Jerry Sandusky accused of child molestation (4 Viewers)

[CrossEyed]

Paterno is scum, too.

Aren't you and a lot of people jumping to conclusions here? I agree that IF all of the facts being reported now are true, and IF there are no other facts that might mitigate Paterno's actions (or lack of actions in this case) then it's difficult to reach any conclusion other than the one you've drawn. But how often does it happen that the whole truth is always what we first think it is? I say almost never. Everyone is in such a rush to judgment. If Joe Paterno is truly guilty of helping to conceal these horrible crimes, then we'll know soon enough. But for now I suggest it's best to take a deep breath and wait for all the facts to come out, and to withhold judgment until they do.

Come on, tim, everyone knows that Paterno runs the show at Penn State. There is absolutely no way he wasn't aware that something despicable was going on with Sandusky. His abrupt departure makes a lot more sense now. Paterno will always be remembered as a great coach. He will no longer be remembered as a great human being.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

 

[shake zula]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

IF all the facts are true, and there are no other facts we don't know, then they deserve much worse, probably. But again, I say this is all very premature.

I agree with bolded but how do you figure it is premature? The are enough admissions to conclude that they deserve the same if not worse than other schools have received for petty offenses. Even if the underlying accusations are false, which we all know they aren't going to be, they covered it up. If it gets worse throughout the process then the punishments gets worse. There is no walking this back from big time sanctions.

 

[Sammy3469]

Paterno is scum, too.

Aren't you and a lot of people jumping to conclusions here? I agree that IF all of the facts being reported now are true, and IF there are no other facts that might mitigate Paterno's actions (or lack of actions in this case) then it's difficult to reach any conclusion other than the one you've drawn. But how often does it happen that the whole truth is always what we first think it is? I say almost never. Everyone is in such a rush to judgment. If Joe Paterno is truly guilty of helping to conceal these horrible crimes, then we'll know soon enough. But for now I suggest it's best to take a deep breath and wait for all the facts to come out, and to withhold judgment until they do.

That's where you're wrong...this has nothing to do with concealing the crimes and everything to do with the responsibity to report the suspected crimes. This isn't some petty recruiting violation. Children's well-being were at stake. He's one of the people at PSU that could ensure those accusations were adequately investigate.

 

[shake zula]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

I don't know if it'll be losc. The rule is here.. There has got to be a catch all in the bylaws. I'd be shocked if there wasn't. Moreover, I don't think this is a moral issue. This is going to jail/big time lawsuit stuff. I don't see how Paterno survives this.

 

[timschochet]

Paterno is scum, too.

Aren't you and a lot of people jumping to conclusions here? I agree that IF all of the facts being reported now are true, and IF there are no other facts that might mitigate Paterno's actions (or lack of actions in this case) then it's difficult to reach any conclusion other than the one you've drawn. But how often does it happen that the whole truth is always what we first think it is? I say almost never. Everyone is in such a rush to judgment. If Joe Paterno is truly guilty of helping to conceal these horrible crimes, then we'll know soon enough. But for now I suggest it's best to take a deep breath and wait for all the facts to come out, and to withhold judgment until they do.

Come on, tim, everyone knows that Paterno runs the show at Penn State. There is absolutely no way he wasn't aware that something despicable was going on with Sandusky. His abrupt departure makes a lot more sense now. Paterno will always be remembered as a great coach. He will no longer be remembered as a great human being.

I agree that it doesn't sound good at all. But I still want to hear more before I pass judgment. I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine so perhaps that colors my thinking. But usually there's always a lot we don't know and I say it's too early in the game to reach these sorts of conclusions.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

Paterno is scum, too.

Aren't you and a lot of people jumping to conclusions here? I agree that IF all of the facts being reported now are true, and IF there are no other facts that might mitigate Paterno's actions (or lack of actions in this case) then it's difficult to reach any conclusion other than the one you've drawn. But how often does it happen that the whole truth is always what we first think it is? I say almost never. Everyone is in such a rush to judgment. If Joe Paterno is truly guilty of helping to conceal these horrible crimes, then we'll know soon enough. But for now I suggest it's best to take a deep breath and wait for all the facts to come out, and to withhold judgment until they do.

Come on, tim, everyone knows that Paterno runs the show at Penn State. There is absolutely no way he wasn't aware that something despicable was going on with Sandusky. His abrupt departure makes a lot more sense now. Paterno will always be remembered as a great coach. He will no longer be remembered as a great human being.

