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How's the Packer decision to go with Rodgers looking now? (2 Viewers)

I didn't think Favre had a two-year stretch which could compare, but in fairness I went and looked at his numbers and his stretch from '94-'97 was silly good.
:lmao: So you didn't think Favre had a 2-year stretch which compared, even though he won 3 consecutive MVP awards?
What's so funny?And thanks for the heads up. I had no idea Favre won MVP awards.

Yes, I thought Aaron's two-year numbers would have been better than any Favre stretch. One, because Rodgers had numbers which would have been MVP-worthy in many years. Two, because Favre won his MVPs 15 years ago. The game has changed dramatically in that time. Much more of a passing game now with the rules governing defensive contact changing.

Go look at some of the MVP seasons from only 20 years or so ago.

Montana for instance, who won it in '89 & '90.

1989: 3,521 yards, 26 TDs, 8 INTs

1990: 3,944 yards, 26 TDs, 16 INTs

Or Steve Young.

1992: 3,465, 25 TDs, 7 INTs

Rodgers stats last season (4,434 / 30 / 7 ) would compare favorably to any of Favre's 3 MVP seasons.

If you have any other questions you'd like answered, I'll be around.
:lmao: Yes, your answers here have been so compelling that it would be worth asking you more questions. 3-time consecutive MVP. I would certainly make the ingoing assumption that his numbers sucked. Priceless.
 
I didn't think Favre had a two-year stretch which could compare, but in fairness I went and looked at his numbers and his stretch from '94-'97 was silly good.
:lmao: So you didn't think Favre had a 2-year stretch which compared, even though he won 3 consecutive MVP awards?
What's so funny?And thanks for the heads up. I had no idea Favre won MVP awards.

Yes, I thought Aaron's two-year numbers would have been better than any Favre stretch. One, because Rodgers had numbers which would have been MVP-worthy in many years. Two, because Favre won his MVPs 15 years ago. The game has changed dramatically in that time. Much more of a passing game now with the rules governing defensive contact changing.

Go look at some of the MVP seasons from only 20 years or so ago.

Montana for instance, who won it in '89 & '90.

1989: 3,521 yards, 26 TDs, 8 INTs

1990: 3,944 yards, 26 TDs, 16 INTs

Or Steve Young.

1992: 3,465, 25 TDs, 7 INTs

Rodgers stats last season (4,434 / 30 / 7 ) would compare favorably to any of Favre's 3 MVP seasons.

If you have any other questions you'd like answered, I'll be around.
:lmao: Yes, your answers here have been so compelling that it would be worth asking you more questions. 3-time consecutive MVP. I would certainly make the ingoing assumption that his numbers sucked. Priceless.
No need to deflect. I'm sure there are others who don't realize QBs have better numbers now as opposed to 15-20 years ago.My six year-old nephew, for instance.

 
ookook said:
Well, I for one am pleased with the way the decision worked out. Even at the time, I thought it would be folly to let Rodgers go without giving him a chance to start (of course, I probably wouldn't have drafted him if I had been making decisions at the time).That does not mean that how they went about it was ideal. There could have been more transparency and candor. There could have been fewer restrictions placed on the options of where Favre would play. There could have been lots of things worked out if egos had not prevailed on both sides.With all of that said, I think fantasy boards overestimate how good Rodgers is right now being naturally biased by fantasy numbers. I am pretty sure that for just this season, there are 6 to 8 QBs I would be equally happy with. Of course, that is pretty good company but is a bit early to talk the Hall. Of course, given his age, I am giddy about future years' prospects.
I don't think he is being overestimated because of fantasy at all.The kid has such great control of the offense, a rocket arm, and is smart with the football.I don't agree that he is better than Favre ever was...yet...but he could get to that point if he can last and keep this up (and can prove he can do it when it matters late in games, late in the season, and in the postseason).
Am I allowed to agree with you Sho?
You should quite often, as I am often right. :)
 
