Looting in Missouri after cops shoot 18 year old (2 Viewers)

[Christo]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

 

[Bigboy10182000]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

Maybe they thought he was being robbed? I dont know

 

[msommer]

So if the last shot was to the top of the head, it makes most sense the his momentum had him moving towards the cop.

Or that he was crumpling to the ground from having been shot 5 other times. Or that he was shot in the eye and jerked his head down.

One of the wounds was to his hand, right? Isn't it possible that was the first shot and it caused his arm to raise so the next several shot could hit the inside of his arm?

It is possible. Lots of things are possible. There's just no definitive proof from the body chart.

Don't start mentioning the other possibilities (without rushing the cop) because then Christo/jim11/lod01 will just tell you that it's not possible.

Allowing for possibilities is a one way street for that crowd

 

[Christo]

So if the last shot was to the top of the head, it makes most sense the his momentum had him moving towards the cop.

Or that he was crumpling to the ground from having been shot 5 other times. Or that he was shot in the eye and jerked his head down.

One of the wounds was to his hand, right? Isn't it possible that was the first shot and it caused his arm to raise so the next several shot could hit the inside of his arm?

It is possible. Lots of things are possible. There's just no definitive proof from the body chart.

Don't start mentioning the other possibilities (without rushing the cop) because then Christo/jim11/lod01 will just tell you that it's not possible.

Allowing for possibilities is a one way street for that crowd

Link to where I said a scenario was not possible?

 

[Henry Ford]

Awesome discussion on how "excessive use of force" complaint investigations were dealt with in Ferguson until at least 2010.

“The officer himself could complete it and give it to the supervisor for his approval,” the prior chief, Thomas Moonier, testified in a deposition. “I would read it. It would be placed in my out basket, and my secretary would probably take it and put it with the case file.”

No copy was made for the officer’s personnel file.

 

[lod01]

Honestly, yes.

ETA. not likely, but more likely. We've all heard stories in which cops are angry and shoot to kill when it's unnecessary to do so, and then try to cover it up later. How often do we hear about unarmed guys charging armed cops? I never have.

How many links would you like me to produce.?

The Gaynier one this week:

http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2014/08/dallas-police-investigating-officer-involved-shooting.html/

The shooting was captured on private video, which shows that Gaynier charged at the officer, said Maj. Jeff Cotner of the crimes against persons division.

 

[lod01]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

FOR THE PEOPLE SAYING OFFICER WILSON WAS BEAT UP PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO....THATS HIM MOMENTS AFTER THE SHOOTING....HE LOOKS FINE

This is the 3rd time ive posted this video and yet people are still talking about a fractured face ...enough already...his face would have been so swollen you would see it from the moon

 

[Henry Ford]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

I think you have a different idea of what paranoia is than I do.

 

[Christo]

FOR THE PEOPLE SAYING OFFICER WILSON WAS BEAT UP PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO....THATS HIM MOMENTS AFTER THE SHOOTING....HE LOOKS FINE

This is the 3rd time ive posted this video and yet people are still talking about a fractured face ...enough already...his face would have been so swollen you would see it from the moon

Dr. Busted Knuckles?

 

[BustedKnuckles]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

Aaaaand we have a winner....a couple of us were wondering when someone was going to play the weed card lol

 

[[icon]]

What I think is the guy was walking down the street, the cops yelled at him, he turned around and tried to sell them a KitKat bar. Of course, the officer bought a Kit Kat bar thinking "mmm I like Kit Kats". However, as the boy was walking away (with his hard earned new dollar), the officer took a bite only to find his Kit Kat was stale.

Here's where it gets a little confusing. I think the officer leapt out of the car and ran after the boy yelling "Hey I think you accidentally gave me a stale Kit Kat Bar", but the boy heard "Damn you black thug, I'm going to kill you". So the boy turned around with a magical "single use" ray gun from the planet Zoltan (which he had received in trade for a previous Kit Kat bar) and fired at the officer. The officer, having actually been a stand-in for Jackie Chan (little known prior work experience the STLPD has been maliciously witholding from the public), was able to nimbly duck the laser beam shot like Keanu Reaves in that Matrix movie.

