good point about manning in the nickel sets. also rucker and peppers get enough pressure on the QB that the WR may not have time to beat the coverage in the deep middle. i certainly dont think minter will be lost at FS, but they certainly would rather have him at SS. since they were already deciding to end davis's development at safety, i would think they are doing this for depth for this season, but that davis will end up an LB eventually, but like you said, this situation is changing so much its hard to know what the next move will be.Minter will not exactly be lost as the team's starting FS. He played FS for the Panthers in the late 90's and is not lacking coverage skills. More importantly, the Panthers have two top-shelf CB's (Lucas and Gamble) and an above-average nickle CB (Manning) to take much of the pass liability away from Minter and/or Davis. I think we'll see the following secondary lineups for the Panthers:Base D
CB: Lucas
FS: Minter
SS: Davis
CB: Gamble
Nickle/Pass
CB: Lucas
FS: Bashir/McCree
SS: Minter
CB: Gamble
CB: Manning
* Davis moved to LB
NOTE: I'M AFRAID TO HIT THE "ADD REPLY" BUTTON ON MY RESPONSE. ONCE MY POST IS ENTERED, I'M SURE DAVIS WILL BE MOVED TO ANOTHER POSITION.
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[DYNASTY] The Rookie 100 Index (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Bloom
- Start date
8/23 morency up because of his performance over the weekend. tatupu up looks healthy and should start soon. ware jumps up 12 spots with his ridiculous debut. orlovsky looks solid. fincher needs more time. gates and jackson moving up as their roles seem to be solidifying. fitzpatrick looking like a diamond in the rough. greene sliding as wallace looks good and he looks raw.
kellumsboys
Footballguy
thanks ! back to the front pageWith C-Buck done for the year and probably for good, I think Moats jumps Shelton up to 5. Westbrook is on a one year deal and could bolt. Moats has been outstanding in the Preseason, gain yards in chunks. Shelton has been average and could be the 4th tailback behind Foster, Davis and Goings.Moats seems like a better deal at this point. Thoughts?
well it really comes down the likelihood that foster is resigned vs. the likelihood that westbrook is resigned. my gut feeling is that westbrook does get resigned and foster doesnt. the other variable is that the carolina running game is one of the 2 or 3 best in the league, and the philly running game does not produce a true feature back.the other problem is that if you want to bump moats for 2005 value, you have to contend with the possibility that the eagles sign a levens/hambrick or trade for a gordon/morris to fill the "run it up the gut 10-15 times a game role". even that is no sure thing for moats.
i do LOVE moats' talent and think he will eventually be at worst a big part of an RBBC down the line. still, shelton has a shot to become an entrenched feature back in a sick running attack - i know that the going has been slow for him in camp so far, but i dont think you have to be that good of a runner to succeed behind that line, i think just about any competent back will do - so if shelton really does get the shot in 06 (and the contract sitch for foster, injury sitch for davis, and henning comments all indicate that its shelton's job to lose next year), its hard to see him being a bust behind that line.
at "dump crap"a handful of updates added - just scan for 8/24link
"We picked Eric Shelton because he was big and strong, and ran smart and with toughness in college," said Henning. "We're looking for a big, strong power back who can take the ball 25 times a game.
"We are completely up in the air about Stephen Davis. We were in a darned if you do/darned if you don't position on draft day. If we hadn't have taken Eric or someone like him, then Stephen didn't come back, we would have been shorthanded. But if we DID take Eric and Stephen comes back, we could be longhanded there. We felt the latter was a better situation to be in, so that's why we took Eric Shelton in the second round."
"The only thing you can't tell in the transition from college to pro is whether a guy is going to be capable of carrying the ball 25 times a game," said Henning. "Somewhere along the line, we would like to see Eric become a featured back in the NFL. There is a lot of road that has to be traveled before we see that."
"We picked Eric Shelton because he was big and strong, and ran smart and with toughness in college," said Henning. "We're looking for a big, strong power back who can take the ball 25 times a game.
"We are completely up in the air about Stephen Davis. We were in a darned if you do/darned if you don't position on draft day. If we hadn't have taken Eric or someone like him, then Stephen didn't come back, we would have been shorthanded. But if we DID take Eric and Stephen comes back, we could be longhanded there. We felt the latter was a better situation to be in, so that's why we took Eric Shelton in the second round."
"The only thing you can't tell in the transition from college to pro is whether a guy is going to be capable of carrying the ball 25 times a game," said Henning. "Somewhere along the line, we would like to see Eric become a featured back in the NFL. There is a lot of road that has to be traveled before we see that."
