Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch (1 Viewer)

[jonessed]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

 

[Christo]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

 

[identikit]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

 

[jon_mx]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

Just when Tim starts to show some reasoning, he flies off the handle and posts something like this. Simply terrible.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

Just when Tim starts to show some reasoning, he flies off the handle and posts something like this. Simply terrible.

So I'm only reasonable when I agree with you? This is not a case of me relying on reason. We're not in court. Carolina Hustler asked me to link evidence of Zimmerman being racist. There isn't any. This is just something I feel in my gut. It's completely my intuition telling me this.

 

[jon_mx]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

It has nothing to do with proving something in court. You are reaching for any reason to justify your position. An anonymous tipster has no credibility what so ever. Until we know who this person is, how well he knows Zimmerman, and what he is basing his statement on, you can not put one ounce of weight into what was said. Then to go on and misquote what Zimmerman said is simply ridiculous. Just terrible all the way around. There are a lot more character references who put their names out there and have some credibility based on actaully having a known relationship with Zimmerman.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

It has nothing to do with proving something in court. You are reaching for any reason to justify your position. An anonymous tipster has no credibility what so ever. Until you who this person is, how well he knows Zimmerman, and what he is basing his statement on, you can not put one ounce of weight into what was said. Then to go on and misquote what Zimmerman said is simply ridiculous. Just terrible all the way around. There are a lot more character references who put their names out there and have some credibility based on actaully having a known relationship with Zimmerman.

Of course you're welcome to your opinion. I'll stick with mine.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What makes you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

 

[jonessed]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yeah, black garage doors. If those garage doors were white they’d still be open right now because Zimmerman would never have wanted them closed in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What make you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

I don't think there's any evidence that this happened.

 

[jon_mx]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

Just when Tim starts to show some reasoning, he flies off the handle and posts something like this. Simply terrible.

So I'm only reasonable when I agree with you? This is not a case of me relying on reason. We're not in court. Carolina Hustler asked me to link evidence of Zimmerman being racist. There isn't any. This is just something I feel in my gut. It's completely my intuition telling me this.

No, you are reasonable when you base your conclusions on legitimate facts. When this witness explains the basis for his statement, then it will have at least some credibly.

 

[identikit]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yeah, black garage doors. If those garage doors were white they'd still be open right now because Zimmerman would never have wanted them closed in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell.

 

[jon_mx]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What make you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

I don't think there's any evidence that this happened.

The kicking his ### part there is plenty of evidence, and that is what the self-defense claim will rest on.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

So I'm only reasonable when I agree with you? This is not a case of me relying on reason. We're not in court. Carolina Hustler asked me to link evidence of Zimmerman being racist. There isn't any. This is just something I feel in my gut. It's completely my intuition telling me this.

If this is only a gut feeling, then you probably shouldn't say things like this.

He has called in on white kids before, if a white kid was the subject of the call this time, and then started running while Zimmerman was on the phone, I believe Zimmerman would have done the same thing. If the white kid turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him, I believe the outcome would have been the same as well.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What make you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

I don't think there's any evidence that this happened.

Witnesses, doctors reports, photos of injuries, injuries listed in police reports?No evidence?

 

[timschochet]

No, you are reasonable when you base your conclusions on legitimate facts. When this witness explains the basis for his statement, then it will have at least some credibly.

If racism were a crime and I were on a jury weighing whether Zimmerman is a racist, I would find him not guilty of the charge, because there is no evidence to prove it. So in a sense I agree with you. But again, racism is not a crime and we're not in a court of law. My intuition, my gut tells me that this guy is a racist. I can't prove it, and I don't have to prove it. Maybe some evidence will emerge that proves it for me, but right now I'm not aware of it. It's just a feeling I have. If I were to make the argument that, based on this feeling, Zimmerman should be charged with murder and sent to prison, then that would be worthy of ridicule. (In fact, some public persons such as Al Sharpton have made this exact argument, and they deserve all the derision they're getting.) But I am not making that argument, or anything close to it.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What make you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

I don't think there's any evidence that this happened.

