LOL, in reading the thread it was obvious this was the goal of OP.... anyways, i dealt with a similar situation in my work league... the rookie owner traded jamal charles for royal, snelling, michael floyd (I am not kidding)... he then preceeded to flat out drop roddy white on waivers.... worst of all it the charles went to the 2 time defending champion... I was pissed and disappointed in the new owner... but my hope is he learns from his mistakes and will be a better owner because of it... rookie owners are unpredictable
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League Disaster - looking for input (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter CariocaSean
- Start date
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
If anything, the 1st trade only weakens the argument that the 2nd trade was collusion. Just an honest to goodness owner that doesn't know better.
You don't have a veto rule in place so you need to live with the results. Classic example of sour grapes.
You don't have a veto rule in place so you need to live with the results. Classic example of sour grapes.
Johnny Blood
Footballguy
Actually "sour grapes" is when you denigrate what you can't have and say you don't want it anyway. This looks like the opposite; everyone except the two alleged winners are drooling over the value they can't have because the new guy didn't ship these sweet, delicious players their way.
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DropKick
Footballguy
So you just want people to comment who agree with you? I think Blood is on the mark and gave a very practical interpretation of the actions of a newbie. And, just because the trades may seem imbalanced, does not make it so - nor is it a reason to jump to the collusion card. The guy is getting his feet wet. You invited a rookie - live with it until he gets his bearings.
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
You invited a rookie into the league, and he made some pretty dumb trades that a rookie owner might make.
DISASTER.
DISASTER.
It's high treason.
I would call an owners only meeting, and not invite him to that meeting.
I would then suspend him from being allowed to submit a lineup.
Then, he would not be allowed in the 20th year league photo.
He would be allowed to participate in the next weekly meeting, but not in person. He could dial in via conference call.
I would also tackle him when his team is in victory formation.
After all this, if he wants to stick around, then it warrants consideration to keep him in the league.
I would call an owners only meeting, and not invite him to that meeting.
I would then suspend him from being allowed to submit a lineup.
Then, he would not be allowed in the 20th year league photo.
He would be allowed to participate in the next weekly meeting, but not in person. He could dial in via conference call.
I would also tackle him when his team is in victory formation.
After all this, if he wants to stick around, then it warrants consideration to keep him in the league.
Excellent advice here.... I was that rookie at one point (thus the screen name). Similar buy in and redraft even. This whole thing could turn out to provide the best league stories if you are truly in it for the fun.
ebsteelers
Footballguy
wait is this the same guy as the other thread?
cobalt_27
Footballguy
CariocaSean
Footballguy
It's not what you want to hear but the right thing to do is let the trades stand. I agree, the guy has no idea what he is doing, but lots of people were horrible their first year playing. He paid his $100 entry into the league and he is not breaking any rules, he's just doing a really bad job managing his team. Either see if he improves at all as the year goes on, or just kick him out next season.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Of course. Been around here for nearly a decade, and it can't recall a more absurd train wreck than the dual threads you created.
StopTradingMeTebow
Footballguy
The part that I don't get is, for what would people really be colluding for in a $100 league?
I realize we play for more than the $$, and for me sometimes the $$ are only there so the leagues stay competitive and active over free leagues.
But to spend time colluding and risk friendships (since you know these people) for at most (assuming they win at least a couple playoff games) $300 profit each??...sure doesn't seem worth it.
If it was a $500 league or similar, then there might be some actual incentive...
To spend 4+ months to maybe score that? Quicker way to make a buck
Just a crappy rook but that term carries a meaning for a reason. You're experiencing it.
I realize we play for more than the $$, and for me sometimes the $$ are only there so the leagues stay competitive and active over free leagues.
But to spend time colluding and risk friendships (since you know these people) for at most (assuming they win at least a couple playoff games) $300 profit each??...sure doesn't seem worth it.
If it was a $500 league or similar, then there might be some actual incentive...
To spend 4+ months to maybe score that? Quicker way to make a buck
Just a crappy rook but that term carries a meaning for a reason. You're experiencing it.
