Public Schools are getting worse (1 Viewer)

[Ilov80s]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

 

[Instinctive]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

 

[Sparky Polastri]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

You disagree with me? You said here, in fewer words, the same thing I did.

 

[Ilov80s]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

 

[djmich]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

You disagree with me? You said here, in fewer words, the same thing I did.

Ha, I was disagreeing with the part I italicized and put in blue...you were last reply in the chain.

 

[Sparky Polastri]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

You disagree with me? You said here, in fewer words, the same thing I did.

Ha, I was disagreeing with the part I italicized and put in blue...you were last reply in the chain.

 

[Psychopav]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

You're a crusty veteran, don't let anyone tell you otherwise

 

[Sparky Polastri]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

This is the kind of person I feel like should be allowed to be punched in the throat without consequence. My parents didn't ask me to do things. They told me to do them. I am grateful they took that route.

 

[Psychopav]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

This is the kind of person I feel like should be allowed to be punched in the throat without consequence. My parents didn't ask me to do things. They told me to do them. I am grateful they took that route.

Texas just instituted a law that k-12 public school students are not allowed to use personal communication devices during the school day. Each district is responsible for setting their own policy. Some are buying magnetically sealed and locked pouches in which students have to deposit their phones when entering school in the morning, and then they are unlocked so the kids can retrieve their phones at the end of the day. My kid's district is not requiring that, just making them keep their phones out of sight and off. The first infraction results in the phone being confiscated for the day, with rapidly escalating consequences. I feel bad for the teachers who have to police this stuff.

 

[Ilov80s]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

This is the kind of person I feel like should be allowed to be punched in the throat without consequence. My parents didn't ask me to do things. They told me to do them. I am grateful they took that route.

Texas just instituted a law that k-12 public school students are not allowed to use personal communication devices during the school day. Each district is responsible for setting their own policy. Some are buying magnetically sealed and locked pouches in which students have to deposit their phones when entering school in the morning, and then they are unlocked so the kids can retrieve their phones at the end of the day. My kid's district is not requiring that, just making them keep their phones out of sight and off. The first infraction results in the phone being confiscated for the day, with rapidly escalating consequences. I feel bad for the teachers who have to police this stuff.

I like the idea of the law because it makes it easier for the teachers and administrators to say "hey we didn't make the rule, we just have to enforce it".

But it does create a certain traffic cop element to it. Are we going to pull over and ticket every driver who is going 2 mph over the limit? And then what are the rapidly escalating consequences? Who is enforcing all those, who is managing all the confiscated phones, etc. It's a headache no matter what approach is taken. I will say a lot of teachers just need to be more consistent about enforcing it though. If you start from day with a policy, a plan and diligently enforce it early the kids usually comply pretty well but it has to start from the first minute the kids enter your class on day 1 and you can never waiver. You got to be like The Terminator because if the kids sense any weakness they well beg, plead, negotiate, crash out and do everything they can to get you to give in.

 

[Psychopav]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

This is the kind of person I feel like should be allowed to be punched in the throat without consequence. My parents didn't ask me to do things. They told me to do them. I am grateful they took that route.

Texas just instituted a law that k-12 public school students are not allowed to use personal communication devices during the school day. Each district is responsible for setting their own policy. Some are buying magnetically sealed and locked pouches in which students have to deposit their phones when entering school in the morning, and then they are unlocked so the kids can retrieve their phones at the end of the day. My kid's district is not requiring that, just making them keep their phones out of sight and off. The first infraction results in the phone being confiscated for the day, with rapidly escalating consequences. I feel bad for the teachers who have to police this stuff.

I like the idea of the law because it makes it easier for the teachers and administrators to say "hey we didn't make the rule, we just have to enforce it".

But it does create a certain traffic cop element to it. Are we going to pull over and ticket every driver who is going 2 mph over the limit? And then what are the rapidly escalating consequences? Who is enforcing all those, who is managing all the confiscated phones, etc. It's a headache no matter what approach is taken. I will say a lot of teachers just need to be more consistent about enforcing it though. If you start from day with a policy, a plan and diligently enforce it early the kids usually comply pretty well but it has to start from the first minute the kids enter your class on day 1 and you can never waiver. You got to be like The Terminator because if the kids sense any weakness they well beg, plead, negotiate, crash out and do everything they can to get you to give in.