Witnesses, doctors reports, photos of injuries, injuries listed in police reports?No evidence?

There is evidence of a fight. There is evidence of injuries suffered by Zimmerman. There is evidence that, at the time of the shooting, Martin may have been on top of Zimmerman. There is no evidence that Martin "jumped on him" or attacked him from behind, as Zimmerman's brother has claimed. We still don't know how this fight started, and we may never know.

 

[timschochet]

if a white kid was the subject of the call this time, and then started running while Zimmerman was on the phone, I believe Zimmerman would have done the same thing. If the white kid turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him, I believe the outcome would have been the same as well.

1. I don't.2. There is no evidence that Martin turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him. I don't understand why you keep repeating this. All we know is that there was a struggle and Zimmerman suffered injuries. That's it. Anything else is conjecture.

 

[Christo]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

You have no idea if this is true.

 

[timschochet]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

You have no idea if this is true.

You have no idea it's not true.

 

[Christo]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

What make you think this?I think if a white kid jumped on him and was beating the #### out of him, he'd have been shot as well.. It's not about color, it's about self defense..

I don't think there's any evidence that this happened.

Witnesses, doctors reports, photos of injuries, injuries listed in police reports?No evidence?

There is evidence of a fight. There is evidence of injuries suffered by Zimmerman. There is evidence that, at the time of the shooting, Martin may have been on top of Zimmerman. There is no evidence that Martin "jumped on him" or attacked him from behind, as Zimmerman's brother has claimed. We still don't know how this fight started, and we may never know.

Link?

 

[identikit]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

You have no idea if this is true.

Knowing what's been reported of Zimmerman's previous activities, we can be very sure that Zimmerman would have followed anyone of any race that he didn't recognize.

Tim makes up things in his head and dumps them out here to support his very narrow viewpoint of the moment.

 

[jon_mx]

if a white kid was the subject of the call this time, and then started running while Zimmerman was on the phone, I believe Zimmerman would have done the same thing. If the white kid turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him, I believe the outcome would have been the same as well.

1. I don't.2. There is no evidence that Martin turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him. I don't understand why you keep repeating this. All we know is that there was a struggle and Zimmerman suffered injuries. That's it. Anything else is conjecture.

Well according to your latest logic, offering up rumor amd cojecture and gut feelings is perfectly fine. In truth, you calling out Zimmerman as a racist is far worse.

 

[Christo]

http://www.msnbc.msn...ocid=ansmsnbc11

An anonymous police tipster, meanwhile, suggested that Zimmerman could be confrontational, especially against black people.

"I don't at all know who this kid was or anything else," the unnamed caller called told police shortly after the shooting. "But I know George, and I know that he does not like black people. He would start something. He's very confrontational. It's in his blood. We'll just say that."

No, this is not evidence of any sort. It doesn't, in my mind, convict Zimmerman of anything and I still believe that, based on what we know, Zimmerman should be acquitted. But if it's true it gives me a better feel about what happened here. I think that if Martin attacked Zimmerman it was because Zimmerman said or did something to cause it to happen. I think Zimmerman at the very least is probably guilty of manslaughter. I think he's a bad guy who should be put away and it would be a shame to see him walk away from this. But unfortunately there appears to be no way to prove it.

You're really going to put more stock in an anonymous caller than in his black neighbors who've PUBLICLY said the opposite?

Yeah. Based on his comment "These ####ers always get away", based on his history of phone calls to the police, I am. But again, it's only a subjective feeling on my part. It doesn't prove anything, and it certainly isn't close to evidence that can be used in court. But that's what I think.

It was "these ### holes always get away".. And that has no racial implications.. Nothing he said was racial at all. If you disagree, please show me otherwise.And his calls in to the police were not only for black people. He called in about people of other races as well.

Hell, he called the police for stuff like open garage doors.tim being tim.

