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Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory...NERDS already ruining a series that hasn't started (6 Viewers)

shadyridr said:
The tv show is a drama and like it or not Sam and Gilly have been a major part of this drama for a long time and they are one of the few "good" guys on the show. The point was finally to get some background info on the family of Sam. If the whole point was to introduce another Valerian sword into the mix it could have been done countless other ways without introducing Sams family or even using Sam as a conduit.
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We'll just have to disagree. I think his family was the plot device and the sword the point. They spent as much time on describing that sword as they did on actual substance of the family, which was really just about how much of a #### his dad was. We already knew that. Feel free to let me know if I missed something new about his family background aside from the sword. 

They've been so big on Valyrian steel throughout the show that I almost can't imagine them just randomly introducing more swords without key characters like Sam. They even spent screen time having Tywin melt down Ned's sword to make the two he gave out.

 
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shadyridr said:
Who said that was the whole point of last night's story with him?
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I just did. 

We knew his dad was a ####, we knew that Sam kinda sorta acts like a man at the end but isn't confrontational, and that Gilly loves him and will stick up for him and tell him that he is more than what people think of him.  Sure, we get proof his dad was a #### and see his home, but the main thing that came out of that is now: 1. Sam has in his possession one of the few things that can kill White Walkers, and 2. the supposed point of that stop was to drop off the fam to the fam so he can study which now can't happen.  My take is more likely than not he has to get back up to the wall so the sword is there for the battle, and that is his best shot at being safe if daddy comes after him. 

 
thecatch said:
Sam also took another half step into not being a total ##### which is interesting and probably important for his character. 
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I would have agreed with this more if he stood up to his family face to face or at least raised his voice to his father.  Instead the ladies did, and he was a half a tick away from leaving them behind. 

 
KarmaPolice said:
I would have agreed with this more if he stood up to his family face to face or at least raised his voice to his father.  Instead the ladies did, and he was a half a tick away from leaving them behind. 
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 agreed, which is why I downgraded it to a half a step. But ultimately taking responsibility for his family and stealing the sword is a big act of rebellion that previous iterations of Sam would have never contemplated. 

 
thecatch said:
 agreed, which is why I downgraded it to a half a step. But ultimately taking responsibility for his family and stealing the sword is a big act of rebellion that previous iterations of Sam would have never contemplated. 
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Fair enough.  In one step it might be breaking a request from Jon to go to the Citadel and giving the finger to his family on the way out.  Season 1 Sam would not have done that - agreed. 

 
The Duff Man said:
I thought the Dany scene was redundant. 

Last episode:. Are you with me? YES!!!

This episode: No are you REALLY with me? YES!!

She might as well have put her hand to her ear ala Hulk Hogan. 
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To all my freaks out there! Big Poppa Pump is your hookup. Holler... If you hear me! 

 
You ####### nerds.

It's episode 6 and they showed Sam puking on the ship for like 3 minutes and maybe 10 minutes with moms and pops. "The 4% total of that show really bugged me. I'm gonna ##### about it on a message board because we only have 3x more episodes."

You ####### nerds.

 
strykerpks said:
You ####### nerds.

It's episode 6 and they showed Sam puking on the ship for like 3 minutes and maybe 10 minutes with moms and pops. "The 4% total of that show really bugged me. I'm gonna ##### about it on a message board because we only have 3x more episodes."

You ####### nerds.
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Look, BearsDood69 from the internet knows a helluva lot more about where this show is going and Sam's role in it much more than Martin or the show's producers.

 
Don't understand the Dany complaints. When she talked to Dothraki before about crossing the sea, they laughed at and ignored her...and she was already leading those Dothraki. They spent what...three minutes?....on her, and showed how she has FURTHER captured them such that now they WILL cross the ocean for her. It was THREE FRIGGING MINUTES, had some great CGI, AND advanced her story..it was NOT more of the same ole same ole.

 
Truly don't understand most of the complaints, period. Its a great show. If you want to nitpick TWD, or something like that, fine. But this is a crazy high quality show. Not saying its perfect, but the acting is so great that I'm not sure I've ever been bored by a scene or really disliked a choice the writers have made. I just get immersed and go with it, and its crazy entertaining. Even the more "boring", slow plotlines with lesser characters are still great TV. 

