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Cultural Appropriation (1 Viewer)

JFC

White girl with corn rows = ok     

Wearing black face = not ok

Enjoying tacos = ok

Wearing a comically large sombrero and talking like Speed Gonzales = not ok

Learning martial arts = ok

Using your fingers to squint your eyes and going ching-chong ching-chong =  not ok

 
But feel free to check back after we deal with climate change, affordable access to health care and the insane egomaniac whom we decided to give the power to singlehandedly destroy the human race for some reason and I'll see what I can do to lend a hand ;)
Freedom of Speech is under attack on two fronts. The Trump administration and the far right are practically waging war on the fourth estate right now. That is a big deal.

But freedom of speech is also under attack from the opposite extreme, for very different reasons and in very different ways. It is a much more subtle and insidious assault than the ham-fisted histrionics of buffoons like Trump or Michael Savage, which is exactly what makes it dangerous. Arguably more dangerous.

 
Freedom of Speech is under attack on two fronts. The Trump administration and the far right are practically waging war on the fourth estate right now. That is a big deal.

But freedom of speech is also under attack from the opposite extreme, for very different reasons and in very different ways. It is a much more subtle and insidious assault than the ham-fisted histrionics of buffoons like Trump or Michael Savage, which is exactly what makes it dangerous. Arguably more dangerous.
I've argued against this idea in the Free Speech thread, happy to continue it over there. I don't think it necessarily fits with "cultural appropriation."

 
Using your fingers to squint your eyes and going ching-chong ching-chong =  not ok
that one hurts, man - seriously, it's funny as all hell ... ####, even fat ### Rosie got slammed for doing it on that facacta yenta (look at me misappropriating the Yiddish ??) show ... where has our sense of good-natured ribbing gone?

hell, my Italian surname was twisted so that "grease" replaced the last syllable - yeah, greasy guinea bull#### - i never gave one rat's ###, as most of those who engaged in that chicanery were Kraut MFers or sheep ####### Scotsmen  :shrug:

 
I need a macro that posts to this every time someone bemoans a threat to free speech online. 
I understand that, but when government organs (say, a public university) deter or prohibit speech on the basis of it being "offensive" or "inflammatory", then that is a First Amendment issue.

And when people call for laws making "hate speech" illegal, then that becomes a First Amendment issue as well.

 
I understand that, but when government organs (say, a public university) deter or prohibit speech on the basis of it being "offensive" or "inflammatory", then that is a First Amendment issue.

And when people call for laws making "hate speech" illegal, then that becomes a First Amendment issue as well.
I'm not aware of this happening to any significant extent. There's a difference between deterrence/prohibition and deciding not to give you a microphone and a lectern and air-conditioned seating and security at the expense of the taxpayer. 

But like I said, we've been doing that back and forth over in the free speech thread.  This cultural appropriation stuff is mostly just funny.

 
Not to derail this wonderful thread, but:

I was talking to my father, mentioned that an Eastern European guy I used to work with bought into  pizza franchise.  My dad grumbles something about it not being real Italian, blah blah blah.  A couple years later, I was talking about a pizza place he used to go to when I was a kid called Guiseppe's or something similar.  My dad said he used to go to school with the guy that owned it.  The owner's name was like Joe O'Brien or something totally Irish.
Irish? O'Brien? AYFKM??!?

ferchrissakes, at least the Egyptians have a dose of that 'swarthy, Mediterranean' gig goin' on like us Spaghetti benders  :shrug:

 i'd rather eat cat #### with a knittin' needle than a Pizza 0'Pie  :X (and i be half Irish) 

 
Spreading good ideas from one culture to another is how society becomes more awesome. Anyone who complains about burritos displacing ham sandwiches is a cultural Luddite.

 
Cultural appropriation, as far as I can tell, is a relatively new concept used by those who traffic in identity politics to shut down raw speech and expression of those who use mediums traditionally endemic to other cultures than their own, especially minority or dispossessed ones. I've read the thread, but I feel the need to define it to say this: 

It's a pernicious concept. It decries cultural sharing, as Maurile pointed out above, and could actually be called the new autarky of the cultural identity politics left, in that it is tribalistic and potentially nationalistic. I think it implicates raw free speech and raw free expression, limits talent to a select few, and puts otherwise earnest people on the defensive in ways that implicate very sensitive things. 