Is it time for Matt Jones to leap Mike Williams and Clayton? I have my draft coming up next week. It is likely BMW and Jones will be there. I cannot justify taking BMW and Clayton. Here is why:1. Situation - Jones is #3 with an aging Jimmy Smith #1. Starting job next year is highly likely. BMW is #4 right now and does not seem to be moving up the charts. At best #3 WR by the end of the year, barring injury. Clayton is #3 in Balitmore but more than likely will start early in the season if not week one. But, he is in a run first offense with a suspect QB. 2. Talent - BWM has yac issues. Clayton is 5'10". Jones is the most complete package of the three as an athlete. The other two are currenty better recievers. Jones has a higher ceiling in the pros that Clayton and BMW. Though the difference between Williams and Jones is less because the red-zone opportunities. In a dynasty league talent normally trumps situation but I do not completely ignore the situation. Looking at the big picture, I rank Matt Jones only behing Edwards in a dynasty league. Thoughts?
i wont argue with you if you take jones over clayton. i see jones and BMW as 9 and 9A at this point. i agree that jones has a higher upside than clayton or BMW. however, i am probably as high on clayton as anyone on this board - so im sure im in the minority having him ahead of jones - after his high visibility performance last night, i guess 6 or 7 is where you have to take him if you believe in him.
kellumsboys
Footballguy
I cannot believe this has not been pinned 
lots and lots of updates for the final preseason edition... fincher and jordan beck both got hurt pretty bad, but their value was based on beyond 2005 and neither was expected to contribute much this year. clarett, anthony davis and kay jay harris were cut, waiting to see where they land. Ive been busy preparing for drafts, but i hope to get at least the top 30 or 40 updated today.
igbomb
Footballguy
No way. I don't think anyone else in my league knew about this thread when we did our rookie draft this last weekend. I'd like to keep it that way.and, imo, should be on the product list for next year's subscription.. no question...It's not "their" info.Helluva job by Bloom on this.I cannot believe this has not been pinned
dirtyhalos
capital letter hater!
I completely agree, I would like to see FBG's really step up their dynasty coverage next year, and a list like this or even possibly Bloom being put on staff is a great startI have already emailed Joe and David about how I feel about this and STRONGLY recommend anybody else to do the same if they want more dynasty coverage next year.........and dont forget to mention this thread......it has been a very valuable part of my research this yearand, imo, should be on the product list for next year's subscription.. no question...It's not "their" info.Helluva job by Bloom on this.I cannot believe this has not been pinned
Barry Jive and The Uptown Five
Footballguy
As a Stiller fan, this was my biggest fear when they drafted Gibson.Great measurables, but not a great gameday player. I wrote back in my pre-draft WR rankings that Fred heard footsteps when the wateroy brought out the Gatorade. Wonder if this is what the Steelers staff is seeing in camp.
any thoughts on the new rankings? a ton of things have changed since the last preseason edition...I particularly struggled with: jones vs. BMW vs. WilliamsonHow far to drop Arrington, Shelton, and MoatsHow for to bump up Bradley, Henry, and Brandon JonesHow to value DJ/Thurman in relation to speculative offense prospects (vs. those that are clearly big parts of their teams future)
Born to Run
Footballguy
The future possibilities of the 3rd tier rookie WRs is interesting. Specifically, Mark Bradley, Reggie Brown, Brandon Jones, and Chris Henry. I have Jones leading the pack because I like the short/mid-term upside with McNair/Volek and he has a good chance to be the #1in Tenn. Henry seems to have caught Palmer's eye (and a few passes) so I have him second. Chicago does not produce top 10 WRs (someone jump in here if I am wrong) so I like Bradley the least. Reggie needs TO to go away to get a bigger share of the Philly "spread it around" passing game.
-OZ-
Footballguy
You're doing great work here Bloom.
This is the only thread I have bookmarked seperate from the forum.Nobody is always going to see eye to eye on 100 players, but I'd sure drop Arrington more than you have.
Evaluating IDP vs. Offense is league specific IMO. In some they have very little value, in some a top LB is almost as valuable as a top TE or WR (I'll show you the scoring for my league if you wonder about this).
