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Former KC GM Scott Pioli 2013 NFL draft (1 Viewer)

Bracie Smathers

Footballguy
I'm astonded that Pioli seemingly gave up the goods on how he grades the top underclassmen of the 2013 NFL draft.

He got fired a few weeks ago and doesn't give up how he ranks the Seniors but this is pretty insightful concerning how he grades out the underclassmen of the upcoming draft.

My link

Ex-Chiefs G.M. ranks the top-ten draft-eligible underclassmen

Posted by Evan Silva on January 28, 2013, 12:04 PM EST

Peter King’s latest Monday Morning Quarterback column contains a segment with ex-Chiefs G.M. Scott Pioli where Pioli ranks the top-ten underclassmen available for April’s NFL draft. It’s a rare glimpse into an NFL General Manager’s mindset regarding draft opinions front-office decision makers keep so secret.

Pioli was fired on January 4, but his work on this year’s underclassmen is still relatively fresh. Underclassmen don’t participate in the late-January all-star game circuit. All that is currently available on them is college tape. And Pioli was doing tape and scouting work until his dismissal.

Pioli ranks Texas A&M tackle Luke Joeckel as the top underclassman eligible for the 2013 draft, calling him a “strong candidate” to be selected first overall. Pioli’s former team, of course, holds the No. 1 pick.

Alabama cornerback Dee Milliner, Florida defensive tackle Sharrif Floyd, Florida State defensive end Bjoern Werner, and Ohio State defensive tackle Johnathan Hankins make up the rest of Pioli’s top five.

Alabama running back Eddie Lacy is sixth, and Pioli envisions him as an “every-down back” in the NFL with “low mileage” after playing behind Mark Ingram and Trent Richardson his first two seasons.

Georgia linebacker Jarvis Jones, Cal receiver Keenan Allen, Georgia linebacker Alec Ogletree, and San Diego State tight end Gavin Escobar round out the top ten.

Jones, who is ESPN draft analyst Mel Kiper’s top-rated overall prospect for the 2013 draft, has some concerns, according to Pioli. Pioli calls Jones a potentially “tough positional fit” in the NFL due to tweener-type size and noted that Jones dominated in certain games while disappearing in others.
Jarvis Jones also is reported to have spinal stenosis and he's had neck surgery in the past.I think the above information is a gold mine for anyone trying to project the first round.

We never get this sort of insider information from someone at the top of a front office and since Pioli got fired January 4th his information is probably better than anyone who is renoun for accurate mock drafts out there right now.

 
Here's the link to Peter Kings MMQB snippet with Pioli that gives more information:

My link

The envelope, please, on the top underclassmen in the draft.

I asked former Chiefs GM Scott Pioli, who was in the midst of finalizing the club's preliminary draft board when fired early this month, to examine the record 73 underclass players who declared for the draft and pick the top 10, in his mind. His view of the junior board:

First of all, Jan. 28 is a dangerous time to commit to "top players" in any category, particularly underclassmen. There is still a lot of work to do before we know who and what these players are. Sometimes players look better with less information. NFL rules don't allow teams to officially scout underclassmen during fall campus visits, and scouts can't comment publicly on them either. When scouts go into school visits in the fall, they are not allowed to ask questions about underclassmen when speaking with coaches, trainers and any other support staff. Obviously, scouts and team officials with relationships with coaches or other school officials might glean some information regarding the players prematurely, but the understanding is clear on campuses: We're there to scout the fourth-year players, not anyone younger.

So you might ask, "Well, how do you have an idea about how the underclassmen will be rated so soon after they've declared?" I'll give you an example. I went to Tallahassee this year to scout Florida State prospects. Four other Chiefs' scouts were on campus as well during the year. We all watched tape, and we watched practice. When it comes to defensive end Bjoern Werner, for instance, we obviously saw him stand out on tape and in person. So it's not difficult to understand why he's so highly regarded by NFL teams: Watching Florida State, Werner's production jumps out at you.

This draft may have a record number of underclassmen, but it may not be the quality that people are expecting. How I see the top 10 juniors now, keeping in mind the fact-finding on them will be ongoing for the next three months before the draft:

1. Luke Joeckel, T, Texas A&M. Strong candidate for the first overall pick. Three-year starter at left tackle in the Big 12 and never red-shirted. A true height-weight-speed prospect who plays with good athleticism and body control. Will play early while he develops better hip and core strength. Good teammate too.

2. Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama. One of the youngest players in the draft (20), but a very experienced corner from the best-coached DB group in the country. Milliner has the flexibility, intelligence and experience to play outside corner and also line up in the slot. Should contribute on special teams early in his career.

3. Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida. Also 20, Floyd is a strong, athletic defensive lineman who, at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, has position and scheme versatility. Good competitor and tough player against the run and pass. Not great sack numbers, but consistently disruptive in the pass rush, and the type of player who makes those around him better by making the offense concentrate so much on stopping him.

4. Bjoern Werner, DE, Florida State. Born in Germany, Werner learned football while at a Connecticut prep school as an exchange student. Played just two prep years before signing with Florida State. Two-year starter at left end in FSU's base and sub packages who shows surprising natural instincts, good hand strength and athletic ability. Pretty impressive to see he had 13 sacks in the ACC in the 2012 season.

5. Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State. At 6-3 and 335, he still has the athleticism to line up at multiple positions on the line -- not just at the nose. Active and instinctive, and showed improvement from 2011. Very good player versus the run that needs to continue to improve his every-down consistency.

6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

7. Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia. Began his college career at USC in 2009 and transferred closer to home after suffering a neck injury his true freshman year. Highly instinctive and productive college player, but at 6-3 and 241, could be a tough positional fit. Dominated certain games (Florida), disappeared in others (Alabama).

8. Keenan Allen, WR, Cal. Originally committed to Alabama out of HS, but decided to join his QB brother Zach to play together at Cal. Allen is a big (6-3, 210), savvy and highly competitive WR who has played the slot and outside. Lacks top speed, but is very natural and quick. In a WR class that appears to lack elite players, he may be the best.

9. Alec Ogletree, MLB, Georgia. Tremendously talented athlete at 6-3 and 232, and should be an every-down NFL inside 'backer or middle 'backer. Has the skill and ability to contribute immediately all defenses as well as special teams. Jumps off the tape and could have the most upside of any underclassman in the draft. But some off-the-field issues will need to be studied before giving him a final grade.

10. Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State. Three-year starter who was hampered this season by a knee injury that he played through. Good height-weight-speed prospect at 6-6 and 255 who right now is more receiver than blocker. I'm high on his ability to produce as an offensive tight end right now in the more wide-open NFL offenses. He's what we call an "F-type'' tight end, a receiver who can play off the line probably more productively than as a blocker right now.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
 
The one ranking that really caught my attention was Escobar, Pauline likes him too. SDSU went off my radar after Hillman surprisingly declared last year, so I don't know anything about him.

 
Not surprised to see Lacy so high. I think as the draft gets closer he'll continue to climb draft boards and be the 1st RB taken, and be a 1st rounder.

 
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
 
'Kleck said:
Not surprised to see Lacy so high. I think as the draft gets closer he'll continue to climb draft boards and be the 1st RB taken, and be a 1st rounder.
I think that's been his home since the title game, probably earlier. Someone will trade into the end of day one and pick him as the first back. Doesn't change my evaluation of the talent, but my evaluation doesn't matter about when and where he is picked.
 
'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
Way premature for the Marshawn talk, unfair to judge given his favorable surroundings but fact is he hasn't been the pile pusher that Marshawn is/was. Could he be? Sure, maybe. Hasn't shown he's capable though.
 
'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
Way premature for the Marshawn talk, unfair to judge given his favorable surroundings but fact is he hasn't been the pile pusher that Marshawn is/was. Could he be? Sure, maybe. Hasn't shown he's capable though.
Funny I already think he's better then Lynch.
 
'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
The first think about Lacy that wowed me was his speed. He breaks long runs surprisingly often for a guy his size. I think he is faster than Lynch and makes people miss a lot more than Lynch. Just hard to project anyone being as hard to tackle as Lynch. We'll see.

 
A team might draft Lacy earlier than they should due to him being the clear cut best RB in what appears to be a weak RB draft. I think he happens to be a very good RB in a weak class this year which may cause him to appear better than he is. I don't rate him as elite.

