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Koya

Koya

Footballguy
I am an unabashed Giants fan. This year so far has been awesome (and trust me, last year started off nicely as well if you recall). Eli has been progressing at a fantastic pace, far ahead of my expectations (and I always liked the trade so I have been reservedly optimistic).That said, I just switched to ESPN and Tom Jackson and Michael Irvin BOTH had the Giants in their top 5 teams.Did I misread this and it is not their top 5 NFL teams... or do people really think the Giants are THAT good?I think they have a shot at making the playoffs and with the Eagles staggering, a shot at the division. But I expect some downs with these early ups.Does the objective observer see the Giants as a top 5 team? Maybe bottom of top 10, but even I dont quite see that, yet.

 
Giants fan here.When the media starts to give the Giants respect, that's when I worry.They seem to play better when nobody expect them to. Hoping that Coughlin can can help them play up to expectations. :unsure:

 
Hey,Im obviously a giants fan but heres how i feel. There is alot of hype about the Giants right now on all the nfl shows. We ARE good,but not 36-0 good over a good skins team. We have two very winnable games coming up at SF then against Min.Both with their starting QB's out. That could put us at 7-2 then the schedule gets harder and that will be the test.I dont think we'll know just how good they are until then. Momentum is a hell of a thing though. We are the favorites in the NFC East now IMO and about a year and a few defensive moves away from getting deep into the playoffs.

 
Giants fan here.

When the media starts to give the Giants respect, that's when I worry.

They seem to play better when nobody expect them to. Hoping that Coughlin can can help them play up to expectations. :unsure:
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Good replies all around, and I tend to agree. But this is spot on - except a couple important keys which I hope seperate now from a few years back (Fassel). (1) The coach. (2) and most mportantly Eli.

Hopefully the combo will prevent the Giants from acting opposite of expectations, now that we have some.

 
I'm also biased, as a Skins fan, but I'll try to give an honest opinion....They play very well at home, and were very impressive yesterday. If they get home field advantage, then they'd be the favorites imho to come out of the NFC. However, I think that getting HFA will be too tough in that division. Seattle has a much easier road and Atl has the experience of last year.Lets see how they do on the road against a quality opponent before we hand the division over to them just yet.The NFC(and all of football except for the Colts) really is a jumbled mess right now....NYG blows out Wash, Dallas blows out Philly, Wash beats Dallas, Dallas beats NYG....and thats just the East!I hate to give such a cop out answer, but the NFC East is pretty much going to come down to pure 100% luck. These teams are so close that whoever gets that one bounce of the ball, that one tipped pass, that one extra home game(sorry, but you knew I had to take that shot somewhere) is going to win it. The Giants have as good a chance as any.

 
Win a road game, then you can start talking about them. They got crushed @SD and lost in Dallas. Actually, what I've noticed is that the only team in that division that hasn't been blown out and has been close in every game is the Cowboys. They appear to be the most balanced team in NFC East. The Giants always play good D at home. They are talented, but I think people are overlooking Dallas. How would the Giant's be doing without Tiki the last 3 weeks? ;)

 
Take my comments with a grain of salt: I am a Broncos fan and besides the AFC west playing the NFC east this year, we don't get to see a lot of your games. However, this may be premature but that comeback of sir Eli's against the Broncos looked very Elwayesque. I truly believe that Denver outplayed the Giants and Eli stole the game from us. Sound farmiliar. Kinda like karma coming back to bite us. How many games did Elway steal in the closing minutes? But I regress, I think you have that special QB in Eli. The Giants should be contenders for a while. I don't think you are quite ready to make superbowl reservations yet, but with a couple of key additions you will be right there. Eli is only going to get better, Shockey is still young. If Tiki lasts until the rest of the team matures then go for the gold. By the way, I still haven't forgiven you for the superbowl loss in 1986/87 :hot: lol. I hate Phil Simms :D and his son didn't do me any favors in fantasy this week either. Had to play him with Bulger out and Hasslebeck on bye :bag: lol. Good luck to your Giants.

 
How would the Giant's be doing without Tiki the last 3 weeks? ;)
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I'm sorry but that is a ridiculous comment. Thats like saying where would the colts be without Manning. He's been on the team for almost ten years its a given.I'm a Giants fan, and my opinion is that it is very fair to say the Giants are ONE of the top teams in a very mediocre NFC. The Giants have the best offense in the east, and they still have yet to find the perfect balance of run and pass. Eli has not been great lately but he has been good enough. If the Giants can just give half the defensive effort they gave the skins then they have a chance to go places this year. Right now the Cowboys are more balanced than the Giants, but the Giants have the better offense and special teams, it all comes down to how the defense plays...it's funny but the exact opposite was the concern up until 2002. I'm not counting out Philly at all, they've earned that, but I am counting out the skins, they caught lightning in a bottle for a couple of games with Brunell, but that is over now.
 
