Jerious Norwood (1 Viewer)

[chook]

Did a search and couldn't find anything on this, but I'm notoriously non-observant at times.

Norwood looks really good when used sporadically for the Falcons, and has that incredible career YPC, so is there any chance he could ever move on to a feature role in the future?

I know he's not the prototype build for an every-down RB, but there's always exceptions to rules; could this be one of them?

 

[djmich]

I think there is a good chance that he moves on to a role where he will still split time, but get more carries, and be a viable start in fantasy football (potential for RB 15-20).

 

[bumpman]

I think there is a good chance that he moves on to a role where he will still split time, but get more carries, and be a viable start in fantasy football (potential for RB 15-20).

I don't think he needs to move anywhere to do that. He could get there on the Falcons if Ryan continues his advancement and the offense can increase its overall scoring next year and the year after.

 

[PlayaHata]

What is Norwood's current contract situation?

 

[zamboni]

What is Norwood's current contract situation?

I think he's signed through 2009, but not totally sure. Will have to wait another year.

 

[Traders2001]

Norwood will never ever be a every down back, if he goes to another team they will use him the same way the Falcons do .

You cant compare him to Turner , it s not even close.

 

[Hoss_Cartwright]

Norwood will never ever be a every down back, if he goes to another team they will use him the same way the Falcons do .You cant compare him to Turner , it s not even close.

Is this the moment where you bring up his thin legs?

 

[Birdie048]

Long term value for Norwood is not as promising as the Turner comparison simply because of the limited role Norwood would play in an offense - 3rd down, COP RB. He could be in a platoon RBBC style to like the current Atl offense elsewhere, but his role is very unlikely to exceed his current production.

I do not see him being a Westbrook type RB. It's not his size alont, but his overall skill set that is the limiting factor. Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

As much as I wish (I own him), I don't see his role expanding to anything more than it is today.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

I do not see him being a Westbrook type RB. It's not his size alont, but his overall skill set that is the limiting factor. Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

Point well taken, but I'd like to say that he's better than Bush in that area, and he seems to put up pretty good numbers overall (I personally think those numbers will fall sooner than later, but before the injury I had to admit he was posting numbers).

 

[Garts]

Norwood is super tough I think...but that doesn't mean he has power....it seems evertime ATL runs him it is an outside play after Turner has beat 'em up inside....so somewhat predictable.

Would like to see them in tandem at once even more often.

He is a great producer when given touches.

 

[Tau837]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

 

[stbugs]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

 

[Tau837]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

First off, let me say I'm not arguing that Norwood can be a feature back. I agree it is doubtful he will ever have more of a role than what he has now in Atlanta. I just don't think the facts back up what people think about him.As for 1st and 10, I'm not buying that they play the pass when Norwood is in. He has 24 carries and 2 catches on 1st and 10. On 1st down overall, he has 27 carries and 2 catches. That's an example of the facts not backing up people's impressions.To continue the theme, on 2nd down, he has 34 carries and 6 catches. On 3rd down, he has 8 carries and 15 catches. To me, this is just typical progression. Defenses would typically play the run more on 1st and 2nd down and the pass more on 3rd and medium to long situations (and Norwood has only 1 carry in 3rd and short, since that is Turner's role). Defenses study tendencies. I see no reason to believe they are leaving the box when Norwood is in the game on 1st and 2nd down, any more than situations normally dictate against typical offenses. And I'm sure they are well aware that Norwood is more likely to catch a pass than run on 3rd down and try to defend him accordingly.So I think it is impressive that Norwood has averaged 5.5 ypc on 1st down, 4.4 ypc on 2nd down, and 7.3 ypr on 3rd down, since that shows he has performed well despite the defense generally knowing whether he is likely to run or catch in each situation.ETA: Not sure where to find info about men in the box, but splits do show that 66 of his 69 carries and 21 of his 24 catches occurred when the defense had 4 defenders on the line.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

