British lawmaker shot dead (1 Viewer)

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

BIRSTALL, England, June 16 (Reuters) - A British member of Parliament was shot dead in the street in northern England on Thursday, causing deep shock across Britain and the suspension of campaigning for next week's referendum on the country's EU membership.

Jo Cox, 41, a lawmaker for the opposition Labour Party and vocal supporter of Britain remaining in the European Union, was attacked as she prepared to hold a meeting with constituents in Birstall near Leeds.

Media reports said she had been shot and stabbed.

SEE ALSO: Orlando gunman penned chilling posts during attack

West Yorkshire Police said a 52-year-old man was arrested by officers nearby and weapons including a firearm recovered. The motive for the attack was not immediately known.

"The whole of the Labour Party and Labour family - and indeed the whole country - will be in shock at the horrific murder of Jo Cox today," Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn said in a statement.

Prime Minister David Cameron said the killing of Cox, who was married with two children and had worked on U.S. President Barack Obama's 2008 election campaign, was a tragedy.

"We have lost a great star," the Conservative prime minister said in a statement. "She was a great campaigning MP with huge compassion, with a big heart. It is dreadful, dreadful news."

British lawmakers are not in parliament ahead of the June 23 referendum on whether Britainshould remain in the EU.

The rival referendum campaign groups said they were suspending activities for the day and Cameron said he would pull out of a planned rally in Gibraltar, the British territory on the southern coast of Spain.

It was not immediately clear what the impact would be on the referendum

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Sad, horrible. 

More info here, it's an open question how this guy was politically motivated, that is was he aligned with a particular group, or if he himself was known to be politically ideological. (Edited).

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jo-cox-shot-dead-britain-first-denies-involvement-labour-mp-birstall-shooting-stabbing-attack-a7086001.html

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I have to ask the question, since there are no guns in England, where did this man get a gun? Are there police armed with guns or citizens with guns who could take this individual out? I noticed they were arresting the man, highly doubtful he would be taken alive in America after gunning down the politician although it has happened. 

Just curious how that part of it plays out in Europe because I thought most of those countries do not allow their citizens to own any guns, yes/no?

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

Sad, horrible. 

More info here, it's an open question whether this was politically motivated.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jo-cox-shot-dead-britain-first-denies-involvement-labour-mp-birstall-shooting-stabbing-attack-a7086001.html

Not sure how there was any question from the eyewitness accounts. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Not sure how there was any question from the eyewitness accounts. 

I edited already, it was stupid phrasing. The article I posted talks about whether he was motivated by a particular group.

More info on the killer here.

http://www.itv.com/news/2016-06-16/jo-cox-killing-what-do-we-know-about-suspect-tommy-mair/

 

[BigSteelThrill]

I have to ask the question, since there are no fewer guns in England, where did this man get a gun? Are there police armed with guns or citizens with guns who could take this individual out? I noticed they were arresting the man, highly doubtful he would be taken alive in America after gunning down the politician although it has happened. 

Just curious how that part of it plays out in Europe because I thought most of those countries do not allow their citizens to own any guns, yes/no?

It makes it harder, not impossible.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

I have to ask the question, since there are no guns in England, where did this man get a gun? Are there police armed with guns or citizens with guns who could take this individual out? I noticed they were arresting the man, highly doubtful he would be taken alive in America after gunning down the politician although it has happened. 

Just curious how that part of it plays out in Europe because I thought most of those countries do not allow their citizens to own any guns, yes/no?

Apparently it was a homemade gun.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

It makes it harder, not impossible.

Then it really is frightening all the guns flying off the shelves in America right now, how are they going to outlaw them when millions are in circulation? 

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Apparently it was a homemade gun.

Muchos Gracias 

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Then it really is frightening all the guns flying off the shelves in America right now, how are they going to outlaw them when millions are in circulation? 

Same as any law.

And "because its tough" according to some isn't a good reason to not have laws.

If the penalty for having illegal guns is high enough -- people will get rid of them. They will just pick another form of entertainment.

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

Same as any law.

And "because its tough" according to some isn't a good reason to not have laws.

If the penalty for having illegal guns is high enough -- law abiding people will get rid of them. They will just pick another form of entertainment.

fixed

 

[BigSteelThrill]

fixed

Yet, you then have less guns and less guns manufactured and the intended result begins.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Same as any law.

And "because its tough" according to some isn't a good reason to not have laws.

If the penalty for having illegal guns is high enough -- people will get rid of them. They will just pick another form of entertainment.