If this such an open and shut case why did the Grand Jury allow Sandusky to walk the streets for three years while it leisurely took its time to build a case? You are jumping to conclusions. That doesn't mean that you are wrong, just that "everyone knows" pretty much nothing at this point.

 

[CrossEyed]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

IF all the facts are true, and there are no other facts we don't know, then they deserve much worse, probably. But again, I say this is all very premature.

I agree with bolded but how do you figure it is premature? The are enough admissions to conclude that they deserve the same if not worse than other schools have received for petty offenses. Even if the underlying accusations are false, which we all know they aren't going to be they covered it. If it gets worse throughout the process then the punishments gets worse. There is no walking this back from big time sanctions.

Agreed. They may get off on legal technicalities, but this is an institution where parents need to trust that their 18-22 yr old children are safe. Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno, Schultz, and Curley violated that trust. They had a responsibility to protect the children that were on their campus (and I don't care that they weren't PSU students) and they failed miserably.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

I don't know if it'll be losc. The rule is here.. There has got to be a catch all in the bylaws. I'd be shocked if there wasn't. Moreover, I don't think this is a moral issue. This is going to jail/big time lawsuit stuff. I don't see how Paterno survives this.

Maybe I'm missing your point, but by "being punished" I assume that you meant NCAA sanctions. Obviously in the court of public opinion Penn State is going to suffer as much or more than the universities you listed.

 

[shake zula]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

IF all the facts are true, and there are no other facts we don't know, then they deserve much worse, probably. But again, I say this is all very premature.

I agree with bolded but how do you figure it is premature? The are enough admissions to conclude that they deserve the same if not worse than other schools have received for petty offenses. Even if the underlying accusations are false, which we all know they aren't going to be they covered it. If it gets worse throughout the process then the punishments gets worse. There is no walking this back from big time sanctions.

Agreed. They may get off on legal technicalities, but this is an institution where parents need to trust that their 18-22 yr old children are safe. Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno, Schultz, and Curley violated that trust. They had a responsibility to protect the children that were on their campus (and I don't care that they weren't PSU students) and they failed miserably.

Agreed. There is no way around this. When the resignations start flowing in the ship is sinking. I'm not shocked in the least if Paterno tenders next. Conduct of upper management was indefensible.

 

[CrossEyed]

Paterno is scum, too.

Aren't you and a lot of people jumping to conclusions here? I agree that IF all of the facts being reported now are true, and IF there are no other facts that might mitigate Paterno's actions (or lack of actions in this case) then it's difficult to reach any conclusion other than the one you've drawn. But how often does it happen that the whole truth is always what we first think it is? I say almost never. Everyone is in such a rush to judgment. If Joe Paterno is truly guilty of helping to conceal these horrible crimes, then we'll know soon enough. But for now I suggest it's best to take a deep breath and wait for all the facts to come out, and to withhold judgment until they do.

Come on, tim, everyone knows that Paterno runs the show at Penn State. There is absolutely no way he wasn't aware that something despicable was going on with Sandusky. His abrupt departure makes a lot more sense now. Paterno will always be remembered as a great coach. He will no longer be remembered as a great human being.

If this such an open and shut case why did the Grand Jury allow Sandusky to walk the streets for three years while it leisurely took its time to build a case? You are jumping to conclusions. That doesn't mean that you are wrong, just that "everyone knows" pretty much nothing at this point.

Being able to prove something legally is one thing. But from what I read in that report, nobody will ever be able to convince me that there wasn't a cover-up or, at the very least, a look in the other direction. Nobody wanted to destroy the life of their buddy Sandusky. But none of them did anything to try to protect the lives of those boys.

 

[shake zula]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

I don't know if it'll be losc. The rule is here.. There has got to be a catch all in the bylaws. I'd be shocked if there wasn't. Moreover, I don't think this is a moral issue. This is going to jail/big time lawsuit stuff. I don't see how Paterno survives this.

Maybe I'm missing your point, but by "being punished" I assume that you meant NCAA sanctions. Obviously in the court of public opinion Penn State is going to suffer as much or more than the universities you listed.

My point is that there will be NCAA sancaction one way or another and that those sanctions should be stronger than whatever is/was levied against OSU/UM/USC. By sanctions I think you'll see fines and permanent bans no loss of scholarships or other onfield implications.

