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Javon Walker for Tatum Bell? (1 Viewer)

JohnnyU

Footballguy
Take it for what it's worth, which is not much. This was mentioned on sirius. Sorry if this is a :honda:.

 
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Slinger

Footballguy
The Packers just resigned Davenport recently. With him, Green and Gado already on the roster I highly doubt the Packers trade for Bell.

 

JohnnyU

Footballguy
The Packers just resigned Davenport recently.  With him, Green and Gado already on the roster I highly doubt the Packers trade for Bell.
Is Gado a RB? lol. Poop dude can't stay healthy either. Maybe GB would like to rid itself of the Walker problem.
 
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-OZ-

Footballguy
The Packers just resigned Davenport recently. With him, Green and Gado already on the roster I highly doubt the Packers trade for Bell.
Is Gado a RB? lol. Poop dude can't stay healthy either. Maybe GB would like to rid itself of the Walker problem.
That seems to be the logic here.FWIW, don't both Najeh and Ahman have 1 year contracts? I'm not sure about Gado's.

With Denver, figure Smith is aging, Lelie isn't a #1 WR, so Walker makes sense for them. Plus they can draft their RB. So really no true downside here.

Is it possible that Denver would trade Lelie and Bell for Walker and one of Ahman, Najeh or Gado? Any of these, but especially Ahman would be fierce behind Denver's line for a year. I suspect it wouldn't happen, but figured I'd ask.

 

KCC

Footballguy
I would never trade Walker for someone because they've looked good (and not great, as so many others have) running behind the Denver O-line.

 

Loco Barlow

Footballguy
I would never trade Walker for someone because they've looked good (and not great, as so many others have) running behind the Denver O-line.
Well, Tatum Bell HAS looked great running behind that Denver O-line. He's shown his explosiveness with two back to back 5.0+ ypc seasons. The only thing that kept Tatum Bell from a 1000+ yard, 10+ TD season this year was that his playing time was limited. Otherwise, he's probably a Denver stud.
 
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kwille

Footballguy
I could see a very remote chance of Walker for Bell and a 2nd round pick. But definitely not straight up.

 

thatguy

Footballguy
I could see a very remote chance of Walker for Bell and a 2nd round pick. But definitely not straight up.
Walker is probably worth Bell or a 2nd round pick. No way is he worth both with all the questions regarding his recovery.Plus, he has said repeatedly that he does not want to play with the Packers, so they'd be wise to get what they can for him before the situation escalates.

 
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-OZ-

Footballguy
I would never trade Walker for someone because they've looked good (and not great, as so many others have) running behind the Denver O-line.
Sure, just trade Champ Bailey instead. ;) Obviously Portis was worth more than Bell is, but Champ was worth more than Walker is as well.

 

KCC

Footballguy
I would never trade Walker for someone because they've looked good (and not great, as so many others have) running behind the Denver O-line.
Well, Tatum Bell HAS looked great running behind that Denver O-line. He's shown his explosiveness with two back to back 5.0+ ypc seasons. The only thing that kept Tatum Bell from a 1000+ yard, 10+ TD season this year was that his playing time was limited. Otherwise, he's probably a Denver stud.
I think you and I are actually on the same page. My issues are that Bell hasn't had a 200 carrie or a 1000 yrd. season yet, was the second best back on his team last year in terms of total yards and TDs, and wasn't able to beat out Mike Anderson to become the sole starting RB. His ypc may be impressive, but there are a lot of backs out there that have looked very impressive in Denver. If people feel Walker is worth giving up for Bell, what would you be willing to trade for Anderson?
 

-OZ-

Footballguy
If people feel Walker is worth giving up for Bell, what would you be willing to trade for Anderson?
Obviously Baltimore was interested in anderson, but I'm not sure I'd give much for a 33 year old RB.
 

Loco Barlow

Footballguy
If people feel Walker is worth giving up for Bell, what would you be willing to trade for Anderson?
Obviously Baltimore was interested in anderson, but I'm not sure I'd give much for a 33 year old RB.
I think Baltimore signing Anderson is nothing more than lipstick on a pig. I'd be surprised if Anderson even accumulates 300 yards rushing in Baltimore. It's kind of like when Denver went out and signed Garrison Hearst...anybody remember that? Didin't think so, it turned out to be non-news.
 
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Buckeyedawgs

Footballguy
You guys don't seem to get it. All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries. Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet. That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts!

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs! It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.

 

sho nuff

Footballguy
You guys don't seem to get it. All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries. Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet. That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts!

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs! It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.
Not sure how bell really fits in with what they want to do though. But he would be a change of pace from the bigger bodies of Green Gado and Davenport.How about this...Walker for Bell and they swap the #5 pick for both of Denver's first rounders?

 

JuniorNB

Footballguy
If Green Bay does this, it's an indication of either, Walker's attitude becoming too much to handle, or his rehab isn't going very well.

Bell is and always will be a home run threat, but he's horrible at short yardage. He fumbles too much. And he can't block.

I can't see them trading a number one receiver for a change of pace, home run threat back.