To use the example Tobias did: We all know Elvis "appropriated" Chuck Berry, but Berry was popular in his own day. It's authors like Nelson George and others who complained about the popularity of Elvis, but Elvis was a product of a time a lot more racist than the one we have today. We also know Eminem "appropriated" hip hop and rap, and he even admitted it. But here's the thing: They were two wildly popular and respected entertainers in their own right, both by fans and colleagues alike. They might not have deserved their wild popularity, but many people will tell you that they were the best in the game at the time. And that's the rub. The new "cultural appropriation" warriors won't allow for the most talented among us to use form and medium to express ourselves. They'd rather shut people up than take Q-Tip's approach, which was, "You can be white and groove but don't crap the roll." 

People also seem to be confusing exploitation with expression and speech and form and medium. Exploitation is a different matter entirely. When Mario Battali (Batali? I read Heat by Buford and Batali looks right) apprentices in Italy or Spain, he's following in a tradition of people and chefs who have done this. When people travel from Portland to Mexico to find out how to make authentic burritos, they're not stealing anything. They're following in a tradition of cultural respect and cultural sharing. We've gotten to the point where I hear people discussing Justin Bieber's dreadlocks in settings where they're angry he's grown them. What happened to laughing at that like the Ras Trent of yore? Exploitation happens for many reasons, not the least of which is intellectual property laws. Berry Gordy was one of the worst violators and labor exploiters in the music industry, yet nary a peep from the likes of a George or a Mos Def. Diddy absolutely hosed his artists in their recording contracts. Again, nary a peep (well, the Lox made a peep, but that's for another day.) Anyway, my long point can be condensed as such: Exploitation of labor happens everywhere, cultural appropriation seems to seek to head that off by limiting cultural sharing.  

Cultural appropriation is, as Redmond said, maybe not the sign of the idiot, but the sign of somebody who is limited in worldview, outlook, and wants to limit our natural right to speech, expression, labor, you name it.  

It's sinister.  

Also, when I say speech, I say it in the Tocquevillian sense, as always.  

 
That's crazy - but I suspect there's more to the closing than simply the outrage over how they learned to make burritos.
I mean... maybe there is... but do you really think the social justice warriors need more provocation than what's mentioned in the story?

Couple young white millennial girls open a burrito store and the next thing they know they're being attacked as racists and their yelp page is bombarded with negative reviews. They fold. Easy targets. 

 
I mean... maybe there is... but do you really think the social justice warriors need more provocation than what's mentioned in the story?

Couple young white millennial girls open a burrito store and the next thing they know they're being attacked as racists and their yelp page is bombarded with negative reviews. They fold. Easy targets. 
I don't think the SJWs need any more "provocation", but does the average burrito eater really gives a ####? 

 
TobiasFunke said:
Sure. Some proposed rules for consideration:

Rule #1:  Don't be an ###hole. Respect other cultures.

Rule #2:  Don't be a crybaby.   There are literally thousands of more important problems to worry about every day. 

That work for everyone?
Those rules work best when we apply them to everyone equally.   

 
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Couple young white millennial girls open a burrito store and the next thing they know they're being attacked as racists and their yelp page is bombarded with negative reviews.
What's being overlooked here is that it's really the aggrieved Mexicans who are engaging in cultural appropriation. Whining about meddlesome competition from members of other cultures was originally white people's shtick.

 
sublimeone said:
I keep hearing about 'cultural appropriation.' Apparently Katy Perry is guilty of cultural appropriation for wearing her hair in corn rows and dressing like a geisha. And now she's taking another huge risk walking the very fine line of sexual orientation appropriation - maybe this isn't a thing yet, I'm not sure.

We know that gender appropriation is about how you identify but don't dare identify as an African-American but native American is probably OK.

And then there's the business angle, these white ladies were bullied into shutting down their burrito shop by left-wing nuts for cultural appropriation. Meanwhile George Clooney and two other white guys just sold their tequila brand, 'Casamigos Tequila' for $1B and there hasn't been a peep about cultural appropriation. 

This is all just very confusing for those of us not on the cutting edge of gender/race political correctness run amok.

Help us understand so that the next time we take a trip to the Caribbean we don't unwittingly patronize the native peoples tempting us to appropriate their culture.

Maybe some the board liberals can help clear things up for us normal folk.
To be fair those burritos look like crap.

 

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