Josh Freeman - what's his future hold? (2 Viewers)

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly.

This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:

Colin Kaepernick 	118.0%Tom Brady		117.2%Peyton Manning		115.9%Russell Wilson 		114.6%Drew Brees		111.3%Robert Griffin III	109.4%Aaron Rodgers		108.4%Alex Smith 		106.1%Eli Manning		106.1%Tony Romo		105.7%Matt Schaub		105.6%Cam Newton 		105.6%Matt Ryan		105.5%Matthew Stafford 	104.6%Josh Freeman 	        102.1%Joe Flacco 		102.0%Ben Roethlisberger	101.8%Carson Palmer		101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 		99.8%Andrew Luck 		99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 	97.1%Jay Cutler		95.8%Andy Dalton 		95.7%Ryan Tannehill 		95.2%Jake Locker 		95.0%Brandon Weeden 		92.7%Philip Rivers		91.4%Matt Cassel		90.3%Chad Henne 		89.9%Michael Vick		89.3%Mark Sanchez 		89.0%Christian Ponder 	87.0%John Skelton 		85.2%Blaine Gabbert		83.5%Nick Foles 		82.8%Kevin Kolb 		76.8%Brady Quinn 		74.1%

 

[cstu]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly.

This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:

Colin Kaepernick 118.0%Tom Brady 117.2%Peyton Manning 115.9%Russell Wilson 114.6%Drew Brees 111.3%Robert Griffin III 109.4%Aaron Rodgers 108.4%Alex Smith 106.1%Eli Manning 106.1%Tony Romo 105.7%Matt Schaub 105.6%Cam Newton 105.6%Matt Ryan 105.5%Matthew Stafford 104.6%Josh Freeman 102.1%Joe Flacco 102.0%Ben Roethlisberger 101.8%Carson Palmer 101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 99.8%Andrew Luck 99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 97.1%Jay Cutler 95.8%Andy Dalton 95.7%Ryan Tannehill 95.2%Jake Locker 95.0%Brandon Weeden 92.7%Philip Rivers 91.4%Matt Cassel 90.3%Chad Henne 89.9%Michael Vick 89.3%Mark Sanchez 89.0%Christian Ponder 87.0%John Skelton 85.2%Blaine Gabbert 83.5%Nick Foles 82.8%Kevin Kolb 76.8%Brady Quinn 74.1%

How does he rank over the last 5 games of the season when he threw 6 TD's to 10 INT's and never completed more than 55% of his passes?

 

[Shanahanigans]

How does he rank over the last 5 games of the season when he threw 6 TD's to 10 INT's and never completed more than 55% of his passes?

If you can cherry pick those five games, let me cherry pick the 5 games from Week 6 to Week 10, when he threw for 1467 Yards, 13 TDs, and just 1 INT.

It makes much more sense to look at someone's performance over the course of the entire season, than it does to cherry pick games that suit your argument.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly.

This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:

Colin Kaepernick 118.0%Tom Brady 117.2%Peyton Manning 115.9%Russell Wilson 114.6%Drew Brees 111.3%Robert Griffin III 109.4%Aaron Rodgers 108.4%Alex Smith 106.1%Eli Manning 106.1%Tony Romo 105.7%Matt Schaub 105.6%Cam Newton 105.6%Matt Ryan 105.5%Matthew Stafford 104.6%Josh Freeman 102.1%Joe Flacco 102.0%Ben Roethlisberger 101.8%Carson Palmer 101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 99.8%Andrew Luck 99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 97.1%Jay Cutler 95.8%Andy Dalton 95.7%Ryan Tannehill 95.2%Jake Locker 95.0%Brandon Weeden 92.7%Philip Rivers 91.4%Matt Cassel 90.3%Chad Henne 89.9%Michael Vick 89.3%Mark Sanchez 89.0%Christian Ponder 87.0%John Skelton 85.2%Blaine Gabbert 83.5%Nick Foles 82.8%Kevin Kolb 76.8%Brady Quinn 74.1%

How does he rank over the last 5 games of the season when he threw 6 TD's to 10 INT's and never completed more than 55% of his passes?

Why would I give five games more weight than all sixteen?

Why would I give five bad games more weight than the very good first eleven?

Why would I assume that a 24 year old QB who put up league average #s wouldn't be better than that when he reaches his prime in the next year or two?

 

[Shanahanigans]

It's very simple. If Freeman produces this year he gets a huge long term extension. If he doesn't, the Bucs let him walk and have a QB waiting who spent a year learning and getting ready.Nice planning by the Bucs.

I don't think it's smart planning if you are suggesting Glennon might be their starter next year. I am a State fan and watched every game of Glennon's career. He's not very good. Tall, yes. Strong arm, yes. But inaccurate, shaky decision making, poor footwork, and not a strong leader.

So he's Josh Freeman?

