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He's definitely not a "plodder." He lacks elite vision and instincts, but he's plenty fast and athletic IMO. He's just a guy who will blast full speed into a couple of defenders and drag them for a 5 yard gain rather than making the subtle shift of direction to cut it back for 20+.Comparing any RB outside of healthy Peterson or McFadden to Jamaal Charles an unfair starting point. Charles has HOF level natural running ability.
I drafted him at the end of the first round. Not really sure whom else you wanted me to draft? One of the 20 WRs not named Calvin that all looked about the same coming into this year? Has AJ, Fitz or Julio separated themselves from the pack? How about MJD coming off his holdout? Perhaps Charles or ADP coming off ACLs? Maybe Forte with Bush waiting to steal his GL carries? CJ1K? The end of RD1 was a black hole this year. Everybody had major flaws. I knew the Cowboy line was bad, and I knew about Murray's injury history. I also knew that he was one of the few RBs that was a good bet to see a heavy workload and get goal line carries. At this point, of all the players with FBG rankings between 10-25, only Charles, Green, Gronkowski and Brees, look like they were worthy of the pick. I got one of them in the 2nd Rd.
Pretty good comparison. Similar skill sets and running styles. Lynch may be a touch stronger, but Murray a touch faster.Marshawn Lynch?
FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season. I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.Marshawn Lynch?
He's not dancing in the holes, so that should be blamed on the Oline.
Maybe ranking him as a top 7 rb is a little to high, saying he's no better then a 4th to 5th round pick shows that you are high.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??It's like Ingram last year only 10 times worse. I think he'll have some nice games but this guy is going about 3 rounds too high.
Was still the 20 highest scoring RB for the week for players who were on teams in my league. Makes him a starter in week 4. Only scored 1 point less then Rice.Maybe ranking him as a top 7 rb is a little to high, saying he's no better then a 4th to 5th round pick shows that you are high.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??
In my league, he's 3 points behind Lesean McCoy and Adrian Peterson, and 2 points ahead of Mcfadden. In terms of running backs drafted in the first round, he's performed at about the same level as many of them.Honestly, Ray Rice and Arian Foster (and maybe MJD or Lynch if they went higher in your league than mine) are the only first round RB's who have lived up to their draft spot so far.Was still the 20 highest scoring RB for the week for players who were on teams in my league. Makes him a starter in week 4. Only scored 1 point less then Rice.Maybe ranking him as a top 7 rb is a little to high, saying he's no better then a 4th to 5th round pick shows that you are high.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??
Fantasy owners don't really care why a guy sucks. If he sucks, then he sucks, and we hate him.
Ya I get that. Seems unfair but I understand it. Also I mostly play dynasty so I tend to look at talent more than situation.
Even in the deep shark leagues lynch was an early to mid scone rounder. In the less competitive leagues I was mocked heavily for taking him. Regardless I'm riding the beast across the board this year based upon risk /reward analysis.In my league, he's 3 points behind Lesean McCoy and Adrian Peterson, and 2 points ahead of Mcfadden. In terms of running backs drafted in the first round, he's performed at about the same level as many of them.Honestly, Ray Rice and Arian Foster (and maybe MJD or Lynch if they went higher in your league than mine) are the only first round RB's who have lived up to their draft spot so far.Was still the 20 highest scoring RB for the week for players who were on teams in my league. Makes him a starter in week 4. Only scored 1 point less then Rice.Maybe ranking him as a top 7 rb is a little to high, saying he's no better then a 4th to 5th round pick shows that you are high.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??
Saw Chris Wesseling say the same thing. Good stat.
Not surprising if you have watched Dallas play.
