Muslims in NYC Planning to Build Second Mosque Near Ground Zero (1 Viewer)

[Jewell]

Sharia vs. The law on a Global Scale,

 

[Mister Martie]

Well, the secrecy about the funding is slowly starting to trickle out. There was never a doubt that the big money behind the cultural center/mosque were also supporters of terrorism. It is beyond naive to think the statement being made by this building was something other than supporting the attacks of 9-11.

'Hamas' mosque funder

6G gift to front group

By JENNIFER GOULD KEIL

Last Updated: 6:17 AM, September 3, 2010

An Egyptian-born businessman who lives on Long Island — and who once gave thousands of dollars to a Hamas front group — is a major investor in the proposed mosque near Ground Zero, it was reported last night, in the first disclosure of the money behind the controversial project.

Hisham Elzanaty was a “significant investor” in developer Sharif el-Gamal’s $4.8 million purchase of the former Burlington Coat Factory building, where the mosque and Islamic cultural center will be built, the donor’s lawyer, Wolodymyr Starosolsky, told Fox 5 News.

El-Gamal himself has refused to disclose where he got the money to buy the building in July 2009. Elzanaty owns a $2million home in Roslyn Heights, and operates medical companies out of a building in The Bronx. He also owns the New York Neuro and Rehab Center in Morningside Heights.

Is this the best you can do?

Pretty much, but don't worry he'll make up a bunch of stuff that he thinks proves his point but just pushes him further away from reality.

Wow, the denial you people are in is really impressive

Welcome back, Peens.

 

[jon_mx]

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

 

[Darth Cheney]

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

Freedom ain't free, Brah. Sometimes, it hurts.

 

[jon_mx]

Freedom ain't free, Brah. Sometimes, it hurts.

I wish I enjoyed the freedom to build whatever I want where ever I wanted. I have been turned down on several occasions by zoning boards. Why when a group supported largely by terrorist-sympathizers wish to build something, do we need to bend over backwards and not resist their every wish? This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection. There is no reason that the same rules that apply to everyone else should not be used against this project. If people don't like a project, they can use every legal tool to prevent it. I really wish liberals had this respect for freedom when other projects are being proposed.

 

[bigbottom]

Freedom ain't free, Brah. Sometimes, it hurts.

Freedom isn't free.There's a hefty ####in' fee.

 

[bigbottom]

This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection.

Only churches deserve special protection?

 

[jon_mx]

This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection.

Only churches deserve special protection?

Establishment of religion is specifically protected in the constitution, and more specifically this protection is codified in the The Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act. So yes, there are special protections there.

 

[bigbottom]

This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection.

Only churches deserve special protection?

Establishment of religion is specifically protected in the constitution, and more specifically this protection is codified in the The Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act. So yes, there are special protections there.

And wouldn't these protections extend to synagogues and mosques as well?

 

[mad sweeney]

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

This guy's as slanted as you are "his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks,". That quote is completely untrue but is stated as fact to support the position. And then he goes in the whole "he could do more of his stated goal by doing something somewhere else, preferably overseas" and the ever popular "Muslims countries wouldn't tolerate us doing the same over there" baseless and ridiculous arguments that don't apply to how the US operates. Pretty sure you'll be buying a Fathead of this guy if it ever came out since you've been parotting these empty "ideals" since the beginnign.

 

[mad sweeney]

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

This guy's as slanted as you are "his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks,". That quote is completely untrue but is stated as fact to support the position. And then he goes in the whole "he could do more of his stated goal by doing something somewhere else, preferably overseas" and the ever popular "Muslims countries wouldn't tolerate us doing the same over there" baseless and ridiculous arguments that don't apply to how the US operates. Pretty sure you'll be buying a Fathead of this guy if it ever came out since you've been parotting these empty "ideals" since the beginnign.

 

[bigbottom]

From another thread:

It is not a mosque. The Cordoba Initiative is not a church. what exactly is this mythical freedom of religion you keep wrongly bringing up?

You make the most absurd illogical points. Explain what a non-church organization building a cultural center using money from unknown sources has to do with freedom of religion.

I'm honestly confused on this issue. Will there be a mosque at the center or not? In the above posts, you appear to be suggesting that it's not a mosque. But then when you want to make a point regarding the symbolic significance of the center, you post numerous references to it being a mosque:

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

 

[mad sweeney]

Freedom ain't free, Brah. Sometimes, it hurts.