Well played.

 

[DawnBTVS]

There has to be some worry if you're Greg Schiano. Freeman is a QB that completed 40 fewer passes despite throwing the ball just 9 times more than the season before. With that said, he had a much higher YPA, TD%, and lower INT%. At the cost of consistency, however.

He sandwiched a great run in the middle with maddening inconsistency at the start and close of the season.

YPG rounded up or down

G01-05: 1,118 [224 YPG] and 8 TD vs 5 INT [2-3 Record]

G06-11: 1,643 [274 YPG] and 13 TD vs 2 INT [4-2 Record]

G12-16: 1,304 [217 YPG] and 6 TD vs 10 INT [1-5 Record]

People can mention "cherry picking" games but it's pretty clear that Freeman had two distinct parts of the season where he was average or really bad.

He definitely has the physical ability to be a good quarterback but Freeman needs to show consistency for the better part of the season to be successful in the NFL and stick as a starter in Tampa Bay under Schiano. If a coach can't tell how his QB will play over the course of a 5-6 game stretch, how can he trust that QB to lead him to the playoffs or even a Super Bowl?

 

[cstu]

How does he rank over the last 5 games of the season when he threw 6 TD's to 10 INT's and never completed more than 55% of his passes?

If you can cherry pick those five games, let me cherry pick the 5 games from Week 6 to Week 10, when he threw for 1467 Yards, 13 TDs, and just 1 INT.

It makes much more sense to look at someone's performance over the course of the entire season, than it does to cherry pick games that suit your argument.

Ok, he had a great stretch in the middle of the year. That's nice but he's been a starter for 4 years and shouldn't be falling apart right when they're in the playoff hunt. He's was outplayed by Ponder down the stretch to get the Vikings in the playoffs. Think about that.

 

[ghostguy123]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly.

This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:

Colin Kaepernick 118.0%Tom Brady 117.2%Peyton Manning 115.9%Russell Wilson 114.6%Drew Brees 111.3%Robert Griffin III 109.4%Aaron Rodgers 108.4%Alex Smith 106.1%Eli Manning 106.1%Tony Romo 105.7%Matt Schaub 105.6%Cam Newton 105.6%Matt Ryan 105.5%Matthew Stafford 104.6%Josh Freeman 102.1%Joe Flacco 102.0%Ben Roethlisberger 101.8%Carson Palmer 101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 99.8%Andrew Luck 99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 97.1%Jay Cutler 95.8%Andy Dalton 95.7%Ryan Tannehill 95.2%Jake Locker 95.0%Brandon Weeden 92.7%Philip Rivers 91.4%Matt Cassel 90.3%Chad Henne 89.9%Michael Vick 89.3%Mark Sanchez 89.0%Christian Ponder 87.0%John Skelton 85.2%Blaine Gabbert 83.5%Nick Foles 82.8%Kevin Kolb 76.8%Brady Quinn 74.1%

On my god I would hate to be the guy who had to figure out those stats.

 

[msommer]

With VJax and Williams (downfield WRs), a strong OLine, talented RB, and neither a strong pass-catching tight-end nor Welker-like slot WR, it seems to me that the Bucs offense is to be predicated on: 1) running the ball and 2) taking shots downfield, especially off play-action. To me, that means Freeman has to: 1) protect the football, especially on sacks and short-to-intermediate passes, 2) be accurate downfield, and 3) generally make good decisions, such as knowing when to scramble for the first down or throw the ball away if it's not there downfield. I'm not convinced that he is *strong* in any of these three areas. His intermediate-to-deep accuracy hasn't been great, he's turned the ball over at critical times, and his decision-making has been suspect. Of course, he's still young, has some physical tools, and can develop. I'm also not convinced a rookie will develop into what the Bucs need faster than Freeman, especially if the rookie is a project QB.

I would've rather seen the Bucs bring in a Carson Palmer type veteran, even Kolb maybe, to push Freeman. People like to hate on Kolb, but the Arizona OL were a bunch of turnstiles and Kolb showed some talent when he was in Philly. The Bucs have strength at the skill positions and OLine -- a great scenario for a veteran QB to come in and be successful...

The drafting of Glennon smacks most of Schiano wanting "his guy" to put "his stamp" on the team, rather than doing what is best for the Bucs to be successful in the next 1-2 years.

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

When I saw this I decided to run the numbers

2009. 291 attempts, 159 completions 1851 yards 10 TDs 18 interceptions completed 54.6% of his passes, 11.6 ypc, 0.03 td per attempt, 0.06 int per attempt

2010 474 attempts, 291 completions 3451 yards 25 TDs 6 interceptions, completed 61.4% of his passes, 11.9 ypc, 0.05 td per attempt, 0.01 int per attempt

2011 551 attempts, 346 completions 3592 yards 16 TDs 22 interceptions, completed 62.8% of his passes, 10.4 ypc, 0.03 td per attempt, 0.04 int per attempt

2012 558 attempts, 306 completions 4065 yards 27 TDs 17 interceptions, completed 54.8% of his passes, 13,3 ypc, 0.05 td per attempt, 0.03 int per attempt

So from 2011 his completion ratio went from 62.8 to 54.8, but his ypc increased by three whole yards. He got more tds per attempt than 2011 and fewer ints.

