Houston Texans 2013 In-season thread (1 Viewer)

[GregR]

ESPN has an Insider article between Matt Williamson and Mike Sando on whether the Texans should rebuild. Out of respect I won't repost the entire thing, but here are a few snippets. I'm really grabbing from multiple spots in the conversation to lump them by topic, so the article flow isn't what my snippets make it seem.

On where they are as a team, both indicated they think they are better than their record:

Williamson: ...Maybe [my power ranking of 13th] was a little high, but this team is closer to the middle of the pack than it is to 25th or 27th. I know they've lost seven in a row, but the last three they have lost by a combined seven points to pretty good teams. There is no shame in losing at Kansas City or Arizona, or losing to Andrew Luck when your head coach collapses at halftime. I actually think they are much better with Case Keenum at QB...

Sando: ... This defense ranks first in fewest yards allowed per game, eighth in yards allowed per play and is comfortably above average in expected points added (EPA), which reflects how many points a team allows in relation to how many average defense would allow in the same situations. I'm just not sure there's much hope for Keenum, and I wonder how much more Andre Johnson, Owen Daniels and Arian Foster have left to give. ..

Williamson: ... Most teams with bad records have huge problems, but I don't see it with this team. They rush the passer well. They have the best player the world on defense in J.J. Watt, who makes everyone around him better. Yeah, their outside linebackers aren't great, but it's not like they struggle to generate pressure. We don't know what they have at quarterback, but right now, Keenum is better than Schaub. ...

Williamson: I see the Texans as the team they've been over the last three games as opposed to the nightmare of earlier in the season. They have been a sound football team recently.

On QB:

Williamson: ...My big concern is that Keenum looks good, they go with him and then he's always that guy Schaub was at his best -- good enough to win some games, but not win in the playoffs. Then you pick 25th every year in the draft and wind up in no-man's land with guys like Andy Dalton, who might have a high floor, but also a lower ceiling.... One thing I've noticed, though, is Keenum seems less effective as the games go along. You wonder if people are figuring him out and he can't adjust back.

Sando: ... Kubiak is known for having a quarterback-friendly system. Keenum's Total QBR scores by quarter drop precipitously from 95.2 for the first, 86.9 for the second, 33.0 for the third and 6.6 for the fourth. Schaub's numbers did not follow such a pattern. Keenum hasn't played enough for us to read much into quarterly patterns, but it's something to watch.

Williamson: The bottom line is, whenever free agency and the draft rolls around, if they like Keenum, I don't see a major need. I do think Keenum could be the guy. If they don't think so, they might use that first-round pick, which could be around seventh overall, on a quarterback.

On RB:

Sando: ... Foster's future also could be in some question, although releasing him would not produce massive cap savings. With Ben Tate headed for free agency, the Texans might need to draft a running back to go along with whatever quarterback they might want to target....

Williamson: ...I think I'd get rid of both [Foster and Tate]. I'd let them walk and draft someone in the first round or even try to find someone later, such as an Alfred Morris or Zac Stacy...

My note: I think releasing Foster this offseason makes little sense because of lack of cap savings. Only thing you'd do is clear some of the dead money off your cap quicker, but I would wait and see how he does coming back from injury. It isn't like he's an old man already.

On receivers:

Williamson: Daniels .... worry me a lot more than Johnson in terms of what they have left. Few seem to realize just how strong a season Johnson is having. Even if he does lose a step in the near future, he is such a complete receiver. With his great size and strength, he should remain effective as the Texans slowly transition to DeAndre Hopkins as their top target.

 

[GregR]

I need some advice before I lock in HOU as my survivor pool pick this week. The Texans in no way, shape or form would think about "tanking" for a better draft pick, right? No offense, but I just have to ask. Because if they all give max effort, I see no way Matt McGloin (expected to start in place of Pryor) walks into Houston and is effective against Wade's defense.

But the seven losses in a row are definitely a concern.

I think at this point in the season there is 0% chance they tank for a better draft pick. Case Keenum is playing for a shot at an NFL career as a starter. Gary Kubiak may be coaching for his job at this point. If Houston is like 2-12 going into the end of the season, you'd have to ask me then. But right now, I don't think there is any chance they intentionally tank.

The team is playing better the last three weeks, they've really only outright sucked against the 49ers and Rams. But on the downside, Joe Mays and Kareem Jackson are both GTDs. So the defense might be missing both starting ILBs, both starting safeties, and their #2 CB. Plus Foster and Owen Daniels being out.