I agree but that's an opportunity for the administrators who don't manage their teachers.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

North Carolina education leaders have adopted the ambitious goal of having the best public school system in the nation by 2030.

The State Board of Education approved a five-year strategic plan

Pillars of strategic plan​

The strategic plan is based on three main components. In addition to wanting to make the state's public schools the best in the nation, the other components are high academic achievement and character development.

The plan is built around eight pillars:

• Prepare Each Student for Their Next Phase in Life  - Expanding rigorous pathways, dual enrollment and character development.
• Revere Public School Educators  - Competitive compensation and career advancement opportunities
• Enhance Parent, Caregiver and Community Support – Strengthening family engagement and partnerships
• Ensure Healthy, Safe and Secure Learning Environments - Physical and emotional safety with mental health support
• Optimize Operational Excellence - Modernizing systems and eliminating administrative burdens
• Lead Transformative Change - Research-driven innovation and accountability reform
• Celebrate the Excellence in Public Education - Comprehensive messaging to highlight successes
• Galvanize Champions to Fully Invest in and Support Public Education - Building coalitions for increased investment and pride in our schools

The plan would carry out the pillars with actions such as:

• Start a new program to focus on improving foundational math skills in the early grades.
• Lobby state lawmakers to restore providing extra pay to teachers who have master's degrees.
• Partner with groups to expand school-based health services for students and staff, including telehealth.
• Establish a task force to develop a new school accountability model for assessing school performance.
• Launch a statewide reading campaign to have students read 10 million books annually.

Measuring the success of the plan​

The strategic plan has several key goals for measuring success by 2030:

• Raise the four-year high school graduation rate from 86.9 to 92%.
• Raise the ACT composite score from 18.5 to 20 . The ACT is taken by high school juniors.
• Raise the participation rate on Advancement Placement exams among 10th- through 12th-graders from 21.5% to 30%. Students take AP courses for college credit and to raise their grade point average.
• Raise the participation rate on Career Technical Education (CTE) courses among K-12 students from 36.1% to 41%.
• Raise the percentage of school-aged children enrolled in public schools from 84.5% to 89%. This percentage includes both traditional public schools and charter schools.
• Raise pay so North Carolina leads the Southeast in educator compensation.
• Raise North Carolina's performance on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) exams given to fourth- and eighth-grade students nationally every two years. The state is scoring below 2019 levels in 8th-grade reading and math and 4th-grade reading.

This is great and all, but the NCGA is openly against at least 5 of the 8 pillars. They are more concerned about private school vouchers than actually improving conditions in the public school system.

 

[Sparky Polastri]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Exactly. I've been in meetings with parents of HS students who's behavior is very problematic and causing all these negative outcomes for the kid where staff is bringing up how problematic their phone use is only to hear the parents say things like, "I don't know why kids even have phones in school, they don't need them. They should be here to work and learn not be on their phones." When we then suggest not sending your kid to school with their phone then, it immediately turns into "oh well they would get mad about that, can the principal just take it from them each day or maybe each class have the teacher check it in and then return it when class is over?"

This is the kind of person I feel like should be allowed to be punched in the throat without consequence. My parents didn't ask me to do things. They told me to do them. I am grateful they took that route.

Texas just instituted a law that k-12 public school students are not allowed to use personal communication devices during the school day. Each district is responsible for setting their own policy. Some are buying magnetically sealed and locked pouches in which students have to deposit their phones when entering school in the morning, and then they are unlocked so the kids can retrieve their phones at the end of the day. My kid's district is not requiring that, just making them keep their phones out of sight and off. The first infraction results in the phone being confiscated for the day, with rapidly escalating consequences. I feel bad for the teachers who have to police this stuff.

Here's a good example. Very similar thing happening here in FL. My pops? Gave my younger brother two options. Leave the phone in the car or take it into school, but locked down only to access emergency calls during school.