Yep, guess so. And Christo being Christo. And Hustler being Hustler. That's what I think, guys. I'm not trying to prove anything in court. But if Trayvon was a white kid he'd be alive right now because Zimmerman would never have followed him in the first place. I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

You have no idea if this is true.

You have no idea it's not true.

I'm not the one who said it.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

if a white kid was the subject of the call this time, and then started running while Zimmerman was on the phone, I believe Zimmerman would have done the same thing. If the white kid turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him, I believe the outcome would have been the same as well.

1. I don't.2. There is no evidence that Martin turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him. I don't understand why you keep repeating this. All we know is that there was a struggle and Zimmerman suffered injuries. That's it. Anything else is conjecture.

There was a witness that saw Tayvon on top of Zimmerman. We also know that they didn't travel far enough from Zimmerman's vehicle. It's reasonable to assume that Martin either turned back, or lied in wait.. 8 mins pass, and they were still within 200 feet of Zimmerman's vehicle..There is a lot more evidence saying Zimmerman was defending himself then there is saying he is racist. Actually, as you've said, there is no evidence suggesting he was racist. So I'm puzzled as to why you'd ignore the evidence and cling to the racist allegations rather than concede that Zimmerman may have been defending himself..

 

[timschochet]

if a white kid was the subject of the call this time, and then started running while Zimmerman was on the phone, I believe Zimmerman would have done the same thing. If the white kid turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him, I believe the outcome would have been the same as well.

1. I don't.2. There is no evidence that Martin turned back and jumped on Zimmerman and beat the #### out of him. I don't understand why you keep repeating this. All we know is that there was a struggle and Zimmerman suffered injuries. That's it. Anything else is conjecture.

There was a witness that saw Tayvon on top of Zimmerman. We also know that they didn't travel far enough from Zimmerman's vehicle. It's reasonable to assume that Martin either turned back, or lied in wait.. 8 mins pass, and they were still within 200 feet of Zimmerman's vehicle..There is a lot more evidence saying Zimmerman was defending himself then there is saying he is racist. Actually, as you've said, there is no evidence suggesting he was racist. So I'm puzzled as to why you'd ignore the evidence and cling to the racist allegations rather than concede that Zimmerman may have been defending himself..

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

 

[Carolina Hustler]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with[QUOTE='timschochet]I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.
[/QUOTE]

 

[timschochet]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with[QUOTE='timschochet]I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

[/QUOTE]Of course it doesn't. That's why I wrote that one is a possibility and the other is what I think happened. Actually both are possibilities.

 

[Underachievers]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with[QUOTE='timschochet]I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

[/QUOTE]I have to say that, I have no problem giving tim his props in this thread. As more and more info comes out in this story, he has, for the most part, changed his initial opinions when warranted. Not a whole heck of a lot of posters will do that.

 

[SacramentoBob]

Anything new here?

 

[Christo]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with[QUOTE='timschochet]I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

I have to say that, I have no problem giving tim his props in this thread. As more and more info comes out in this story, he has, for the most part, changed his initial opinions when warranted. Not a whole heck of a lot of posters will do that.[/QUOTE]Really? Wasn't his initial position pretty much that he believed Zimmerman is racist and guilty of manslaughter?

 

[timschochet]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with

There were times when I thought he would be found legally guilty. Now I don't. There was a time when I thought that the fact that he was charged meant the prosecution must have something beyond what they've revealed so far. Now I no longer believe that, and I agree with jon_mx that his prosecution is largely political. I hate to acknowledge that. So yes, I have changed my mind quite a bit in this thread. It's nothing that I deserve props for, though.

 

[Christo]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with

There were times when I thought he would be found legally guilty. Now I don't. There was a time when I thought that the fact that he was charged meant the prosecution must have something beyond what they've revealed so far. Now I no longer believe that, and I agree with jon_mx that his prosecution is largely political. I hate to acknowledge that. So yes, I have changed my mind quite a bit in this thread. It's nothing that I deserve props for, though.

