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Doctor violently dragged from full United flight (1 Viewer)

EYLive said:
My wife and I are just 2 people but we're scheduled for at least 2 more round trips this year. United will not be considered. If all the people on social media are as outraged as they claimed to be (or not) there will be plenty of lost business for United.
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you new to this social media thing?

 
Sounds like there should be some great deals coming up on United, and you know they will treat you at least slightly better than usual.

 
EYLive said:
My wife and I are just 2 people but we're scheduled for at least 2 more round trips this year. United will not be considered. If all the people on social media are as outraged as they claimed to be (or not) there will be plenty of lost business for United.
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these are the same morons who were giving Kelly Clarkston a hard time because she gave her 2 year old daughter some Nutella

"ZOMG THE SUGAR!!!!!!!"

"CONGRATS ON GIVING YOUR KID CANCER.  DIDNT YOU READ THE STUDY ON WHACKO MOMMY BLOG"

 
whiskey7 said:
I know. I was simply saying its not their policy to toss money at passengers until they find someone's price. The UA employees were limited by policy that day. They had to comply with company policy or (likely) face losing their job. People in here keep saying all they (UA employees) had to do was up the offer until they found a taker. But its not that simple.
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They is the company. And the policy the employees followed isn't even applicable to the situation. First, it wasn't an overbooked flight. Everyone booked for the flight had a seat. What they wanted to do was bump people for employees who weren't booked for the flight but needed a last minute way of getting to Louisville. And second, even if was an overbooked situation, the policy is applicable to customers who haven't boarded yet. Once the customers had boarded, they've taken possession of what they've already paid for. At that point, there isn't a court in the country that would rule in favor of the company's policy over the customer's possession of what they paid for, despite the airlines having done this for years.  

 
Grace Under Pressure said:
The people defending the airline on any point should wonder when it was exactly they lost their sense or right and wrong in life. @shader must feel like he's arguing with a brick wall in here.

F'n lol at "the guy could have drove it's not that far" in particular. C'mon. 
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elbowrm said:
I don't see anyone here defending the airline.  
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This exchange is from page 1 and unfortunately there are some defenders, which is fairly unbelievable, but I suppose not 100% surprising nowadays.

Corporations are made up of people. A corporation by definition is a group of people or a company acting as an individual, and authorized as such by law. 

Corporate interests should always align 100% with consumer interests. If you work for a corporation, please keep in mind that other individuals are your consumers, and need to be treated as the top of the hierarchy. Because ultimately we are all customers of corporations in different circumstances.

I work for a Fortune top 10 corporation in marketing, appealing directly to consumers in most cases. We live this consumer-focused mindset as a rule every day in our business, because we have to in order to exist. Hopefully this is a wake-up/reminder call to the airline industry that they have to as well.

 
EYLive said:
My wife and I are just 2 people but we're scheduled for at least 2 more round trips this year. United will not be considered. If all the people on social media are as outraged as they claimed to be (or not) there will be plenty of lost business for United.
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They aren't. They will forget the whole incident and move onto the next thing that pops up on their iphone.

 
lod001 said:
They aren't. They will forget the whole incident and move onto the next thing that pops up on their iphone.
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You said earlier that the whole incident would have blown over by now and it has not only not blown over, it has gotten worse for UA.

 
Dan Lambskin said:
EYLive said:
My wife and I are just 2 people but we're scheduled for at least 2 more round trips this year. United will not be considered. If all the people on social media are as outraged as they claimed to be (or not) there will be plenty of lost business for United.
Click to expand...
these are the same morons who were giving Kelly Clarkston a hard time because she gave her 2 year old daughter some Nutella

"ZOMG THE SUGAR!!!!!!!"

"CONGRATS ON GIVING YOUR KID CANCER.  DIDNT YOU READ THE STUDY ON WHACKO MOMMY BLOG"
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i guess the more i read the more glad i am that you have me on ignore take that to the bank nonbrohan 

 
HellToupee said:
I believe they offered $800 with no takers . Can't blame people for wanting to get home. I was told  they are capped on what they can offer by some regulation . 