ookook said:
Well, I for one am pleased with the way the decision worked out. Even at the time, I thought it would be folly to let Rodgers go without giving him a chance to start (of course, I probably wouldn't have drafted him if I had been making decisions at the time).That does not mean that how they went about it was ideal. There could have been more transparency and candor. There could have been fewer restrictions placed on the options of where Favre would play. There could have been lots of things worked out if egos had not prevailed on both sides.With all of that said, I think fantasy boards overestimate how good Rodgers is right now being naturally biased by fantasy numbers. I am pretty sure that for just this season, there are 6 to 8 QBs I would be equally happy with. Of course, that is pretty good company but is a bit early to talk the Hall. Of course, given his age, I am giddy about future years' prospects.
I don't think he is being overestimated because of fantasy at all.The kid has such great control of the offense, a rocket arm, and is smart with the football.I don't agree that he is better than Favre ever was...yet...but he could get to that point if he can last and keep this up (and can prove he can do it when it matters late in games, late in the season, and in the postseason).
Am I allowed to agree with you Sho?
You should quite often, as I am often right. :lmao:
Isn't that kinda like someone telling you they never lie? :)
 
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Raider nation...

You're killing your own argument here. The fact that the older QBs (as a group) put up lower numbers when compared to the QBs today only makes favre look even better---when compared to Rodgers.

 
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.

Rodgers is currently in his 2nd year starting. I believe Favre did not win an MVP until his 4th year starting.

Mike Holmgren actually considered replacing Brett Favre with Mark Brunell early in his career due to his mishaps. It's difficult to manage a team when the QB can single handedly lose you a game due to his tendency to throw interceptions at the worst possible times.

Favre throwing interceptions can be blamed for playoff losses against the Eagles, Rams, and Giants as a Packer. As well as the loss to the Saints as a Viking. He had his times when he was great, but his mistakes ended 4 seasons for his teams.

As far as comparing Favre to Rodgers, they're two different QB's. I enjoyed the Favre years as a Packer fan. But towards the end I wondered if they could have won another SB or two with a more conservative QB. I will say it's a relief to see Rodgers throw the ball away or take a sack (although he is to blame for far too many). In only his second year as a starter he is just going to be better as he progresses, but more importantly the core players around him are very young. As they mature, I think we are going to see some truly astronomical numbers for # 12.

 
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I didn't think Favre had a two-year stretch which could compare, but in fairness I went and looked at his numbers and his stretch from '94-'97 was silly good.
:confused: So you didn't think Favre had a 2-year stretch which compared, even though he won 3 consecutive MVP awards?
What's so funny?And thanks for the heads up. I had no idea Favre won MVP awards.

Yes, I thought Aaron's two-year numbers would have been better than any Favre stretch. One, because Rodgers had numbers which would have been MVP-worthy in many years. Two, because Favre won his MVPs 15 years ago. The game has changed dramatically in that time. Much more of a passing game now with the rules governing defensive contact changing.

Go look at some of the MVP seasons from only 20 years or so ago.

Montana for instance, who won it in '89 & '90.

1989: 3,521 yards, 26 TDs, 8 INTs

1990: 3,944 yards, 26 TDs, 16 INTs

Or Steve Young.

1992: 3,465, 25 TDs, 7 INTs

Rodgers stats last season (4,434 / 30 / 7 ) would compare favorably to any of Favre's 3 MVP seasons.

If you have any other questions you'd like answered, I'll be around.
Why did you leave out Favre's last season (4,202 / 33 / 7) - where Rodgers comes up short on as well.
No he didn't.
 
I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
 
I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
The real MVP was Reggie White.
 
I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
The real MVP was Reggie White.
Favre played extremely well that whole season. Reggie White was clearly the defensive MVP - but more importantly, he was also the vocal, veteran leader of that team. Without Reggie White, there is no way that team wins a Super Bowl. It was such a fun season to watch.
 
