ATC1
Footballguy
http://bucssoundoff.tboblogs.com/index.php...f/related/C440/
Man sounds like D. Jax last year. We will need to keep an eye out.
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Caddy sat out (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ATC1
- Start date
M
MLBrandow
Guest
Colmer was expected to be cut, so this is no news. Recurring problems from a condition he had in college.
Marc Levin
Hangs out with Oscar Zeta Acosta
I'm sorry, but with Caddie I have a big "uh-oh" attached to him. I have more confidence in Brown handling a fulltime load than Caddie.
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MLBrandow
Guest
we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
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Marc Levin
Hangs out with Oscar Zeta Acosta
yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
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I would gladly take Caddy at 5 personally. I mean he showed he has skills last year, the Bucs picked two offensive linemen in the first and second round this year and Gruden loves the kid...
Do what you want but Caddy will be mine in two or three out of 4 FF leagues I am in.
Do what you want but Caddy will be mine in two or three out of 4 FF leagues I am in.
M
MLBrandow
Guest
Okay. We'll revisit after TC then, when your rankings are final. Sound good?yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
Colin Dowling
Footballguy
I am extremely excited about he Carnell Williams era in Tampa.... I would place him squarly in Tier 2 w/ Portis this season.
Colin
Colin
Vicktimized
Footballguy
You're not worried about Alstott jacking carries at the goal?
Colin Dowling
Footballguy
No. I said 14 months ago and I'll say it again: Carnell Williams has some of the best Ballion ("balane" + "vision" = "Ballion") of any back in the NFL. I feel that even at their best, he's a better goalline back then Alstott except in situations where Gruden wants to say "Heck with geting fancy, run it hard core up the middle..."Colin
Vicktimized
Footballguy
Probably true, but last season Alstott still stole the short yardage carries. Williams was dinged, but might Gruden use Alstott there to lighten the load on him?
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MLBrandow
Guest
Alstott will barely see any PT this year. Why would there be worry?He's not the starting fullback, he won't be a big factor in the receiving game with Cadillac and Pittman hogging receptions, and he won't be a factor on the goal-line with Williams getting all the carries.
He came back to be a locker room presence and backup goal-line carrier. I don't see why people can't accept that. He did.
Better yet, why don't you go ahead and post your rankings every week like Marc does?TIA.Okay. We'll revisit after TC then, when your rankings are final. Sound good?yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
J
Marc Levin
Hangs out with Oscar Zeta Acosta
my rankings will be "final" the day before the real games start.But we can revisit this as much as you wish.Okay. We'll revisit after TC then, when your rankings are final. Sound good?yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Brandow certainly seems to think he knows a lot.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Given the softness (meaning injuries, not playing style) that Caddy has shown, I think it's entirely necessary to spell him on plays where he will be taking abuse such as the goal-line.
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MLBrandow
Guest
That was last year.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Ok, new coach this year or something?
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MLBrandow
Guest
No, last year he was being spelled to avoid overuse. He didn't show any wear, but it was just for precautionary reasons. And it wasn't even the whole season. After Cadillac was fine, Alstott barely saw any goal-line time. I'm not sure why everyone is so hyped up over a four game stretch where Cadillac was still recovering from injury.This is a case where going off numbers alone is a bad idea, and you need to watch football games. Cadillac saw significantly more of the goal-line carries once he was at full speed later in the season.
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Alstott carried the ball 3 times in the last 4 games. Carnell got EVERY big short yardage carry, except for one in the playoffs. When Alstott was stuffed on 3rd and 1 against Washington, Gruden called a pass play on 4th.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Caddy proved to be more effective in short yardage and goal line situations by his play than Alsuck was last year.
Expiriment over.
Expiriment over.
Otis
Footballguy
Better yet, why don't you go ahead and post your rankings every week like Marc does?TIA.Okay. We'll revisit after TC then, when your rankings are final. Sound good?yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
J
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MLBrandow
Guest
J is just bitter because his boy Chester Taylor is going to stink it up too 
just kidding J, you know I love you.
