-baller
Footballguy
you mean in year, since that's what everybody was saying about them last year.
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Coach of the Year (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter -baller
- Start date
-OZ-
Footballguy
They'll either be a playoff team or have beaten 2 playoff teams.
-OZ-
Footballguy
there's no excuse to not make the playoffs with this year's schedule. Certainly not if you have the coach of the year.
Enforcer
Footballguy
You bet. He also did a great job of choosing who the Phins played against this year. With schedule management like that its tough lose. To be fair, the Pats got the same slide schedule playing the AFC and NFC West teams.Trying to credit the turnaround to the coach over the slide schedule isn't right.
The division wasn't really that tough. It just happened to have three evenly-matched mediocre teams in it. New England was 2-2 against the other two good teams and 1-3 in the other games against decent teams you listed.New England thrived against the bad teams, played average against teh average teams, and got their butts kicked by the good teams.Hardly coach of the year consideration.
Enforcer
Footballguy
They got 8 games against the two worst divisions in football. The AFC West and NFC West have been an embarrassment this year. That's half their schedule. Shocking they won 7 of those 8.Outside of those 8 games they are 3-4.
Sun 9/7 Kansas City W 17-10
Sun 9/14 at NY Jets W 19-10
Sun 9/21 Miami L 13-38
bye
Sun 10/5 at San Francisco W 30-21
Sun 10/12 at San Diego L 10-30
Mon 10/20 Denver W 41-7
Sun 10/26 St. Louis W 23-16
Sun 11/2 at Indianapolis L 15-18
Sun 11/9 Buffalo W 20-10
Thu 11/13 NY Jets L 31-34
Sun 11/23 at Miami W 48-28
Sun 11/30 Pittsburgh L 10-33
Sun 12/7 at Seattle W 24-21
Sun 12/14 at Oakland W 49-26
Sun 12/21 Arizona W 47-7
Sun 12/28 at Buffalo 1:00 pm
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-OZ-
Footballguy
Denver and San Diego are in your argument for how tough their schedule is? Perhaps that shows you how weak it is.I like their division, it's one of the better in the league, but their non-div was weak, aside from Pittsburgh and Indy.1 Sep 07 KC 2-135 Oct 05 SF 6-96 Oct 12 SD 7-87 Oct 20 DEN 8-78 Oct 26 STL 2-139 Nov 02 IND 11-413 Nov 30 PIT 11-414 Dec 07 SEA 4-1115 Dec 14 OAK 4-1116 Dec 21 ARI 8-710 non-div games, right now 4 of those teams have winning records, 4 are among the worst teams in the league, and they have a total of a 63-87 record, .420. I'll grant you that they played 2 of the best teams in the NFL, but they lost both games.
Buffaloes
Footballguy
Do you really think the NFC East is one of the best divisions this year? Belichick has done a good job but this is a team that was absolutely loaded coming into the year and had a pretty easy schedule. Including Denver and SD on your list of quality teams is a streeeeeeeetch.ETA:My list would be:
1.) Smith
2.) Sparano
3.) Harbaugh/Fisher
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ScottyFargo
Footballguy
Exactly. Miami and the Jets have turned their seasons around, but that doesn't make the Pats record look much better.There is no chance that B.B. is the best coach of the year.Enforcer said:
-baller
Footballguy
if you know anything at all about football --- even the tiniest bit, obviously the afc east is one of the best divisions in football.
yeah, and san diego and denver suck.....
if you're watching the pats right now:
coach
of
the
year
edit ps
why don't all you pats haters list me off all the teams in the league w/no 'bad' teams on their schedules.
yeah, and san diego and denver suck.....
if you're watching the pats right now:
coach
of
the
year
edit ps
why don't all you pats haters list me off all the teams in the league w/no 'bad' teams on their schedules.
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It's not how many good teams you play, it's how many you beat. You listed four teams that you thought were good, and New England (and Belichick)were 1-3 against them. (and one of them was Denver, who can hardly be considered good).if you know anything at all about football --- even the tiniest bit, obviously the afc east is one of the best divisions in football.yeah, and san diego and denver suck.....
