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Miami Dolphins owner-Stephen Ross...NFL drops the hammer and Miami loses their 2023 1st, 2024 3rd, Ross suspended 6 Games (1 Viewer)

Dr. Octopus said:
Why a second topic?
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I answered this question as PC as I could the other day but this morning there seems to be only 1 topic left in the forum. 

Mine is focused on illegal fixing of NFL games by 1 of their 32 owners, I even changed the title from the one I started with to solely focus on Stephen Ross and the bounty he put in play...allegedly.  

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Flores maintains in his 58-page lawsuit that Ross offered him $100k per game that he would lose and there is some mystery around that. Was it in play starting Week 1 when they lost 59-10 to the Baltimore Ravens and Minkah Fitz was quickly shuffled out of here to Pittsburgh, maybe he caught wind of the sham early on. 

Did Ross offer the $100k after Flores got his 1st win in Week 8? When Miami was 1-7 and he wanted to make sure Miami would continue to lose? I would like to know when the $100k per week offer to lose was put in play. 
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In fairness to Ross, when Ross was paying Flores to win games he didn't.  So it makes perfect sense to pay him to lose to see of that works.  

 
Bracie Smathers said:
Ian Rapoport@RapSheet

If tanking allegations are proven true, #Dolphins owner Stephen Ross would face severe discipline, up to and including Ross losing the team by a vote of fellow owners, sources say.

My story:

Dolphins' Stephen Ross could lose team by owner vote if NFL investigation into tanking allegations proven true
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We can only pray down here in South Florida...if he admits even jokingly that he said those words or those words escaped his lips under any circumstances or intentions, team should be taken away from him, we've been screaming how dumb and ignorant the man is when it comes to football matters. Icing on the cake.

 
While like my buddy MOP I would not shed a tear if Ross lost his ownership, It would be interesting if the same allegations hit Snyder or one of the "Big" owners. Snyder basically was running a toxic workplace for years and he still gets to own the WFT.  Should be interesting.

 
Dog and pony show and nothing will come of this when all said and done.

Zero evidence and it's basically the word of two guys who got fired by Ross vs the word of Ross.

 
STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
Why is it OK to openly tank in the NBA but in the NFL we need to remove the owner? 
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Pip's Invitation said:
Has an NBA owner offered coach(es) money to lose games? To me that seems on a different level than "not field a talented team in hopes of losing." 
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STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
Im not sure it’s happened in the NFL either. 
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There is an accusation in a court filing alleging a "bonus per loss" scheme during the Miami Dolphins 2019 season in the NFL. Has anything remotely similar occurred in the NBA? (I do not know as I don't follow the NBA.)

We absolutely know that there has been at least one occurance of "not fielding a talented team in hopes of losing" with the Indianapolis Colts "Suck-4-Luck" campaign during the 2011 season in the NFL. 

 
Ruffrodys05 said:
There is an accusation in a court filing alleging a "bonus per loss" scheme during the Miami Dolphins 2019 season in the NFL. Has anything remotely similar occurred in the NBA? (I do not know as I don't follow the NBA.)

We absolutely know that there has been at least one occurance of "not fielding a talented team in hopes of losing" with the Indianapolis Colts "Suck-4-Luck" campaign during the 2011 season in the NFL. 
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Tim Donaghy was the Referee I believe although others had to be involved but they were caught in a gambling scandal, point shaving, phantom foul calls, Playoffs to boot in the NBA, It seems easy to cheat in the NBA and the last 2:00 of an NFL game, you're screwed if the game is close, refs can decide it and that takes a lot of the fun out. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Tim Donaghy was the Referee I believe although others had to be involved but they were caught in a gambling scandal, point shaving, phantom foul calls, Playoffs to boot in the NBA, It seems easy to cheat in the NBA and the last 2:00 of an NFL game, you're screwed if the game is close, refs can decide it and that takes a lot of the fun out. 
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Yes MOP, I recall that incident but, that wasn't an owner offering a head coach cash incentives to lose games. Correct? So, different circumstances and not similar in my eyes.

 
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Ministry of Pain said:
-The NYG really expanded the law suit to racism by hiring Daboll 3 days prior to Coach Flores being interviewed
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This is a common exaggerated and untrue sentiment. NFL teams have spent at least 40 years interviewing talented people they had no intention of hiring or drafting. 

They're getting dirt and the candidate is getting experience. 

Tony Dungy was a huge catalyst for this process and used it to encourage African Americans to get noticed and experience. There was some older OC that went to interviews and got hired as a HC after being turned down like a dozen times before.

The Packers coach LaFleur impressed everyone in a round of HC interviews where he didn't get the job. He stunk as the Titans OC and yet was hired as the Packers coach just after.