I see morons proclaiming in some tv show threads that Justified is one of the great recent tv shows....####### really? And yet GoT gets nitpicked to death because we're so spoiled with quality on this show. 

 
Littlefinger had a goal of taking the Knights of the Vale to Winterfell after the battle between the Boltons and Stannis and defeating the worn down victor and declaring himself warden of the north. That still his goal now? Only instead of Stannis it is Jon and Sansa?

 
Quez said:
Doesn't Jaquen still owe Arya 1 more kill? 
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I didn't think so.  I though he didn't want to do the last kill she asked of him, so she told him to kill himself and he caved in and honored her original request.  That was a while back though...

 
Deepster said:
I didn't think so.  I though he didn't want to do the last kill she asked of him, so she told him to kill himself and he caved in and honored her original request.  That was a while back though...
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She unnamed Jaqen H'ghar if he would help her and Gendry / Hot Pie escape Harrenhal.  Which he did (killed at least 3 guards near the gate)

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Sam figures out how to duplicate the sword to make many more. Or melt it down into arrows or something
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This. 

Though I will say the 30 mins of Fat Sam storyline was totally not worth that bit of plot movement. I realize they're setting him up to rise above and become a huge hero, but that segment of the show was a snoozefest. 

 
renesauz said:
Don't understand the Dany complaints. When she talked to Dothraki before about crossing the sea, they laughed at and ignored her...and she was already leading those Dothraki. They spent what...three minutes?....on her, and showed how she has FURTHER captured them such that now they WILL cross the ocean for her. It was THREE FRIGGING MINUTES, had some great CGI, AND advanced her story..it was NOT more of the same ole same ole.
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Complainers gonna complain.

 
I am trying to figure out Margery's angle here. There is no reason to believe that she really broke and is in the Sparrow's camp having turned Tommen. Now, obviously Tommen is turned because he is easily swayed but though it may have helped her and her brother out (though that was not clear)- now what?

The Sparrow is just playing the master chess players like Cercei and Olenna like newbs.

 
renesauz said:
Don't understand the Dany complaints. When she talked to Dothraki before about crossing the sea, they laughed at and ignored her...and she was already leading those Dothraki. They spent what...three minutes?....on her, and showed how she has FURTHER captured them such that now they WILL cross the ocean for her. It was THREE FRIGGING MINUTES, had some great CGI, AND advanced her story..it was NOT more of the same ole same ole.
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Nothing inspires a calvary more then seeing  your leader riding a flying fire breathing Dragon 

 
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I have to figure that Sam won't be the one wielding Heartsbane, but someone else will.  If he heads to Kings Landing still, who are some likely candidates that can be effective with it against White Walkers?  Possible candidates:

  • FrankenMountain
  • Bronn (just mentioned again this episode...I miss that guy)
  • Loras (if he gets his #### together...he was supposed to be a pretty awesome knight, right?)
  • The Hound (if he turns up alive still)
  • If Dany gets to Kings Landing in time, one of her main guys could use it
  • Obviously there are lots of good fighters out there, but many aren't at KL or don't seem to have plans to be there so I didn't include Blackfish, Benjin, Jaqen, Thoros, etc.
Any other ones I might be missing?

 
Chadstroma said:
I am trying to figure out Margery's angle here. There is no reason to believe that she really broke and is in the Sparrow's camp having turned Tommen. Now, obviously Tommen is turned because he is easily swayed but though it may have helped her and her brother out (though that was not clear)- now what?

The Sparrow is just playing the master chess players like Cercei and Olenna like newbs.
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He's been one step ahead of them the whole time.

I'm also trying to figure out Margaery's angle because she's clearly got one. It's one thing for her to work the Sparrow but what she's doing is at odds with Olenna and that's something she's never done before. 

 
bagger said:
With Jamie going north to River Run with his valerian steel sword, Arya likely going to the north with hers, and Sam joining as well, they are setting up all of the most important weapons in the realm to be at the exact spot needed most, to repel the white walkers.
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Jamie joining Jon's side at some point would be kinda cool in my opinion. His story has been on the road to redemption for some time now.   

 
strykerpks said:
You ####### nerds.