This seems consistent with two things: being asked to take more shots downfield and having an issue with downfield accuracy. It might also have something to do with having a different scheme to run and different receivers

If I had access to more refined data and wanted to spend more time on it I would look at YAC for the TB receivers (trend) and catches out of the backfield (scheme/personnel).

But even with the limited dataset looked at above it is hardly conclusive that he has regressed each of the past two seasons.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

	QB		Age	TDs	INTs	 QB Rate 	NY/A 	 ANY/A Josh Freeman 		25	27	 17	  81.6 	 	6.68 	 6.30 Joe Flacco 		28	22	 10	  87.7 	 	6.34 	 6.33 Matthew Stafford 	25	20	 17	  79.8 		6.29 	 5.81

 

[bucsbaby]

So, what is the reasoning here -- that Flacco just won the Superbowl, yet Freeman out-performed him, while being 3 years younger?

Sure, average QBs can win Superbowls. Look no further than Dilfer or Brad Johnson. Some top-notch QBs also sometimes flop in the playoffs -- see Manning, Peyton.

Flacco also looked good during the Superbowl run. However, even quite recently, people were questioning whether Flacco should be replaced.

Bottom line though is that Flacco stepped up his game to help his team win. In contrast, during crunch-time, Freeman has shown a tendency to do the opposite. Is it possible that Freeman could lead TB to glory? Sure. Can he do it during the window the Bucs have created with their recent drafts, trades, and FA moves?

That's the multi-million dollar question.

 

[gump]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly. This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:

Colin Kaepernick 	118.0%Tom Brady		117.2%Peyton Manning		115.9%Russell Wilson 		114.6%Drew Brees		111.3%Robert Griffin III	109.4%Aaron Rodgers		108.4%Alex Smith 		106.1%Eli Manning		106.1%Tony Romo		105.7%Matt Schaub		105.6%Cam Newton 		105.6%Matt Ryan		105.5%Matthew Stafford 	104.6%Josh Freeman 	        102.1%Joe Flacco 		102.0%Ben Roethlisberger	101.8%Carson Palmer		101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 		99.8%Andrew Luck 		99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 	97.1%Jay Cutler		95.8%Andy Dalton 		95.7%Ryan Tannehill 		95.2%Jake Locker 		95.0%Brandon Weeden 		92.7%Philip Rivers		91.4%Matt Cassel		90.3%Chad Henne 		89.9%Michael Vick		89.3%Mark Sanchez 		89.0%Christian Ponder 	87.0%John Skelton 		85.2%Blaine Gabbert		83.5%Nick Foles 		82.8%Kevin Kolb 		76.8%Brady Quinn 		74.1%

This is part of Freeman's issues...if he decides pre-snap he's throwing dowfield....he throws downfield. Sometimes with Martin breaking in the open out of the backfield.I think most Buc fans just see a talented offense that needs to be managed better.

 

[bucsbaby]

Freeman has regressed the past two seasons, especially with regard to his accuracy. It's even more concerning that the offense now has VJax and Martin yet he's still playing poorly.

He didn't 'regress' -- he threw the ball deeper down field. And he did throw too many INTs, but overall he didn't play poorly. This is Net Yards/Attempt indexed to the league average after every pass was adjusted for the quality of the defense it came against:Colin Kaepernick 118.0%Tom Brady 117.2%Peyton Manning 115.9%Russell Wilson 114.6%Drew Brees 111.3%Robert Griffin III 109.4%Aaron Rodgers 108.4%Alex Smith 106.1%Eli Manning 106.1%Tony Romo 105.7%Matt Schaub 105.6%Cam Newton 105.6%Matt Ryan 105.5%Matthew Stafford 104.6%Josh Freeman 102.1%Joe Flacco 102.0%Ben Roethlisberger 101.8%Carson Palmer 101.6%----------------------- 100.0% (league average)Sam Bradford 99.8%Andrew Luck 99.0%Ryan Fitzpatrick 97.1%Jay Cutler 95.8%Andy Dalton 95.7%Ryan Tannehill 95.2%Jake Locker 95.0%Brandon Weeden 92.7%Philip Rivers 91.4%Matt Cassel 90.3%Chad Henne 89.9%Michael Vick 89.3%Mark Sanchez 89.0%Christian Ponder 87.0%John Skelton 85.2%Blaine Gabbert 83.5%Nick Foles 82.8%Kevin Kolb 76.8%Brady Quinn 74.1%

This is part of Freeman's issues...if he decides pre-snap he's throwing dowfield....he throws downfield. Sometimes with Martin breaking in the open out of the backfield.I think most Buc fans just see a talented offense that needs to be managed better.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Too bad Schiano doesn't trust him. That doesn't help in the development process if you ask me. I'm not picking on GS but if you knew Freeman wasn't it then you should have been in on the QB sweepstakes last season.