 

[CrossEyed]

Pretty disappointed to hear that Curley is being allowed to take a leave of absence. PSU is not helping their public image here.

 

[HellToupee]

I wonder how insulated Paterno is from the media reports , what I mean is I wonder if he's aware of how big this story is, do things get filtered for him?

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

...I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine so perhaps that colors my thinking....

Even if we cut Paterno every break here he most certainly failed in how he prepared the one student that spent almost ten years in how to handle such an incident.

 

[timschochet]

Pretty disappointed to hear that Curley is being allowed to take a leave of absence. PSU is not helping their public image here.

All of these guys are maintaining their innocence, aren't they? You think they should be railroaded without a hearing or trial? It seems to me a leave of absence is the proper course here for the time being.

 

[BobbyLayne]

I wonder how insulated Paterno is from the media reports , what I mean is I wonder if he's aware of how big this story is, do things get filtered for him?

You're suggesting he doesn't watch t.v. or go on the internet? Which I suppose is possible for an 84 y.o...but I do know many seniors who are tech savvy. And I would think seniors employed by a university would be...but I have no idea if JoePA is.

 

[Walton Goggins]

http://deadspin.com/5856887/as-recently-as-2009-jerry-sandusky-was-running-an-overnight-football-camp-for-kids-on-penn-state-campuses

penn state scandal

By Barry Petchesky

Nov 6, 2011 6:40 PM

25,782 22

As Recently As 2009, Jerry Sandusky Was Running An Overnight Football Camp For Kids On Penn State Campuses

Of the child sexual assault charges against former Penn State coach Jerry Sandusky, the fact that stands out most is that Joe Paterno, Tim Curley and Gary Schultz were aware of incidents as early as 2002. Curley testified to the grand jury that he "advised Sandusky that he was prohibited from bringing youth onto the Penn State campus from that point forward." Seven years later, in the summer of 2009, Sandusky was still hosting overnight camps for children as young as 9 at other Penn State schools.

A reader sends us the flyer for the Sandusky Football Camp, a four-day, three-night resident clinic offered at Penn State's Behrend campus in Erie, and other stops around the state including Penn State Harrisburg.

According to the program's now-defunct website,

The goal of the camp is to learn as much about the game of football while having an enjoyable experience. Jerry Sandusky's personal experience and his excellent staff will cater to each individual camper helping them to reach their personal potential. With a variety of individual drills for every position team drills, and games, the participants will be able to build a solid fundamental background for which they can carry the rest of their lives. They will walk away with many of the ideas and concepts Jerry Sandusky has used during his brilliant career. A career that included two national championships and 28 bowl appearances! Lessons on life discipline, teamwork, trust, and loyalty will be stressed in motivational speeches by great guest speakers and selected video presentations. Regular camp instructors will include members of Jerry's family, other college and high school coaches, and former Penn State players.

It's unclear if Sandusky was compensated by Penn State for overseeing the camp, which he operated via his Sandusky Associates company located in State College. But multiple schools in the Penn State system hosted and provided facilities for the program, touted Sandusky's Penn State affiliation, and featured other instructors from the Penn State family: an implicit endorsement of the camp at the very least.

Sandusky ran the camp for nearly a decade, but there doesn't appear to have been a 2010 edition. By that summer, a grand jury had already begun its investigation.

 

[Bottomfeeder Sports]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

I don't know if it'll be losc. The rule is here.. There has got to be a catch all in the bylaws. I'd be shocked if there wasn't. Moreover, I don't think this is a moral issue. This is going to jail/big time lawsuit stuff. I don't see how Paterno survives this.

Maybe I'm missing your point, but by "being punished" I assume that you meant NCAA sanctions. Obviously in the court of public opinion Penn State is going to suffer as much or more than the universities you listed.

My point is that there will be NCAA sancaction one way or another and that those sanctions should be stronger than whatever is/was levied against OSU/UM/USC. By sanctions I think you'll see fines and permanent bans no loss of scholarships or other onfield implications.

But my point is what authority does the NCAA have to pass down any sanctions in an instance like this? As we both noted it would almost have to be in some "catch all" language. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to say Penn State doesn't deserve all that it will get from this, but I am not so sure that the NCAA is in any position. Maybe the Big 10 is in a better position, but we would likely never hear of those kind of sanctions.