Good repsonses all around - and I dont think I read anything that sounded out of bounds, or too biased.Road Wins - Absolutely. Very good point. It was nice to see Manning not once, but TWICE lead the Giants down the field against the Dallas (since Jacobs fumbled it going in) even though their D had nothing left in OT. That said, they have to actually win one. Eli - He has looked that way on more than one occasion this year, which is awesome. The best thing about a good (so far) season. He is inconsistent to a degree - he has played less than a full season still (or close to it) - but when he needs to turn it up and get a clutch throw, he seems to deliver. As I recall, this is something he possessed in college, and clutch is something you usually either have, or do not. All in all, these comments make me think that I have been underestimating my Giants a bit. The east is a jumble though, so any team can go on a 3-4 game winning or losing streak at any time.

 
The Giants are a very well coached team. They have good balance on offense and some playmakers on defense. I do worry about their depth at the skill positions. But before we anoint them best in the East, let them win a meaningful game on the road. They got destroyed in San Diego. The Dallas game was much closer than it had any right to be. They were significantly outplayed in that one, particularly their offense. They were very fortunate to pull out the Denver game. Now, they destroyed an over-achieving Washington. They have the best record in the NFC. Does that make them top 5? Uh, not in my book. Top 10? maybe. Top 15? Certainly. If you do your theoretical "who would win on a neutral field" game, I would put Indy, Pit, SD, Den, NE, Dal, Sea, Car, and Atl above them. Maybe Philly. Probably not the Bucs. But thats my list. You can do your own. Don't listen to the Mediots.

 
The Giants can beat anyone in the NFC on any given day. They have an emerging superstar in Eli Manning at QB. They have a top tier TE in Jeremy Shockey and 2 solid wide receivers in Buress and Toomer. They have an outstanding running back who can run, catch and pick up the blitz on passing situations.Their secondary is their achilles heal. For them to make a legitimate run at the playoffs and further they'll have to find away to get better vs. the pass.

 
History dictates that the Giants defense will have to make major strides the rest of the way in order to be a real title contender, HOWEVER, they are clearly much better than I or most folks expected. While Manning didn't have gaudy stats yesterday, every thing I've seen from him points to his being the real deal. He has been grace under pressure.To think 10 wins probably won't win the NFC East this year...surprising.

 
History dictates that the Giants defense will have to make major strides the rest of the way in order to be a real title contender, HOWEVER, they are clearly much better than I or most folks expected. While Manning didn't have gaudy stats yesterday, every thing I've seen from him points to his being the real deal. He has been grace under pressure.

To think 10 wins probably won't win the NFC East this year...surprising.
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Major strides?In the last 3 weeks against good teams (Dallas, Denver, and Washington) the Giants defense has given up only 3 TDs and 39 total points for an average of 13 points per game.

 
game, I would put Indy, Pit, SD, Den, NE, Dal, Sea, Car, and Atl above them. Maybe Philly. Probably not the Bucs.
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I would put Philly ahead of them, but not Dallas. I think if anything, the Giants and Dallas are very close to even with the Giants looking better as their team continues to Gel where I see Bledsoe being Bledsoe and hurting the team at some point without enough good skill around him to compensate. Philly needs to lose to the Giants before I can put them ahead. Atl is a team that I am simply not as high on as everyone else. Last year was a great year with just a terribly easy schedule. I am not sold on Vick - yeah, he had one unreal win against GB but we see that GB has not been the same for 5 years now, as they were in their prime.

Either way, just to think they are close to, or are actually a top 10 team is pretty cool for a giants fan like myself, who is looking at this season as a stepping stone to the future, not an end to itself (much like the Mets season, I might add)

 
The G-men ARE FOR REAL BABY!!!! Seriously, what's not to like about them right now? Their O is simply ferocious, their defense isn't incredible but seems to be making good strides. The NFC is wide open this year and there's no reason to think the Giants can't make some waves. Put simply, who in the conference is easily better than the Giants? I don't think you can say any one team is much more dominant than them. The problem is their division is incredibly tough and looks like it's going to be a close race all season. At the least, they're fun as hell to watch...

 
The Giants can beat anyone in the NFC on any given day. They have an emerging superstar in Eli Manning at QB. They have a top tier TE in Jeremy Shockey and 2 solid wide receivers in Buress and Toomer. They have an outstanding running back who can run, catch and pick up the blitz on passing situations.

