Defensive TD Problem from Arizona-Denver Game? (1 Viewer)

[joecarterfan]

I'm still trying to clarify if the last TD from the Arizona Defense is going to be credited to the team defense? It's probably gonna cost my team a chance to move on in the playoffs. Does anyone know how this is going to be ruled? It's going to cost me 10 points that I really need! When will official stats be out? Thanks!

 

[OddibeMcD]

Covered here and in the game thread.

The D didn't score. It was an int fumbled at the 1 and recovered in the end zone. The Arizona defense did not score based on the vagaries of the change of possession rules.

 

[shadyridr]

Without a doubt credited to defense. Just give it time to update.

 

[joecarterfan]

Covered here and in the game thread.

The D didn't score. It was an int fumbled at the 1 and recovered in the end zone. The Arizona defense did not score based on the vagaries of the change of possession rules.

I just can't understand how this is not a Defensive TD. The ball never changed possession!

 

[Trizzler]

Unfortunate that a fellow TCU alum, Daryl Washington, had to pull a Leon Lett and fumble the ball away at the goal line. But as mentioned above, I don't believe this will be credited as a defensive TD.

 

[OddibeMcD]

I am not at all sure of this, but I think that at the timeof the fumble the Cardinals have to be the offensive team for the fumble rules spelled out in the Rulebook tobe applied correctly. The rulebook makes explicit reference to offensive players fumbling and defensive players fumbling.

Also, the NFL defines the offensive team as "Whenever a team is in possession (3-2-7), it is the Offense and, at such

time, its opponent is the Defense." So, when the fumle occurred the Cardinals were technically the offense for they had established possession of the football after the interception. But, when the fumble occurred, Dockery actually recovered an offensive fumble and was not a defender at the time of the fumble. Because Dockery was an offensive player, he cannot be credited as a defensive player and his touchdown was not a defensive touchdown.

Do you think that Dockery (or the Cardinal D) should be credited with a fumble recovery on the play? For the NFL, his recovery is treated no differently than Skelton covering up the ball when the center fumbled because of the thumb injury (think that was the Cardinals, had several games going).

 

[Utter Chaos]

I am not at all sure of this, but I think that at the timeof the fumble the Cardinals have to be the offensive team for the fumble rules spelled out in the Rulebook tobe applied correctly. The rulebook makes explicit reference to offensive players fumbling and defensive players fumbling. Also, the NFL defines the offensive team as "Whenever a team is in possession (3-2-7), it is the Offense and, at suchtime, its opponent is the Defense." So, when the fumle occurred the Cardinals were technically the offense for they had established possession of the football after the interception. But, when the fumble occurred, Dockery actually recovered an offensive fumble and was not a defender at the time of the fumble. Because Dockery was an offensive player, he cannot be credited as a defensive player and his touchdown was not a defensive touchdown. Do you think that Dockery (or the Cardinal D) should be credited with a fumble recovery on the play? For the NFL, his recovery is treated no differently than Skelton covering up the ball when the center fumbled because of the thumb injury (think that was the Cardinals, had several games going).

That means at the time of the interception Arizona became the offensive team. So according to your interpretation of the definition, the defense can never score because if you have the ball you're on offense. Offense and defense is determined at the time of the snap. In this case Arizona was on defense. It should be a defense touchdown.

 

[OddibeMcD]

First off, its not my "interpretation" of the definition, Section 35, Article 1 is the definition for determining offense/defense. Section 35, Article 3(a) defines possession after an interception. I'm puzzled how you can interpret "Whenever a team is in possession (3-2-7), it is the Offense and, at such time, its opponent is the Defense," and A change of possession occurs when a player of the defensive team secures possession of a ball that has been kicked, passed, or fumbled by a player of the offensive team, or when the ball is awarded to the opposing team by rule. A change of possession includes but is not limited to: (a) an interception of a forward pass," as anything other than Arizona becoming the offensive team at the time of the interception.

Fantasy Football scoring generally looks at whether the player was an offensive or defensive player at the time possession was established. Thus, Washington was a defender at the time of the interception. Once possession was established he, and every other Cardinal player was on offense. Therefore, when Washington fumbled Dockery was not a defensive player and cant be credited with a defensive touchdown.

 

[RavenLunatic]

What about intentional laterals on the return? That happens a lot.