 

[RCon]

But it does create a certain traffic cop element to it. Are we going to pull over and ticket every driver who is going 2 mph over the limit? And then what are the rapidly escalating consequences? Who is enforcing all those, who is managing all the confiscated phones, etc. It's a headache no matter what approach is taken. I will say a lot of teachers just need to be more consistent about enforcing it though. If you start from day with a policy, a plan and diligently enforce it early the kids usually comply pretty well but it has to start from the first minute the kids enter your class on day 1 and you can never waiver. You got to be like The Terminator because if the kids sense any weakness they well beg, plead, negotiate, crash out and do everything they can to get you to give in.

I'm not sure if it's state law/policy or just the local high school policy, but last year they started a no phone policy in class. There's a cell phone "locker" on every door where kids put their phones when they walk in and they collect their phones on the way out. Teachers say it worked great.

 

[Max Power]

North Carolina education leaders have adopted the ambitious goal of having the best public school system in the nation by 2030.

The State Board of Education approved a five-year strategic plan

Pillars of strategic plan​

The strategic plan is based on three main components. In addition to wanting to make the state's public schools the best in the nation, the other components are high academic achievement and character development.

The plan is built around eight pillars:

• Prepare Each Student for Their Next Phase in Life  - Expanding rigorous pathways, dual enrollment and character development.
• Revere Public School Educators  - Competitive compensation and career advancement opportunities
• Enhance Parent, Caregiver and Community Support – Strengthening family engagement and partnerships
• Ensure Healthy, Safe and Secure Learning Environments - Physical and emotional safety with mental health support
• Optimize Operational Excellence - Modernizing systems and eliminating administrative burdens
• Lead Transformative Change - Research-driven innovation and accountability reform
• Celebrate the Excellence in Public Education - Comprehensive messaging to highlight successes
• Galvanize Champions to Fully Invest in and Support Public Education - Building coalitions for increased investment and pride in our schools

The plan would carry out the pillars with actions such as:

• Start a new program to focus on improving foundational math skills in the early grades.
• Lobby state lawmakers to restore providing extra pay to teachers who have master's degrees.
• Partner with groups to expand school-based health services for students and staff, including telehealth.
• Establish a task force to develop a new school accountability model for assessing school performance.
• Launch a statewide reading campaign to have students read 10 million books annually.

Measuring the success of the plan​

The strategic plan has several key goals for measuring success by 2030:

• Raise the four-year high school graduation rate from 86.9 to 92%.
• Raise the ACT composite score from 18.5 to 20 . The ACT is taken by high school juniors.
• Raise the participation rate on Advancement Placement exams among 10th- through 12th-graders from 21.5% to 30%. Students take AP courses for college credit and to raise their grade point average.
• Raise the participation rate on Career Technical Education (CTE) courses among K-12 students from 36.1% to 41%.
• Raise the percentage of school-aged children enrolled in public schools from 84.5% to 89%. This percentage includes both traditional public schools and charter schools.
• Raise pay so North Carolina leads the Southeast in educator compensation.
• Raise North Carolina's performance on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) exams given to fourth- and eighth-grade students nationally every two years. The state is scoring below 2019 levels in 8th-grade reading and math and 4th-grade reading.

This is great and all, but the NCGA is openly against at least 5 of the 8 pillars. They are more concerned about private school vouchers than actually improving conditions in the public school system.

School vouchers might have been counter productive in my opinion. Its following the same path as student loans. My youngest attends a private Christian school and the rates increased substantially over the last year once government assistance became available.

It could be the school though. It also looks to be morphing into more of prep school vs religious school. They're getting big into recruiting kids for athletics now and that's a whole separate can of worms.

 

[rockaction]

It’s Jonathan Haidt. Parents and educators wanted to get rid of the phone scourge but lacked . . . wherewithal (?) and a good plan. They kept failing. He sort of galvanized the amorphous consensus into a coherently tailored plan and was explicitly arguing its urgency. This might be The Free Press but he pushed the pile over the goal line.

How Jonathan Haidt Won the Fight Against Smartphones in Schools

His book has gained bipartisan fans from Barack Obama to Bill Gates to Sarah Huckabee Sanders. Olivia Reingold reports on the Haidt effect.

www.thefp.com

 

[JohnnyU]

It’s Jonathan Haidt. Parents and educators wanted to get rid of the phone scourge but lacked . . . wherewithal (?) and a good plan. They kept failing. He sort of galvanized the amorphous consensus into a coherently tailored plan and was explicitly arguing its urgency. This might be The Free Press but he pushed the pile over the goal line.

