How's the Packer decision to go with Rodgers looking now? (2 Viewers)

[sho nuff]

re: ThompsonThe poster was right before... Thompson thinks his way is the right way and has the ego to prove it. Fine, but 99/100 times when you have a Pro Bowl QB wanting to return vs. a "rookie" QB who never started a game... you take the veteran QB. Thompson threw Rodgers to the wolves and that was unfair to Rodgers. Again, this year is Rodgers learning curve that I believe most Packers fans have embraced. We, however, do not like this nor are willing to accept it because of what the team did last year. We want that again and we saw those results walk out of the door when Thompson made the "wrong" decision to not bring Favre back.

If it was just vet QB wanting to return...fine...bit it was not just that simple. He was not just wanting to return without other things happening before that.Anyone expecting a repeat of last year needs to have their heads checked.

Where do you get your information from? ESPN, Fox News, CNNSi, where exactly? There have been many news stories, mostly, from the national media market who have reported many false things compared to what was reported in the local market. Believe who you will but I will believe the Green Bay media over the national media when it comes to anything Packers related. Keep shouting what you would like to believe but the louder you say something, does not make it true.

Who reported the false things? Oh yeah...taking Favre at his word over the multitude of reports.He admits to telling them several times he could not commit.Admits that he told them not to come to Mississippi after the owners meeting because he could not commit. His words...not the words of a journalist or even the team. But his own words he admits he told them not to bother. The GB media reported this as well. Funny, it seems ESPN is the one reporting Brett's side more than the Green Bay media...so where are you getting your info from?

 

[sho nuff]

re: Favre = 4-5The teams would have game planned differently for him. A reason why Grant was great last year is because he was an unknown with Favre behind him. Favre was known for picking teams apart and beating them. With that knowledge, teams laid off of the line because they did not want to get beat by Favre vs. Grant. Move ahead to this year and who is the unknown? Rodgers is. Tee up on the QB by sending blitz packages that a rookie may not pick out, hit him a few times early, and stop the run forcing the pass. Rodgers has had some good games while the injured back field labors. With all things equal, I think the Packers would be 6-3 with Favre right now. O-line issues do not hamper Favre as they do Rodgers. How many quick slants have we seen this year? That was Favre's go to play with Driver or Jennings. Rodgers does not hit those throws. The LB's lay off the line a little bit more with Favre and the threat of a deep ball and quick release. Rodgers does not have either of those tools yet... deep ball, quick release.

The quick slants are still there...but not as often.And Rodgers has shown the ability and the guts (I don't like that word, but best I could come up with) to go deep. A bit too often at times IMO.Favre was good at handling the blitz at times...and piss poor at other times.And people have to look at the line as far as some of the struggles with the run game too. I don't think anybody can honestly say Clifton is playing as well as he has in the past.

No, the slants are not there. Rodgers has thrown, maybe, a handful this whole year. Those slants and hitches keep the LB's honest and not allowed to cheat the line thus helping out in the run game. Rodgers does not throw those either because he is not reading them, not able to do so, or whatever. Those quick tosses and gains keep the defense from cheating. Surely, even you can acknowledge this. Defenses do not have to prepare for those throws like they did with Favre. That helps the defense out greatly.How can you say "Favre was good at handling the blitz at times... and piss poor at other times" and keep a straight face on you? If we are going to compare Favre vs. Rodgers at picking up the blitz, Favre wins this argument every time. No way does Favre take two safeties yesterday, no way does Favre hold the ball as long as Rodgers does. Yesterday there was a play when Rodgers rolled out and Minnesota had a delayed blitz on and he took a sack. No way does that happen with Favre back there. If you cannot acknowledge these differences than you should not add anymore to the conversation, seriously.

So what's the debate? A 16 year vet is better at recognizing the blitz and getting rid of the ball? No kidding? Look, Rodgers has played better than most of us thought. But it's year one starting for him.Anyone that wants to compare Rodgers right now to Favre right now is doing so completely unfairly.If you want to rip Thompson for the decision, knowing full well we'd see some growing pains. Have at it. That was his call. I still believe it's the correct one long term, and I'm willing to see a one-two year dip in record as Rodgers gets his feet wet.

Have you read my other postings in the thread? I clearly admit and accept that Favre is "better" at many things compared to Rodgers. I know this.Others have gone on record saying the Packers would be in the same position now even if Favre was behind the line. I do not think that would be true. If it is true, the people bashing Favre should come in here and give credit to the team for the 4-12 year instead of bashing Favre for those days. Again, all of your questions in the post have been answered and accepted by me in this thread.

The 4-12 days were never all his fault either. Nor were all the wins all on him either.Thats the point...the rest of this current team is playing poorly. QB is not the biggest issue right now.The line and the defense are playing far worse than last year.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

 

[sho nuff]

Just read some interesting facts....The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver. Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Points given up in those games...13, 13, 24, 16, 14, 13Notice anything there? Also Favre played incredible in those games. But he has hardly looked like that guy this year.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Just read some interesting facts....The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver. Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Points given up in those games...13, 13, 24, 16, 14, 13Notice anything there?