 

[tri-man 47]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

 

[whoknew]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

IF all the facts are true, and there are no other facts we don't know, then they deserve much worse, probably. But again, I say this is all very premature.

I agree with bolded but how do you figure it is premature? The are enough admissions to conclude that they deserve the same if not worse than other schools have received for petty offenses. Even if the underlying accusations are false, which we all know they aren't going to be they covered it. If it gets worse throughout the process then the punishments gets worse. There is no walking this back from big time sanctions.

Agreed. They may get off on legal technicalities, but this is an institution where parents need to trust that their 18-22 yr old children are safe. Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno, Schultz, and Curley violated that trust. They had a responsibility to protect the children that were on their campus (and I don't care that they weren't PSU students) and they failed miserably.

Agreed. There is no way around this. When the resignations start flowing in the ship is sinking. I'm not shocked in the least if Paterno tenders next. Conduct of upper management was indefensible.

Not just upper management.Assuming the allegations in the grand jury report are true - how does McQuery keep coming to work everyday knowing that he saw a grown man rape a 10 year old and the people to whom he reported it basically did nothing? Did he think it was settled? I don't really understand that part.

 

[CrossEyed]

Pretty disappointed to hear that Curley is being allowed to take a leave of absence. PSU is not helping their public image here.

All of these guys are maintaining their innocence, aren't they? You think they should be railroaded without a hearing or trial? It seems to me a leave of absence is the proper course here for the time being.

I have all the evidence I need to feel comfortable saying that all these guys failed morally and ethically. They might have lawyers that can keep them out of jail, but there is no way they should have jobs at an institution where parents need to feel that their children are safe.

 

[Walton Goggins]

http://deadspin.com/5856777/a-guide-to-the-child-sexual-abuse-charges-against-jerry-sandusky-and-to-penn-states-alleged-willful-ignorance

A Guide To The Child Sexual Abuse Charges Against Jerry Sandusky, And To Penn State’s Alleged Willful Ignorance

The Pennsylvania Attorney General's office has made public the entire 23-page grand jury report that is the basis for former Penn State defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky's indictment. The report is a graphic, disturbing account of the litany of sex crimes that Sandusky is accused of committing against eight boys from the mid-1990s until the late-2000s. It also details the sequence of events that led to charges of perjury and failure to report suspected child abuse (the latter is a summary offense in Pennsylvania) against two Penn State administrators, including athletic director Tim Curley.

The allegations against Sandusky were handed down Friday, and he was arrested Saturday. Curley is expected to turn himself in Monday, according to the Associated Press.

Sandusky, 67, coached at Penn State for more than 30 years. He spent the final 23 of those years—the last of which was 1999—as the Nittany Lions' defensive coordinator. From 1977 until his retirement last year, Sandusky had also run a foster home in State College, Pa., for troubled children called The Second Mile. (The photo above is from a Sports Illustrated story published in 1999 and depicts children from The Second Mile program. We've blacked out the faces, since the grand jury report identifies one of them as a victim of Sandusky.) The Second Mile, according to the report, "gave [sandusky] access to hundreds of boys, many of whom were vulnerable due to their social situations." After his retirement from coaching, Sandusky also still had full access to Penn State's football facilities.

What follows is a summary of the grand jury's report.

• Sandusky's victims all reported a wide array of sexual abuse allegations. Sandusky, who is married, met many of them through The Second Mile. Many spent the night at his home. He brought them to Philadelphia Eagles games, plus Penn State practices, tailgate parties, and home games. One of the victims traveled to the 1998 Outback Bowl and the 1999 Alamo Bowl as a member of Sandusky's family's party. That same victim often stayed with Sandusky at a State College-area hotel on the night before home games. He also frequently dined with the coaching staff and accompanied Sandusky to numerous charity outings. Sandusky had lavished this victim with a variety of gifts. According to the report, "Sandusky even guaranteed [this victim] he could be a walk-on player at Penn State. [The victim] was in a video about linebackers that featured Sandusky, and he appeared with him in a photo accompanying an article about Sandusky in Sports Illustrated." Sandusky later tried to bribe this victim with cigarettes and marijuana after this victim began refusing his advances.