Yes, you've flopped around a lot on peripheral issues. And we wasted time discussing your claim that when you said you thought he was guilty you didn't mean guilty in the legal sense. But the question still stands. Wasn't it your initial position that Zimmerman is racist and guilty of manslaughter?

 

[Carolina Hustler]

I have conceded this several times. One has nothing to do with the other. Zimmerman could have been a racist #### and also could have been defending himself. In fact, that's a very distinct possibility in my mind.

Doesn't jive with[QUOTE='timschochet]I think Zimmerman is racist as hell and guilty of manslaughter.

I have to say that, I have no problem giving tim his props in this thread. As more and more info comes out in this story, he has, for the most part, changed his initial opinions when warranted. Not a whole heck of a lot of posters will do that.[/QUOTE]He seems to be open to this other information, yes.. But he's still insisting that Zimmerman was racist and guilty of manslaughter.. When there is no evidence of this whatsoever.. Based on a "gut feeling".. That's ridiculous..

 

[Novice2]

Im hoping this Zimmerman fella gets aquitted for the mere enjoyment i would get from watching the white guilt liberals crying in their seltzer water. Plus, im always up for a good looting/riots on TV.

Stay classy.

So I can put you down on the list of people hoping for riots and looting too? Stay classy.

I'm not hoping it happens, but it's certainly a possibility. It will be made all the worse by some in the media portraying things that are not known as facts. That's how this whole circus got started in the first place.

....... they are just looking for a reason and excuse to loot and riot since they think they are allowed. I mean seriously, who is gonna say anything about it? if you do, well you are a racist

You are a racist for even typing that. I hope the race crusaders find out where you work and demand you get fired!

 

[Carolina Hustler]

Im hoping this Zimmerman fella gets aquitted for the mere enjoyment i would get from watching the white guilt liberals crying in their seltzer water. Plus, im always up for a good looting/riots on TV.

Stay classy.

So I can put you down on the list of people hoping for riots and looting too? Stay classy.

I'm not hoping it happens, but it's certainly a possibility. It will be made all the worse by some in the media portraying things that are not known as facts. That's how this whole circus got started in the first place.

....... they are just looking for a reason and excuse to loot and riot since they think they are allowed. I mean seriously, who is gonna say anything about it? if you do, well you are a racist

You are a racist for even typing that. I hope the race crusaders find out where you work and demand you get fired!

Does seem to be a racist comment actually, assuming "They" refers to black people..Not sure if you're serious, but hoping someone gets fired for what they type on a message board seems pretty extreme..

 

[kentric]

Look above. It's absurd to say that Martin speaking first "started" the encounter when he clearly tried to ditch Zimmerman but Z found him again.

Even with Zimmerman following Martin in the development (where he lived), it was Martin who engaged with Zimmerman first (unless of course you don't believe Martin's GF).

Martin spoke first to ask a guy who's been following him why he was following him. Yeah, that's starting it all right!eta: and if you further believe the gf, Zimmerman made first physical contact.

Her basis for Zimmerman initiating physical contact was that the phone went dead. The phone dying could as easily be attributed to Martin jumping Zimmerman.

 

[kentric]

We don't know exactly what was said, but if Zimmerman didn't physically or verbally threaten Trayvon, Trayvon should not have attacked him..

And here is a real problem for Zimmerman's defense. Yes, as I've written, based on what we know, he should be acquitted. But I still think this is a problem. Why did Trayvon attack him?

Sorry, but it is illogical for me to believe that all Zimmerman did was ask Martin what he was doing there, and Martin responding by knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming him with punches. That just doesn't fly. It doesn't ring true to me, and it won't ring true to a jury. Zimmerman MUST have said something or done something that Martin found threatening. Maybe he didn't mean to. Maybe it was misinterpreted. Or maybe Zimmerman deliberately said or did something threatening, knowing exactly what he was doing. Either way, Zimmerman is covering up something when he claims that he was attacked from behind for no reason whatsoever. Are you willing to admit this?

