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Classic Album Discussion Thread: The Kinks-Lola Versus Powerman and the Moneygoround, Pt. 1 (1 Viewer)

timschochet said:
But the real star of the album is Stevie Nicks. “Rhiannon” is her best ever rock song and “Landslide” is her best ever ballad; both are all time classics that will still be played 100 years from now. 
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I love this thread, but I think that's really overstating the staying power of these songs. I personally have never even heard "Rhiannon." The only time I hear "Landslide" anymore is in the dentist's chair. Fleetwood Mac, to me, is boring as heck for some reason. But thanks for the thread again, I don't want to come off poorly.  

 
rockaction said:
I love this thread, but I think that's really overstating the staying power of these songs. I personally have never even heard "Rhiannon." The only time I hear "Landslide" anymore is in the dentist's chair. Fleetwood Mac, to me, is boring as heck for some reason. But thanks for the thread again, I don't want to come off poorly.  
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You must've heard Rhiannon.

I like Fleetwood Mac, but this version of the band isn't anything that excites me. Hipster alert: I prefer the Green/Kirwan/Spencer band.

 
timschochet said:
I’m sorry but I find this statement almost impossible to believe. 
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I'll look it up, but I don't think so. Maybe I just never had a title to put with the song? That's entirely possible, as my youth was not formed around AOR radio. I guess this is what me and wikkid talk about constantly, the sort of fragmenting of society that didn't happen back when. 

edit before the post: Oh, I've heard that song a million times. Just never cared about it. Don't like Fleetwood Mac.  

 
I guess that's why radio DJs should always announce the songs of the bands they play. That, and my own incompetence in never finding out what the song was. Heard that a lot in my youth.  

 
rockaction said:
I'll look it up, but I don't think so. Maybe I just never had a title to put with the song? That's entirely possible, as my youth was not formed around AOR radio. I guess this is what me and wikkid talk about constantly, the sort of fragmenting of society that didn't happen back when. 

edit before the post: Oh, I've heard that song a million times. Just never cared about it. Don't like Fleetwood Mac.  
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That’s what I figured. But your personal taste aside I stand by my 100 year comment. These songs are really ubiquitous. 

 
Apple Jack said:
You must've heard Rhiannon.

I like Fleetwood Mac, but this version of the band isn't anything that excites me. Hipster alert: I prefer the Green/Kirwan/Spencer band.
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I love the Peter Green stuff too. Not so much the Welch era. 

But it’s a completely different band, a blues band.

 
timschochet said:
That’s what I figured. But your personal taste aside I stand by my 100 year comment. These songs are really ubiquitous. 
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I see what you're saying, but what's ubiquity gonna be in the era of personalized tastes, though? There are those of us that depend entirely on YouTube, Spotify, and blogs to deliver us new music. I agree with you, it seems to be a cultural touchstone of a song, but what happens when distribution changes? Anyway, no major quibble, just food for thought.  

 
rockaction said:
I see what you're saying, but what's ubiquity gonna be in the era of personalized tastes, though? There are those of us that depend entirely on YouTube, Spotify, and blogs to deliver us new music. I agree with you, it seems to be a cultural touchstone of a song, but what happens when distribution changes? Anyway, no major quibble, just food for thought.  
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We already know the answer to your question, IMO, because it’s kind of the point of this thread: what happens is the art form stops. There will be no more ubiquitous music. The Beatles are over. 

But that doesn’t mean we won’t remember them. There hasn’t been a universally known painter since Pablo Picasso. That art form is also dead. But 100 years from now people will still visit art museums. 

 
I really should correct my last comment. I don’t mean the art dies; it just has much less ubiquity. 

Another great example is theatre, the play. There used to be plays that everybody knew: from Shakespeare to Shaw to Tennessee Williams. Then movies and TV came along. These days the only plays that everyone knows are musicals. Serious drama is still written and produced, in fact more than ever before, but for most people to know them they need to be shown in a different form: movie or TV. But we still all know the classics and our great grandchildren will as well. 