Quote from Rodgers

“Just confidence, I think,” Rodgers said. “I feel good about the things we’re doing on offense. We’re spreading the ball around. One stat that doesn’t show is zero sacks. … The checks I’m making at the line of scrimmage are getting us in good situations, and accuracy-wise, I’m throwing the ball well. But I really think it starts up front. I mean, those guys give me time, we’re tough to stop.”

 
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.Rodgers is currently in his 2nd year starting. I believe Favre did not win an MVP until his 4th year starting. Mike Holmgren actually considered replacing Brett Favre with Mark Brunell early in his career due to his mishaps. It's difficult to manage a team when the QB can single handedly lose you a game due to his tendency to throw interceptions at the worst possible times. Favre throwing interceptions can be blamed for playoff losses against the Eagles, Rams, and Giants as a Packer. As well as the loss to the Saints as a Viking. He had his times when he was great, but his mistakes ended 4 seasons for his teams. As far as comparing Favre to Rodgers, they're two different QB's. I enjoyed the Favre years as a Packer fan. But towards the end I wondered if they could have won another SB or two with a more conservative QB. I will say it's a relief to see Rodgers throw the ball away or take a sack (although he is to blame for far too many). In only his second year as a starter he is just going to be better as he progresses, but more importantly the core players around him are very young. As they mature, I think we are going to see some truly astronomical numbers for # 12.
Wasn't that Eagles playoff loss the one where the defense allowed the Eagles to convert late in the game on 4th and 26? I find it inconsistent that you are saying Rodgers can't do it all himself but then you blame a number of losses on Favre without appearing to share blame with the rest of the team.
 
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I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
:popcorn:Favre had a 107+ rating in all three postseason games that year.
 
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.Rodgers is currently in his 2nd year starting. I believe Favre did not win an MVP until his 4th year starting. Mike Holmgren actually considered replacing Brett Favre with Mark Brunell early in his career due to his mishaps. It's difficult to manage a team when the QB can single handedly lose you a game due to his tendency to throw interceptions at the worst possible times. Favre throwing interceptions can be blamed for playoff losses against the Eagles, Rams, and Giants as a Packer. As well as the loss to the Saints as a Viking. He had his times when he was great, but his mistakes ended 4 seasons for his teams. As far as comparing Favre to Rodgers, they're two different QB's. I enjoyed the Favre years as a Packer fan. But towards the end I wondered if they could have won another SB or two with a more conservative QB. I will say it's a relief to see Rodgers throw the ball away or take a sack (although he is to blame for far too many). In only his second year as a starter he is just going to be better as he progresses, but more importantly the core players around him are very young. As they mature, I think we are going to see some truly astronomical numbers for # 12.
Wasn't that Eagles playoff loss the one where the defense allowed the Eagles to convert late in the game on 4th and 26? I find it inconsistent that you are saying Rodgers can't do it all himself but then you blame a number of losses on Favre without appearing to share blame with the rest of the team.
He gets all the credit for the wins, why not the blame for the losses too then?
 
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.

Rodgers is currently in his 2nd year starting. I believe Favre did not win an MVP until his 4th year starting.

Mike Holmgren actually considered replacing Brett Favre with Mark Brunell early in his career due to his mishaps. It's difficult to manage a team when the QB can single handedly lose you a game due to his tendency to throw interceptions at the worst possible times.

Favre throwing interceptions can be blamed for playoff losses against the Eagles, Rams, and Giants as a Packer. As well as the loss to the Saints as a Viking. He had his times when he was great, but his mistakes ended 4 seasons for his teams.