At this point, I think the officer was unfortunately NOT aware this was a misunderstanding (perhaps malicious sale of stale Kit Kats in addition to attempted murder), had but one course of action. I think it's prudent to note that it cannot be reasonably expected the officer KNOW this ray gun was of the Zoltan single-use variety from a distance of 30 feetmeters, and would vaporize in seconds. Nope, he probably thought it was a NORMAL ray gun and another shot was likely imminent, and was forced to return fire in self defense.

Unfortunately, when the boy collapsed all of his Kit Kat's scattered around the pavement as the single-use Zoltan ray-gun vaporized. Now, it's a hot summer day and after laying out the police tape I imagine the cops were hungry. That's hard work in those conditions... so I'm guessing they probably ate up the leftover Kit Kats without thinking about their role as crucial evidence in my theory.

There's been pretty much nothing in the 29,201 eyewitness accounts that disproves my theory.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

FOR THE PEOPLE SAYING OFFICER WILSON WAS BEAT UP PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO....THATS HIM MOMENTS AFTER THE SHOOTING....HE LOOKS FINE

This is the 3rd time ive posted this video and yet people are still talking about a fractured face ...enough already...his face would have been so swollen you would see it from the moon

Dr. Busted Knuckles?

breaking faces is kind of my area of expertise

 

[Christo]

FOR THE PEOPLE SAYING OFFICER WILSON WAS BEAT UP PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO....THATS HIM MOMENTS AFTER THE SHOOTING....HE LOOKS FINE

This is the 3rd time ive posted this video and yet people are still talking about a fractured face ...enough already...his face would have been so swollen you would see it from the moon

Dr. Busted Knuckles?

breaking faces is kind of my area of expertise

So you stick around to diagnose the type a break?

 

[Henry Ford]

And for reference, here's a picture of a guy with an orbital fracture.

How many days healed?

 

[Christo]

And for reference, here's a picture of a guy with an orbital fracture.

How many days healed?

 

[Henry Ford]

Here's a fresh one. Just got stitched up.

 

[Gary Coal Man]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

Aaaaand we have a winner....a couple of us were wondering when someone was going to play the weed card lol

You are aware that there's a reason why they do toxicology reports on the deceased in such situations? It's because substances in your system can and often do alter behavior. If it wasn't potentially relevant they wouldn't waste the time, energy, and money having the tests performed.

 

[jon_mx]

So if the last shot was to the top of the head, it makes most sense the his momentum had him moving towards the cop.

Or that he was crumpling to the ground from having been shot 5 other times. Or that he was shot in the eye and jerked his head down.

But none of those makes the most sense.

 

[Christo]

Here's a fresh one. Just got stitched up.

And another. Looks pretty fresh to me.

We going to see that on a grainy camera phone from across the street?

 

[Henry Ford]

Here's a fresh one. Just got stitched up.

And another. Looks pretty fresh to me.

We going to see that on a grainy camera phone from across the street?

I don't know. Do we?

 

[msommer]

I can't wrap my head around why Brown (according to some reports) would be beating the guy up.....run 30 feet away and then decide to finially do something right and "freeze" when ordered to. Why not just keep running?

Marijuana in system. It is possible he was high at the time. Most people are paranoid when high. Not all.

would he have been suspended by the NFL?

Ref Josh Gordon, there's mariguana in the system and a very different thing is being high

 

[Henry Ford]

So if the last shot was to the top of the head, it makes most sense the his momentum had him moving towards the cop.

Or that he was crumpling to the ground from having been shot 5 other times. Or that he was shot in the eye and jerked his head down.

But none of those makes the most sense.

Why not?

 

[tom22406]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

 

[Christo]

Here's a fresh one. Just got stitched up.

And another. Looks pretty fresh to me.

We going to see that on a grainy camera phone from across the street?

I don't know. Do we?

Calling Dr. Knuckles!

 

[Henry Ford]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

Or at least some kind of facial injury, I guess.

 

[tom22406]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

Or at least some kind of facial injury, I guess.

