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Looting in Missouri after cops shoot 18 year old (1 Viewer)

Serious question: What are the sources, so far, from the Officer's side?

The Police Department

The family friend

The background voice John Doe

Are there any others?
So what side is more credible.....someone who just robbed a store? Or an officer of the law answering the call and doing his job?

I give the benefit of the doubt to the law first. That was my upbringing. I don't side with alleged criminals first. I let the courts and law investigate. But the benefit of the doubt in my home sides with those who are hired to serve and protect. If we are not giving Police the benefit of the doubt first...then we are going to hell in a hen basket.

Sometimes they are guilty. But most of the time they are being asked to do a job none else wants to do.

 
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I should post the comments below after he posted it but I don't think the filter here will let me get 2 words in.People actually think this is true or want to believe it is.
I don't understand how anyone could believe that article really happened. That would be like fracturing someone's orbital bone with your fist without leaving evidence on/under your skin.
That can be seen from space.
The puncher's skin. Which showed no signs of having punched anyone, according to all autopsies.
Yet I believe you've conceded that if there was a fracture it could have been caused by the kid grabbing the cop and banging his head on something else like the steering wheel or the inside of the car door.
Not just conceded. Many, many pages ago, I believe I suggested it may have been from contact with the door.Again, doesn't fit with the allegations of the "beating" Wilson took, thus far.
Hitting someone's head against a car door isn't a "beating"?
Which news report/eyewitness account is this version from?

As far as I've read, the initial reports were the officer tried to open the door up, he was too close to the kids, and the door sprung back on him.

Is there a report of the dead kid beating the officer in the head with the door? Missed that one.
:lmao:
 
Serious question: What are the sources, so far, from the Officer's side?

The Police Department

The family friend

The background voice John Doe

Are there any others?
So what side is more credible.....someone who just robbed a store? or an officer of the law.

I give the benefit of the doubt to the law first. that was my upbringing. I don't side with alleged criminals first. I let the courts and law investigate. But the benefit of the doubt in my home sides with those who are hired to serve and protect.

Sometimes they are guilty. But most of the time they are being asked to do a job none else wants to do.
why you we judging anything at this point?

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.

Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.
No evidence of fractured orbital bone. A source says that didn't happen. And the police weren't responding to a robbery call, the officer stopped him for jaywalking and obstructing traffic.

 
Serious question: What are the sources, so far, from the Officer's side?

The Police Department

The family friend

The background voice John Doe

Are there any others?
So what side is more credible.....someone who just robbed a store? or an officer of the law.

I give the benefit of the doubt to the law first. that was my upbringing. I don't side with alleged criminals first. I let the courts and law investigate. But the benefit of the doubt in my home sides with those who are hired to serve and protect.

Sometimes they are guilty. But most of the time they are being asked to do a job none else wants to do.
What "side" is more credible? Which "side" are the eyewitnesses on? Are they less credible because they live in the same neighborhood as the kid? Because you think they just hate cops?

You are writing off eyewitness accounts from people you've never met, talked to, or otherwise evaluated. The soul criteria for discounted those accounts is ... what?

I get that Johnson isn't probably going to prove to be the most credible source. But he isn't the only source.

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.

Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.
Can they even charge the guy with the store robbery? He's dead. I mean you can't have a trial can you? Russia can but I don't think that flies over here.

 
Good morning. I wanted to make 2 points this morning:

1. The state senator (Jamilah Nasheed) who threatened more rioting if Wilson is not indicted is both irresponsible and despicable, and she reminds me strongly of Maxine Waters during the LA Riots, whom I also have always detested. This woman as a public official has, IMO, a greater responsibility to the public than does the guy on the street or even journalists. It's absolutely shameful to attempt to influence justice in this manner.

2.Regarding Wilson's facial injury, I really don't see how it matters whether it's a fracture or just swelling. All of the witnesses agree that there was an initial struggle; what we don't know is what happened next. iMO, the extent of the facial injury has no bearing on whether or not the shooting was a crime.

 
We don't know that happened. Unconfirmed
See why I don't speculate you ninny?
What's with the name calling?Can't take a dose of your own medicine?

That calls for a :lmao:
msommer: Speculate, Christo! Speculate, Christo!Christo: It's not worth it.

msommer: You fence sitter.