I think Houston being favored by a touchdown is about right, all said. The team has a fragile psyche at this point though. As long as Keenum keeps from turning the ball over much I think they'll be ok there versus what it was earlier in the year with Schaub at QB.

 

[Raider Nation]

Thanks Greg. BTW, the line just moved from 7 to 7.5 with the McGloin news.

 

[dhockster]

I need some advice before I lock in HOU as my survivor pool pick this week. The Texans in no way, shape or form would think about "tanking" for a better draft pick, right? No offense, but I just have to ask. Because if they all give max effort, I see no way Matt McGloin (expected to start in place of Pryor) walks into Houston and is effective against Wade's defense.

But the seven losses in a row are definitely a concern.

I think at this point in the season there is 0% chance they tank for a better draft pick. Case Keenum is playing for a shot at an NFL career as a starter. Gary Kubiak may be coaching for his job at this point. If Houston is like 2-12 going into the end of the season, you'd have to ask me then. But right now, I don't think there is any chance they intentionally tank.

The team is playing better the last three weeks, they've really only outright sucked against the 49ers and Rams. But on the downside, Joe Mays and Kareem Jackson are both GTDs. So the defense might be missing both starting ILBs, both starting safeties, and their #2 CB. Plus Foster and Owen Daniels being out.

I think Houston being favored by a touchdown is about right, all said. The team has a fragile psyche at this point though. As long as Keenum keeps from turning the ball over much I think they'll be ok there versus what it was earlier in the year with Schaub at QB.

I agree with Greg, here. Tanking a game is not something I think Gary Kubiak would do, especially the first game back from health problems. Add in the fact that I think most or the players

like him and I think they will try to play hard for him.

 

[GregR]

And in this week's Texans edition of "who the #### is that playing for them now?", if you see a number #52 starting at ILB this weekend, it's Jeff Tarpinian.

 

[Major]

Come on Case. Give us a 2nd half. You got the first half mastered.

 

[glock]

Come on Case. Give us a 2nd half. You got the first half mastered.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Kubiak just decided that Schaub is his second half QB I guess....

This coach is a total disaster

 

[Raider Nation]

You guys out-terribled us. A few more minutes on the game clock and it might have been different.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Yall deserved it.....we let McGloin and Jennings take it to us. Lost in all the Kubiak QB crap is the terrible job Wade Phillips is doing. Rankings be damned, this defense is way overrated. Lack of turnovers, awful red zone, and giving up the big play are trademarks of this defense

 

[Raider Nation]

The Tate run on 3rd & 2 from the 3 was so telegraphed. If Schaub pulls that and boots the other way, Graham might have been wide open.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

The last couple of plays were typical of Schaub and this entire regime....they got two chances on 4 th down and neither were particularly good plays

 

[TheFly06]

Kubiak has poisoned this team. It's time to go. If Bob McNair fires him on Monday, I will do cartwheels and have a parade. Totally inexcusable to pull the plug on Keenum so soon for his crony Schaub. I am absolutely disgusted. The 2-14 year in 2005 was bad, but I'm more ashamed and embarrassed about this season by far.

 

[Bob Magaw]

Yall deserved it.....we let McGloin and Jennings take it to us. Lost in all the Kubiak QB crap is the terrible job Wade Phillips is doing. Rankings be damned, this defense is way overrated. Lack of turnovers, awful red zone, and giving up the big play are trademarks of this defense

in 2012, the defense was night and day different when Cushing went out...

he is the heart and soul of the defense.

 

[coolnerd]

Kubiak has poisoned this team. It's time to go. If Bob McNair fires him on Monday, I will do cartwheels and have a parade. Totally inexcusable to pull the plug on Keenum so soon for his crony Schaub. I am absolutely disgusted. The 2-14 year in 2005 was bad, but I'm more ashamed and embarrassed about this season by far.

yeah, the point of playing keenum at this juncture is to see if he is really a QB of the future. this was the chance to see if he could overcome meh play to rally the team later in the game.

 

[flapgreen]

Good for Tate. Houston has some of the worst fans in football, not necessarily the guys in here, but their fans are terrible.