Yep...I see the number 13 three times.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Those stats combined with the offense going from #2 last year in the NFL to #19th this year in total yards tell the story. I guess we can add the terrible play calling by McCarthy and Sanders refusal to blitz.

 

[H.K.]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

 

[Challenge Everything]

Just read some interesting facts....The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver. Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Points given up in those games...13, 13, 24, 16, 14, 13But he has hardly looked like that guy this year.

Packers games in 2007 after 9 games = 228 points for and 142 from opponents.Packers games in 2008 after 9 games = 237 points for and 206 from opponents.I would be willing to bet the defense has scored more points in 2008 than it did in 2007 by this time. But, as far as scoring goes, the Packers of 2008 have put the points up to be successful. And, quit repeating "Favre is not the same in 2008 as he was in 2007" argument. Nobody is trying to say otherwise.

 

[FavreCo]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

On the flip side, the defense suffers without Favre. Teams can run on the Pakcers and control the ball. Lat year they had to keep up with the Packers offense. That meant throw more agains the packers.For instance, in 2007 Minnesota ran the ban 37 times total in 2 games vs the Packers becasue they were getting thrashed. They couldn't run and hope to win.

In 2008, the Vikings ran the ball 74 times total in 2 games. They don't have to try and keep up. Thus the D wears down. That's because the O is not the same with Rodgers.

 

[sho nuff]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Those stats combined with the offense going from #2 last year in the NFL to #19th this year in total yards tell the story. I guess we can add the terrible play calling by McCarthy and Sanders refusal to blitz.

Don't get me started on Sanders.I have no clue why, with the secondary GB has, that they don't blitz more.

 

[sho nuff]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

Now...I know even more that Im right about it...because HK is spouting off in here disagreeing with me.

 

[griz145389]

I thought the general consensus was that the Packers had a much better team then the Jets. Ted Thompson is a genius with picking all these great players in the draft, just look at all that great depth the Packers have. Seems to be working out pretty well for the team. The Packers will be mired in mediocrity until Ted leaves. He is unwilling to make the push to turn a good team into a great one.

I disagree...they were not mired in mediocrity last year.Yes...he makes some good moves.But everyone loves the sign sign sign mentality of some other GMs...what does it get them. Ask Al Davis and Dan Snyder.I think they will be just fine while Ted is around. He has proven he will make the moves when he sees a guy he needs and wants.This season...what was the real savior to this team? Favre? Not the way he is playing this year.

I am not suggesting that a gm should sign every big name free agent on the market, however picking up a few players here and there would not be a bad thing. Other than Charles Woodson, he has not made any large splashes in free agency. Why walk into a year 30 million below the cap? If you are always worried about building for the future, today will never come. The NFL is not about what might or might not happen 2 years from now in free agency, it is about making the right moves to make your team a superbowl contender. Being so tight with money that you would think Thompson has to pay these guys himself is not a good aspect of a general manager. He does pretty well at managing the draft, but his refusal to go after any players in free agency is why the Packers will not be a great team. When a team performs the way the Packers did the year before, and they have the type of cap room the Packers did in the offseason, you would expect them to seriously make a play for a top free agent or two. Instead our big signing was Brandon Chillar.

Why must teams make large splashes in FA. And have you seen the FA busts out there.And FA is not the only way to build a team. How many big time FAs have the Colts signed in the past 10 years? Yet they are one of the winningest teams out there.TT has signed Woodson (one I actually thought he overpaid for and am glad to be wrong about that), Pickett (who played very well last year and not so much this year), Chillar. Also he spends money keeping the core guys around. Like Driver, Kampman, Barnett, Harris. He traded to get Grant. He brought in some other guys that simply did not work out...ol Marquand Manuel who was seen as a decent safety a few years ago...but he sucks we later found out.As for Chillar...yes, he was the signing this year...and has been pretty solid...probably playing better than any other LB we have.Notice a GM who is a good friend of Ted Thompson, who has the same style is 9-0 right now in Tennessee. Tell me what big FA moves they have made.And what top free agents out there this year would have helped this Packer team?Were we going to sign and LT and kick Clifton to the curb? Any top LBs out there that would have replaced Hawk or Barnett? Should TT have anticipated Cullen Jenkins injury and signed a top DE?

free agent signings by the Titans includedJevon Kearse, Alge Crumpler, Justin Mccareins, Jake Scott. They are all listed as being starteres for the Titans this year, in addition they also signed a few backups. The Packers signed Frost as their punter, other than that no starters, and only backup (Chillar) that is getting any significant time on the field. So please enlighten me how this is the same style of going after people in free agency. I would have been happy if teh Packers had made similar signings to what the Titans made. However we ended up with a punter that is horrible and a good backup.

 

[sho nuff]

I thought the general consensus was that the Packers had a much better team then the Jets. Ted Thompson is a genius with picking all these great players in the draft, just look at all that great depth the Packers have. Seems to be working out pretty well for the team. The Packers will be mired in mediocrity until Ted leaves. He is unwilling to make the push to turn a good team into a great one.