Christo discusses someone else's speculation.

msommer: You don't know that!
Well, I got a chuckle out of it.

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.
No evidence of fractured orbital bone. A source says that didn't happen. And the police weren't responding to a robbery call, the officer stopped him for jaywalking and obstructing traffic.
Wow.....I can't believe the lack of information on this. It's just absurd.

WTF is this police force doing? How come official reports and an account of this are not even known at this point? I mean I understand an investigation takes a lot of time. But what is the official statement of what happened to cause a police officer to put 6 slugs into an 18 year old man for jaywalking.

Jaywalking? No freaking way.

 
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Serious question: What are the sources, so far, from the Officer's side?

The Police Department

The family friend

The background voice John Doe

Are there any others?
So what side is more credible.....someone who just robbed a store? or an officer of the law.

I give the benefit of the doubt to the law first. that was my upbringing. I don't side with alleged criminals first. I let the courts and law investigate. But the benefit of the doubt in my home sides with those who are hired to serve and protect.

Sometimes they are guilty. But most of the time they are being asked to do a job none else wants to do.
What "side" is more credible? Which "side" are the eyewitnesses on? Are they less credible because they live in the same neighborhood as the kid? Because you think they just hate cops?

You are writing off eyewitness accounts from people you've never met, talked to, or otherwise evaluated. The soul criteria for discounted those accounts is ... what?

I get that Johnson isn't probably going to prove to be the most credible source. But he isn't the only source.
Again....I have not read enough....I need to catch up. The lack of real information is troubling.

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.
No evidence of fractured orbital bone. A source says that didn't happen. And the police weren't responding to a robbery call, the officer stopped him for jaywalking and obstructing traffic.
Wow.....I can't believe the lack of information on this. It's just absurd.WTF is this police force doing? How come official reports and an account of this are not even known at this point? I mean I understand an investigation takes a lot of time. But was is the official statement of what happened to cause a police officer to put 6 slugs into a an 18 year old man for jaywalking.

Jaywalking? No freaking way.
Yes, little known law in that area. But cops are allowed to gun-down jaywalkers without a warning.HTH

 
No major media source has yet to confirm the below information so take it with a grain of salt for now:

BREAKING REPORT: Officer Darren Wilson Suffered “Orbital Blowout Fracture to Eye Socket” During Mike Brown Attack

The Gateway Pundit can now confirm from two local St. Louis sources that police Officer Darren Wilson suffered facial fractures during his confrontation with deceased 18 year-old Michael Brown. Officer Wilson clearly feared for his life during the incident that led to the shooting death of Brown. This was after Michael Brown and his accomplice Dorian Johnson robbed a local Ferguson convenience store.

Local St. Louis sources said Wilson suffered an “orbital blowout fracture to the eye socket.” This comes from a source within the Prosecuting Attorney’s office and confirmed by the St. Louis County Police.

A blowout fracture is a fracture of one or more of the bones surrounding the eye and is commonly referred to as an orbital floor fracture.
If this is confirmed to be true....this officer was getting the crap beaten out him. A fractured eye socket is no joke. Sorry but when your using physical force like this on a police officer and you just robbed a convenience store and you reportedly reached for an officers weapon.Your a dead man in most cases.
Keep reading.
Yeah I am not following this too closely.Is anything been confirmed or are we all just speculating etc. My stance is....I take the polices words far more seriously and more credible initially until proven to be guilty. The guy was robbing a store and committed a crime. The police were answering a call.

He is already on the wrong side of this.
No evidence of fractured orbital bone. A source says that didn't happen. And the police weren't responding to a robbery call, the officer stopped him for jaywalking and obstructing traffic.
Wow.....I can't believe the lack of information on this. It's just absurd.

WTF is this police force doing? How come official reports and an account of this are not even known at this point? I mean I understand an investigation takes a lot of time. But what is the official statement of what happened to cause a police officer to put 6 slugs into an 18 year old man for jaywalking.

Jaywalking? No freaking way.
Way!

 
Thought this was interesting:

http://www.npr.org/2014/08/21/342207432/who-are-the-protesters-getting-arrested-in-ferguson

There was nobody at the QuikTrip on Thursday — that's the gas station and convenience store that burned down on the first night of violent protests in Ferguson, Mo. It was once a focal point for protesters.

