Cleveland school shooting (1 Viewer)

[Marvin]

Let me preface this with saying I am not sure with where I stand on the suggestion that ATC1 brings up, and I would likely be against it, but Marvin's response sheds some light on me with why I think kids coming out of school are dumber and act more childish. The teaches (Marvin) act like kids themselves. I have many friends that are teachers that I am absolutely amazed that they are supposed to be teaching kids. They act like morons, they are disrespectful, they can't carry an intellegent conversation etc., and they are supposed to educate our youth? It sad. (note, bad teachers have nothing to do with this kid shooting other kids...this is just a side rant about the poor quality of teahcers america has. There are good teachers out there, but a majority are not.)

1. Kids coming out of school today are dumber and act more childish. You're just getting older.2. Do you honestly think that how I post on some internet messageboard is how I address my students? 3. The majority of teachers in America are not good teachers? Proof?4. You misspelled "intelligent" and "teachers". You also didn't capitalize America.

3) Well if your corrections of his grammar and spelling are any indication...I kid, I kid.

Yeah

 

[Clifford]

And the solution of shoot outs in school hallways with grown men gunning down kids doesn't sound stupid? Are we really operating under the assumption that all would go completely smoothly with this idea? No one ever misses the shooter and hits and innocent kid? Or mistakes a fake weapon for a real one and kills a kid holding a toy (God knows that's never happened)?

That's what we're talking about?

Seems like it would be easier just to allow each police department to hire one more cop to be at every single school. If you're going to have someone tasked with the job of responding to this it should at least be a trained professional. I still say it's a bad idea and certainly does not solve the problem of gun violence in schools.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

And the solution of shoot outs in school hallways with grown men gunning down kids doesn't sound stupid? Are we really operating under the assumption that all would go completely smoothly with this idea? No one ever misses the shooter and hits and innocent kid? Or mistakes a fake weapon for a real one and kills a kid holding a toy (God knows that's never happened)?That's what we're talking about?Seems like it would be easier just to allow each police department to hire one more cop to be at every single school. If you're going to have someone tasked with the job of responding to this it should at least be a trained professional. I still say it's a bad idea and certainly does not solve the problem of gun violence in schools.

What about the work place or a fast food place or just anywhere someone decides they want to kill a whole lotta inocent people just because...you gonna have a cop on hand before 10 people die? The best scenerio is NOBODY has guns, but we all know that not gonna happen. Just like dugs are illegal but people still buy them wherever they can.

 

[ATC1]

It's a MASSIVE assumption to say that simply because someone has qualified for a CCP, that they would react to a situation like this in a way that would impact positively.

It's akin to saying that the best way to save people from heart attacks is to "arm" the populace with scalpels and sutures. Knowing how to properly respond to a situation like this goes way, way beyond knowing how to safely load, fire and maintain a firearm.

I'd wager that arming teachers would make matters much, much worse and probably cause more injuries or death.

If a school wants to prepare for something like this, they should keep trained law enforcement on the premises at all times. And even then, law enforcement isn't going to respond perfectly 100% of the time.

Simply because a person has qualified for a CCP does NOT make them the "right" person to deal with something like this.

Great response. Agree 100% with the bolded part. Honestly, I have no idea if I will respond in the correct matter. I have never been in that situation. All I can say is I have been trained and take it very seriously. Scalpels and sutures will not help a person with a heart attack as much as a person certified in CPR and AED use is present. That person will know to call 911, try to locate an AED in case of cardiac arrest, know how and when to use CPR, etc.

If you have someone Not certified in CPR just trying to be a good samaritan it could make things worse. Best to just call 911 and find someone who does.

Having law enforcement present would be best case, but having a cardiac surgeon present to a man having chest pains doesn't always work.

 

[Claydon]

How did he get a gun in the school.

Are there not signs to prevent this?

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Another shooting today....

Now, imagine lunatic children like this didn't have access to guns....your statement becomes.....existenceless.

