Afraid people will be confused?Can we change the thread title from accused to convicted?
Afraid people will be confused?Can we change the thread title from accused to convicted?
The report got next to no coverage on the weekend. It's not showing up on any major media sites and is already tossed aside. The central argument was that the prior report was rushed because they couldn't talk to the major players because of the ongoing trial, yet they turned up nothing substantial.Jay Paterno really should just let it be
More? Don't you mean anythingBut it does raise good concerns about the Freeh report. Look Joe Pa should of done more, but just to dismiss this report is foolish and you have your head in the sand. I think this poses big problems for the NCAA since they used the Freeh report to discipline Penn State. If you think the Freeh report is solid then you also have to consider this report, since the ones that released this report are just as qualified as Mr. Freeh is. I am not saying Joe Pa is innocent or should not face the same judgment, but To me the emails lost prior to 2004 is a huge miss that was not reported. Both sides cherry picked what they wanted to help the point they wantedPaterno family report is out....drum roll please.....it vindicates Joe Pa......shocker
But didn't PSU agree to everything handed down by the NCAA? PSU didn't want this staying on the front page any longer than it had to so they agreed so there wouldn't be an ongoing investigation, then the front page again when anything was announced. I may be misremebering things though.how about the main question of lack of sufficient information directly from who they consider took part of the cover up. Why did they not disclose that they did not have all of the emails, They really only used 30 sources instead of the number they reported. Look I am not saying that the Freeh Report is all wrong, but it is being used as the bible for the NCAA, which did no investigation on their own. And this report is just as creditable as that report which raises the stakes that the NCAA is going to have to pay out some serious $$$ or that Penn St could face some issues from those that support it. I am not talking about what Sandusky did do and how the entire community was part of his horrific mess. This is about the NCAA and what did with out a full investigation on their own.such as?But it does raise good concerns about the Freeh report.Paterno family report is out....drum roll please.....it vindicates Joe Pa......shocker
Look Joe Pa should of done more, but just to dismiss this report is foolish and you have your head in the sand. I think this poses big problems for the NCAA since they used the Freeh report to discipline Penn State. If you think the Freeh report is solid then you also have to consider this report, since the ones that released this report are just as qualified as Mr. Freeh is. I am not saying Joe Pa is innocent or should not face the same judgment, but To me the emails lost prior to 2004 is a huge miss that was not reported. Both sides cherry picked what they wanted to help the point they wanted
ESPN devoted significant coverage over the weekend. And the central argument of the King & Spalding report isn't that the Freeh report was "rushed." The central argument is that the Freeh Report arrived at concusions that were not supported by the evidentiary record. Which strikes me as an eminently fair criticism.The report got next to no coverage on the weekend. It's not showing up on any major media sites and is already tossed aside. The central argument was that the prior report was rushed because they couldn't talk to the major players because of the ongoing trial, yet they turned up nothing substantial.Jay Paterno really should just let it be
I think this will sway this off topic some, but yes...PSU did agree to everything handed down by the NCAA, because basically, the NCAA said that if they didn't, they were going to hit them with even worse sanctions. It's a catch-22. It's also part of basis for the NCAA anti-trust suit. Basically, the "judge," aka NCAA, said, "Accept what we give you, or we'll give you far worse, which you will also then have to accept." So basically, saying Penn State agreed to everything handed down was to say that Penn State agreed because they had no other choice. I think the right thing for PSU is what they did...take your lashings and get out of the spotlight. I think that the Paterno report hurts more than it helps...but that doesn't change the fact that PSU "accepting sanctions as-is" was really PR fluff because their hand was forced by the NCAA's power.But didn't PSU agree to everything handed down by the NCAA? PSU didn't want this staying on the front page any longer than it had to so they agreed so there wouldn't be an ongoing investigation, then the front page again when anything was announced. I may be misremebering things though.
The bolded was really what I was getting at, PSU just wanted it off the front page and knew that they were going to take recruiting hits no matter what. I am not a real fan of the NCAA and agree with some that what they did was heavy handed, but I think the NCAA felt just as much PR pressure as PSU did...doesn't make it right, but does make it understandable to me.I think this will sway this off topic some, but yes...PSU did agree to everything handed down by the NCAA, because basically, the NCAA said that if they didn't, they were going to hit them with even worse sanctions. It's a catch-22. It's also part of basis for the NCAA anti-trust suit. Basically, the "judge," aka NCAA, said, "Accept what we give you, or we'll give you far worse, which you will also then have to accept." So basically, saying Penn State agreed to everything handed down was to say that Penn State agreed because they had no other choice.But didn't PSU agree to everything handed down by the NCAA? PSU didn't want this staying on the front page any longer than it had to so they agreed so there wouldn't be an ongoing investigation, then the front page again when anything was announced. I may be misremebering things though.