I love Pep Hamilton and his story of the Luck's influence and how in the XFL he wowed em so much in the coaching interview, they just made him GM too. In Houston, even with Tim Kelly on staff, they had to have him after a great interview. He was their passing game coordinator last year and did great work with little. The Panthers OC job he was to be interviewed for- he turned them down. 

Patricia was coach if Detroit and he isn't getting much play so now he's gonna be working the other side of the ball in New England to better his resume.

The shine of the star has a lot to do with it and we don't want to admit that. We want wins and losses or the rank of a D or O to matter so much but reputation is king.

I think it's highly questionable if you tell me no team did something to lose to get a top pick- it could be as little as a stud sitting weeks with a twisted ankle to a major purposeful bad play call- I certainly believe it happened.

Flores is the same as every employee that left every job and figuratively burned the place down when he left- it makes prospective employers think twice. It really took the shine off a wonderful start to a HC career. 

The NFL has a long-standing policy of waiting til the dust settles to hire/sign players and coaches whose actions stirred the pot publicly. Is Urban Meyer getting all these job offers? How about Buddy Ryan?

Also, even the non eventful- You mentioned NYG but did Judge get offers or retreat to NE? Jeff Fisher was on the competition committee between jobs. McCarthy after Green Bay.

Theres a definite gap, almost always. Parcells was widely respected yet sat before Dallas. Plenty like him, it's just common.

We want them hired and root for it's but reality is they always sit a year or so til another opportunity is presented.

I wish Flores tons of luck in the future but he better not be bitter next year when he's interviewing. Take the time to chill and be with family and start anew in 2023.

 
Summer Wheat said:
To make those accusations Flores has to have some sort of documentation, texts, checks something right?
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What if he doesn't? What if he says Ross offered it to him and Ross has already let it surface that he was "just kidding" 

-I ask this question 1st, do you believe Flores without any proof, word alone? I do for a lot of reasons, this man has a lot of discipline and I feel his moral compass points North. Stephen Ross on the other hand is a slimy Real Estate Developer that hangs out in New York more than Florida, he's a part time owner that sticks his 81 year old nose into places it doesn't belong. We've systematically written and displayed over many years here in the Shark Pool and the Miami Dolphins thread, time and time again he pops up as the main crux of the problems down here and so I ask you why on earth would we NOT BELIEVE Flores?! 

If you say he said he said then you are accusing Flores of being a liar, it absolutely says "I won't believe anything the man says until I see the proof" because you're a Doubting Thomas where as I have heard the good word and I 100% believe Brian Flores based on the long rap sheet of Stephen Ross going back to Bullygate and even before that with his 1st coaching merry go round with Tony Sporano where he was secretly meeting with Harbaugh before he signed with the Niners. 

There's nothing you can point to with Ross that would make you believe he didn't try and do this based on his bumblings and fumblings over the past 10-12 years. 

Just think about what i am saying, I totally understand your POV, I've been on your side many times with lots of other situations that arise in the NFL but this is one time where I think we need to take the accusations very seriously and start moving towards new ownership here in Miami. Enough embarrassments, the true fans deserve so much better down here. We have children that have gone their entire lives without witnessing Miami win a single Playoff game, how can you expect to keep a fan base doing that? Even the 80s generation never saw but 1 trip to the Super Bowl, there was an AFCC with a drubbing at home against the Buffalo Bills in like '92 and that was 30 years ago. They played in 3 straight Super Bowls VI, VII and VIII, all of them before I was even born. I have gotten to watch the entire games replayed but still I grew up on Marino and a lot of heartbreak. 

I'm sharing this because i would ask for a little leeway in my zest to oust Stephen Ross, it comes from the heart. 

 
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-Correction, there was actually 2 trips to the Super Bowl in the 80s, we had the '82 strike shortened season, just imagine a 9 game season...

Miami went 7-2, got run over by John Riggins in the Super Bowl and was the beginning of a ringing theme with almost no defense especially along the DL throughout the 80s. 

'82 and '84, it made for a rather tight fan base down here and Orange Bowl sellouts to line up and watch Marino. We even had an AFCC vs NE in '85, perhaps we could have pulled off 1 more victory vs the Bears had we made it to the Super Bowl but instead the '85 Bears are regarded as on of the best of all time. 

 
STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
Why is it OK to openly tank in the NBA but in the NFL we need to remove the owner? 
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it's not really the tanking that is the issue so much as the fact that Ross owns a stake in a betting house, so if he is intentionally manipulating the outcomes, that could be a major problem.  Of course, one might wonder why he is allowed to have such a stake at all when such conflicts of interest can so easily arise.

 
Long Ball Larry said:
it's not really the tanking that is the issue so much as the fact that Ross owns a stake in a betting house, so if he is intentionally manipulating the outcomes, that could be a major problem.  Of course, one might wonder why he is allowed to have such a stake at all when such conflicts of interest can so easily arise.
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Seriously. The only possible saving grace for the NFL is that Flores said he didn’t accept the payments/terms.

