Evangelical support of Trump (1 Viewer)

[jm192]

I'm less interested in that one at least personally as most all the people I knew were backing Rubio. Our very popular Republican governor, Bill Haslam called for Trump to drop out of the race after the "grab them" tapes. I know it's anecdotal, but I'm relying a lot on my personal friends for this thread and none of them were backing Trump in the primaries. 

I also didn't vote for Trump in the primaries. 

 

[tommyGunZ]

I'm less interested in that one at least personally as most all the people I knew were backing Rubio. Our very popular Republican governor, Bill Haslam called for Trump to drop out of the race after the "grab them" tapes. I know it's anecdotal, but I'm relying a lot on my personal friends for this thread and none of them were backing Trump in the primaries. 

It’s interesting that your personal friends didn’t back Trump early, but after seeing him up close for several years and knowing far more about him, are now supporters (including Haslam).  

 

[tommyGunZ]

Add one more - why did some Evangelicals vote for him in the primaries - I will probably go to my grave wondering how that happened.  I think that’s the key, IMO - Trump brought a segment of voters who were not being accounted for by both parties and got them to vote for an outsider - once he became the nominee it was obvious most Evangelicals would vote for him - but the ones who voted for him in the primaries and the ones defending him now are, IMO, hurting what they claim to be their greater cause - the church.

75% of Republicans are white Christians.  I don’t get it either - Trump is the antithesis of what I thought a Christian was, but I think the most likely explanation is simply to take white Christians at their word - this is who they wanted and these are the policies they are in favor of.  Making excuses about them being fooled or that they are voting against their own interests is both insulting and condescending.  Trump has a 90% approval rating amongst Republicans.  He is more popular in his party than Reagan was.

At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.     

 

[Bucsfan5493]

Not only is Trump a dishonest person who lies all the time, even in situations when the truth wouldn't be harmful to him, but he's also creating a culture where his followers can dismiss facts they don't like with a shrug and a "Fake News", just like their leader does. 

Trump's lies aren't harmless.  They're extremely harmful, and have damage way beyond his inner circle.

Great overall post, but this is the most important for me. And it just amazes me how Trump supporters either don't see it, refuse to acknowledge it or simply don't care. It's such a dangerous precedent and standard to set for the leader of the country. The fact that his behavior has been normalized has me very worried for the future and it's why I've now gotten into politics and will be voting for the first time in 2020.

I really don't want to be forced to vote for one party, but to be honest with you, 90% of Republicans continuing to support this guy is going to make it very difficult for me to vote for one of their candidates going forward unless there are some dramatic changes to their party. The Democrats are far from perfect and I have my issues with them, but right now they aren't even in the same ballpark as Republicans for allowing this mess to continue for as long as it has.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Great overall post, but this is the most important for me. And it just amazes me how Trump supporters either don't see it, refuse to acknowledge it or simply don't care. It's such a dangerous precedent and standard to set for the leader of the country. The fact that his behavior has been normalized has me very worried for the future and it's why I've now gotten into politics and will be voting for the first time in 2020.

I really don't want to be forced to vote for one party, but to be honest with you, 90% of Republicans continuing to support this guy is going to make it very difficult for me to vote for one of their candidates going forward unless there are some dramatic changes to their party. The Democrats are far from perfect and I have my issues with them, but right now they aren't even in the same ballpark as Republicans for allowing this mess to continue for as long as it has.

Glad to hear you’re getting involved Buc.  As a former Republican but now longtime liberal/Democrat, I can assure you that even the biggest Democratic supporters know that our party isn’t perfect, and there will always be issues we see differently.  

 

[timschochet]

Trump has a 90% approval rating amongst Republicans.  He is more popular in his party than Reagan was.

I honestly believe that so much of this is a “circle the wagons” mentality against what they (Republicans) perceive is an attack against them. 

The best analogy IMO is to American blacks during the OJ trial. I don’t think they exactly loved OJ. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

Add one more - why did some Evangelicals vote for him in the primaries - I will probably go to my grave wondering how that happened.  I think that’s the key, IMO - Trump brought a segment of voters who were not being accounted for by both parties and got them to vote for an outsider - once he became the nominee it was obvious most Evangelicals would vote for him - but the ones who voted for him in the primaries and the ones defending him now are, IMO, hurting what they claim to be their greater cause - the church.

I was shocked when it was down to Trump, Cruz and Kasich.  How could Kasich get only 10% of the vote?  It showed me that the majority of the Republican party wasn't anywhere near where I thought they were.  

 

[tonydead]

Great overall post, but this is the most important for me. And it just amazes me how Trump supporters either don't see it, refuse to acknowledge it or simply don't care. It's such a dangerous precedent and standard to set for the leader of the country. The fact that his behavior has been normalized has me very worried for the future and it's why I've now gotten into politics and will be voting for the first time in 2020.