Except I don't feel it's entertainment but I get your vibe.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

A few more details on the killer, Mair, corrections welcome:

- he occasionally helped at the library where he shot Cox.

- known locally as an avid gardener.

- he was mentally ill, undergoing psychotherapy.

- he comes from a mixed race family, though he is not.

- neighbors and the brother says he was apolitical but...,

- sounds like the gun was homemade.

- the gun was possibly built from a manual he bought from a Brit neo nazi group in 1999.

- he was associated with at least one other extremist group, pro South African apartheid.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/1297840/receipts-emerge-of-diy-explosives-books-bought-by-tommy-mair-including-a-guide-to-building-a-home-made-gun/?CMP=spklr-_-Editorial-_-TWITTER-_-TheSunNewspaper-_-20160617-_-News-_-496356870-_-Imageandlink

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Is that why the average person who owns a gun... owns 8+ guns?  We all know better.

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

Yet, you then have less guns and less guns manufactured and the intended result begins.

Yes and in this world we will no longer have famine, everyone will love one another and actually value human lives. Looking forward to it. 

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Yes and in this world will no longer have famine and everyone will love one another and actually value human lives. Looking forward to it. 

Nice rant, I guess. You obviously didnt like it actually working towards its intended result.

I wasnt being for/against -- just fixing some erroneous statements being made as a counter to the laws possibility.

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

Nice rant, I guess. You obviously didnt like it actually working towards its intended result.

I wasnt being for/against -- just fixing some erroneous statements being made as a counter to the laws possibility.

Depends on what your "intended result" is. Is your intention to stop my grandmothers ability to defend herself from two intruders that broke into her house, tried to rob and rape her but luckily she was able to get to my grandfathers gun?

 

[BigSteelThrill]

In the particular facet we are talking about >>> the intended result would be lowering the amount of guns to a point where ...

Then it really is frightening all the guns flying off the shelves in America right now, how are they going to outlaw them when millions are in circulation? 

... this dumb silly argument isnt being made.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

In the particular facet we are talking about >>> the intended result would be lowering the amount of guns to a point where ...

... this dumb argument isnt being made.

It's not an argument, it's a fact. Why the personal insults when we are just discussing things? Can you just dial that part back a smidge, thanks. Just discuss your side or way of looking at things. I just said it seems crazy with the amount flying off the shelves, millions will be in circulation, that's a big problem. You dismiss it as nothing and look down upon me for suggesting it in order to make it appear you have a much stronger case, it's just smoke and mirrors and insults.

It's not a dumb argument, it's a logical question to wonder about all the guns in current circulation, it's not a massive road block to any of the progress you want bu ### must be dealt with. You just dismiss it to paint some utopian thought. 

Do you really believe lawmakers are going to take everyone's guns away? So stop acting like a few people are the hold outs to progress, it's not a dumb argument, it's on the forefront of a lot of folks' minds. 

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Its not you MOP, its the argument. Its not like it was a novel idea to bemoan that the numbers were already too high and it wont be easy peasey so don't bother trying. That is a dumb silly approach. And it will be made again by someone else.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Suspected killer of British lawmaker had ties to neo-Nazi group, watchdog says


...

According to documents obtained by the Southern Poverty Law Center, the U.S.-based organization that tracks extremist groups, Mair was a longtime supporter of the National Alliance, a once-prominent white supremacist group. In 1999, Mair bought a manual from the organization that included instructions on how to build a pistol, the center said.

... Witnesses told British media that the assailant appeared to have been waiting for Cox outside a library in Birstall where she had been meeting constituents as part of her usual weekly schedule.

Witnesses recounted a savage attack in which the assailant targeted Cox with a gun as well as with a knife. The attacker continued to stab and kick Cox even after she had fallen to the ground, bleeding.

...

The last British lawmaker to be killed while in office was Conservative Ian Gow in 1990 from a bomb placed under his car by the Irish Republican Army. The same year, a former Parliament member, Donald Kaberry, was wounded in an IRA bombing and died the next year.

The attack on Cox echoed the 2011 shooting of then-Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-Ariz.) in Tucson, also while meeting constituents. Giffords was severely wounded but survived. On Thursday, she tweeted: “Absolutely sickened to hear of the assassination of Jo Cox. She was young, courageous, and hardworking. A rising star, mother, and wife.”

Hithem Ben Abdallah, a resident who told reporters he had seen the assault firsthand, described how a good Samaritan initially tried to stop the attacker from stabbing Cox. But the attacker, who was wearing a white baseball cap, then pulled a gun from a bag and scuffled with Cox before shooting her at least twice.