How Jonathan Haidt Won the Fight Against Smartphones in Schools

His book has gained bipartisan fans from Barack Obama to Bill Gates to Sarah Huckabee Sanders. Olivia Reingold reports on the Haidt effect.

www.thefp.com

Smartphones in the classroom was dumb from the beginning. I raised my granddaughter and that was an issue for her and attention in high school. It's my fault for allowing her to take the phone to school in the first place. I wish they wouldn't have allowed students to have them in the classroom. That way she could still have it between classes and at lunch, but not in the classroom, where she is supposed to be paying attention.

 

[beer 30]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

 

[Joe Schmo]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

 

[beer 30]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

Yes, it's all of the above, IEP with the sensory stimulation issue.

How does this work in actual emergency?

 

[Joe Schmo]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

Yes, it's all of the above, IEP with the sensory stimulation issue.

How does this work in actual emergency?

According to my sister, a paraeducator, it works the same way in real time as it does during a drill. If there is an alarm for any reason and the students need to take emergency action, the in class para or other staff with knowledge of the IEP will go to the students and put the headsets on to keep them calm and keep them moving. It becomes rote which is one benefit of the drills.

 

[Joe Schmo]

I gotta tell you, it's amazing how far we've come in world of primary and secondary education where inclusivity of those with differing abilities is now possible thanks to so many thoughtful strategies that never existed back in my day. I'm an old fart in my late 50's and I remember the short bus and also recall the cruel nicknames I and my fellow classmates referred to those who rode them, we were pretty awful even if we didn't know we were at the time.

 

[beer 30]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

Yes, it's all of the above, IEP with the sensory stimulation issue.

How does this work in actual emergency?

According to my sister, a paraeducator, it works the same way in real time as it does during a drill. If there is an alarm for any reason and the students need to take emergency action, the in class para or other staff with knowledge of the IEP will go to the students and put the headsets on to keep them calm and keep them moving. It becomes rote which is one benefit of the drills.

I wonder if they try to put the students in the same room. Imagine if you have a few of these sprinkled throughout the school and only one or two folks who can assist?

 

[Joe Bryant]

It’s Jonathan Haidt. Parents and educators wanted to get rid of the phone scourge but lacked . . . wherewithal (?) and a good plan. They kept failing. He sort of galvanized the amorphous consensus into a coherently tailored plan and was explicitly arguing its urgency. This might be The Free Press but he pushed the pile over the goal line.

How Jonathan Haidt Won the Fight Against Smartphones in Schools

His book has gained bipartisan fans from Barack Obama to Bill Gates to Sarah Huckabee Sanders. Olivia Reingold reports on the Haidt effect.

www.thefp.com

Yes. He's been on this for a good while.

Thought this was interesting.

Jonathan Haidt on Instagram: "Testimonials are coming in from teachers about their newly #phonefreeschools and the amazing things that students are now doing — like taking notes, completing their assignments, and talking to each other. “Was it this

153K likes, 5,836 comments - jonathanhaidt on August 12, 2025: "Testimonials are coming in from teachers about their newly #phonefreeschools and the amazing things that students are now doing — like taking notes, completing their assignments, and talking to each other. “Was it this easy of a...

www.instagram.com

 

[Joe Schmo]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

Yes, it's all of the above, IEP with the sensory stimulation issue.

How does this work in actual emergency?

According to my sister, a paraeducator, it works the same way in real time as it does during a drill. If there is an alarm for any reason and the students need to take emergency action, the in class para or other staff with knowledge of the IEP will go to the students and put the headsets on to keep them calm and keep them moving. It becomes rote which is one benefit of the drills.

I wonder if they try to put the students in the same room. Imagine if you have a few of these sprinkled throughout the school and only one or two folks who can assist?

In elementary school students are often kept together throughout the day so each classroom teacher and assistant knows which students need what accommodations. Once in middle and high, every teacher is given notice of students with learning plans and how they are to implement them but the students are also encouraged and pushed to start taking responsibility for themselves. Again, I am second hand familiar with some of this stuff but this is my understanding of how it works.

