Eli Manning (1 Viewer)

[saintfool]

If you're in it to be just good enough to make it to the playoffs, keep Eli. But if you're trying to win Super Bowls, you're not going to do it with Eli.

You can say that about 75% + of the current NFL QB's.

I agree. But the point is that Eli is among their number.In regards to yesterday, I'll agree that his teammates didn't do him any favors either. Shockey almost looked like he wanted to lose.

shockey looks like he wants to play for another team. most giants, i think, would want to play for another non-coughlin team.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

If you're in it to be just good enough to make it to the playoffs, keep Eli. But if you're trying to win Super Bowls, you're not going to do it with Eli.

You can say that about 75% + of the current NFL QB's.

I agree. But the point is that Eli is among their number.In regards to yesterday, I'll agree that his teammates didn't do him any favors either. Shockey almost looked like he wanted to lose.

shockey looks like he wants to play for another team. most giants, i think, would want to play for another non-coughlin team.

We'll take Bill Cowher and a real O.C.

 

[BoltBacker]

How did the NFC get so stinky?

I don't really think it's just the NFC. If you take NE out of the AFC and the whole conference simply isn't that good with INDY ailing(and how sure are we Harrison will be back at 100%). PIT fans like to thump their chests but they've lost to ARZ/DEN/NYJ this season. Jax may be the second best team in the AFC at the moment. At least the NFC has two good teams.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

How did the NFC get so stinky?

I don't really think it's just the NFC. If you take NE out of the AFC and the whole conference simply isn't that good with INDY ailing(and how sure are we Harrison will be back at 100%). PIT fans like to thump their chests but they've lost to ARZ/DEN/NYJ this season. Jax may be the second best team in the AFC at the moment. At least the NFC has two good teams.

Rozelle's dream of parity seems to be resulting in mostly average football.

 

[Synthesizer]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

 

[BoltBacker]

How did the NFC get so stinky?

I don't really think it's just the NFC. If you take NE out of the AFC and the whole conference simply isn't that good with INDY ailing(and how sure are we Harrison will be back at 100%). PIT fans like to thump their chests but they've lost to ARZ/DEN/NYJ this season. Jax may be the second best team in the AFC at the moment. At least the NFC has two good teams.

Rozelle's dream of parity seems to be resulting in mostly average football.

Meh, I think it's overblown to an extent. 60's GB. 70's PIT. 80's SF. 90's DAL. 00's NE. I'm not sure all that much has changed, it's just that teams like GB/DAL can rise up more quickly now from disappointing seasons to true SB contenders. The NYG's aren't as far away from being a SB contender right now than GB was last season. I'm slow to blame coaches but I think there are quite a few coaches that could take that team pretty far next season. Of course, to start with a new coach might have been able to take the NYG's pretty far with Tiki on the team.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Eli's situation is symptomatic of a league wide shortage of quality QB play. It's quite shocking really.

I know there was discussion last week of why QBs stink. It seemed to come down to lack of coaching.

How hard would it be to hire former QBs to coach these guys up, rather than leaving it as an afterthought done by the head coach/OC?

 

[saintfool]

Giant fan here. Plax also has had poor second half season stats. Don't forget, Toomer was out for the better half of last year and in years past Shockey has always seemed to be questionable after game 8. What Eli lacks is moxie. He just doesn't have the fierceness and absolute desire to win. That is what I see from his actions on the field and his remarks after games. He has no fire. He grew up in a very affluent family and did not have to climb a ladder to succeed like Romo, Garcia, Brady, Warner, etc. Having to earn your right to play makes better players. Eli has no fight in him because he never had to fight in his life.

this kind of arm chair psychology is pretty ridiculous, imo. you can make a point with this being indicative of a kind of "1st round lottery pick qb" syndrome. but to suggest that a lack of "moxie" - whatever that is in a QB - is his problem is silly. ever worse is the notion that his pedigree is somehow to blame for his inconsistencies.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Saw an interesting stat last night that showed Eli's QB rating plummeting in the second half of all his seasons so far. I have to wonder if that is a contributing factor to the G-Men's usual late season collapses, or if it's the other way around?