 
Well, yeah, I don't see the Lynch comparisons at all from watching them both in school. Lynch runs with a level of power I never saw from Lacy. Consistently anyway. That's what makes Lynch so special, his ability to run with that level of power multiple times every week. I think it got away from him as the losing took its toll on him in Buffalo, but since midseason 2011 he's ran like a bigger, stronger version of the guy I saw in school.

 
A team might draft Lacy earlier than they should due to him being the clear cut best RB in what appears to be a weak RB draft. I think he happens to be a very good RB in a weak class this year which may cause him to appear better than he is. I don't rate him as elite.
Its not a weak RB class so much as its a middle-heavy RB class. As in, there aren't any difference-makers that will be first rounders at the top (maybe one), but there's VERY solid depth and value that will be drafted between rounds 2-5 that will contribute from day 1 for many teams.
 
I think the dynasty rookie drafts are going to end up even more focussed than normal on situation this year rather than ability/talent.The value train is coming to the second round near you in May 2013Im thinking I might move back from mid 1st to mid 2nd and take a starter for my trouble if I get the chance. Although Lattimore still intrigues me if he lasts until mid/late first.

 
A team might draft Lacy earlier than they should due to him being the clear cut best RB in what appears to be a weak RB draft. I think he happens to be a very good RB in a weak class this year which may cause him to appear better than he is. I don't rate him as elite.
Its not a weak RB class so much as its a middle-heavy RB class. As in, there aren't any difference-makers that will be first rounders at the top (maybe one), but there's VERY solid depth and value that will be drafted between rounds 2-5 that will contribute from day 1 for many teams.
Great post.
 
3. Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida. Also 20, Floyd is a strong, athletic defensive lineman who, at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, has position and scheme versatility. Good competitor and tough player against the run and pass. Not great sack numbers, but consistently disruptive in the pass rush, and the type of player who makes those around him better by making the offense concentrate so much on stopping him.
He just sounds like Amobye Okoye (SP?)
 
4. Bjoern Werner, DE, Florida State. Born in Germany, Werner learned football while at a Connecticut prep school as an exchange student. Played just two prep years before signing with Florida State. Two-year starter at left end in FSU's base and sub packages who shows surprising natural instincts, good hand strength and athletic ability. Pretty impressive to see he had 13 sacks in the ACC in the 2012 season.
Would LOVE him to fall to the Eagles!
 
3. Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida. Also 20, Floyd is a strong, athletic defensive lineman who, at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, has position and scheme versatility. Good competitor and tough player against the run and pass. Not great sack numbers, but consistently disruptive in the pass rush, and the type of player who makes those around him better by making the offense concentrate so much on stopping him.
He just sounds like Amobye Okoye (SP?)
Why do you say that?
 
3. Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida. Also 20, Floyd is a strong, athletic defensive lineman who, at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, has position and scheme versatility. Good competitor and tough player against the run and pass. Not great sack numbers, but consistently disruptive in the pass rush, and the type of player who makes those around him better by making the offense concentrate so much on stopping him.
He just sounds like Amobye Okoye (SP?)
Why do you say that?
I remember him reading about the same way when he came out as well..even down to the age. It was a while ago so maybe I'm misremembering.FWIW, I havent watched Floyd play
 
I remember him reading about the same way when he came out as well..even down to the age. It was a while ago so maybe I'm misremembering.FWIW, I havent watched Floyd play
I have watched a lot of Floyd and didn't watch much Amobi, in college, so I can't say how close they are as prospects. I just find it odd to compare them because Amobi busted. I wouldn't project Floyd to bust and think he is a very good talent. He was likely the most important player on arguably the best defense in the nation.
 
A team might draft Lacy earlier than they should due to him being the clear cut best RB in what appears to be a weak RB draft. I think he happens to be a very good RB in a weak class this year which may cause him to appear better than he is. I don't rate him as elite.
Its not a weak RB class so much as its a middle-heavy RB class. As in, there aren't any difference-makers that will be first rounders at the top (maybe one), but there's VERY solid depth and value that will be drafted between rounds 2-5 that will contribute from day 1 for many teams.
Agreed, which is a big reason why I think it will be a rough year on the rb free agent market. Just get your guy for cheap day two or early day three.
 