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I made the 2nd trade with the rookie owner. I am also the defacto commish although we run it more like a Republic.
Thank you everyone for all the input. Some of it was very constructive.
From my perspective, I certainly got the better end of my trade, especially at 4-0 with the luxury of patience, but the deal was hardly a game changer. The first trade, however, was much worse.
My guilt pertaining to the situation only ties to my vouching for the rookie owner, who is a great guy and loves football but playing fantasy for the first time. I thought he'd catch on faster.
He doesn't understand any of this. I'm sure he would be shocked at this thread's existence.
Additionally, the resulting outrage saw some pretty ugly accusations and characterizations thrown his way. I'm used to guys like Sean and Dormado slinging mud. He's not.
The result of this is probably that we lose an owner who could potentially learn and be a long term contributor - whether we kick him out or he ends up quitting to spare the headache.
As he told me: "I thought this #### was supposed to be fun."
Thank you everyone for all the input. Some of it was very constructive.
From my perspective, I certainly got the better end of my trade, especially at 4-0 with the luxury of patience, but the deal was hardly a game changer. The first trade, however, was much worse.
My guilt pertaining to the situation only ties to my vouching for the rookie owner, who is a great guy and loves football but playing fantasy for the first time. I thought he'd catch on faster.
He doesn't understand any of this. I'm sure he would be shocked at this thread's existence.
Additionally, the resulting outrage saw some pretty ugly accusations and characterizations thrown his way. I'm used to guys like Sean and Dormado slinging mud. He's not.
The result of this is probably that we lose an owner who could potentially learn and be a long term contributor - whether we kick him out or he ends up quitting to spare the headache.
As he told me: "I thought this #### was supposed to be fun."
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
The owners in your league should be ashamed of themselves for brow-beating that dude - especially since they didn't know him. If I were the rookie - while I wouldn't tank - I wouldn't play in that league after this season. It's one thing for long-time friends to give each other grief; it's another for people who don't know someone to make nasty comments against him.
No offense to you, GCP, but I think the best thing that could happen to your friend is to get as far away from that bunch of #######s as possible. His quote to you is everything that is wrong with many FF leagues.
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Cobalt_27, I just wanted to let you know that we got together as a league and decided that you were a better person than we are. After all, we had two owners start threads about a fantasy football league on a fantasy football message board... you were right, it was pathetic. You've been around for a decade (great message board bonafides), you clearly know what you're talking about. Please, feel free to continue to put us and our league down to either A. feel better about yourself or B. look cool in front of the other internet message board posters.... you've earned it.
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ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Ruffrodys05
IBL Representative
When I was new to this game I made a few bad trades and eventually learned from my mistakes. I wasn't kicked out. Trades weren't reversed. Life went on.
If I was the new guy and I was frozen out of my team for these trades I'd consider it a blessing in disguise and happily walk away. No fun league.
If I was the new guy and I was frozen out of my team for these trades I'd consider it a blessing in disguise and happily walk away. No fun league.
Kwai Chang Caine
Footballguy
It's a shame that this rookie owner has to have his first FF experience with this particular group of people. I'd be very surprised if he ever joins a league again at that's a shame. For what I've read of the three(?) people from the league, I'd say you fellas ought to be ashamed of yourselves. Wether from complaining about the trades--neither of which are catastrophic and in my opinion he might have the better end of trade two; to coming on here and asking for righteous validation (probably mad because you didn't fleece him first); to his own friend and voucher seemingly taking advantage of him.
I would imagine a guy who has never played FF suddenly having strangers bust his balls on some geek message board would be pretty infuriating. Maybe one of you three "pals" of his can point him to this thread and let him see that not every fantasy player behaves like you three.
Seriously guys, you're adults right?
I would imagine a guy who has never played FF suddenly having strangers bust his balls on some geek message board would be pretty infuriating. Maybe one of you three "pals" of his can point him to this thread and let him see that not every fantasy player behaves like you three.
Seriously guys, you're adults right?
