What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

HOW TO GET TO HEAVEN WHEN YOU DIE! Read This First Post, THEN Q & A Discussion! ASK QUESTIONS HERE! (1 Viewer)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Politician Spock said:
When I was younger, I made up my mind without looking into it. That's why I spent 30 years of my life being a christian. The more I looked into, the less believable it came. 

Make no mistake, I want it to be true. I really do. It would be awesome if it were true. But wanting it to be true can make people see what they want to see. To really look into it, I had to put my desire for it to be true aside, and let reason prevail.

There is far more factual evidence that Jesus was King Izas of Edessa, than there is that Jesus was a carpenter. There is factual evidence in historical records that King Izas was a Nazarene Jew, led the revolt against Rome, and was crucified outside Jerusalem, along with two other leaders of the revolt. And we can see from Edessan coins that the King of Edessa wears a crown of thorns. It was the traditional headdress of the kings of Edessa. Then we have factual evidence that most everything else attributed to Jesus in the NT came from pagan religions, which were very astrology based (12 constellations/apostles, virgin birth/Virgo, age of Aries ending/Lamb sacrifice, age of Pisces beginning/being fishers of men, heaven and hell are pagan beliefs - not Jewish beliefs).

Looking at factual evidence, It's easy to see where pretty much everything about christianity was pieced together from.... assuming you haven't already made up your mind without looking into it. There's nothing original about it, at all. 
Click to expand...
Interesting.  The more I look into it, the more I know it's true.  You must not be looking in the right places.  You obvously are getting your info from non Christian sources who leave out anything that contradicts their false claims.  Evolutionists leave out info from the School textbooks all of the time that support Creationism.  

 
Paddington said:
Interesting.  The more I look into it, the more I know it's true.  You must not be looking in the right places.  You obvously are getting your info from non Christian sources who leave out anything that contradicts their false claims.  Evolutionists leave out info from the School textbooks all of the time that support Creationism.  
Click to expand...
For 30+ years I limited myself to getting my info from Christian sources... who leave out anything that contradicts their doctrine. It wasn't until I was willing to consider non-christian sources that I realized how close minded I was, and had been indoctrinated.

If you are looking for support of a belief, there are "right places" that will provide that support. Ignoring everything else however leads to misinformed conclusions. Knowing everything I've learned there is no way I can conclude christianity to be true. Again, I'm not saying I've found the right, one true religion. I'm just saying christianity isn't it. 

 
Do the guys that are constantly trying to review for Christianity get some kind of special privileges?  Verizon is akways hammering me with deals like this.  When you get to heaven do you have to put in the referral code?

 
Andy Dufresne said:
Why can't I chose annihilation? I was doing pretty good without existence for roughly 13.8 billion years.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I've gotten to the point in my life where I know I don't want to live forever. When I was younger, of course I wanted to live forever. But the more I experience of life, and especially other people (specifically christians) the more I appreciate that life eventually ends. This might be a reason why it's harder to convert older people to Christianity. Get 'em while they're young!

 
Paddington said:
I hope they have a good pepperoni substitute since I don't believe that meat will be eaten there.  
Click to expand...
Ugh, there's nothing worse than tofu pepperoni, count me out. I can cancel my reservation, right?

 
Paddington, 

I applaud your tenaciousness. But you suffer from the fallacy of wishful thinking: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wishful_thinking#As_a_fallacy

I understand you think you are presenting evidence, facts and logic that in turn result in your conclusion, but this is because what you are presenting is formed, determined and even limited by your fallacy of wishful thinking. It is even encouraged, perhaps even required, by "believers" to study in a method of wishful thinking fallacy, such as not reading or studying anything that may disagree with the faith. At times in history, defenders of the faith even killed those who willingly studied outside of the faith and came to different conclusions. They we're deemed heretics and killed as such. It's even been suggested that the formation of "secret societies" occurred so that people could study outside of the christian doctrine without being deemed a heretic and killed for it. 