(please don't ban me again)
just kidding J, you know I love you.
(please don't ban me again)
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
How exactly did he avoid overuse? Get real man! He got run into the ground that first month.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
gregjcross
Footballguy
Brando:
Saying Caddy didnt suffer "any wear" last year bursts the credibility from anything you are posturing. The injury was from overuse, its well documented. He was out for a number of weeks after getting 25+ carries game after game; and while this can happen to any RB you have to think the coaching staff will be acutely aware of it. Gruden usually establishes a back and also spreads the carries around at the goalline as he did in OAK.
Gruden is addicted to the run unlike his time in OAK so this helps all Tampa backs
Saying Caddy didnt suffer "any wear" last year bursts the credibility from anything you are posturing. The injury was from overuse, its well documented. He was out for a number of weeks after getting 25+ carries game after game; and while this can happen to any RB you have to think the coaching staff will be acutely aware of it. Gruden usually establishes a back and also spreads the carries around at the goalline as he did in OAK.
Gruden is addicted to the run unlike his time in OAK so this helps all Tampa backs
goonsquad
Think different.
Caddy suffered an ankle and foot injury in Week 4. Is it really "well documented" that he would not have suffered the same injury if he had less carries in the previous weeks? There's no chance the injury was just a fluke ankle injury?Gruden didn't seem worried enough to limit his carries late last season, as he went 29/112/2 in Week 14 and 31/150/1 in Week 16 last year.
Mighty Mice
Footballguy
FWIW I was at Bucs camp all morning at Disney Wide World of Sports and viewed the entire practice. Caddy took part in every drill and looked very crisp in 7 on 7 drills and 11 on 11's. Both he and Alstott were in on goalline packages (split the reps).
He did have 2 ugly drops in 7 on 7's, and a third in individual passing drills. Pittman looked smoother catching the rock by far, but that was to be expected.
D.Boston stood on the side after the individual drills, no 7 on 7's or 11 on 11's for him. From where I was though he did look alot smaller than I remember him. Much less "bulked up".
Clayton and Galloway both looked very solid. Clayton had a great one handed grab on a slant route.
Just $.02 from a guy in the stands.
He did have 2 ugly drops in 7 on 7's, and a third in individual passing drills. Pittman looked smoother catching the rock by far, but that was to be expected.
D.Boston stood on the side after the individual drills, no 7 on 7's or 11 on 11's for him. From where I was though he did look alot smaller than I remember him. Much less "bulked up".
Clayton and Galloway both looked very solid. Clayton had a great one handed grab on a slant route.
Just $.02 from a guy in the stands.
Mighty Mice
Footballguy
It was kind of hard to follow every player through all the drills. I don't remember Clayton not catching anything thrown at him, except the one deep sideline route where I thought he was overthrown. Galloway burned J.Boldin on a deep one. I thought the tandem was very solid.
I was there too.I thought Clayton looked pretty terrible, fwiw. He did have that nice one-handed catch I guess.
gregjcross
Footballguy
SNIP
Caddy suffered an ankle and foot injury in Week 4. Is it really "well documented" that he would not have suffered the same injury if he had less carries in the previous weeks? There's no chance the injury was just a fluke ankle injury?
SNIP
Read the links
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7279844/did/9678922
http://www.fanball.com/fb/playerNewsBreake...d=3389&id=53168
Gruden kept riding him with a foot injury. So, because he was being OVERused with a hurt foot, he compensated then had the hammy injury on the same leg.
This extended his time out of games.
Caddy suffered an ankle and foot injury in Week 4. Is it really "well documented" that he would not have suffered the same injury if he had less carries in the previous weeks? There's no chance the injury was just a fluke ankle injury?
