Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch (1 Viewer)

[The Commish]

Christo...would it be considered "ill will" if he was using racially charged labels like "coon" or "*****" etc? Is that what "ill will" means? Sorry for the dumb question, but I find it easier to get answers rather than assume.

The difficulty is linking the thought with the gun shot.Second degree murder: You walk in on your wife having sex with your best friend. He runs. The next day he comes up to you at the golf club to apologize. You grab your 9-iron from your bag and crack him upside the head a few times. It's not first degree murder because it wasn't premeditated. It's not manslaughter because too much time passed between catching him in bed and hitting him. But the act of swinging the club was caused by the ill will you have against him for sleeping with your wife.Let's assume here Zimmerman did call Martin a coon. It occurred several minutes before the gun shot. What happened between the time he said coon and pulled the trigger is very important. If Martin was the one who turned the encounter from verbal to physical, the prosecutor has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that racial animus is what caused Zimmerman to pull the trigger rather than Zimmerman pulling the trigger because Martin was hitting him.

Thanks!

 

[Carolina Hustler]

BTW, I've read a lot of comments here and elsewhere talking about riots.Links to the riots that have been going on are appreciated. Thanks.

Have there been riots already? Aside from some teenagers flash mobbing a drug store, there hasn't even been anything resembling a riot to my knowledge.

 

[ATC1]

BTW, I've read a lot of comments here and elsewhere talking about riots.

Links to the riots that have been going on are appreciated. Thanks.

I don't know about "riots", but

About 100 students who walked out of class at North Miami Beach Senior High School in honor of Trayvon Martin, the Miami Gardens teenager who was shot to death last month in Sanford, ended up ransacking a Walgreens drugstore, breaking displays and merchandise, North Miami Beach police said.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/28/2718440/students-in-trayvon-martin-walkout.html#storylink=cpy

According to local news affiliates, a 27-year-old Gainesville man was walking home from the bars early Tuesday morning when he said he was jumped by five to eight men who yelled “Trayvon” before the attack. The call before the attack appears to be in reference to the Sandford case that has rocked national headlines, and led to broader societal discussions on crime and race.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/attackers-allegedly-yell-trayvon-before-beating-man-in-another-possible-racially-motivated-assault/

 

[Carolina Hustler]

I hope she knows something we I don't know.

Most people do speculate.

 

[SacramentoBob]

If I'm forming a mob to attack people I have them yell out "self-defense!" the entire time, not Trayvon.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

First important question: will a bond be granted? Make a prediction.

No bond, this has already been decided..

On what basis? Is Zimmerman gonna flee? Is Zimmerman dangerous? Don't see a good argument to be made to deny bail.

I don't even know this for certain. A guy I work with told me he caught an update on his phone today, and it said "second degree murder.. No Bond"

 

[ATC1]

If I'm forming a mob to attack people I have them yell out "self-defense!" the entire time, not Trayvon.

For your sake I hope they are not armed.

 

[renesauz]

Well guys, it's been a good run. I'm sure there will be more to get whipped up over when the sentence comes down, one way or the other. A few years from now this will be just one of the thousands of anecdotes that makes the rest of the world scared to visit our country.

At least 2 to 1 odds Zimmerman walks, either by a hung jury or outright acquittal.

Doubt it. They don't charge crimes with those kind of odds.

They do under circumstances like these, where failure to charge will lead to significant riots. No surprise to me. There was enough to bring charges, but unless they have something significant that hasn't been released, probably not enough to convict.

 

[renesauz]

Well guys, it's been a good run. I'm sure there will be more to get whipped up over when the sentence comes down, one way or the other. A few years from now this will be just one of the thousands of anecdotes that makes the rest of the world scared to visit our country.

At least 2 to 1 odds Zimmerman walks, either by a hung jury or outright acquittal.

Doubt it. They don't charge crimes with those kind of odds.

You do when you have the whole country watching, a huge angry mob demanding action lead by the biggest race-baiters, and a Justice Department with an army of their top agents snooping around looking for someone to prosecute. There is probably more political pressure to press charges in this case in years. This is a classic of a case of being railroaded as you will ever see.

Complete and utter nonsense.