I think the question is how parents that can raise this kid have access to guns. My stance is that schools should not be a gun ban zone for adults (teachers) who went through the proper mandatory training, back ground check, and practice to conceal a firearm for protection in a situation like this. We are lucky this kid got spooked by someone and decided to run instead of continuing to fire. I applaud the person that spooked him to run.

I agree as long as the training was in depth. Too many times you hear of these shootings and it's just some piece of #### running around preying on the weak while kids and teachers are fleeing for their lives and praying they don't get shot. I wouldn't even say all the teachers or adults but a couple wouldnt hurt.

 

[Marvin]

Another shooting today....

Now, imagine lunatic children like this didn't have access to guns....your statement becomes.....existenceless.

I think the question is how parents that can raise this kid have access to guns. My stance is that schools should not be a gun ban zone for adults (teachers) who went through the proper mandatory training, back ground check, and practice to conceal a firearm for protection in a situation like this. We are lucky this kid got spooked by someone and decided to run instead of continuing to fire. I applaud the person that spooked him to run.

I agree as long as the training was in depth. Too many times you hear of these shootings and it's just some piece of #### running around praying on the weak while kids and teachers are feeing for their lives and praying they don't get shot. I wouldn't even say all the teachers or adults but a couple wouldnt hurt.

 

[ATC1]

Another shooting today....

Now, imagine lunatic children like this didn't have access to guns....your statement becomes.....existenceless.

I think the question is how parents that can raise this kid have access to guns. My stance is that schools should not be a gun ban zone for adults (teachers) who went through the proper mandatory training, back ground check, and practice to conceal a firearm for protection in a situation like this. We are lucky this kid got spooked by someone and decided to run instead of continuing to fire. I applaud the person that spooked him to run.

I agree as long as the training was in depth. Too many times you hear of these shootings and it's just some piece of #### running around praying on the weak while kids and teachers are feeing for their lives and praying they don't get shot. I wouldn't even say all the teachers or adults but a couple wouldnt hurt.

As a teacher, do you have a MBGPP?

 

[ATC1]

CHARDON, Ohio (AP) — The 17-year-old suspect in a deadly shooting rampage at an Ohio high school appeared briefly in juvenile court as residents of the shaken community offered sympathy and support for families and friends of the three students who were killed and two who were wounded.

A prosecutor described suspect T.J. Lane as "someone who's not well" and said the teen didn't know the victims but chose them randomly.

Lane admitted taking a .22-caliber pistol and a knife to the 1,100-student Chardon High School and firing 10 shots at a group of students sitting at a cafeteria table Monday morning, prosecutor David Joyce said.

So much for a big gun.

Authorities offered their own condolences Tuesday and shared a nugget of welcome news, announcing that an 18-year-old girl who was hurt in the shootings had been released from the hospital and was home with family. The second injured teen remained in serious condition at a suburban Cleveland hospital.

Those trying to understand what prompted the shootings got few answers from the court hearing, which came hours after the death toll rose to three.

Lane, a thin young man described by other students as extremely quiet, spoke little in court, where a judge ordered him held for at least 15 days.

Lane's grandfather, who has custody of the teenager, and two aunts joined him in court. The women lightly embraced the older man as the hearing began.

Prosecutors have until Thursday to bring charges and are expected to ask that Lane be tried as an adult. He will probably be charged with three counts of aggravated murder and other offenses, Joyce said.

The prosecutor appeared to rule out rumors and speculation that the young gunman lashed out after being bullied or that the shooting had something to do with drug-dealing.

"This is not about bullying. This is not about drugs," Joyce said. "This is someone who's not well, and I'm sure in our court case we'll prove that to all of your desires and we'll make sure justice is done here in this county."

Joyce would not elaborate. Both sides in the case are under a gag order imposed by the judge at the prosecutor's request.

The judge also barred media outlets from taking photos of the faces of the suspect and some of his relatives. The Associated Press transmitted photos and video of Lane that were shot before the hearing. The AP and at least one other media outlet, The Plain Dealer of Cleveland, plan to challenge the judge's order Wednesday.