It's episode 6 and they showed Sam puking on the ship for like 3 minutes and maybe 10 minutes with moms and pops. "The 4% total of that show really bugged me. I'm gonna ##### about it on a message board because we only have 3x more episodes."

You ####### nerds.
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Holy overreaction. You can continue to have your weekly parties with the rest of the drama club and post your reactions on youtube. Relax a little bit and breathe, nobody's dragging your baby through a stream. #GorillaLivesMatter

 
Chadstroma said:
No. She had him kill the tickler guy, the Lannister Lord and then the third was the whole bunch of Lannister soldiers so they could escape.
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Not really. The request she made of him was for help escaping - not "would you kill x". He killed those soldiers as a means of helping her escape and he helped her escape because she named him as her third kill and she wouldn't take it back unless he agreed to help. I dunno - I think she has her third kill left since she never made a specific request for those guards to be killed - only for help escaping.

 
Margaery's loyalty is to her family above all else....maybe even above her husband. this show has shown us that sitting on the Iron Throne almost guarantees an unhappy ending, and for that reason i think Tommen's time is short.

i could see a scenario where there's another regicide at her (or Loras'?) hand, taking the Sparrow and his dudes by surprise and usurping whatever power they've been able to cull so far. alternatively, maybe Cerci gets her trial by combat with FrankenMountain going 1v1 against Tommen, thereby ratcheting up the tension between mother & son & wife.

 
packersfan said:
Chadstroma said:
I am trying to figure out Margery's angle here. There is no reason to believe that she really broke and is in the Sparrow's camp having turned Tommen. Now, obviously Tommen is turned because he is easily swayed but though it may have helped her and her brother out (though that was not clear)- now what?

The Sparrow is just playing the master chess players like Cercei and Olenna like newbs.
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He's been one step ahead of them the whole time.

I'm also trying to figure out Margaery's angle because she's clearly got one. It's one thing for her to work the Sparrow but what she's doing is at odds with Olenna and that's something she's never done before. 
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Margaery has an angle, but it may be shorter term. I think priority #1 was to get Loras out of there and #2 was to get herself back as the queen. After that, she might be playing it by ear. That said, there is an off chance that #1 was the only goal and that she is in fact getting her religion. Agreed on the Sparrow, he's way ahead. I think Olenna is a pretty solid player, but Cersei is playing with too much emotion lately that she didn't even know Tommen was hanging out with the Sparrow.

 
T J said:
Not really. The request she made of him was for help escaping - not "would you kill x". He killed those soldiers as a means of helping her escape and he helped her escape because she named him as her third kill and she wouldn't take it back unless he agreed to help. I dunno - I think she has her third kill left since she never made a specific request for those guards to be killed - only for help escaping.
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Maybe but the conversation went something like...

"help me escape"

"That would require more than 1 more death"

"So? Help me escape"

"No. Name one name"

"You"

"please un name me"

"not unless you help me escape"

"fine."

Goes and kills a bunch of Lannister soldiers. Later, Gendry was giving her grief like "you could have ended this whole war by naming Joffrey, etc and you did what?" Their perspective was her three names were fulfilled. :shrug:   So, maybe you have a technicality to work from but I am thinking no.

 
packersfan said:
Chadstroma said:
I am trying to figure out Margery's angle here. There is no reason to believe that she really broke and is in the Sparrow's camp having turned Tommen. Now, obviously Tommen is turned because he is easily swayed but though it may have helped her and her brother out (though that was not clear)- now what?

The Sparrow is just playing the master chess players like Cercei and Olenna like newbs.
Click to expand...
He's been one step ahead of them the whole time.

I'm also trying to figure out Margaery's angle because she's clearly got one. It's one thing for her to work the Sparrow but what she's doing is at odds with Olenna and that's something she's never done before. 
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I got the sense that she was trying to undermine the Lannisters by sinking the their monarchy/reign... somehow. Not sure how that plays out, especially considering she's tied to them- but that was my knee-jerk reaction to her move.