So good news for the NFL, but a really bad look for Ross.

If the allegations are proved to be true he should be stripped of his team, and be prosecuted.  But since he’s wealthy he’ll probably never do time regardless. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
What if he doesn't? What if he says Ross offered it to him and Ross has already let it surface that he was "just kidding" 

-I ask this question 1st, do you believe Flores without any proof, word alone? I do for a lot of reasons, this man has a lot of discipline and I feel his moral compass points North. Stephen Ross on the other hand is a slimy Real Estate Developer that hangs out in New York more than Florida, he's a part time owner that sticks his 81 year old nose into places it doesn't belong. We've systematically written and displayed over many years here in the Shark Pool and the Miami Dolphins thread, time and time again he pops up as the main crux of the problems down here and so I ask you why on earth would we NOT BELIEVE Flores?! 

If you say he said he said then you are accusing Flores of being a liar, it absolutely says "I won't believe anything the man says until I see the proof" because you're a Doubting Thomas where as I have heard the good word and I 100% believe Brian Flores based on the long rap sheet of Stephen Ross going back to Bullygate and even before that with his 1st coaching merry go round with Tony Sporano where he was secretly meeting with Harbaugh before he signed with the Niners. 

There's nothing you can point to with Ross that would make you believe he didn't try and do this based on his bumblings and fumblings over the past 10-12 years. 

Just think about what i am saying, I totally understand your POV, I've been on your side many times with lots of other situations that arise in the NFL but this is one time where I think we need to take the accusations very seriously and start moving towards new ownership here in Miami. Enough embarrassments, the true fans deserve so much better down here. We have children that have gone their entire lives without witnessing Miami win a single Playoff game, how can you expect to keep a fan base doing that? Even the 80s generation never saw but 1 trip to the Super Bowl, there was an AFCC with a drubbing at home against the Buffalo Bills in like '92 and that was 30 years ago. They played in 3 straight Super Bowls VI, VII and VIII, all of them before I was even born. I have gotten to watch the entire games replayed but still I grew up on Marino and a lot of heartbreak. 

I'm sharing this because i would ask for a little leeway in my zest to oust Stephen Ross, it comes from the heart. 
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First of all, I hardly know who Steven Ross is nor do I care. 

Second, in these situations it is not about what you know, it is what you can prove.

I do not know much about Flores but if his moral compass is so high would he told his story about Ross paying him to lose games if he was hired by The Giants?

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
It is absolutely against the law.

18 U.S. Code § 224 - Bribery in sporting contests
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Bribing someone to fix games is against the law. Owners and players are not allowed to bet on games. 

The NFL managing who wins and loses games is perfectly legal. 
 

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2013/02/when-its-legal-to-rig-a-sports-game-and-why-it-shouldnt-be/273152/

“The web of laws applicable to sports, such as the Sports Bribery Act of 1964, only prohibits gambling-related corruption. There is no federal law explicitly preventing the clandestine manipulation of sporting events to enhance suspense. This gap is problematic. As with certain televised quiz shows decades ago, the in-game action of sporting events can be contrived in profit-maximizing ways. The federal law passed in the wake of the Quiz Show Scandal does not explicitly include televised sports; it only forbids deception of the public in connection with contests of an "intellectual" nature. Wheel of Fortune, Jeopardy!, and Who Wants to Be A Millionaire are covered by the law. Football, basketball, and baseball are not.”

 
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STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
Bribing someone to fix games is against the law. Owners and players are not allowed to bet on games. 

The NFL managing who wins and loses games is perfectly legal. 
 

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2013/02/when-its-legal-to-rig-a-sports-game-and-why-it-shouldnt-be/273152/

“The web of laws applicable to sports, such as the Sports Bribery Act of 1964, only prohibits gambling-related corruption. There is no federal law explicitly preventing the clandestine manipulation of sporting events to enhance suspense. This gap is problematic. As with certain televised quiz shows decades ago, the in-game action of sporting events can be contrived in profit-maximizing ways. The federal law passed in the wake of the Quiz Show Scandal does not explicitly include televised sports; it only forbids deception of the public in connection with contests of an "intellectual" nature. Wheel of Fortune, Jeopardy!, and Who Wants to Be A Millionaire are covered by the law. Football, basketball, and baseball are not.”
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That’s stunning. 😳

 
My wife and I had not been on a vacation since pre-pandemic so of course while I was in the Smoky Mountains, news breaks about Ross being punished, that's right an actual owner NOT involved in sex trafficking or sexual misconduct because those are pretty serious accusations against other owners in the NFL but Goodell and others have decided that tampering....UNPRECEDENTED TAMPERING but not tanking or losing football games on purpose and angering millions of NFL fans and gamblers but just simple tampering and offering Tom Brady ownership and likely the starting QB role in 2022, THAT WAS TOO MUCH!