 
Folks, it has been almost 40 years since the cable explosion, so it's possible now for an adult with an adult child to have not had a relationship with their radio. And that seems the difference - going to the movies was nice and TV was ubiquitous, but the radio told us where we were going. Only a few folks knew when albums were dropping, but we knew that last week Secret Agent Man came at us and changed us, this week Dock of the Bay, the next week Light My Fire, the next week Purple Haze, the next week Sunshine of Your Love. Never were so many completely fresh things happening and, for the first time, we could carry around the delivery system everywhere we went. And then, in college, life came at folks album by album and it was all the same albums for all of us pretty much and we rose & fell with that. But i can totally see not having that relationship with my media once the video age began and there were so many more ways to find out what's what.

 
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rockaction said:
I see what you're saying, but what's ubiquity gonna be in the era of personalized tastes, though? There are those of us that depend entirely on YouTube, Spotify, and blogs to deliver us new music. I agree with you, it seems to be a cultural touchstone of a song, but what happens when distribution changes? Anyway, no major quibble, just food for thought.  
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This guy makes an interesting point regarding streaming services - arguing that it that it kills the history and is a danger to the industry when you don't "own" something 

https://youtu.be/pmm1yq5Q4FE

 
I love the Fleetwood Mac album. I like all of the songs on it.  I'm not sure which is my favorite, cause it changes.  I've always really dug Lindsey's guitar on the closing song "I"m So Afraid", and his playing is even better when they perform that song live.  

A long time ago when I worked in a big resort in Florida in the entertainment department, I was assigned to do aqua aerobics. I had never done them before in my life, and had no idea what exercises to do.  There was no youtube to get ideas from, but most any movement in the water is good resistance for your body, so I just made stuff up.  I'm sure any certified aqua aerobics instructor would gasp at my routine I did. Anyway, I had a mixed Fleetwood Mac cassette with songs from various albums. I used that as my music for my "classes". I used the olympic size pool shallow end to do it, and I tell you what, it does get cold sometimes in Florida, and some of those snow bird guests would be out there raring to go when it was cold out! I had to suck it up and jump in. I remember a couple of the exercises to specific songs. I used "Over My Head" when we would lean against the pool wall and do leg lifts sideways, upwards, and down. I would come back to the exercise later, and do it to the song "Hypnotized".  I would use "Tusk" for when we would run from one end of the shallow end to the other. Palmetto bugs would sometimes fly in the pool, and those mothers would dart right at you to try and latch on to get out, and I'd hear random screams from some of the guests.  :lol:   People would sing along to the Fleetwood Mac tunes, and I think most enjoyed the wing it workout. 💪

 
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I like this album, but three of the greatest songwriters ever? Come on, now. 

The goofy way Fleetwood Mac assigns credit to a song has made some overrate certain writers in the band. Their rule was always whoever brings the idea for the song into the band gets the full credit.  If you listen to some of the demos of songs by Nicks, they were decent at best, and then the band, or Buckingham more notably, fleshed them out fully in the studio and made them what they became yet received no co-writing credit. It goes without saying that all three do their best work when getting input from the others.

 
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Count me among those that prefer the Green/Kirwan/Spencer version - their blues jam in Chicago from 1969 is the stuff of legends. I do like the Buckingham/Nicks version, but really only this self-titled album and, of course, Rumours.  I view this album as slightly below the mammoth Rumours, although some songs (e.g., "Landslide") are as good as anything they ever did IMO.

 
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timschochet said:
That’s what I figured. But your personal taste aside I stand by my 100 year comment. These songs are really ubiquitous. 
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Weird and arbitrary rabbit hole to wander down. Songs of the last half century or so will probably have longer useful lives than those prior, but with a few isolated exceptions I couldn't name a single song before the 50's.  Rhiannon and Landslide are two songs that have stood the test of time (despite Billy Corgan trying to ruin Landslide) and I see no reason for them to fall out of rotations anytime soon, but 150 years after their release?  This isn't Beethoven.