Seems like no bigger power trip than the tsa & people working the gates
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Then offer $1,000, $1,200, $1,500, etc.  Everyone has their price.  They could have wired this dude $1M and they'd be better off

 
Dickies said:
Then offer $1,000, $1,200, $1,500, etc.  Everyone has their price.  They could have wired this dude $1M and they'd be better off
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They won't break the policy because people will catch on and start inflating the price.

Most people will take a little cash but on the rare occasion they don't it's easier to call in the gestapo

They didn't know this guy would become the poster child for aeronautic abuse or they would have wired that million

 
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Dickies said:
Then offer $1,000, $1,200, $1,500, etc.  Everyone has their price.  They could have wired this dude $1M and they'd be better off
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Or, they could have just rented a car and drove their employees to Kentucky.  $150 bucks total?  Maybe?

Maybe they don't rent cars at airports and it wasn't possible.

 
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chet said:
Cornell law prof on why UA was legally wrong to deplane Dr. Dao.

It echoes what many here have been saying all week.
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What interests me is how they define "boarding."  It's a lose-lose for United.  If he had "boarded," then they did not have valid grounds to remove him, as the law professor points out.  Lose.  If they argue the process of "boarding" continues until the point of departure, then passengers will feel ill at ease until the plane is moving down the runway. Lose. 

That said, it was dumb of the guy to rush back onto the plane. In the context of airline safety, that can't be tolerated.  

 
tri-man 47 said:
What interests me is how they define "boarding."  It's a lose-lose for United.  If he had "boarded," then they did not have valid grounds to remove him, as the law professor points out.  Lose.  If they argue the process of "boarding" continues until the point of departure, then passengers will feel ill at ease until the plane is moving down the runway. Lose. 

That said, it was dumb of the guy to rush back onto the plane. In the context of airline safety, that can't be tolerated.  
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IN today's presser, they claimed he had no recollection of anything after being concussed.  That will play well to the jury if it ever gets there.

 
MaxThreshold said:
Or, they could have just rented a car and drove their employees to Kentucky.  $150 bucks total?  Maybe?

Maybe they don't rent cars at airports and it wasn't possible.
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No, this has been covered a couple times before if you had bothered to read the thread. Union contracts and established company procedures would have prohibited that (not saying that either are correct or the best way to go, but renting an Uber was simply not an option for UA).

 
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When a flight is oversold, UA can deny boarding to some passengers, who then receive compensation under specific guidelines. However, Dao was not denied boarding. He was granted boarding and then involuntarily removed from the airplane. What does the contract say about that?

It turns out that the contract has a specific rule regarding “Refusal of Transport” (Rule 21), which lays out the conditions under which a passenger can be removed and refused transport on the aircraft. This includes situations where passengers act in a “disorderly, offensive, abusive, or violent” manner, refuse to comply with the smoking policy, are barefoot or “not properly clothed,” as well as many other situations.

There is absolutely no provision for deplaning a seated passenger because the flight is oversold.

An added complication here is that the flight wasn’t even oversold. The contract defines an oversold flight as “a flight where there are more Passengers holding valid confirmed Tickets that check-in for the flight within the prescribed check-in time than there are available seats.”

In this case, the airline attempted to remove seated passengers to make room for airline staff requiring transport to another airport, not because it had sold more tickets than there were seats available.
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-united-legally-wrong-deplane-134223391.html

 
squistion said:
No, this has been covered a couple times before if you had bothered to read the thread. Union contracts and established company procedures would have prohibited that (not saying that either are correct but renting an Uber was simply not an option for UA).
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Unfortunately for me, I don't have time to sit on these boards 24/7 and read every thread like you.  Job, kids - responsibility and all that.  You probably wouldn't know what I'm talking about.

 
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MaxThreshold said:
Unfortunately for me, I don't have time to sit on these boards 24/7 and read every thread like you.  Job, kids - responsibility and all that.  You probably wouldn't know what I'm talking about.
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Fine, then continue to make a fool of yourself asking something that has been answered several times.

 
MarvinTScamper said:
MaxThreshold said:
Wow.  That article was fantastic.  I hope UA pays dearly.
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I thought the article was meh.  It's an argument, and one that might win.  Or not. 
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I agree.  This situation isn't specifically addressed in the contract.  Using a narrow definition of "boarding", this doesn't qualify as a denial of boarding.  Using an equally narrow definition, it doesn't qualify as refusal of transport either since UA was going to re-accommodate the passengers on another flight.