If Lacy is as big as listed and tests as expected there's no way he makes it out of the first. Jets, Rams, Steelers and Bengals all well positioned and with a need.

 
If Lacy is as big as listed and tests as expected there's no way he makes it out of the first. Jets, Rams, Steelers and Bengals all well positioned and with a need.
Agree. People think I'm crazy, but I really don't see what makes Trent Richardson elite, that Lacy doesn't also have. I really think that if Richardson and Ingram didn't go to Bama people wouldn't question Lacy. But he is downgraded as a prospect because people find it hard to believe that a school will produce 3-5 1st round RBs in a row. Richardson has a lower center of gravity and could be harder to tackle. But Lacy makes a lot more people miss and is still a load to bring down in his own right. And he doesn't have the knee issues. If Richardson is 100/100 in terms of RB prospects post-Peterson, I don't see an argument for Lacy being less than 95/100. Watching the Mizz/UGA/ND carries, what prospects, including Richardson, have a more impressive span of play?
 
I think Richardson's build and low center of gravity is exactly what gives him a boost in people's subconscious minds, rightly or wrongly. He's the ideal build for a 3-down RB in most people's minds. I'm still working my way through RB cut-ups. Is Lacy very involved in the passing game? That's a big plus for Richardson in PPR leagues.

 
I think Richardson's build and low center of gravity is exactly what gives him a boost in people's subconscious minds, rightly or wrongly. He's the ideal build for a 3-down RB in most people's minds. I'm still working my way through RB cut-ups. Is Lacy very involved in the passing game? That's a big plus for Richardson in PPR leagues.
Richardson had 29 catches as a JR, Lacy had 22. Considering that Lacy was in more of a time split, I'd say it's fair to say he was involved in the passing game just as much as Trent.
 
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'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
Way premature for the Marshawn talk, unfair to judge given his favorable surroundings but fact is he hasn't been the pile pusher that Marshawn is/was. Could he be? Sure, maybe. Hasn't shown he's capable though.
Funny I already think he's better then Lynch.
WTF?Serious Rolltide koolaid drinkin lives here.

 
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I think Richardson's build and low center of gravity is exactly what gives him a boost in people's subconscious minds, rightly or wrongly. He's the ideal build for a 3-down RB in most people's minds. I'm still working my way through RB cut-ups. Is Lacy very involved in the passing game? That's a big plus for Richardson in PPR leagues.
Richardson had 29 catches as a JR, Lacy had 22. Considering that Lacy was in more of a time split, I'd say it's fair to say he was involved in the passing game just as much as Trent.
Right, I know what the numbers say, and that's encouraging for Lacy. But does his skill set warrant it in the pros? In the NFL many teams would need to see him as the best pass-catching back on the roster to use him that way, rather than working in a second back that's more skilled in that area.The Browns can't really afford to invest the resources in a guy who does it better than TRich, but it doesn't really matter because he is skilled in that area and deserves those touches in space.As I haven't seen a lot of Lacy yet (have mostly focused on Randle, Bernard, Jamison, and some lesser guys so far) on tape, I'm wondering if he's particularly skilled in this area, or if he was forced those touches. What do you think? Complete workhorse back, including passing situations?
 
Right, I know what the numbers say, and that's encouraging for Lacy. But does his skill set warrant it in the pros? In the NFL many teams would need to see him as the best pass-catching back on the roster to use him that way, rather than working in a second back that's more skilled in that area.The Browns can't really afford to invest the resources in a guy who does it better than TRich, but it doesn't really matter because he is skilled in that area and deserves those touches in space.As I haven't seen a lot of Lacy yet (have mostly focused on Randle, Bernard, Jamison, and some lesser guys so far) on tape, I'm wondering if he's particularly skilled in this area, or if he was forced those touches. What do you think? Complete workhorse back, including passing situations?
It's hard for me to really say. I don't know what to look for beyond a back catching with his hand and being quick to turn north and south. Beyond that, to me, it seems like the same skills that make someone a good RB would apply. And Lacy did make some nice catches with his hands and is quick in turning up field. I don't think he's Forte, Rice, or Spiller, who all run great deeper routes. But I don't think Richadson belongs in that catagory either.As far as Lacy being a complete 3 down back, I do think he is.
 