I think the right thing for PSU is what they did...take your lashings and get out of the spotlight. I think that the Paterno report hurts more than it helps...but that doesn't change the fact that PSU "accepting sanctions as-is" was really PR fluff because their hand was forced by the NCAA's power.
Only 30, huh?They really only used 30 sources...
PSU as an institution has a future and wants to "put this behind them" to do look forward and recover. The late Joe Paterno has no future and so his family is stuck debating about past events as a way of trying to salvage his legacy.It's PR 101, don't you think?It is interesting in that PSU wants to take the punishment and move on...yet the Paterno family/camp does not.
I liked the "this report is just as creditable [sic] as that report." Of course- everyone knows an independent review commissioned by the PSU trustees is just as credible as a report commissioned by the Paterno family! It's just common sense.Only 30, huh?They really only used 30 sources...
I would think that the way to review the credibility of both reports is to actually read the reports. Neither report strikes me as the height of legal craftmanship, but it's impossible to read the Freeh Report's conclusions about the 1998 allegations and accept its conclusions about Paterno's knowledge.EDIT:I'm going to amend the bold to say that I think it's impossible to read the Freeh report, knowing what we know about the 1998 allegations and what McQueery said he told Paterno, and believe that the Freeh report's conclusions are the only conclusions supported by the evidence.I liked the "this report is just as creditable [sic] as that report." Of course- everyone knows an independent review commissioned by the PSU trustees is just as credible as a report commissioned by the Paterno family! It's just common sense.Only 30, huh?They really only used 30 sources...
Context and motivation absolutely play a role in credibility. Obviously reading them both is important too, but you can't ignore that element.I would think that the way to review the credibility of both reports is to actually read the reports. Neither report strikes me as the height of legal craftmanship, but it's impossible to read the Freeh Report's conclusions about the 1998 allegations and accept its conclusions about Paterno's knowledge.I liked the "this report is just as creditable [sic] as that report." Of course- everyone knows an independent review commissioned by the PSU trustees is just as credible as a report commissioned by the Paterno family! It's just common sense.Only 30, huh?They really only used 30 sources...
Context and motivation absolutely play a role in credibility. Obviously reading them both is important too, but you can't ignore that element.I would think that the way to review the credibility of both reports is to actually read the reports. Neither report strikes me as the height of legal craftmanship, but it's impossible to read the Freeh Report's conclusions about the 1998 allegations and accept its conclusions about Paterno's knowledge.I liked the "this report is just as creditable [sic] as that report." Of course- everyone knows an independent review commissioned by the PSU trustees is just as credible as a report commissioned by the Paterno family! It's just common sense.Only 30, huh?They really only used 30 sources...

Yeah, he's really been by far the best "national sportswriter" on this case from Day 1. Really seems to understand the case, the issues and is fair and reasonable. As a PSU alum, it's hard to argue his conclusions.pretty good articleMy linkWetzel has a good, fair take as usual.
Hard for me to understand why this isn't a more popular conclusion.Read a lot of the Paterno report.
There's no doubt the Freeh report was a cram-down. I'm convinced it has a lot of assumptions. I think it goes way too far when it concludes a 'conspiracy to cover-up' especially from Joe's perspective.
That said, nothing in the Paterno report suggests the Freeh report conclusions CAN'T be true, it really just suggests it was incomplete and inaccurate and poses other possibilities. Neither is particularly conclusive for me.
I still think the NCAA stepped way outside of its jurisdiction on this, especially in light of the failings of the Freeh report.
Yeah, this is my biggest beef as well. Malcolm Gladwell did a nice article on it as well but it got no play in the media. I think people just like to make up their minds on these sort of things and then move on. But if you're interested, this is a good perspective of how difficult it can be to uncover monsters like Sandusky:Linkhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSW6aG9hWokFascinating interview.Lot of troubling things about the whole thing make more sense after listening to this. I'm more convinced than ever that the rush to judgement of everyone other than Sandusky has been ridiculous. The interviewee is a guy who's done thousands of child sex investigations basically saying the Freeh report is worthless because Freeh, and most people, simply don't understand the dynamics of these kinds of cases, and that it could have happened anywhere...was not unique to college football.