Their secondary is their achilles heal. For them to make a legitimate run at the playoffs and further they'll have to find away to get better vs. the pass.
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Their secondary is quite poor. My guess is that is addressed in the off season, and the Giants could be a top 5 type team going into next year (whether they fulfill on that, who knows). It seems Philly might be waning, Dallas who knows with their QB situation and Parcells not getting younger and Washington with a great coach, a very good RB, but no QB for the future.
 
i would love to get vick in the meadowlands on a nice 10 degree day in january with the wind blowing every direction. he cant pass now imagine him with the wind.tell the big tuna to open up the doors

 
Jets fan here and I called it last night - The Giants are going to the Super Bowl.....I had a premonition last night and saw it as the clock struck 12......(just add alcohol)Looking to see what the best odds are and how I can make a little money off this fact......I'm not a Giants fan at all (so it's true).... But, I'll enjoy their season and the ride (Since the Jets BLOW yet again)......SUPER BOWL.Enjoy it Giant fans :thumbup:

 
They have an outstanding running back who can run, catch and pick up the blitz on passing situations.
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I'm glad you mentioned this. I think that this has played a huge factor in the success of their offense this season. Go back and look at the block he made on Toomer's game winning catch agaist Denver. Just one example of how critical Tiki is to the passing game.If the Giants can win the games they are supposed to, like the next two vs SF and MIN, they are putting themselves in a great position at 7-2 heading in to the meat of their schedule.

Their next 5 games are PHIL, @ SEA, DAL, @ PHIL, and KC. If they can come through these games at 3-2, they will be sitting pretty at 10-4 with games @ WAS and @OAK to wrap up the season and decide the fate of the Mara Men.

 
They beat Washington by 36 points, and the Redskins beat SF the previous week by 35 points. I'll only be convinced they're for real if they confirm the form by beating SF by 71 points or more this week.

 
The G-men ARE FOR REAL BABY!!!!

Seriously, what's not to like about them right now? Their O is simply ferocious, their defense isn't incredible but seems to be making good strides. The NFC is wide open this year and there's no reason to think the Giants can't make some waves. Put simply, who in the conference is easily better than the Giants? I don't think you can say any one team is much more dominant than them. The problem is their division is incredibly tough and looks like it's going to be a close race all season. At the least, they're fun as hell to watch...
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The problem is that about 6 or 7 other teams in the NFC are for real too. No team is more dominant than the Giants...true. But they aren't more dominant than those 6 or 7 other teams either. As has already been said, the Giants have shown nothing on the road yet, so they still have a ton to prove.
 
They beat Washington by 36 points, and the Redskins beat SF the previous week by 35 points. I'll only be convinced they're for real if they confirm the form by beating SF by 71 points or more this week.
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you're ignoring the home/road aspect
 
I will believe the Giants are for real and are a legitimate contender as soon as they beat a good team on the road.

 
I would put Indy, Pit, SD, Den, NE, Dal, Sea, Car, and Atl above them.  Maybe Philly.  Probably not the Bucs. 
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no love for the Bengals
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Norman Einstein, yep, forgot about them. Put them in there too.Koya, I rank Dallas ahead because of their defense. Their D is only likely to improve as the young guys mature and the whole group continues adjusting to life in the 3-4. But look at what they have done in the last 5 games:

AZ 12 first downs, 7-17 on 3rd down, 213 net yards, 3.5 yards per play. 13 points allowed.

Sea 20 first downs, 3-13 on 3rd, 289 net yards, 4.4 YPP, 13 points (10 in last minute).

NYG 11 first downs, 1-11 on 3rd, 270 net yards, 5.1 ypp. 13 points (7 in last minute)

Phi 6 first downs, 2-12 on 3rd, 129 net yards, 3.0 ypp. 3 points.

Oak 16 first downs, 2-10 on 3rd, 333 net yards, 5.9 ypp. 19 points (9 after 1st quarter.

Going into these games, Philly, NYG, and Seattle were each the top ranked offense in the NFL. These 5 teams scored only 4 touchdowns against them. This ain't Houston, Cleveland, Detroit and the Bears they have shut down.

And they are likely to get better. So say what you will about Bledsoe. (Incidently, he is the highest rated NFC passer after week 8). Its the D that makes Dallas a top team going forward.