ScottyFargo
Footballguy
Last year the AFC east was one of the worst, which helped the Pats to 16-0... This year, they won't quite make that mark. Other coaches have worked harder with less. Pats probably would have done even better had they been able to cheat this year as in previous years. I am sure you are sorry they got caught.if you know anything at all about football --- even the tiniest bit, obviously the afc east is one of the best divisions in football.yeah, and san diego and denver suck.....
What good team has New England beaten this year? I'll give them the win against Denver (who will finish at .500 in a poor division), but the only other decent teams they've beat (MIA, NYJ) have also beaten them.Now go ahead and tell me what good team they beat.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Your schtick is showing. How many play 4 teams with the worst records in the league? If you're going to argue for the guy, at least try to show teams with worst records with weaker schedules.if you know anything at all about football --- even the tiniest bit, obviously the afc east is one of the best divisions in football.yeah, and san diego and denver suck.....
Enforcer
Footballguy
You don't have any respect for people that disagree with you, not matter how sound their argument is. As long as you're starting off with that as a basis for your belief system, you're not going to be convinced of anything. Have fun with that.I'm a Seattle fan, and when I see Seattle fans acting like tools I try to call them on it. Hopefully one the Pat fans will do the same here.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Tony Sporano and Mike Smith should be the top 2 IMHO
gonzobill5
Footballguy
i don't think harbaugh is getting enough love in here. 11-5 after 5-11 last year, and if the refs got that call right in the pittsburgh game they would have won that division. he restored the fire in that defense (they gave up 8 points less per game this year) and did more with less on offense than any team in the league.
i can't understand how people can mention sparano and smith and leave harbaugh out.
i can't understand how people can mention sparano and smith and leave harbaugh out.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Miami was 1-15...went to 11-5 when most felt it was a 2-3 year project at best, this is simply unreal. IIRC, Atlanta was like 4-12 last year, went to 11-5 and do not have near the defensive players that Baltimore has in Ray Lewis and Ed Reed. And Baltimore benefitted from an easier schedule...when a team has an off year but has a lot of good players they typically will respond well from a new coach. It's not like the cupboard was completely bare here.When you say not enough love...you wouldn't really vote for harbaugh on a ballott over Spoano or Mike Smith would you? Assume it like baseballl and you can vote 1-2-3...or like the Heisman.I cn only see it Sporano-Smith-Harbaugh...or Smith-Sporano-Harbaugh. Clearly what Miami and Atlanta have doen is just ridiculous. With the 1st pick int he 2008 NFL Draft...the Miami Dolphins select...to 2008 AFC East Division Champions!!! That's pretty flippin incredible.
Sulla
Marius hates me
Sparano is definitely COTY. 1-15 to 11-5 speaks for itself. And if he doesn't get it, then Smith should get it. From Michael Vick and 4-12 to NFC South Champs? Come on now.
Enforcer
Footballguy
After reading most of the suggestions in this thread I have to agree with this line of thinking.
Serenity Now
Footballguy
Dude, I'm as big a Pats fan as there is, but put the crack pipe down, wouldya? Yes, the Brady injury would have been reason enough to toss the season in the trash, not to mention lots of other injuries (Adalius Thomas, for instance), yes, they overcame a lot and outperformed expectations. The Dolphins and Falcons seasons surpass it.
=Smackdown=
Footballguy
1-15 to 11-5
SPARANO
SPARANO
gonzobill5
Footballguy
it would be a very tough choice between the three. when i said he doesn't get enough love, i meant he should be mentioned in the same sentence as the other two. there are some reasons that i think he is more deserving. smith and sparano greatly benefitted from off season acquisitions. the play of pennington and turner are the major reasons for their turnarounds. baltimore on the other hand lost a HOF left tackle and gained a QB that just about everybody thought wasn't polished enough to start right away. i am very impressed with what the other two have done, and they are probably the better story lines. but the way the ravens have won this year, and the way they've responded after big losses, is pretty revealing and shows me harbaugh deserves A LOT more credit than he's getting.