I disagree...they were not mired in mediocrity last year.Yes...he makes some good moves.But everyone loves the sign sign sign mentality of some other GMs...what does it get them. Ask Al Davis and Dan Snyder.I think they will be just fine while Ted is around. He has proven he will make the moves when he sees a guy he needs and wants.This season...what was the real savior to this team? Favre? Not the way he is playing this year.

I am not suggesting that a gm should sign every big name free agent on the market, however picking up a few players here and there would not be a bad thing. Other than Charles Woodson, he has not made any large splashes in free agency. Why walk into a year 30 million below the cap? If you are always worried about building for the future, today will never come. The NFL is not about what might or might not happen 2 years from now in free agency, it is about making the right moves to make your team a superbowl contender. Being so tight with money that you would think Thompson has to pay these guys himself is not a good aspect of a general manager. He does pretty well at managing the draft, but his refusal to go after any players in free agency is why the Packers will not be a great team. When a team performs the way the Packers did the year before, and they have the type of cap room the Packers did in the offseason, you would expect them to seriously make a play for a top free agent or two. Instead our big signing was Brandon Chillar.

Why must teams make large splashes in FA. And have you seen the FA busts out there.And FA is not the only way to build a team. How many big time FAs have the Colts signed in the past 10 years? Yet they are one of the winningest teams out there.TT has signed Woodson (one I actually thought he overpaid for and am glad to be wrong about that), Pickett (who played very well last year and not so much this year), Chillar. Also he spends money keeping the core guys around. Like Driver, Kampman, Barnett, Harris. He traded to get Grant. He brought in some other guys that simply did not work out...ol Marquand Manuel who was seen as a decent safety a few years ago...but he sucks we later found out.As for Chillar...yes, he was the signing this year...and has been pretty solid...probably playing better than any other LB we have.Notice a GM who is a good friend of Ted Thompson, who has the same style is 9-0 right now in Tennessee. Tell me what big FA moves they have made.And what top free agents out there this year would have helped this Packer team?Were we going to sign and LT and kick Clifton to the curb? Any top LBs out there that would have replaced Hawk or Barnett? Should TT have anticipated Cullen Jenkins injury and signed a top DE?

free agent signings by the Titans includedJevon Kearse, Alge Crumpler, Justin Mccareins, Jake Scott. They are all listed as being starteres for the Titans this year, in addition they also signed a few backups. The Packers signed Frost as their punter, other than that no starters, and only backup (Chillar) that is getting any significant time on the field. So please enlighten me how this is the same style of going after people in free agency. I would have been happy if teh Packers had made similar signings to what the Titans made. However we ended up with a punter that is horrible and a good backup.

So they signed a cheap and old used up DE.A TE who is 2nd on their depth chart.Ill give you Scott...but thats also after losing their own guys on the line the past few years.And an overrated and cheap WR.None of those guys were big key highly touted FAs. Crumpler is the only thing close to that.And Chillar has also started as he did against the Colts.And GB was also in a better position this year without the needs that Tennessee had.TN lost Starks and Odom off their Dline.and had no WRs.Its quite a bit the same style as TT adding guys a few years ago in places of need without breaking the bank on big time free agents.You might want to read up on Reinfeldt and Thompson's style and relationship.

 

[griz145389]

I thought the general consensus was that the Packers had a much better team then the Jets. Ted Thompson is a genius with picking all these great players in the draft, just look at all that great depth the Packers have. Seems to be working out pretty well for the team. The Packers will be mired in mediocrity until Ted leaves. He is unwilling to make the push to turn a good team into a great one.

I disagree...they were not mired in mediocrity last year.Yes...he makes some good moves.But everyone loves the sign sign sign mentality of some other GMs...what does it get them. Ask Al Davis and Dan Snyder.I think they will be just fine while Ted is around. He has proven he will make the moves when he sees a guy he needs and wants.This season...what was the real savior to this team? Favre? Not the way he is playing this year.

I am not suggesting that a gm should sign every big name free agent on the market, however picking up a few players here and there would not be a bad thing. Other than Charles Woodson, he has not made any large splashes in free agency. Why walk into a year 30 million below the cap? If you are always worried about building for the future, today will never come. The NFL is not about what might or might not happen 2 years from now in free agency, it is about making the right moves to make your team a superbowl contender. Being so tight with money that you would think Thompson has to pay these guys himself is not a good aspect of a general manager. He does pretty well at managing the draft, but his refusal to go after any players in free agency is why the Packers will not be a great team. When a team performs the way the Packers did the year before, and they have the type of cap room the Packers did in the offseason, you would expect them to seriously make a play for a top free agent or two. Instead our big signing was Brandon Chillar.