And these protestors might be waiting a long time for anything to get done(either way)

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson

 

[[icon]]

you nerds are killing me

 

[timschochet]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

I think it's significant, because it might not have been a robbery. In fact, I have not heard any confirmation from the store owner that it in fact WAS a robbery. And if it wasn't a robbery, then I have less reason to be skeptical of Johnson's testimony- which is my only interest in the robbery in the first place. Otherwise, whether or not Brown robbed a store is immaterial to what happened to him afterwards, IMO.

 

[Gary Coal Man]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

I think it's significant, because it might not have been a robbery. In fact, I have not heard any confirmation from the store owner that it in fact WAS a robbery. And if it wasn't a robbery, then I have less reason to be skeptical of Johnson's testimony- which is my only interest in the robbery in the first place. Otherwise, whether or not Brown robbed a store is immaterial to what happened to him afterwards, IMO.

A customer called the police, but the store proprietor told the police when they arrived that Brown took the cigarillos and pushed him on the way out of the store. It's in the police report:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/file/ferguson-police-report?page=2

 

[timschochet]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

 

[timschochet]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

I think it's significant, because it might not have been a robbery. In fact, I have not heard any confirmation from the store owner that it in fact WAS a robbery. And if it wasn't a robbery, then I have less reason to be skeptical of Johnson's testimony- which is my only interest in the robbery in the first place. Otherwise, whether or not Brown robbed a store is immaterial to what happened to him afterwards, IMO.

A customer called the police, but the store proprietor told the police when they arrived that Brown took the cigarillos and pushed him on the way out of the store. It's in the police report:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/file/ferguson-police-report?page=2

OK thanks. In that case we can discount Johnson's story, since he clearly not to be trusted. Brown's actions are irrelevant IMO to what took place with Wilson.

 

[Henry Ford]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Your opinion on this case is extremely malleable.

 

[Gary Coal Man]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

Or at least some kind of facial injury, I guess.

Fox News is reporting that a source "close to the department's top brass" described the injury as an orbital fracture. Still no pictures or medical report.

Darren Wilson, the Ferguson, Mo., police officer whose fatal shooting of Michael Brown touched off more than a week of demonstrations, suffered severe facial injuries, including an orbital (eye socket) fracture, and was nearly beaten unconscious by Brown moments before firing his gun, a source close to the department's top brass told FoxNews.com.

“The Assistant (Police) Chief took him to the hospital, his face all swollen on one side,” said the insider. “He was beaten very severely.”


According to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said..
“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face.

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6 foot, 4 inch, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

The source also said the dashboard and body cameras, which might have recorded crucial evidence, had been ordered by Ferguson Police Chief Thomas Jackson, but had only recently arrived and had not yet been deployed.

St. Louis County police, who have taken over the investigation, did not return requests for comment about possible injuries suffered by Wilson.

Edward Magee, spokesman for St. Louis County Prosecutor Robert McCullough, said the office will not disclose the nature of the evidence it will reveal to a grand jury.

"We'll present every piece of evidence we have, witness statements, et cetera, to the grand jury, and we do not release any evidence or talk about evidence on the case."

Nabil Khattar, CEO of 7Star Industries – which specializes in firearms training for law enforcement and special operations personnel – confirmed that police are typically instructed to use deadly force if in imminent danger of being killed or suffering great bodily injury.

“You may engage a threat with enough force that is reasonably necessary to defend against that danger,” he said.

Wilson is a six-year veteran of the Ferguson police force department, and has no prior disciplinary infringements.

Massive protests have since taken over the St. Louis community, prompting Missouri Gov. Jay Nixon last Thursday to place Highway Patrol Capt. Ron Johnson at the helm of security operations in an effort to calm ongoing tensions. The federal government is also investigating the death, and Attorney General Eric Holder has taken the lead – calling “the selective release of sensitive information” in the case “troubling.”

On Friday, Ferguson police released surveillance video showing Brown stealing cigars from a convenience store just before his death. Jackson came under intense criticism for disclosing the tape and a related police report as he also insisted that the alleged robbery and the encounter with Wilson were unrelated matters. Brown’s family, through their attorney, suggested the tape’s release was a strategic form of “character assassination.”