I wish I enjoyed the freedom to build whatever I want where ever I wanted. I have been turned down on several occasions by zoning boards. Why when a group supported largely by terrorist-sympathizers wish to build something, do we need to bend over backwards and not resist their every wish? This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection. There is no reason that the same rules that apply to everyone else should not be used against this project. If people don't like a project, they can use every legal tool to prevent it. I really wish liberals had this respect for freedom when other projects are being proposed.

Well Mr Super "Conservatives Do No Wrong", on what legal grounds should it b prevented? Who is bending over backwards? Seems like the only bending is to overcome the people who don't want it built, not bending over any legal obstacles. What special protection is it getting? What rule is being applied to it that isn't applied to other projects? I really wish your Conservative Cross would lighten up and ease your burden, you could help it by acknowledging the fact that conservatives are just as two faced, hypocritical mess as the Liberals. Your shtick is ridiculous.

 

[mad sweeney]

From another thread:

It is not a mosque. The Cordoba Initiative is not a church. what exactly is this mythical freedom of religion you keep wrongly bringing up?

You make the most absurd illogical points. Explain what a non-church organization building a cultural center using money from unknown sources has to do with freedom of religion.

I'm honestly confused on this issue. Will there be a mosque at the center or not? In the above posts, you appear to be suggesting that it's not a mosque. But then when you want to make a point regarding the symbolic significance of the center, you post numerous references to it being a mosque:

Behind the Cordoba Mosque Controversy

by Mark Silverberg

September 3, 2010 at 4:40 am

While liberal elites focus on the soon-to-rise Cordoba mosque as a symbol of religious tolerance, liberty and interfaith understanding, other issues have been pushed to the sidelines – issues that may appear trivial to us, but which resonate throughout Arab and Muslim world.

The New York authorities could have declared the location a nationally-protected historic site but chose not to do so; and there is no question that Imam Faisal Abdul Rauf and his supporters have both the legal and constitutional right to build the mosque wherever they wish; but there are other questions that merit serious attention – one of which is why Rauf (despite declaring his intention to foster greater religious tolerance, pluralism, inter-religious dialogue and understanding) would demonstrate such insensitivity and lack of reverence by choosing to build this mosque near a site where, on 9/11/2001, 2,700 New Yorkers were incinerated by radical Islamic terrorists.

One is also entitled to be suspicious about his motives, given his refusal to recognize Hamas as a terrorist organization, his claim that U.S. foreign policy was responsible for the 9/11 attacks, and his support for "progressive" Muslim intellectuals like Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi the Muslim Brotherhood's spiritual guide and a favorite of the Saudi royal family. Qaradawi's fatwas, for example, call for the execution of Muslim reformers as apostates, the killing of American troops in Iraq, suicide bombings in Israel, and the rejection of secularism in Islamic societies

Noteworthy is Rauf's intention to raise funds for the $100M 13-story Islamic Center from the most authoritarian, least religiously tolerant Arab regimes in the Middle East. Does anyone actually believe that fostering "religious tolerance and pluralism" is a major selling-point in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Qatar and especially with the Saudis who have spent an estimated $100 billion in petro-dollars over the past thirty-five years to spread radical Islamic dawa (proselytizing) through mosques and madrasses worldwide?

If the Saudis and the other Gulf Emirates are really prepared to put millions towards this project in the interests of promoting religious tolerance, wouldn't a better way be to allow a church, synagogue or multicultural center to be built in Mecca? But do no wait for that to happen any time soon: there are no churches or synagogues in Saudi Arabia, nor are visits by non-believers to the sacred sites of Mecca and Medina allowed; so the argument that the Saudis and the others might consider funding the Center as symbolic support for religious tolerance and pluralism in Islam defies credibility. It is more likely that any financial support emanating from these countries will be geared to promoting jihadi Salafist Islam and the acceptance of Sharia Law in America.. Consequently any financial support from these regimes for this project should be suspect.

Consider as well the historical and religious symbolism this mosque projects throughout the Islamic world. For centuries, the rallying cry of Islamists has been to reclaim their lost medieval Islamic Empire in Southern Spain, known in Islamic history as Andalusia (Al-Andalus). Osama Bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and virtually all proponents of jihadi Salafist Islam speak incessantly of restoring Al-Andalus. So to radical Islamists, a mosque rising near Ground Zero, well before a new World Trade Center has even begun being constructed, symbolizes Islamic triumphalism and supremacy -- part of a long tradition of minarets built over the conquered religious sites of enemies.