Why must teams make large splashes in FA. And have you seen the FA busts out there.And FA is not the only way to build a team. How many big time FAs have the Colts signed in the past 10 years? Yet they are one of the winningest teams out there.TT has signed Woodson (one I actually thought he overpaid for and am glad to be wrong about that), Pickett (who played very well last year and not so much this year), Chillar. Also he spends money keeping the core guys around. Like Driver, Kampman, Barnett, Harris. He traded to get Grant. He brought in some other guys that simply did not work out...ol Marquand Manuel who was seen as a decent safety a few years ago...but he sucks we later found out.As for Chillar...yes, he was the signing this year...and has been pretty solid...probably playing better than any other LB we have.Notice a GM who is a good friend of Ted Thompson, who has the same style is 9-0 right now in Tennessee. Tell me what big FA moves they have made.And what top free agents out there this year would have helped this Packer team?Were we going to sign and LT and kick Clifton to the curb? Any top LBs out there that would have replaced Hawk or Barnett? Should TT have anticipated Cullen Jenkins injury and signed a top DE?

free agent signings by the Titans includedJevon Kearse, Alge Crumpler, Justin Mccareins, Jake Scott. They are all listed as being starteres for the Titans this year, in addition they also signed a few backups. The Packers signed Frost as their punter, other than that no starters, and only backup (Chillar) that is getting any significant time on the field. So please enlighten me how this is the same style of going after people in free agency. I would have been happy if teh Packers had made similar signings to what the Titans made. However we ended up with a punter that is horrible and a good backup.

So they signed a cheap and old used up DE.A TE who is 2nd on their depth chart.Ill give you Scott...but thats also after losing their own guys on the line the past few years.And an overrated and cheap WR.None of those guys were big key highly touted FAs. Crumpler is the only thing close to that.And Chillar has also started as he did against the Colts.And GB was also in a better position this year without the needs that Tennessee had.TN lost Starks and Odom off their Dline.and had no WRs.Its quite a bit the same style as TT adding guys a few years ago in places of need without breaking the bank on big time free agents.You might want to read up on Reinfeldt and Thompson's style and relationship.

No none of the guys that the Titatns signed was a blockbuster deal. However, each and every one of them that I mentioned is a significant contributor to their team. That is my point. The Packers signed a horrible punter, and a good back up line backer that can start at times. There should be some happy medium between going nuts like Snyder, and doing next to nothing like Thompson. Again please explain to me how the Packers free agency period was similar to the Titans. You can't because they were not. When you pick examples to try and make a point, at least make sure they are correct examples before you post them.I don't think Thompson is a horrible GM. He does very well with the draft. However there is more to being a gm than just the draft, and it is fairly obvious that Thompson does not make the moves in free agency that could put the team at the next level. I do not bash him for every move he makes. For instance I sided with him on the Tony G issue. He has done a good job with the draft as I have already mentioned. But he is too tight with tcap dollars, and that is why he will not put the Packers at the next level.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

You crack me up. Stop the run and run the ball.

That's why they are where they are. Period.

 

[Tau837]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

You crack me up. Stop the run and run the ball.

That's why they are where they are. Period.

Well, last year the Packers were 8-1 after 9 games despite not being able to run the ball. So half your argument doesn't hold up.

 

[Man in the yellow hat]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

You crack me up. Stop the run and run the ball.

That's why they are where they are. Period.

Well, last year the Packers were 8-1 after 9 games despite not being able to run the ball. So half your argument doesn't hold up.

Go take a look at the run defense. There is your answer. Anyone who doesn't see that the run defense is killing them this year...well, I just don't even know what to say.

 

[Tau837]

Just read some interesting facts....

The Packers are currently tied for 20th place in the NFL and have not beat a team with a winning record.

First seven games last year they beat Philly, Giants, Chargers, Vikings, Redskins, and Broncos in Denver.

Avg rushing yards in those six victories only 45.50 yards. Yet six victories.

Rushing defense: 07, I have them at about 98 yards per game over the first seven.Rushing defense: 08, I have them at about 131 yard per game over the first seven.

Penalties 07: 407 yards over first seven.

Penalties 08: 508 yards over first seven.

If you want to know the difference, I thinks those stats tell the story.

Excellent illustration on how the offense suffering from the loss of Favre has hurt the Packer D Nothing sums TT's folly up better than this:

2007 Packers with Favre 8-1

2008 Packers without Favre 4-5

2007 Jets without Favre 1-8

2008 Jets with Favre 6-3

Again, I feel sorry for the real Packer fans who have had to suffer through this nightmare.

You crack me up. Stop the run and run the ball.

That's why they are where they are. Period.

Well, last year the Packers were 8-1 after 9 games despite not being able to run the ball. So half your argument doesn't hold up.

Go take a look at the run defense. There is your answer. Anyone who doesn't see that the run defense is killing them this year...well, I just don't even know what to say.

OK, then you should have said that instead of citing two reasons, one of which hasn't been any different than last year.

 

[deep vacuum]

 

[JamesTheScot]

On the flip side, the defense suffers without Favre. Teams can run on the Pakcers and control the ball. Lat year they had to keep up with the Packers offense. That meant throw more agains the packers.For instance, in 2007 Minnesota ran the ban 37 times total in 2 games vs the Packers becasue they were getting thrashed. They couldn't run and hope to win.In 2008, the Vikings ran the ball 74 times total in 2 games. They don't have to try and keep up. Thus the D wears down. That's because the O is not the same with Rodgers.