• Also: "[This victim] remembers Sandusky being emotionally upset after having a meeting with Joe Paterno in which Paterno told Sandusky he would not be the next head coach at Penn State and which preceded Sandusky's retirement. Sandusky told the victim not to tell anyone about the meeting. That meeting occurred in May 1999."

• Sandusky was investigated by university police in 1998 after a mother reported to them that her 11-year-old son had showered with Sandusky. A university police detective and a municipal police detective later eavesdropped on a conversation between the mother and Sandusky in which Sandusky answered "I don't know ... maybe" when the mother asked him if he had touched her son inappropriately. He also admitted he had showered with the boy to an investigator with the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare. The university police detective advised Sandusky not to shower with a child again, and Sandusky promised he would not. No charges were filed.

• In March 2002, a graduate assistant stumbled upon Sandusky and a boy showering together at Penn State's football facility. The grand jury report included the horrifying details of what that graduate assistant saw and heard:

As the graduate assistant entered the locker room doors, he was surprised to find the lights and the showers on. He then heard rhythmic, slapping sounds. He believed the sounds to be those of sexual activity. As the graduate assistant put his sneakers in his locker, he looked in the shower. He saw a naked boy ... whose age he estimated to be ten years old, with his hands up against the wall, being subjected to anal intercourse by a naked Sandusky. The graduate assistant was shocked but noticed that both [the victim] and Sandusky saw him. The graduate assistant left immediately, distraught.

• The graduate assistant informed Joe Paterno the next day, and Paterno told Curley the day after that. About a week and a half after that, the graduate assistant met with Curley and Gary Schultz, Penn State's Vice President for Finance and Business and the other school administrator to be charged with perjury and failure to report an allegation. The graduate assistant described what he saw as being of a "sexual nature." Paterno said the graduate assistant had told him Sandusky's actions were "disturbing" and "inappropriate." Curley acknowledged to the grand jury that he was told Sandusky's actions were "inappropriate" and that they had made the graduate assistant "uncomfortable"; however, Curley denied under oath that he was told Sandusky had done anything sexual. Schultz conceded under oath that the graduate assistant had told him of inappropriate sexual conduct. But he also testified that the allegations were "not that serious" and that he and Curley were unaware any crime had taken place.

• It is worth noting here what Paterno did upon hearing a first-hand story from a "very upset" graduate assistant, in the words of the report, about "Jerry Sandusky ... fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy": Paterno took no action except to tell his athletic director.

• Curley and Schultz did tell Penn State president Graham Spanier what they had heard, but Spanier told the grand jury that Curley and Schultz had described Sandusky's actions to him as mere "horsing around in the shower." Spanier also denied any knowledge of the 1998 investigation of Sandusky by university police. Spanier issued a statement Saturday saying Curley and Schultz had his "unconditional support."

• Schultz's duties included oversight of the university police. He testified that he was aware of the 1998 incident and acknowledged similarities between it and the 2002 allegations. But according to the grand jury report, Schultz "never sought or reviewed a police report on the 1998 incident and never attempted to learn the identity of the child in the shower in 2002. No one from the university did so. Schultz did not ask the graduate assistant for specifics. No one ever did. Schultz expressed surprise upon learning that the 1998 investigation by University Police produced a lengthy police report. Schultz said there was never any discussion between himself and Curley about turning the 2002 incident over to any police agency." The graduate assistant was also never questioned by police.

• Sandusky was told he could no longer bring children into Penn State's football facility in light of the 2002 incident, and the executive director of The Second Mile was made aware of that fact, in addition to the incident. Schultz testified that Spanier had approved this decision. Schultz also said he believed he and Curley had informed a "child protection agency" about the 2002 incident. Curley also admitted "the ban on bringing children to the campus was unenforceable," in the words of the report.

• Records show that the 2002 incident was never reported to the Department of Public Welfare, Children and Youth Services, or the university police, in violation of state law.

• The Patriot-News of Harrisburg reported Saturday that a source close to the investigation said Paterno would not be charged and that he would testify against Sandusky at trial.

• One of Sandusky's victims told the grand jury Sandusky had brought him to Penn State's preseason practices in 2007—a full five years after Paterno was made aware of sexual activity involving Sandusky and another boy.

You can read the entire grand jury report here:

 

[whoknew]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

Doesn't he donate a bunch of money to the University? I think he sets up and helps fund a bunch of scholarships or something.