I don't think he is near being terrible, but I think the OL is terrible, and the QB and WRs aren't on the same page. I think the play calling is suspect too. The offense is a mess.'Kool-Aid Larry said:
Lynch was a pretty obvious stud. I took him in the first in several leagues just because it's better to reach than to take a guy based on consensus opinion.Even in the deep shark leagues lynch was an early to mid scone rounder. In the less competitive leagues I was mocked heavily for taking him. Regardless I'm riding the beast across the board this year based upon risk /reward analysis.In my league, he's 3 points behind Lesean McCoy and Adrian Peterson, and 2 points ahead of Mcfadden. In terms of running backs drafted in the first round, he's performed at about the same level as many of them.Honestly, Ray Rice and Arian Foster (and maybe MJD or Lynch if they went higher in your league than mine) are the only first round RB's who have lived up to their draft spot so far.Was still the 20 highest scoring RB for the week for players who were on teams in my league. Makes him a starter in week 4. Only scored 1 point less then Rice.Maybe ranking him as a top 7 rb is a little to high, saying he's no better then a 4th to 5th round pick shows that you are high.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??
They should get the starting center, Costa, back after their bye. He's no world beater though. But perhaps it means that Cook slides over to guard and Bernadeau hits the bench.
I was never a believer of Murray coming into this season. Everybody was freaking out about him at the end of last year coming into this year and all I saw was 2-3 monster games against some of the worst defenses in the league. That combined with 2 TDs thought 8 games was enough to make me stay away. I purposely had Murray on my list of guys to avoid unless they fell far, I had no intentions on drafting him unless he dropped to me in the 3rd round as I just felt there were better options in the 2nd like Lynch for example. So far he's doing the same thing this season, one big game vs the Giants and 1 TD through 4 games. You take the Giants game out of the equation and he's averaging 2.58ypc with a 1/3 shot at a TD each week. That's horrendous.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season. I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
He's actually outscored Lynch in .5 ppr in half the games so far. It is rare to find a matchup proof RB, which is another way of saying almost every RB feasts on bad Ds.. I have no idea what you guys expect from a less than top 5 RB pick, but when you have to throw out 1/4 of the season to make your point that a guy is a bust, you should take the time to rethink your point IMO.I was never a believer of Murray coming into this season. Everybody was freaking out about him at the end of last year coming into this year and all I saw was 2-3 monster games against some of the worst defenses in the league. That combined with 2 TDs thought 8 games was enough to make me stay away. I purposely had Murray on my list of guys to avoid unless they fell far, I had no intentions on drafting him unless he dropped to me in the 3rd round as I just felt there were better options in the 2nd like Lynch for example. So far he's doing the same thing this season, one big game vs the Giants and 1 TD through 4 games. You take the Giants game out of the equation and he's averaging 2.58ypc with a 1/3 shot at a TD each week. That's horrendous.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season. I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
In fairness, he's performing like a top 5 back. Foster and Rice are ahead of him, but he's on par (or higher) with Chris Johnson, Darren Mcfadden, and Lesean McCoy...at least in my league settings.He's actually outscored Lynch in .5 ppr in half the games so far. It is rare to find a matchup proof RB, which is another way of saying almost every RB feasts on bad Ds.. I have no idea what you guys expect from a less than top 5 RB pick, but when you have to throw out 1/4 of the season to make your point that a guy is a bust, you should take the time to rethink your point IMO.I was never a believer of Murray coming into this season. Everybody was freaking out about him at the end of last year coming into this year and all I saw was 2-3 monster games against some of the worst defenses in the league. That combined with 2 TDs thought 8 games was enough to make me stay away. I purposely had Murray on my list of guys to avoid unless they fell far, I had no intentions on drafting him unless he dropped to me in the 3rd round as I just felt there were better options in the 2nd like Lynch for example. So far he's doing the same thing this season, one big game vs the Giants and 1 TD through 4 games. You take the Giants game out of the equation and he's averaging 2.58ypc with a 1/3 shot at a TD each week. That's horrendous.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season. I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
No, no, no. That wasn't a comparison at all. Lynch >>>> Murray. Someone else had asked who else should they have drafted in the first round. I was simply answering that Lynch should've been the pick. I know it would have been met with some dissent, but that's why I wish auction was more popular.'Ridgelake said:Pretty good comparison. Similar skill sets and running styles. Lynch may be a touch stronger, but Murray a touch faster.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
Yeah, that was stupid. He'd been ranked higher and I saw him going around 2.01 in ADPs before his arrest. FBG downgraded him immediately and despite reports that there would be no suspension this year they never moved him all the way back up. I never saw how he wasn't an easy 1st round pick considering the fodder that was going in there. Even in a good year, a 300 carry back with goal line carries should be considered worthy of at least a late 1st.I mainly play non-PPR. Lynch is 6th. Murray is 19th. FBG scoring puts them at 59 and 41 pts to date. Lynch is putting up 4.6 ypc to Murray's 3.9 ypc. They both are at 7.1 ypr but Murray has 114 yards to Lynch's 50. So maybe he's not leaps and bounds ahead of Murray, but he's easily better. He's never done his owners wrong - putting up no less than 9.7 pts in a week and topping 18 twice.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.