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Lacy has shown passing game skills, haven't seen the open field abilities Richardson showed though. Also haven't seen lacy grind out the tough yards in the pile Richardson does though. And lacy does not have a jump cut close to Richardson imho. Lots of skills from Richardson i have never consistently seen from lacy. It's why I think Ingram is a better comp, and that is not a bad thing. Also not a great thing though.

 
Lacy has shown passing game skills, haven't seen the open field abilities Richardson showed though. Also haven't seen lacy grind out the tough yards in the pile Richardson does though. And lacy does not have a jump cut close to Richardson imho. Lots of skills from Richardson i have never consistently seen from lacy. It's why I think Ingram is a better comp, and that is not a bad thing. Also not a great thing though.
I have to disagree with most of this. Lacy did as much in the open field as Richardson did, if not more. His jump cut is top notch and one of the things that really stands out. His footwork is that of a much smaller back. The comparisons that keep getting thrown out are baffling to me (S.Greene, B.Jacobs, M.Ingram). Ingram is a good player and I think he will produce when he gets a chance. But Lacy is bigger, stronger, and faster than Ingram and if he went to another school, we'd never say Ingram when talking about him. The other 2 are beyond my comprehension.
 
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'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
My big question with Lacy is speed. While you say Lynch doesn't wow you with his speed, he ran in the mid 4.4s at the NFL combine. He also showed sme explosiveness with a long jump in the mid 10s as well.If Lacy shows up to the combine and runs in the 4.4s and shows off elite explosion, then I think those sort of comparisons will become valid. Just my opinion, and I certainly know much less than Pioli, but he looks like he is closer to a 4.55 or 4.6 guy from what I have seen.

 
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Lacy has shown passing game skills, haven't seen the open field abilities Richardson showed though. Also haven't seen lacy grind out the tough yards in the pile Richardson does though. And lacy does not have a jump cut close to Richardson imho. Lots of skills from Richardson i have never consistently seen from lacy. It's why I think Ingram is a better comp, and that is not a bad thing. Also not a great thing though.
I have to disagree with most of this. Lacy did as much in the open field as Richardson did, if not more. His jump cut is top notch and one of the things that really stands out. His footwork is that of a much smaller back. The comparisons that keep getting thrown out are baffling to me (S.Greene, B.Jacobs, M.Ingram). Ingram is a good player and I think he will produce when he gets a chance. But Lacy is bigger, stronger, and faster than Ingram and if he went to another school, we'd never say Ingram when talking about him. The other 2 are beyond my comprehension.
I definitely agree the Greene and Jacobs comps are horrendous. That's l bells game, not lacy.
 
'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
My big question with Lacy is speed. While you say Lynch doesn't wow you with his speed, he ran in the mid 4.4s at the NFL combine. He also showed sme explosiveness with a long jump in the mid 10s as well.If Lacy shows up to the combine and runs in the 4.4s and shows off elite explosion, then I think those sort of comparisons will become valid. Just my opinion, and I certainly know much less than Pioli, but he looks like he is closer to a 4.55 or 4.6 guy from what I have seen.
Doug Martin ran a 4.55 last year and I can remember some people getting concerned about his speed after he ran that time. Obviously that was a non issue and I don't see it being a problem for lacy either. I don't think he is a 4.40 guy, but I also don't think he needs to be one to be successful at the next level.
 
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'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
My big question with Lacy is speed. While you say Lynch doesn't wow you with his speed, he ran in the mid 4.4s at the NFL combine. He also showed sme explosiveness with a long jump in the mid 10s as well.If Lacy shows up to the combine and runs in the 4.4s and shows off elite explosion, then I think those sort of comparisons will become valid. Just my opinion, and I certainly know much less than Pioli, but he looks like he is closer to a 4.55 or 4.6 guy from what I have seen.
Doug Martin ran a 4.55 last year and I can remember some people getting concerned about his speed after he ran that time. Obviously that was a non issue and I don't see it being a problem for lacy either. I don't think he is a 4.40 guy, but I also don't think he needs to be one to be successful at the next level.
Fighting the urge to get on my combine numbers are borderline worthless soapbox...
 