On Thursday, Missouri Gov. Jay Nixon ordered his state's National Guard to start withdrawing, a sign of the calm that has finally descended on the city racked by protests ever since police shot and killed an unarmed 18-year-old African-American man named Michael Brown.

While the QuikTrip was quiet, there's more of a crowd a short walk away at the Canfield Green Apartment Complex — that's where Brown was shot. Members of the NAACP are here dropping off food and water for residents.

"A lot of people have had trouble getting out of here," says John Gaskin of the St. Louis County chapter of the NAACP. "Many of the people that live in this area don't have cars; as you can see, many of the more accessible stores — like the convenient marts — are closed because of the looting."

He says the presence of U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder has helped calm down protests. So have the rain and heat. On Wednesday night, only six people were arrested in Ferguson, according to the Missouri Highway Patrol. That's way down from the previous night when 51 people were arrested.

More than 160 people have been arrested since the protests began, nearly two weeks ago. Arrest records provide details about where the protesters are coming from.

Sgt. Al Notham, who works with the Highway Patrol, says the bad actors have largely been weeded out. "Community leaders are stepping in. We're getting all kinds of assistance from the community. They're actually doing a fantastic job."

Since the protests erupted, people in Ferguson have insisted that the troublemakers are not from this community. Capt. Ron Johnson, the highway patrolman in charge of security here, said as much earlier this week.

"I am not going to let the criminals that have come out here from across this country and don't live in this community define this neighborhood and define what we're going to do to make it right," Johnson says.

In fact, of the 51 people who were arrested Tuesday night and Wednesday morning, only one person was from Ferguson. The rest were from surrounding towns and faraway cities such as Des Moines, Iowa, Chicago and New York.

Some were arrested for property damage, disorderly conduct and burglary. Most were taken in for simply not dispersing when police ordered them to.

The violence and looting have also been largely at night. During the day, the protests are completely different. Peaceful protesters have come to Ferguson from as far as Chicago, Atlanta and Detroit to be a part of an outcry sparked by Brown's death.

Kevin Mattson drove here from Athens, Ohio, with his family to protest aggressive policing and to support the plight of young black men.

"It's my obligation as a citizen of the nation," Mattson says.

The Mattson family was protesting earlier this week along with 15 or 20 other people, some praying, in front of the Ferguson police station. While Mattson and his wife, Vicky, are white; his son, Jay, is black.

"Just being African-American and seeing a kid only two years older than me get shot, it's really, just sad and makes me worried about how I am going to act when I leave the small town I live in now," Jay Mattson says. "Because everybody grew up with me and they knew who I was, but when I move away I don't know how other people are going to react to me."

The protests may have died down for now. But Gaskin, with the NAACP, says his group is planning a youth march on Saturday. And a decision on whether to charge police officer Darren Wilson with shooting Michael Brown could be weeks away. That could give people from across the country plenty of time to figure out the way to Ferguson.

 
It's not. Though the article on their front page about Kim Jong Un taking the ice bucket challenge seems possible.
I should post the comments below after he posted it but I don't think the filter here will let me get 2 words in.People actually think this is true or want to believe it is.
I don't understand how anyone could believe that article really happened. That would be like fracturing someone's orbital bone with your fist without leaving evidence on/under your skin.
That can be seen from space.
The puncher's skin. Which showed no signs of having punched anyone, according to all autopsies.
Can you unpack this a little? I didn't realize any results of the other two autopsies have been released yet and the one that was released indicated no signs of a struggle, but didn't specify if that finding meant inuries to Brown's hand.

 
Officer Down Memorial Page lists 30 officers killed by a shooting in the line of duty in 2013.

Wiki lists 313 people that police officers killed in 2013.
Are those really the same thing? I'm asking because I don't know. Is the first only a listing of cops killed by a firearm (not by stabbing, auto accidents, getting beaten, whatever) - and the 2nd one is for all deaths no matter the cause? I ask because two officers in my county alone died in auto accidents last year.
Also, for reference and comparison, there were 16,238 homicides in the US in 2011. Take out the officers killed in line of duty and the killings by police officers, you still have a number that is 50x higher in the general population.