 

[WilsonTheVolleyball]

I'm probably the biggest Kubiak and Schaub apologists out there, but what happened yesterday was absolutely boneheaded. There was no reason to bench Keenum due to the reasons that have already been posted. I cannot defend Kubiak any longer. Thanks for the memories; time to go.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Yeah our fans are any different than anywhere else.....sold out every game in our sorry history. Been plenty supportive thru the years. Its perfectly acceptable to be sick of Schaub and Kubiak.....I guess a "true" fan would just blindly continue to buy into a dumpster fire. Not trying to say we r the greatest but yesterday is a lousy barometer to say the fans suck.....no the team and management suck.

 

[flapgreen]

I'm probably the biggest Kubiak and Schaub apologists out there, but what happened yesterday was absolutely boneheaded. There was no reason to bench Keenum due to the reasons that have already been posted. I cannot defend Kubiak any longer. Thanks for the memories; time to go.

That was ignorant.

 

[flapgreen]

Yeah our fans are any different than anywhere else.....sold out every game in our sorry history. Been plenty supportive thru the years. Its perfectly acceptable to be sick of Schaub and Kubiak.....I guess a "true" fan would just blindly continue to buy into a dumpster fire. Not trying to say we r the greatest but yesterday is a lousy barometer to say the fans suck.....no the team and management suck.

I'm not basing it on yesterday. They have been bad for years. They have every right to be upset, though. This year has been a mess, along with the last years. From what I saw, yesterday was inexcusable. Kubiak is a moron. Just my opinion...

 

[jsharlan]

Yall deserved it.....we let McGloin and Jennings take it to us. Lost in all the Kubiak QB crap is the terrible job Wade Phillips is doing. Rankings be damned, this defense is way overrated. Lack of turnovers, awful red zone, and giving up the big play are trademarks of this defense

In fairness, the defense is missing alot of players, both ILBs are gone, #2 CB is gone, #1 safety is gone. Some of the players who are left are just terrible. I'm looking at your Reed and Mercilus.

 

[jsharlan]

Good for Tate. Houston has some of the worst fans in football, not necessarily the guys in here, but their fans are terrible.

This isn't true at all. I have lived in many areas of the country, and the fanbases are all relatively the same. Even the ones with storied traditions of winning. You want better fans? Maybe win a game.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

It was pretty pathetic watching how slow our defense is on that Jennings run.....we need a completely new roster of LBs too

 

[jsharlan]

DJ Swag getting run over by a backup RB was rather pathetic. His resume is about hard hitting and "Swag" and he gotten completely blown up.

 

[ragnarok628]

what can be said? just a very disappointing season, right when Texan fans were finally able to (we thought) legitimately hope for great things... But then you have Schaub struggling so mightily right out of the gate, which is something i still don't understand. He's never been a Great Quarterback but after years of Good Enough i think most Texans fans were OK with that level out of Schaub. As long as the run game and defense is clicking and we can count on our QB to take care of the football, good thing happen. Then all of the sudden he becomes Christian Ponder bad, how does that even happen? FWIW Kubiak's play calling has always held us back, but last year we got to the playoffs in spite of it. now all of the sudden we can't beat anybody. have the players given up? just really disappointing.

 

[dhockster]

DJ Swag getting run over by a backup RB was rather pathetic. His resume is about hard hitting and "Swag" and he gotten completely blown up.

His problem was, as with most hard hitting safeties these days, is he is all about the hit, and not about the tackle. He didn't even attempt to wrap up and when he hit a guy who was the same size as him with the same amount of momemtum, his hit was neutralized. he was left to chase Jennings, and Jennings was faster then he was. Nice job, Rook.

 

[dhockster]

Yeah our fans are any different than anywhere else.....sold out every game in our sorry history. Been plenty supportive thru the years. Its perfectly acceptable to be sick of Schaub and Kubiak.....I guess a "true" fan would just blindly continue to buy into a dumpster fire. Not trying to say we r the greatest but yesterday is a lousy barometer to say the fans suck.....no the team and management suck.

I'm not basing it on yesterday. They have been bad for years. They have every right to be upset, though. This year has been a mess, along with the last years. From what I saw, yesterday was inexcusable. Kubiak is a moron. Just my opinion...

I don't get it. You applaud Ben Tate for calling out the fans, and then you say they (the fans) have every right to be upset. Other than rioting, booing is the only way for the fans to show their displeasure in the moment. Down the road they can show it by not buying tickets.