As far as comparing Favre to Rodgers, they're two different QB's. I enjoyed the Favre years as a Packer fan. But towards the end I wondered if they could have won another SB or two with a more conservative QB. I will say it's a relief to see Rodgers throw the ball away or take a sack (although he is to blame for far too many). In only his second year as a starter he is just going to be better as he progresses, but more importantly the core players around him are very young. As they mature, I think we are going to see some truly astronomical numbers for # 12.
Wasn't that Eagles playoff loss the one where the defense allowed the Eagles to convert late in the game on 4th and 26? I find it inconsistent that you are saying Rodgers can't do it all himself but then you blame a number of losses on Favre without appearing to share blame with the rest of the team.
He gets all the credit for the wins, why not the blame for the losses too then?
Tell me about it....I almost feel bad for Greg Lewis. He is the mediocre receiver that made an incredible catch at the back of the endzone with a 49er defender all over him to win a week 3 game last season. The catch of Lewis' career, and Favre got all the credit....even won an ESPY for it. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-pl...9000d5d812f33ea

 
I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
The real MVP was Reggie White.
Of the game or the season?Favre's numbers and his level of play were ridiculous back then...he had a legit claim for the MVP of that Super Bowl too...Howard had that huge play that helped swing momentum...but lets not forget the TDs that got things started and the TD run of Favre as well.
 
sho nuff said:
Phurfur said:
The real MVP was Reggie White.
Of the game or the season?Favre's numbers and his level of play were ridiculous back then...he had a legit claim for the MVP of that Super Bowl too...Howard had that huge play that helped swing momentum...but lets not forget the TDs that got things started and the TD run of Favre as well.
Reggie was in decline as a player but was dominant at times(like 2 plays in the Superbowl).The defense was good with Gilbert Brown/Dotson/Sean Jones and Reggie. It was more than Reggie and Favre was MVP.
 
Ghost Rider said:
I think Rodgers is gonna be a great one, but let me just remind us all that he lit it up last year in the preseason, too, and everyone was all over the Packers bandwagon, only to see them struggle a bit out of the gates in the regular season last year. Now, I understand that we are talking in real terms here, not necessarily fantasy ones, but all I am saying is that we should never get too excited about what we see in preseason.
he lit it up in preseason, then lit it up in the regular season too. dont see what youre saying here
Rodgers and the offense struggled quite a bit the first two weeks of the season after looking unstoppable all preseason. That is all I was saying.
The Westin said:
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.
a. Howard did not scored 2 special teams touchdowns in that game; he scored 1. b. Favre still put 29 points on the board in that game. Not that I am saying you did this, but I always laugh when people try to say that Favre only has a ring because of Desmond Howard, as if that one play was the whole game.
It wasn't but that one play really hurt the Patriots and turned the tide back to Green bay. When Reggie got 2 sacks on Bledsoe it almost sealed the deal.
 
Pretty interesting read from Andrew Brandt.

Randys rant; was almost a Packer (twice)

Brett Favre's wishes unanswered in 2007, 2008 - Andrew Brandt

September 15, 2010, 01:01 PM EST

The strange ranting of Randy Moss this week takes me back to the weekend of the 2007 Draft; much of it spent trying to sign Moss. It was a brief but intense negotiation that fueled some fire with Brett Favre when, for the first of two times, the Packers couldn’t agree with Moss on a contract.

Moss for sale

The Raiders bold experiment with Moss – they had traded Napoleon Harris and the 7th pick in the 2005 Draft for him – ended after two seasons when Moss could be had for a mid-round pick. Ted Thompson surprisingly had some interest, having been impressed with the way Moss handled himself at a charity event that he happened to be at in Texas. And Brett, of course, was extremely jazzed about the idea.

Now there were two parts to the deal to make it happen. First, there had to be agreement with the Raiders on draft pick compensation. We were offering a fifth-round pick and the Patriots later came up with a fourth. That, however, was the not the key to the deal.

One-year deal breaker

Moss was scheduled to make $9.75 million for 2007 and $11.25 million in 2008. Those amounts may well have been $100 million and $200 million; he was not making what was on the contract. We needed to bring in Moss, coming off a year with a pedestrian 43 receptions, at a more reasonable number with upside. The Patriots were also showing interest.

