HBO - Song of Ice&Fire Series -Varsity Thread - no TV only whiners (5 Viewers)

[Rick James]

lmao the books are still far and away superior to the show.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

lmao the books are still far and away superior to the show.

actually both books & show appear to be falling off at the same point.

found last nights episode a bit of snoozer.

Game of Talk.

 

[Kraft...]

They are really playing up the grey scale, don't recall it being a major plot point in the books

 

[sn0mm1s]

They are really playing up the grey scale, don't recall it being a major plot point in the books

Well, we have hints that greyscale is more than just a disease. Val tells Jon Snow that Stannis' daughter Shireen should be killed because she has greyscale. Also, the Stonemen are in the books but it is Jon Connington that gets infected - not Jorah.

 

[Super King]

Which means.... We're not getting him or young Griff.

 

[Sinn Fein]

Which means.... We're not getting him or young Griff.

Which brings us back to three remaining Targaryens in the world...

 

[Sinn Fein]

They are really playing up the grey scale, don't recall it being a major plot point in the books

Maybe they can fight the Others without repercussions. Jorah leads the defenses on the gound in the final battle, while Daenerys and Snow control the Dragons in the sky

 

[Whomper]

They are really playing up the grey scale, don't recall it being a major plot point in the books

Maybe they can fight the Others without repercussions. Jorah leads the defenses on the gound in the final battle, while Daenerys and Snow control the Dragons in the sky

I always felt that Bran would have something to do with controlling the Dragons (or at least one of them ) when the big showdown occurs

 

[Thunderlips]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

 

[Super King]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

Don't forget no Victorian story arc. Which sucks, cuz in the books, the sack of Mereen was actually going to be worth reading after all those ####ty Dany chapters.

 

[Gr00vus]

lmao the books are still far and away superior to the show.

actually both books & show appear to be falling off at the same point.

found last nights episode a bit of snoozer.

Game of Talk.

 

[Abrantes]

Interesting reactions. I'm loving the season thus far, actually. Probably has to do with me thinking books 4 and 5 were horribly bloated, leading to my appreciation of the cuts D&D are making. The show is much, much tighter, and moving at Usain Bolt speed compared to the books in terms of plot progression. From a reader's perspective, I don't get the "Game of Talk" criticism at all, but to each their own.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

I mainly agree but they can fix Jaquen H'ghar pretty quickly IMO

Same with the Victorian

 

[Gr00vus]

From a reader's perspective, I don't get the "Game of Talk" criticism at all, but to each their own.

It's the difference between a written medium and a visual one. Given the ability to actually show stuff happening instead of talking about it, it's disappointing when the show spends a ton of time doing exposition via forced dialogue and/or has to introduce entire scenes of forced dialogue whose sole purpose is setting up other scenes. This season has done a ton of both.

 

[Gr00vus]

So what are the hypotheses on Tyrion's actual ancestry? Seems like they've set things up for him to be the 3rd Targaryen. Mad king got it on with Tywin's wife?

 

[Thunderlips]

So what are the hypotheses on Tyrion's actual ancestry? Seems like they've set things up for him to be the 3rd Targaryen. Mad king got it on with Tywin's wife?

That's the weakest link in the story, IMO..... with really, the only hint or roundabout mention of it in the show being the comment Tywin made to Tyrion (paraphrasing) " Because I could not prove that you weren't mine...I allowed you take our name" when he asked for his birthright of Casterly Rock.

 

[CletiusMaximus]

So what are the hypotheses on Tyrion's actual ancestry? Seems like they've set things up for him to be the 3rd Targaryen. Mad king got it on with Tywin's wife?

That's the weakest link in the story, IMO..... with really, the only hint or roundabout mention of it in the show being the comment Tywin made to Tyrion (paraphrasing) " Because I could not prove that you weren't mine...I allowed you take our name" when he asked for his birthright of Casterly Rock.