I've got to disagree here. You're putting the cart before the horse.Running a ball control offense is THE textbook way to control a quick strike offense. So even if Favre was the high scoring threat you made him out to be, opposing teams last year would have been able to mitigate that advantage by controlling the ball on the ground from the first quarter on and keeping him off the field. It doesn't matter if Favre scored a TD in the first 5 minuted of a quarter if the opposition can grind out a 10 minute drive on the ground, then the score will still be 7-7 at the end of the quarter and the opposiiton is under no pressure to abandon the run.However, if the GB D stops that grinding running game, then FAvre's scoring can create a point deficit. So it's still the D which dictates what the opposition can do - not Favre. If the D plays well, the Packers build a lead. If the D doesn't, the other team stays close and the game is contested till the final buzzer. In other words, it doesn't matter how many points Favre scores, if the D isn't getting stops early in the game, there isn't going to be a lead for Favre to play with. But even when the D limits scores, it's going to take a double digit lead in the teens or more in the late second or third quarters to get a running team to quit running the ball.I haven't seen any stats posted which show the point spread that Favre enjoyed entering the 4th quarter last year compared to Rodgers this year so it's mere speculation at this point. But even if FAvre did have an advantage - that advantage might be the reuslt of the D playing better last year, not Favre playing better last year than Rodgers is this year.

 

[H.K.]

Go take a look at the run defense. There is your answer.

Anyone who doesn't see that the run defense is killing them this year...well, I just don't even know what to say.

From the Data Dominator -Through Ten games with Favre in 2007

2,757 Passing Yards

129 First Downs

Through Ten games with Rodgers in 2008

2,123 Passing Yards

92 First Downs

You want the root cause for poor rushing defense? Look at how your current QB is putting you defense back on the field compared to who you had last season.

GB's Defense and Special teams have scored 7 TD's so far this year, last year they had 3 TD's in the first 10 games.

You are throwing the wrong side of the ball under the bus.

 

[Phase of the Game]

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/34206699.html#comments

McCarthy's day-after press conference: Vikings game

By Greg A. Bedard of the Journal Sentinel

Nov. 10, 2008 12:49 p.m. | Green Bay - Coach Mike McCarthy will discuss the Packers' 28-27 loss to the Minnesota Vikings starting at 12:15 p.m.

We'll bring you news and notes as they happen.

Linebacker Nick Barnett is out for the season with a torn knee ligament. No surgery scheduled yet.

McCarthy said he doesn't second-guess himself, specifically about the end of the game. He liked the play calls, was comfortable with the distance on the field. But the goal was "to get the first down and get the time all the way down."

"I'd love to say the playcalling was god awful but I don't think that was the case after viewing the game film. Defensively I thought we played outstanding from the turnover standpoint...Frankly I think the offense needs to play much better to keep the defense off the field, which factored into the run defense."

"The punting wasn't what it needed to be."

"You want me to swing all the way to the right when we win, and all the way to the left when when we lose. I'm not going to that."

"I know you don't want to hear it, but we were one play away from being successful yesterday."

"Changes aren't for today." But they could be made later in the week.

"I'm not going to make excuses for Aaron, he needs to play better...But this is his first opportunity playing up there."

"I'm comfortable with the way the game was called."

"The amount of pressure was too much. So it was a challenge to keep battling to stay above that. He actually played better in the second half than the first half....The one thing that's disappointing for me from an offensive emphasis this week was to start fast and we did not do that. Our tempo was not there getting in and out of the huddle. We emphasize it all week and we didn't do it. We need to start the game faster."

Our protection problems have come in bunches. Really it's negative plays. We had seven negative plays and eight penalties so a combined 15 negative plays.

Jarrett Bush (ankle) will be a challenge to play this week. Brandon Chillar will have his shoulder looked at again this week.

I thought our football team improved over the course of the week. I'm disappointed in the result.

 

[sho nuff]

No none of the guys that the Titatns signed was a blockbuster deal. However, each and every one of them that I mentioned is a significant contributor to their team. That is my point. The Packers signed a horrible punter, and a good back up line backer that can start at times. There should be some happy medium between going nuts like Snyder, and doing next to nothing like Thompson. Again please explain to me how the Packers free agency period was similar to the Titans. You can't because they were not. When you pick examples to try and make a point, at least make sure they are correct examples before you post them.I don't think Thompson is a horrible GM. He does very well with the draft. However there is more to being a gm than just the draft, and it is fairly obvious that Thompson does not make the moves in free agency that could put the team at the next level. I do not bash him for every move he makes. For instance I sided with him on the Tony G issue. He has done a good job with the draft as I have already mentioned. But he is too tight with tcap dollars, and that is why he will not put the Packers at the next level.

I did not say the free agent periods were the same. I said the styles are the same.Neither GM does alot in free agency, will not break the bank, and will add pieces as needed.The fact of the matter is the Titans needed to do more, especially on the Dline, as they let 3 players go (Starks, Odom, Laboy) recently. They had no big receiving option so they added 2.My example stands quite strong if you actually get what I was saying.Its obvious he will make the moves when players are there that he wants and needs (Woodson, Pickett, Chillar...) I agree he is good with the draft (except on the Oline).