I negotiated with Moss’s agent while the recruiting from the alpha dogs – Brett and Tom Brady -- intensified. Moss was getting texts and calls throughout the weekend from both Favre and Brady both imploring him to come and form a powerhouse duo.

The offers from both teams were very similar for 2007, both around $3 million with additional incentives. Our proposal allowed Moss to make more than the Patriots proposal, although we had significant money tied to 45-man active roster bonuses, protecting us from injury if he could not play.

Our offer, however, required a second year in 2008. Moss and his agents were adamant that he wanted only a one-year deal. Having lost market value from his Raider experience, Moss would agree to a massive pay reduction for 2007 but wanted to hit the open market in 2008 coming off what he expected to be a big season.

The feeling in our discussions was that we did not want to rent Randy for a year only to have him shop to highest bidder in a few months trying to recoup some of his lost earnings in 2007. We discussed different ideas, but in the end we were insistent on a two-year deal. While we haggled about an appropriate roster bonus to activate the second year of the deal, the Patriots relented on the length and agreed to a one-year deal. That was it; he was going with Brady.

Mississippi burning

Brett was livid. The rest of the weekend I was fielding calls from Bus Cook about what went wrong in trying to sign Randy. Ted did not want to deal with Bus, so I listened patiently to their rancor and tried to explain our position.

I truly empathized with Brett. He had befriended and admired Randy for years and the two of them had dreamed of playing together. Here was an opportunity for us to make it a reality. But ultimately, we stood on our principles requiring more than a one-year commitment.

I told Brett to trust what we had at the position; that Greg Jennings would be a star in a couple years. He said he didn’t have a couple of years. Brett offered to give up some of his salary for the following season – although that was his last season with the Packers (see below) -- to bring in Randy. I told that was much appreciated but we would never take his money away from him to sign another player.

Brett was forever wanting a more aggressive attitude by the front office toward player acquisition than the present regime. My constant message that our method of drafting and developing talent rather than acquiring proven commodities only served to infuriate him and his resentment of a general manager that showed him none of the compassion and welcomed input of previous regimes.

Patriot games

Fast forward to 2008. After a wonderful year for the Patriots, catching 98 balls for 1493 yards and 23 touchdowns, Moss was a free agent as he designed, now with interest from several teams to cash in on his one-year deal. And cash in he did, re-signing with the Patriots for a three-year, $27 million deal with over $14 million guaranteed.

And guess what team showed some decent interest again in 2008? Yes, the Packers (along with the Eagles and Cowboys). But again, despite getting Brett's hopes up again, the Packers bowed out of the bidding (I had left the Packers at that point but heard the anger and frustration from Brett’s camp). Moss re-signed with the Patriots on March 3rd. Favre retired from the Packers on March 4th. Coincidence?

Whither Randy?

Now Moss is coming to the end of that deal with deafening silence from the Patriots about re-signing for the third time. A lot can change between now and March, but it appears he has had his run wit the team, and it’s been a successful and lucrative one. And one that found the Packers in second place for his services twice.