I really don't want to be forced to vote for one party, but to be honest with you, 90% of Republicans continuing to support this guy is going to make it very difficult for me to vote for one of their candidates going forward unless there are some dramatic changes to their party. The Democrats are far from perfect and I have my issues with them, but right now they aren't even in the same ballpark as Republicans for allowing this mess to continue for as long as it has.

It amazes me how many people are still amazed by it.  We elected grab'em by the ##### guy, in 2016.

 

[Bucsfan5493]

It amazes me how many people are still amazed by it.  We elected grab'em by the ##### guy, in 2016.

Maybe I'm just too young and haven't experienced enough of people, but I think it will always amaze me how 50% of the country was okay with or even enthusiastic about setting the bar that low.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I honestly believe that so much of this is a “circle the wagons” mentality against what they (Republicans) perceive is an attack against them. 

The best analogy IMO is to American blacks during the OJ trial. I don’t think they exactly loved OJ. 

Republicans didn’t circle the wagons for Reagan?  or Bush? 

Republicans are telling you what they are tim.  At what point are you going to believe them? 

 

[Joe Bryant]

75% of Republicans are white Christians.  I don’t get it either - Trump is the antithesis of what I thought a Christian was, but I think the most likely explanation is simply to take white Christians at their word - this is who they wanted and these are the policies they are in favor of.  Making excuses about them being fooled or that they are voting against their own interests is both insulting and condescending.  Trump has a 90% approval rating amongst Republicans.  He is more popular in his party than Reagan was.

At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.     

Thanks for the post. 

Lazy google question - You mention, Reagan. Do you have a quick link to the historical numbers for how republicans approved of other presidents?

And this one stabs me right in the heart. "At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.     "

I don't think he does represent Christianity. BUT, I fully understand why you think that would be true. And as a non Trump voting Christian, that makes me super sad. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Republicans didn’t circle the wagons for Reagan?  or Bush? 

Republicans are telling you what they are tim.  At what point are you going to believe them? 

In my opinion, Reagan or Bush Republicans didn't feel anywhere near like they needed to "defend" from an "attack" like Trump Republicans have. I think that's accurate. So yes, I think Trump Republicans have accurately felt a need to "circle the wagons" way more than Reagon or Bush Republicans did. 

Now that's not to say their side didn't fire the first shot. But circling the wagons isn't dependent on who fired the first shot. 

I would say Obama Democrats accurately felt a need to "circle the wagons". 

 

[timschochet]

Republicans are telling you what they are tim.  At what point are you going to believe them? 

Trump is a bigot. Republicans support Trump. According to your argument I should therefore assume that Republicans are bigots. 

I don’t. I think the flaw lies in your argument. It’s a subtle flaw and not easy to explain, and sometimes not easy to even understand. But I know that people are complicated, and they can support Trump, and some even love Trump, without themselves being wretched as I believe Trump himself to be. 

So the answer to your question is never. 

 

[Jackstraw]

Add one more - why did some Evangelicals vote for him in the primaries - I will probably go to my grave wondering how that happened. 

Trump would punish all the right people.  I know Joe thinks even suggesting that is deplorable but I don't know how you watch rally after rally and can't see there is some validity to it.  

How else do you explain nominating a siver spoon east coast real estate developer gential grabber cheating husband that goes in gold toilets and quotes "Two Corinthians". Over say Jeb Bush, Ted Cruz, John Kasich who have all the evangelical credentials in the world?    

 

[the moops]

Thanks for the post. 

Lazy google question - You mention, Reagan. Do you have a quick link to the historical numbers for how republicans approved of other presidents?

Best I could find with a quick search. This is polling during May of the president's 3rd term. Percent of republicans that approve

Trump 89

G.W. Bush 94

G.H.W Bush 94

Reagan 79

Ford 80

Nixon 78

Eisenhower 90

Source: Gallup historical data

 

[the moops]

Link

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2019/jun/06/donald-trump/donald-trump-says-republican-voters-him-more-they-/

 

[msommer]

Trump is a bigot. Republicans support Trump. According to your argument I should therefore assume that Republicans are bigots. 

I don’t. I think the flaw lies in your argument. It’s a subtle flaw and not easy to explain, and sometimes not easy to even understand. But I know that people are complicated, and they can support Trump, and some even love Trump, without themselves being wretched as I believe Trump himself to be. 

So the answer to your question is never. 

"Some, I assume, are good people"

- Donald J Trump

 

[Mile High]

Maybe I'm just too young and haven't experienced enough of people, but I think it will always amaze me how 50% of the country was okay with or even enthusiastic about setting the bar that low.

Not really 50%, only about 50% of 60% of the country. Around 40% of the voting age Americans don't seem to care what happens since they don't vote.

 

[tommyGunZ]

In my opinion, Reagan or Bush Republicans didn't feel anywhere near like they needed to "defend" from an "attack" like Trump Republicans have. I think that's accurate. So yes, I think Trump Republicans have accurately felt a need to "circle the wagons" way more than Reagon or Bush Republicans did. 

Now that's not to say their side didn't fire the first shot. But circling the wagons isn't dependent on who fired the first shot. 