So as I stated a few posts ago. Murray has faced rushing defenses ranked 2, 3, 4 and 22 this season. He faces one top 10 rushing d the rest of the year.Lynch has faced rushing d's ranked 16, 18, 19 and 26 so far. He faces 6 top 10 rushing defenses between now and week 16. (11 weeks).Yeah, that was stupid. He'd been ranked higher and I saw him going around 2.01 in ADPs before his arrest. FBG downgraded him immediately and despite reports that there would be no suspension this year they never moved him all the way back up. I never saw how he wasn't an easy 1st round pick considering the fodder that was going in there. Even in a good year, a 300 carry back with goal line carries should be considered worthy of at least a late 1st.I mainly play non-PPR. Lynch is 6th. Murray is 19th. FBG scoring puts them at 59 and 41 pts to date. Lynch is putting up 4.6 ypc to Murray's 3.9 ypc. They both are at 7.1 ypr but Murray has 114 yards to Lynch's 50. So maybe he's not leaps and bounds ahead of Murray, but he's easily better. He's never done his owners wrong - putting up no less than 9.7 pts in a week and topping 18 twice.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.
After 4 weeks we're still in that realm of possibility where defenses are ranked better based on the quality of offenses they've seen. Maybe it's possible that Murray is actually just not that good? I'm looking at his game vs Tampa where he put up 18 carries for 38 yards... after we just saw Alfred Morris completely expose that defense all day I'm left to believe that Tampa's run D is a lie. If Green Bay can put up 4ypc against CHI with Benson than shouldn't Murray be able to do better than 2.6ypc? The only game Murray has shown any promise in so far was the Giants game, coincidentally it's also the only game Dallas has showed any promise in...So as I stated a few posts ago. Murray has faced rushing defenses ranked 2, 3, 4 and 22 this season. He faces one top 10 rushing d the rest of the year.Lynch has faced rushing d's ranked 16, 18, 19 and 26 so far. He faces 6 top 10 rushing defenses between now and week 16. (11 weeks).Yeah, that was stupid. He'd been ranked higher and I saw him going around 2.01 in ADPs before his arrest. FBG downgraded him immediately and despite reports that there would be no suspension this year they never moved him all the way back up. I never saw how he wasn't an easy 1st round pick considering the fodder that was going in there. Even in a good year, a 300 carry back with goal line carries should be considered worthy of at least a late 1st.I mainly play non-PPR. Lynch is 6th. Murray is 19th. FBG scoring puts them at 59 and 41 pts to date. Lynch is putting up 4.6 ypc to Murray's 3.9 ypc. They both are at 7.1 ypr but Murray has 114 yards to Lynch's 50. So maybe he's not leaps and bounds ahead of Murray, but he's easily better. He's never done his owners wrong - putting up no less than 9.7 pts in a week and topping 18 twice.'Kitrick Taylor said:FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season.'FF Ninja said:Marshawn Lynch?
I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.
The difference between the two right now is about 110 yards and a TD. It will be interesting to see where these two end up.
I don't think any of you have actually seen him play.He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield. He has very good, not elite vision. He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down. He is an excellent receiver.He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side. The offensive system is pass first.In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35. Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
I don't think any of you have actually seen him play.He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield. He has very good, not elite vision. He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down. He is an excellent receiver.He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side. The offensive system is pass first.In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35. Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
I don't know if I can recall a young player with 4.4 speed being called a plodder.