In 630 AD, Muslims captured Islam's holiest city, Mecca, and erected a mosque at the Ka'aba -- the site of a building reputedly built by the Patriarch Abraham.

The great mosque at Cordoba was built over the Christian Church of St. Vincent.

The eighth century Al-Aqsa Mosque rests on the site of the destroyed Jewish Second Temple in Jerusalem.

The Ayasofya Mosque was built over the Byzantine Christian Hagia Sophia basilica in Istanbul.

And the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus was constructed over the remains of what was once the Church of St. John the Baptist.

As these mosques were built to symbolize Islamic conquest over the religion of conquered peoples throughout the ages, the Cordoba mosque near the 9/11 site will be seen in the Arab and Muslim world as symbolic of Islamic supremacy in the face of American weakness and appeasement.

So while we are waiting for Imam Rauf's great Islamic Renaissance to unfold, perhaps it might be better to prepare for the videos that might soon begin appearing throughout the Arab world, portraying images of the Cordoba Mosque transposed over the ruins of the World Trade Center. We can expect it to be another hit, as was the anti-Semitic thirty-part TV series "Horseman Without a Horse," based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion forgery, and shown throughout the Arab world during Ramadan in the months following 9/11.

Building this mosque in that place may be legal, but this does not make it right; we too easily dismiss its symbolic value to our enemies. Contrary to popular belief, the proposed mosque does not represent "the audacity of hope" or symbolize religious tolerance; nor will it assist us in avoiding another "misunderstanding" similar to that which "caused" two passenger planes to crash into the World Trade Center on 9/11. Rather, it represents a cold disregard for the worst disaster in American history; an insult to the United States and to the memory of those who died that day, and a symbolic victory for those who continue to justify murder in the name of religion.

There are thousands of sites in New York City where another mosque could be built without the Ground Zero resonance, but that, it seems, would defeat the purpose of building it near that location.

As an ironic side-effect, the Cordoba mosque will actually reinforce the connection between the events of 9/11 and Islam. Additionally, the fact that Muslims will be celebrating the joyous holiday of Eid al-Fatr, marking the end of Ramadan, on or near September 11th this year, will make this connection even more apparent. As Raymond Ibrahim notes: "The greater lesson of the 9/11 mosque is that, so long as Islamists rock the boat and bring attention to themselves - even through non-violent means - (the more) they risk exposing themselves."

Like I said earlier, he's two faced about it. Whatever's most convenient for his argument is what he'll trot out. He has no arguments against it whatsoever that don't involve the fact it's a Muslim building.

 

[Darth Cheney]

Freedom ain't free, Brah. Sometimes, it hurts.

Freedom isn't free.There's a hefty ####in' fee.

Freedom is also just another word for nothing left to lose.

 

[Mario Kart]

This is not a religious organization, it is not a church, the project deserves no special protection.

Only churches deserve special protection?

Establishment of religion is specifically protected in the constitution, and more specifically this protection is codified in the The Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act. So yes, there are special protections there.

I don't believe I just read this. This has to be a dream.

 

[Not Sure]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/opinion/08mosque.html?hp

Op-Ed Contributor

Building on Faith

By FEISAL ABDUL RAUF

Feisal Abdul Rauf is the chairman of the Cordoba Initiative and the imam of the Farah mosque in Lower Manhattan.

Published: September 7, 2010

As my flight approached America last weekend, my mind circled back to the furor that has broken out over plans to build Cordoba House, a community center in Lower Manhattan.I have been away from home for two months, speaking abroad about cooperation among people from different religions. Every day, including the past two weeks spent representing my country on a State Department tour in the Middle East, I have been struck by how the controversy has riveted the attention of Americans, as well as nearly everyone I met in my travels.

We have all been awed by how inflamed and emotional the issue of the proposed community center has become. The level of attention reflects the degree to which people care about the very American values under debate: recognition of the rights of others, tolerance and freedom of worship.

Many people wondered why I did not speak out more, and sooner, about this project. I felt that it would not be right to comment from abroad. It would be better if I addressed these issues once I returned home to America, and after I could confer with leaders of other faiths who have been deliberating with us over this project. My life’s work has been focused on building bridges between religious groups and never has that been as important as it is now.