 

[cstu]

Too bad Schiano doesn't trust him. That doesn't help in the development process if you ask me. I'm not picking on GS but if you knew Freeman wasn't it then you should have been in on the QB sweepstakes last season.

If the guy wasn't so obsessed with DB's he could have had Tannehill. I like Barron a lot but you have to have a good QB.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Too bad Schiano doesn't trust him. That doesn't help in the development process if you ask me. I'm not picking on GS but if you knew Freeman wasn't it then you should have been in on the QB sweepstakes last season.

If the guy wasn't so obsessed with DB's he could have had Tannehill. I like Barron a lot but you have to have a good QB.

It will be very difficult for the Bucs to get into the playoffs in the NFC...I can only think of 1-2 teams that have no shot at making the playoffs in the NFC, AFC is much more defined in terms of front runner. Chicago won 10 game last year and Lovie Smith was fired. I don't know how you can put Tampa in front of teams like Atlanta, SF, Sea, someone has to win the East and North, maybe a wildcard from those 2 divisions as well, so assume the Bucs go 8-8/9-7 and miss the playoffs.

Now Schiano can use Freeman as a scapegoat to buy time for his job and say "I never got to being in my guy, I never drafted Freeman"

I hope that's not the case but it seems possible and why Schiano won't get behind him all the way.

 

[Grahamburn]

Too bad Schiano doesn't trust him. That doesn't help in the development process if you ask me. I'm not picking on GS but if you knew Freeman wasn't it then you should have been in on the QB sweepstakes last season.

If the guy wasn't so obsessed with DB's he could have had Tannehill. I like Barron a lot but you have to have a good QB.

Tannehill is better than Freeman how?

 

[Premier]

Man there is a lot of dumb in this thread. Tannehill?

 

[Wise Old Owl]

So, what is the reasoning here -- that Flacco just won the Superbowl, yet Freeman out-performed him, while being 3 years younger?

Sure, average QBs can win Superbowls. Look no further than Dilfer or Brad Johnson. Some top-notch QBs also sometimes flop in the playoffs -- see Manning, Peyton.

Flacco also looked good during the Superbowl run. However, even quite recently, people were questioning whether Flacco should be replaced.

Bottom line though is that Flacco stepped up his game to help his team win. In contrast, during crunch-time, Freeman has shown a tendency to do the opposite. Is it possible that Freeman could lead TB to glory? Sure. Can he do it during the window the Bucs have created with their recent drafts, trades, and FA moves?

That's the multi-million dollar question.

This was never really true, the real debate was if he deserved the money he wanted/got. Your point is valid though, the main reason we look at Flacco and Freeman differently is that Flacco has won at least one playoff game a season since he's been in the league and has played great in Superbowls and AFCC games.

Freeman's main problem is inconsistency (similar to Flacco) and since he's a team that is underperforming hes an easy target for blame. I think we see improvement this year, but he's not going to take that step to take him into top 10 fantasy QB's that people expected two years ago. The real question is should be be concerning ourselves with someone who's best case scenario is Flacco or Dalton or Cutler type numbers?

 

[bucsbaby]

From a pure stats perspective, Freeman has been good enough. Also,it's a team game and the QB can't do it all. However, watching the games, Freeman just hasn't had "it" often enough for the Bucs to win playoff games. Granted, the Bucs have also been down early and often a lot because of their brutal pass D.

If it's beetween Freeman or turning things over to Glennon? Freeman in a landslide. But if Freeman doesn't step up his game this season, I want the Bucs to go after a vet for the next few years during their window and then let Glennon develop.

 

[Grahamburn]

The Bucs scored 34, 10, 22, 28, 23, 23, 21, 0, and 13 points in their losses.

Tampa had late leads in 4 games they ended up losing because the defense couldn't get a stop.

There definitely is a ton of pressure on Freeman to win this season, but he doesn't necessarily have to be any better for the Bucs to win several more games this year than they did in 2012.

The guy just had the best statistical season in Tampa Bay history. Give him a freaking break.

 

[Chase Stuart]

The Bucs scored 34, 10, 22, 28, 23, 23, 21, 0, and 13 points in their losses.

Tampa had late leads in 4 games they ended up losing because the defense couldn't get a stop.

There definitely is a ton of pressure on Freeman to win this season, but he doesn't necessarily have to be any better for the Bucs to win several more games this year than they did in 2012.

The guy just had the best statistical season in Tampa Bay history. Give him a freaking break.