However, FoxNews.com’s source insisted that there was absolutely no spin agenda behind the tape’s release and that there were a number of Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) media requests filed by media outlets seeking it. Tom Jackson is said to have waited on publicly releasing it, and did not want it shown until Brown’s grieving mother first had the chance to see it.

“He defied the FOIAs as long as he could,” noted the insider. “A powerful, ugly spin has completely ruined public discourse on this whole situation.” (Link)

Follow @holliesmckay www.twitter.com/holliesmckay

 

[Henry Ford]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

Or at least some kind of facial injury, I guess.

Fox News is reporting that a source "close to the department's top brass" described the injury as an orbital fracture. Still no pictures or medical report.

Darren Wilson, the Ferguson, Mo., police officer whose fatal shooting of Michael Brown touched off more than a week of demonstrations, suffered severe facial injuries, including an orbital (eye socket) fracture, and was nearly beaten unconscious by Brown moments before firing his gun, a source close to the department's top brass told FoxNews.com.

“The Assistant (Police) Chief took him to the hospital, his face all swollen on one side,” said the insider. “He was beaten very severely.”


According to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said..
“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face.

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6 foot, 4 inch, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

The source also said the dashboard and body cameras, which might have recorded crucial evidence, had been ordered by Ferguson Police Chief Thomas Jackson, but had only recently arrived and had not yet been deployed.

St. Louis County police, who have taken over the investigation, did not return requests for comment about possible injuries suffered by Wilson.

Edward Magee, spokesman for St. Louis County Prosecutor Robert McCullough, said the office will not disclose the nature of the evidence it will reveal to a grand jury.

"We'll present every piece of evidence we have, witness statements, et cetera, to the grand jury, and we do not release any evidence or talk about evidence on the case."

Nabil Khattar, CEO of 7Star Industries – which specializes in firearms training for law enforcement and special operations personnel – confirmed that police are typically instructed to use deadly force if in imminent danger of being killed or suffering great bodily injury.

“You may engage a threat with enough force that is reasonably necessary to defend against that danger,” he said.

Wilson is a six-year veteran of the Ferguson police force department, and has no prior disciplinary infringements.

Massive protests have since taken over the St. Louis community, prompting Missouri Gov. Jay Nixon last Thursday to place Highway Patrol Capt. Ron Johnson at the helm of security operations in an effort to calm ongoing tensions. The federal government is also investigating the death, and Attorney General Eric Holder has taken the lead – calling “the selective release of sensitive information” in the case “troubling.”

On Friday, Ferguson police released surveillance video showing Brown stealing cigars from a convenience store just before his death. Jackson came under intense criticism for disclosing the tape and a related police report as he also insisted that the alleged robbery and the encounter with Wilson were unrelated matters. Brown’s family, through their attorney, suggested the tape’s release was a strategic form of “character assassination.”

However, FoxNews.com’s source insisted that there was absolutely no spin agenda behind the tape’s release and that there were a number of Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) media requests filed by media outlets seeking it. Tom Jackson is said to have waited on publicly releasing it, and did not want it shown until Brown’s grieving mother first had the chance to see it.

“He defied the FOIAs as long as he could,” noted the insider. “A powerful, ugly spin has completely ruined public discourse on this whole situation.” (Link)

Follow @holliesmckay www.twitter.com/holliesmckay

So he beat the guy badly enough to cause an orbital fracture, but there were no signs of bruising on his hands? That seems weird.

 

[tom22406]

Looks like ABC is running with the orbital fracture story now

The Ferguson police officer who shot and killed an unarmed teenager suffered “a serious facial injury” in the altercation before firing the fatal shots, according to a source close to the officer who spoke to ABC News today.

The characterization about Officer Darren Wilson being injured in his confrontation with Michael Brown emerged on the day that a grand jury was expected to begin hearing evidence in the shooting. Attorney General Eric Holder is also visiting Ferguson today, meeting with community leaders and groups to discuss the tension over the shooting.