Did Tyrion never discuss dreaming of dragons in the HBO version? I don't recall any discussion of Johanna and Aerys in the show, but would not be surprised if there's been a bit more than just Tywin's comments to support this theory, which is pretty strong in the books. At least it is known to HBO viewers that Tywin was Aerys' Hand, which puts Johanna in the right place at the right time.

 

[Gr00vus]

So what are the hypotheses on Tyrion's actual ancestry? Seems like they've set things up for him to be the 3rd Targaryen. Mad king got it on with Tywin's wife?

That's the weakest link in the story, IMO..... with really, the only hint or roundabout mention of it in the show being the comment Tywin made to Tyrion (paraphrasing) " Because I could not prove that you weren't mine...I allowed you take our name" when he asked for his birthright of Casterly Rock.

Agreed. The 3rd Targaryen thing isn't being developed very well. Particularly with the plot changes in the show. There are some obscure options left that would take some explaining for show viewers that hasn't really happened yet (Stannis/Shireen, Gendry, Trystane Martell could/do have Targaryen blood), but seems like they should have been developing those a bit more than they have if they're going to go that way and not have it come off as cheap.

 

[Gr00vus]

So what are the hypotheses on Tyrion's actual ancestry? Seems like they've set things up for him to be the 3rd Targaryen. Mad king got it on with Tywin's wife?

That's the weakest link in the story, IMO..... with really, the only hint or roundabout mention of it in the show being the comment Tywin made to Tyrion (paraphrasing) " Because I could not prove that you weren't mine...I allowed you take our name" when he asked for his birthright of Casterly Rock.

Did Tyrion never discuss dreaming of dragons in the HBO version? I don't recall any discussion of Johanna and Aerys in the show, but would not be surprised if there's been a bit more than just Tywin's comments to support this theory, which is pretty strong in the books. At least it is known to HBO viewers that Tywin was Aerys' Hand, which puts Johanna in the right place at the right time.

IIRC they covered some of Tyrion's fascination with dragons briefly (I'm thinking of a scene where he's talking about the dragon skulls when they're in the dungeons of the Red Keep, and another where he talks about some reading he'd done on dragons). He also pulled off using the wildfire the old mad king had laying around. Tenuous stuff.

 

[BillyBarooo]

lmao the books are still far and away superior to the show.

actually both books & show appear to be falling off at the same point.

found last nights episode a bit of snoozer.

Game of Talk.

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

 

[Super King]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

#5 ended on a good note, with the Golden Company landing at Storm's End and Dany and Drogon landing in the Dothraki sea. Plus Victorian piling on to the sack of Mereen

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

#5 ended on a good note, with the Golden Company landing at Storm's End and Dany and Drogon landing in the Dothraki sea. Plus Victorian piling on to the sack of Mereen

And Arya just came out of her blind spell, right?

 

[Super King]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

#5 ended on a good note, with the Golden Company landing at Storm's End and Dany and Drogon landing in the Dothraki sea. Plus Victorian piling on to the sack of Mereen

And Arya just came out of her blind spell, right?

####, forgot about that too. Winds of Winter is going to be off the hook.

 

[Gr00vus]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

#5 ended on a good note, with the Golden Company landing at Storm's End and Dany and Drogon landing in the Dothraki sea. Plus Victorian piling on to the sack of Mereen

And Arya just came out of her blind spell, right?

####, forgot about that too. Winds of Winter is going to be off the hook.

There's also the whole Jon getting gang stabbed (to death?) thing.

 

[Super King]

Seems like a whole lot of set up for...what exactly? a bunch of meandering story lines and characters, just like books 4 and 5?

I think the books started to lose me in the middle of #3 (it's been a while).

IIRC the last half of the series seemed like a fairly dull travelog of Middle Earth or whatever.

#5 ended on a good note, with the Golden Company landing at Storm's End and Dany and Drogon landing in the Dothraki sea. Plus Victorian piling on to the sack of Mereen

And Arya just came out of her blind spell, right?