From a pure stats perspective, Freeman has been good enough. Also,it's a team game and the QB can't do it all. However, watching the games, Freeman just hasn't had "it" often enough for the Bucs to win playoff games. Granted, the Bucs have also been down early and often a lot because of their brutal pass D.If it's beetween Freeman or turning things over to Glennon? Freeman in a landslide. But if Freeman doesn't step up his game this season, I want the Bucs to go after a vet for the next few years during their window and then let Glennon develop.

-- Against the Giants, Freeman had his tema up 27-16 entering the 4th quarter. The Giants scored 18 points to go up 34-27, Freeman threw a 41-yard TD pass to tie the game, but then the Giants scored another TD to win.-- Against the Eagles, Freeman had his team up 21-10 with 7 minutes left; they were up 21-16 with 2 seconds left and lost.-- Against the Redskins, Freeman had his team up 22-21 with 1:42 left and Washington having the ball on their own 20.

-- Trailing 35-21 against the Saints with 8 minutes to go, he led the Bucs on two touchdown drives to tie it. The second touchdown came as time expired but Mike Williams was called for an illegal touch pass to nullify the game-tying TD.

-- Against the Falcons, he played a good game and lost 24-23. Connor Barth missed a 56-yarder with 3 mins left that could have given Tampa the lead.

Forget Freeman's stats. With a good defense last year, Tampa goes 11-5.

 

[Faust]

Video Link:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-netwo...0000200107/Is-Glennon-the-future-in-Tampa-Bay

Is QB Mike Glennon the Tampa Bay Buccaneers' future?

02:41 – Heath Evans and Darren Sharper debate if rookie QB Mike Glennon could supplant Josh Freeman as the Tampa Bay Buccaneers' starter.

 

[Premier]

The Bucs scored 34, 10, 22, 28, 23, 23, 21, 0, and 13 points in their losses. Tampa had late leads in 4 games they ended up losing because the defense couldn't get a stop. There definitely is a ton of pressure on Freeman to win this season, but he doesn't necessarily have to be any better for the Bucs to win several more games this year than they did in 2012. The guy just had the best statistical season in Tampa Bay history. Give him a freaking break.

From a pure stats perspective, Freeman has been good enough. Also,it's a team game and the QB can't do it all. However, watching the games, Freeman just hasn't had "it" often enough for the Bucs to win playoff games. Granted, the Bucs have also been down early and often a lot because of their brutal pass D.If it's beetween Freeman or turning things over to Glennon? Freeman in a landslide. But if Freeman doesn't step up his game this season, I want the Bucs to go after a vet for the next few years during their window and then let Glennon develop.

-- Against the Giants, Freeman had his tema up 27-16 entering the 4th quarter. The Giants scored 18 points to go up 34-27, Freeman threw a 41-yard TD pass to tie the game, but then the Giants scored another TD to win.-- Against the Eagles, Freeman had his team up 21-10 with 7 minutes left; they were up 21-16 with 2 seconds left and lost.-- Against the Redskins, Freeman had his team up 22-21 with 1:42 left and Washington having the ball on their own 20. -- Trailing 35-21 against the Saints with 8 minutes to go, he led the Bucs on two touchdown drives to tie it. The second touchdown came as time expired but Mike Williams was called for an illegal touch pass to nullify the game-tying TD. -- Against the Falcons, he played a good game and lost 24-23. Connor Barth missed a 56-yarder with 3 mins left that could have given Tampa the lead. Forget Freeman's stats. With a good defense last year, Tampa goes 11-5.

This made me depressed all over again.

 

[donkshow]

I don't hate him. He certainly can put up BEAST games. His consistency is annoying and he cannot be relied on week in and week out yet.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

For purposes of fantasy football discussion, it's hard to peg where Freeman will be till they settle on who their tight end is going to be. Schiano is crossing his fingers that Luke Stocker can come in and replace Dallas Clark's stats. Right now, they have about 5 guys at the TE spot that haven't done squat in their careers. A good tight end will do wonders opening up the passing lanes. Maybe that situation develops in camp, but for now it's clear as mud.

 

[bucsbaby]

In today's NFL, 20-something points doesn't guarantee you a win. With the Saints and Falcons in the division, Tampa has to be able to win some shootouts if necessary. Again, Freeman is good enough, but if the Bucs want to go deeper into the playoffs, he has to play at his best more consistently , limiting mistakes and making plays. Of course, the D also has to be waaay better. And Glennon is not the answer, at least not in the next 3 years.

 

[Faust]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...chiano-mike-glennon-can-play-quickly-for-bucs

Greg Schiano: Mike Glennon 'can play quickly' for Bucs

By Kevin Patra NFL.com

Tampa Bay Buccaneers rookie quarterback Mike Glennon will get a chance to win playing time. The Bucs believe he can step in for incumbent starter Josh Freeman and perform at any moment -- if needed.