I say this to you as someone who suffered through it myself for 30+ years. I didn't know I was suffering from it then. Wishful thinking is a very positive experience. I understand the positive emotion of believing it. I still want it to be true. It would be amazing if it were true. But only after I put my "wishful thinking" aside, and willingly considered all the evidence, even that which opposed my faith, was I able to come to think without fallacy. 

I respect your decision to believe it, and have no issue with you continuing to believe it. I'm writing this for no other purpose than to balance your recruitment of others. They deserve to know both sides of the story. And just like you hope people believe you so that they may get to heaven when they die, I hope they believe me so that they don't waste 30+ years of their life on this religion like I did. 

 
Politician Spock said:
Paddington, 

I applaud your tenaciousness. But you suffer from the fallacy of wishful thinking: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wishful_thinking#As_a_fallacy

I understand you think you are presenting evidence, facts and logic that in turn result in your conclusion, but this is because what you are presenting is formed, determined and even limited by your fallacy of wishful thinking. It is even encouraged, perhaps even required, by "believers" to study in a method of wishful thinking fallacy, such as not reading or studying anything that may disagree with the faith. At times in history, defenders of the faith even killed those who willingly studied outside of the faith and came to different conclusions. They we're deemed heretics and killed as such. It's even been suggested that the formation of "secret societies" occurred so that people could study outside of the christian doctrine without being deemed a heretic and killed for it. 

I say this to you as someone who suffered through it myself for 30+ years. I didn't know I was suffering from it then. Wishful thinking is a very positive experience. I understand the positive emotion of believing it. I still want it to be true. It would be amazing if it were true. But only after I put my "wishful thinking" aside, and willingly considered all the evidence, even that which opposed my faith, was I able to come to think without fallacy. 

I respect your decision to believe it, and have no issue with you continuing to believe it. I'm writing this for no other purpose than to balance your recruitment of others. They deserve to know both sides of the story. And just like you hope people believe you so that they may get to heaven when they die, I hope they believe me so that they don't waste 30+ years of their life on this religion like I did. 
Click to expand...
So what you are saying is that anything that goes against what you would like to be true is not evidence.  You can't refute my evidence, so you will just dismiss it as Non Evidence.  That's not a healthy way to live.  At least Christians, who invented the Scientific Method, who invented Schools, Colleges and Universities, can look at opposing evidence and explain why they disagree with it.  I guess you can't.  It's not wishful thinking.  It's common sense based on the facts and logic.  You should try it.  I know who God is and I will continue to spread the truth of His Gospel throughout the world.    

 
Paddington said:
So what you are saying is that anything that goes against what you would like to be true is not evidence.  You can't refute my evidence, so you will just dismiss it as Non Evidence.  That's not a healthy way to live.  At least Christians, who invented the Scientific Method, who invented Schools, Colleges and Universities, can look at opposing evidence and explain why they disagree with it.  I guess you can't.  It's not wishful thinking.  It's common sense based on the facts and logic.  You should try it.  I know who God is and I will continue to spread the truth of His Gospel throughout the world.    
Click to expand...
I'm saying the opposite of what you said in the first sentence. I want Christianity to be true. I really do. It would be great if it were true. I however no longer believe it because there is more evidence of it not being true than there is of it being true. The evidence you've presented is pretty much limited to the Bible, of which there exists a slew of evidence that it has been altered over the centuries, and which shows a lot of the stories are just pagan stories rebranded. You've even claimed the authors of the gospels were writing as eye witness accounts, of which there is no evidence, even biblical, that suggests such. No one knows who authored them and we know without a doubt that at least two of them used a source we call "Q". Eye witness accounts don't pull their accounts from another source. 

 
Paddington said:
 At least Christians, who invented the Scientific Method, who invented Schools, Colleges and Universities,
Click to expand...
Almost none of this is true.

Galileo developed the scientific method based on the writings of Aristotle, among others. Galileo was, of course, considered by the Christians of his time to be a heretic.

The first schools were developed in ancient Greece, India, and China, none of which were Christian.