"railroaded" is obviously too far...but "complete and utter nonsense" is too far the other way.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

If I'm forming a mob to attack people I have them yell out "self-defense!" the entire time, not Trayvon.

Have fun with that.. Wouldn't surprise me..

 

[renesauz]

So when this woman asserts that this is not the case, she's lying. And all the people who are up there with her are lying. Got it.

Can you see colors at all? It is NOT black and white here. This is all kinds of gray.

 

[SacramentoBob]

Either that or "What's the frequency, Kenneth?"

 

[renesauz]

Love how the pro-Zimm crowd is backpedaling to "well she had no choice but to charge him now".

Hardly. Many in that crowd (which is not exactly pro-Zimm as much as anti-mob) expected charges of some sort at some point. Whether they stick or not is another story.

 

[renesauz]

I don't think I am. But here's what I will concede to you guys:Like many of you, I will be watching this case very closely, because it fascinates me. If it turns out that the prosecution has no more evidence out there than we know at this present time (or at least, no more evidence of a decisive nature), then I will sadly conclude that I was wrong about this, and that those of you who disagree with me are right- that this woman must have been pressured into charging Zimmerman, that she should not have charged him. I will feel that way whether or not Zimmerman is ultimately convicted. There had better be new evidence. Otherwise the system is not what I thought it was. If Zimmerman is convicted based on the evidence the public knows now, that will be a travesty of justice. Zimmerman's actual guilt or innocence is much less relevant to me than the integrity of the system. There HAS to be new evidence, or there's been a royal screwing here.

 

[Carver]

Rioters rejoice as they are 1 step closer to that brand new flat screen TV, ask judge for a speedy trial.

Actually, this has delayed their shopping spree.

However, it gives them a better idea on the exact date and time to riot, thus increasing their chances of getting the TV they have scouted out.

They all fantasize about us you know. Even if they tell you differently. It's usually the first thing they confess to us afterwards.

 

[fatness]

BTW, I've read a lot of comments here and elsewhere talking about riots.Links to the riots that have been going on are appreciated. Thanks.

Link to where people said riots were happening.

Yes, that's what I'm looking for. People keep referring to rioting. I want to read the accounts. Thanks.

 

[jon_mx]

BTW, I've read a lot of comments here and elsewhere talking about riots.Links to the riots that have been going on are appreciated. Thanks.

Link to where people said riots were happening.

Yes, that's what I'm looking for. People keep referring to rioting. I want to read the accounts. Thanks.

I think most people were referring to the potential of the mobs to riot if charges were not pressed.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Every part where you enter your opinion.Unreal. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

You kinda missed my point. What I think (I was clear that I was expressing my opinions in the first post - 'hunch' 'bet' 'I think') has no bearing on his innocence or guilt. And everyone deserves their day in court. Which I also said.

 

[jon_mx]

Every part where you enter your opinion.Unreal. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

You kinda missed my point. What I think (I was clear that I was expressing my opinions in the first post - 'hunch' 'bet' 'I think') has no bearing on his innocence or guilt. And everyone deserves their day in court. Which I also said.

You stated, "Nothing I said is actually in dispute is it?" but yet all of your statements are riddled with untruths or unproven assertions.

 

[timschochet]

Christo has stated several times in this thread that Zimmerman must testify in his own behalf. He (Christo) has explained that this is necessary because Zimmerman's defense will be that he acted in self-defense. I am not enough of a legal expert to give an opinion on this, but I can't remember the last time in one of these high-profile cases the accused actually took the stand. Any of you guys with some legal expertise agree with Christo on this point? Do you really think Zimmerman will testify? I hope Christo is right, especially if the case is televised, because that will make extreme drama.

Highly unlikely he'd testify. The 911 tape will come in as will his statements to the police on the night of the shooting. So why expose yourself to cross examination when your story of what happened is already in front of the jury?

This makes sense to me. Hopefully Christo or someone else who disagrees with this will respond.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

BTW, I've read a lot of comments here and elsewhere talking about riots.Links to the riots that have been going on are appreciated. Thanks.

Link to where people said riots were happening.

Yes, that's what I'm looking for. People keep referring to rioting. I want to read the accounts. Thanks.