 
Favre's only Superbowl win came the year his team had the best defensive player in the league as well as the #1 rated defense. Desmond Howard scored 2 Special Teams touchdowns and earned himself Superbowl MVP honors. Aaron Rodgers cannot be expected to do it all himself, as Brett Favre didn't have to either.Rodgers is currently in his 2nd year starting. I believe Favre did not win an MVP until his 4th year starting. Mike Holmgren actually considered replacing Brett Favre with Mark Brunell early in his career due to his mishaps. It's difficult to manage a team when the QB can single handedly lose you a game due to his tendency to throw interceptions at the worst possible times. Favre throwing interceptions can be blamed for playoff losses against the Eagles, Rams, and Giants as a Packer. As well as the loss to the Saints as a Viking. He had his times when he was great, but his mistakes ended 4 seasons for his teams. As far as comparing Favre to Rodgers, they're two different QB's. I enjoyed the Favre years as a Packer fan. But towards the end I wondered if they could have won another SB or two with a more conservative QB. I will say it's a relief to see Rodgers throw the ball away or take a sack (although he is to blame for far too many). In only his second year as a starter he is just going to be better as he progresses, but more importantly the core players around him are very young. As they mature, I think we are going to see some truly astronomical numbers for # 12.
Wasn't that Eagles playoff loss the one where the defense allowed the Eagles to convert late in the game on 4th and 26? I find it inconsistent that you are saying Rodgers can't do it all himself but then you blame a number of losses on Favre without appearing to share blame with the rest of the team.
He gets all the credit for the wins, why not the blame for the losses too then?
Maybe you need to reread the post I responded to. It wasn't giving Favre all the credit for the wins. It was minimizing his contribution to the wins and pinning the blame on him for the losses.
 
Pretty interesting read from Andrew Brandt.

Randys rant; was almost a Packer (twice)

Brett Favre's wishes unanswered in 2007, 2008 - Andrew Brandt

September 15, 2010, 01:01 PM EST

The strange ranting of Randy Moss this week takes me back to the weekend of the 2007 Draft; much of it spent trying to sign Moss. It was a brief but intense negotiation that fueled some fire with Brett Favre when, for the first of two times, the Packers couldn’t agree with Moss on a contract.

Moss for sale

The Raiders bold experiment with Moss – they had traded Napoleon Harris and the 7th pick in the 2005 Draft for him – ended after two seasons when Moss could be had for a mid-round pick. Ted Thompson surprisingly had some interest, having been impressed with the way Moss handled himself at a charity event that he happened to be at in Texas. And Brett, of course, was extremely jazzed about the idea.

Now there were two parts to the deal to make it happen. First, there had to be agreement with the Raiders on draft pick compensation. We were offering a fifth-round pick and the Patriots later came up with a fourth. That, however, was the not the key to the deal.

One-year deal breaker

Moss was scheduled to make $9.75 million for 2007 and $11.25 million in 2008. Those amounts may well have been $100 million and $200 million; he was not making what was on the contract. We needed to bring in Moss, coming off a year with a pedestrian 43 receptions, at a more reasonable number with upside. The Patriots were also showing interest.

I negotiated with Moss’s agent while the recruiting from the alpha dogs – Brett and Tom Brady -- intensified. Moss was getting texts and calls throughout the weekend from both Favre and Brady both imploring him to come and form a powerhouse duo.

The offers from both teams were very similar for 2007, both around $3 million with additional incentives. Our proposal allowed Moss to make more than the Patriots proposal, although we had significant money tied to 45-man active roster bonuses, protecting us from injury if he could not play.

Our offer, however, required a second year in 2008. Moss and his agents were adamant that he wanted only a one-year deal. Having lost market value from his Raider experience, Moss would agree to a massive pay reduction for 2007 but wanted to hit the open market in 2008 coming off what he expected to be a big season.

The feeling in our discussions was that we did not want to rent Randy for a year only to have him shop to highest bidder in a few months trying to recoup some of his lost earnings in 2007. We discussed different ideas, but in the end we were insistent on a two-year deal. While we haggled about an appropriate roster bonus to activate the second year of the deal, the Patriots relented on the length and agreed to a one-year deal. That was it; he was going with Brady.

Mississippi burning

Brett was livid. The rest of the weekend I was fielding calls from Bus Cook about what went wrong in trying to sign Randy. Ted did not want to deal with Bus, so I listened patiently to their rancor and tried to explain our position.

I truly empathized with Brett. He had befriended and admired Randy for years and the two of them had dreamed of playing together. Here was an opportunity for us to make it a reality. But ultimately, we stood on our principles requiring more than a one-year commitment.