The person I feel most sorry for yesterday was Andre Johnson. No touchdowns first 6 games with Schaub. 5 touchdowns in 3 games with Keenum. Keenum has 3 bad series in one quarter and Kubiak goes back to Schaub. Result: No touchdowns for Andre. He is the one that should be booing Kubiak.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Yeah I thought the same but didnt want to start a pissing match...I know there are some things like showing up at Schaubs house but thats a random wacko or two....

 

[WilsonTheVolleyball]

I fell asleep when the score was 14-14 and couldn't follow the game as it wasn't shown here in New Orleans, but I just gotta know: when Schaub took the field, did the fans boo? I know I would've, not because of my hatred for Schaub, but because of my hatred of the decision to do so at that point in time.

Just for conversation's sake, Jay Cutler is an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season. It's not a forgone conclusion that the Bears will sign him either. I would love to have Cutler. He's already use to wearing blue.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

The fans booed loudly enough that the team had to go to their silent count at home

 

[Braktastic]

I am surprised Kubiak still has a job today.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Bob McNair is ridiculously slow to make a change....we r all worried hes gonna make another excuse for the idiot coach

 

[WilsonTheVolleyball]

The fans booed loudly enough that the team had to go to their silent count at home

Wow! Wish this was uploaded somewhere because while I take your word, I still want to see it to believe it.

 

[jsharlan]

I love McNair for bringing football back to Houston, but I think he is too soft, which apparently is flowing from the top down.

 

[GregR]

I fell asleep when the score was 14-14 and couldn't follow the game as it wasn't shown here in New Orleans, but I just gotta know: when Schaub took the field, did the fans boo? I know I would've, not because of my hatred for Schaub, but because of my hatred of the decision to do so at that point in time.

Just for conversation's sake, Jay Cutler is an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season. It's not a forgone conclusion that the Bears will sign him either. I would love to have Cutler. He's already use to wearing blue.

Yes, about the same 5-10% booed him as had booed him before.

A lot of them shut up when the team started moving the ball with him there, then booed again when the comeback fell short.

 

[GregR]

The fans booed loudly enough that the team had to go to their silent count at home

Wow! Wish this was uploaded somewhere because while I take your word, I still want to see it to believe it.

There was booing at Schaub first going in, and at the ending, and maybe one or two other plays in the middle with bad throws. Nothing that lasted or required a silent count. They were snapping the ball fast to go up tempo and save time, not because they were on a silent count or dealing with noise.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

That may be true I was just reporting what I heard on 790 this morning..... I was too busy going Ramsey like the bud light commercial at my TV

 

[FF Ninja]

I fell asleep when the score was 14-14 and couldn't follow the game as it wasn't shown here in New Orleans, but I just gotta know: when Schaub took the field, did the fans boo? I know I would've, not because of my hatred for Schaub, but because of my hatred of the decision to do so at that point in time.

Just for conversation's sake, Jay Cutler is an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season. It's not a forgone conclusion that the Bears will sign him either. I would love to have Cutler. He's already use to wearing blue.

I'd take Cutler, too, but we can't afford a veteran at the moment. We'll have 3.5M and 7M in dead money from Schaub's contract the next two years (and some from Ed Reed's bonehead contract) and we need to pay JJ Watt soon. Our best hope is to go into next season with Keenum and a rookie to groom. We have too many needs and not enough cap to buy ourselves a QB. On offense we just need a right tackle, but on defense we need a nose tackle, to reduce Antonio Smith's contract or find a new DE, at least one OLB, a FS, and at least one CB.

 

[False Start]

There is no possible way that Kubiak starts Schaub this week right? He has to know that is not going to save his job and do the exact opposite.

 

[jsharlan]

I put nothing past Kubiak at this point. He's a cornered cat.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

It's impossible to tell.... I'm expecting him to start schaub gain because hes off his rocker.....

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Just said in his press conference case will start this week

 

[dhockster]

Just said in his press conference case will start this week

So why, again, did he put Schaub in yesterday?

Here's my other question for Gary. If Case ran the hurry up regularly at U of H, and the hurry up is a good way to neutralize defenses from doing too much against you (they can't change out personnel), why is Gary not running hurry up with Case? It seems like he is setting him up to fail.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

See if theres a podcast of his presser on 610....Kubiak was grilled pretty good by guys like Barry Warner about some of these questions....i dont have time to find a link or i would sorry

 

[False Start]

This is your coach, no wonder this team is 2n8.