Can you link me to where someone said that in this thread?

 

[GreatLakesMike]

Christo...would it be considered "ill will" if he was using racially charged labels like "coon" or "*****" etc? Is that what "ill will" means? Sorry for the dumb question, but I find it easier to get answers rather than assume.

The difficulty is linking the thought with the gun shot.Second degree murder: You walk in on your wife having sex with your best friend. He runs. The next day he comes up to you at the golf club to apologize. You grab your 9-iron from your bag and crack him upside the head a few times. It's not first degree murder because it wasn't premeditated. It's not manslaughter because too much time passed between catching him in bed and hitting him. But the act of swinging the club was caused by the ill will you have against him for sleeping with your wife.Let's assume here Zimmerman did call Martin a coon. It occurred several minutes before the gun shot. What happened between the time he said coon and pulled the trigger is very important. If Martin was the one who turned the encounter from verbal to physical, the prosecutor has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that racial animus is what caused Zimmerman to pull the trigger rather than Zimmerman pulling the trigger because Martin was hitting him.

Maybe a dumb question, but I'm reading your post as jury selection means everything?ETA: If racial insults were thrown.

 

[jon_mx]

Christo has stated several times in this thread that Zimmerman must testify in his own behalf. He (Christo) has explained that this is necessary because Zimmerman's defense will be that he acted in self-defense. I am not enough of a legal expert to give an opinion on this, but I can't remember the last time in one of these high-profile cases the accused actually took the stand. Any of you guys with some legal expertise agree with Christo on this point? Do you really think Zimmerman will testify? I hope Christo is right, especially if the case is televised, because that will make extreme drama.

Highly unlikely he'd testify. The 911 tape will come in as will his statements to the police on the night of the shooting. So why expose yourself to cross examination when your story of what happened is already in front of the jury?

This makes sense to me. Hopefully Christo or someone else who disagrees with this will respond.

I think it depends how good of a case the prosecution has. I think he will testify if the case is good.

 

[timschochet]

First important question: will a bond be granted? Make a prediction.

No bond, this has already been decided..

On what basis? Is Zimmerman gonna flee? Is Zimmerman dangerous? Don't see a good argument to be made to deny bail.

I don't even know this for certain. A guy I work with told me he caught an update on his phone today, and it said "second degree murder.. No Bond"

Corey was asked about it, and said "no comment." The defense attorney was also asked, and stated that he would seek a bond. If there is no bond for 2nd degree murder, then I doubt the defense attorney would have stated that he was going to seek it. But who knows if he can get it?

 

[Christo]

Christo...would it be considered "ill will" if he was using racially charged labels like "coon" or "*****" etc? Is that what "ill will" means? Sorry for the dumb question, but I find it easier to get answers rather than assume.

The difficulty is linking the thought with the gun shot.Second degree murder: You walk in on your wife having sex with your best friend. He runs. The next day he comes up to you at the golf club to apologize. You grab your 9-iron from your bag and crack him upside the head a few times. It's not first degree murder because it wasn't premeditated. It's not manslaughter because too much time passed between catching him in bed and hitting him. But the act of swinging the club was caused by the ill will you have against him for sleeping with your wife.Let's assume here Zimmerman did call Martin a coon. It occurred several minutes before the gun shot. What happened between the time he said coon and pulled the trigger is very important. If Martin was the one who turned the encounter from verbal to physical, the prosecutor has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that racial animus is what caused Zimmerman to pull the trigger rather than Zimmerman pulling the trigger because Martin was hitting him.

Maybe a dumb question, but I'm reading your post as jury selection means everything?

It's the most important aspect of every jury trial.

 

[ATC1]

Every part where you enter your opinion.

Unreal. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

You kinda missed my point. What I think (I was clear that I was expressing my opinions in the first post - 'hunch' 'bet' 'I think') has no bearing on his innocence or guilt. And everyone deserves their day in court. Which I also said.

You make it seem like Zimmerman is already guilty before his day in court. We already know you think Martin did absolutely nothing wrong to prevent his death and take comfort in knowing Zimmerman's is already doomed without conviction.