I would say Obama Democrats accurately felt a need to "circle the wagons". 

We’re about the same age Joe, I think.     Did you follow politics with enough passion during the Reagan years to make that claim?  I know I certainly didn’t.  I know that liberals attacked Reagan’s intelligence (“he’s an actor”), integrity (Iran-Contra), and competency (dementia) to extents that I’m guessing provided lots of rallying the troops amongst Republicans, but like I said don’t know how that compares to folks rallying around Trump.  I did follow politics a lot closer in 2003-4, and I know there was a ton of circling the wagons on behalf of GWBush, in large part defending him as being our President while at war.  
Perhaps you and Tim are correct, and it really is different this time.  I always wonder about that claim though.  

 

[tommyGunZ]

Best I could find with a quick search. This is polling during May of the president's 3rd term. Percent of republicans that approve

Trump 89

G.W. Bush 94

G.H.W Bush 94

Reagan 79

Ford 80

Nixon 78

Eisenhower 90

Source: Gallup historical data

Thanks @the moops.  Not a coincidence that 3rd May of both Bush terms where support was higher than Trump, we were at war on foreign soil.   

 

[tommyGunZ]

Thanks for the post. 

Lazy google question - You mention, Reagan. Do you have a quick link to the historical numbers for how republicans approved of other presidents?

And this one stabs me right in the heart. "At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.     "

I don't think he does represent Christianity. BUT, I fully understand why you think that would be true. And as a non Trump voting Christian, that makes me super sad. 

FWIW, Trump doesn’t represent what I understood Christianity to be from my upbringing as a Southern Baptist.  If I still believed I would be right there with you and extremely frustrated that the vast majority of people who shared my faith support this ugliness.  

 

[[scooter]]

And this one stabs me right in the heart. "At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.     "

I don't think he does represent Christianity. BUT, I fully understand why you think that would be true. And as a non Trump voting Christian, that makes me super sad. 

I'm not into bible prophesy or Revelation stuff, but it amazes me that more Christians aren't concerned about Trump being the Anti-Christ.

I mean, *I* don't think Trump is the Anti-Christ. But I have memories of 8 years of my evangelical relatives and Facebook friends telling me that they were convinced that Obama was the Anti-Christ -- and much of their theory was based on 1) their belief that Obama was only pretending to be a Christian, and 2) their belief that Obama can't be a true Christian because he was too arrogant. And now those same people brush off Trump's narcissism and Bible ignorance and have no problem with Trump joking about being the "second coming" and think nothing of their evangelical leaders showing complete deference to Caesar Trump. It's weird, to say the least.

Meanwhile, public trust in Christian leaders is at an all-time low. I don't think that's a coincidence.

 

[John Blutarsky]

I'm not into bible prophesy or Revelation stuff, but it amazes me that more Christians aren't concerned about Trump being the Anti-Christ.

I mean, *I* don't think Trump is the Anti-Christ. But I have memories of 8 years of my evangelical relatives and Facebook friends telling me that they were convinced that Obama was the Anti-Christ -- and much of their theory was based on 1) their belief that Obama was only pretending to be a Christian, and 2) their belief that Obama can't be a true Christian because he was too arrogant. And now those same people brush off Trump's narcissism and Bible ignorance and have no problem with Trump joking about being the "second coming" and think nothing of their evangelical leaders showing complete deference to Caesar Trump. It's weird, to say the least.

Meanwhile, public trust in Christian leaders is at an all-time low. I don't think that's a coincidence.

That poll is from 2018.

--John Fea,  a professor of American history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania, 
told HuffPost he believes the prominence of the Roman Catholic Church’s sexual abuse scandal this year may be contributing to a lack of trust in the clergy. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Best I could find with a quick search. This is polling during May of the president's 3rd term. Percent of republicans that approve

Trump 89

G.W. Bush 94

G.H.W Bush 94

Reagan 79

Ford 80

Nixon 78

Eisenhower 90

Source: Gallup historical data

Thank you. 

It helps to see he's pretty much in line with other Republican presidents.

I also think that's something to do with polls. They are super interesting in how and when a question is asked. Barring asking this during a time where there's something extreme like a war or a depression, my guess is you'd almost always get about this same approval rating 10 months from a Presidential election. 

It's also sort of self selecting. If you were a Republican, but don't like Trump and no longer identify as a Republican, you're not included in the poll. This isn't like a sports team. A large part of whether you identify as in or out of the group is based on whether you like leader of the group. It also doesn't speak at all to the size of the group. That can be dangerous in comparing percentages too.

 

[Lutherman2112]

That poll is from 2018.

--John Fea,  a professor of American history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania, 
told HuffPost he believes the prominence of the Roman Catholic Church’s sexual abuse scandal this year may be contributing to a lack of trust in the clergy. 