 

[sho nuff]

For those bringing up the Jets record and the Packers record.

How does this sound to you.

2007

Tampa 9-7

New Orleans 7-9

I guess New Orleans should have went after Garcia instead of Brees right?

Hint...its not just about the QB...you have to take the rest of the team into consideration.

Before Favre was even thought of in NY, they brought in Faneca, Jenkins, and Pace. They added more than just #4 and those additions are doing quite well for them.

Their run defense is much better and their Oline is quite improved as well.

 

[Frank Black]

I expected Rogers to take GB to the Superbowl during his 1st year as a starter. I don't believe that a 1st year starter should have any learning curve whatsoever. I don't see even the slightest indication that Rogers can be a successful QB in the NFL.

 

[Sabertooth]

McCarthy needs to get this team some accountability. The penalties fall on the coach. You just can't have marginal players like Clifton and Colledge committing penalties. It's one thing when a star player gets a penalty because they make up for those lost yards by making plays. But when mediocre players such as any of the offensive lineman make these type of mistakes before even getting the chance to be blown back off the ball, it really sets up failure. The Packers honestly don't have a single lineman that would be considered great. Tauscher is the best they've got but he's getting long in the tooth and none of the young prospects have shown any real ability. Plus they make a lot of mental mistakes and are small.

 

[sho nuff]

McCarthy needs to get this team some accountability. The penalties fall on the coach. You just can't have marginal players like Clifton and Colledge committing penalties. It's one thing when a star player gets a penalty because they make up for those lost yards by making plays. But when mediocre players such as any of the offensive lineman make these type of mistakes before even getting the chance to be blown back off the ball, it really sets up failure. The Packers honestly don't have a single lineman that would be considered great. Tauscher is the best they've got but he's getting long in the tooth and none of the young prospects have shown any real ability. Plus they make a lot of mental mistakes and are small.

I would not call Clifton marginal or mediocre overall. His play this year...sure...

 

[H.K.]

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/34206699.html#comments

McCarthy's day-after press conference: Vikings game

By Greg A. Bedard of the Journal Sentinel

Nov. 10, 2008 12:49 p.m. | Green Bay - Coach Mike McCarthy will discuss the Packers' 28-27 loss to the Minnesota Vikings starting at 12:15 p.m.

Frankly I think the offense needs to play much better to keep the defense off the field, which factored into the run defense.

I'm not going to make excuses for Aaron, he needs to play better.

/discussion

 

[CletiusMaximus]

Clifton has got to be feeling the heat now and it will be interesting to see how he plays on Sunday, and really how the team in general responds in a huge game after the devastating loss last weekend. I re-watched some of the game last night and it was terrible to see all the drives that were stalled due to penalties, forcing the team into 2nd and 3rd down passing situations. Clifton played in the pro bowl last February, is reportedly a proud man and I am hoping to see him respond positively in a huge game against the Bears. McCarthy probably has as much job security as any coach in the NFL right now, so I expect him to do whatever is necessary to right the ship and get a win.

The season will be back on track with a Jets win on Thursday and a Packers win on Sunday.

 

[Sabertooth]

McCarthy needs to get this team some accountability. The penalties fall on the coach. You just can't have marginal players like Clifton and Colledge committing penalties. It's one thing when a star player gets a penalty because they make up for those lost yards by making plays. But when mediocre players such as any of the offensive lineman make these type of mistakes before even getting the chance to be blown back off the ball, it really sets up failure. The Packers honestly don't have a single lineman that would be considered great. Tauscher is the best they've got but he's getting long in the tooth and none of the young prospects have shown any real ability. Plus they make a lot of mental mistakes and are small.

I would not call Clifton marginal or mediocre overall. His play this year...sure...

Of course I am talking about this year! He's old and hasn't been the same since the Sapp ordeal. He needs to be replaced, as does every other player on that line not named Tauscher. And Tauscher's heir apparent needs to be found. And they need to scrap the ZBS which mean they probably need a different OLine coach. They lost a lot when they lost Beightol. Sitton may have a chance. Giancomo or whatever his name is has the size. Colledge peaked in college. Spitz is just a guy, probably belongs on a bottom feeder like Cincy though. Moll, just a guy (is he even on the team)? Barbre is just a guy who can't even crack the lineup on a line full of underachievers. Wells is just ok.

 

[sho nuff]

McCarthy needs to get this team some accountability. The penalties fall on the coach. You just can't have marginal players like Clifton and Colledge committing penalties. It's one thing when a star player gets a penalty because they make up for those lost yards by making plays. But when mediocre players such as any of the offensive lineman make these type of mistakes before even getting the chance to be blown back off the ball, it really sets up failure. The Packers honestly don't have a single lineman that would be considered great. Tauscher is the best they've got but he's getting long in the tooth and none of the young prospects have shown any real ability. Plus they make a lot of mental mistakes and are small.

I would not call Clifton marginal or mediocre overall. His play this year...sure...