Its illogical for you to believe Martin jumped Zimmerman, but is it logical to assume Zimmerman jumped Martin? Just on the basis of the injuries sustained by Zimmerman I would have to go with Martin initiating it. That is not to say Zimmerman couldn't have pushed Martin's shoulder or something, but I would think you'd have to at least consider it 50/50.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

But again, racism is not a crime and we're not in a court of law. My intuition, my gut tells me that this guy is a racist. I can't prove it, and I don't have to prove it.

This is pretty much the definition of "prejudice."

 

[timschochet]

We don't know exactly what was said, but if Zimmerman didn't physically or verbally threaten Trayvon, Trayvon should not have attacked him..

And here is a real problem for Zimmerman's defense. Yes, as I've written, based on what we know, he should be acquitted. But I still think this is a problem. Why did Trayvon attack him?

Sorry, but it is illogical for me to believe that all Zimmerman did was ask Martin what he was doing there, and Martin responding by knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming him with punches. That just doesn't fly. It doesn't ring true to me, and it won't ring true to a jury. Zimmerman MUST have said something or done something that Martin found threatening. Maybe he didn't mean to. Maybe it was misinterpreted. Or maybe Zimmerman deliberately said or did something threatening, knowing exactly what he was doing. Either way, Zimmerman is covering up something when he claims that he was attacked from behind for no reason whatsoever. Are you willing to admit this?

Its illogical for you to believe Martin jumped Zimmerman, but is it logical to assume Zimmerman jumped Martin? Just on the basis of the injuries sustained by Zimmerman I would have to go with Martin initiating it. That is not to say Zimmerman couldn't have pushed Martin's shoulder or something, but I would think you'd have to at least consider it 50/50.

I don't think it's logical to assume that either guy "jumped" the other. I think the most likely scenario is that harsh words were spoken and then somebody took the first swing. According to Zimmerman's brother, words were spoken in which Zimmerman said nothing provocative, and then Zimmerman turned around, walked back toward his car, and Martin attacked Zimmerman from behind. Presumably this will be Zimmerman's testimony (though we won't know until he says it himself). I don't believe this, though it's possible.

 

[timschochet]

But again, racism is not a crime and we're not in a court of law. My intuition, my gut tells me that this guy is a racist. I can't prove it, and I don't have to prove it.

This is pretty much the definition of "prejudice."

It's a personal prejudice, yes. I'm not applying it to a group of people, just George Zimmerman.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

But again, racism is not a crime and we're not in a court of law. My intuition, my gut tells me that this guy is a racist. I can't prove it, and I don't have to prove it.

This is pretty much the definition of "prejudice."

It's a personal prejudice, yes. I'm not applying it to a group of people, just George Zimmerman.

That doesn't make it any better.

 

[jon_mx]

We don't know exactly what was said, but if Zimmerman didn't physically or verbally threaten Trayvon, Trayvon should not have attacked him..

And here is a real problem for Zimmerman's defense. Yes, as I've written, based on what we know, he should be acquitted. But I still think this is a problem. Why did Trayvon attack him?

Sorry, but it is illogical for me to believe that all Zimmerman did was ask Martin what he was doing there, and Martin responding by knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming him with punches. That just doesn't fly. It doesn't ring true to me, and it won't ring true to a jury. Zimmerman MUST have said something or done something that Martin found threatening. Maybe he didn't mean to. Maybe it was misinterpreted. Or maybe Zimmerman deliberately said or did something threatening, knowing exactly what he was doing. Either way, Zimmerman is covering up something when he claims that he was attacked from behind for no reason whatsoever. Are you willing to admit this?

Its illogical for you to believe Martin jumped Zimmerman, but is it logical to assume Zimmerman jumped Martin? Just on the basis of the injuries sustained by Zimmerman I would have to go with Martin initiating it. That is not to say Zimmerman couldn't have pushed Martin's shoulder or something, but I would think you'd have to at least consider it 50/50.