A team might draft Lacy earlier than they should due to him being the clear cut best RB in what appears to be a weak RB draft. I think he happens to be a very good RB in a weak class this year which may cause him to appear better than he is. I don't rate him as elite.
I don't think he's elite but he's looks like he'll be a very good NFL back. If he gets drafted into a good situation he'll be the consensus 1.01 pick.
 
'Donnybrook said:
'Bracie Smathers said:
6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

Pioli will be doing some work for NBC Sports Network at the Super Bowl.
That has to be the most contraversal ranking. I started watching Lacy more. He reminds me of Marshaun Lynch. He doesn't wow you with speed but he is strong, makes good moves and has vision.
My big question with Lacy is speed. While you say Lynch doesn't wow you with his speed, he ran in the mid 4.4s at the NFL combine. He also showed sme explosiveness with a long jump in the mid 10s as well.If Lacy shows up to the combine and runs in the 4.4s and shows off elite explosion, then I think those sort of comparisons will become valid. Just my opinion, and I certainly know much less than Pioli, but he looks like he is closer to a 4.55 or 4.6 guy from what I have seen.
Doug Martin ran a 4.55 last year and I can remember some people getting concerned about his speed after he ran that time. Obviously that was a non issue and I don't see it being a problem for lacy either. I don't think he is a 4.40 guy, but I also don't think he needs to be one to be successful at the next level.
Fighting the urge to get on my combine numbers are borderline worthless soapbox...
They aren't worthless but they need to be looked at as a package. Martin performed very well except in the 40 - and a 4.55 isn't bad for a 220+ lb. RB anyway.
 
Doug Martin ran a 4.55 last year and I can remember some people getting concerned about his speed after he ran that time. Obviously that was a non issue and I don't see it being a problem for lacy either. I don't think he is a 4.40 guy, but I also don't think he needs to be one to be successful at the next level.
I agree. I think 4.50 would be a solid time for him. He had plenty of long runs and is clearly very fast for his size, at the very least.
 
I figured that Lacy being listed in Pioli's top-ten underclassmen list would generate some discussion especially on a FF board and it has but I am also curious about some of the names listed that aren't or haven't been listed in some early mocks and aren't the apple of the fantasy community.

Here's Pioli's top-ten underclassmen list again.

'Bracie Smathers said:
1. Luke Joeckel, T, Texas A&M. Strong candidate for the first overall pick. Three-year starter at left tackle in the Big 12 and never red-shirted. A true height-weight-speed prospect who plays with good athleticism and body control. Will play early while he develops better hip and core strength. Good teammate too.

2. Dee Milliner, CB, Alabama. One of the youngest players in the draft (20), but a very experienced corner from the best-coached DB group in the country. Milliner has the flexibility, intelligence and experience to play outside corner and also line up in the slot. Should contribute on special teams early in his career.

3. Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida. Also 20, Floyd is a strong, athletic defensive lineman who, at 6-foot-3 and 303 pounds, has position and scheme versatility. Good competitor and tough player against the run and pass. Not great sack numbers, but consistently disruptive in the pass rush, and the type of player who makes those around him better by making the offense concentrate so much on stopping him.

4. Bjoern Werner, DE, Florida State. Born in Germany, Werner learned football while at a Connecticut prep school as an exchange student. Played just two prep years before signing with Florida State. Two-year starter at left end in FSU's base and sub packages who shows surprising natural instincts, good hand strength and athletic ability. Pretty impressive to see he had 13 sacks in the ACC in the 2012 season.

5. Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State. At 6-3 and 335, he still has the athleticism to line up at multiple positions on the line -- not just at the nose. Active and instinctive, and showed improvement from 2011. Very good player versus the run that needs to continue to improve his every-down consistency.

6. Eddie Lacy, RB, Alabama. Low-mileage rusher (355 carries in three seasons with the Tide) who played behind two outstanding backs early in his career (Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson). Averaged 6.8 yards per rush in his college career behind an offensive line better than some NFL lines. Good receiving skills, and a willing blocker. He should be an every-down back in the NFL.

7. Jarvis Jones, OLB, Georgia. Began his college career at USC in 2009 and transferred closer to home after suffering a neck injury his true freshman year. Highly instinctive and productive college player, but at 6-3 and 241, could be a tough positional fit. Dominated certain games (Florida), disappeared in others (Alabama).