Bucs coach Greg Schiano told Dan Pompei of the National Football Post that Glennon "can play quickly."

"But our situation will be only if he's needed," Schiano said. "Or if he wins the job. Look, I'm not against that. We have a starting quarterback. It's not like we're looking to find a starter. But competition is competition. Mike Glennon is a fierce competitor. I knew that when he was coming out of high school. Now being able to work with him a little, you can see it on the practice field."

Scouts seemed to have a love-or-hate take on Glennon. The 6-foot-7 quarterback's size and big arm appealed to some, while other analysts defined him as an immobile, sitting duck in the pocket.

Schiano scoffed at the idea that any perceived lack of mobility will hurt him in the NFL.

"He has pocket presence, ability to feel the rush and move in the pocket," Schiano said to NFP. "He can extend the play. Can he tuck the ball and run away from people? No. He is not going to be the guy who makes the 30-yard run. Can he tuck it and keep himself safe? Yes, he shows that he does that on college tape a lot. He takes off to run to get out of bounds."

Conventional wisdom says Glennon will sit and watch Freeman this year. Depending on each quarterback's progression, however, the Bucs might find themselves with a Drew Brees-Philip Rivers conundrum on their hands next offseason.

Follow Kevin Patra on Twitter @kpatra.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

I hope Freeman tells that jumped up H.S. gym coach where to stick it next year as he signs a gazillion dollar UFA contract for some other team.

 

[Faust]

Schiano seems to be hell bent on giving his guy every opportunity to win the the job as quickly as possible. I find this to be a little unusual, that you would want to roll with a raw and unproven 3rd round draft prospect in 2013 or 2014 over a player who has had some NFL experience and was a first round draft pick, even if that player has had some ups and downs so far in his short NFL tenure.

 

[Faust]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...enty-preseason-reps-174933326.html#more-47677

Buccaneers plan to give Mike Glennon plenty of preseason reps

By Doug Farrar | Shutdown Corner

One year ago, Seattle Seahawks head coach Pete Carroll went all-in on third-round quarterback Russell Wilson, saying that the former North Carolina State signal-caller (by way of Wisconsin) would get a huge number of reps in the preseason. He certainly did -- Wilson was worked like a mule up to, in, and through, the preseason, and it's safe to say things worked out pretty well ... pretty well, that is, for everyone but seeming incumbent Matt Flynn, who Seattle signed to a lucrative free agent contract before Wilson was drafted.

Now, another team has taken Carroll's "Always Compete" mantra to that same position, applying it to another third-round pick from NC State, and that philosophy may spell trouble for a seeming incumbent and former first-round pick. Tampa Bay Buccaneers head coach Greg Schiano came away from his first year at the helm of the Bucs without a clear picture of quarterback Josh Freeman, and that was reflected in his comments after the season.

Though Freeman became the first player in franchise history to throw for more than 4,000 yards in a season, and his 27 passing touchdowns also set a team mark, he was as bad as the Bucs were down the stretch. Tampa Bay lost five of its last six games, and Freeman threw nine of his 17 picks in the last three games. Of course, it wasn't Freeman's fault that the Bucs' pass defense was a dumpster fire in 2012, but when Schiano was asked about Freeman's future, he didn't sound convinced.

“That’s a question that, again, I’m not all in with myself yet, so how could I me all in with Josh Freeman or any other player?'' Schiano told the Tampa Bay Times last Dec. 31. "I’m not side-stepping you, but I need to evaluate.

"What I can say is, a 4,000-yard passer, a touchdown record – there’s a lot of things you say, “Wow.’ Are there things that frustrate you? Yeah. There’s things that frustrate him, too. And I’m not ducking the question, because quite frankly, I really like Josh Freeman. But I want to make sure I don’t get ahead of my skis at all here and really evaluate every single thing to what’s best for this organization. Do I think Josh Freeman is going to win Super Bowls in this league? I do. So, I hope that happens here. But again, at the end of the day, I have to evaluate everything before I can say that’s what we’re doing."

Part of that evaluation was the selection of NC State quarterback Mike Glennon in the third round. Glennon, who we ranked as the 41st-best player in this year's Shutdown 50 series, impressed the Bucs brass enough at the team's rookie minicamp for Schiano and general manager Mark Dominik to give Glennon the Russell Wilson treatment. Glennon got his chance after Wilson transferred to Wisconsin because NC State head coach Tom O'Brien would not let Wilson pursue his baseball aspirations, and Glennon was the beneficiary. Apparently, he took his collegiate lessons to the NFL, and looked like a model student from Day 1.

“We’re going to put a lot of pressure on him and see a lot of reps from him in the preseason," Dimonik recently told NFL.com (via JoeBucsFan.com). "He’s got to play. We may not see as much of Dan Orlovsky or even of Josh Freeman somewhat in the preseason as much as you’re going to see Glennon.