Only one suggestion, and it's just a personal method, but tiering the list can come in handy. Just as an example, I'd probably go:
1. Cadillac Williams RB, TB VALUE RISING
2. Ronnie Brown RB, MIA VALUE RISING - up from 3
3. Cedric Benson RB, CHI VALUE FALLING - down from 2
4. Braylon Edwards WR, CLE VALUE RISING - up from 5
5. Mike Williams WR, DET VALUE RISING - up from 9
6. Troy Williamson WR, MIN VALUE RISING - UP FROM 12
7. Matt Jones WR, JAX VALUE RISING - UP FROM 10
8. JJ Arrington RB, ARI VALUE FALLING - down from 4
9. Frank Gore RB, SF VALUE RISING - up from 11
10. Mark Clayton WR, BAL VALUE FALLING - down from 7
11. Alex D Smith QB, SF VALUE STEADY
12. Ryan Moats RB, PHI VALUE FALLING - down from 8
13. Eric Shelton RB, CAR VALUE FALLING - DOWN FROM 6
14. Derrick Johnson OLB, KC VALUE RISING up from 21
15. Odell Thurman MLB, CIN VALUE RISING up from 20
Again, great work - are you going to do this in 2006 too?
Might get yourself an article in the weekly subscriber's area
I plan on doing it in 06, and i may even stick my neck out enough to put out a PRE DRAFT edition. Of course, Kay Jay Harris and T.A. McClendon would have been top 50 guys in my pre-draft list, so what do i know?Again, great work - are you going to do this in 2006 too?
Might get yourself an article in the weekly subscriber's area
just getting the awareness is great.. thank you very much!!!In my league, Auction Keeper, I let the teams bid in the offseason on three draft eligible college players... this info would give a nice touch to exposing players not named Leinart, Bush or Maroney.. as to get the super duper steals..I plan on doing it in 06, and i may even stick my neck out enough to put out a PRE DRAFT edition. Of course, Kay Jay Harris and T.A. McClendon would have been top 50 guys in my pre-draft list, so what do i know?Again, great work - are you going to do this in 2006 too?
Might get yourself an article in the weekly subscriber's area
again thanks!!
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Mister CIA
Footballguy
Any news on Buffalo Bill RB Lionel Gates?All I can google on the guy is that he was "inactive for the nth consecutive week ."Not that I'm expecting anything at the moment, but an encouraging word would be nice.
Shaud Williams is the backup there, no reason to have Gates active right now. He should still definitely be on your radar as he showed a lot more speed in preseason than he did at the combine - apparently he was hurt at the combine. When you combine decent speed with Gates's size and all around ability, you have a pretty nice RB prospect, worth rostering in IDP dynasty leagues with 40+ roster.
Mister CIA
Footballguy
Not 40 deep IDP, but 25 without IDP, so he's in the ballpark. I'll continue to hold on to him for the reasons you stated above. I'm looking for (and hoping to not find) any negative reports on him since the preseason, i.e., terrible blocker, can't grasp offensive schemes, personality conflicts, etc.Thanks for the encouraging word.
Weiner Dog
Footballguy
When will Derrick Johnson and Odell Thurman leap-frog Ryan Moats and Eric Shelton??
I grappled a lot with that. Im very close to moving them ahead of Shelton. Moats is a tougher call. I don't read that much into Moats not being active - the key to his value is whether Westbrook gets resigned - If Westbrook walks, Moats could be an instant top 15 RB. Its very difficult to compare locked in value with limited upside (DJ/Thurman) to speculative value with almost unlimited upside (Moats). I mean, there is no LB that is worth a long term starting RB, not even close. Then again, DJ/Thurman have very little downside/risk at this point. Anyone else have thoughts on this?When will Derrick Johnson and Odell Thurman leap-frog Ryan Moats and Eric Shelton??
Turbo Punch
Footballguy
Bloom,What do you think of Marion Barber after this week? Looks like Parcells trust him more than Thompson and he looked better than A-Train. Also looks like a good receiver out of the backfield. Time to move him up if because he looks like the #2 behind JJ.
Its hard to say. I mean if Barber has mental errors in the walkthru next week and TT doesn't, Parcells could flip them again. I think its clear at this point that TT is a solid RB prospect in his own right, and that really hurts barber's outlook. I would think that for the next few years we'll be looking JJ as the starter with a TT/barber RBBC backup, and Barber assuming 3rd down duties. Atrain is just holding down the fort while the rooks get some seasoning. The bottom line is that TT has cut into Barber's long term value, and their status for this past week doesnt change that for me - now if TT's problems persist and he starts to get pushed out of the RB picture, then Barber is in for a bump for sure.
suchislife
Footballguy
With T.O.'s departure, how big of a boost do you give Reggie Brown? Given the offense he plays in and his new-found opportunity, does he now jump ahead of Brandon Jones, Chris Henry and Mark Bradley? And I know Mark Clayton is a better talent, but I like Reggie's situation a whole lot better. Thoughts?
Barry Jive and The Uptown Five
Footballguy
FWIW - I always thought Reggie Brown was in a very good dynasty situation, regardless of TO.Given what we know today, I would personally move him above all those you mentioned given what we know about talent, rosters and opportunity.
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