8. Keenan Allen, WR, Cal. Originally committed to Alabama out of HS, but decided to join his QB brother Zach to play together at Cal. Allen is a big (6-3, 210), savvy and highly competitive WR who has played the slot and outside. Lacks top speed, but is very natural and quick. In a WR class that appears to lack elite players, he may be the best.

9. Alec Ogletree, MLB, Georgia. Tremendously talented athlete at 6-3 and 232, and should be an every-down NFL inside 'backer or middle 'backer. Has the skill and ability to contribute immediately all defenses as well as special teams. Jumps off the tape and could have the most upside of any underclassman in the draft. But some off-the-field issues will need to be studied before giving him a final grade.

10. Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State. Three-year starter who was hampered this season by a knee injury that he played through. Good height-weight-speed prospect at 6-6 and 255 who right now is more receiver than blocker. I'm high on his ability to produce as an offensive tight end right now in the more wide-open NFL offenses. He's what we call an "F-type'' tight end, a receiver who can play off the line probably more productively than as a blocker right now.
OT Luke Joeckel is listed near or at the top of many early mocks so even though he's not a fantasy option he's been discussed and has been listed in early mocks.CD Dee Millilner has also been listed consistently as a top-ten pick in many early mocks but he hasn't been discussed a lot and doesn't seem that people are in love or hate with him but I think he's an interesting guy and we'll hear more about him in the upcoming months before the draft.

Sharrif Floyd, DT, Florida is a guy who hasn't been discussed much and he hasn't been seen EARLY in many mocks to date. I think he's a guy who should be disccused more. Utah DT Star Lotuleilei is widely seen in the top-five but Sharrif hasn't. If Pioli has him as his third best underclassmen then I'm sure mocks around the country will start to have him rise up their boards. I'm curious to hear more about this particular guy since he hasn't been part of many mocks to date.

DE Bjoern Werner has been discussed and he's been consistently listed high on many early mocks.

Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State is yet another DT who hasn't generated much discussion and he hasn't been seen in many or any early mocks as a top-ten pick but according to Pioli he might be a high enough selection to make it into the top-ten.

Lacy and Jarvis Jones have been discussed. Lacy hasn't been listed as a high selection in many early mocks and this is a fantasy forum so the bulk of the discussion has understandably revoled around him and Jones is atop Kiper's mock and he's been listed high in many early mocks but Pioli raises some concerns and I feel he may slide.

Keenan Allen, WR, Cal is a fantasy guy and he's not been listed in many early mocks so I thought he'd generate more discussion but :tumbleweed: so far. The Lacy talk has been interesting so I'd be interested in hearing more on Allen.

Alec Ogletree, MLB, Georgia hasn't been listed high on most early mocks and its safe to say that he won't be a top-ten pick but I find it interesting that Pioli gave him a mention. I don't know much about him or what system Ogletree is a good fit or even what position he might fit in.

Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego State, I've heard this is a good TE draft but this was the first mention I had heard of this guy. How high in the draft does he go and who might take him seem to be logical fantasy topics.

Getting this sort of information from a GM about the top underclassmen hasn't ever happened to my knowledge and I think other names listed deserve more attention.

Any thoughts on the other guys who made it on Pioli's top-ten underclassmen list? The Lacy discussion has been interesting to follow but I'm curious to hear more about the other top underclassmen prospects on Pioli's list.

 
I cannot recall if a GM ever did this before. This seems like the kind of information that would be the property of the football team and a non disclosure agreement would be in place. Either in writing or just as good taste. But I guess not.Right away the mention of Ogletree further confirmed my suspicion that he will be the 1st MLB taken in the draft. While he may not be a top 10 pick I do not see him lasting to the 20's. Which is too bad as I think he would be a great player for the Vikings. I think if Teo's stock had not been damaged that perhaps Ogletree might have been the 2nd or 3rd MLB but I pretty much expect him to the 1st one now.Floyd is a player who has been rising for the past couple weeks in things I have been reading. At first I was seeing Floyd being mocked as the Vikings 2nd round pick (52) then more recently as their 1st round pick (23). There seems to be 5 or more 1st round DT prospects and Floyd is one of them. Hankins was/is? considered by some a possible top 5 pick and is the only DT I have been reading about who might be able to compete with Star Lotulelei for being the top DT taken. Richardson was talked about as a 1st rounder but I didn't see any lists with him in the top 10 like I saw a few with Hankins. At least that is how I was seeing it before the senior bowl. I look at CBS list just now and I see it has pretty significantly changed in the past day or 2 with both Floyd, Richardson and Jesse Williams now ranked ahead of Hankins. The high grade for Escobar is perhaps the most eye opening because almost all the scouting services and mocks have juniors Eartz and Eifert ahead of him. That is something that makes me question how up to date this list from Pioli actually is.