 

Kleck.

Footballguy
If Green Bay does trade Walker, I'd rather see them trade him for a draft pick(s) than Bell. There are a few RB's in this draft I think Green Bay could get in the 3rd round that I feel would be a better fit.

 

cstu

Footballguy
You guys don't seem to get it. All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries. Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet. That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts!

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs! It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.
Not sure how bell really fits in with what they want to do though. But he would be a change of pace from the bigger bodies of Green Gado and Davenport.How about this...Walker for Bell and they swap the #5 pick for both of Denver's first rounders?
If this does go down, it signals that Favre isn't coming back and that the Packers are going to be a running team with Rodgers at QB. That Favre is retiring is the only reason I can see this trade happening.
 
You guys don't seem to get it.  All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries.  Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet.  That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts! 

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs!  It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.
Not sure how bell really fits in with what they want to do though. But he would be a change of pace from the bigger bodies of Green Gado and Davenport.How about this...Walker for Bell and they swap the #5 pick for both of Denver's first rounders?
If this does go down, it signals that Favre isn't coming back and that the Packers are going to be a running team with Rodgers at QB. That Favre is retiring is the only reason I can see this trade happening.
If this trade happens I will personally shoot Ted Thompson's dog.
 

Buckeyedawgs

Footballguy
I see it as Bell being last years Tony Fisher! Except he might be forced a heavy load early until the other three backs are recovered.

You can't blame Thompson for Walker's attitude problem. He is signed to a contract! If Walker wants big $$$ it's show time to prove he deserves it! He got a huge signing bonus his rookie year. One year of production and 2 years of whinning does not merit a huge pay increase! If he's gonna act like T.O and be a problem and refuse to play then they gotta get rid of him! Let someone else have the BABY!

 

The Boss

Footballguy
I'm amazed at how people are just ready to throw Tatum Bell under the bus. Tatum Bell is dynamite when he touches the ball. Sure he gets stopped for a loss just like any other back. I really think the stories about Tatum Bell's lack of positive yardage, fumbling, injury-proness, etc. are way, way, way overexaggerated.

 

cstu

Footballguy
I'm amazed at how people are just ready to throw Tatum Bell under the bus. Tatum Bell is dynamite when he touches the ball. Sure he gets stopped for a loss just like any other back. I really think the stories about Tatum Bell's lack of positive yardage, fumbling, injury-proness, etc. are way, way, way overexaggerated.
That's the FF effect on a guy that everyone wanted to be the next Portis. It's not his fault and I think he's done well for a 2nd round NFL draft pick.
 

Big Score

Footballguy
You guys don't seem to get it. All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries. Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet. That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts!

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs! It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.
FYI,Gado's injury was not all that serious.

Luckily for Gado, an injured MCL is far less severe than a torn anterior cruciate ligament (ACL). Unlike an ACL injury, a torn MCL often does not even require surgery, though the recovery time can still be up to 12 weeks. That timeframe should get Gado back on the field sometime this spring
 

pigskinliquors

Dr. Parrothead
You guys don't seem to get it. All 3 packer RB are comeing off serious injuries. Yes, they have 3 proven backs signed and all 3 capable of produceing if healthy. But they have 0 proven backs that are not seriously injured and we have no idea even if they will actually be be able to ever play again. They are not at the point they can even run yet. That is why they all signed cheap 1 year contracts!

I could see this happening. Packers need all the RB help they can get with the seriousness of there injured backs! It won't be June at earliest before they can even test the injuries to see if they can be effective again.
Not sure how bell really fits in with what they want to do though. But he would be a change of pace from the bigger bodies of Green Gado and Davenport.How about this...Walker for Bell and they swap the #5 pick for both of Denver's first rounders?
If this does go down, it signals that Favre isn't coming back and that the Packers are going to be a running team with Rodgers at QB. That Favre is retiring is the only reason I can see this trade happening.
If this trade happens I will personally shoot Ted Thompson's dog.
P.E.T.A we have another Packer incident on line two...
 

The Boss

Footballguy
I'm amazed at how people are just ready to throw Tatum Bell under the bus.  Tatum Bell is dynamite when he touches the ball.  Sure he gets stopped for a loss just like any other back.  I really think the stories about Tatum Bell's lack of positive yardage, fumbling, injury-proness, etc. are way, way, way overexaggerated.
That's the FF effect on a guy that everyone wanted to be the next Portis. It's not his fault and I think he's done well for a 2nd round NFL draft pick.
I agree. Though I still don't feel Bell has been given a fair opportunity to see what he can do. Bell is strong, did something like 24 reps at the combine--the most of any RB I believe. His rookie year he had a 5.3 ypc average on something like 73 carries---small sample size. Then this year his load is increased to 173 carries and he still averages 5.3 ypc. I don't know what they're seeing in Denver, but this guy looks good to me. If they're afraid he'll wear down, then give him the chance to prove them wrong. They had the same concerns about Portis and Portis answered the critics. I feel Bell can too.
 