I told Brett to trust what we had at the position; that Greg Jennings would be a star in a couple years. He said he didn’t have a couple of years. Brett offered to give up some of his salary for the following season – although that was his last season with the Packers (see below) -- to bring in Randy. I told that was much appreciated but we would never take his money away from him to sign another player.

Brett was forever wanting a more aggressive attitude by the front office toward player acquisition than the present regime. My constant message that our method of drafting and developing talent rather than acquiring proven commodities only served to infuriate him and his resentment of a general manager that showed him none of the compassion and welcomed input of previous regimes.

Patriot games

Fast forward to 2008. After a wonderful year for the Patriots, catching 98 balls for 1493 yards and 23 touchdowns, Moss was a free agent as he designed, now with interest from several teams to cash in on his one-year deal. And cash in he did, re-signing with the Patriots for a three-year, $27 million deal with over $14 million guaranteed.

And guess what team showed some decent interest again in 2008? Yes, the Packers (along with the Eagles and Cowboys). But again, despite getting Brett's hopes up again, the Packers bowed out of the bidding (I had left the Packers at that point but heard the anger and frustration from Brett’s camp). Moss re-signed with the Patriots on March 3rd. Favre retired from the Packers on March 4th. Coincidence?

Whither Randy?

Now Moss is coming to the end of that deal with deafening silence from the Patriots about re-signing for the third time. A lot can change between now and March, but it appears he has had his run wit the team, and it’s been a successful and lucrative one. And one that found the Packers in second place for his services twice.
Very interesting read. I remember having.....um....spirited debates on this board with people who insisted that the Packers never had any opportunity to sign Moss. Some of those folks were....less than polite.....in responding to people who (somewhat critically of Ted Thompson) suggested otherwise.Pretty clear from the above that the Pack had a very real shot at landing Moss back in '07.

Now whether or not that would have been a good idea....well, that's certainly a topic worth debating.

 
Brett was livid. The rest of the weekend I was fielding calls from Bus Cook about what went wrong in trying to sign Randy. Ted did not want to deal with Bus, so I listened patiently to their rancor and tried to explain our position.

I truly empathized with Brett. He had befriended and admired Randy for years and the two of them had dreamed of playing together. Here was an opportunity for us to make it a reality. But ultimately, we stood on our principles requiring more than a one-year commitment.

I told Brett to trust what we had at the position; that Greg Jennings would be a star in a couple years. He said he didn’t have a couple of years.
:lmao: at Favre's BS.
 
Very interesting read. I remember having.....um....spirited debates on this board with people who insisted that the Packers never had any opportunity to sign Moss. Some of those folks were....less than polite.....in responding to people who (somewhat critically of Ted Thompson) suggested otherwise.
I remember those debates, and some folks saying that Thompson should have done what Favre wanted, team be damned. That was the first public example I remember of Favre wanting to play GM.
 
Brett was livid. The rest of the weekend I was fielding calls from Bus Cook about what went wrong in trying to sign Randy. Ted did not want to deal with Bus, so I listened patiently to their rancor and tried to explain our position.

I truly empathized with Brett. He had befriended and admired Randy for years and the two of them had dreamed of playing together. Here was an opportunity for us to make it a reality. But ultimately, we stood on our principles requiring more than a one-year commitment.

I told Brett to trust what we had at the position; that Greg Jennings would be a star in a couple years. He said he didn’t have a couple of years.
:lmao: at Favre's BS.
Was worth a shot right? :lol:
 
The other thing hidden in the decision.

One of the main pieces in the trade up to get Clay Matthews, was the pick GB got from the Jets for Favre.

Seems like that is working out pretty well.