Definitely could be that she played the only card she could think of, not realizing that troops were on their way to save her (as somebody else posted above).

 
Quint said:
Margaery's loyalty is to her family above all else....maybe even above her husband. this show has shown us that sitting on the Iron Throne almost guarantees an unhappy ending, and for that reason i think Tommen's time is short.

i could see a scenario where there's another regicide at her (or Loras'?) hand, taking the Sparrow and his dudes by surprise and usurping whatever power they've been able to cull so far. alternatively, maybe Cerci gets her trial by combat with FrankenMountain going 1v1 against Tommen, thereby ratcheting up the tension between mother & son & wife.
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Why in Seven Hells would Tommen enter the trial by combat?

 
El Floppo said:
I got the sense that she was trying to undermine the Lannisters by sinking the their monarchy/reign... somehow. Not sure how that plays out, especially considering she's tied to them- but that was my knee-jerk reaction to her move.

Definitely could be that she played the only card she could think of, not realizing that troops were on their way to save her (as somebody else posted above).
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Yeah that could be. Maybe she didn't realize Grandma and Cersei would join forces to try and kick the Sparrow's ### although that was the obvious conclusion she should've seen coming. I'm guessing the Sparrow knew it was gonna happen at some point which is why he was working the kid so hard.  

 
stbugs said:
Margaery has an angle, but it may be shorter term. I think priority #1 was to get Loras out of there and #2 was to get herself back as the queen. After that, she might be playing it by ear. That said, there is an off chance that #1 was the only goal and that she is in fact getting her religion. Agreed on the Sparrow, he's way ahead. I think Olenna is a pretty solid player, but Cersei is playing with too much emotion lately that she didn't even know Tommen was hanging out with the Sparrow.
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Olenna has been a pretty shrewd player but she's been outwitted by the Sparrow at every turn so far. He's been one step ahead of everyone. At some point someone is gonna get the drop on him. Maybe it's gonna be Margaery but it doesn't appear it's gonna be Olenna, Cersei or Jamie.   

 
Chadstroma said:
Why in Seven Hells would Tommen enter the trial by combat?
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some bit of misplaced hubris?

Margaery goads him into it via some bit about protecting his new religion?

Sparrow goads him into it for a similar reason, knowing that w/out a king in place he and his group can assume more power (coupled with his belief that Margaery is still in his pocket and won't go against him)?

just spitballin here.

 
Quint said:
Margaery's loyalty is to her family above all else....maybe even above her husband. this show has shown us that sitting on the Iron Throne almost guarantees an unhappy ending, and for that reason i think Tommen's time is short.

i could see a scenario where there's another regicide at her (or Loras'?) hand, taking the Sparrow and his dudes by surprise and usurping whatever power they've been able to cull so far. alternatively, maybe Cerci gets her trial by combat with FrankenMountain going 1v1 against Tommen, thereby ratcheting up the tension between mother & son & wife.
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He's a decent kid. For that reason alone he seems almost guaranteed to die a horrible death.

 
packersfan said:
Olenna has been a pretty shrewd player but she's been outwitted by the Sparrow at every turn so far. He's been one step ahead of everyone. At some point someone is gonna get the drop on him. Maybe it's gonna be Margaery but it doesn't appear it's gonna be Olenna, Cersei or Jamie.   
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What has Olenna done so far where she was outwitted outside of the scene we just saw? Isn't that her first real effort to get Margaery out? Cersei obviously has been outwitted based on what she had to do in punishment and losing Tommen so easily. I'd say the Sparrow has outwitted Tommen the most, then Cersei, then Jamie, then Olenna and then Margaery. I put Margaery last as she was able to get out of her predicament on her own without doing the walk of shame.

 
packersfan said:
He's a decent kid. For that reason alone he seems almost guaranteed to die a horrible death.
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Decent usually means short life span on the show but he is massively naïve and lacking a healthy amount of suspicion of others as well even after both of his siblings have been poisoned to death. I mean, if my other siblings were killed with poison, I would be all kinds of paranoid. Tommen on the other hand takes everything everyone says to him at face value. Poor lil' guy. I doubt he makes it out of this season.

 
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