As for 'innocent' - I'm glad we live in a country where the burden is on the state to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone committed a crime before they lock them up. At the same time, to the degree that I care I take some comfort that Zimmerman is going to live with this every day, and deal with it every time he meets someone new for the rest of his life. Just like OJ, I don't care much if he beats the rap - Zimmerman initiated and continued a completely avoidable and pointless encounter that resulted in death of a 17 year old who was minding his OFB and doing nothing wrong.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

You make it seem like Zimmerman is already guilty before his day in court. We already know you think Martin did absolutely nothing wrong to prevent his death and take comfort in knowing Zimmerman's is already doomed without conviction.

'Guilty' is for the court to decide. 'Responsible for senselessly killing a kid who was minding his own business and actually attempted to avoid a confrontation' is my take on events and isn't likely to change unless evidence comes out that things went down radically different than it sounds right now.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Love how the pro-Zimm crowd is backpedaling to "well she had no choice but to charge him now".

there was a pro-zimm crowd in here?I'll take a link...

Do you also have problems finding the ocean when you're on the beach?

If I am on a beach in Arizona, yes.

Sorry...I was using the well known definition of beach in this case.

Interesting

 

[The Commish]

Love how the pro-Zimm crowd is backpedaling to "well she had no choice but to charge him now".

there was a pro-zimm crowd in here?I'll take a link...

Do you also have problems finding the ocean when you're on the beach?

If I am on a beach in Arizona, yes.

Sorry...I was using the well known definition of beach in this case.

Interesting

Learn something?

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I'm glad it's going to trial. Zim may very well have feared for his life to the extent that lethal force was permissible. I don't know. IMO the reason why this thing got so big was because the cops should have made an arrest that night. It wasn't their role to determine whether an affirmative defense was justified under the circumstances. Al Sharpton even said as much today. Which was good coming from him.

My thoughts, however, are that there is some evidence against Zim that we don't know about yet. The fact that she charged second degree murder instead of manslaughter is telling to me as a lawyer (although I'm not a criminal attorney). My understanding is that second degree murder carries 25-life sentence. Under normal circumstances manslaughter carries 10-20, however, in Florida my understanding is that killing a minor and using a gun are both aggravating circumstances that automatically raise the charge to aggravated manslaughter which carries 20-life. Being that manslaughter would be easier to convict on in this case, I have to think there is some damning evidence or forensics out there.

One thing I heard today for the first time was that Zim may suffer from PTSD. If that is the case, his threshold for what makes him fear for his life might be lower, which could be interesting for the case as you find a plaintiff/defendant as they are. Was he in the military?

 

[Underachievers]

Bump.....

Geez...cannot believe that this thread almost made it half way down the page.

 

[timschochet]

So according to the Stand Your Ground law: if Zimmerman is acquitted of this charge, he can then turn around and sue the State of Florida for charging him in the first place? Is that correct?

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

First important question: will a bond be granted? Make a prediction.

No bond, this has already been decided..

On what basis? Is Zimmerman gonna flee? Is Zimmerman dangerous? Don't see a good argument to be made to deny bail.

I don't even know this for certain. A guy I work with told me he caught an update on his phone today, and it said "second degree murder.. No Bond"

Corey was asked about it, and said "no comment." The defense attorney was also asked, and stated that he would seek a bond. If there is no bond for 2nd degree murder, then I doubt the defense attorney would have stated that he was going to seek it. But who knows if he can get it?

It starts out as automatically no bond in Florida apparently. Then they can go before the judge and petition for bond.

 

[jon_mx]

So according to the Stand Your Ground law: if Zimmerman is acquitted of this charge, he can then turn around and sue the State of Florida for charging him in the first place? Is that correct?

That was my take. How will it be if Zimmerman ends up with a huge payday at the end of this?

 

[Charlie Frown]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So according to the Stand Your Ground law: if Zimmerman is acquitted of this charge, he can then turn around and sue the State of Florida for charging him in the first place? Is that correct?

That was my take. How will it be if Zimmerman ends up with a huge payday at the end of this?

Where does it say that? You need to go to court to assert an affirmative defense. You can't just shoot people and always assert self defense and not ever get charged. That's a license to kill. Perhaps the law is poorly written and will end up challenged or amended later.