We are proceeding with the community center, Cordoba House. More important, we are doing so with the support of the downtown community, government at all levels and leaders from across the religious spectrum, who will be our partners. I am convinced that it is the right thing to do for many reasons.

Above all, the project will amplify the multifaith approach that the Cordoba Initiative has deployed in concrete ways for years. Our name, Cordoba, was inspired by the city in Spain where Muslims, Christians and Jews co-existed in the Middle Ages during a period of great cultural enrichment created by Muslims. Our initiative is intended to cultivate understanding among all religions and cultures.

Our broader mission — to strengthen relations between the Western and Muslim worlds and to help counter radical ideology — lies not in skirting the margins of issues that have polarized relations within the Muslim world and between non-Muslims and Muslims. It lies in confronting them as a joint multifaith, multinational effort.

From the political conflicts between Israelis and Palestinians to the building of a community center in Lower Manhattan, Muslims and members of all faiths must work together if we are ever going to succeed in fostering understanding and peace.

At Cordoba House, we envision shared space for community activities, like a swimming pool, classrooms and a play space for children. There will be separate prayer spaces for Muslims, Christians, Jews and men and women of other faiths. The center will also include a multifaith memorial dedicated to victims of the Sept. 11 attacks.

I am very sensitive to the feelings of the families of victims of 9/11, as are my fellow leaders of many faiths. We will accordingly seek the support of those families, and the support of our vibrant neighborhood, as we consider the ultimate plans for the community center. Our objective has always been to make this a center for unification and healing.

Cordoba House will be built on the two fundamental commandments common to Judaism, Christianity and Islam: to love the Lord our creator with all of our hearts, minds, souls and strength; and to love our neighbors as we love ourselves. We want to foster a culture of worship authentic to each religious tradition, and also a culture of forging personal bonds across religious traditions.

I do not underestimate the challenges that will be involved in bringing our work to completion. (Construction has not even begun yet.) I know there will be interest in our financing, and so we will clearly identify all of our financial backers.

Lost amid the commotion is the good that has come out of the recent discussion. I want to draw attention, specifically, to the open, law-based and tolerant actions that have taken place, and that are particularly striking for Muslims.

President Obama and Mayor Michael Bloomberg both spoke out in support of our project. As I traveled overseas, I saw firsthand how their words and actions made a tremendous impact on the Muslim street and on Muslim leaders. It was striking: a Christian president and a Jewish mayor of New York supporting the rights of Muslims. Their statements sent a powerful message about what America stands for, and will be remembered as a milestone in improving American-Muslim relations.

The wonderful outpouring of support for our right to build this community center from across the social, religious and political spectrum seriously undermines the ability of anti-American radicals to recruit young, impressionable Muslims by falsely claiming that America persecutes Muslims for their faith. These efforts by radicals at distortion endanger our national security and the personal security of Americans worldwide. This is why Americans must not back away from completion of this project. If we do, we cede the discourse and, essentially, our future to radicals on both sides. The paradigm of a clash between the West and the Muslim world will continue, as it has in recent decades at terrible cost. It is a paradigm we must shift.

From those who recognize our rights, from grassroots organizers to heads of state, I sense a global desire to build on this positive momentum and to be part of a global movement to heal relations and bring peace. This is an opportunity we must grasp.

I therefore call upon all Americans to rise to this challenge. Let us commemorate the anniversary of 9/11 by pausing to reflect and meditate and tone down the vitriol and rhetoric that serves only to strengthen the radicals and weaken our friends’ belief in our values.

The very word “islam” comes from a word cognate to shalom, which means peace in Hebrew. The Koran declares in its 36th chapter, regarded by the Prophet Muhammad as the heart of the Koran, in a verse deemed the heart of this chapter, “Peace is a word spoken from a merciful Lord.”

How better to commemorate 9/11 than to urge our fellow Muslims, fellow Christians and fellow Jews to follow the fundamental common impulse of our great faith traditions?

 

[the moops]

At Cordoba House, we envision shared space for community activities, like a swimming pool, classrooms and a play space for children. There will be separate prayer spaces for Muslims, Christians, Jews and men and women of other faiths. The center will also include a multifaith memorial dedicated to victims of the Sept. 11 attacks.

Terror babies!!!