SNIP
Read the links
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7279844/did/9678922
http://www.fanball.com/fb/playerNewsBreake...d=3389&id=53168
Gruden kept riding him with a foot injury. So, because he was being OVERused with a hurt foot, he compensated then had the hammy injury on the same leg.
This extended his time out of games.
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goonsquad
Think different.
IIRC, Cadillac came out and said that he didn't fully disclose the severity of the injury to the coaching staff. So he may have come back from injury too soon and struggled because of it, but that has no bearing on your claim that it was well documented that his initial injury was from overuse due to repeated weeks of 25+ carries.It was a fluke injury. He missed three weeks, came back too soon and struggled for three more. All it shows is that he was ineffective while playing on an injured ankle. Nothing more.
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MLBrandow
Guest
You really, really, really need to watch more football games rather than just mouth off like you're doing.2-10-DET18 (10:40) C.Williams left tackle to DET 6 for 12 yards (K.Kennedy).
That was the play where Williams was injured. It had nothing to do with wear, just the way that he cut. It was his first run of the game, and would have been an easy break for a TD. He blew by Kennoy Kennedy, but got caught from behind because he started limping.
Similarly, when he came back, he hurt himself again on a goofy missed-tackle that caused Cadillac to pull his hamstring. Both were the result of the same type of move that he said he corrected in the offseason and it was a complete nonissue.
I bet I've said this (as well as Capella) a half dozen or more times this year.
And Gruden wasn't "riding him" when he was hurt. He wanted to leave him out of the game, and Cadillac kept saying "put me back in coach" etc etc. So Gruden put him back in, and he just further hurt himself.
Anyone that actually watched the Bucs games will tell you this. Anyone that just looks at game logs on nfl.com will tell you he broke down. If you choose to believe game logs over game film, more power to you. It just means I'll be able to grab him on the turn instead of the middle of the round.
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
My fantasy leagues tend to score off the game logs than the game film. Are you guys predicting that Cadillac is capable of carrying the rock 480 times this season? Because you sure like to trot out the games with the huge amounts of carries as evidence that he can handle it.
And as far as his injury not coming from overuse, that's possible I guess. But every injury is the result of a single incident "breaking the camel's back." I mean Earl Campbell's or Terrell Davis' career, it's assumed, were cut short by overuse. However you can look to specific injuries as the cause of these breakdowns.
To say that Caddy is capable of huge amounts of carries is simply homerism and folly. Here's what I've been able to dig up on him at Wikipedia:
2001: In 2001, he played in nine games before breaking his collarbone and finished the season with 614 yards on 120 carries (5.1 avg.) and six touchdowns.
2002: The 2002 season also ended prematurely for Williams as he broke his left fibula against Florida and missed the last six games of the season. He was able to amass 745 yards on 141 attempts (5.3 avg.) and 10 touchdowns in only seven games prior to the injury.
2003: In 2003, he stayed healthy and set an Auburn single-season record with 17 touchdowns and gained 1,307 yards on 241 attempts (5.4 avg.).
2004: He led the team in rushing for the third time with 1,165 yards on 239 carries (4.9 avg.) and scored 12 touchdowns.
2005: 290 carries 1178 yards.
He had a career high in carries last season. He did so and got hurt. He's hurt again right now. He just might not have the wherewithal to carry much more than that.
And as far as his injury not coming from overuse, that's possible I guess. But every injury is the result of a single incident "breaking the camel's back." I mean Earl Campbell's or Terrell Davis' career, it's assumed, were cut short by overuse. However you can look to specific injuries as the cause of these breakdowns.
To say that Caddy is capable of huge amounts of carries is simply homerism and folly. Here's what I've been able to dig up on him at Wikipedia:
2001: In 2001, he played in nine games before breaking his collarbone and finished the season with 614 yards on 120 carries (5.1 avg.) and six touchdowns.
2002: The 2002 season also ended prematurely for Williams as he broke his left fibula against Florida and missed the last six games of the season. He was able to amass 745 yards on 141 attempts (5.3 avg.) and 10 touchdowns in only seven games prior to the injury.