The decline has been a trend since 1985 and there are many causes. A good 5 part series I reread recently.

https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2018/january/8-people-americans-trust-more-than-their-local-pastor.html

 

[Joe Bryant]

We’re about the same age Joe, I think.     Did you follow politics with enough passion during the Reagan years to make that claim?  I know I certainly didn’t.  I know that liberals attacked Reagan’s intelligence (“he’s an actor”), integrity (Iran-Contra), and competency (dementia) to extents that I’m guessing provided lots of rallying the troops amongst Republicans, but like I said don’t know how that compares to folks rallying around Trump.  I did follow politics a lot closer in 2003-4, and I know there was a ton of circling the wagons on behalf of GWBush, in large part defending him as being our President while at war.  
Perhaps you and Tim are correct, and it really is different this time.  I always wonder about that claim though.  

I didn't really follow Reagan that closely. I was too busy in college listening to Dead Kennedy albums mocking him or Jody Foster's Army stuff while marching for Texas A&M to divest itself of investments in companies that did business in South Africa and supported Apartheid.

But I do remember it being a more civil time. They took shots (literally) at him but it always seemed way less like a battle. I remember them talking like Reagan could battle Tip O'Neil during the day but when the workday was over, they could have a dinner and a cigar. That type of thing. 

For me, the combativeness seemed to pick up with Bill Clinton. But the last three years have been way more circling the wagons than anytime I can remember. 

 

[[scooter]]

I'm not into bible prophesy or Revelation stuff, but it amazes me that more Christians aren't concerned about Trump being the Anti-Christ.

I mean, *I* don't think Trump is the Anti-Christ. But I have memories of 8 years of my evangelical relatives and Facebook friends telling me that they were convinced that Obama was the Anti-Christ -- and much of their theory was based on 1) their belief that Obama was only pretending to be a Christian, and 2) their belief that Obama can't be a true Christian because he was too arrogant. And now those same people brush off Trump's narcissism and Bible ignorance and have no problem with Trump joking about being the "second coming" and think nothing of their evangelical leaders showing complete deference to Caesar Trump. It's weird, to say the least.

Meanwhile, public trust in Christian leaders is at an all-time low. I don't think that's a coincidence.

That poll is from 2018.

--John Fea,  a professor of American history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania, 
told HuffPost he believes the prominence of the Roman Catholic Church’s sexual abuse scandal this year may be contributing to a lack of trust in the clergy. 

2018 is the most recent version of that Gallup poll as far as I know. 

I'm sure that the Catholic sex abuse scandals have played a role, but those cases were mostly publicized 15-20 years ago and have been somewhat "baked in" to public opinion since then. If you look at Gallup's polling history, there is a sharp decline for clergy starting around 2001 -- which is right around the time when the Catholic abuse scandal started making daily appearances in the headlines. However, there was another significant decline from 2017-2018, despite the fact that the Catholic church did not experience an increase in sex abuse scandals during that time.

Maybe the evangelical deference to Trump has nothing to do with that, maybe not.

 

[tonydead]

Perhaps an exercise in empathy is in order.  
 

Try to view all this through the lens of someone who views sexual assault as a crime that should be prosecuted, even if the perpetrator is rich and powerful. Instead of the lens of a person who as recently as a few weeks ago cheered the idea of Trump committing more sexual assaults after a rally.

Falsehood.   Want me to post the PM you requested explaining how that was a mistake, a mistake I apologize for?  And a mistake I did the time for.

Yet you continue with lies and slander.  You must feel horrible inside.

 

[msommer]

I know that liberals attacked Reagan’s intelligence (“he’s an actor”), integrity (Iran-Contra), and competency (dementia)

I don't discount people'sintelligenve because they are or were actors. but two out three ain't bad

 

[timschochet]

The other reason evangelicals love Trump- abortion. I know it’s a broken record but we have to look at this from a historical perspective. Since Roe vs Wade and the start of the right to life movement, we’ve had 3 Republican Presidents before Trump. All 3 of them campaigned on ending abortion. 2 of them, Reagan and George W. Bush, were devout religious Christians. They made promises, collected tons of money from evangelicals and once elected, they did...nothing. At times they did worse than nothing; all 3 appointed judges who turned out to be “soft” on abortion, who ended up protecting it. Right wing Christians felt they were being taken for granted. 

Now along comes Trump. He makes no pretense at being an evangelical. He’s even been pro choice in the past. He’s probably paid for abortions in his personal life. But as President he’s delivered. Judges to the Supreme Court and tons of lesser courts who are solidly pro-life. Trump is the ONLY Republican President who has kept his promise on this. Of course they’re going to keep supporting him! Why would they not? 

 

[tonydead]

2018 is the most recent version of that Gallup poll as far as I know. 

I'm sure that the Catholic sex abuse scandals have played a role, but those cases were mostly publicized 15-20 years ago and have been somewhat "baked in" to public opinion since then. If you look at Gallup's polling history, there is a sharp decline for clergy starting around 2001 -- which is right around the time when the Catholic abuse scandal started making daily appearances in the headlines. However, there was another significant decline from 2017-2018, despite the fact that the Catholic church did not experience an increase in sex abuse scandals during that time.