 
Am I the only one who sees that this is his top 10 underclassmen, not a top 10 all players list?As for Lacy, he will be as good as the line blocking for him lets him be. Right situation, I could easily see 1400 total yards. Wrong situation, hopeful to get 500 total yards. Put him in Minnesota and he runs rampant. Arizona and he looks like Beanie Wells.RBs just aren't that important guys. Talent almost never trumps situation except in the most rare of circumstances (ADP, Sanders, OJ). He's a nice looking player coming out. Just like Alfred Morris, Arian Foster, and countless others.

 
Keenan Allen, WR, Cal is a fantasy guy and he's not been listed in many early mocks so I thought he'd generate more discussion but :tumbleweed: so far. The Lacy talk has been interesting so I'd be interested in hearing more on Allen.
Allen's been discussed pretty heavily in the 2013 Draft-Eligible Prospects thread. The general consensus is that he's a pretty solid prospect, maybe not a AJ Green or Julio Jones level fantasy guy, but will probably turn into a good possession receiver.
 
Keenan Allen, WR, Cal is a fantasy guy and he's not been listed in many early mocks so I thought he'd generate more discussion but :tumbleweed: so far. The Lacy talk has been interesting so I'd be interested in hearing more on Allen.
Allen's been discussed pretty heavily in the 2013 Draft-Eligible Prospects thread. The general consensus is that he's a pretty solid prospect, maybe not a AJ Green or Julio Jones level fantasy guy, but will probably turn into a good possession receiver.
One thing I was interested in was how WR Keenan Allen compares to last year's supplemental pick WR Josh Gordon.Cleveland took some heat for the pick but Gordon turned out to be a very good young reciever so the criticism subsided but I was wondering how well Josh would stack up against the top WRs from this class.

It doesn't look like a very good WR class and Allen is the top rated WR I've seen so I was wondering how WR Keenan Allen compares with WR Josh Gordon.

Also if WR Josh Gordon were available in this draft class I am wondering how high he'd go in this draft class. This class does't seem to be very strong or deep so I am curious where he might have gone in this draft.

It seems he would go in the first round and probably pretty high so it looks like a good value but I'm curious where people would put him in this draft class.

 
Keenan Allen, WR, Cal is a fantasy guy and he's not been listed in many early mocks so I thought he'd generate more discussion but :tumbleweed: so far. The Lacy talk has been interesting so I'd be interested in hearing more on Allen.
Allen's been discussed pretty heavily in the 2013 Draft-Eligible Prospects thread. The general consensus is that he's a pretty solid prospect, maybe not a AJ Green or Julio Jones level fantasy guy, but will probably turn into a good possession receiver.
One thing I was interested in was how WR Keenan Allen compares to last year's supplemental pick WR Josh Gordon.Cleveland took some heat for the pick but Gordon turned out to be a very good young reciever so the criticism subsided but I was wondering how well Josh would stack up against the top WRs from this class.

It doesn't look like a very good WR class and Allen is the top rated WR I've seen so I was wondering how WR Keenan Allen compares with WR Josh Gordon.

Also if WR Josh Gordon were available in this draft class I am wondering how high he'd go in this draft class. This class does't seem to be very strong or deep so I am curious where he might have gone in this draft.

It seems he would go in the first round and probably pretty high so it looks like a good value but I'm curious where people would put him in this draft class.
This WR class is all over the place, really. It will be really important to see where the NFL thinks these guys should go. I think Gordon on par with just about anyone in the class. I think he belongs in there with Hunter/Patterson, in terms of phisical skills. All 3 are raw, but very talented.

 

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