Of course I am talking about this year! He's old and hasn't been the same since the Sapp ordeal. He needs to be replaced, as does every other player on that line not named Tauscher. And Tauscher's heir apparent needs to be found. And they need to scrap the ZBS which mean they probably need a different OLine coach. They lost a lot when they lost Beightol. Sitton may have a chance. Giancomo or whatever his name is has the size. Colledge peaked in college. Spitz is just a guy, probably belongs on a bottom feeder like Cincy though. Moll, just a guy (is he even on the team)? Barbre is just a guy who can't even crack the lineup on a line full of underachievers. Wells is just ok.

He made his first pro-bowl last year.Has not missed a game I don't think (before the Titans game this year) since coming back from the Sapp deal.They need to sign Tauscher is the big thing right now. And I agree, right now he is the only one playing all that well. I don't mind Wells and Spitz. Colledge...meh, time to cut their losses there.IMO, they lost alot when they lost Jagz to BC as he was the one who brought the ZBS to Green Bay.

 

[Sabertooth]

McCarthy needs to get this team some accountability. The penalties fall on the coach. You just can't have marginal players like Clifton and Colledge committing penalties. It's one thing when a star player gets a penalty because they make up for those lost yards by making plays. But when mediocre players such as any of the offensive lineman make these type of mistakes before even getting the chance to be blown back off the ball, it really sets up failure. The Packers honestly don't have a single lineman that would be considered great. Tauscher is the best they've got but he's getting long in the tooth and none of the young prospects have shown any real ability. Plus they make a lot of mental mistakes and are small.

I would not call Clifton marginal or mediocre overall. His play this year...sure...

Of course I am talking about this year! He's old and hasn't been the same since the Sapp ordeal. He needs to be replaced, as does every other player on that line not named Tauscher. And Tauscher's heir apparent needs to be found. And they need to scrap the ZBS which mean they probably need a different OLine coach. They lost a lot when they lost Beightol. Sitton may have a chance. Giancomo or whatever his name is has the size. Colledge peaked in college. Spitz is just a guy, probably belongs on a bottom feeder like Cincy though. Moll, just a guy (is he even on the team)? Barbre is just a guy who can't even crack the lineup on a line full of underachievers. Wells is just ok.

He made his first pro-bowl last year.Has not missed a game I don't think (before the Titans game this year) since coming back from the Sapp deal.They need to sign Tauscher is the big thing right now. And I agree, right now he is the only one playing all that well. I don't mind Wells and Spitz. Colledge...meh, time to cut their losses there.IMO, they lost alot when they lost Jagz to BC as he was the one who brought the ZBS to Green Bay.

The line just has no identity at all. They hung their hat on the pass blocking last season but that has gone light years backwards. Obviously the run blocking hasn't been much better and the penalties have just killed them.

 

[hauser42]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

 

[Ookie Pringle]

Jets with Favre are now 7-3 and in first place in the AFC East.

 

[Ookie Pringle]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

Injuries happen to every team in the NFL. If the Packers have "depth at almost every spot on the team" then why are they 4-5 and how do they look like a contender for YEARS TO COME?

 

[parasaurolophus]

the local radio clowns on 1250AM are driving me nuts with this crap.

After three weeks they were all in love with Rodgers and supported Ted Thompson.

Now they have turned on Thompson, but they claim its not because of Rodgers. They think that TT should have done a better job with the defensive line because thats why we cant win any games.

Well what about the offense? This team is averaging 50 fewer yards of offense per game and only 2 fewer rushing yards per game.

This team is far better if Favre is QB.

They were 13-3 last year. No way they dont win this crappy division this year.

 

[hauser42]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

Injuries happen to every team in the NFL. If the Packers have "depth at almost every spot on the team" then why are they 4-5 and how do they look like a contender for YEARS TO COME?

I take it you did not see this team play the last couple of weeks. They just about beat the only undefeated team in the league on the road. Did not bring more than a C game to the dome last week and just about won. IF they would have won those games all you would hear is how great this team is, now all want to dump on them.YEARS TO COME is right. Take a look at the roster before you post next time. Lot of young talent on the roster and cap space to keep them around for years. For only a couple of players missing from last year this is the same team that made it the NFC title game.One player doesn't make a team. Favre got a lot of credit for winning over the years, but he had a lot of teammates helping him. Look at Bretts numbers this year, you dont see the yardage like you did last year. Packer wideouts gained a ton of yardage for him last year after the catch. Cotchery and Coles are not guys that can do that so Bretts numbers have suffered for the lack of talent around him.

 

[bcr8f]

I'd like to thank the Jets for that 2nd round pick.

 

[bcr8f]

Go take a look at the run defense. There is your answer.

Anyone who doesn't see that the run defense is killing them this year...well, I just don't even know what to say.

From the Data Dominator -Through Ten games with Favre in 2007

2,757 Passing Yards

129 First Downs

Through Ten games with Rodgers in 2008

2,123 Passing Yards

92 First Downs

You want the root cause for poor rushing defense? Look at how your current QB is putting you defense back on the field compared to who you had last season.