 

[beer 30]

Lot of educators in this thread, tell me if this is normal. I was kinda shocked when I heard it.

Scenario - routine fire drill. Two children in a class have a condition where fire drills cause heightened anxiety so special ed teacher has to come to room, put noise cancelling headphones on the kids and escort them out.

Y'all ever heard of something that? Is this the new normal?

Sounds like an effective strategy as there are people out there with sensory stimulation issues and if ear phones help these students cope then it's a plus. Also, it may be part of an IEP or other learning plan designed for these particular students.

Yes, it's all of the above, IEP with the sensory stimulation issue.

How does this work in actual emergency?

According to my sister, a paraeducator, it works the same way in real time as it does during a drill. If there is an alarm for any reason and the students need to take emergency action, the in class para or other staff with knowledge of the IEP will go to the students and put the headsets on to keep them calm and keep them moving. It becomes rote which is one benefit of the drills.

I wonder if they try to put the students in the same room. Imagine if you have a few of these sprinkled throughout the school and only one or two folks who can assist?

In elementary school students are often kept together throughout the day so each classroom teacher and assistant knows which students need what accommodations. Once in middle and high, every teacher is given notice of students with learning plans and how they are to implement them but the students are also encouraged and pushed to start taking responsibility for themselves. Again, I am second hand familiar with some of this stuff but this is my understanding of how it works.

Thanks for the feedback, appreciate the info on this

Was genuinely curious how this works during a situation. There are so many kids with IEP's in school now, like almost every one in my daughters class has something going on.

 

[Zow]

Maybe consider prioritizing outcomes over outputs when it comes to teacher performance? This is a "teach to learn" vs "teach to the test" kind of decision.

I think the goals that were trying to be reached by standardizing weren't really met and were a last gasp at saving the socioeconomically disadvantaged. There's a whole lot of policy to talk about w/r/t to the pros and cons of testing/not testing and the "teach to the test" came about because there were communities turning out students that couldn't function and who were passed through the system as if the system's function wasn't to educate but to be a day care or a political instrument.

It's a tough debate. The autonomy of "teach to learn" can be abused. And this made strange bedfellows. It's actually one side of the aisle you wouldn't think that used to push for the SATs and that pushed No Child Left Behind. If you look up its history, it's interesting.

If I keep going, I'll have a nice long vacation from this place. I'll just say this. The bold is one of the things few talk about. If I sit back and think about the things that are wrong with education, it's not that they are being ignored. I think people fully recognize what the problems are. We don't talk about them though and instead we try to come up with solutions that appear to solve the problem, but don't really address the core problem(s) so it makes me happy when I see even small acknowledgements like yours here. "The problems" we have really aren't going to be able to be addressed in the classrooms in a meaningful way. They need to be addressed in community and society as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that is controversial at all. Schools are a reflection of their community. Schools and teachers play a role but they can only do so much with that they are given. If you are a chef and your kitchen manager keeps giving you low quality cuts of meat, out of season fruits, freezer burned fish, etc. is it really the chef's fault that the food is mediocre? Cooking, running a restaurant, etc. is always hard work and requires a lot of attention to detail, multi-tasking, wearing many hats, etc. However, the end results are going to be much better with locally grown produce, waygu steaks and fresh fish brought in right from the boats. You want to fix the schools, fix the community.

If not controversial and everyone agrees, why do you believe they continue to ignore the underlying problem(s) with their faux attempts at addressing "education"? I'd love to believe that most don't think its controversial, but I see no real evidence to back that up. Most actions seem to point towards the opposite.

I'd disagree and believe many do think its controversial to suggest its anything other than the teachers, the facilities, or the curriculum. You think most parents think its their fault?

No they don't think it's their fault. But they would likely agree other parents are doing a bad job and our communities aren't like they used to be and kids are too online too young and our society doesn't promote social interaction enough any more and all those things. It's like polling about Congress. If you poll people about well Congress is doing they will overwhelmingly say it's awful. If you poll people about how their local Congres person is doing, they lean strongly positive and generally choose to re-elect them.

if there's one thing I've learned in my nearly 18 months as a parent, it's that every parent thinks all the other ones are the problem and they do an amazing job.