It's the angry mob mentality that this society falls for time and time again. It'e either that or people are just dumb.Hard for me to understand why this isn't a more popular conclusion.Read a lot of the Paterno report.
There's no doubt the Freeh report was a cram-down. I'm convinced it has a lot of assumptions. I think it goes way too far when it concludes a 'conspiracy to cover-up' especially from Joe's perspective.
That said, nothing in the Paterno report suggests the Freeh report conclusions CAN'T be true, it really just suggests it was incomplete and inaccurate and poses other possibilities. Neither is particularly conclusive for me.
I still think the NCAA stepped way outside of its jurisdiction on this, especially in light of the failings of the Freeh report.
It's the angry mob mentality that this society falls for time and time again. It'e either that or people are just dumb.Hard for me to understand why this isn't a more popular conclusion.Read a lot of the Paterno report.
There's no doubt the Freeh report was a cram-down. I'm convinced it has a lot of assumptions. I think it goes way too far when it concludes a 'conspiracy to cover-up' especially from Joe's perspective.
That said, nothing in the Paterno report suggests the Freeh report conclusions CAN'T be true, it really just suggests it was incomplete and inaccurate and poses other possibilities. Neither is particularly conclusive for me.
I still think the NCAA stepped way outside of its jurisdiction on this, especially in light of the failings of the Freeh report.
It's easy to understand why people join the lynch mob. Not that that excuses it of course.Your wish has been granted.I would have had no problem with the death penalty. For multiple years. At the very least they should have gotten a TV ban.
I hope Bill O'Brien gets an NFL job and the judge laughs at Corbett's lawsuit.
Here is the transcript of the interview. The questions are being asked by Anthony Sassano, an agent with the Pennsylvania attorney general's office. The text is sic; everything is as it appears in Ziegler's book and presumably in the original:
INTERVIEW: JOSEPH V. PATERNO
The date is 10/24/11; time 12:17 p.m., interview of coach Joseph Vincent Paterno, 830 North McKee Street, State College, PA. Scott Paterno is here representing his father. Randy Feathers is also present.
SASSANO: Coach are you aware that this statement is being taped and do you give me permission to tape this statement?
J. PATERNO: Yes.
SASSANO: Did Mike McQueary, some years ago, come to you, report to you an incident that he observed in the shower between Jerry Sandusky and another individual most likely a young boy.
J. PATERNO: Yes he did.
SASSANO: Okay, and can you tell me what Mike McQueary told you please.
J. PATERNO: Mike McQueary came and said he was in the shower and that Jerry Sandusky was in the shower with another person, a younger, how young I don’t know and Mike never mentioned it, that there was some inappropriate sexual activity going on. We didn’t get in to what the inappropriate action was, but it was inappropriate. And that’s how I knew about it.
SASSANO: So he did not elaborate to you what this sexual activity was, only that he witnessed some sexual activity between Sandusky and a young boy?
J. PATERNO: Well he, well he, to be frank with you it was a long time ago, but I think as I recall he said something about touching.
SASSANO: Touching?
J. PATERNO: Touching.. whatever you want to call them, privates, whatever it is.
SASSANO: Okay, could he have said there was something more? An actual sex act?
J. PATERNO: He never said that.
SASSANO: Okay. Subsequent to that conversation with Mike, you took some appropriate action, correct?
J. PATERNO: Yea, I did because I felt, again, at that time Jerry Sandusky was not working for me.
SASSANO: Correct.
J. PATERNO: Jerry had retired from the coaching staff two or three years earlier. So I didn’t feel it was my responsibility to make any kind of a decision as to what to do with him, so I called our athletic director, I told him that Mike McQueary had something that he probably ought to share with him.
SASSANO: Okay, did you tell him that over the phone or did you have a meeting in person here at your house?
J. PATERNO: No, I told him over the phone.
SASSANO: Did you have a subsequent meeting at your house?
J. PATERNO: Oh gez, I don’t know, we.. he’s been over here, he comes over here for a lot of different reasons and something may have come up during our, he may have come over about a football schedule, he may have come over about something else and in the process we may have gotten in to it, I can’t say absolutely no and I can’t tell you I remember doing it.
SASSANO: Okay, the key element is, do you remember if you told Mr. Curley whether in person or over the phone, that McQueary witnessed a sexual incident between Sandusky and a boy?