 
I think the Packers are in better shape than they've been in a long time. We're no longer in salary cap hell and we're poised to make a run for the next few years at least. Life is good in Packer Nation. :thumbup:

 
Rogers is looking good, but he's still 0-2 against Favre's Vikings.
Thanks, wasn't aware of that. :thumbup:
1-2 nowWhat are the odds on it being 2-2 after this coming weekend?
In Minnesota, I'd say Packers favored by 3. I wouldn't be surprised if the Packers retired Childress like they did Phillips though. I say final score41-17 Packers.
I'd be plenty pleased with any victory, no matter how narrow or lucky, and no injuries.
 
although technically i would argue farve is 3-0, since I still think that Moss short armed that last throw into the endzone.

and i say that as a packer fan

 
I have said since Day 1 that TT is making what is quite possibly the biggest blunder in NFL history.
:lmao: Packer fans (the real ones, not some of the message board posers in this thread with jealousy based vendettas against Favre) all agree with you. It is criminal what has happened to that franchise.
Just looking through this thread from the start and there are some gems.Though, I doubt any who were bashing me non-stop in the first 20 pages will admit that TT has actually shown he knows a bit about football.But this one is great.The biggest blunder in NFL history and someone claiming that real Packer fans all felt that way.Hah!!!!!
 
Matthews is the best player on the Packers right now. I'd hate to see what he'd do on the Jets with the rest of their studs.
:thumbdown: You don't really understand football do you?
What about what he said is so wrong?Matthews may very well be their best player right now...if not 1a and 1b with Rodgers.Now, how he would have gotten to the Jets is a mystery as I don't think they traded with them to go into the 1st round.
 
Matthews is the best player on the Packers right now. I'd hate to see what he'd do on the Jets with the rest of their studs.
:goodposting: You don't really understand football do you?
What about what he said is so wrong?Matthews may very well be their best player right now...if not 1a and 1b with Rodgers.Now, how he would have gotten to the Jets is a mystery as I don't think they traded with them to go into the 1st round.
I wasn't looking at the draft, more stating that there are not a lot of stars on the Packers defense outside of Matthews. If they could add another great player or two he'd be even better.
 
I wasn't looking at the draft, more stating that there are not a lot of stars on the Packers defense outside of Matthews. If they could add another great player or two he'd be even better.
I think there are several stars and some very good up and comers right now.But I would like to see another threat on the other OLB spot.But Woodson, Collins, Tramon are stars or becoming stars.Raji has the potential in the middle.And quietly (well, quietly to those not paying attention) AJ Hawk is playing much better and been very good calling the defense. Add in the help he is getting with Bishop (and maybe that is a difference with AJ that he and Bishop play better together than Hawk and Barnett did).Ive heard several radio guys speculating that they should try Barnett at OLB next year. Certainly worth a shot IMO.
 
If Pickett is back healthy the Packers could actually have a semblance of a defensive line rotation for the game agains the Vikes. that would be really something. They have'nt had this all year.

 
If Pickett is back healthy the Packers could actually have a semblance of a defensive line rotation for the game agains the Vikes. that would be really something. They have'nt had this all year.
What, you don't like moving Lang in there. :goodposting:
 
If Pickett is back healthy the Packers could actually have a semblance of a defensive line rotation for the game agains the Vikes. that would be really something. They have'nt had this all year.
What, you don't like moving Lang in there. :popcorn:
Let's just say I think that Jenkins, Raji, Howard Green, and Picket all healthy are a lot better rotation than jenkins with a cast and Raji. The Packers have been decent against the run with only two Dlinemen. They might be something to see now. I know Raji can use the rest.Also, I would not mind seeing Jenkins, Raji, and Pickett all meeting at Brett Favre as he steps up to avoid Matthews.
 
A lot of people on both sides of this were wrong. A few interesting stats...

Favre's record since leaving the Packers is 24-17. Rodgers is 23-18.

Favre got to the NFC Championship game and Rodgers has yet to win a playoff game.

:rolleyes:

 
A lot of people on both sides of this were wrong. A few interesting stats...Favre's record since leaving the Packers is 24-17. Rodgers is 23-18.Favre got to the NFC Championship game and Rodgers has yet to win a playoff game. :whistle:
Right. And the Viking's future looks very bright with Favre.
 

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