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There might be 2-3 I'd contend but it's hard for me to believe anyone thinks he's not a top 15. I like him so I think he's a top 10-15 qb. I think he disappoints some people because a)He's paid like a top 7 QB... and b) because of the package they spent to get him. Others just don't like anyone with the name Manning.One or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
No way would I take him over Cutler. The rest, yep. But Schaub and Clemens have potential to actually be better.Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:BeckLosmanClemensBollerSchaubYoungRiversCutlerCulpepperCroyleCampbellKitnaGrossmanJacksonGarciaDelhommeLeftwichSmithWarner/LeinartOne or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
I wouldn't take him over Kitna, Delhomme (healthy) but that's purely subjective...My point is a lot of the guys you've listed here may get quite better (Rivers, Cutler, Campbell, etc.) Eli right now has all the weapons, and he's not getting the job done. I just don't think he's going to get a whole lot betterId take Eli over the following starting QBs:BeckLosmanClemensBollerSchaubYoungRiversCutlerCulpepperCroyleCampbellKitnaGrossmanJacksonGarciaDelhommeLeftwichSmithWarner/LeinartOne or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
I would place him at #16 then because I would take Cutler, Rivers, Schaub and Delhomme over him.Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:BeckLosmanClemensBollerSchaubYoungRiversCutlerCulpepperCroyleCampbellKitnaGrossmanJacksonGarciaDelhommeLeftwichSmithWarner/LeinartOne or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
And you feel comfortable saying that when he's all of 26yo?The only young guys that are better at this point are Romo/Roeth/Anderson/Cutler imo. There's a bunch of guys that have plenty of room and time to grow but Eli is on that list. Up until this last game he's had a much better year than last year.... when people were writing him off as topping out at the age of 25.
you are 100% correct, he can now be called a 'bust'..to stink it up like that against the WORST pass defense in the NFL , says it all..they say that the 4th year of a QB's career, is where he is at the make-or-break point, either they are the real deal,or you move on and look to draft another QB in the upcoming draft. the Giants have to be thinking about looking at their next 'franchise' QB, the one Eli was supposed to be.the problem I have with Eli is that the Giants gave up a lot to get him , and the front office will take longer than most teams to dump him, so we might be stuck with him for some time.and I say this as a Giants fan, he sucks, the cat's out of the bag..its no longer a thing of maybe this or that, the fact is, he hasn't gotten it done, in nearly 4 full years in the NFL, he's failed as a starting QB, esp when you consider the $$ they pay him...
All four of those guys have played better than Eli at some point. Delhomme is older than most realize(He'll be 33 before the end of this years playoffs) though and it wouldn't surprise me if he never eclipses Eli again... no way I'd take Delhomme over Eli at this point in their careers. Eli hasn't even entered that 28yo-32yo prime for a QB while Delhomme is dinged and past it.
Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:
Beck
Losman
Clemens
Boller
Schaub
Young
Rivers
Cutler
Culpepper
Croyle
Campbell
Kitna
Grossman
Jackson
Garcia
Delhomme
Leftwich
Smith
Warner/Leinart
One or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
From that list I'd take Schaub, Kitna, Garcia and Delhomme. Maybe Young and possibly Rivers. This thread is making me realize how little regard I have for Eli. It must be tough having a Hall of Fame-worthy older brother, but he's the one who chose to play in the New York area.Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:BeckLosmanClemensBollerSchaubYoungRiversCutlerCulpepperCroyleCampbellKitnaGrossmanJacksonGarciaDelhommeLeftwichSmithWarner/LeinartOne or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
I had him last year and he got me 6 pts a game during the playoffs. Good at the beginning of the year and terrible late. He's awful.
Did I watch what game? The game yesterday or the 49 other NFL starts he has? Most logical fans don't base their opinion of a player on one, two, or even five individual games. Manning has been fairly consistant over the past two years and this year and you should know what you're going to get from him over the course of the year: 215 YPG.1.5 TD/1.1 INT. You will also get games like yesterday and the 4 TD 312 game he had against the Cowboys. He's not Peyton, he's never going to be Peyton, and most people don't expect that kind of production. Right now his team is 7-4 and in the playoff hunt so I'm sure he's not in jeopardy of losing his job anytiime soon. Right now he's 11th in traditional scoring leagues so I guess he was a boderline drop in your 5 team dynasty league. I'm also sure he really took you dropping him to heart and couldn't sleep last night. Maybe someone in your league will pick him up and he'll have a 3 TD, 280 yard game against you.I had him last year and he got me 6 pts a game during the playoffs. Good at the beginning of the year and terrible late. He's awful.