First off, let me say I'm not arguing that Norwood can be a feature back. I agree it is doubtful he will ever have more of a role than what he has now in Atlanta. I just don't think the facts back up what people think about him.As for 1st and 10, I'm not buying that they play the pass when Norwood is in. He has 24 carries and 2 catches on 1st and 10. On 1st down overall, he has 27 carries and 2 catches. That's an example of the facts not backing up people's impressions.To continue the theme, on 2nd down, he has 34 carries and 6 catches. On 3rd down, he has 8 carries and 15 catches. To me, this is just typical progression. Defenses would typically play the run more on 1st and 2nd down and the pass more on 3rd and medium to long situations (and Norwood has only 1 carry in 3rd and short, since that is Turner's role). Defenses study tendencies. I see no reason to believe they are leaving the box when Norwood is in the game on 1st and 2nd down, any more than situations normally dictate against typical offenses. And I'm sure they are well aware that Norwood is more likely to catch a pass than run on 3rd down and try to defend him accordingly.So I think it is impressive that Norwood has averaged 5.5 ypc on 1st down, 4.4 ypc on 2nd down, and 7.3 ypr on 3rd down, since that shows he has performed well despite the defense generally knowing whether he is likely to run or catch in each situation.ETA: Not sure where to find info about men in the box, but splits do show that 66 of his 69 carries and 21 of his 24 catches occurred when the defense had 4 defenders on the line.

Plus, even if what he said were true (that defenders were playing pass when Norwood is featured on 1st down), my thought is "so what?" or even "So much the better!". If defenses are so scared of Norwood's receiving ability that they avoid stacking the box and it allows him to beat them inside, that's a GOOD thing, not a bad one. Not sure that's a 100% cause and effect there, but in any case, for the MOST part, success on 1st and 10 is success on 1st and 10.The only thing I can figure is that the team really, truly does not believe Norwood can hold up to featured usage and wants to keep him available as much as they can throughout the season. Because as you point out, and despite the prevailing misconceptions, Norwood has been REMARKABLY effective in nearly ALL situations they put him in (except maybe pass protection/blocking?). As an owner I would LOVE to see what he could do as a featured runner, but it has become clear to me that isn't going to happen in Atlanta.

 

[cstu]

How good of a blocker is Norwood? While I don't expect him to be an every down back, I do think he has the talent to be a much bigger part of an offense than he has been but he needs to be able to block well.

 

[stbugs]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

First off, let me say I'm not arguing that Norwood can be a feature back. I agree it is doubtful he will ever have more of a role than what he has now in Atlanta. I just don't think the facts back up what people think about him.As for 1st and 10, I'm not buying that they play the pass when Norwood is in. He has 24 carries and 2 catches on 1st and 10. On 1st down overall, he has 27 carries and 2 catches. That's an example of the facts not backing up people's impressions.To continue the theme, on 2nd down, he has 34 carries and 6 catches. On 3rd down, he has 8 carries and 15 catches. To me, this is just typical progression. Defenses would typically play the run more on 1st and 2nd down and the pass more on 3rd and medium to long situations (and Norwood has only 1 carry in 3rd and short, since that is Turner's role). Defenses study tendencies. I see no reason to believe they are leaving the box when Norwood is in the game on 1st and 2nd down, any more than situations normally dictate against typical offenses. And I'm sure they are well aware that Norwood is more likely to catch a pass than run on 3rd down and try to defend him accordingly.So I think it is impressive that Norwood has averaged 5.5 ypc on 1st down, 4.4 ypc on 2nd down, and 7.3 ypr on 3rd down, since that shows he has performed well despite the defense generally knowing whether he is likely to run or catch in each situation.ETA: Not sure where to find info about men in the box, but splits do show that 66 of his 69 carries and 21 of his 24 catches occurred when the defense had 4 defenders on the line.

Plus, even if what he said were true (that defenders were playing pass when Norwood is featured on 1st down), my thought is "so what?" or even "So much the better!". If defenses are so scared of Norwood's receiving ability that they avoid stacking the box and it allows him to beat them inside, that's a GOOD thing, not a bad one. Not sure that's a 100% cause and effect there, but in any case, for the MOST part, success on 1st and 10 is success on 1st and 10.The only thing I can figure is that the team really, truly does not believe Norwood can hold up to featured usage and wants to keep him available as much as they can throughout the season. Because as you point out, and despite the prevailing misconceptions, Norwood has been REMARKABLY effective in nearly ALL situations they put him in (except maybe pass protection/blocking?). As an owner I would LOVE to see what he could do as a featured runner, but it has become clear to me that isn't going to happen in Atlanta.