Brown, 18, was shot and killed by Wilson on Aug.9, and protesters have been angrily calling for Wilson's arrest and indictment since that day.

St. Louis County Prosecutor David McCullough cautioned today that a decision on whether or not the officer would be indicted will not come quickly. He told ABC News "our target date is the middle of October" for wrapping up the evidence and asking the jury to decide whether to charge Wilson. Grand juries typically meet one day a week.

A source close to Wilson told ABC News that during the struggle at the patrol car, Wilson suffered “a serious facial injury.”

The injury was not described, but last week Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson said that Wilson had swelling to the side of his face

http://abcnews.go.com/US/ferguson-shooting-grand-jury-decide-october-charge-cop/story?id=25047905

Or at least some kind of facial injury, I guess.

Fox News is reporting that a source "close to the department's top brass" described the injury as an orbital fracture. Still no pictures or medical report.

Darren Wilson, the Ferguson, Mo., police officer whose fatal shooting of Michael Brown touched off more than a week of demonstrations, suffered severe facial injuries, including an orbital (eye socket) fracture, and was nearly beaten unconscious by Brown moments before firing his gun, a source close to the department's top brass told FoxNews.com.

“The Assistant (Police) Chief took him to the hospital, his face all swollen on one side,” said the insider. “He was beaten very severely.”


According to the well-placed source, Wilson was coming off another case in the neighborhood on Aug. 9 when he ordered Michael Brown and his friend Dorain Johnson to stop walking in the middle of the road because they were obstructing traffic. However, the confrontation quickly escalated into physical violence, the source said..
“They ignored him and the officer started to get out of the car to tell them to move," the source said. "They shoved him right back in, that’s when Michael Brown leans in and starts beating Officer Wilson in the head and the face.

The source claims that there is "solid proof" that there was a struggle between Brown and Wilson for the policeman’s firearm, resulting in the gun going off – although it still remains unclear at this stage who pulled the trigger. Brown started to walk away according to the account, prompting Wilson to draw his gun and order him to freeze. Brown, the source said, raised his hands in the air, and turned around saying, "What, you're going to shoot me?"

At that point, the source told FoxNews.com, the 6 foot, 4 inch, 292-pound Brown charged Wilson, prompting the officer to fire at least six shots at him, including the fatal bullet that penetrated the top of Brown's skull, according to an independent autopsy conducted at the request of Brown's family.

Wilson suffered a fractured eye socket in the fracas, and was left dazed by the initial confrontation, the source said. He is now "traumatized, scared for his life and his family, injured and terrified" that a grand jury, which began hearing evidence on Wednesday, will "make some kind of example out of him," the source said.

The source also said the dashboard and body cameras, which might have recorded crucial evidence, had been ordered by Ferguson Police Chief Thomas Jackson, but had only recently arrived and had not yet been deployed.

St. Louis County police, who have taken over the investigation, did not return requests for comment about possible injuries suffered by Wilson.

Edward Magee, spokesman for St. Louis County Prosecutor Robert McCullough, said the office will not disclose the nature of the evidence it will reveal to a grand jury.

"We'll present every piece of evidence we have, witness statements, et cetera, to the grand jury, and we do not release any evidence or talk about evidence on the case."

Nabil Khattar, CEO of 7Star Industries – which specializes in firearms training for law enforcement and special operations personnel – confirmed that police are typically instructed to use deadly force if in imminent danger of being killed or suffering great bodily injury.

“You may engage a threat with enough force that is reasonably necessary to defend against that danger,” he said.

Wilson is a six-year veteran of the Ferguson police force department, and has no prior disciplinary infringements.

Massive protests have since taken over the St. Louis community, prompting Missouri Gov. Jay Nixon last Thursday to place Highway Patrol Capt. Ron Johnson at the helm of security operations in an effort to calm ongoing tensions. The federal government is also investigating the death, and Attorney General Eric Holder has taken the lead – calling “the selective release of sensitive information” in the case “troubling.”

On Friday, Ferguson police released surveillance video showing Brown stealing cigars from a convenience store just before his death. Jackson came under intense criticism for disclosing the tape and a related police report as he also insisted that the alleged robbery and the encounter with Wilson were unrelated matters. Brown’s family, through their attorney, suggested the tape’s release was a strategic form of “character assassination.”