Maybe the evangelical deference to Trump has nothing to do with that, maybe not.

I don't know if it's baked into the polls or not, but, the real damning stuff has just come out the past 2-3 years.  High ranking Cardinals going down and the cover up exposed all the way to the pope.  Link.

ETA: Now I read your post more closely that would explain the decline in 2017-2018, you are mistaken they didn't experience any scandal during that time.

 

[tommyGunZ]

The other reason evangelicals love Trump- abortion. I know it’s a broken record but we have to look at this from a historical perspective. Since Roe vs Wade and the start of the right to life movement, we’ve had 3 Republican Presidents before Trump. All 3 of them campaigned on ending abortion. 2 of them, Reagan and George W. Bush, were devout religious Christians. They made promises, collected tons of money from evangelicals and once elected, they did...nothing. At times they did worse than nothing; all 3 appointed judges who turned out to be “soft” on abortion, who ended up protecting it. Right wing Christians felt they were being taken for granted. 

Now along comes Trump. He makes no pretense at being an evangelical. He’s even been pro choice in the past. He’s probably paid for abortions in his personal life. But as President he’s delivered. Judges to the Supreme Court and tons of lesser courts who are solidly pro-life. Trump is the ONLY Republican President who has kept his promise on this. Of course they’re going to keep supporting him! Why would they not? 

Trump hasn’t “kept his promise” until we know how this Supreme Courts rules on these issues over the next decade.  

 

[lazyike]

That poll is from 2018.

--John Fea,  a professor of American history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania, 
told HuffPost he believes the prominence of the Roman Catholic Church’s sexual abuse scandal this year may be contributing to a lack of trust in the clergy. 

Roman Catholics break from Evangelicals on their support of Trump according to this poll where they favor Biden over Trump 52% to 39% in a hypothetical ballot. Some of that may be because of a large percentage of Hispanics are Catholic. The headlines seem to be misleading where it shows 58% of devout Catholics would vote for Trump( even that number is lower than Evangelicals) but only 34% of all Catholics would. I sense that Catholics break from Trump on Immigration in particular.

https://religionunplugged.com/news/2019/12/9/religious-catholics-favor-president-trumps-re-election-new-poll-finds

 

[Joe Bryant]

Another from a different angle. If nothing, I try to get different perspectives on this.
 

Onward, Christian Fascists . https://www.truthdig.com/articles/onward-christian-fascists/

The greatest moral failing of the liberal Christian church was its refusal, justified in the name of tolerance and dialogue, to denounce the followers of the Christian right as heretics. By tolerating the intolerant it ceded religious legitimacy to an array of con artists, charlatans and demagogues and their cultish supporters. It stood by as the core Gospel message—concern for the poor and the oppressed—was perverted into a magical world where God and Jesus showered believers with material wealth and power. The white race, especially in the United States, became God’s chosen agent. Imperialism and war became divine instruments for purging the world of infidels and barbarians, evil itself. Capitalism, because God blessed the righteous with wealth and power and condemned the immoral to poverty and suffering, became shorn of its inherent cruelty and exploitation. The iconography and symbols of American nationalism became intertwined with the iconography and symbols of the Christian faith. The mega-pastors, narcissists who rule despotic, cult-like fiefdoms, make millions of dollars by using this heretical belief system to prey on the mounting despair and desperation of their congregations, victims of neoliberalism and deindustrialization. These believers find in Donald Trump a reflection of themselves, a champion of the unfettered greed, cult of masculinity, lust for violence, white supremacy, bigotry, American chauvinism, religious intolerance, anger, racism and conspiracy theories that define the central beliefs of the Christian right. When I wrote “American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America” I was deadly serious about the term “fascists.”

The evangelical magazine Christianity Today, by stating the obvious about Trump, that he is immoral and should be removed from office, became the latest recipient of the Christian right’s vicious and hypocritical backlash. Nearly 200 evangelical leaders, including former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, former Rep. Michele Bachmann, Jerry Falwell Jr. and Ralph Reed, signed a joint letter denouncing the Christianity Today editorial, written by the magazine’s president, Timothy Dalrymple, and outgoing Editor Mark Galli. Evangelical Christians who criticize Trump are as swiftly disappeared from the ranks as Republican politicians who criticize Trump. Trump received 80% of the white evangelical vote in the 2016 presidential election, and in a poll this month 90% of Republicans said they opposed impeachment and ouster of the president. Among Republicans who identify as white evangelical Protestants, that number rises to 99%.

Tens of millions of Americans live hermetically sealed inside the vast media and educational edifice controlled by Christian fascists. In this world, miracles are real, Satan, allied with secular humanists and Muslims, is seeking to destroy America, and Trump is God’s anointed vessel to build the Christian nation and cement into place a government that instills “biblical values.” These “biblical values” include banning abortion, protecting the traditional family, turning the Ten Commandments into secular law, crushing “infidels,” especially Muslims, indoctrinating children in schools with “biblical” teachings and thwarting sexual license, which includes any sexual relationship other than in a marriage between a man and a woman. Trump is routinely compared by evangelical leaders to the biblical king Cyrus, who rebuilt the temple in Jerusalem and restored the Jews to the city.