OK, well the "as an owner" statement kind of clouds the comment, but I never said he wasn't effective. I in fact am a Norwood owner in one keeper league. Unless he signs some sort of #1 RB deal in the off season, I won't keep him, but as a Turner owner in another league, I know how well both have done.All I said is that Norwoods touches have a 3 to 1 ratio and Turners are 50+ to 1, rushes to receptions. That to me shows that Norwood is in on a lot more pass plays than Turner is. If that doesn't make sense then not sure what to do. If you really think the defense isn't thinking more about the run when Turner is in and more about the pass when Norwood is in, then I can't help here.Also, just because Norwood doesn't get a reception, doesn't mean it isn't a passing down. If Roddy White catches it, while Norwood is in, it isn't reflected in Norwood's stats.If Just Win Baby can show me the split of pass play percentages while Turner is in versus Norwood and it shows that Norwood is in on more running plays percentage wise, then I will change my tune. The 24 rushes and 2 receptions shows nothing to me about passing. Norwood may get touches 90% when he is in on first down and 25% on 3rd, which means he plays way more on 3rd downs even though he has more "stats" on first down. Again, I would bet a lot of money that Norwood is in on a higher percent of pass plays than Turner is.

 

[Tau837]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

First off, let me say I'm not arguing that Norwood can be a feature back. I agree it is doubtful he will ever have more of a role than what he has now in Atlanta. I just don't think the facts back up what people think about him.As for 1st and 10, I'm not buying that they play the pass when Norwood is in. He has 24 carries and 2 catches on 1st and 10. On 1st down overall, he has 27 carries and 2 catches. That's an example of the facts not backing up people's impressions.To continue the theme, on 2nd down, he has 34 carries and 6 catches. On 3rd down, he has 8 carries and 15 catches. To me, this is just typical progression. Defenses would typically play the run more on 1st and 2nd down and the pass more on 3rd and medium to long situations (and Norwood has only 1 carry in 3rd and short, since that is Turner's role). Defenses study tendencies. I see no reason to believe they are leaving the box when Norwood is in the game on 1st and 2nd down, any more than situations normally dictate against typical offenses. And I'm sure they are well aware that Norwood is more likely to catch a pass than run on 3rd down and try to defend him accordingly.So I think it is impressive that Norwood has averaged 5.5 ypc on 1st down, 4.4 ypc on 2nd down, and 7.3 ypr on 3rd down, since that shows he has performed well despite the defense generally knowing whether he is likely to run or catch in each situation.ETA: Not sure where to find info about men in the box, but splits do show that 66 of his 69 carries and 21 of his 24 catches occurred when the defense had 4 defenders on the line.

Plus, even if what he said were true (that defenders were playing pass when Norwood is featured on 1st down), my thought is "so what?" or even "So much the better!". If defenses are so scared of Norwood's receiving ability that they avoid stacking the box and it allows him to beat them inside, that's a GOOD thing, not a bad one. Not sure that's a 100% cause and effect there, but in any case, for the MOST part, success on 1st and 10 is success on 1st and 10.The only thing I can figure is that the team really, truly does not believe Norwood can hold up to featured usage and wants to keep him available as much as they can throughout the season. Because as you point out, and despite the prevailing misconceptions, Norwood has been REMARKABLY effective in nearly ALL situations they put him in (except maybe pass protection/blocking?). As an owner I would LOVE to see what he could do as a featured runner, but it has become clear to me that isn't going to happen in Atlanta.

OK, well the "as an owner" statement kind of clouds the comment, but I never said he wasn't effective. I in fact am a Norwood owner in one keeper league. Unless he signs some sort of #1 RB deal in the off season, I won't keep him, but as a Turner owner in another league, I know how well both have done.All I said is that Norwoods touches have a 3 to 1 ratio and Turners are 50+ to 1, rushes to receptions. That to me shows that Norwood is in on a lot more pass plays than Turner is. If that doesn't make sense then not sure what to do. If you really think the defense isn't thinking more about the run when Turner is in and more about the pass when Norwood is in, then I can't help here.Also, just because Norwood doesn't get a reception, doesn't mean it isn't a passing down. If Roddy White catches it, while Norwood is in, it isn't reflected in Norwood's stats.If Just Win Baby can show me the split of pass play percentages while Turner is in versus Norwood and it shows that Norwood is in on more running plays percentage wise, then I will change my tune. The 24 rushes and 2 receptions shows nothing to me about passing. Norwood may get touches 90% when he is in on first down and 25% on 3rd, which means he plays way more on 3rd downs even though he has more "stats" on first down. Again, I would bet a lot of money that Norwood is in on a higher percent of pass plays than Turner is.