However, FoxNews.com’s source insisted that there was absolutely no spin agenda behind the tape’s release and that there were a number of Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) media requests filed by media outlets seeking it. Tom Jackson is said to have waited on publicly releasing it, and did not want it shown until Brown’s grieving mother first had the chance to see it.

“He defied the FOIAs as long as he could,” noted the insider. “A powerful, ugly spin has completely ruined public discourse on this whole situation.” (Link)

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So he beat the guy badly enough to cause an orbital fracture, but there were no signs of bruising on his hands? That seems weird.

Don't think it could have been just one punch with his size?

 

[msommer]

Brown grabbed the uniform and repeatedly pulled the orbital bone into the car door

/jim11

 

[timschochet]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Your opinion on this case is extremely malleable.

Thank you. At this point, everyone should be malleable. As you have pointed out, there is much more that we don't know than we do. As each new fact comes in, that should change your opinion, so long as you are a reasonable person without a particular ax to grind.

 

[Henry Ford]

Don't think it could have been just one punch with his size?

Sure it could. Still would have left a mark.

 

[Henry Ford]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Your opinion on this case is extremely malleable.

Thank you. At this point, everyone should be malleable. As you have pointed out, there is much more that we don't know than we do. As each new fact comes in, that should change your opinion, so long as you are a reasonable person without a particular ax to grind.

That sounds exhausting. Let's wait for all the new facts to come in first.

 

[Gary Coal Man]

So he beat the guy badly enough to cause an orbital fracture, but there were no signs of bruising on his hands? That seems weird.

Don't think it could have been just one punch with his size?

I have no clue what happened between Brown and Wilson, but I do know that one well placed, open hand, ##### slap from a much larger man can do a lot of damage. Just ask John Stossel.

 

[tom22406]

So he beat the guy badly enough to cause an orbital fracture, but there were no signs of bruising on his hands? That seems weird.

Don't think it could have been just one punch with his size?

I have no clue what happened between Brown and Wilson

Just to be really clear here,nobody does at this point except Wilson.

 

[Jim11]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/08/20/missouri-cop-was-badly-beaten-before-shooting-michael-brown-says-source/

Missouri cop was badly beaten before shooting Michael Brown, says source

 

[sublimeone]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Why do you give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who just robbed a convenience store and attacked a cop instead of the cop?

 

[Jim11]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Why do you give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who just robbed a convenience store and attacked a cop instead of the cop?

Because he's not exactly a deep thinker.

 

[GrandpaRox]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

My God you will never change.

 

[Henry Ford]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

Why do you give the benefit of the doubt to the guy who just robbed a convenience store and attacked a cop instead of the cop?

Why do you give the benefit of the doubt to a cop who's going in front of a grand jury for shooting someone instead of the dead guy?

 

[Christo]

Has anyone figured out why it was significant that the store customer rather than the store clerk called 911?

I think it's significant, because it might not have been a robbery. In fact, I have not heard any confirmation from the store owner that it in fact WAS a robbery. And if it wasn't a robbery, then I have less reason to be skeptical of Johnson's testimony- which is my only interest in the robbery in the first place. Otherwise, whether or not Brown robbed a store is immaterial to what happened to him afterwards, IMO.

 

[Christo]

The injury to Wilson's face makes it more likely, at least to me, that he committed a crime here.

My likely scenario: Wilson stops Brown and Johnson. A scuffle occurs. Brown hits Wilson in the face, causing the injury. The two kids take off running. Wilson fires his gun. The first shot either misses or wings Brown in the arm. Brown turns around, and either raises his arms in surrender or does not, just turns around. (Not sure what happened to Johnson at this point.)

And here is where the crime is committed by Wilson: in fear or rage or both, Wilson does not ask Brown to surrender. He does not instruct Brown to lie down on the ground. Instead, he fires his remaining bullets at Wilson. And that's murder.

There's probably no way to prove it, but that's what I think probably happened.

99 opinions and willing to state them all.