Zimmerman knowing he had a gun on himself would be a friggin idiot to get into a fist fight. Martin was pissed that Zimmerman was following him and attacked him. There is no other logical conclusion which can be drawn. No way in hell does anyone enter into a fist fight with a loaded weapon. Tim's logic is so bent against Zimmerman it is unreal. Of course Martin was pissed some jackass was following him around watching him. There is a lot of people on the forum who would have acted the same way.

 

[kentric]

It is silly of the police to speculate that this could have been prevented had Zimmerman stayed in his vehicle. Why not speculate that this could have been prevented had Martin not doubled back to confront Zimmerman and start kicking his ###? There are lots of circumstances that could have prevented the situation from occurring. The hard facts seem to support Zimmerman's version.

http://www.cfnews13.com/content/news/cfnews13/news/article.html/content/news/articles/cfn/2012/5/18/zimmerman_evidence.html

SANFORD --

"Avoidable" -- that's how some investigators described the deadly encounter between George Zimmerman and 17-year-old Trayvon Martin.

After Thursday's release of new documents, photos and other pieces of evidence in the case against Zimmerman, lawyers on both sides have spoken about Florida state prosecutors' findings.

The newly released evidence includes nearly 200 pages of documents, interviews with witnesses and Zimmerman's father, and some intense photos of blood on Zimmerman's head and face shortly after the shooting.

The officers who first investigated the shooting scene said it might not have happened if Zimmerman would have stayed in his car, waited for police and identified himself as a concerned citizen.

But Friday morning, Zimmerman's lawyer, Mark O'Mara, reacted to police statements saying the situation could have been avoided.

"I understand the law enforcement perceptive that this was avoidable -- and quite honesty, in every life event or experience, we can go back to one of the premises and say had it not happened, had he not been going to the target store, had Trayvon Martin not been in the neighborhood had he not gotten out of his car," O'Mara told NBC's "Today" show Friday. "We have to deal with what did happen, and explain that properly and in a courtroom."

There were no clear witness statements among the evidence released Thursday about who started the scuffle between Zimmerman and Martin.

What we do know is that there were just 8½ minutes between the time George Zimmerman first dialed 911 and the moment the fatal shot was fired.

The reports also indicated Martin had traces of THC in his system, a main component in marijuana.

But Benjamin Crump, the Martin family's lawyer who appeared Thursday on CNN's "Piers Morgan Tonight," said that didn't matter.

"What's really relevant is the fact there was no toxicology report done on George Zimmerman," said Crump. "We don't know what else was in his system with the prescribed medicines he was on, to have him get out of his car in the rain and profile, pursue and confront Trayvon Martin, and then kill Trayvon Martin in cold blood, even though he was unarmed. So the trace amounts of marijuana is irrelevant."

According to forensics reports, Zimmerman's DNA was found on the gun, except for the trigger. Another person's DNA was also found on the gun, but experts said could not immediately identify whose it was.

Zimmerman has pleaded not guilty to charges of second-degree murder for Martin's death. His whereabouts have been kept secret after he bonded out of jail in April.

This wasnt like treyvon caught a stray bullitt walking down the street,this was the direct result of a bad decision by zimmerman.

Trayvons decisions play a part as well.

going to a store to buy something shouldnt cost you your life...no matter what

Punching someone in the face and then climbing on top of them, smacking their head against the ground is more likely to cost you your life then getting out of your car because you're in the neighborhood watch program and your trying to look out for your neighbors..

You mean, making sure a stalker is unconscious before you walk away from him? Sorry, if that was me, I'd pound the guy til I was sure he couldn't get up and come after me. That's what all you guys seem to think shouldn't matter. Zimmerman is an armed man stalking a kid, but the kid can't defend himself and make sure he's safe before he lets up.

When you buy a lottery ticket and the numbers don't match its ok to throw the ticket out. Holding onto the ticket and arguing your numbers are the correct numbers when they're not is a lost cause.

 

[kentric]

We don't know exactly what was said, but if Zimmerman didn't physically or verbally threaten Trayvon, Trayvon should not have attacked him..