 

[shake zula]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

What NCAA infractions are they accused of committing? Does "lack of institutional control" apply in cases like this? Not should it apply, but does it? Is there a general morality clause?(These are questions, not a rebuttal.)

I don't know if it'll be losc. The rule is here.. There has got to be a catch all in the bylaws. I'd be shocked if there wasn't. Moreover, I don't think this is a moral issue. This is going to jail/big time lawsuit stuff. I don't see how Paterno survives this.

Maybe I'm missing your point, but by "being punished" I assume that you meant NCAA sanctions. Obviously in the court of public opinion Penn State is going to suffer as much or more than the universities you listed.

My point is that there will be NCAA sancaction one way or another and that those sanctions should be stronger than whatever is/was levied against OSU/UM/USC. By sanctions I think you'll see fines and permanent bans no loss of scholarships or other onfield implications.

But my point is what authority does the NCAA have to pass down any sanctions in an instance like this? As we both noted it would almost have to be in some "catch all" language. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to say Penn State doesn't deserve all that it will get from this, but I am not so sure that the NCAA is in any position. Maybe the Big 10 is in a better position, but we would likely never hear of those kind of sanctions.

I don't know what the language is but I would be beyond shocked if there wasn't some language that allowed the NCAA a wide berth in these kinds of situations.

 

[HellToupee]

http://deadspin.com/5856887/as-recently-as-2009-jerry-sandusky-was-running-an-overnight-football-camp-for-kids-on-penn-state-campuses

penn state scandal

By Barry Petchesky

Nov 6, 2011 6:40 PM

25,782 22

As Recently As 2009, Jerry Sandusky Was Running An Overnight Football Camp For Kids On Penn State Campuses

The goal of the camp is to learn as much about the game of football while having an enjoyable experience . Jerry Sandusky's personal experience and his excellent staff will cater to each individual camper helping them to reach their personal potential. With a variety of individual drills for every position team drills, and games, the participants will be able to build a solid fundamental background for which they can carry the rest of their lives . They will walk away with many of the ideas and concepts Jerry Sandusky has used during his brilliant career..

scary

 

[AmosMoses]

PSU deserves to receive a punishment in line w/ what USC/OSU/UM received/will receive.

IF all the facts are true, and there are no other facts we don't know, then they deserve much worse, probably. But again, I say this is all very premature.

I agree with bolded but how do you figure it is premature? The are enough admissions to conclude that they deserve the same if not worse than other schools have received for petty offenses. Even if the underlying accusations are false, which we all know they aren't going to be they covered it. If it gets worse throughout the process then the punishments gets worse. There is no walking this back from big time sanctions.

Agreed. They may get off on legal technicalities, but this is an institution where parents need to trust that their 18-22 yr old children are safe. Sandusky, McQueary, Paterno, Schultz, and Curley violated that trust. They had a responsibility to protect the children that were on their campus (and I don't care that they weren't PSU students) and they failed miserably.

Agreed. There is no way around this. When the resignations start flowing in the ship is sinking. I'm not shocked in the least if Paterno tenders next. Conduct of upper management was indefensible.

Billy Bats made it clear that Paterno is "middle management".

 

[timschochet]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

For me, he's been a hero because he did remind me of Wooden. Just always seemed like a very classy guy who ran a clean program for a long time. Seemed like a good guy. I admire class and decency. Until this incident, I had always related Paterno to those attributes.

 

[CrossEyed]

http://deadspin.com/5856887/as-recently-as-2009-jerry-sandusky-was-running-an-overnight-football-camp-for-kids-on-penn-state-campuses

penn state scandal

By Barry Petchesky

Nov 6, 2011 6:40 PM

25,782 22

As Recently As 2009, Jerry Sandusky Was Running An Overnight Football Camp For Kids On Penn State Campuses

The goal of the camp is to learn as much about the game of football while having an enjoyable experience . Jerry Sandusky's personal experience and his excellent staff will cater to each individual camper helping them to reach their personal potential. With a variety of individual drills for every position team drills, and games, the participants will be able to build a solid fundamental background for which they can carry the rest of their lives . They will walk away with many of the ideas and concepts Jerry Sandusky has used during his brilliant career..

scary

Yeah, this just keeps getting worse and worse for PSU.