 
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I think the Giants team is very much what we saw yesterday - which still makes me pretty damn happy about the now, and ecstatic about the future. Some ups and downs and some inconsistency - but enough talent to win enough games right now. Great talent with a very young QB will mean some great plays and some frustration. They need a little luck, but once they are rolling can be tough to stop... until/unless they stop themselves.The fact that the Giants fell so flat against the Vikings is somewhat indicitive of their lack of experience at key positions - but also something that happens to almost every team in the NFL (losing to a team against whom, you have no business losing). My biggest concern is the secondary. Still. Deloach scares the bejeebez outta me. I see a bomb then see "39" and pray.

 
I think the Giants team is very much what we saw yesterday - which still makes me pretty damn happy about the now, and ecstatic about the future.

Some ups and downs and some inconsistency - but enough talent to win enough games right now. Great talent with a very young QB will mean some great plays and some frustration. They need a little luck, but once they are rolling can be tough to stop... until/unless they stop themselves.

The fact that the Giants fell so flat against the Vikings is somewhat indicitive of their lack of experience at key positions - but also something that happens to almost every team in the NFL (losing to a team against whom, you have no business losing).

My biggest concern is the secondary. Still. Deloach scares the bejeebez outta me. I see a bomb then see "39" and pray.
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Nice win for the Giants and one I'm sure Giants fans took great pleasure in given the whipping they've taken at the Birds hands the last few years. Eli isn't great yet, but I keep being impressed with his ability to make plays when the team needs them. It's hard for me to believe that the season has come down to my being happy about the play of Trent Cole and J. Jackson versus worrying about wins and losses.
 
The thing that makes the Giants dangerous is their defense. They have probably the best set of DEs in football. Now as Koya has alluded to, their secondary may not be the best. But good pressure helps any secondary look better.The Gmen have come on in my mind. But its not because of Manning, Tiki, Shockey and Plaxico. Its because they have been shutting people down. That will carry them farther in January when the elements come into play.It will be interesting to see how they and the Cowboys play out the rest of the year. The two teams are rather similar with strong D's and inconsistent offenses. Watching things like this play out are what makes football fun.

 
When looking at the NFC playoff picture after 11 weeks I don't think there is a single team that is head and shoulders better than the others. Seattle, Chicago, Dallas, NY, Carolina, Tampa and Atlanta .... 7 teasm, 6 playoff spots. I really don't see Washington making a run. Of those teams, all of them can be beaten. Home field and injuries downt eh stretch will be huge but the NFC playoffs should be exciting. Lots of evenly matched talent.As for my G-Men, I didn't think I'd be talking playoffs at this point prior to the season's start. I had us down for 8-8, maybe 9-7. The defense has really made strides the past several games. DeLoatch scares me too but if he keeps playing the way he's been Frank Walker or the rookie Corey Webster will take his slot. Who knows, maybe Will Peterson will rise from the dead and pronounce hs back healthy!Yesterday's win over Philly was sweet in that it put the coffin nail in their season but was a bit unfulfilling in terms of the personnel the Eagles were missing.I still think the Giants are a playmaker or two away on defense to really make a deep playoff run or win the SuperBowl, but the good news is the future is rosy. The team is relatively young and has patched holes exceedingly well. At this point, I'll be amazed if the Giants don't make the playoffs this year. They have a tough stretch in the next few weeks but finish with Washington and Oakland. The Dallas game is the important game left on their schedule. That dictates wether they compete for the division or the wild card. I think Atlanta will be on the outside looking in. They've got a brutal stretch of divisional games remaining. The only good news is they own Carolina and they get 'em twice.

 
Let's hope the injuries to Pettigout and O'Hara are minor. They could potentially be devestating.

 
When looking at the NFC playoff picture after 11 weeks I don't think there is a single team that is head and shoulders better than the others. Seattle, Chicago, Dallas, NY, Carolina, Tampa and Atlanta .... 7 teasm, 6 playoff spots. I really don't see Washington making a run.

Of those teams, all of them can be beaten. Home field and injuries downt eh stretch will be huge but the NFC playoffs should be exciting. Lots of evenly matched talent.

As for my G-Men, I didn't think I'd be talking playoffs at this point prior to the season's start. I had us down for 8-8, maybe 9-7. The defense has really made strides the past several games. DeLoatch scares me too but if he keeps playing the way he's been Frank Walker or the rookie Corey Webster will take his slot. Who knows, maybe Will Peterson will rise from the dead and pronounce hs back healthy!

Yesterday's win over Philly was sweet in that it put the coffin nail in their season but was a bit unfulfilling in terms of the personnel the Eagles were missing.