GB's Defense and Special teams have scored 7 TD's so far this year, last year they had 3 TD's in the first 10 games.

You are throwing the wrong side of the ball under the bus.

Different year. Rodgers 24

Favre 39

Real fans care more about the future than one year. If they brought Favre back and Rodgers became a FA you would be bashing Green Bay(because that's what you do) for letting him go.

 

[Challenge Everything]

One player doesn't make a team. Favre got a lot of credit for winning over the years, but he had a lot of teammates helping him. Look at Bretts numbers this year, you dont see the yardage like you did last year. Packer wideouts gained a ton of yardage for him last year after the catch. Cotchery and Coles are not guys that can do that so Bretts numbers have suffered for the lack of talent around him.

The stats difference is due to the play calling. Have you seen the Jets' play calling? The Jets also have a 1,000 yard rusher on the horizon... the Packers do not. at "pass yards" are because the WR's are different and thus have caused lower pass yards. The play calling is altogether different thus yards are not as prevalent.

 

[Phase of the Game]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.

Tell us how the offensive line has been built so well.

 

[Phase of the Game]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

Injuries happen to every team in the NFL. If the Packers have "depth at almost every spot on the team" then why are they 4-5 and how do they look like a contender for YEARS TO COME?

One player doesn't make a team.

I hope there comes a day when the TT lovers will acknowledge how much Brett Favre meant to the Packers and the impact he is having for the Jets.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Go take a look at the run defense. There is your answer.

Anyone who doesn't see that the run defense is killing them this year...well, I just don't even know what to say.

From the Data Dominator -Through Ten games with Favre in 2007

2,757 Passing Yards

129 First Downs

Through Ten games with Rodgers in 2008

2,123 Passing Yards

92 First Downs

You want the root cause for poor rushing defense? Look at how your current QB is putting you defense back on the field compared to who you had last season.

GB's Defense and Special teams have scored 7 TD's so far this year, last year they had 3 TD's in the first 10 games.

You are throwing the wrong side of the ball under the bus.

Different year. Rodgers 24

Favre 39

Real fans care more about the future than one year. If they brought Favre back and Rodgers became a FA you would be bashing Green Bay(because that's what you do) for letting him go.

Wrong, the Packers could have easily had Favre back this year and kept Rodgers.

 

[Phase of the Game]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

Injuries happen to every team in the NFL. If the Packers have "depth at almost every spot on the team" then why are they 4-5 and how do they look like a contender for YEARS TO COME?

For only a couple of players missing from last year this is the same team that made it the NFC title game.

And yet the Packers are 4-5 and may be looking at 4-6 if they can't stop the Bears streak of 4 straight wins at Lambeau Field.

 

[ScottyFargo]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.

Tell us how the offensive line has been built so well.

I almost posted the same thing last night, but I didn't want to pull the rug out from under anybody.

 

[sho nuff]

Jets with Favre are now 7-3 and in first place in the AFC East.

Yup...and unlike previous games...he did look very good last night. I will give him that.Looks more and more like a 2nd rounder.Though, kudos to the broadcast team last night for not just glowing about Favre and actually mentioning the other major additions to that team.

 

[sho nuff]

the local radio clowns on 1250AM are driving me nuts with this crap.After three weeks they were all in love with Rodgers and supported Ted Thompson. Now they have turned on Thompson, but they claim its not because of Rodgers. They think that TT should have done a better job with the defensive line because thats why we cant win any games. Well what about the offense? This team is averaging 50 fewer yards of offense per game and only 2 fewer rushing yards per game.This team is far better if Favre is QB.They were 13-3 last year. No way they dont win this crappy division this year.

Few things.It is not about Rodgers. He is playing pretty well.Several areas have regressed from last year...most notably the Oline, the Dline, and the LBs.Losing Jenkins hurt the Dline for sure, not sure why Pickett all of a sudden sucks...but he does. Jolly has had a very good year, so losing Corey Williams hurt a bit, but Jolly was starting over him last year anyway (prior to Jolly getting hurt).Far better with Favre? Maybe. I would agree better. But not sure about far better. Unless somehow he is going to keep the Oline from dumb penalties and letting guys free to the QB.

 

[sho nuff]

My heart goes out to the true Packer fans who have had to suffer due to TT's ego. They deserved better.

Suffer How??Man has rebuilt the team into a contender for years to come. Packers have gone from having only solid starters to having depth at almost every spot on the team.Tougher schedule and injuries really have took care of this team. 13-3 just doesn't happen that much in the NFL. Lot of things have to happen to get that many wins and last year it did.

Injuries happen to every team in the NFL. If the Packers have "depth at almost every spot on the team" then why are they 4-5 and how do they look like a contender for YEARS TO COME?

One player doesn't make a team.

I hope there comes a day when the TT lovers will acknowledge how much Brett Favre meant to the Packers and the impact he is having for the Jets.

I hope there comes a day when you realize there are other parts of the team not performing that have little to nothing to do with Brett Favre...and that for several games this year, Favre has not played that well. And that the rest of the Jets have improved quite a bit. NFL network realized that and highlighted the other changes...maybe someday you will admit that.