No, I don't have that data. But you seem to be hung up on comparing Norwood to Turner. Why is that? Yes, I agree, Turner is in on more running plays and Norwood is in on more passing plays. So? I'm not sure what your point is.I thought your point was to imply that Norwood's per carry average is inflated because he often runs on passing plays. I think the data I presented above refutes that. I was never comparing him to Turner... I was talking about Norwood in the context of his abilities to succeed as a NFL RB. Look at the first post I responded to... it was about his inability to run between the tackles.If your point was different, then explain it. If your point was to show his ypc is inflated because he often runs on passing plays, then present a case that overcomes the data I posted.

Norwood may get touches 90% when he is in on first down and 25% on 3rd, which means he plays way more on 3rd downs even though he has more "stats" on first down. Again, I would bet a lot of money that Norwood is in on a higher percent of pass plays than Turner is.

Huh? Norwood has 8 carries on third down for the season, compared to 15 catches. Yes, obviously he tends to be in on a high percentage of passing plays on 3rd down. Duh. And if he gets 90% of the touches on the 1st down plays he is in for... and he has 24 carries and 2 catches... you're just proving my point.You're really not making sense here.

 

[treat88]

Kid should stay in ATL and thrive in his Eric Metcalf-lite role. He's a great player in this role.

Keeps him healthy and productive.

In a feature back role he would be neither fairly quickly.

 

[stbugs]

Nowrood is a good outside runner, but struggles between the tackles on anything like 1st and 10 when they are expected to run the ball.

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I can't find exact splits that fit your statement. However, I did find these:Left Sideline - 15/54 (3.6 ypc)Left Side - 9/36 (4.0 ypc)Middle - 20/145 (7.3ypc)Right Side - 10/57 (5.7 ypc)Right Sideline - 15/91 (6.1 ypc)This equates to:30/145 (4.8 ypc) outside the tackles39/238 (6.1 ypc) between the tacklesAlso, on 1st & 10 - 24/132 (5.5 ypc)All of this looks fine to me. It does not appear to substantiate your claim, though it's not a direct fit. Norwood only has 8 carries on third down (compared to 27 on 1st down and 34 on 2nd down), so I can't tell from the splits that he has padded his stats in non-running situations.

I understand splits, but in the current offense, when Norwood is in the defense plays pass and when Turner is in they play run. Sure, the Falcons might not be that simplistic in the calls, but Turner sure isn't getting any receptions, so I would think that Norwood does benefit from less men in the box. Not saying he isn't talented, just that even on first down the defense with Norwood in could be playing pass.Also, many draws go right up the gut.FYI, Turners run to reception ration is 50+ to 1 and Norwood's is 3 to 1 and that doesn't count any pass plays he is in on that he didn't make the catch or stayed into block.

First off, let me say I'm not arguing that Norwood can be a feature back. I agree it is doubtful he will ever have more of a role than what he has now in Atlanta. I just don't think the facts back up what people think about him.As for 1st and 10, I'm not buying that they play the pass when Norwood is in. He has 24 carries and 2 catches on 1st and 10. On 1st down overall, he has 27 carries and 2 catches. That's an example of the facts not backing up people's impressions.To continue the theme, on 2nd down, he has 34 carries and 6 catches. On 3rd down, he has 8 carries and 15 catches. To me, this is just typical progression. Defenses would typically play the run more on 1st and 2nd down and the pass more on 3rd and medium to long situations (and Norwood has only 1 carry in 3rd and short, since that is Turner's role). Defenses study tendencies. I see no reason to believe they are leaving the box when Norwood is in the game on 1st and 2nd down, any more than situations normally dictate against typical offenses. And I'm sure they are well aware that Norwood is more likely to catch a pass than run on 3rd down and try to defend him accordingly.So I think it is impressive that Norwood has averaged 5.5 ypc on 1st down, 4.4 ypc on 2nd down, and 7.3 ypr on 3rd down, since that shows he has performed well despite the defense generally knowing whether he is likely to run or catch in each situation.ETA: Not sure where to find info about men in the box, but splits do show that 66 of his 69 carries and 21 of his 24 catches occurred when the defense had 4 defenders on the line.

Plus, even if what he said were true (that defenders were playing pass when Norwood is featured on 1st down), my thought is "so what?" or even "So much the better!". If defenses are so scared of Norwood's receiving ability that they avoid stacking the box and it allows him to beat them inside, that's a GOOD thing, not a bad one. Not sure that's a 100% cause and effect there, but in any case, for the MOST part, success on 1st and 10 is success on 1st and 10.The only thing I can figure is that the team really, truly does not believe Norwood can hold up to featured usage and wants to keep him available as much as they can throughout the season. Because as you point out, and despite the prevailing misconceptions, Norwood has been REMARKABLY effective in nearly ALL situations they put him in (except maybe pass protection/blocking?). As an owner I would LOVE to see what he could do as a featured runner, but it has become clear to me that isn't going to happen in Atlanta.