The first formal universities, however, were Christian.

 
Politician Spock said:
Yeah, I've gotten to the point in my life where I know I don't want to live forever. When I was younger, of course I wanted to live forever. But the more I experience of life, and especially other people (specifically christians) the more I appreciate that life eventually ends. This might be a reason why it's harder to convert older people to Christianity. Get 'em while they're young!
Click to expand...
I don't get that. I don't appreciate that life ends at all. This is the thing I hate most about atheism: the understanding that the party ends. I'd love to be able to tell myself lies about a neverending soul and other nonsense, but I can't do that either. So I have to live with the cold realization that the curtain will fall when I want nothing more than unending encores.

 
timschochet said:
Almost none of this is true.

Galileo developed the scientific method based on the writings of Aristotle, among others. Galileo was, of course, considered by the Christians of his time to be a heretic.

The first schools were developed in ancient Greece, India, and China, none of which were Christian.

The first formal universities, however, were Christian.
Click to expand...
This is true. We can thank Islam for far more advances in learning than we can thanks the Christians for. Not that that makes Islam any more true than Christianity, but to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable. 

 
Politician Spock said:
This is true. We can thank Islam for far more advances in learning than we can thanks the Christians for. Not that that makes Islam any more true than Christianity, but to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable. 
Click to expand...
Wouldn't it be more accurate to say "we can thank people who happened to be Islamic" rather than "we can thank Islam"? Was it really their religion that led them to learning?

 
Politician Spock said:
This is true. We can thank Islam for far more advances in learning than we can thanks the Christians for. Not that that makes Islam any more true than Christianity, but to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable. 
Click to expand...
How about Calculus? 

 
Smoo said:
Yes. And? What is the operating significance of their being Christian? Would they have failed to develop Calculus if they were not Christian?
Click to expand...
Merely responding to the statement that was made, not the straw man which you wish to discuss.

 
Jrodicus said:
Merely responding to the statement that was made, not the straw man which you wish to discuss.
Click to expand...
Huh?

He said "to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable." You replied "what about Calculus?"

Your implied claim there is that Christianity should get credit for Calculus. That's the point I was refuting. So where's the straw man?

 
Smoo said:
Huh?

He said "to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable." You replied "what about Calculus?"

Your implied claim there is that Christianity should get credit for Calculus. That's the point I was refuting. So where's the straw man?
Click to expand...
Politician Spock said:
This is true. We can thank Islam for far more advances in learning than we can thanks the Christians for. Not that that makes Islam any more true than Christianity, but to give Christianity credit for anything significant in academia is laughable. 
Click to expand...

 
Isaac Newton was born to a christian family, however by his thirties his religious beliefs were more deist than christian. Even if one were to claim he was a christian, they would have to accept that his christian beliefs were not orthodox. In fact, today his beliefs would be considered heresy. He rejected the concept of the trinity and saw worshiping Jesus as god to be idolatry. He also rejected the idea of an immortal soul, and the existence of the devil and demons. 

Gottfried Leibniz can be called a christian, as he never really challenged it much. But he also rarely ever went to church. He said he was a priest of natural rights and that was all he found in the bible. It's also rumored that he rejected blessings on his deathbed. If anything, he's was a christian by birth, and birth only. 

To thank Christianity for calculus because of these two is laughable. But again were talking about a religion that takes credit for everything and makes up BS to explain how it takes credit for it. It's Christmas time. Need a better example?

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Paddington
  • Poll Poll
How To Get To Heaven When You Die. Read The First Post. Then Q&A Discussion. Ask Questions Here! (2
7 8 9
Replies
429
Views
5K
dgreen
dgreen
Paddington
  • Locked
  • Poll Poll
How To Get To Heaven When You Die
2 3
Replies
105
Views
2K
Joe Bryant
Joe Bryant
Joe Bryant
A Glimpse of Beauty In an Ugly Place
Replies
0
Views
195
Joe Bryant
Joe Bryant

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top