J. PATERNO: To my knowledge yes I think Tim was aware of the fact that Mike had been a.. had seen this inappropriate action.
SASSANO: Sexual action?
J. PATERNO: Well yea, I guess you’d call it sexual. I don’t .. he had a, yea.
SASSANO: Okay, so now it’s quite clear to Mike so, oh I’m sorry, to Mr. Curley. So if Mr. Curley would have told us some…
J. PATERNO: Now I can’t, I can’t tell you it was exactly clear to Mr. Curley you’d have to ask him. I can only tell that he was.. it was transmitted to him that there was inappropriate action. To what degree I didn’t, I never asked Mike. All I know was that it was basic.. it was something we would probably take, uh, probably call sexual. What Tim got out of it I have no way of knowing. But Tim was aware of the fact that we felt we had a problem.
SASSANO: And do you know what happened after that with regards to Mr. McQueary and/or Mr. Curley?
J. PATERNO: Nope.
SASSANO: Did Mr. Curley get back to you at some point in time after that to advise you what actions were taken…
J. PATERNO: No, no, I didn’t, I had other things to do, we had… As I said, Jerry was not working for me.
SASSANO: Right.
J. PATERNO: So I felt that I had done, I’ve asked Mike to, Mike had come to me not knowing what to do. He explained what his, what his dilemma was. I said okay. I said we got to go up the ladder. I made sure Curley knew that there was a problem and then that was it. Until all of the sudden ten years later or eight years later people are asking me what happened. But prior to that you know that was…. Jerry was not part of our activities. He wasn’t, there was no need for me to go around in any way.
SASSANO: Subsequent to Mr. McQueary coming to you and you advising Mr. Curley of this inappropriate sexual action, whatever that maybe..
J. PATERNO: Mr. Curley did not come to me, I went to Mr. Curley, I got in touch..
S. PATERNO: You misheard what he said, he said Mr. McQueary came to you.
J. PATERNO: Who?
S. PATERNO: He said Mr. McQueary came to you.
SASSANO: Mike.
S. PATERNO: You misheard him
J. PATERNO: He did not come to me.
S. PATERNO: Mike McQueary.
J. PATERNO: Ohhh, McQueary, I thought you said Curley.
S. PATERNO: Not Curley. He’s not used to hearing Mike called Mr. McQueary.
J. PATERNO: No no no. Mike McQueary. Mike McQueary saw it on a Friday, came over here and sat at the very table we’re doing this interview, alright, and was very upset. I said what’s your problem and he said I saw something yesterday, I was in the shower, I was in the locker room, Jerry Sandusky was taking a shower with a person. And he said they were doing things that, ya know, and I never got in to know hey what did he do, did he do this, did he do that, but obviously there was a sexual kind of activity. I said hey Tim we got to let the other people know because I have no responsi… I have no authority over Jerry.
SASSANO: Subsequent, to that you’re saying Mr. Curley never got back to you, correct, to advise you?
J. PATTERNO: There was no need to get back.
SASSANO: Did any police department ever get ahold of you about this?
J. PATTERNO: Nope.
SASSANO: Did anybody from the University, well, anybody from the University Police Department contact you?
J. PATTERNO: Well, not till ten years later.
SASSANO: Okay.
J. PATTERNO: All of the sudden this thing was…I got a telephone call saying hey you’re going to get subpoenaed. I said about what.
SASSANO: Okay, and just so, I don’t think I asked you this, the alleged inappropriate sexual behavior that occurred, where did Mike tell you, and you’re saying in the shower or locker room, what building?
J. PATERNO: The Lasch Building where we are.
SASSANO: The Lasch, basically the complex, the football complex, basically,
J. PATERNO: The football complex.
SASSANO: Where all the brain trust, the offices are, the work-out room and stuff like that.
J. PATERNO: The weight room is and our academic support center is and all that.
SASSANO: Coach, how long have you known Mike McQueary?
J. PATERNO: Since he was a high school kid.
SASSANO: And you’ve known him for a long number of years now, correct?
J. PATERNO: I would, he played for me, played for Penn State is what I should say, he.. when he graduated from high school he came here, what year he got out of high school I can’t say..
SASSANO: Okay, but you’ve known him for quite a number of years.
J. PATERNO: Oh, yea,
ASSANO: He’s been on your staff for a long period of time.
J. PATERNO: Twelve, fifteen years probably.
SASSANO: Do you know him to be a trustworthy individual?