Like drivers on the road or putters on the golf course.

 

[Joe Bryant]

FWIW, I shared the no phone video with a friend of mine who teaches in Nashville.

She replied,

We’ve been on a no phones kick for three years now, and it’s awesome.

 

[Sand]

Yes. He's been on this for a good while.

Thought this was interesting.

Jonathan Haidt on Instagram: "Testimonials are coming in from teachers about their newly #phonefreeschools and the amazing things that students are now doing — like taking notes, completing their assignments, and talking to each other. “Was it this

153K likes, 5,836 comments - jonathanhaidt on August 12, 2025: "Testimonials are coming in from teachers about their newly #phonefreeschools and the amazing things that students are now doing — like taking notes, completing their assignments, and talking to each other. “Was it this easy of a...

www.instagram.com

Folks disparage Alabama, but they did good here.

 

[MAC_32]

North Carolina education leaders have adopted the ambitious goal of having the best public school system in the nation by 2030.

The State Board of Education approved a five-year strategic plan

Pillars of strategic plan​

The strategic plan is based on three main components. In addition to wanting to make the state's public schools the best in the nation, the other components are high academic achievement and character development.

The plan is built around eight pillars:

• Prepare Each Student for Their Next Phase in Life  - Expanding rigorous pathways, dual enrollment and character development.
• Revere Public School Educators  - Competitive compensation and career advancement opportunities
• Enhance Parent, Caregiver and Community Support – Strengthening family engagement and partnerships
• Ensure Healthy, Safe and Secure Learning Environments - Physical and emotional safety with mental health support
• Optimize Operational Excellence - Modernizing systems and eliminating administrative burdens
• Lead Transformative Change - Research-driven innovation and accountability reform
• Celebrate the Excellence in Public Education - Comprehensive messaging to highlight successes
• Galvanize Champions to Fully Invest in and Support Public Education - Building coalitions for increased investment and pride in our schools

The plan would carry out the pillars with actions such as:

• Start a new program to focus on improving foundational math skills in the early grades.
• Lobby state lawmakers to restore providing extra pay to teachers who have master's degrees.
• Partner with groups to expand school-based health services for students and staff, including telehealth.
• Establish a task force to develop a new school accountability model for assessing school performance.
• Launch a statewide reading campaign to have students read 10 million books annually.

Measuring the success of the plan​

The strategic plan has several key goals for measuring success by 2030:

• Raise the four-year high school graduation rate from 86.9 to 92%.
• Raise the ACT composite score from 18.5 to 20 . The ACT is taken by high school juniors.
• Raise the participation rate on Advancement Placement exams among 10th- through 12th-graders from 21.5% to 30%. Students take AP courses for college credit and to raise their grade point average.
• Raise the participation rate on Career Technical Education (CTE) courses among K-12 students from 36.1% to 41%.
• Raise the percentage of school-aged children enrolled in public schools from 84.5% to 89%. This percentage includes both traditional public schools and charter schools.
• Raise pay so North Carolina leads the Southeast in educator compensation.
• Raise North Carolina's performance on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) exams given to fourth- and eighth-grade students nationally every two years. The state is scoring below 2019 levels in 8th-grade reading and math and 4th-grade reading.

This is great and all, but the NCGA is openly against at least 5 of the 8 pillars. They are more concerned about private school vouchers than actually improving conditions in the public school system.

School vouchers might have been counter productive in my opinion. Its following the same path as student loans. My youngest attends a private Christian school and the rates increased substantially over the last year once government assistance became available.

It could be the school though. It also looks to be morphing into more of prep school vs religious school. They're getting big into recruiting kids for athletics now and that's a whole separate can of worms.

Our data starts streaming in soon and won't be final until October, but that's generally not been the case with our network. Met with a high school today- their avg out of pocket pre voucher was ~$3500, now it's under $2K. Our K-8 schools are less. Sure the sticker price is up, but 'right size towards your cost to educate while keeping tuition affordable' has been our message and to this point we haven't had any major issues. For reference we have 106 schools in our network and legislation expanded access July 2023.