 
Fleetwood Mac has a great history.  I really didn't know Fleetwood Mac 1.0. Fleetwood with his crazy drumming, Lindsay with his unique  self taught "pick less" guitar rifts, Christine with greatly underappreciated vocals/keyboards/writing,  John with his great bass lines and Stevie's mystical interests.  Rhiannon (the Welch Witch)  probably my favorite song overall, which can give a good sound system a work out,  features John's bass.  Rumors probably my overall favorite album with the songs and the drama background. Stevie's "Bella Donna" album is a favorite also with "Stop Dragging My Heart Around" with Tom Petty along with "On The Edge of Seventeen" and "How Still My Love", a simple ballad and features John's bass and Lindsday's guitar.

 
wikkidpissah said:
Folks, it has been almost 40 years since the cable explosion, so it's possible now for an adult with an adult child to have not had a relationship with their radio. And that seems the difference - going to the movies was nice and TV was ubiquitous, but the radio told us where we were going. Only a few folks knew when albums were dropping, but we knew that last week Secret Agent Man came at us and changed us, this week Dock of the Bay, the next week Light My Fire, the next week Purple Haze, the next week Sunshine of Your Love. Never were so many completely fresh things happening and, for the first time, we could carry around the delivery system everywhere we went. And then, in college, life came at folks album by album and it was all the same albums for all of us pretty much and we rose & fell with that. But i can totally see not having that relationship with my media once the video age began and there were so many more ways to find out what's what.
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Yes, what was once just radio exposure is now that plus all the tv and movie usage, as well as video games and of course YouTube.

The positive imo is how many young people can learn about classic songs from all these different sources. 

 
rockaction said:
I'll look it up, but I don't think so. Maybe I just never had a title to put with the song? That's entirely possible, as my youth was not formed around AOR radio. I guess this is what me and wikkid talk about constantly, the sort of fragmenting of society that didn't happen back when. 

edit before the post: Oh, I've heard that song a million times. Just never cared about it. Don't like Fleetwood Mac.  
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I'm in the rockaction camp.    I don't like Fleetwood Mac at all.   The music bores me.   

 
PIK95 said:
I loved the band but Stevie Nicks is so overrated.
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I don’t know what it is. Technically, she’s only an okay singer. But the unique raspiness of her voice just makes her voice iconic to me. Couple that with the fact that I’ve been smitten with her since the 70s (if only I had a time machine) and she’ll never be overrated as far as I’m concerned. 

 
cannot and will not ever understand the love for anything Fleetwood Mac , they're just absolutely horrible..whenever I hear the sad sappy voices singing their ABBA-like songs I immediately rush to turn the station or turn off the radio..the coolest thing about Tusk is/was the video other than that it's a complete waste of time.

F. Mac is up there with Brian Adams as the worst music ever made. I respect people who like either artist, it takes a level of intestinal fortitude to withstand Buckingham's  guitar sounds, Adams' whiny voice and cheesy songs.but F. Mac should never have an album included in a best ever rock albums list

fleewood mac..sheesh.. :sleep: ..DING..11th floor.. - elevator music

I literally would rather watch paint dry than listen to the Mac..

I'll give them one song I like, Green Manalishi , remade a classic by Judas Priest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL7dqIIDATU 

 
Tanner9919 said:
cannot and will not ever understand the love for anything Fleetwood Mac , they're just absolutely horrible..whenever I hear the sad sappy voices singing their ABBA-like songs I immediately rush to turn the station or turn off the radio..the coolest thing about Tusk is/was the video other than that it's a complete waste of time.

F. Mac is up there with Brian Adams as the worst music ever made. I respect people who like either artist, it takes a level of intestinal fortitude to withstand Buckingham's  guitar sounds, Adams' whiny voice and cheesy songs.but F. Mac should never have an album included in a best ever rock albums list

fleewood mac..sheesh.. :sleep: ..DING..11th floor.. - elevator music

I literally would rather watch paint dry than listen to the Mac..

I'll give them one song I like, Green Manalishi , remade a classic by Judas Priest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL7dqIIDATU 
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I’m stunned a band like Fleetwood Mac would elicit a response like this.  It’s not like they’re Nickleback.