Trump has filled his own ideological void with Christian fascism. He has elevated members of the Christian right to prominent positions, including Mike Pence to the vice presidency, Mike Pompeo to secretary of state, Betsy DeVos to secretary of education, Ben Carson to secretary of housing and urban development, William Barr to attorney general, Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh to the Supreme Court and the televangelist Paula White to his Faith and Opportunities Initiative. More importantly, Trump has handed the Christian right veto and appointment power over key positions in government, especially in the federal courts. He has installed 133 district court judges out of 677 total, 50 appeals court judges out of 179 total, and two U.S. Supreme Court justices out of nine. Almost all of these judges were, in effect, selected by the Federalist Society and the Christian right. Many of the extremists who make up the judicial appointees have been rated as unqualified by the American Bar Association, the country’s largest nonpartisan coalition of lawyers. Trump has moved to ban Muslim immigrants and rolled back civil rights legislation. He has made war on reproductive rights by restricting abortion and defunding Planned Parenthood. He has stripped away LGBTQ rights. He has ripped down the firewall between church and state by revoking the Johnson Amendment, which prohibits churches, which are tax-exempt, from endorsing political candidates. His appointees throughout the government routinely use biblical strictures to justify an array of policy decisions including environmental deregulation, war, tax cuts and the replacement of public schools with charter schools, an action that permits the transfer of federal education funds to private “Christian” schools.

I studied ethics at Harvard Divinity School with James Luther Adams, who had been in Germany in 1935 and 1936. Adams witnessed the rise there of the so-called Christian Church, which was pro-Nazi. He warned us about the disturbing parallels between the German Christian Church and the Christian right. Adolf Hitler was in the eyes of the German Christian Church a volk messiah and an instrument of God—a view similar to the one held today about Trump by many of his white evangelical supporters. Those demonized for Germany’s economic collapse, especially Jews and communists, were agents of Satan. Fascism, Adams told us, always cloaked itself in a nation’s most cherished symbols and rhetoric. Fascism would come to America not in the guise of stiff-armed, marching brownshirts and Nazi swastikas but in mass recitations of the Pledge of Allegiance, the biblical sanctification of the state and the sacralization of American militarism. Adams was the first person I heard label the extremists of the Christian right as fascists. Liberals, he warned, as in Nazi Germany, were blind to the tragic dimension of history and radical evil. They would not react until it was too late.

Trump’s legacy will be the empowerment of the Christian fascists. They are what comes next. For decades they have been organizing to take power. They have built infrastructures and organizations, including lobbying groups, schools and universities as well as media platforms, to prepare. They have seeded their cadre into the political system. We on the left, meanwhile, have seen our institutions and organizations destroyed or corrupted by corporate power.

The Christian fascists, as in all totalitarian movements, need a crisis, manufactured or real, in order to seize power. This crisis may be financial. It could be triggered by a catastrophic terrorist attack. Or it could be the result of a societal breakdown from our climate emergency. The Christian fascists are poised to take advantage of the chaos, or perceived chaos. They have their own version of the brownshirts, the for-hire mercenary armies and private contractors amassed by Christian fascists such as Erik Prince, the brother of Betsy DeVos. The Christian fascists have seized control of significant portions of the judiciary and legislative branches of government. FRC Action, the legislative affiliate of the Family Research Council, gives 245 members of Congress a perfect 100% for votes that support the agenda of the Christian right. The Family Research Council, which has called on its followers to pray that God will vanquish the “demonic forces” behind Trump’s impeachment, is identified by the Southern Poverty Law Center as a hate group because of its campaigns to discriminate against the LGBTQ community.

The ideology of the Christian fascists panders in our decline to the primitive yearnings for the vengeance, new glory and moral renewal that are found among those pushed aside by deindustrialization and austerity. Reason, facts and verifiable truth are impotent weapons against this belief system. The Christian right is a “crisis cult.” Crisis cults arise in most collapsing societies. They promise, through magic, to recover the lost grandeur and power of a mythologized past. This magical thinking banishes doubt, anxiety and feelings of disempowerment. Traditional social hierarchies and rules, including an unapologetic white, male supremacy, will be restored. Rituals and behaviors including an unquestioning submission to authority and acts of violence to cleanse the society of evil will vanquish malevolent forces.