“He was fighting with her and wrestling with her and then the gun went off twice and then she fell between two cars and I came and saw her bleeding on the floor,” Abdallah said, according to Britain’s Press Association.

Cox, the mother of two young children, was elected in May 2015. She also was national chair of Labour Women’s Network. On her Twitter page, she described herself as “mum, proud Yorkshire lass, boat dweller, mountain climber and former aid worker.” She previously worked as an adviser to the Britain-based aid group Oxfam.

Nick Grono, head of the Freedom Fund, an anti-slavery group where Cox once worked, said she “lived her ideals.” She and her husband would spend Christmas vacations in the Balkans, working with children who had been traumatized by the conflict there, he said. He also said she enjoyed “hiking everywhere around Scotland.”

...

Before Cox’s death was announced Thursday afternoon, her husband posted a photo of her on Twitter standing beside their houseboat in London.

Brendan Cox later released a statement saying his wife would have had no regrets about her life.

“Jo believed in a better world and she fought for it every day of her life with an energy, and a zest for life that would exhaust most people,” he wrote. “She would have wanted two things above all else to happen now, one that our precious children are bathed in love and two, that we all unite to fight against the hatred that killed her. Hate doesn’t have a creed, race or religion, it is poisonous.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/suspected-killer-of-british-lawmaker-jo-cox-ties-neo-nazi-ties-group-says/2016/06/17/2067ea0a-33ef-11e6-ab9d-1da2b0f24f93_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_britain-425am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

- It's not mentioned here but Mair worked at that library as a volunteer occasionally, this has a bit of an Oswald effect here because Cox just happened to appear where Mair was.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

In 2010 Mr Mair, then aged 46, told a local newspaper about his mental health issues. He volunteered at the Oakwell Hall country park in Birstall that year after learning about an opportunity through the Mirfield-based Pathways Day Centre for adults with mental illness..

He said at the time: “I can honestly say it has done me more good than all the psychotherapy and medication in the world.

“Many people who suffer from mental illness are socially isolated and disconnected from society, feelings of worthlessness are also common mainly caused by long-term unemployment.

“All these problems are alleviated by doing voluntary work.

“Getting out of the house and meeting new people is a good thing, but more important in my view is doing physically demanding and useful labour.

“When you have finished there is a feeling of achievement which is emotionally rewarding and psychologically fulfilling.

“For people for whom full-time, paid employment is not possible for a variety of reasons, voluntary work offers a socially positive and therapeutic alternative.”

Pathways is described on the South West Yorkshire Partnership NHS Foundation Trust website as a “team that offers support to people experiencing mental health difficulties”.

Tommy Mair lived in a small semi detached house which last night was cordoned off and under police guard

Neighbours of Mr Mair's said the suspect was “quiet but very helpful” and that he had lived in the house for 40 years. He was understood to have lived with his grandmother until she died about 20 years ago. Since then he has lived on his own and was believed to have never had any full time employment.

Local said they did not think he had a job or drove a car, and described how he would do gardening chores for local people.

David Pickles said: “He’s lived there longer than me and I’ve lived here since 1975. I still can’t believe it. He’s the last guy I would have thought of.

“He’s just quiet. He kept himself to himself. He lived by himself. He’s been on his own for about 20 years.

“I’ve never seen a lot of people visiting or anything like that, but he likes gardening. He did a lot of people’s gardens round here. But he did it quietly.”

Mr Pickles said he did not know of any connection between his neighbour and Ms Cox.

Another neighbour, who did not want to be named, said: “We’ve known him quite a lot of years. I’ve known him since I was young. He lived with his grandmother in that house, she died a few years ago. He was a bit of a loner. It’s a bit of a shock - he did everyone’s gardens.

“I can’t say a wrong word about him, he was so quiet. It’s come as a shock to everybody.”

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/homenews/14562830.Jo_Cox_killing__Scot_held_over_MP_s_death_had_a_history_of_mental_health_issues/?ref=rss

 

[cstu]

Does anyone believe he would have been anything but a Trump voter if he lived here?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Does anyone believe he would have been anything but a Trump voter if he lived here?

I think we already know that Duke & Co. are supporting Trump, so yeah he would. 

I was surprised to learn that National Alliance is US based.

 

[Tom Servo]

- sounds like the gun was homemade

And we're having this latest gun control slap fight...why?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

And we're having this latest gun control slap fight...why?