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P Boy

Footballguy
I agree. Though I still don't feel Bell has been given a fair opportunity to see what he can do. Bell is strong, did something like 24 reps at the combine--the most of any RB I believe. His rookie year he had a 5.3 ypc average on something like 73 carries---small sample size. The this year his load is increased to 173 carries and he still averages 5.3 ypc. I don't know what they're see ing in Denver, but this guy looks good to me. If they're afraid he'll wear down, then give him the chance to prove them wrong. They had the same concerns about Portis and Portis answered the critics. I feel Bell can too.
Here's the crux of the issue. It doesn't matter if you think he can be a 25 carry-a-week RB, or that I don't think he can be a decent 25 carry-a-week RB. What matters is that Shanahan doesn't trust him to tote the mail full time (which he has plainly said & backed up with his actions) - and that being the case, for as long as he is with DEN he'll throw yet another large knot into an always very tangled web in the preseason.
 

The Boss

Footballguy
I agree.  Though I still don't feel Bell has been given a fair opportunity to see what he can do.  Bell is strong, did something like 24 reps at the combine--the most of any RB I believe.  His rookie year he had a 5.3 ypc average on something like 73 carries---small sample size.  The this year his load is increased to 173 carries and he still averages 5.3 ypc.  I don't know what they're see ing in Denver, but this guy looks good to me.  If they're afraid he'll wear down, then give him the chance to prove them wrong.  They had the same concerns about Portis and Portis answered the critics.  I feel Bell can too.
Here's the crux of the issue. It doesn't matter if you think he can be a 25 carry-a-week RB, or that I don't think he can be a decent 25 carry-a-week RB. What matters is that Shanahan doesn't trust him to tote the mail full time (which he has plainly said & backed up with his actions) - and that being the case, for as long as he is with DEN he'll throw yet another large knot into an always very tangled web in the preseason.
Very true. But sometimes I just don't get the NFL or what talent evaluators are seeing. It's such an inexact science that is dominated by subjective opinions. For instance, Tatum Bell is probably physically bigger than Reggie Bush. Yet, most regard Bell as a role player while Bush is viewed as a franchise player....and I'm assuming a 20+ carry per week RB. Yes, I know Bush has some intangibles Bell doesn't, I'm making this comparison based purely on physical size. I also understand some guys play through pain more than others, but really at this point the jury is still out on both Bell and Bush, really Bush more so than Bell. Bell proved he'd play through pain last year with his separated shoulder. I just don't get it. I guess that's why they pay guys like Ron Wolf and Phil Savage the big money...to sit back and recylce players they've once scouted before, and every now and then they get lucky and pat themselves on the back on how good they are at scouting players.
 
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P Boy

Footballguy
Very true. But sometimes I just don't get the NFL or what talent evaluators are seeing. It's such an inexact science that is dominated by subjective opinions. For instance, Tatum Bell is probably physically bigger than Reggie Bush. Yet, most regard Bell as a role player while Bush is viewed as a franchise player....and I'm assuming a 20+ carry per week RB. Yes, I know Bush has some intangibles Bell doesn't, I'm making this comparison based purely on physical size. I also understand some guys play through pain more than others, but really at this point the jury is still out on both Bell and Bush, really Bush more so than Bell. Bell proved he'd play through pain last year with his separated shoulder. I just don't get. I guess that's why they pay guys like Ron Wolf and Phil Savage the big money...to sit back and recylce players they've once scouted before, and every now and then they get lucky and pat themselves on the back on how good they are at scouting players.
You may be right, but what it comes down to is how things play out on the field. Results justify or recant decisions made by these guys. And as far as Shanahan goes, he may have been wrong about a couple of guys in his backfield, but the guy operates the state-of-the-art NFL running game on offense, and that gives him more credibility than anyone here has, or most NFL people, for that matter.Coaches also see things we don't. We see players' stats and measureables, and we see them on the field on Sundays - sometimes more, sometimes less - but we don't see their attitude or passion in practice. We don't see them day after day, week after week in relevant drills & situations like the coaches do. Coaches get much more of a look at players - and that includes their desire for the game, their heart, their decision making, intangibles that we don't see, as well as all the tangible skills in a much more controlled setting.

That said, some coaches have prejudices, like we all do, or are convinced that sometimes they can force a square peg into a round hole (this is what I see when I think of Dayne with the Giants), and when a player doesn't perform like they want the player to they'll cut the player loose & sometimes run them over afterwards to massage their egos. They're human and they make mistakes too, and sometimes those mistakes come from being too close to the players & not having enough perspective. In short, they make mistakes just like we do. If they make too many, though, it costs them their jobs - which is something we don't have to worry about here - so we can make some pretty off the wall assumptions or not understand the "stupidity" of some coaches, and be pretty adamant in running with them.

So if Shanahan is talking about QBs or WRs, I have a tendancy to doubt him, since his track record with QBs and WRs isn't exactly great as far as evaluating, drafting, and developing them. But when it comes to RBs - I'll trust his judgment much more than anyone's here - including my own.

 

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