 

[shake zula]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

For me, he's been a hero because he did remind me of Wooden. Just always seemed like a very classy guy who ran a clean program for a long time. Seemed like a good guy. I admire class and decency. Until this incident, I had always related Paterno to those attributes.

No offense but..A classy guy who looks the other way while 60 year old dudes sexually assualt little boys. I love sports but to worship any of these people as heros is embarrassing. Come on Tim.

 

[timschochet]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

 

[B-Deep]

I have Joe Pa signed memorabilia all over my basement and it came down yesterday. IMO as soon as you hear an under aged child was in a Penn St. shower room with ANYONE associated with school its up to Joe to make a stink about it. It boggles my mind that this can just be passed over and he could sleep at night, it sickens me.

I feel bad for you and fans like you. This completely sucks, I have never been a Joepa fan, but no one would have expected this.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I'm not sure why people are really calling for Paterno's head unless they are accusing him of having more knowledge of Sandusky's actions over a greater period of time with a grander scheme of covering up his friend's actions that Joe already knew about for sometime. If indeed this was the only incident Joe was aware of or made aware of, I do not see what he did wrong. I do not think it was on Joe to call the police as he was not a witness nor was he Sandusky's boss. McQuery likely should have called the police himself.

Where is this "horsing around" term coming from? That is what people are saying the exact quote from Joe to Curly was? First, if McQueary didn't go into graphic detail to Joe (and apparently that is what the DA believes as well otherwise Joe would be charged with perjury as well) then Joe may have used that term to mean doing something inappropriate sexually. That's a term I have heard my 80 year old grandfather use on several occasions when talking about people having sex. Secondly, even if "horsing around" is the only thing Joe said to Curly (which I do not believe is the case) Curly still interviewed McQueary, during which conversation I assume McQueary told the full account of what he saw. It then was on Curly to take action.

Given the eye-witness account and number of victims over a lengthy period of time (and I am sure some others may come out now) there is little to no doubt in my mind that Sandusky is a predator of the worst kind. Taking advantage of those helpless boys who are troubled and in need when you are the one that is supposed to be giving them hope is truly despicable. I'm sure he will take the easy way out and never get a verdict. Cowards do that, and Sandusky clearly is a coward.

I do find it interesting sociologically that as soon as we as a society here "child molester" that person is automatically guilty, and no matter the verdict, that person is tainted for life. It seems there is no worse accusation nor a way to recover from such an accusation in our country. I'm sure there are people out there who have been falsely accused whose lives have been ruined. This is not one of them, in my opinion, but i find the vitriol interesting nevertheless.

 

[Truman]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

For me, he's been a hero because he did remind me of Wooden. Just always seemed like a very classy guy who ran a clean program for a long time. Seemed like a good guy. I admire class and decency. Until this incident, I had always related Paterno to those attributes.

No offense but..A classy guy who looks the other way while 60 year old dudes sexually assualt little boys. I love sports but to worship any of these people as heros is embarrassing. Come on Tim.

No offense but.....Maybe you should read Tim's post before responding.

 

[shake zula]

That this is a lesser story than the UM/OSU "scandals" shows were we are as a nation. The UM story was front page #### on Yahoo and ESPN.com for two straight weeks.

 

[timschochet]

I freely admit to being a fan of Paterno; he's always been a hero of mine

I was going to ask about this when you mentioned it earlier in the thread -- Why is he your hero? Because he coached football at the same place for a really long time? I don't view Paterno as one who has had an enduring effect on his sport (ala John Wooden). What makes him a hero? It seems to me that your hero-bar is set rather low.

For me, he's been a hero because he did remind me of Wooden. Just always seemed like a very classy guy who ran a clean program for a long time. Seemed like a good guy. I admire class and decency. Until this incident, I had always related Paterno to those attributes.

No offense but..A classy guy who looks the other way while 60 year old dudes sexually assualt little boys. I love sports but to worship any of these people as heros is embarrassing. Come on Tim.

Obviously if that's what he did then I would no longer feel the same way about him. But none of this has been proven to anything close to my satisfaction.

 

[CrossEyed]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

Tim, again, this was not an isolated incident. There had been at least one prior investigation. And yet everyone pretended that it was perfectly fine that this guy kept hanging out with young boys. Use your head here.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Wow, this could really tarnish JoePa for eternity. He is going to have to step down after the season if not sooner. I'm shocked he didn't retire a while back when he knew this would eventually get out.