The Christian fascists propagate their magical thinking through a selective literalism in addressing the Bible. They hold up as sacrosanct biblical passages that buttress their ideology and ignore, or grossly misinterpret, the ones that do not. They live in a binary universe. They see themselves as eternal victims, oppressed by dark and sinister groups seeking their annihilation. They alone know the will of God. They alone can fulfill God’s will. They seek total cultural and political domination. The secular, reality-based world, one where Satan, miracles, destiny, angels and magic do not exist, destroyed their lives and communities. That world took away their jobs and their futures. It ripped apart the social bonds that once gave them purpose, dignity and hope. In their despair they often struggled with alcohol, drug and gambling addictions. They endured familial breakdown, divorce, evictions, unemployment and domestic and sexual violence. The only thing that saved them was their conversion, the realization that God had a plan for them and would protect them. These believers were pushed by a callous, heartless corporate society and rapacious oligarchy into the arms of charlatans. All who speak to them in the calm, rational language of fact and evidence are hated and ultimately feared, for they seek to force believers back into “the culture of death” that nearly destroyed them.

We can blunt the rise of this Christian fascism only by reintegrating exploited and abused Americans into society, giving them jobs with stable, sustainable incomes, relieving their crushing personal debts, rebuilding their communities and transforming our failed democracy into one in which everyone has agency and a voice. We must impart to them hope, not only for themselves but for their children.

Christian fascism is an emotional life raft for tens of millions. It is impervious to the education, dialogue and discourse the liberal class naively believes can blunt or domesticate the movement. The Christian fascists, by choice, have severed themselves from rational thought. We will not placate or disarm this movement, bent on our destruction, by attempting to claim that we too have Christian “values.” This appeal only strengthens the legitimacy of the Christian fascists and weakens our own. We will transform American society to a socialist system that provides meaning, dignity and hope to all citizens, that cares and nurtures the most vulnerable among us, or we will become the victims of the Christian fascists we created.

Chris Hedges is a Truthdig columnist, a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, a New York Times best-selling author, a professor in the college degree program offered to New Jersey state prisoners by Rutgers University, and an ordained Presbyterian minister. He has written 12 books, including the New York Times best-seller “Days of Destruction, Days of Revolt” (2012), which he co-authored with the cartoonist Joe Sacco. His other books include "Wages of Rebellion: The Moral Imperative of Revolt," (2015) “Death of the Liberal Class” (2010), “Empire of Illusion: The End of Literacy and the Triumph of Spectacle” (2009), “I Don’t Believe in Atheists” (2008) and the best-selling “American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America” (2008). His latest book is "America: The Farewell Tour" (2018). His book “War Is a Force That Gives Us Meaning” (2003) was a finalist for the National Book Critics Circle Award for Nonfiction and has sold over 400,000 copies. He writes a weekly column for the website Truthdig and hosts a show, "On Contact," on RT America.

 

[msommer]

Christian fascism is an emotional life raft for tens of millions. It is impervious to the education, dialogue and discourse the liberal class naively believes can blunt or domesticate the movement. The Christian fascists, by choice, have severed themselves from rational thought. We will not placate or disarm this movement, bent on our destruction, by attempting to claim that we too have Christian “values.” This appeal only strengthens the legitimacy of the Christian fascists and weakens our own

I call the potential Christian fascist future Ameristan. I stole that from Neal Stephenson, don't know if he's stolen it from somewhere else.

 

[timschochet]

I think this latest guy carries it way too much in the other direction. He sounds like the scriptwriter for The Handmaid’s Tale. I’m not afraid of fascism from the Christian Right; it’s a fantasy. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

I think this latest guy carries it way too much in the other direction. He sounds like the scriptwriter for The Handmaid’s Tale. I’m not afraid of fascism from the Christian Right; it’s a fantasy. 

I do find it interesting the opinions swing from the Church is dead and Christians will soon be outdated to Christian Fascists are primed to take over the world. Like anything, I'm sure the truth is in there somewhere but seems interesting. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

The one i keep going back to is Tommygunz "At some point I think we should just come to grips with the fact that Trumpism represents the views and policy preferences of white Christianity in America.    "

I don't think he does represent Christianity. BUT, I fully understand why you think that would be true. And as a non Trump voting Christian, that makes me super sad. 

 

[Endowed]

I hear Christian's frequently say he is Gods chosen one. Or something to that line of thinking.

Dont need tommygunz for that.

 

[Ranethe]

I think this latest guy carries it way too much in the other direction. He sounds like the scriptwriter for The Handmaid’s Tale. I’m not afraid of fascism from the Christian Right; it’s a fantasy. 

It amazes me that you continue to minimize this. That article Joe posted is exactly on point IMO. It’s not a fantasy (nor is it yet a reality; it is, however, a plausible potential-perhaps likely-outcome).and you of all people with your interest and knowledge of both history and current events, should realize this. 

This virulent form of right wing ideology is sweeping the globe to some extent. I am surprised Joe posted that as much of it appears to be in opposition to what he advocates for regarding political talk/behavior. We cannot excuse or provide cover for Trumpism under any banner, including civility, difference of opinion, or “both sides”.

eta: it’s interesting that he mentions that horrible argument often levied against the left: you’re intolerant of my intolerance. Such a cynical, phony, weak argument we often see in here.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Maybe the government isn't the best tool to live up to your "do unto others" commandment but that still doesn't square with demanding government to at best be indifferent to others and more often than not worst.   You can't "love thy neighbor" and choose policies of indifference.  You can't "love God" and support the messenger of the hateful rhetoric directed at the Father's children in the twitter feed and rallies of the current president.   