J. PATERNO: Absolutely.
SASSANO: If he came and told you something
J. PATERNO: Absolutely..
SASSANO: Would you automatically believe it?
J. PATERNO: Absolutely. He was very upset when I…
SASSANO: Knowing him as you know him, and dealing with stress and pressure like he does in his system, do you know him to be one that over-reacts or does he appropriately handle that and report the same thing?
J. PATERNO: Well, he’s a competitor, a fiery guy in that sense. But I can’t, in his relationship with people I don’t remember him over-reacting. Once in a while with one of his players he’ll foul up and he’ll, and I’ll have to say, you know, are you sure he’s the guy, and you know that kind of thing. But in something like that I don’t think I’ve ever seen him overreact.
SASSANO: In your appraisal of him then if he was upset about something it would be for an appropriate reason, correct?
J. PATERNO: It was legitimate. It was legitimate.
SASSANO: It was what?
J. PATERNO: He would have been legitimately upset.
SASSANO: Okay. Do you have anything you wish to add to this statement?
J. PATERNO: (laughing) I hope it’s the last one.
SASSANO: Okay, Scott Paterno, Attorney Scott Paterno, do you have anything you wish to add to this statement?
S. PATERNO: No, No.
How about now?"Jerry Sandusky - new Penn State defensive coordinator" Seriously, can we change the title yet?
I don't think anyone has forgotten about him. Why would people want to continue to talk about such a horrible person?Sandusky has to be the biggest Aaron Hernandez fan in the world. Seems everyone has forgotten about this creep.
He got off easily, f'ng POSI hope Paterno is orally servicing donkeys for eternity in a burning fire pit in he11.
He was fired last year and has been unemployed ever since. He's filed a $4 million dollar whistleblower lawsuit against Penn State:This may have been addressed in the past few pages since the Sandusky trial, but my memory sucks. What has happened to McQueary?
He was so quiet you could hear the bodies slapping in the shower.Joe Paterno was a quiet man.
Ooof. Another skeleton falls out of the closet.BELLEFONTE, Pa. — A son of former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky is seeking to have his name changed more than a year after his adoptive father was convicted of child sexual abuse.
Matt Sandusky filed papers Tuesday in Centre County Court seeking to have the names of him and his family changed. Though the documents are sealed, they show he filed for a name change, along with his wife and four children.
Matt Sandusky had been expected to be a defense witness until the trial, when he told investigators that he also had been abused by Jerry Sandusky.
Jerry Sandusky was convicted on 45 counts of sexual abuse. He is serving a 30- to 60-year prison sentence and maintains he was wrongfully convicted. He is pursuing appeals.
Is he changing his name to Jerry?BELLEFONTE, Pa. — A son of former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky is seeking to have his name changed more than a year after his adoptive father was convicted of child sexual abuse.
Matt Sandusky filed papers Tuesday in Centre County Court seeking to have the names of him and his family changed. Though the documents are sealed, they show he filed for a name change, along with his wife and four children.
Matt Sandusky had been expected to be a defense witness until the trial, when he told investigators that he also had been abused by Jerry Sandusky.
Jerry Sandusky was convicted on 45 counts of sexual abuse. He is serving a 30- to 60-year prison sentence and maintains he was wrongfully convicted. He is pursuing appeals.
Guy deserves to be in jail as an accomplice to covering that up. Staying at the school and advancing in the coaching ranks knowing that they covered up rape and molestation?! Piss off coward.Mr. Retukes said:He was fired last year and has been unemployed ever since. He's filed a $4 million dollar whistleblower lawsuit against Penn State:http://deadspin.com/5948411/mike-mcqueary-has-filed-a-4-million-lawsuit-against-penn-stateDragons said:This may have been addressed in the past few pages since the Sandusky trial, but my memory sucks. What has happened to McQueary?
If your last name was Sandusky, wouldn't you change it too?BELLEFONTE, Pa. — A son of former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky is seeking to have his name changed more than a year after his adoptive father was convicted of child sexual abuse.
Matt Sandusky filed papers Tuesday in Centre County Court seeking to have the names of him and his family changed. Though the documents are sealed, they show he filed for a name change, along with his wife and four children.
Matt Sandusky had been expected to be a defense witness until the trial, when he told investigators that he also had been abused by Jerry Sandusky.
Jerry Sandusky was convicted on 45 counts of sexual abuse. He is serving a 30- to 60-year prison sentence and maintains he was wrongfully convicted. He is pursuing appeals.