I have the same three, but Sparano at #1, then Smith then BB. Had the Pats made the playoff, he would have been #1. It's his greatest season as a coach, regardless of the finish.
Um, Miami played the same schedule, though they didn't draw Indi and Pittsburgh, yet their coach is the overwhelming choice that I'm seeing. How does that figure. They're all NFL teams. If you don't play well, you can lose any day. The giants barely beat Arizona, and NE crushed them. Denver beat Tampa Bay, New Orleans, Atlanta and San Diego, yet NE crushed them. Eleven wins is eleven wins in the NFL. There's no way to diminish it. It's an achievement.JuniorNB said:
-baller
Footballguy
so, if mangina had beaten miami you would've made belichick #1...?not sure that line of reasoning makes any sense to me.
Agree on all accounts.can anyone of you guys explain why Fisher isn't in your top 3? I'm a bit surprisedAgree on all accounts.
-baller
Footballguy
all the coaches in this discussion, and even a few more, are very good coaches just by nature of consideration for coach of the year, so it's just a question of who really made the somewhat bigger impact, and who gets credit for what.
I'm not knocking any of these guys, but......
harbaugh inherited a championship caliber defense that had a down year last season due to injury, and whatever else,
while the offense took off under cameron.
you have to give some of the miami credit to parcells, and as someone has already pointed out, how can anyone possibly knock the pats schedule and then lobby for a guy coaching a team w/an even easier schedule?
mike smith gets all this credit because atl was a trainwreck and he had a rookie qb, but who was the hotter prospect in august --- ryan or cassell?
and while belichick won just as many games w/a guy who hadn't even started since high school, he was doing it while half his team was being put on ir --- what kind of adversity was mike smith dealing with?
this goofy claim that there has to be some kind of 10 game turnaround is ridiculous ---- if somebody wins 7 games w/the lions next year, does that make him a genius, or just show us that marinelli is an idiot.
these supposed coaches of the year took over disasters and did well w/them, so congrats on that.
meanwhile, belichick 'took over' a team coming off an undefeated regular season, led by one of the best coaches in football --- how is being an excellent coach in '07 a knock on him in '08 when he is essentially turning over half his roster w/players from off the street?
I'm not knocking any of these guys, but......
harbaugh inherited a championship caliber defense that had a down year last season due to injury, and whatever else,
while the offense took off under cameron.
you have to give some of the miami credit to parcells, and as someone has already pointed out, how can anyone possibly knock the pats schedule and then lobby for a guy coaching a team w/an even easier schedule?
mike smith gets all this credit because atl was a trainwreck and he had a rookie qb, but who was the hotter prospect in august --- ryan or cassell?
and while belichick won just as many games w/a guy who hadn't even started since high school, he was doing it while half his team was being put on ir --- what kind of adversity was mike smith dealing with?
this goofy claim that there has to be some kind of 10 game turnaround is ridiculous ---- if somebody wins 7 games w/the lions next year, does that make him a genius, or just show us that marinelli is an idiot.
these supposed coaches of the year took over disasters and did well w/them, so congrats on that.
meanwhile, belichick 'took over' a team coming off an undefeated regular season, led by one of the best coaches in football --- how is being an excellent coach in '07 a knock on him in '08 when he is essentially turning over half his roster w/players from off the street?
DropKick
Footballguy
Kind of silly to criticize NE for losing to Indy and Pittsburgh, two of the better teams in the NFL. Especially when you consider NE is starting a second string QB with minimal experience. They lose by 3 at Indy and to the Steelers at home in miserable conditions. The vast majority of teams in the NFL would implode without their QB. That is indisputable. Kudos to the Patriots for being that competitive without Brady and a significant set of injuries to what was already an "aging" defense.How many games would the Colts win with Sorgi at QB? Weak schedule or not?
DropKick
Footballguy
Great seasons by both teams... Except the Dolphins were not as bad as 1-15 would suggest and the Falcons are a wild card... not NFC South Champs.After reading most of the suggestions in this thread I have to agree with this line of thinking.Sparano is definitely COTY. 1-15 to 11-5 speaks for itself. And if he doesn't get it, then Smith should get it. From Michael Vick and 4-12 to NFC South Champs? Come on now.