####, forgot about that too. Winds of Winter is going to be off the hook.

There's also the whole Jon getting gang stabbed (to death?) thing.

Well, that too.

 

[Rustoleum]

I'll be disappointed if the endgame boils down to Jon, Tyrion, and Danaerys riding off into the sunset on dragonback. That's too middle school fiction for me. Maybe they can do the Wayne's World Scooby Doo ending instead.

One, or more, of the Dragons/potential riders should bite it at some point. It's happened with the dire wolves, no reason it shouldn't happen to a dragon.

 

[sn0mm1s]

I'll be disappointed if the endgame boils down to Jon, Tyrion, and Danaerys riding off into the sunset on dragonback. That's too middle school fiction for me. Maybe they can do the Wayne's World Scooby Doo ending instead.

One, or more, of the Dragons/potential riders should bite it at some point. It's happened with the dire wolves, no reason it shouldn't happen to a dragon.

If you have ever read any of Martin's other works the endings are never "happy". I have a feeling most, if not all, of the dragons will be dead by the end.

 

[(HULK)]

I'll be disappointed if the endgame boils down to Jon, Tyrion, and Danaerys riding off into the sunset on dragonback. That's too middle school fiction for me. Maybe they can do the Wayne's World Scooby Doo ending instead.

One, or more, of the Dragons/potential riders should bite it at some point. It's happened with the dire wolves, no reason it shouldn't happen to a dragon.

If you have ever read any of Martin's other works the endings are never "happy". I have a feeling most, if not all, of the dragons will be dead by the end.

Tuff Voyaging is a fun read FYI

 

[Sabertooth]

Yeah I don't even want to speculate what the end game will look like. Probably leave the people of Westeros as bad or worse off than they were in the very beginning.

 

[Sinn Fein]

Which family is "winning"?

House Stark

Ned - Dead, lost his head

Catelyn - Dead, nearly lost her head

Rob - Dead - lost his head

Sansa - beaten down, making a comeback - re-builds House Stark (will be hard to do if she marries)?

Arya - No longer a Stark, but surviving - probably makes it to the end game

Bran - Paralyzed, about to become a tree, and live forever

Rickon - meh, wondering the country side with Hodor

Jon Snow - Lord Commander, lying face down in the snow, presumably a Stark-Targaryen, presumably plays a part in the endgame

House Baratheon

Robert - Dead

Renly - Dead

Stanis - Still alive, and claiming the throne

Cersei - (really a Lannister), has the whole shaved nude walk thing going on - probably can't sink much lower

Joffrey - Dead

Myrcella - sent of to Dorne, now disfigured.

Tommen - Puppet King

Robert's ******* - still rowing his boat

House Lannister

Tywin - Dead

Jamie - one-armed bandit, seemingly redeemed himself somewhat since the first book

Cersei - see above, she is done. She has lost the fear factor.

Tyrion - Still has his wits despite many trials and tribulations, probably figures in the end-game.

House Targaryen

Viserys - dead - heavy is the head that wears the crown

Daenerys - mother of dragons, presumably has a role in the end game.

 

[elbowrm]

Targaryen by a mile

 

[rascal]

Is Victorian's hand injury gray scale? I think they are combining Victorian and mormant's role.

 

[Super King]

Is Victorian's hand injury gray scale? I think they are combining Victorian and mormant's role.

No. Victorian got injured during a battle. The red priest he takes on his ship uses his magic to heal him.Jon Connington got the greyscale

 

[Rick James]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

eh...I wouldn't put too much stock into this. HBO knows the end game, but the path they need to take will likely be much different than the path GRRM takes. One has 20 hours of film in which to work, the other has 3,000 pages.

The Greyjoys are prominently featured in the books, but practically nonexistent in the show. Does that mean they're ultimately not important in the books? I don't believe that for a second.