Meanwhile, area schools offered grief counseling to students, staff and others shocked by the rampage.

"We're not just any old place, Chardon," Chardon School Superintendent Joseph Bergant II said. "This is every place. As you've seen in the past, this can happen anywhere, proof of what we had yesterday."

Authorities said Tuesday that Demetrius Hewlin, 16, and Russell King Jr., 17, had died from their injuries. Daniel Parmertor, 16, died shortly after the shooting.

Hewlin attended Chardon High. King and Parmertor were students at the Auburn Career Center, a vocational school, and were waiting in the Chardon High cafeteria for their daily bus when they were shot.

Lane's family is mourning "this terrible loss for their community," Lane's attorney, Robert Farinacci, said in a statement.

Fifteen-year-old Danny Komertz, who witnessed the shooting, said it appeared that the gunman singled out a group of students sitting together. He said Lane was known as an outcast who had apparently been bullied. But other students disputed that.

Farinacci told WKYC-TV that Lane "pretty much sticks to himself but does have some friends and has never been in trouble over anything that we know about."

Lane did not attend Chardon High but waited there for the bus to Lake Academy, a school for students with academic or behavioral problems. Authorities would not say how and why he ended up at Lake Academy.

Student Nate Mueller said he was at the cafeteria table where the victims were shot, and a bullet grazed his ear. Mueller told The Plain Dealer that King — one of those killed — had recently started dating Lane's ex-girlfriend.

Lane "was silent the whole time," Mueller said. "That's what made it so random."

Kala Day, 18, said she rode the morning school bus with Lane and knew the victims.

"He always sat by himself and, like, looked out the window. So I sat with him a few times, because I felt bad for the kid," she said. "He didn't talk. He just stared out the window."

The shooting sent students screaming from the building in panic, and some of that chaos and fear was captured in 911 recordings released Tuesday.

"We just had a shooting at our school. We need to get out of here. Oh, my god," one crying female caller told a dispatcher.

"Everyone's running away," the caller added.

Another caller, a male student, instantly identified the gunman as Thomas Lane, a student, and said he appeared to be shooting at random.

"What was his beef with these kids? Do we know?" the dispatcher asked.

"I have no idea," he said, adding: "He's very quiet and he doesn't really talk to anyone."

Frank Hall, an assistant high school football coach who has been hailed as a hero by students who say he chased the gunman out of the cafeteria, told a Cleveland TV station that he couldn't discuss what happened, but added: "I wish I could have done more."

Frank Hall

 

[mad sweeney]

One thing, other than the entirety of what happened, that really, really bothers me is how tip-toey the news articles are. Calling this kid the "suspected shooter" or "alleged shooter" etc... I understand how the Jewell case changed the way news agencies need to be responsible with accusations, but in cases where there's no doubt that the person did it (especially when they admit it, before or after Mirandizement), calling them alleged and suspected is beyond stupid. It really, really bothers me, but then again I have little respect for news agencies as it is.

 

[mad sweeney]

CHARDON, Ohio (AP) — The 17-year-old suspect in a deadly shooting rampage at an Ohio high school appeared briefly in juvenile court as residents of the shaken community offered sympathy and support for families and friends of the three students who were killed and two who were wounded.

A prosecutor described suspect T.J. Lane as "someone who's not well" and said the teen didn't know the victims but chose them randomly.

Lane admitted taking a .22-caliber pistol and a knife to the 1,100-student Chardon High School and firing 10 shots at a group of students sitting at a cafeteria table Monday morning, prosecutor David Joyce said.

So much for a big gun.

Authorities offered their own condolences Tuesday and shared a nugget of welcome news, announcing that an 18-year-old girl who was hurt in the shootings had been released from the hospital and was home with family. The second injured teen remained in serious condition at a suburban Cleveland hospital.