“We’re excited about just the little bit we saw from him [during rookie minicamp] in terms of mentally what he could handle. We kept piling more on him and he kept doing a great job digesting it, regurgitating it and running the team.”

Freeman, who is in the last year of the five-year, $26 million contract he signed after the Bucs selected him with the 17th pick in the 2009 draft, has seemed to get up Schiano's nose for a while. Whether it's his streaky play, of the fact that he's not as "rah-rah" as Schiano would like, or a simple schism in overall football philosophy (Dominik drafted Freeman, and Schiano may want his own guy under center), it would appear that the Bucs are not committed to Freeman beyond this year -- and the switch could come sooner than some expected.

 

[bucsbaby]

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

 

[Raider Nation]

I hope Freeman tells that jumped up H.S. gym coach where to stick it next year as he signs a gazillion dollar UFA contract for some other team.

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

How DARE he encourage competition!

 

[Shanahanigans]

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

Ya, this story seems pretty media driven. In the same breath Schiano talks about how Josh Freeman is more athletic than Glennon, and how Freeman keeps his eyes downfield better than any QB he's seen, which he says in indicative of his toughness. The media wants there to be a QB controversy where there isn't one. The only way Glennon starts is with an injury to Freeman.

The Russell Wilson comparisons are off base unless you seriously think Matt Flynn was/is on the same level as Freeman.

 

[Premier]

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

You actually believe this stuff huh?

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

How DARE he encourage competition!

Yeah. Coaches around the league are threatening their starters with crap backups.Harbaugh: I'm looking forward to seeing what Tyrod Taylor can do this preaseason. I'm open to him winning the job.Shwartz: Matty's been OK, but I'm pretty excited to see what Shaun Hill can bring to the table. I think he's got a good shot to start sooner rather than later.And, yes. Glennon >> Freeman is every bit as stupid.

 

[Bojang0301]

I don't see why Josh Freeman would stay when he becomes a FA. Schiano doesn't like him as his QB and it's really quite stupid. Freeman looks like a top tier talent who has just had some bumps in the road. Not sure if Schiano is asking him to be all world but if he thinks Mike Glennon is going to be that I don't think he'll be in the NFL long.

 

[Faust]

Competition would be fine if it was a level playing field, but this feels like Schiano will be looking to part ways with Freeman and then he will be able to go with his choice in Glennon for 2014. It could be overblown by the media to be sure, but it just feels like there is more to this story here than just the media running with their take.

Either way - Freeman should be highly motivated to play hard this year for his next contract either in Tampa Bay or playing somewhere else.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

I've owned Freeman in a dynasty league since he came out and I think his problem is that he was young and raw coming into the NFL with some outstanding physical tools. I think he needed a very good and experienced QB coach to tighten up the mechanics and mental aspect of the game. Unfortunately he didn't get that with Morris as coach and it doesn't look like he'll get it with Schiano. My guess is that Schiano recognizes the need, yet knows his staff is deficient in this area so he's getting ready to blame Freeman and hope Glennon can do with less coaching. Living in Charlotte I've seen Glennon a number of times and I don't think that's a very good bet by Schiano.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Every franchise in the NFL continually assesses their starting QB wondering if he's got the mettle to lead them to a Super Bowl. It looks like not just Schiano, but the entire Bucs organization has very tepid belief that Freeman will ever be "that guy". If they could replace him with any of the 3 QB's playing for the competitors in their division, they would do it in a heartbeat. No way would they treat Cam, Drew, or Ryan like they treat Free. But it is what it is.

Freeman is a pretty good QB, can make all the throws in 7 on 7 practices, from any angle to anywhere on the field. Got the youth, arm, size, athletic. Problem a lot of people seem to pick at is despite being a gym rat and working his butt off to get better, he seems to be the same ole Josh on Sundays. By that, I mean his poor decision making at times.

Give Free time and he will slice and dice most defenses up. But then that's what they say about Blaine Gabbert, so that's not saying much. But get in his face, he vapor locks onto his primary read and exposes himself to the costly turnovers. He needs to 'trust' what he is seeing downfield and process the information in his brain in real time, keeping the eyes focused downfield, even in a collapsing pocket. This is what Brees does so well. It's like his mind counter needs to catch up to his body counter. In the end, only the truly great ones have the raw ablity coupled with the field savvy to make plays. But, there are only so many Drew Brees in the NFC South, let alone the league.

Free is coming up on a potential Joe Flacco payday if he can overcome his image as the 4th best QB in the division. But only if he figures how to get the ball loose in pressure to a myriad of receivers. Other teams know the book on him. Get in his face and wait for him to make a mistake. If he can learn to make them pay, he will get his Flacco payday. If not, welcome in the Glennon era sooner than you think.