And it was a really crude design too, it might have been made of pipe by the look of it.

That was from 1999, so that doesn't even get to the possibilities of modern 3D printing going on.

 

[Tom Servo]

And it was a really crude design too, it might have been made of pipe by the look of it.

That was from 1999, so that doesn't even get to the possibilities of modern 3D printing going on.

So if I can print my own gun, more gun control seems...pointless?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

So if I can print my own gun, more gun control seems...pointless?

This goes with the Paris and Brussels attacks as far as I'm concerned. Obviously the UK and France have extremely strict gun laws and reality is that terrorists and murderers are going to get their guns.

As far as the far right terrorist aspect, people should not think that terrorism ends with one kind of terrorism, everything has a reaction, it can just keep escalating. We have the Iraq War and then the pullout and then Syrian civil war and Isis and then mass migration and then cultural tension.... which leads to an increase in racial and nationalistic groups who 'push back', this can go on and on, we are living in an age of escalating social and political violence and I really hope somehow our leaders get it in hand.

 

[Tom Servo]

This goes with the Paris and Brussels attacks as far as I'm concerned. Obviously the UK and France have extremely strict gun laws and reality is that terrorists and murderers are going to get their guns.

As far as the far right terrorist aspect, people should not think that terrorism ends with one kind of terrorism, everything has a reaction, it can just keep escalating. We have the Iraq War and then the pullout and then Syrian civil war and Isis and then mass migration and then cultural tension.... which leads to an increase in racial and nationalistic groups who 'push back', this can go on and on, we are living in an age of escalating social and political violence and I really hope somehow our leaders get it in hand.

Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of birth pains. - Matthew 24:7-8

 

[The General]

This story didn't seem to get very much attention. Act of terriorism, someone was killed, a public figure no less. This type of thing seems made for top headlines and 30 pages.

 

[Eephus]

This story didn't seem to get very much attention. Act of terriorism, someone was killed, a public figure no less. This type of thing seems made for top headlines and 30 pages.

It's a big story in the UK press

 

[comfortably numb]

This story didn't seem to get very much attention. Act of terriorism, someone was killed, a public figure no less. This type of thing seems made for top headlines and 30 pages.

His name isn't Muhammad Achtef Zaire.

 

[The General]

It's a big story in the UK press

You don't say.

 

[cstu]

This story didn't seem to get very much attention. Act of terriorism, someone was killed, a public figure no less. This type of thing seems made for top headlines and 30 pages.

It's no fun to discuss when the terrorist is white. 

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

UK - 50-60 gun homicides annually

US - 8,000+ gun homicides annually

UK citizen kills a politician with a homemade gun.

US reaction: see told you gun laws are pointless!

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of birth pains. - Matthew 24:7-8

Things that have occurred throughout human history occurring now is definitely a sign.

 

[St. Louis Bob]

I have to ask the question, since there are no guns in England, where did this man get a gun? Are there police armed with guns or citizens with guns who could take this individual out? I noticed they were arresting the man, highly doubtful he would be taken alive in America after gunning down the politician although it has happened. 

Just curious how that part of it plays out in Europe because I thought most of those countries do not allow their citizens to own any guns, yes/no?

Its a law, not magic.

 

[The General]

UK - 50-60 gun homicides annually

US - 8,000+ gun homicides annually

UK citizen kills a politician with a homemade gun.

US reaction: see told you gun laws are pointless!

Agreed, that is an odd thing to take from this.

 

[sho nuff]

So if I can print my own gun, more gun control seems...pointless?

No

 

[Insomniac]

Does anyone believe he would have been anything but a Trump voter if he lived here?

Instead of saying "Britain First" would he have said "Make Britain Great again"?

 

[Boston]

It's no fun to discuss when the terrorist is white. 

No...I think the difference is everyone pretty much agrees he is a scumbag and no one is trying to defend his actions...not much room to have a debate when logic prevails...

 

[The Z Machine]

No...I think the difference is everyone pretty much agrees he is a scumbag and no one is trying to defend his actions...not much room to have a debate when logic prevails...

I doubt there's many people defending scumbag terrorists motivated by a corrupted interpretation of Islam, but those threads go on for days...  

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

The difference is its not US and it's not a big slaughter (thank god). If this were a US Congresswoman it would be different IMO.

 

[Tom Servo]

No

No what?

 

[sho nuff]

No what?

No fat chicks?

Or I answered no to your question...you know, that I had quoted.

 

[Pedro Cerrano Fan]

RIP Jo Cox.