 

[Super King]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

eh...I wouldn't put too much stock into this. HBO knows the end game, but the path they need to take will likely be much different than the path GRRM takes. One has 20 hours of film in which to work, the other has 3,000 pages.

The Greyjoys are prominently featured in the books, but practically nonexistent in the show. Does that mean they're ultimately not important in the books? I don't believe that for a second.

I bet we get Balon's death and the Kingsmoot, and Victorian sailing for meereen all in one episode.

 

[Psychopav]

Who cares about the books now? The show has gotten past where we are in the books, and did it more optimally and with more interesting storylines. The next book better be phenomenal; it if suffers from the same drag as the last two books, Martin runs the risk of the show being the only thing people remember.

 

[Super King]

Who cares about the books now? The show has gotten past where we are in the books, and did it more optimally and with more interesting storylines. The next book better be phenomenal; it if suffers from the same drag as the last two books, Martin runs the risk of the show being the only thing people remember.

Lots of people? After suffering thru the 4th book, and most of the 5th, the 6th seems like it's set up for some #### to go down

 

[CBusAlex]

Yeah I don't even want to speculate what the end game will look like. Probably leave the people of Westeros as bad or worse off than they were in the very beginning.

Martin's idea of "bittersweet" is probably to kill off so many of the good characters and leave so many evil SOBs in power that it will actually be a relief when the white walkers show up and just put humanity out of its misery.

 

[massraider]

I think the end game in the last book winds up with white walkers meeting Dani's dragons.

White Walkers+fire=no more White Walkers.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

I forgot how much was going on at the end of ADWD. This next book should be amazing.

How long in advance do we know books are coming out? Is like to read or listen to the others before the new one and want to give myself some time.

 

[Swing 51]

How long in advance do we know books are coming out? Is like to read or listen to the others before the new one and want to give myself some time.

Not sure but I would think they plan on hyping the #### out of the release of TWOW. Thought I read recently that TWOW will be released before season 6 on HBO but I haven't seen an estimated date.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Martin said he wants to have the book out before Season 6. So basically 10-11 months from now. Obviously no guarantees he meets that deadline, but it was nice to hear something.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Other than buying the audio books and renting the CDs from the library how else can I listen to these? You guys have to know a way ?

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I forgot how much was going on at the end of ADWD. This next book should be amazing.

How long in advance do we know books are coming out? Is like to read or listen to the others before the new one and want to give myself some time.

The last book was 4 months from Martin announcing it was done until it was on the shelf. I'd imagine the publisher would clear space to get the next one out in a similar time frame.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

I kind of thought it wouldn't have been a big deal to his future books with HBO going ahead of him.....but after last night, I think he really screwed the pooch. Just this season, we've seen a future demise or reduction of any relevance to:

Jorah (Greyscaled)

Selmy (killed)

Rayder (killed)

Jaquen H'ghar (if he's training Arya at the Temple....there's much relevance to him being in Old Town)

It's almost to the point as far as the books go that you kind of hope he comes out at tells you that the HBO story and the books are going to be two completely different stories.....because if not, (including the ones that aren't going to make an appearance Griff, Connington, Stoneheart and the ones he's deemed the book stories to be so irrelevant that he's giving the characters new stories in the show Jamie/Sansa)....there's no much left that's relevant in most of the secondary characters.

 

[Good Posting Judge]

The whitewalkers are winning.

Martin kind of reminds me of George Lucas. He's capable of building an amazing world that people fully buy into, but he really has no idea how to tell a good story within that world. I'm not a fan of his writing, but I think if he allowed other people to write GOT books within the GOT universe, covering stuff that happened in the past, and after the original run of books take place, it could be pretty amazing.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So apparently snoop watches to learn about history.

 

[Swing 51]

At least they didn't have a dog copulate with Sansa last night! Yikes was that a tough scene to take in.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Could they have made the sand snakes and dorne any worse?