Those trying to understand what prompted the shootings got few answers from the court hearing, which came hours after the death toll rose to three.

Lane, a thin young man described by other students as extremely quiet, spoke little in court, where a judge ordered him held for at least 15 days.

Lane's grandfather, who has custody of the teenager, and two aunts joined him in court. The women lightly embraced the older man as the hearing began.

Prosecutors have until Thursday to bring charges and are expected to ask that Lane be tried as an adult. He will probably be charged with three counts of aggravated murder and other offenses, Joyce said.

The prosecutor appeared to rule out rumors and speculation that the young gunman lashed out after being bullied or that the shooting had something to do with drug-dealing.

"This is not about bullying. This is not about drugs," Joyce said. "This is someone who's not well, and I'm sure in our court case we'll prove that to all of your desires and we'll make sure justice is done here in this county."

Joyce would not elaborate. Both sides in the case are under a gag order imposed by the judge at the prosecutor's request.

The judge also barred media outlets from taking photos of the faces of the suspect and some of his relatives. The Associated Press transmitted photos and video of Lane that were shot before the hearing. The AP and at least one other media outlet, The Plain Dealer of Cleveland, plan to challenge the judge's order Wednesday.

Meanwhile, area schools offered grief counseling to students, staff and others shocked by the rampage.

"We're not just any old place, Chardon," Chardon School Superintendent Joseph Bergant II said. "This is every place. As you've seen in the past, this can happen anywhere, proof of what we had yesterday."

Authorities said Tuesday that Demetrius Hewlin, 16, and Russell King Jr., 17, had died from their injuries. Daniel Parmertor, 16, died shortly after the shooting.

Hewlin attended Chardon High. King and Parmertor were students at the Auburn Career Center, a vocational school, and were waiting in the Chardon High cafeteria for their daily bus when they were shot.

Lane's family is mourning "this terrible loss for their community," Lane's attorney, Robert Farinacci, said in a statement.

Fifteen-year-old Danny Komertz, who witnessed the shooting, said it appeared that the gunman singled out a group of students sitting together. He said Lane was known as an outcast who had apparently been bullied. But other students disputed that.

Farinacci told WKYC-TV that Lane "pretty much sticks to himself but does have some friends and has never been in trouble over anything that we know about."

Lane did not attend Chardon High but waited there for the bus to Lake Academy, a school for students with academic or behavioral problems. Authorities would not say how and why he ended up at Lake Academy.

Student Nate Mueller said he was at the cafeteria table where the victims were shot, and a bullet grazed his ear. Mueller told The Plain Dealer that King — one of those killed — had recently started dating Lane's ex-girlfriend.

Lane "was silent the whole time," Mueller said. "That's what made it so random."

Kala Day, 18, said she rode the morning school bus with Lane and knew the victims.

"He always sat by himself and, like, looked out the window. So I sat with him a few times, because I felt bad for the kid," she said. "He didn't talk. He just stared out the window."

The shooting sent students screaming from the building in panic, and some of that chaos and fear was captured in 911 recordings released Tuesday.

"We just had a shooting at our school. We need to get out of here. Oh, my god," one crying female caller told a dispatcher.

"Everyone's running away," the caller added.

Another caller, a male student, instantly identified the gunman as Thomas Lane, a student, and said he appeared to be shooting at random.

"What was his beef with these kids? Do we know?" the dispatcher asked.

"I have no idea," he said, adding: "He's very quiet and he doesn't really talk to anyone."

Frank Hall, an assistant high school football coach who has been hailed as a hero by students who say he chased the gunman out of the cafeteria, told a Cleveland TV station that he couldn't discuss what happened, but added: "I wish I could have done more."

Frank Hall

Good on the coach. Everyone would like to think they'd do something in that situation but who knows. Glad he didn't die like the hero teacher in the Columbine shootings.

 

[Fat Nick]

How did he get a gun in the school.Are there not signs to prevent this?