The same names are being bantered around by all. Harbaugh, Sparano, Smith, Fisher, and Belichek (with one or two guys claiming Skeletor...who shouldn't even be on the radar for this after that collapse)
Fisher has the record, and hs certainly done a great job, but nothing he's done screams CY to me, especially when compared to some of the others.
Harbaugh has rejuvenated the Ravens, and done a good job with a rookie QB, but we all saw the potential of this squad before the season. Congrats for acheiving that potential, but if they've over-acheived, it's only marginally.
Belichek is certainly a worthy candidate. Tons of huge injuries, and still managed a winning season. But...there's no way to escape the fact that it's a 5 win deficit from the previous year. If the schedule had been tougher, BB would be an easier sell. IN another year, he might even win it.
Smith has been awesome...but how much is him and how much is the luck of drafting Ryan and aquiring Turner? I can't fault anyone for naming him COY, but I think there's one better candidate...
Sparano. Too many people say it's Parcells doing. HUH?????? Did Parcells install the scheme? Did Parcells develope all the game plans? Teach the lines how to work as solid units? Make halftime adjustments? OK..Parcells made some nice off-season moves...but certainly no big ones outside of Sparano himself and Pennington. This is a 1 win team who just matched the biggest single season turnaround in league history. READ THAT AGAIN.....
This is a 1 win team who just matched the biggest single season turnaround in league history. While you can make a pretty strong argument for any of the other coaches listed, I think it would be a travesty for Sparano to not win this award. He's earned it.
1. Sparano
2. Smith
3. Belichek
4. Harbaugh
5. Fischer
6. who cares (but not Skeletor)
Fisher has the record, and hs certainly done a great job, but nothing he's done screams CY to me, especially when compared to some of the others.
Harbaugh has rejuvenated the Ravens, and done a good job with a rookie QB, but we all saw the potential of this squad before the season. Congrats for acheiving that potential, but if they've over-acheived, it's only marginally.
Belichek is certainly a worthy candidate. Tons of huge injuries, and still managed a winning season. But...there's no way to escape the fact that it's a 5 win deficit from the previous year. If the schedule had been tougher, BB would be an easier sell. IN another year, he might even win it.
Smith has been awesome...but how much is him and how much is the luck of drafting Ryan and aquiring Turner? I can't fault anyone for naming him COY, but I think there's one better candidate...
Sparano. Too many people say it's Parcells doing. HUH?????? Did Parcells install the scheme? Did Parcells develope all the game plans? Teach the lines how to work as solid units? Make halftime adjustments? OK..Parcells made some nice off-season moves...but certainly no big ones outside of Sparano himself and Pennington. This is a 1 win team who just matched the biggest single season turnaround in league history. READ THAT AGAIN.....
This is a 1 win team who just matched the biggest single season turnaround in league history. While you can make a pretty strong argument for any of the other coaches listed, I think it would be a travesty for Sparano to not win this award. He's earned it.
1. Sparano
2. Smith
3. Belichek
4. Harbaugh
5. Fischer
6. who cares (but not Skeletor)
This thread is about coach of the year.No one is saying that Bellichick didn't have a huge hurdle to overcome by losing Brady, or that he did a horrible job, but the fact remains that he didn't win one game against the three legitimately good teams he played this year. Besides that, he lost one player and went from undefeated to not even making the playoffs.Last I checked, Brady wasn't the first quarterback to get injured and miss the season. This was a Super Bowl team full of awesome talent and BB failed to get them into the playoffs in a very so-so division.Like I said, he did a decent job keeping the Pats competitive and battling to the end, but coach of the year consideration? Come on.
Captain Spaulding
Footballguy
Coach of the year? I think it has to be narrowed to Smith, Sparano and Harbaugh since all 3 of these teams turned things around drastically from the season before.
Why not Belichick? - 18-1 last year ...yes he lost Brady and Maroney for this season but he still couldn't win the AFC East at least with a defense that was reletivily intact and offensive pro- bowlers in Moss and Welker on offense.