Did you even watch the game?
Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:
Beck
Losman
Clemens
Boller
Schaub
Young
Rivers
Cutler
Culpepper
Croyle
Campbell
Kitna
Grossman
Jackson
Garcia
Delhomme
Leftwich
Smith
Warner/Leinart
One or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.
Youre just being ridiculous now
Right now the only reason I would take Eli over Schaub as an NFL QB is durability. All else is even. Schaub in his first full season is completing 66% of his passes for more avg. yards per play with an inferior supporting cast. Eli Blutarski (0.0 rating once) couldn't dream of those numbers AFTER 3 seasons (42 games).As far as FF, I own this POS and I see no improvement. How can you suck against MINN pass defense if you are above average as a QB? Inaccuracy, that's how. Maybe it's becasue Shockey and Burress don't spend the offseason with Manning (like Peyton and Harrison/Wayne) but we obviously are never going to know that answer. Those 2 primadonnas could care less about that. But this guy is flat out innacurate.
Still, in a season where he's been surrounded by less offensive talent than Eli he's had a QB rating 10 points higher than Eli ever has. I can see where people would make the argument. It's really just splitting hairs at this point. They aren't separated by that much right now.BTW I was a Schaub skeptic and he's winning me over. Never understood all the fuss about him in ATL but he's really surprised me how well he's played in less than ideal circumstances in HOU(AJ/Green missing most of the season).
Just talked about that with a coworker today. He has been horrible in the 2nd half of the seasons every year so far. Not sure why. Perhaps its the cold weather.
Giant fan here. Plax also has had poor second half season stats. Don't forget, Toomer was out for the better half of last year and in years past Shockey has always seemed to be questionable after game 8. What Eli lacks is moxie. He just doesn't have the fierceness and absolute desire to win. That is what I see from his actions on the field and his remarks after games. He has no fire. He grew up in a very affluent family and did not have to climb a ladder to succeed like Romo, Garcia, Brady, Warner, etc. Having to earn your right to play makes better players. Eli has no fight in him because he never had to fight in his life.
saintfool said:
main reason I didn't expect much from Eli in the beginning was the fact that he'd have Gilbride in charge of his development.
no chance this happens, IMO.
In the NFL, I don't think you can ever say "no chance."What if Coughlin isn't the coach?
I think, for better or worse, Eli Manning and the Giants will be joined at the hip. He hasn't been all awful and has still shown enough promise for them to think he can still be a franchise QB. It's also not like they have any type of promising backup in place who is pushing for the job. I think they'd rather have Eli than most other QBs who will become available, either in the draft or free agency.
I'm just
here a bit as I agree there's little chance the Giants don't keep Eli.But if I'm the GM, and I see Eli have another 2nd half of the season meltdown, I seriously think about blowing the thing up and starting over. That Giants team is really really average - which leads to the results we see from them. One up week, one down week. Lather, rinse, repeat.If you're in it to be just good enough to make it to the playoffs, keep Eli. But if you're trying to win Super Bowls, you're not going to do it with Eli.That describes just about every team in the NFL except NE/DAL/GB. It's one bad loss. Assuming DAL/GB get the NFC byes the NYG's could beat any other NFC team in the first round even with Coughlin as coach.
i think folks forget how maligned coughlin & co were the last few years. everyone was willing to say he was the problem with the giants until this year. if there is one thing we know about coughlin, it's that he just doesn't change. he's somehow managed a lower profile this year while Eli has become the face of the franchise. fine but to forget coughlin's role in the development of eli and the franchise is patently absurd. i have no doubt that a change in staff could help eli.saintfool said:
You can say that about 75% + of the current NFL QB's.
That's indicative of how bad the NFC is, not how good the Giants are.How did the NFC get so stinky?
I haven't forgotten. My son knows 3 Giants by the way I scream at the TV. Eli, The Beast, and Fire Coughlin.i think folks forget how maligned coughlin & co were the last few years. everyone was willing to say he was the problem with the giants until this year. if there is one thing we know about coughlin, it's that he just doesn't change. he's somehow managed a lower profile this year while Eli has become the face of the franchise. fine but to forget coughlin's role in the development of eli and the franchise is patently absurd. i have no doubt that a change in staff could help eli.saintfool said:
I agree. But the point is that Eli is among their number.In regards to yesterday, I'll agree that his teammates didn't do him any favors either. Shockey almost looked like he wanted to lose.
Here comes the Coughlin collapse and right on schedule