 

[bucsbaby]

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

You actually believe this stuff huh?

I'm not saying the Bucs are a superbowl contender, but you don't think they have talent now at all 3 levels of the D, on their OLine, and at the skill positions? there are still some holes, but with good QB play, there's no reason the Bucs couldn't be in playoff contention.

 

[Premier]

Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Big step backwards imo. Bucs are going to try to break in a rookie during a window of opportunity where they are loading up on talent at every other position on the team??? They now have at least some talent on all three levels of the defense, on the OLine, and at the skill positions (except maybe TE). Why waste that on a rookie QB??? Schiano isn't looking good here imo.

You actually believe this stuff huh?

I'm not saying the Bucs are a superbowl contender, but you don't think they have talent now at all 3 levels of the D, on their OLine, and at the skill positions? there are still some holes, but with good QB play, there's no reason the Bucs couldn't be in playoff contention.

No. I meant I can't understand how you believe this Freeman/Glennon stuff. Because the Bucs do have a good team, and they aren't going to toss that away for a third round rookie QB from Mayberry.

 

[bucsbaby]

I hope so

 

[gump]

I've owned Freeman in a dynasty league since he came out and I think his problem is that he was young and raw coming into the NFL with some outstanding physical tools. I think he needed a very good and experienced QB coach to tighten up the mechanics and mental aspect of the game. Unfortunately he didn't get that with Morris as coach and it doesn't look like he'll get it with Schiano. My guess is that Schiano recognizes the need, yet knows his staff is deficient in this area so he's getting ready to blame Freeman and hope Glennon can do with less coaching.

Mike Sullivan has received a lot of credit for helping Eli in NY....now he's the problem?

 

[Sabertooth]

I put it 75% that Freeman keeps Glennon on the bench

 

[DawnBTVS]

I think Freeman sticks as the starting QB but leaves after in FA. It's not too surprising that Schiano would want "his" QB in, even if Freeman is talented (albeit inconsistent). Freeman was the draft pick of a previous regime and struggled with consistency last season in Schiano's first year as head coach. If I'm Schiano, why do I want to hitch my wagon to Freeman if he displays that same inconsistency this season? After this year, Freeman will have been starting for 4 full seasons. Sooner or later a light bulb has to come on for him.

All coaches who come in start to get rid of the previous regimes players and get their own players in. It's the nature of being a head coach and taking over a team. The only difference is that Schiano wants competition for a QB who has had one great year, 2 awful ones (10 TD vs 18 INT & 16 TD vs 22 INT), and a good but inconsistent year last year.

 

[Faust]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...hiano-tampa-bay-buccaneers-have-a-starting-qb

Greg Schiano: Tampa Bay Buccaneers have a starting QB

By Gregg Rosenthal

Around The League Editor

One day after Tampa Bay Buccaneers coach Greg Schiano was quoted saying that rookie quarterback Mike Glennon could "play quickly" if necessary, Schiano tried to leave no doubt about his brewing quarterback "battle."

"We have a starting quarterback and it is Josh Freeman," Schiano said Monday at his press conference after the team's first OTA.

Schiano addressed the issue to the team, telling them he believes in Freeman but he also believes in competition. Schiano says he doesn't think it bothers Freeman at all because Freeman knows it's "his team."

"Believe it or not we have a good relationship," Schiano said when questioned about the perception that Freeman is not "his guy."

All of the competition talk in Tampa is overblown. Schiano is sending a message to Freeman about the hold on his job, but it's not like there's any reason to believe Glennon will be in the same ballpark as Freeman as an NFL quarterback. Glennon arrives in the NFL with a lot to learn, just like Freeman did four years ago. Glennon can't close the gap during the offseason.

Schiano can talk competition, but he knows Freeman will give the Buccaneers the best option to win in 2013. It's only when the team starts to look towards the future that Glennon could come into play.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

I've owned Freeman in a dynasty league since he came out and I think his problem is that he was young and raw coming into the NFL with some outstanding physical tools. I think he needed a very good and experienced QB coach to tighten up the mechanics and mental aspect of the game. Unfortunately he didn't get that with Morris as coach and it doesn't look like he'll get it with Schiano. My guess is that Schiano recognizes the need, yet knows his staff is deficient in this area so he's getting ready to blame Freeman and hope Glennon can do with less coaching.

Mike Sullivan has received a lot of credit for helping Eli in NY....now he's the problem?

Mike Sullivan is the TB QB coach? I thought it was the guy that was the QB coach in Arizona last year. And having owned John Skelton, yes, he may be the problem. Isn't it McNaulty or something like that?

 

[beef]

Talks of freeman losing his job this year is crazy. Talks of freeman ever being a legit #1 qb is even crazier.

 

[Faust]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000204815/article/top-10-quarterbacks-25-or-under-josh-freeman

Top 10 quarterbacks 25 or under: Josh Freeman