 

[TexanFan02]

Christo has stated several times in this thread that Zimmerman must testify in his own behalf. He (Christo) has explained that this is necessary because Zimmerman's defense will be that he acted in self-defense. I am not enough of a legal expert to give an opinion on this, but I can't remember the last time in one of these high-profile cases the accused actually took the stand. Any of you guys with some legal expertise agree with Christo on this point? Do you really think Zimmerman will testify? I hope Christo is right, especially if the case is televised, because that will make extreme drama.

Highly unlikely he'd testify. The 911 tape will come in as will his statements to the police on the night of the shooting. So why expose yourself to cross examination when your story of what happened is already in front of the jury?

This makes sense to me. Hopefully Christo or someone else who disagrees with this will respond.

You have to remember that Zimmerman is borderline crazy and has ignored his attorneys advice before. If he WANTS to take the stand, which he probably will, his attorney can't stop him.

 

[TexanFan02]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

Nothing I said is actually in dispute is it?Zimmerman killed someone.I think people who kill someone should be forced to prove self-defense court in most cases.I think Zimmerman is clinically whacked.Based on 'whacked,' I believe it's likely that parts of his story are proved to be lies.I don't believe it's open and shut that he'll beat the rap even in FL, though I think he's got decent shot.Which of those statements are you taking issue with?As for 'innocent' - I'm glad we live in a country where the burden is on the state to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone committed a crime before they lock them up. At the same time, to the degree that I care I take some comfort that Zimmerman is going to live with this every day, and deal with it every time he meets someone new for the rest of his life. Just like OJ, I don't care much if he beats the rap - Zimmerman initiated and continued a completely avoidable and pointless encounter that resulted in death of a 17 year old who was minding his OFB and doing nothing wrong.

Every statement you made which start with 'I think' or 'I believe' are very much in dispute and/or just plain false assertions. I suppose it technically true you may think them, but they are factually incorrect.

And just to clarify Zimm doesn't have to "prove" anything. He is the defendant in this case and it is up to the DA to prove that he committed this crime beyond a reasonable doubt. All he has to do is provide a hint of doubt via a defense.

Well to assert an affirmative defense such as self defense the burden actually falls on the defendant.

 

[jon_mx]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Presumption of innocence is terrible???

 

[The Commish]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

 

[SacramentoBob]

I think we can all agree here that Zimmerman would've made a ####ty police officer.

 

[TexanFan02]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

 

[jon_mx]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

 

[TexanFan02]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

That's normally for a jury to decide. Not just for the police to take the killers word and let him go.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

He confessed to killing an unarmed person. He added in that it was in self defense. Its his word against the evidence.

 

[TexanFan02]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

He confessed to killing an unarmed person. He added in that it was in self defense. Its his word against the evidence.

And in any other state, including Texas, he would have been charged and brought before a jury of his peers. I wonder why John Mx hates America?

 

[jon_mx]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

He confessed to killing an unarmed person. He added in that it was in self defense. Its his word against the evidence.

What evidence shows it was murder?

 

[TexanFan02]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

He confessed to killing an unarmed person. He added in that it was in self defense. Its his word against the evidence.

What evidence shows it was murder?

The dead person. Why do you hate America?

 

[jon_mx]

Zimmerman killed someone - he should have to prove his case in a court of law. Just a hunch based on the fact that Z is almost certainly rowing with one paddle, but I bet there are parts of his story that are just plain false and beating the rap isn't a given even in Florida.

That's not the way it works.

It should be. Terrible law.

Well, in this discussion, it's not the law, it's our system. Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. The charged don't have to "prove" anything in court. That burden falls to the prosecution. That's the point Christo is making.

People who admit to murdering someone aren't presumed innocent. They murdered someone. This law restricts the police from arresting them and letting justice take its course. It's a terrible law.

Who admitted to murder? Murder is the unlawful killing. Self-defense is not unlawful.

He confessed to killing an unarmed person. He added in that it was in self defense. Its his word against the evidence.

And in any other state, including Texas, he would have been charged and brought before a jury of his peers. I wonder why John Mx hates America?

In America each state makes their own laws. Why do you hate America is the more accurate question.