[Buckychudd]

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it.  Elway wasn't that good at baseball.  If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/John_Elway

Was drafted by two baseball teams, Royals in '79 out of high school, Yankees in '81 out of college. Batted .363 as a Sophomore in college.

He might not have been as rich as he is now, but he still would have been a millionaire.

 

[Green Apple Splatter]

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it.  Elway wasn't that good at baseball.  If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/John_Elway

Was drafted by two baseball teams, Royals in '79 out of high school, Yankees in '81 out of college. Batted .363 as a Sophomore in college.

He might not have been as rich as he is now, but he still would have been a millionaire.

If memory serves, he wasn't a highly rated prospect. Lot's of players get drafted out of HS.

Edited to say I could be wrong about Elway as a baseball player. I do remember the media saying no way he would have played baseball. Given that, I'd say that Irsay shouldn't have blinked. The Colts trade the rights to Elway to the Denver Broncos for QB Mark Herrmann, the rights to OL Chris Hinton and a first-round pick in the 1984 draft, which turned out to be Ron Solt. Can you say ROBBED!!

 

[Wadsworth]

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it.  Elway wasn't that good at baseball.  If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/John_Elway

Was drafted by two baseball teams, Royals in '79 out of high school, Yankees in '81 out of college. Batted .363 as a Sophomore in college.

He might not have been as rich as he is now, but he still would have been a millionaire.

If memory serves, he wasn't a highly rated prospect. Lot's of players get drafted out of HS.

I don't know or care about baseball. But he hit over .300 for a Yankees minor league team. That's not bad. But I do agree that almost no one thought he'd skip football for baseball.

 

[redman]

So to summarize, Peyton Manning choked in the playoffs, and then he choked in how he responded to the criticism - have I got that right?

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it.  Elway wasn't that good at baseball.  If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/John_Elway

Was drafted by two baseball teams, Royals in '79 out of high school, Yankees in '81 out of college. Batted .363 as a Sophomore in college.

He might not have been as rich as he is now, but he still would have been a millionaire.

If memory serves, he wasn't a highly rated prospect. Lot's of players get drafted out of HS.

And you have to be damn good to be drafted out of high school.

 

[Chewyguru]

http://img459.imageshack.us/img459/3310/manning9eh.jpg

Peyton hasn't proven to be a top 20 all time QB in my opinion

 

[Sinrman]

This will make great Jerry Springer stuff. I understand both sides. Bradshaw says what he thinks and he's paid to express his opinion. I agree with him that Peyton Manning shouldn't have said what he said for the reasons we're seeing here.

As a father, I can also relate 100% to Archie Manning as it would be tough to hear people rip your son with glee. That's part of why they make the huge dollars in that you have to accept that's how it is and put up with it.

J

 

[brobe4]

Bradshaw just wanted Manning to say Ya'all kicked my butt today.(Bradshaw is a steller ya'all know)

 

[Mr. Vegas]

The problem with Peyton is his body language.

When he is in tight games with NE the last couple of years and with Pitt this year it almost looks like he is ready to cry, his face is pouty, flailing his arms. That is not good out of your QB or leader and I think the team feeds off the negativity. Sensing doom.

Then blaming your line was the last straw.

He can't take the heat. He will never win the Super Bowl.

He's a great Fantasy QB,and a choke of a NFL playoff QB.

I hear Colts are looking for a WR who stands 11' 9''. Maybe Manning won't

over throw Him?

Vandy was ask what happen,He said 'They moved the Goal Posts'.

Wide right.

 

[Green Apple Splatter]

The problem with Peyton is his body language. 

  When he is in tight games with NE the last couple of years and with Pitt this year it almost looks like he is ready to cry, his face is pouty, flailing his arms. That is not good out of your QB or leader and I think the team feeds off the negativity. Sensing doom.

Then blaming your line was the last straw.

Body language?, lol. Looking ready to cry? That's a good one. Just because you don't like the way he looks, doesn't mean his signals are any more negative than other QBs upset with something. Flailing arms? That's what he does when he's changing plays. The only thing from his body language what I see that could cause you to think it's negative, is he does get a pained look on his face after mistakes are made. Hell, a lot of QBs do that. I don't think I've ever seen so much bashing of one player in my life, and some of it is ridiculous, like your post. Hating for hating's sake seems to dominate this message board.

 

[djcolts]

So to summarize, Peyton Manning choked in the playoffs, and then he choked in how he responded to the criticism - have I got that right?

Um...yeah, that covers it.

 

[redman]

The baseball threat wasn't much of a threat and most knew it.  Elway wasn't that good at baseball.  If Irsay had called his bluff, Elway would have been a Colt.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/John_Elway

Was drafted by two baseball teams, Royals in '79 out of high school, Yankees in '81 out of college. Batted .363 as a Sophomore in college.

He might not have been as rich as he is now, but he still would have been a millionaire.

If memory serves, he wasn't a highly rated prospect. Lot's of players get drafted out of HS.

I don't know or care about baseball. But he hit over .300 for a Yankees minor league team. That's not bad. But I do agree that almost no one thought he'd skip football for baseball.

He also had a 90+ mph fastball (not that that should be a surprise). That alone will get you looks.

 

[Jason Wood]

For what it's worth, Stink Schlereth [who in my opinion is the most balanced NFL talking head on ESPN], piled onto the Manning train this morning on Mike & Mike. Stink said Manning didn't play well, and also suggested that the line play was attrocious and a problem with the scheme [he said he was screaming at his TV because the protection breakdowns were easily correctable], but where he took Manning to task is his post-game comments vis-a-vis blaming the line. Stink said, as a former player, to have your QB say, in essence, "I don't want to be a bad teammate and throw my boys under the bus, BUT..." is something that will NOT look well for him and will not be forgotten. He reiterated what many of us have said, whether the loss was his fault or not, the QB has to take the blame, that's the byproduct of being the highest paid and most visible player on the offense.

 

[Ksquared]

JasonI heard Mark S on ESPN both after the Indy game and this morning on M & M and he stated the same thing both times. That the blocking scheme was flawed from the beginning and the coaches never made any adjustments. Mark explained after the game on Sunday on ESPN radio that the guards were being required to read which side the LB was coming around the DL and then move and block them. The other area that was a problem was having the guard slide outside the tackle to stop an overload blitz from the outside. I know his feeling was the responsibility for making the adjustments were on the coaches head and not Manning's. But Mark made it very clear you cannot make the stupid statement that Manning did after the game and there is no excuse for having done so. Your the leader, act like one and take the blame whether it is deserved or not. I am one of those that thinks Manning gets ripped more than he should, but I completely agree with this opinion.

 

[softball]

Someone should point out to Archie that he is unqualified to comment on playoff football.Since he had no experience with playoff football.Eit to add: And if Vanderpush can maintain his spot on the team after ripping Manning. I'm sure Manning will be alright with his teamates after this.....

 

[Super King]

I don't hear any other parents complaining about the media's comments toward their children.  I think Archie needs to let his boys fight for themselves.

I believe Phil Simms did something similar with Steve Young this year.

Don't forget Papa Soldier (i.e., Kellen Winslow)

that's soulja.

 

[Da Guru]

Has a Manning ever won a title at any level??

 

[TommyGilmore]

Has a Manning ever won a title at any level??

Peyton was 34-5 as a starter but they never won the State Championship.