And here is a real problem for Zimmerman's defense. Yes, as I've written, based on what we know, he should be acquitted. But I still think this is a problem. Why did Trayvon attack him?

Sorry, but it is illogical for me to believe that all Zimmerman did was ask Martin what he was doing there, and Martin responding by knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming him with punches. That just doesn't fly. It doesn't ring true to me, and it won't ring true to a jury. Zimmerman MUST have said something or done something that Martin found threatening. Maybe he didn't mean to. Maybe it was misinterpreted. Or maybe Zimmerman deliberately said or did something threatening, knowing exactly what he was doing. Either way, Zimmerman is covering up something when he claims that he was attacked from behind for no reason whatsoever. Are you willing to admit this?

Its illogical for you to believe Martin jumped Zimmerman, but is it logical to assume Zimmerman jumped Martin? Just on the basis of the injuries sustained by Zimmerman I would have to go with Martin initiating it. That is not to say Zimmerman couldn't have pushed Martin's shoulder or something, but I would think you'd have to at least consider it 50/50.

Zimmerman knowing he had a gun on himself would be a friggin idiot to get into a fist fight. Martin was pissed that Zimmerman was following him and attacked him. There is no other logical conclusion which can be drawn. No way in hell does anyone enter into a fist fight with a loaded weapon. Tim's logic is so bent against Zimmerman it is unreal. Of course Martin was pissed some jackass was following him around watching him. There is a lot of people on the forum who would have acted the same way.

I guess it isn't difficult for me to imagine words escalating to the point where Zimmerman pushes Martin and Martin trounces Zimmerman. I wasn't there and personally don't believe that's how it went down, but I don't think you should close the door on the possibility that Zimmerman initiated physical contact.

 

[jon_mx]

We don't know exactly what was said, but if Zimmerman didn't physically or verbally threaten Trayvon, Trayvon should not have attacked him..

And here is a real problem for Zimmerman's defense. Yes, as I've written, based on what we know, he should be acquitted. But I still think this is a problem. Why did Trayvon attack him?

Sorry, but it is illogical for me to believe that all Zimmerman did was ask Martin what he was doing there, and Martin responding by knocking Zimmerman to the ground and slamming him with punches. That just doesn't fly. It doesn't ring true to me, and it won't ring true to a jury. Zimmerman MUST have said something or done something that Martin found threatening. Maybe he didn't mean to. Maybe it was misinterpreted. Or maybe Zimmerman deliberately said or did something threatening, knowing exactly what he was doing. Either way, Zimmerman is covering up something when he claims that he was attacked from behind for no reason whatsoever. Are you willing to admit this?

Its illogical for you to believe Martin jumped Zimmerman, but is it logical to assume Zimmerman jumped Martin? Just on the basis of the injuries sustained by Zimmerman I would have to go with Martin initiating it. That is not to say Zimmerman couldn't have pushed Martin's shoulder or something, but I would think you'd have to at least consider it 50/50.

Zimmerman knowing he had a gun on himself would be a friggin idiot to get into a fist fight. Martin was pissed that Zimmerman was following him and attacked him. There is no other logical conclusion which can be drawn. No way in hell does anyone enter into a fist fight with a loaded weapon. Tim's logic is so bent against Zimmerman it is unreal. Of course Martin was pissed some jackass was following him around watching him. There is a lot of people on the forum who would have acted the same way.

I guess it isn't difficult for me to imagine words escalating to the point where Zimmerman pushes Martin and Martin trounces Zimmerman. I wasn't there and personally don't believe that's how it went down, but I don't think you should close the door on the possibility that Zimmerman initiated physical contact.

I would not close the door on it, but Zimmerman would have to be a bigger idiot than I already think he is to even think about it.

 

[PinkydaPimp]

Anything new here?

It would be nice if the OP could update the original post with links to new non opinion based evidence/updates.

 

[kentric]

Anything new here?

It would be nice if the OP could update the original post with links to new non opinion based evidence/updates.

Taking off 248 pages would definately make it a quicker read.