“Actually, I think I was really thinking of (Keenum) to be honest with you,” Kubiak said. “I’ve been in this league a long time and dealt with a lot of quarterbacks. I’m trying to develop one right now. Right or wrong, I made that decision because of the situation I thought I was fixing to put a young player in from my standpoint of what I was doing coaching wise. I don’t have time to explain that to y’all. That’s why I do what I did. He knows that. I talked to him about that.”

http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2013/11/texans-will-start-case-keenum-vs-jaguars/

 

[Major]

The fans booed loudly enough that the team had to go to their silent count at home

Wow! Wish this was uploaded somewhere because while I take your word, I still want to see it to believe it.

There was booing at Schaub first going in, and at the ending, and maybe one or two other plays in the middle with bad throws. Nothing that lasted or required a silent count. They were snapping the ball fast to go up tempo and save time, not because they were on a silent count or dealing with noise.

A good number of fans including myself checked out with Schaub's entrance so the booing was prob less than it should've been. I couldn't watch b/c I've seen this movie far too many times.

Kubiak is clueless and not focused on the business/big picture of the team. Case is the hometown hero. Season is done. Groom him and let him fail/thrive. Schaub does nothing for this franchise going forward.

And good for Andre for making a scene. He knows Case is the only guy that brings hope to that offense and was probably tired of being quiet about his feelings. If I'm AJ80, I say trade me or fire Kubiak.

 

[Houston turmOiler]

Well they actually asked Kubiak about the booing and having to go to a silent count in the presser, so i wasnt making it up.....whether that is an accurate description or not is another story....Kubiak brushed it off and used the being in the booth excuse...like youd expect him to do so im not sure if theres gonna be a real answer to that

 

[Major]

I fell asleep when the score was 14-14 and couldn't follow the game as it wasn't shown here in New Orleans, but I just gotta know: when Schaub took the field, did the fans boo? I know I would've, not because of my hatred for Schaub, but because of my hatred of the decision to do so at that point in time.

Just for conversation's sake, Jay Cutler is an unrestricted free agent at the end of the season. It's not a forgone conclusion that the Bears will sign him either. I would love to have Cutler. He's already use to wearing blue.

Yes, about the same 5-10% booed him as had booed him before.

A lot of them shut up when the team started moving the ball with him there, then booed again when the comeback fell short.

The only reason they moved the ball is b/c OAK didn't prepare for Schaub and had to play it safe (give the waffle arm his David Carr esque 5-10 yard throws). Inside the 20, Schaub was worthless.

I left the game and hit up the Verizon bar b/c I knew it was over. I felt like that scene in Bronx Tale where the boss tore up the horse racing tickets before the race ended.

 

[GregR]

Alright, so let's say it is the end of the season. Bob McNair hires you as GM. The Texans have the #1 overall pick.

Who do you hire as coach? You can get any college coach or any NFL or college coordinator, but not cannot get a coach of another NFL team, nor Gruden or Cowher. You can retain any Texans coach or coordinator if you wish.

What would you do at starting and backup QB? Any UFA QB you would try to sign, any QB on another roster you'd try to trade for, or if you draft one, who do you target?

What do you do with the #1 pick, which player would you take at this point, or would you try to trade down?

What players still under contract would you release despite the cap hit?

What players whose contracts are up would you try to re-sign?

 

[TheFly06]

Alright, so let's say it is the end of the season. Bob McNair hires you as GM. The Texans have the #1 overall pick.

Who do you hire as coach? You can get any college coach or any NFL or college coordinator, but not cannot get a coach of another NFL team, nor Gruden or Cowher. You can retain any Texans coach or coordinator if you wish.

What would you do at starting and backup QB? Any UFA QB you would try to sign, any QB on another roster you'd try to trade for, or if you draft one, who do you target?

What do you do with the #1 pick, which player would you take at this point, or would you try to trade down?

What players still under contract would you release despite the cap hit?

What players whose contracts are up would you try to re-sign?

First thing I would do is clean house! Bye Kubes! Bye Wade! BYE MARCIANO!I honestly don't know what to do with the pick. I'm unsure if Teddy has superstar potential. I don't follow the college game as closely as the pro game. But all winning teams need THAT guy to go far. Even if Flacco and Eli aren't in the Brady/Peyton tier, they usually have winning seasons and a real chance at the playoffs for multiple years. I want that so badly. If we win a ring one time out of 15 I'd take that!

Head Coach? Again. I don't follow the college game enough. But this guy has NFL experience as well. Supposedly bright offensive minded guy. Vertical passing game.

Bill O'Brien