2003: In 2003, he stayed healthy and set an Auburn single-season record with 17 touchdowns and gained 1,307 yards on 241 attempts (5.4 avg.).
2004: He led the team in rushing for the third time with 1,165 yards on 239 carries (4.9 avg.) and scored 12 touchdowns.
2005: 290 carries 1178 yards.
He had a career high in carries last season. He did so and got hurt. He's hurt again right now. He just might not have the wherewithal to carry much more than that.
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
RB Cadillac Williams isn't convinced that his foot problems last year weren't the result of poor-fitting shoes. That's why he flew to Oregon during the offseason to have Nike custom fit him.
"They measured my foot and everything and had me do some computer running and they actually customized a shoe for my foot," Williams said. "[They fit them] for my arch and everything."
Williams, who sat out most of Friday's workouts with a sore back, received his new shoes Saturday morning. He tested them out during the afternoon practice and gave them high marks.
"They feel real good," said Williams, who participated fully in both workouts Saturday. "Usually with my cleats, when I make cuts and things, they slide and stuff. But these, they stay put. There's no movement with them."
http://www.tbo.com
"They measured my foot and everything and had me do some computer running and they actually customized a shoe for my foot," Williams said. "[They fit them] for my arch and everything."
Williams, who sat out most of Friday's workouts with a sore back, received his new shoes Saturday morning. He tested them out during the afternoon practice and gave them high marks.
"They feel real good," said Williams, who participated fully in both workouts Saturday. "Usually with my cleats, when I make cuts and things, they slide and stuff. But these, they stay put. There's no movement with them."
http://www.tbo.com
goonsquad
Think different.
Please. No one on this board is predicting 480 carries for Caddy or any other RB for that matter. Quit with the hyperbole. All I'm saying is that there is simply no direct evidence that Caddy is injury-prone or breaks down from 20-25 carries per game. In fact, your bolded stats for '03 and '04 show that Caddy can handle a heavy workload without breaking down. 240 carries over an 11 game schedule averages to 22 carries per game, injury free, for two years straight. Again, there is no evidence to say that the broken bones from '01 and '02 were anything but fluke injuries. I see no reason to think that Caddy can't handle a workload of 320-350 carries next year.
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MLBrandow
Guest
How many starting rookie RBs do you think set career highs in carries?Take a guess.
I don't think I've ever read as much misinformation and distortion of numbers as from you in this thread.
nittanylion
Footballguy
"It's gotta be the shoes!!!"Better yet, why don't you go ahead and post your rankings every week like Marc does?TIA.Okay. We'll revisit after TC then, when your rankings are final. Sound good?yup. and Caddie at 11.I have no reason to make a bet - I release (and change) my rankings on a weekly basis.we should make a bet.Don't you have RB like #6?
J
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MLBrandow
Guest
I looked for it and couldn't find it, sorry. I'd bet the house against Alstott seeing significant goal-line work though.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
With some work I could probobly break it down for you zamboni..
But lets just say from watching the games last year.. I own Caddy in 2 dynasty leagues.. I watched Caddy do better in short yardage and GL situations and the Bucs then stopped using Alsuck in those situations all together. You can check the game logs for confirmation.
Thats the fact jack.
I see nothing changing it moving forward.
But lets just say from watching the games last year.. I own Caddy in 2 dynasty leagues.. I watched Caddy do better in short yardage and GL situations and the Bucs then stopped using Alsuck in those situations all together. You can check the game logs for confirmation.
Thats the fact jack.
I see nothing changing it moving forward.
Marc Levin
Hangs out with Oscar Zeta Acosta
I'm not sure I agree, considering he came back from his early season injury, played the rest of the year, and averaged nearly 21 carries per game over the last 8 games without incident - over those last 8 games, he averaged 85 rush yards per game, .5 TDs per game, and 4.1 per carry. Those are pretty good numbers.