A minor footnote on a reprehensible story, but this part fascinates me.WTF was Paterno thinking? Seriously, how do you not step down years ago? You know this is coming out, why in the world do you not go on your farewell tour, have everyone say nice things about you, and fade off into the sunset? I can't understand why he stayed on coaching knowing that this was going to come out.

 

[wadegarrett]

That this is a lesser story than the UM/OSU "scandals" shows were we are as a nation. The UM story was front page #### on Yahoo and ESPN.com for two straight weeks.

I haven't seen one site where it's not one of the lead stories.

 

[B-Deep]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

okwe also assume he knew nothing about 99so thena GA lies to you about seeing your friend raping a child, do you make him an assistant coach?

 

[Billy Bats]

Billy Bats made it clear that Paterno is "middle management".

Still a clown and still out of line. But keep bringing your simpleness to the thread, it is quite entertaining.

 

[CrossEyed]

Wow, this could really tarnish JoePa for eternity. He is going to have to step down after the season if not sooner. I'm shocked he didn't retire a while back when he knew this would eventually get out.

A minor footnote on a reprehensible story, but this part fascinates me.WTF was Paterno thinking? Seriously, how do you not step down years ago? You know this is coming out, why in the world do you not go on your farewell tour, have everyone say nice things about you, and fade off into the sunset? I can't understand why he stayed on coaching knowing that this was going to come out.

The same reason so many of these guys do the things they do and assume they will get away with it...ego.

 

[CrossEyed]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

okwe also assume he knew nothing about 99so thena GA lies to you about seeing your friend raping a child, do you make him an assistant coach?

Exactly. There is so much in this story that screams coverup, I have no idea how some people are defending anyone involved.

 

[B-Deep]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

okwe also assume he knew nothing about 99so thena GA lies to you about seeing your friend raping a child, do you make him an assistant coach?

Exactly. There is so much in this story that screams coverup, I have no idea how some people are defending anyone involved.

"Listen, jerry sandusky is a great guy, you are the nonly one who has ever said anything bad about him, and you made up a ludicrous story about how he committed rape. This guy is my friend ya know. So, wanna be an assistant coach?"

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Why wasn't he charged in 99?

 

[CrossEyed]

Another interesting tidbit to this story. McQueary is supposedly on a recruiting trip. Really? He's in the kitchens and living rooms of high school kids and their parents trying to sell them on the merits of PSU football right now?

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

I personally (and as a PSU alum) hope that Sandusky's "actions," bring down the JoePa legacy, because how he handled this situation shouldn't define his legacy.

this sentence doesn't make much sense to me.you want it to bring down his legacy, but also think it shouldn't define him?

 

[B-Deep]

Another interesting tidbit to this story. McQueary is supposedly on a recruiting trip. Really? He's in the kitchens and living rooms of high school kids and their parents trying to sell them on the merits of PSU football right now?

I cannot help but wonder, since sandusky kept his office and was around the program, how encounters between those two have gone since then.I mean, at some point they are gonna be in urinals next to each other, how exactly does that go down?

 

[whoknew]

I want to ask a theoretical question: suppose Paterno heard the accusation, reported it to Curley, and then a few days later Curley tells Paterno, "We investigated the matter; there's nothing to this story." Does Paterno really have an obligation at that point to pursue this matter on his own? Should he really report it to the police or to the press (pretty much the same thing) and ruin Sandusky's life whether the guy was innocent or guilty?

At that point, I would think JoePa would tell his coach who reported it - McQuery. And McQuery saw Sandusky raping a 10 year old boy. He's really going to go along with the "there's nothing to the report" story? If I'm JoePa and I have one of my kids - my young coach who played for me - tell me he saw this, its not going to be enough that Curley tells me there's nothing to it. I'd want to know more. I'd want to get to the bottom of it. If this is what happened and JoePa didn't investigate further - why not?

 

[Chase Stuart]

I do find it interesting sociologically that as soon as we as a society here "child molester" that person is automatically guilty, and no matter the verdict, that person is tainted for life. It seems there is no worse accusation nor a way to recover from such an accusation in our country. I'm sure there are people out there who have been falsely accused whose lives have been ruined. This is not one of them, in my opinion, but i find the vitriol interesting nevertheless.

IIRC, we had someone on these boards whose ex-wife basically did that to him in order to get custody of the kids. Or something like that.