 
Tanner9919 said:
cannot and will not ever understand the love for anything Fleetwood Mac , they're just absolutely horrible..whenever I hear the sad sappy voices singing their ABBA-like songs I immediately rush to turn the station or turn off the radio..the coolest thing about Tusk is/was the video other than that it's a complete waste of time.

F. Mac is up there with Brian Adams as the worst music ever made. I respect people who like either artist, it takes a level of intestinal fortitude to withstand Buckingham's  guitar sounds, Adams' whiny voice and cheesy songs.but F. Mac should never have an album included in a best ever rock albums list

fleewood mac..sheesh.. :sleep: ..DING..11th floor.. - elevator music

I literally would rather watch paint dry than listen to the Mac..

I'll give them one song I like, Green Manalishi , remade a classic by Judas Priest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL7dqIIDATU 
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Each to his own but this sounds like crazy talk.

 
prosopis said:
Each to his own but this sounds like crazy talk.
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I think, for some, Fleetwood Mac is a bit too tame.  I sorta get it, as I think some of their hits are a bit too lightweight, but they sure wrote some darn good songs in their heyday.  Gypsy, Dreams, Rhiannon, Go Your Own Way, Big Love, Monday Morning, Hold Me, The Chain and I'm So Afraid are all songs I never get tired of hearing. 

 
bigbottom said:
I don’t know what it is. Technically, she’s only an okay singer. But the unique raspiness of her voice just makes her voice iconic to me. Couple that with the fact that I’ve been smitten with her since the 70s (if only I had a time machine) and she’ll never be overrated as far as I’m concerned. 
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I think everyone wanted to smash her back in the day.  Kinda like Samantha Fox.  That is the main reason she is popular imo.  

 
northern exposure said:
Were Neil Finn and Mike Campbell in the band? I'm interested to know how they meshed with the others. I'm a big fan of Finn's and Campbell's other work. 
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They were and both were fantastic.  I'm a huge Petty fan so knew Mike Campbell well.  They did a great rendition of Free Falling with a Petty montage playing on the giant video screens.  Very cool.  Neil Finn - what an impressive voice.  Got a lot of praise from Mick and did a few Crowded House numbers.

 
Mott the Hoople- All the Young Dudes (1972)

Sweet Jane

Mamma’s Little Jewel

All the Young Dudes

Sucker

Jerkin’ Crocus

One of the Boys

Soft Ground

Ready for Love/ After Lights

Sea Diver

David Bowie produced this album and wrote the title song; he also recommended the Lou Reed cover of “Sweet Jane.” But this band’s sound is their own: Ian Hunter is a marvelous vocalist and Mick Ralphs was one of the best guitarists of the era. Other gems on this record include “Mama’s Little Jewel” and “Sucker”. Glam rock at its height. 

 
Judge Smails said:
They were and both were fantastic.  I'm a huge Petty fan so knew Mike Campbell well.  They did a great rendition of Free Falling with a Petty montage playing on the giant video screens.  Very cool.  Neil Finn - what an impressive voice.  Got a lot of praise from Mick and did a few Crowded House numbers.
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Thanks for the feedback. I was hoping they would somehow acknowledge the impressive catalogue each artist carries with them and not just stick to Fleetwood Mac songs. Neil Finn is one of my favorite songwriters/musicians of all time. He has a way with dark, deep lyrics matched with much lighter melodies. 

The homage to Petty sounds cool too.

 
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timschochet said:
Mott the Hoople- All the Young Dudes (1972)

Sweet Jane

Mamma’s Little Jewel

All the Young Dudes

Sucker

Jerkin’ Crocus

One of the Boys

Soft Ground

Ready for Love/ After Lights

Sea Diver

David Bowie produced this album and wrote the title song; he also recommended the Lou Reed cover of “Sweet Jane.” But this band’s sound is their own: Ian Hunter is a marvelous vocalist and Mick Ralphs was one of the best guitarists of the era. Other gems on this record include “Mama’s Little Jewel” and “Sucker”. Glam rock at its height. 
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Best ever version of Sweet Jane:

https://youtu.be/Fa9nN3G2CSg

 
timschochet said:
Mott the Hoople- All the Young Dudes (1972)