Just talked about that with a coworker today. He has been horrible in the 2nd half of the seasons every year so far. Not sure why. Perhaps its the cold weather.

but San diego would have been horrible for him.

 

[BoltBacker]

Eli's situation is symptomatic of a league wide shortage of quality QB play. It's quite shocking really.

I think there's a changing of the guard going on. I can't remember a time there were so many young QB's starting around the league.- Roeth/Romo/Palmer/Cutler all look like they are going to be the next stars.- Eli/Cambell/Young/Schaub are all solid and should be better in a few years.- Rivers/Brees/Vick?/Losman/Leinart/Smith/Grossman have all taken big steps back from last season but are young enough they should at least be able to raise back to their previous levels of play in the right situation.- Lastly, Anderson and Clemens have played well above where people had expected.That's about half the league that have their #1 QBs under the age of 28. Seems to me there used to be a lot more journeyman vet QB's starting around the league than you see now. I don't have a link to back that up, just seems that way to me.

 

[FavreCo]

How did the NFC get so stinky?

I don't really think it's just the NFC. If you take NE out of the AFC and the whole conference simply isn't that good with INDY ailing(and how sure are we Harrison will be back at 100%). PIT fans like to thump their chests but they've lost to ARZ/DEN/NYJ this season. Jax may be the second best team in the AFC at the moment. At least the NFC has two good teams.

Rozelle's dream of parity seems to be resulting in mostly average football.

Of which I blame on the college game and the ever expanding running QBs who haven't developed properly for the NFL game.

 

[FavreCo]

Eli's situation is symptomatic of a league wide shortage of quality QB play. It's quite shocking really.I know there was discussion last week of why QBs stink. It seemed to come down to lack of coaching.How hard would it be to hire former QBs to coach these guys up, rather than leaving it as an afterthought done by the head coach/OC?

With any hope, Carolina will give Matt Moore an opportunity like Romo got to see if he has what it takes. If they go back to carr again, the whole staff should be fired.

 

[mr. furley]

so far the Giants wins have come:

@ Wash

Philly

NY Jets

@ Atlanta

San Francisco

@ Miami

@ Detroit

w/ losses:

@ Dallas

Green Bay

Dallas

Minnesota

7-4 is a little deceptive considering the wins and losses.

Eli just doesn't tickle my fancy. maybe he is progressing, maybe Gilbride is killing him, maybe he looked better than he should have early because of Tiki+Plax+Shockey.

when i watch their games (too often, unfortunately) i see a guy who gets rattled easily, who panics, who isn't very accurate, whose passes flutter often. he doesn't seem to be a real leader and he looks absolutely lost when things go wrong. as if he has absolutely no idea where he is or what's going on.

imo, he's a fairly standard current NFL QB. he's not asked to do a lot but he probably can't do a whole lot more anyways. he can hit the swing pass, the wide open WR, he'll dink and dunk all day long and wind up with 250 yds and 2td's in a 13 pt loss.

i don't come away from watching their games thinking "wow, he really looked in command out there. guy made some tough throws."

i come away from watching those games thinking "holy crap did he look awful in long stretches." he looks shaky at best when adversity hits. that leads to him throwing a lot of really ugly looking passes.

maybe in 7 on 7 drills he sets the world on fire. i dunno. put a pass rush in his face and he folds.

 

[428143]

I look at Manning, and I consistently see a QB who would rather be on the sidelines, as he always seems to be scared to be on the football field. This is all based upon my interpretation of his body language. Maybe he can buck the trend and become a confident QB as he gets older, but this very rarely happens, so I wouldn't bet on it. His physical gifts are top-notch, and that makes a servicable starter, but I don't think he will ever click at the QB position due to his mental weaknesses. I believe it is in the Giants best interests to find a new QB, asap...if this is possible, I'm not sure, as I have no clue what type of contract Manning has...hopefully, for the sake of Giants fans, the contract expires at the end of the year.