The bolded may be the most important point you've made. He's just not a good HC, or even OC really. Most striking to me is that Romo is actually a good QB. If Garrett would play to his strengths, I think we'd be talking about him being in or near the elite category. There's really not many coaches out there that get so much inconsistency out of what is really a pretty talented roster.I don't think any of you have actually seen him play.
Comparing any RB outside of healthy Peterson or McFadden to Jamaal Charles an unfair starting point. Charles has HOF level natural running ability.
He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield.
He has very good, not elite vision.
He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.
He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down.
He is an excellent receiver.
He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side.
The offensive system is pass first.
In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.
It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35.
Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
I'm not sure its Garrett's fault. At least not directly. The team has been built from the outside in. They have above average talent at the skill positions but only 1 average or better OL. When Garrett became OC, Dallas had one of the best OL in the league. And Romo had elite numbers throwing to the likes of TO and Terry Glenn while Barber was near the league lead in TDs. Garrett and his system were not stupid then. I don't think several years of additional OC and HC experience have made him less smart.But the calls that Garrett is able to run now are not all the same ones he ran then. He's had to really scale back his playbook because he knows the OL can't hold. Unless and until the OL improves, it won't matter much if you've got Jerry Rice, Randy Moss, Jim Brown etc. in their primes at the skill spots. Every member of the OL when Garrett took over is gone/retired. The replacements havent worked. If you're consistently beat up front, its really tough to be successful on offense. Murray's large number of negative runs is an indication of how overwhelmed the OL has been.Dallas tried a bit to address the OL the last couple of seasons. They drafted 3 guys last year, Tyron, Arkin, and Nagy. Arkin isnt ready. Nagy was looking serviceable but got a season ending injury for the 2nd year in a row and was cut in training camp (and signed by Detroit). They signed 2 FA gaurds in the offseason. But its become clear why those guys were not resigned by their respective clubs. They traded a 7th rounder for a backup center who's been forced to start due to other injury.Will the OL improve this year? Its hard to suggest it will get materially worse. You can say they havent had enough time to work together. The 5 guys are all in new spots versus last year. And they literally didnt get a chance to practice together until a couple of days before the first real game. Several of them missed much of training camp due to injury. But while some continuity together should help, its really tough to see much material improvement happening this year. They realistically need to continue to invest both high draft picks and material FA money into upgrading this unit.That's a long winded way of saying I don't think the major problem is Garrett.
You've done a very good job summarizing Murray as well as the unfortunate situation he is in, but I'd also add that Murray:- lacks a second gear - watch the first 20 seconds of this highlight from last year's Rams game http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30-dysv4KNsI don't think any of you have actually seen him play.
Comparing any RB outside of healthy Peterson or McFadden to Jamaal Charles an unfair starting point. Charles has HOF level natural running ability.
He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield.
He has very good, not elite vision.
He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.
He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down.
He is an excellent receiver.
He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side.
The offensive system is pass first.
In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.
It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35.
Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
We're talking about averages here. I don't care about cumulative totals when looking at a rush D. You like to use the 2, 3, 4, and 22 numbers but in terms of yards per carry, it has been 2, 4, 9, and 25 but more importantly, it's only been 4 games so Murray's stats have greatly contributed to them being ranked where they are. Tampa is only allowing 3.2 ypc so far this year (4th place), but they allowed 5.0 ypc last year. I really doubt they finish #4 in terms of yards per carry allowed.The only thing keeping Murray afloat is his 64 catch pace. Will that continue?So as I stated a few posts ago. Murray has faced rushing defenses ranked 2, 3, 4 and 22 this season. He faces one top 10 rushing d the rest of the year.Lynch has faced rushing d's ranked 16, 18, 19 and 26 so far. He faces 6 top 10 rushing defenses between now and week 16. (11 weeks).Yeah, that was stupid. He'd been ranked higher and I saw him going around 2.01 in ADPs before his arrest. FBG downgraded him immediately and despite reports that there would be no suspension this year they never moved him all the way back up. I never saw how he wasn't an easy 1st round pick considering the fodder that was going in there. Even in a good year, a 300 carry back with goal line carries should be considered worthy of at least a late 1st.I mainly play non-PPR. Lynch is 6th. Murray is 19th. FBG scoring puts them at 59 and 41 pts to date. Lynch is putting up 4.6 ypc to Murray's 3.9 ypc. They both are at 7.1 ypr but Murray has 114 yards to Lynch's 50. So maybe he's not leaps and bounds ahead of Murray, but he's easily better. He's never done his owners wrong - putting up no less than 9.7 pts in a week and topping 18 twice.FBGs had him ranked #30 going into the season.Marshawn Lynch?