Sweet Jane

Mamma’s Little Jewel

All the Young Dudes

Sucker

Jerkin’ Crocus

One of the Boys

Soft Ground

Ready for Love/ After Lights

Sea Diver

David Bowie produced this album and wrote the title song; he also recommended the Lou Reed cover of “Sweet Jane.” But this band’s sound is their own: Ian Hunter is a marvelous vocalist and Mick Ralphs was one of the best guitarists of the era. Other gems on this record include “Mama’s Little Jewel” and “Sucker”. Glam rock at its height. 
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Hunter's solo album "You're Never Alone With A Schizophrenic" is a classic. I just looked it up on Wiki and never knew some members of the E Street Band backed up Hunter on the record.

 
I don't know how people don't like Fleetwood Mac. Whatever you want out of a song, you should be able to find in Fleetwood Mac's catalog. I don't even see how it's possible for a rock fan not to like Go Your Own Way or The Chain. When you consider the dynamic between the members, and how, say, Go Your Own Way is written about another member of the band who sings backup on the song, there's a lot of emotional power in these lyrics, as with most great songs.

 
Strong album - one of the better ones of the glam rock era IMO. I do think though that “Ready for Love” was improved upon when Ralphs brought it to Bad Company and sung by Paul Rodgers.

 
timschochet said:
Many rock critics think they have 3, actually. Hopefully at some point we’ll get to the other two. 
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You keep avoiding this question, but why does it matter what critics think? 

Also, I have nothing against Mott the Hoople. They have some good songs and a neat sound. I just don't see them as having a classic album. 

 
Shrugs said:
I don't know how people don't like Fleetwood Mac. Whatever you want out of a song, you should be able to find in Fleetwood Mac's catalog. I don't even see how it's possible for a rock fan not to like Go Your Own Way or The Chain. When you consider the dynamic between the members, and how, say, Go Your Own Way is written about another member of the band who sings backup on the song, there's a lot of emotional power in these lyrics, as with most great songs.
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Have loved Fleetwood Mac thru all their iterations. Never owned a Fleetwood/McVie/McVie/Buckingham/Nicks album because Christine McVie songs are boring and ruin the flow.

 
Ghost Rider said:
You keep avoiding this question, but why does it matter what critics think? 
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It only matters, in terms of this thread, as a justification for my selection of albums. I didn’t want this thread to be thought of “let’s discuss Tim’s favorite albums”; I wanted it it be “let’s discuss the albums that many people regard as classic”. 

Otherwise I agree that critics don’t matter much. 

 
wikkidpissah said:
Have loved Fleetwood Mac thru all their iterations. Never owned a Fleetwood/McVie/McVie/Buckingham/Nicks album because Christine McVie songs are boring and ruin the flow.
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I've never owned a Fleetwood Mac album. Growing up, the 90s is when I bought almost all of my albums, and I knew of Fleetwood Mac then and liked songs like Rhiannon and Landslide, but they weren't really my style as a harder rock fan. As I got older, I kept realizing more and more songs I had heard and liked were Fleetwood Mac, discovering the diversity of the band, the different iterations, and all the tension in the lyrics hidden by catchy melodies that make it one of the most remarkable bands of all time. When someone here says he's never heard Rhiannon, then of course he's heard it, I bet if he went through Fleetwood Mac's catalog he would find a bunch of other songs he didn't know were Fleetwood Mac and realize that he likes quite a few of them. I agree about Christine as the weak link, but have come to understand that she does add something to the band, and I like You Make Loving Fun. Oh, and happy to say I saw them live about a year and a half ago, when they were still Fleetwood Mac, because I don't think Fleetwood Mac exists without Buckingham, even though I know they did exist before him.

 
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Shrugs said:
I agree about Christine as the weak link, but have come to understand that she does add something to the band, and I like You Make Loving Fun. Oh, and happy to say I saw them live about a year and a half ago, when they were still Fleetwood Mac, because I don't think Fleetwood Mac exists without Buckingham, even though I know they did exist before him.
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I like McVie in the band. I especially like her song Think About Me.

 
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