 
So from that article, the vast majority of the protestors are peaceful. And of the VERY FEW who have engaged in rioting and looting, something like 98% of them are from outside Ferguson. This goes completely against the stereotypes that have been made in this thread (especially in the first several pages) and elsewhere.

 
Good morning. I wanted to make 2 points this morning:

1. The state senator (Jamilah Nasheed) who threatened more rioting if Wilson is not indicted is both irresponsible and despicable, and she reminds me strongly of Maxine Waters during the LA Riots, whom I also have always detested. This woman as a public official has, IMO, a greater responsibility to the public than does the guy on the street or even journalists. It's absolutely shameful to attempt to influence justice in this manner.

2.Regarding Wilson's facial injury, I really don't see how it matters whether it's a fracture or just swelling. All of the witnesses agree that there was an initial struggle; what we don't know is what happened next. iMO, the extent of the facial injury has no bearing on whether or not the shooting was a crime.
“Take your hands off me, don’t touch me, I’m a state senator,” Nasheed could be heard shouting as she jostled forward toward a police officer. She obviously never watched "Shooter".

What it does show is the state of mind of Brown. If you are going to attack an officer in his car, you could very well charge at him when he is out of his car.

 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?

 
Good morning. I wanted to make 2 points this morning:

1. The state senator (Jamilah Nasheed) who threatened more rioting if Wilson is not indicted is both irresponsible and despicable, and she reminds me strongly of Maxine Waters during the LA Riots, whom I also have always detested. This woman as a public official has, IMO, a greater responsibility to the public than does the guy on the street or even journalists. It's absolutely shameful to attempt to influence justice in this manner.

2.Regarding Wilson's facial injury, I really don't see how it matters whether it's a fracture or just swelling. All of the witnesses agree that there was an initial struggle; what we don't know is what happened next. iMO, the extent of the facial injury has no bearing on whether or not the shooting was a crime.
Take your hands off me, dont touch me, Im a state senator, Nasheed could be heard shouting as she jostled forward toward a police officer. She obviously never watched "Shooter".

What it does show is the state of mind of Brown. If you are going to attack an officer in his car, you could very well charge at him when he is out of his car.
Disagree. First off we don't know who started the scuffle. But even if it was Brown, at that point Wilson likely did not have his gun out. It's one thing to fight a policeman at close range, ill-advised as that is. It's quite another to charge at a policeman, from any sort of distance, with his gun pointing at you and firing bullets. I still contend that no matter what occurred beforehand, the charge remains extremely implausible.
 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
"less than 3 minutes" could not be any more vague and who knows if that is even accurate at this point. Johnson did say there was some initial dialogue, then the scuffle, then the running and the shooting (and or the running, the shooting, the charging and the shooting).

 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
Didn't he tell them to get off the street and drive away initially then drive back?
 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
Didn't he tell them to get off the street and drive away initially then drive back?
According to untrustworthy source Johnson, sorta, ya.

 
Good morning. I wanted to make 2 points this morning:

1. The state senator (Jamilah Nasheed) who threatened more rioting if Wilson is not indicted is both irresponsible and despicable, and she reminds me strongly of Maxine Waters during the LA Riots, whom I also have always detested. This woman as a public official has, IMO, a greater responsibility to the public than does the guy on the street or even journalists. It's absolutely shameful to attempt to influence justice in this manner.

2.Regarding Wilson's facial injury, I really don't see how it matters whether it's a fracture or just swelling. All of the witnesses agree that there was an initial struggle; what we don't know is what happened next. iMO, the extent of the facial injury has no bearing on whether or not the shooting was a crime.
Take your hands off me, dont touch me, Im a state senator, Nasheed could be heard shouting as she jostled forward toward a police officer. She obviously never watched "Shooter".

What it does show is the state of mind of Brown. If you are going to attack an officer in his car, you could very well charge at him when he is out of his car.
Disagree. First off we don't know who started the scuffle. But even if it was Brown, at that point Wilson likely did not have his gun out. It's one thing to fight a policeman at close range, ill-advised as that is. It's quite another to charge at a policeman, from any sort of distance, with his gun pointing at you and firing bullets. I still contend that no matter what occurred beforehand, the charge remains extremely implausible.
As opposed to sort of implausible?
 