 

[Liquid Tension]

Id take Eli over the following starting QBs:BeckLosmanClemensBollerSchaubYoungRiversCutlerCulpepperCroyleCampbellKitnaGrossmanJacksonGarciaDelhommeLeftwichSmithWarner/LeinartOne or two are debatable but that still makes Manning a top 12 QB in the NFL.

I wouldn't take him over Kitna, Delhomme (healthy) but that's purely subjective...My point is a lot of the guys you've listed here may get quite better (Rivers, Cutler, Campbell, etc.) Eli right now has all the weapons, and he's not getting the job done. I just don't think he's going to get a whole lot better

All the weapons? You mean Plaxico who simply can't cut for the past 5 weeks and cost Eli an INT last week by rounding a square in to the point you thought it was a post route. Maybe you mean his #2 WR is Amani Toomer who is one of the slowest WR's in the league and dropped two passes last week. Maybe you mean Shockey (who I like his toughness) after running at least two lazy routes on blitzes and never stopping his route when Eli threw his way and causing two picks. Maybe it is the worst #3 WR in the league to go along with NO 3rd down RB who can catch a pass like you expect a 3rd down back to catch. Finally, maybe it is an OL that is a very good run blocking unit but is not strong against the pass rush.Shady said it correctly in that Eli is an above average QB. You can most definitely win with him.My take is that his demeanor may not inspire a team at times when the team is playing poorly (him too), but he has that same expression on his face when things are going well and his demeanor allows him to have a short memory. People say he gets rattled, but he has come back with game winning drives time and time again after having poor earlier games. So I say that negative of emotion (and he should get dinged for that) is also a strength for him because his short memory allows him to bounce back.As for getting rattled every QB gets a little happy feet when they get decleated from a blind side hit or even a head on. Brady had the same issue last week in Philly throwing 3 off target passes after getting popped.One item that I don't like is that he does not throw a tight spiral and I think in bad weather that becomes exacerbated. Overall, Eli is in the top half of QB's and you can win with Eli. he has the ability to drive a team down for a game winning drive and while he may not be worth what the Giants gave him or the 1st pick status, he is not the problem with the Giants

 

[Liquid Tension]

I look at Manning, and I consistently see a QB who would rather be on the sidelines, as he always seems to be scared to be on the football field. This is all based upon my interpretation of his body language. Maybe he can buck the trend and become a confident QB as he gets older, but this very rarely happens, so I wouldn't bet on it. His physical gifts are top-notch, and that makes a servicable starter, but I don't think he will ever click at the QB position due to his mental weaknesses. I believe it is in the Giants best interests to find a new QB, asap...if this is possible, I'm not sure, as I have no clue what type of contract Manning has...hopefully, for the sake of Giants fans, the contract expires at the end of the year.

I could not disagree with this more. The guy is very competitive he is just introverted in his expression. he doesn't get too up either. In a day where the entire offense was horrible, he wanted to keep playing and if what you think was the case he would have taken a seat (like they should have done IMO becaue if Eli gets hurt the season is over)

 

[Liquid Tension]

so far the Giants wins have come WashPhillyNY Jets@ AtlantaSan Francisco@ Miami@ Detroitw/ losses DallasGreen BayDallasMinnesota7-4 is a little deceptive considering the wins and losses.Eli just doesn't tickle my fancy. maybe he is progressing, maybe Gilbride is killing him, maybe he looked better than he should have early because of Tiki+Plax+Shockey.when i watch their games (too often, unfortunately) i see a guy who gets rattled easily, who panics, who isn't very accurate, whose passes flutter often. he doesn't seem to be a real leader and he looks absolutely lost when things go wrong. as if he has absolutely no idea where he is or what's going on.imo, he's a fairly standard current NFL QB. he's not asked to do a lot but he probably can't do a whole lot more anyways. he can hit the swing pass, the wide open WR, he'll dink and dunk all day long and wind up with 250 yds and 2td's in a 13 pt loss. i don't come away from watching their games thinking "wow, he really looked in command out there. guy made some tough throws."i come away from watching those games thinking "holy crap did he look awful in long stretches." he looks shaky at best when adversity hits. that leads to him throwing a lot of really ugly looking passes. maybe in 7 on 7 drills he sets the world on fire. i dunno. put a pass rush in his face and he folds.