I still think the Giants are a playmaker or two away on defense to really make a deep playoff run or win the SuperBowl, but the good news is the future is rosy. The team is relatively young and has patched holes exceedingly well.

At this point, I'll be amazed if the Giants don't make the playoffs this year. They have a tough stretch in the next few weeks but finish with Washington and Oakland. The Dallas game is the important game left on their schedule. That dictates wether they compete for the division or the wild card. I think Atlanta will be on the outside looking in. They've got a brutal stretch of divisional games remaining. The only good news is they own Carolina and they get 'em twice.
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I don't necessariliy disagree, but statistically Seattle is the class of the NFC through Week 11. It's not close.
 
I think the Giants team is very much what we saw yesterday - which still makes me pretty damn happy about the now, and ecstatic about the future.

Some ups and downs and some inconsistency - but enough talent to win enough games right now.  Great talent with a very young QB will mean some great plays and some frustration.  They need a little luck, but once they are rolling can be tough to stop... until/unless they stop themselves.

The fact that the Giants fell so flat against the Vikings is somewhat indicitive of their lack of experience at key positions - but also something that happens to almost every team in the NFL (losing to a team against whom, you have no business losing).

My biggest concern is the secondary.  Still.  Deloach scares the bejeebez outta me.  I see a bomb then see "39" and pray.
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Nice win for the Giants and one I'm sure Giants fans took great pleasure in given the whipping they've taken at the Birds hands the last few years. Eli isn't great yet, but I keep being impressed with his ability to make plays when the team needs them. It's hard for me to believe that the season has come down to my being happy about the play of Trent Cole and J. Jackson versus worrying about wins and losses.
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That's funny. I thought the whippings the last couple of years was catch up time for the Eagles... ;)

THE SERIES

The Giants lead the regular season series that began in 1933, 73-65-2, and the postseason series, 2-0. In 2004, the Eagles won both meetings (31-17 on Sept. 12 in Lincoln Financial Field and 27-6 on Nov. 28 in Giants Stadium). That continued a long tradition of series sweeps between the two teams. In the 20 season series from 1985-2004, 18 have ended in sweeps. The teams split their season series in 1990 and 2002. The Giants swept in 1985, ’86, ’87, ’93, ’94, ’97, ’98, ’99, and 2000 (plus a playoff game). Philadelphia won both games in 1988, ’89, ’91, ’92, ’95, ’96, 2001, ’03, and ’04. The Giants’ last victory in the series was on Dec. 28, 2002, a 10-7 overtime triumph that clinched an NFC Wild Card playoff birth.

 
When looking at the NFC playoff picture after 11 weeks I don't think there is a single team that is head and shoulders better than the others.  Seattle, Chicago, Dallas, NY, Carolina, Tampa and Atlanta .... 7 teasm, 6 playoff spots.  I really don't see Washington making a run. 

Of those teams, all of them can be beaten.  Home field and injuries downt eh stretch will be huge but the NFC playoffs should be exciting.  Lots of evenly matched talent.

As for my G-Men, I didn't think I'd be talking playoffs at this point prior to the season's start.  I had us down for 8-8, maybe 9-7.  The defense has really made strides the past several games.  DeLoatch scares me too but if he keeps playing the way he's been Frank Walker or the rookie Corey Webster will take his slot.  Who knows, maybe Will Peterson will rise from the dead and pronounce hs back healthy!

Yesterday's win over Philly was sweet in that it put the coffin nail in their season but was a bit unfulfilling in terms of the personnel the Eagles were missing.

I still think the Giants are a playmaker or two away on defense to really make a deep playoff run or win the SuperBowl, but the good news is the future is rosy.  The team is relatively young and has patched holes exceedingly well. 

At this point, I'll be amazed if the Giants don't make the playoffs this year.  They have a tough stretch in the next few weeks but finish with Washington and Oakland.  The Dallas game is the important game left on their schedule.  That dictates wether they compete for the division or the wild card.  I think Atlanta will be on the outside looking in.  They've got a brutal stretch of divisional games remaining.  The only good news is they own Carolina and they get 'em twice.
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I don't necessariliy disagree, but statistically Seattle is the class of the NFC through Week 11. It's not close.
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Until Seattle proves to me they have a heart, I dont take them seriously. They have had talent forever - but when the cards are down, when it's time to circle them wagons, I see them failing, as always, to live up to the challange.
 
Well, it looks like they were what they were - NFC East Champs! Going to be a tough matchup next week, but regardless of how the playoffs turn out (would certainly love a win), to have Eli lead the team to a divsional crown in his first full year starting is something to be very proud of.Go Giants!

 
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