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Welp. Bottom line, the way your entire league handled this whole thing is awful, punctuated by a bunch of whining here, attempting to solicit mob outrage over this poor rookie. Nobody was asking questions, you were all just looking for permission to be pissed, and you didn't get what you wanted. In fact, everyone's rightfully turned it back on you, your immaturity, and the pettiness of your entire league.dornado said:
I hope that guy can recognize FF can be fun, just not with you guys.
Kwai, thanks for the reply.
In one breath you said that the rookie got the better of me in trade two and in the next you said I should be ashamed of myself for fleecing him. Which is it?
Not that I have a problem with taking the better end on a trade with a friend. After all, each of the other 11 owners are friends of mine or at least people I have known for a long time. I actually enjoy the art of the deal and have a reputation as being a ruthless player, true or not. That certainly contributed to the reaction.
Regardless, thanks for the thread. This has been informative and helped some to see the big picture. Most if not all of the owners are ready to move on and play the season out.
In one breath you said that the rookie got the better of me in trade two and in the next you said I should be ashamed of myself for fleecing him. Which is it?
Not that I have a problem with taking the better end on a trade with a friend. After all, each of the other 11 owners are friends of mine or at least people I have known for a long time. I actually enjoy the art of the deal and have a reputation as being a ruthless player, true or not. That certainly contributed to the reaction.
Regardless, thanks for the thread. This has been informative and helped some to see the big picture. Most if not all of the owners are ready to move on and play the season out.
Exactly what have I said in here that would lead you to say I should be ashamed of myself? Yeesh.
T with T
Footballguy
tds are worth more then yards last time I checked bud... can't just take away tds... that's silly
T with T
Footballguy
T with T
Footballguy
I was thinking 8It just keeps getting better. Are you guys all 12 years old?
ryno1980
Footballguy
Didn't he just say you can't ignore TDs?? It's fair to suggest decker could catch more touchdowns rest of season based on past history. He has a point.
CariocaSean
Footballguy
A lot of self-righteous hypocrites litter this shark pool.
We are all adults playing essentially a football role-playing game. Get over yourselves.
A number of posters seem to understand why some owners might be unhappy with how this situation has unfolded. I appreciate them speaking up.
This will be my last post in the thread. I'll leave it by saying that I firmly believe both trades were extremely lopsided. Of course we all know that trades don't always end up how we think they will, but that really is not the point. Sometimes luck can save people from their mistakes - doesn't mean that they weren't mistakes. It's called blind luck and it isn't a solid method for success.
I will also say that the rookies rationale was that he needed help at RB. We are talking about Pierre Thomas. I don't know that I would even roster him over Hillman (who I have) at this point. I'll be watching to see if Thomas ever cracks his lineup, and how much 'RB help' this deal really gave him.
For reasons that many of you may not be able to understand, a majority of owners in our league had the initial gut response that the second trade was collusion. The rookies explanation isn't really changing that perception for me. But we are taking GCP's and the rookies word for it. Do we have to? No, we don't. Maybe our gut response was the correct one. But we are letting it go and playing it out either way.
Condemn us all you want. I don't think we are out of line for wanting to have a certain competitive level be attained in our league. Most of us stay fairly committed to this one league. We are not happy that, in our opinion, the competitive integrity of the league has been compromised by bringing a rookie into the league. Yes, I get it, we brought a rookie in. But I would have hoped the owner who vouched for him would have had the sense to forego this trade with his good friend, who he brought into the league and vouched for. He had to know the response it would create.
We are all adults playing essentially a football role-playing game. Get over yourselves.
A number of posters seem to understand why some owners might be unhappy with how this situation has unfolded. I appreciate them speaking up.
This will be my last post in the thread. I'll leave it by saying that I firmly believe both trades were extremely lopsided. Of course we all know that trades don't always end up how we think they will, but that really is not the point. Sometimes luck can save people from their mistakes - doesn't mean that they weren't mistakes. It's called blind luck and it isn't a solid method for success.
I will also say that the rookies rationale was that he needed help at RB. We are talking about Pierre Thomas. I don't know that I would even roster him over Hillman (who I have) at this point. I'll be watching to see if Thomas ever cracks his lineup, and how much 'RB help' this deal really gave him.