 
Dickies said:
Then offer $1,000, $1,200, $1,500, etc.  Everyone has their price.  They could have wired this dude $1M and they'd be better off
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Legally, they were only on the hook for 4x the lowest priced ticket if they involuntarily bump someone. The accountants would say there's no reason to offer more than that amount for volunteers. The PR guys might disagree.

 
Not sure if posted already but a woman sitting behind him was just interviewed on CNN. She recorded just before he got yanked out of the seat. The doc was pretty calm as was the security guard who was talking to him. There was a veiled threat something like "you know how this is going to end" but really this thing got crazy very quickly.

They didn't have a video showing the entire encounter but it seemed to be clearly just before he got the heave ho. The woman said he was pretty calm and just kept asking why he got selected, that he was tired, wanted to get home, etc.

As much as I would want him to get off the plane, and I would have in his position, nobody can seriously sit back and say he deserved what he got unless there is something that is missing which I would assume would have come out by now. 

 
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DaVinci said:
Legally, they were only on the hook for 4x the lowest priced ticket if they involuntarily bump someone. The accountants would say there's no reason to offer more than that amount for volunteers. The PR guys might disagree.
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What you are legally on the hook for doesn't preclude you from offering more when the other option is brutalizing a client in front of dozens of smartphone cameras

 
Dickies said:
What you are legally on the hook for doesn't preclude you from offering more when the other option is brutalizing a client in front of dozens of smartphone cameras
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But that isn't the other option. The other three passengers who got booted didn't require a beating to leave the plane.

 
The General said:
Not sure if posted already but a woman sitting behind him was just interviewed on CNN. She recorded just before he got yanked out of the seat. The doc was pretty calm as was the security guard who was talking to him. There was a veiled threat something like "you know how this is going to end" but really this thing got crazy very quickly.

They didn't have a video showing the entire encounter but it seemed to be clearly just before he got the heave ho. The woman said he was pretty calm and just kept asking why he got selected, that he was tired, wanted to get home, etc.

As much as I would want him to get off the plane, and I would have in his position, nobody can seriously sit back and say he deserved what he got unless there is something that is missing which I would assume would have come out by now. 
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"Deserved what he got" is the part no one agrees with.  But there is a HUGE chasm between "I really don't want to get off" and "#### this, I'm not getting off no matter what". 

The courts will decide and I don't think any of these videos show the whole encounter and therefore don't matter to me.  

 
MarvinTScamper said:
"Deserved what he got" is the part no one agrees with.  But there is a HUGE chasm between "I really don't want to get off" and "#### this, I'm not getting off no matter what". 

The courts will decide and I don't think any of these videos show the whole encounter and therefore don't matter to me.  
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The courts won't decide a thing. Zero chance in hell United lets this thing get to a trial. 

 
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MarvinTScamper said:
"Deserved what he got" is the part no one agrees with.  But there is a HUGE chasm between "I really don't want to get off" and "#### this, I'm not getting off no matter what". 

The courts will decide and I don't think any of these videos show the whole encounter and therefore don't matter to me.  
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:lmao:

"I have seen a man assaulted by airport security - on video - but, but, but, did he provoke the officers?"

The ole' Joe Mixon defense, I like your style.

 
MarvinTScamper said:
"Deserved what he got" is the part no one agrees with.  But there is a HUGE chasm between "I really don't want to get off" and "#### this, I'm not getting off no matter what". 

The courts will decide and I don't think any of these videos show the whole encounter and therefore don't matter to me.  
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Dr. Dao is going to get paid BIGLY.

$4mm settlement--do you take the over or under?

 
DaVinci said:
But that isn't the other option. The other three passengers who got booted didn't require a beating to leave the plane.
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They were bullied into submission by a company that, among other things,  lies to their passengers.  They had no legal right to demand that those passengers get off the plane.  They will probably get paid too but nothing like Dr. Dao, obviously.  

 
chet said:
IN today's presser, they claimed he had no recollection of anything after being concussed.  That will play well to the jury if it ever gets there.
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And how do you disprove that?  He's going to get a nice paycheck out of this.

 
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