There's a little sarcasm here but I do feel in my heart that Ross should be forced to sell immediately. His attitude after 20 years of total ineptitude was "Let's Cheat!"

-His words "Wins and losses do not matter" when he fired Brian Flores for being insubordinate to his every wish and whim. I can go on and on about my disdain for Stephen Ross and fear being within ear shot distance of this man for what would come flying out of my mouth but it would not be pleasant and I sure wouldn't be trying to reach over and shake hands with this man.

-The fact Stephen Ross tried to do a victory lap after being suspended into October...
Dan LeBatard is vindicated along with Florio and Ben Voilin who covers the Patriots. I'll try and link some of that thru Youtube right now.

FloresGate

Dolphins Fallout-Ownership in FLUX
 
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1st Round pick in 2023 has been taken away...hope Miami wins the Super Bowl this year and relinquishes the #32 pick.
3rd Rd pick in 2024 seems moot after the 1st but it still hurts especially if turns out to be a high '24 3rd.
$1.5M...$1.500.000.00...One Million Five Hundred Thousand...Chump Change!!! Ross ****s a million before breakfast every morning.
Nothing happens to Brady or Sean Payton as Miami had no permission to seek out Sean Payton who had not told the Saints he was leaving yet. Brady goes back to 2019, Ross had Brady meet him and Flores on Yachts that just happened to be passing in the same dock/harbor and Brian Flores left the meeting and area quickly. \

Ross did jokingly say $100k to tank games...where is the joke exactly? I'd like to know how an owner of an NFL franchise offering money to lose/tank, how is that funny?
If you're not cheating, you'r not trying, right?
 
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Miami tried to tank and get Joe Burrow-Fail!
Miami tried to go Plan B and get Brady-Fail!
Miami fires Flores to get Sean Payton-Fail!

The incompetence displayed by Stephen Ross even by Ross standards is/was a total debacle.
 
Ministry of Pain said:
1st Round pick in 2023 has been taken away...hope Miami wins the Super Bowl this year and hands relinquishes the #32 pick.
3rd Rd pick in 2024 seems moot after the 1st but it still hurts especially if turns out to be a high '24 3rd.
$1.5M...$1.500.000.00...One Million Five Hundred Thousand...Chump Change!!! Ross ****s a million before breakfast every morning.
Nothing happens to Brady or Sean Payton as Miami had no permission to seek out Sean Payton who had not told the Saints he was leaving yet. Brady goes back to 2019, Ross had Brady meet him and Flores on Yachts that just happened to be passing in the same dock/harbor and Brian Flores left the meeting and area quickly. \

Ross did jokingly say $100k to tank games...where is the joke exactly? I'd like to know how an owner of an NFL franchise offering money to lose/tank, how is that funny?
If you're not cheating, you'r not trying, right?
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It's a sense of entitlement that often comes with wealth. Who is most likely to obey the rules at a 4-way stop sign. The driver of a new Mercedes or old Corolla?

Ross spent a lot of money on the team and the stadium, but has made bad decisions such as staying with Grier too long. Now, he and Beal, who should be disqualified from ownership, have possibly cost Miami a chance at yet another franchise QB in the rich 2023 draft. How much did Grier know?

I think Welker and McDaniel played a role in making what's looking like great value picks with wr Ekuzamna in the 4th and qb Skylar Thompson in the 7th.
 
Scrimmages with the Bucs today and tomorrow, followed by a game on Saturday. The excitement in Miami is off the charts. Our fair weather fans have bought all season tickets for 2022 and there is a waitlist for the next year, first time in history. The excitement has been generated by a new and unconventional head coach who lamented missing out on Yeezy Day during a presser. Of course, Cheetah and Terron have also raised expectations. Tua has been very good in practices, more downfield accurate 40 to 50 yards passes, but I'm not a believer until he does it in a real game under pressure.
 
On Sunday night, there could be some anti-Ross protests. Do they allow signs in the stadium anymore? A reminder that his actions will cost us our 2023 1st, in a deep draft. Let's see how Flores will be received.

The main event, aside from the game, will be the Dolphins celebration of the 1972 undefeated team. Guys like Griese, Csonka, and Mercury Morris should be there.
 
SoBeDad said:
On Sunday night, there could be some anti-Ross protests. Do they allow signs in the stadium anymore? A reminder that his actions will cost us our 2023 1st, in a deep draft. Let's see how Flores will be received.

The main event, aside from the game, will be the Dolphins celebration of the 1972 undefeated team. Guys like Griese, Csonka, and Mercury Morris should be there.
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wearing the throwbacks with QB1 under center. should be fun.
 
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