Good morning. I wanted to make 2 points this morning:

1. The state senator (Jamilah Nasheed) who threatened more rioting if Wilson is not indicted is both irresponsible and despicable, and she reminds me strongly of Maxine Waters during the LA Riots, whom I also have always detested. This woman as a public official has, IMO, a greater responsibility to the public than does the guy on the street or even journalists. It's absolutely shameful to attempt to influence justice in this manner.

2.Regarding Wilson's facial injury, I really don't see how it matters whether it's a fracture or just swelling. All of the witnesses agree that there was an initial struggle; what we don't know is what happened next. iMO, the extent of the facial injury has no bearing on whether or not the shooting was a crime.
Take your hands off me, dont touch me, Im a state senator, Nasheed could be heard shouting as she jostled forward toward a police officer. She obviously never watched "Shooter".

What it does show is the state of mind of Brown. If you are going to attack an officer in his car, you could very well charge at him when he is out of his car.
Disagree. First off we don't know who started the scuffle. But even if it was Brown, at that point Wilson likely did not have his gun out. It's one thing to fight a policeman at close range, ill-advised as that is. It's quite another to charge at a policeman, from any sort of distance, with his gun pointing at you and firing bullets. I still contend that no matter what occurred beforehand, the charge remains extremely implausible.
As opposed to sort of implausible?
Sure.
 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
"less than 3 minutes" could not be any more vague and who knows if that is even accurate at this point. Johnson did say there was some initial dialogue, then the scuffle, then the running and the shooting (and or the running, the shooting, the charging and the shooting).
So even Johnson said there was a scuffle?

 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
"less than 3 minutes" could not be any more vague and who knows if that is even accurate at this point. Johnson did say there was some initial dialogue, then the scuffle, then the running and the shooting (and or the running, the shooting, the charging and the shooting).
So even Johnson said there was a scuffle?
Johnson said it was initiated by Wilson, and that Brown only tried to get away from Wilson.

 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
"less than 3 minutes" could not be any more vague and who knows if that is even accurate at this point. Johnson did say there was some initial dialogue, then the scuffle, then the running and the shooting (and or the running, the shooting, the charging and the shooting).
So even Johnson said there was a scuffle?
Johnson said it was initiated by Wilson, and that Brown only tried to get away from Wilson.
Johnson also said that Brown was shot in the back - which didn't happen. Johnson also has warrants out for him and is on camera with Brown in the robbery just before the shooting. I'm not taking much of what he says at face value, but had he said that there was a scuffle that would be very telling.

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
Wiki said US was at 313 apparently, and that was from all types (not just shootings). So no, I don't think the above is true.
Actually there's no reliable data, which is insane if you think about it. According to this guy the 2011 data was 1,146 shot and 607 killed.

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
Wiki said US was at 313 apparently, and that was from all types (not just shootings). So no, I don't think the above is true.
Actually there's no reliable data, which is insane if you think about it. According to this guy the 2011 data was 1,146 shot and 607 killed.
I'm sure there's reliable data at the local level. It's just compiling it. I think people forget that we don't have a unified government system so there is not one source to go to for the information.

 
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.

Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
"less than 3 minutes" could not be any more vague and who knows if that is even accurate at this point. Johnson did say there was some initial dialogue, then the scuffle, then the running and the shooting (and or the running, the shooting, the charging and the shooting).
So even Johnson said there was a scuffle?
Johnson said it was initiated by Wilson, and that Brown only tried to get away from Wilson.
Johnson also said that Brown was shot in the back - which didn't happen. Johnson also has warrants out for him and is on camera with Brown in the robbery just before the shooting. I'm not taking much of what he says at face value, but had he said that there was a scuffle that would be very telling.
Not really.

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
Wiki said US was at 313 apparently, and that was from all types (not just shootings). So no, I don't think the above is true.
Actually there's no reliable data, which is insane if you think about it. According to this guy the 2011 data was 1,146 shot and 607 killed.
I'm sure there's reliable data at the local level. It's just compiling it. I think people forget that we don't have a unified government system so there is not one source to go to for the information.
Here's more info on the difficulty of coming up with a national number.

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
probably. At least as to the UK, since most don't carry guns.