You can, like the author of the rebuttal lie to yourself and believe the "let there be markets"  "moral justification for their own wealth and for the outlandish sufferings" of others is because that "the free market ... was a perfectly designed instrument to reward good Christian behavior and to punish and humiliate the unrepentant", but this requires taking a blind eye to reality and "picking and choosing" a lot of nonsense out of scripture (and/or science and/or history).   

 

[BladeRunner]

I hear Christian's frequently say he is Gods chosen one. Or something to that line of thinking.

Dont need tommygunz for that.

You do?  You're going to have to back this one up because that is absolutely ridiculous.

These over-the-top posts do not help your cause.

 

[John Blutarsky]

I hear Christian's frequently say he is Gods chosen one. Or something to that line of thinking.

Dont need tommygunz for that.

I’d like to see you back this up too.

 

[saintfool]

Maybe the government isn't the best tool to live up to your "do unto others" commandment but that still doesn't square with demanding government to at best be indifferent to others and more often than not worst.   You can't "love thy neighbor" and choose policies of indifference.  You can't "love God" and support the messenger of the hateful rhetoric directed at the Father's children in the twitter feed and rallies of the current president.   

You can, like the author of the rebuttal lie to yourself and believe the "let there be markets"  "moral justification for their own wealth and for the outlandish sufferings" of others is because that "the free market ... was a perfectly designed instrument to reward good Christian behavior and to punish and humiliate the unrepentant", but this requires taking a blind eye to reality and "picking and choosing" a lot of nonsense out of scripture (and/or science and/or history).   

I saw this article on Slate earlier today about how Liberty University - Jerry Falwell Jr's college - handles dissent within its ranks. It's mentioned in the article that Trump was not the LU choice in the primaries (Rubio was) during the run up to the 2016 election. The article gives some insight, I think, on how Christians - especially the conflicted - and much of the GOP keep mostly silent in Trump's time.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I hear Christian's frequently say he is Gods chosen one. Or something to that line of thinking.

Dont need tommygunz for that.

How frequently do you hear this?

I've heard it on the internet. I have a ton of Christian friends and I've never heard it in real life from another person. 

I've heard it in the context of "God can work in unlikely ways" type stuff. The bible is full of God using unlikely people (Moses, Mary, The Apostles) to do great things. I do believe that happens. 

 

[saintfool]

How frequently do you hear this?

I've heard it on the internet. I have a ton of Christian friends and I've never heard it in real life from another person. 

I've heard it in the context of "God can work in unlikely ways" type stuff. The bible is full of God using unlikely people (Moses, Mary, The Apostles) to do great things. I do believe that happens. 

Former Texas Governor, Sec of Energy Rick Perry: I told Trump he was the "chosen one" to lead the US

 

[whoknew]

Former Texas Governor, Sec of Energy Rick Perry: I told Trump he was the "chosen one" to lead the US

Nikki Haley said something similar. Not exactly the same but - Haley responded by saying that his presidency showed that “everything happens for a reason. … I think God sometimes places people for lessons and sometimes places people for change.”

 

[whoknew]

 In February, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, Trump’s press secretary, told TV preacher Pat Robertson’s Christian Broadcasting Network (CBN), “I think God calls all of us to fill different roles at different times, and I think that He wanted Donald Trump to become president. That’s why he’s there, and I think he has done a tremendous job in supporting a lot of the things that people of faith really care about.”

---

Pompeo was asked by CBN correspondent Chris Mitchell, “Could it be that President Trump right now has been sort of raised for such a time as this, just like Queen Esther, to help save the Jewish people from the Iranian menace?”

Pompeo, who was visiting Israel at the time, replied, “As a Christian, I certainly believe that’s possible.” (The Esther story concerns a young woman who uses her beauty to gain power over a king and foil a plot by one of his advisers to slaughter the Jewish people.)

---

Trump’s campaign manager, Brad Parscale, is the latest to join the pack. On April 30 he tweeted, “There has never been and probably never will be a movement like this again. Only God could deliver such a savior to our nation, and only God could allow me to help. God bless America!”

 

[BladeRunner]

Former Texas Governor, Sec of Energy Rick Perry: I told Trump he was the "chosen one" to lead the US

Okay, when someone makes reference to "The Chosen One" in a religious context, they're NOT talking about being President of the United States.  We're talking about the Almighty or Son of God.

Maybe @Endowed can provide more clarity.

 

[SoBeDad]

Separation of church and state is a good idea. Sure, lots of black preachers supported Obama from the pulpit, but this Friday's "Evangelicals for Trump" rally at a predominantly Hispanic Evangelical mega church in Miami takes it to another level. 

Trump event in Miami church may violate IRS rules, non-profit says