Eli is anything but a dink and dunk passer. If anything he probably dinks and dunks at the bottom of the league (stats anyone to refute or back me up?)

 

[Doctor Detroit]

LMAO at the people who would take Schaub over Eli. Some track record he has.

Right now the only reason I would take Eli over Schaub as an NFL QB is durability. All else is even. Schaub in his first full season is completing 66% of his passes for more avg. yards per play with an inferior supporting cast. Eli Blutarski (0.0 rating once) couldn't dream of those numbers AFTER 3 seasons (42 games).As far as FF, I own this POS and I see no improvement. How can you suck against MINN pass defense if you are above average as a QB? Inaccuracy, that's how. Maybe it's becasue Shockey and Burress don't spend the offseason with Manning (like Peyton and Harrison/Wayne) but we obviously are never going to know that answer. Those 2 primadonnas could care less about that. But this guy is flat out innacurate.

bump

 

[Pai Mei]

I think the price of crow is going to rise due to massive shortages. Some of the ?better? posters and staff on these forums looking at being well-fed for quite some time. Possibly years.

 

[Texasmouth]

I hate to admit it but Eli is having a really solid game. I have been pretty impressed with him this post season. He seems to be learning to play within himself instead of despite himself.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

 

[Texasmouth]

Please dont let the Giants win though.....

 

[Synthesizer]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

I stand behind the dork part. But it's looking like I was wrong on the leadership part. He looked really good today in a tough situation. Props to him.

 

[Liquid Tension]

If you're in it to be just good enough to make it to the playoffs, keep Eli. But if you're trying to win Super Bowls, you're not going to do it with Eli.

Once again, football is the ultimate team sport...will the Giants win the SB, probably not, but I can guarantee you that if Eli performs a little better than Roethlisberger did when Ben won a SB (and that would be playing poor), the Giants will NOT win the SB. Eli will have to play solid and the team will have to play solid for them to have a chance.Eli is above average, but any mediocre QB can get you to a SB and win it if the team around you is studly.

 

[Liquid Tension]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

I hope people realize how overrated some of these qualities are. People tend to think that QB's who win have this a lot more than QB's who lose. the truth is that the team decides most of it. all these guys were great leaders in High School and College and have the ability to lead...the difference is that some have more talent than others and some have more talent around them than others.Brady threw picks yesterday and won. Not many QB's can get away with that and win. Just look at Peyton throwing two and they lose and people say he doesn't have what Brady has...yeah a defense that only allowed 12 points.

 

[bradyfan]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

I hope people realize how overrated some of these qualities are. People tend to think that QB's who win have this a lot more than QB's who lose. the truth is that the team decides most of it. all these guys were great leaders in High School and College and have the ability to lead...the difference is that some have more talent than others and some have more talent around them than others.Brady threw picks yesterday and won. Not many QB's can get away with that and win. Just look at Peyton throwing two and they lose and people say he doesn't have what Brady has...yeah a defense that only allowed 12 points.

C'mon. You have to give some credit to the Chargers ineffectiveness in the red zone.

 

[Liquid Tension]

Still a dork with no leadership skills.

I hope people realize how overrated some of these qualities are. People tend to think that QB's who win have this a lot more than QB's who lose. the truth is that the team decides most of it. all these guys were great leaders in High School and College and have the ability to lead...the difference is that some have more talent than others and some have more talent around them than others.Brady threw picks yesterday and won. Not many QB's can get away with that and win. Just look at Peyton throwing two and they lose and people say he doesn't have what Brady has...yeah a defense that only allowed 12 points.

C'mon. You have to give some credit to the Chargers ineffectiveness in the red zone.

Are you talking about SD's offense? If so, how did Brady impact that?

 

[timschochet]

This is a thread I started, and I was totally wrong about Eli. Will he continue to play this well in the future? Who knows? But he's great right now, and you've got to give him credit. What I wrote looks foolish now, but what else is new?