I had a lot of concerns about his motivation after a big contract. Looks like that concern was unfounded at this point. That said, he's not exactly leaps and bounds ahead of where Murray is so far. Agree with Ridgelake's comparison of Murray and Lynch.
The difference between the two right now is about 110 yards and a TD. It will be interesting to see where these two end up.
The Giants clip shows him bowling over one guy, breaking a second tackle, a third if you count his FB, then he cuts upfield, running stride for stride with Dez before getting surrounded.You've done a very good job summarizing Murray as well as the unfortunate situation he is in, but I'd also add that Murray:- lacks a second gear - watch the first 20 seconds of this highlight from last year's Rams game http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30-dysv4KNsI don't think any of you have actually seen him play.
Comparing any RB outside of healthy Peterson or McFadden to Jamaal Charles an unfair starting point. Charles has HOF level natural running ability.
He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield.
He has very good, not elite vision.
He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.
He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down.
He is an excellent receiver.
He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side.
The offensive system is pass first.
In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.
It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35.
Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
- has suspect conditioning - watch as he cuts back inside because he's totally gassed
Im not sure if this guy is serious or not. He links you to 2 great runs that he had. Makes no senseYou've done a very good job summarizing Murray as well as the unfortunate situation he is in, but I'd also add that Murray:- lacks a second gear - watch the first 20 seconds of this highlight from last year's Rams game http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30-dysv4KNsI don't think any of you have actually seen him play.
Comparing any RB outside of healthy Peterson or McFadden to Jamaal Charles an unfair starting point. Charles has HOF level natural running ability.
He has very good but not elite speed. LOL at calling him a plodder. Yea, when 6 guys are in the backfield.
He has very good, not elite vision.
He has excellent cutback ability and is a 1 cut back.
He has good, not great power, but is physical and doesn't back down.
He is an excellent receiver.
He plays behind a line with only 1 quality player in Tryon, the LT, none on the right side.
The offensive system is pass first.
In order to ensure the run is never successful, they usually run the ball out of big formations, essentially telegraphing that the play is a run.
It's hard to establish the run when you're either up by 35 or down by 35.
Did I mention Jason Garrett is his head coach?
- has suspect conditioning - watch as he cuts back inside because he's totally gassed
Felix Jones ran a 4.44 at the combine too. The good news for Murray is the matchups get better after the bye week, especially Carolina in week 7.
The concern is people who took him at the beginning of the second round are looking for way more than a low end rb2
Understood. People should expect RB1 numbers from him, but nobody expected this mess with Dallas. Despite that he's going to sprinkle in some RB1 games and if Dallas can somehow right this ship, lookout!If you drafted him he's a definate hold. No reason to panic and sell low at this point. If you don't have him go get him ASAP.LOL @ comparing Felix to Demarco. Murray is easily a top 10 back in the NFL, just in a bad place right now.
damn, he was off by a couple weeks
Through 6 games last season Ingram: 239/3. This year Murray: 330/1. Pretty close. If not for Chris Johnson's 301/0 we're talking BustOTY, now with the injury he probably jumps Johnson for the honor.Really? You're equating a rookie last year who didn't play much to a guy who broke records in the few games he played? There are zero similarities between the two.I don't get the love for this guy at all, I mean not at all. It's like some pundit ranked him a top 7 rb by default and every other expert jumped on the bandwagon. People are taking this guy late in the first round??