OK, well the "as an owner" statement kind of clouds the comment, but I never said he wasn't effective. I in fact am a Norwood owner in one keeper league. Unless he signs some sort of #1 RB deal in the off season, I won't keep him, but as a Turner owner in another league, I know how well both have done.All I said is that Norwoods touches have a 3 to 1 ratio and Turners are 50+ to 1, rushes to receptions. That to me shows that Norwood is in on a lot more pass plays than Turner is. If that doesn't make sense then not sure what to do. If you really think the defense isn't thinking more about the run when Turner is in and more about the pass when Norwood is in, then I can't help here.Also, just because Norwood doesn't get a reception, doesn't mean it isn't a passing down. If Roddy White catches it, while Norwood is in, it isn't reflected in Norwood's stats.If Just Win Baby can show me the split of pass play percentages while Turner is in versus Norwood and it shows that Norwood is in on more running plays percentage wise, then I will change my tune. The 24 rushes and 2 receptions shows nothing to me about passing. Norwood may get touches 90% when he is in on first down and 25% on 3rd, which means he plays way more on 3rd downs even though he has more "stats" on first down. Again, I would bet a lot of money that Norwood is in on a higher percent of pass plays than Turner is.

No, I don't have that data. But you seem to be hung up on comparing Norwood to Turner. Why is that? Yes, I agree, Turner is in on more running plays and Norwood is in on more passing plays. So? I'm not sure what your point is.I thought your point was to imply that Norwood's per carry average is inflated because he often runs on passing plays. I think the data I presented above refutes that. I was never comparing him to Turner... I was talking about Norwood in the context of his abilities to succeed as a NFL RB. Look at the first post I responded to... it was about his inability to run between the tackles.If your point was different, then explain it. If your point was to show his ypc is inflated because he often runs on passing plays, then present a case that overcomes the data I posted.

Norwood may get touches 90% when he is in on first down and 25% on 3rd, which means he plays way more on 3rd downs even though he has more "stats" on first down. Again, I would bet a lot of money that Norwood is in on a higher percent of pass plays than Turner is.

Huh? Norwood has 8 carries on third down for the season, compared to 15 catches. Yes, obviously he tends to be in on a high percentage of passing plays on 3rd down. Duh. And if he gets 90% of the touches on the 1st down plays he is in for... and he has 24 carries and 2 catches... you're just proving my point.You're really not making sense here.

Well, duh, you don't have the data I think is more relevant. My percentages of 90% and 25% were to show that he may be in on 3rd down a lot more, but not get touches. They were also pulled out of my ###, so they aren't proving anyone's points.The data you posted only has Norwood's touches, it does not have his total # of plays, which is far more relevant to me. That is my point. Here is an example, again with #'s pulled out of my ###:Norwood 1st Down: 50 plays - Norwood's touches: 24 rushes, 2 receptions, 2 incompletions, Other's touches: 12 receptions, 10 incompletionsNorwood 2nd Down: 100 plays - Norwood's touches: 34 rushes, 6 receptions, 6 incompletions, Other's touches: 34 receptions, 20 incompletionsNorwood 2nd Down: 150 plays - Norwood's touches: 8 rushes, 15 receptions, 15 incompletions, Other's touches: 60 receptions, 50 incompletionsNow, of course these numbers are imaginary so they don't include a FB or QB rush, sack, etc. However, just taking the imaginary numbers, my point is that the data you presented shows nothing about the Falcons, not Norwood's splits. If the Falcons pass on 80% of Norwood's downs, then IMHO they will assume pass more often with him than Turner, hence I think Norwood benefits because he is the "3rd down RB."Also, the reason why I am hung up on Turner is because he touch ratio is 50+ to 1 in favor of rushing and Norwood's is 3 to 1, which IMHO pretty much solidifies my point that defenses would treat them differently.

 

[Tau837]

Didn't want to keep quoting the whole exchange here. stbugs, didn't mean my last post to sound harsh, sorry about that.

I understand your point, and it's true that you *could* be right. But that seems to be nothing but speculation. IMO the data that is easily available, which I posted earlier, does not support your view.

 

[groin pains]

A little off topic but for Atlanta homers....is he palying this week? I see he is still listed as questionable after practicing Friday.