Like this?--------------NO GUNS.Seriously.This sign shows we mean business.--------------But seriously, MOST schools don't have metal detectors, etc. You could just walk in with one. I grew up in a really rural area of Virginia. It wasn't uncommon to have several pick up trucks in the parking lot with hunting rifles on the back glass.

 

[MAC_32]

So...this guy just broke out of prison.

 

[Plorfu]

So...this guy just broke out of prison.

Yeah. CNN had a breaking news thing letting us know the police announced his escape on their Facebook page.

 

[Bobcat10]

So...this guy just broke out of prison.

Lock it up tight, Mac. Going on like 4 hours now.

 

[Mr. Retukes]

Maybe someone will kill him before he gets a chance to kill again.

 

[Mr. Nasty]

Have to think this won't end well.

 

[BigJohn]

Got him.

 

[Captain Quinoa]

TJ Lane back in police custody. According to Allen County police scanner, he was armed with a pitchfork when he was apprehended.

 

[Fat Nick]

Jesus man...I was just reading some follow-up on this...This kid deserves whatever he gets...If I was the parent of one of those kids, I'd relish the opportunity to hunt him if he was out on the lam.

On March 19, 2013, Lane was sentenced to three life sentences in prison without parole.After entering the courtroom, he took off his dress shirt to reveal a white T-shirt underneath which had the word "Killer" handwritten across the front. He smiled and smirked during the hearing. After being sentenced, Lane said to the victims' families and the courtroom, "This hand that pulled the trigger that killed your sons now masturbates to the memory. #### all of you", while giving the middle finger.

 

[RBM]

Jesus man...I was just reading some follow-up on this...This kid deserves whatever he gets...If I was the parent of one of those kids, I'd relish the opportunity to hunt him if he was out on the lam.

On March 19, 2013, Lane was sentenced to three life sentences in prison without parole.After entering the courtroom, he took off his dress shirt to reveal a white T-shirt underneath which had the word "Killer" handwritten across the front. He smiled and smirked during the hearing. After being sentenced, Lane said to the victims' families and the courtroom, "This hand that pulled the trigger that killed your sons now masturbates to the memory. #### all of you", while giving the middle finger.

Mother ####er should be dead.

 

[Godsbrother]

Convicted school shooter T.J. Lane's escape from the Allen Correctional Institution Thursday night followed 18 months in prison in which he was disciplined seven times.

In August, prison officials cited Lane, 19, for urinating on a wall in the Allen Correctional Institution. Prison officials took away Lane's recreation privileges for seven days, a prison official told The Plain Dealer earlier this week.

Recreational privileges? The only recreation he should be getting is repeated gang rape.

 

[beer 30]

Convicted school shooter T.J. Lane's escape from the Allen Correctional Institution Thursday night followed 18 months in prison in which he was disciplined seven times.

In August, prison officials cited Lane, 19, for urinating on a wall in the Allen Correctional Institution. Prison officials took away Lane's recreation privileges for seven days, a prison official told The Plain Dealer earlier this week.

Recreational privileges? The only recreation he should be getting is repeated gang rape.

I'd guess that he will be moved shortly, this was a low security prison.

Unfortunately, the police (doing their job correctly) missed an opportunity to end this waste of breathe. When apprehended he was armed with a pitchfork.

"Yes Warden, he was armed and dangerous so we had to put him down"

"232 shots? 132 to the head at point blank range?"

"Yes Warden"

"And what was the point of the assault vehicle being parked on his chest?"

"He twitched sir"

 

[Fat Nick]

Convicted school shooter T.J. Lane's escape from the Allen Correctional Institution Thursday night followed 18 months in prison in which he was disciplined seven times.

In August, prison officials cited Lane, 19, for urinating on a wall in the Allen Correctional Institution. Prison officials took away Lane's recreation privileges for seven days, a prison official told The Plain Dealer earlier this week.

Recreational privileges? The only recreation he should be getting is repeated gang rape.

No kidding. How is somebody so non-remoreseful not in a maximum security facility?