For reasons that many of you may not be able to understand, a majority of owners in our league had the initial gut response that the second trade was collusion. The rookies explanation isn't really changing that perception for me. But we are taking GCP's and the rookies word for it. Do we have to? No, we don't. Maybe our gut response was the correct one. But we are letting it go and playing it out either way.
Condemn us all you want. I don't think we are out of line for wanting to have a certain competitive level be attained in our league. Most of us stay fairly committed to this one league. We are not happy that, in our opinion, the competitive integrity of the league has been compromised by bringing a rookie into the league. Yes, I get it, we brought a rookie in. But I would have hoped the owner who vouched for him would have had the sense to forego this trade with his good friend, who he brought into the league and vouched for. He had to know the response it would create.
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ryno1980
Footballguy
Dude you're being self righteous thinking your opinion of the trade is more important than the guy making the trade and by not listening to everyone who's telling you that on here. Pot meet kettle.
And if you truly believe they colluded and you're not removing both guys from the league, that's a lack of leadership.
And if you truly believe they colluded and you're not removing both guys from the league, that's a lack of leadership.
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CariocaSean
Footballguy
I don't think you understand what self righteousness is. Thinking someone's valuations in a trade are way, way off is not some form of personal condemnation and self righteousness. On the other hand, coming on here and calling people 12 year olds and saying they should be ashamed of themselves definitely is.
Seriously, I'm done in here. I am not going to get stuck in one of the petty back and forth meaningless arguments that I see in the Shark Pool constantly. I come in here to gather and consider insight on football, and less often, to offer what insights I might have.
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CariocaSean
Footballguy
Mario Kart
Footballguy
ryno1980
Footballguy
Self righteous- confident of ones own righteousness, especially when smugly moralistic and intolerant of the behaviors of others.
Yep, think I get it. I read the whole thread unfortunately and you sir fit this definition. You were certain the trades were wrong and anyone who disagreed was crazy.
Yep, think I get it. I read the whole thread unfortunately and you sir fit this definition. You were certain the trades were wrong and anyone who disagreed was crazy.
jdkapow
Footballguy
Let me get this straight. He'd already made a trade that put the league in an uproar. You're the "de facto" commish and the one who brought him into the league and thus must realize that you need to avoid even the appearance of impropriety when it comes to trading with him. And you went ahead and offered him that ridiculous second trade?! As I said in my first comment in this thread (before you chimed in), I think you're the one who comes out looking bad in this whole thing. (Well, the owners who said mean things to him aren't prizes, either: their rage should have been directed at you).GCP said:
And your excuse is, "I thought he'd catch on faster." Which apparently didn't keep you from making an offer that he'd only take if he hadn't caught on faster.
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cobalt_27
Footballguy
Paulymaggs
Footballguy
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
So I read about the first 10 posts. I'd like to say the OP and all those in his league that are complaining of collusion are morons. It's tiresome listening to people who complain about trades yet never have the stones to pull the trigger on one. These two trades are hardly worthy of collusion accusations.
I have many owners in my league that are the same way and ironically they never win the championship.
I have many owners in my league that are the same way and ironically they never win the championship.
Simayi
Footballguy
You say your league has been together 20 years and are all friends except for the rookie - why would you suspect a long-term friend of trying to ruin your friendship for a chance at getting a few extra hundred bucks?
I could see this issue being suspicious if this was a new and relatively anonymous league. However, imo you are being extremely disrespectful towards your long-time friend if you feel that he is colluding with a new owner.
I could see this issue being suspicious if this was a new and relatively anonymous league. However, imo you are being extremely disrespectful towards your long-time friend if you feel that he is colluding with a new owner.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Maybe you should tell the new guy about FBG's and get him a chance to learn a few things. Seems like the rest of you have an unfair advantage.
Hu-Tang Clan
Footballguy
T with T...reading is hard isn't it?
Ryno....thanks for seeing my point. I'm not saying the trade is necessarily equal, I was just trying to play devil's advocate looking at the other side of the trade.