We are a violent, gun toting society. This shouldn't shock.
The German numbers seem legit if nothing has escalated since 2011

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/11/11662345-german-police-fired-just-85-bullets-total-in-2011

 
German police officers fired a total of 85 bullets in 2011, 49 of which were warning shots.
I am willing to bet we are lagging behind a bit in the "warning shot" to "kill shot" ratio.

Or does shooting someone in the arm count as a warning shot? Suppose we can define it how we see fit here in the US of A.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
god bless wiki, holy crap someone has been busy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#James_McKnight

grain of salt, ect. But the accounts are there with references.
Very good reading, thank you for posting this.Under the "shooting incident" section, it says "According to CNN, documents show that less than three minutes passed from the time that Wilson encountered Brown to the time of Brown's death." I didn't realize that so much time had passed.

Initially, had I guessed, the whole thing sounded like it took about a minute (Wilson says something to Brown, Brown says something back, a possible "scuffle", Brown runs, shots fired). If this took 2-3 minutes, what else could have happened?
Didn't he tell them to get off the street and drive away initially then drive back?
This may be accurate. Eventually we will find out if it came across the radio that a man fitting his description just stole an item from a store, while he was driving away, causing him to back up and confront them. It's either that or he told them to get over, they didn't as he drove away and he then saw that they hadn't complied so he threw it in reverse.

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
The numbers are skewed and misleading because those other countries don't shave nearly as many black people for their officers to shoot.
The black people in the UK, Germany and even sweden probably arent the looting, gangsta type either.

You guys seem to be hung up on the persons skin color when in reality its a "behavior and attitude" issue thats the problem.....

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
The numbers are skewed and misleading because those other countries don't shave nearly as many black people for their officers to shoot.
The black people in the UK, Germany and even sweden probably arent the looting, gangsta type either.You guys seem to be hung up on the persons skin color when in reality its a "behavior and attitude" issue thats the problem.....
that must be why all the Bundy idiots are dead.
 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
The numbers are skewed and misleading because those other countries don't shave nearly as many black people for their officers to shoot.
The black people in the UK, Germany and even sweden probably arent the looting, gangsta type either.You guys seem to be hung up on the persons skin color when in reality its a "behavior and attitude" issue thats the problem.....
that must be why all the Bundy idiots are dead.
I have no idea what the hell this means?

 
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
The numbers are skewed and misleading because those other countries don't shave nearly as many black people for their officers to shoot.
The black people in the UK, Germany and even sweden probably arent the looting, gangsta type either.You guys seem to be hung up on the persons skin color when in reality its a "behavior and attitude" issue thats the problem.....
that must be why all the Bundy idiots are dead.
I have no idea what the hell this means?
all the followers of Cliven Bundy the rancher, refusing to leave public property, yelling names and dirty words at the police, pointing AR-15s at the cops and threatening to fire. A bunch of old, idiot white rednecks. And they weren't arrested, much less shot at. Why is that?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Is this true?

@conradhackett: Deaths from police shootings (latest available year)

US 409

Germany 8

Britain 0

Japan 0

http://t.co/zGT8ZNbTq0 http://t.co/afJhJfBefe
The numbers are skewed and misleading because those other countries don't shave nearly as many black people for their officers to shoot.
The black people in the UK, Germany and even sweden probably arent the looting, gangsta type either.You guys seem to be hung up on the persons skin color when in reality its a "behavior and attitude" issue thats the problem.....
that must be why all the Bundy idiots are dead.
I have no idea what the hell this means?
all the followers of Cliven Bundy the rancher, refusing to leave public property, yelling names and dirty words at the police, pointing AR-15s at the cops and threatening to fire. A bunch of old, idiot white rednecks. And they weren't arrested, much less shot at. Why is that?
Being white didnt seem to help david koresh and his followers in Waco much now did it? I dont know a thing about Bundy so i cant really comment....Its a behavior, attitude and total disregard for law that is a problem, i dont see it as a white or black problem since both sides seem to have plenty of criminals that are caught/incarcerated and killed every day....

 
At first I didn't get the Bundy analogy and I argued against it here. But I was wrong ; it's very valid. Can you imagine what would have happened if the Bundy people had all been black? No question in my mind they'd all be dead or in prison.

 

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