Why not Tomlin? - Steelers had the #1 defense last year and won the AFC North to boot. Granted he got the team through the toughest schedule in history (as someone quoted..not sure if "in-history" is accurate though) and finished 12-4 but he didn't do anything extra-ordinary.
Why not Fisher? - Last year the Titans were a pretty tough team that played in the AFC South (toughest division in NFL last season). Compared to the team last year, this Titans team has improved since last season but their really not that much better. I think the AFC as a whole is a little weaker this year than last. I love the scouting/drafting of Johnson and love the decision to bench Young and go with Collins. Collins will show his true colors in playoff crunch-time though if he is counted on to make a play down the stretch.
Why not Belichick? - 18-1 last year ...yes he lost Brady and Maroney for this season but he still couldn't win the AFC East at least with a defense that was reletivily intact and offensive pro- bowlers in Moss and Welker on offense.
Why not Tomlin? - Steelers had the #1 defense last year and won the AFC North to boot. Granted he got the team through the toughest schedule in history (as someone quoted..not sure if "in-history" is accurate though) and finished 12-4 but he didn't do anything extra-ordinary.
Why not Fisher? - Last year the Titans were a pretty tough team that played in the AFC South (toughest division in NFL last season). Compared to the team last year, this Titans team has improved since last season but their really not that much better. I think the AFC as a whole is a little weaker this year than last. I love the scouting/drafting of Johnson and love the decision to bench Young and go with Collins. Collins will show his true colors in playoff crunch-time though if he is counted on to make a play down the stretch.
Enforcer
Footballguy
Why not? Didn't you answer your own question in your first sentence?
-baller
Footballguy
I think you have a solid lead on being funniest poster of the year.as for the guy saying beli shouldn't get it because he didn't win as many games as last year --- was he supposed to win 20 regular seasons games to get your consideration?and that guy raving about sparano, but knocking belichick because of his 'easy schedule' could be runner up as funniest poster.
Dude...you been toolish since post one. Not a single soul in here has tried to say BB has done anything less then a great job. Most simply believe the jobs by Sparano, Smith, and Harbaugh are more impressive.Yep...you're right...Miami actually played a slightly easier schedule. But Miami improved by 10 wins while New England regressed by 5 wins. Regardless of any other factors...that's impressive as hell.
as for the guy saying beli shouldn't get it because he didn't win as many games as last year --- was he supposed to win 20 regular seasons games to get your consideration?
and that guy raving about sparano, but knocking belichick because of his 'easy schedule' could be runner up as funniest poster.
-baller
Footballguy
yeah, but the pats had to play omg genius coty sparano TWICE, so they should get extra credit for that.when sparano wins those games while losing his offensive line, qb, secondary, defensive ends, outside linebackers and starts a rookie practice squad running back, then you can come back and tell me how great he is despite the softest schedule in history.
if you think belichick 'lost one player' you should probably excuse yourself from the discussion.
parcells cleaned house and rebuilt that miami team --- sparano doesn't get credit for an incompetent '07 crew, just like it'd be stupid to demerit belichick in '08 for doing such an awesome coaching job last year w/superior personnel.
treat88
Footballguy
You just made the argument for Mike Tomlin, and his team earned a first round bye despite the adversity.BB is low on the list of COY candidates. He did a fine job, others just did much better.
Breathe.Breathe again.
Nobody has disparaged your beloved Patriots coach.
Take one more deep breathe...re-read the arguments of those who disagree and realize many have good arguments. You can agree to disagree without name-calling. (Particularly since nobody has said BB has done anything less then a good job)
-baller
Footballguy
start breathin', dude.yeah, I'd put tomlin on the short list of runner ups.voting should probably go like this:
belichick
lebeau
tomlin
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Chase Stuart
Footballguy
I agree with the common names thrown around here, but I don't see how you can argue Belichick over Sparano. Did you guys miss the biggest coaching mismatch of the year, when Sparano 
Belichick so bad that I thought I was watching **** Jauron.
Belichick so bad that I thought I was watching **** Jauron.