 

[timschochet]

I am very sensitive to the feelings of the families of victims of 9/11, as are my fellow leaders of many faiths. We will accordingly seek the support of those families, and the support of our vibrant neighborhood, as we consider the ultimate plans for the community center. Our objective has always been to make this a center for unification and healing.

Perhaps I am reading this wrong, but this sentence suggests there may be a possibility for compromise here, as in perhaps moving the community center further away from Ground Zero.

 

[Offa]

Don't listen to him; he's a terrorist trying to trick us all into supporting Sharia by building a cross-fath community centre!

 

[Radio Free Homer]

Well, the secrecy about the funding is slowly starting to trickle out. There was never a doubt that the big money behind the cultural center/mosque were also supporters of terrorism. It is beyond naive to think the statement being made by this building was something other than supporting the attacks of 9-11.

'Hamas' mosque funder

6G gift to front group

By JENNIFER GOULD KEIL

Last Updated: 6:17 AM, September 3, 2010

An Egyptian-born businessman who lives on Long Island — and who once gave thousands of dollars to a Hamas front group — is a major investor in the proposed mosque near Ground Zero, it was reported last night, in the first disclosure of the money behind the controversial project.

Hisham Elzanaty was a “significant investor” in developer Sharif el-Gamal’s $4.8 million purchase of the former Burlington Coat Factory building, where the mosque and Islamic cultural center will be built, the donor’s lawyer, Wolodymyr Starosolsky, told Fox 5 News.

El-Gamal himself has refused to disclose where he got the money to buy the building in July 2009. Elzanaty owns a $2million home in Roslyn Heights, and operates medical companies out of a building in The Bronx. He also owns the New York Neuro and Rehab Center in Morningside Heights.

Fox News: Mosque Investor Tied to Hamas (Not)

Wingnuts | Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 1:41:09 pm PDT

Here we go again. The New York branch of Fox News shrieks: Mosque Investor Was Terror Contributor.

Except that, uh, he wasn’t.

An Egyptian who’s contributing some money to Park51 once donated money to the Holy Land Foundation — before 9/11, years before the charity was known to be connected to Hamas, because he thought he was donating money for an orphanage. Like thousands of other people did.

Out of this information, Fox gets the headline that he was a “terror contributor.” And of course, the usual idiot’s chorus of anti-Muslim bigot blogs is all over it.

Ugh. This has become a flat out witch hunt now. Everyone who donates money to the Park51 project is going to have their entire past dug up, distorted, and used against them.

UPDATE at 9/3/10 5:13:14 pm:

The Associated Press report on the latest nontroversy underscores the absurdity of trying to make this connection:



Many other donors to the foundation gave thinking their donations would fund humanitarian programs.

Other people and companies who donated money, equipment or services to the foundation the year Elzanaty gave included NBA star Hakeem Olajuwon, the Microsoft Corp., and a medical equipment company owned by General Electric, according to tax records.

When the foundation’s leaders were indicted, Attorney General John Ashcroft said, the case was not “a reflection on the well-meaning people who may have donated funds to the foundation.”

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/37..._to_Hamas_(Not)

We all know that Bill Gates has terrorist ties, but why does the NBA hate America?

 

[Radio Free Homer]

I am very sensitive to the feelings of the families of victims of 9/11, as are my fellow leaders of many faiths. We will accordingly seek the support of those families, and the support of our vibrant neighborhood, as we consider the ultimate plans for the community center. Our objective has always been to make this a center for unification and healing.

Perhaps I am reading this wrong, but this sentence suggests there may be a possibility for compromise here, as in perhaps moving the community center further away from Ground Zero.

You are.

 

[Jewell]

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK – The backers of a proposed Islamic center near ground zero are expressing regrets about creating a firestorm with a plan they thought would be simple and noncontroversial.

Hisham Elzanaty, an Egyptian-born businessman who says he provided a majority of the financing to gain control over the two buildings where the center would be built, told The Associated Press that he has always viewed the project primarily as an investment opportunity, and would sell some of the site if the price is right.

And the imam slated to lead the spiritual component of the center told CNN that if he had realized how some Americans would react to the location, he would have picked some other spot.

"If I knew this would happen, if it would cause this kind of pain, I wouldn't have done it," Feisal Abdul Rauf said.

Both men, though, said they strongly support the center going forward. Rauf said moving it now would create the perception that "Islam is under attack" in America and would strengthen the ability of radicals to attract recruits.

The challenges facing the project extend far beyond the debate over its location, and include conflicting interests among the key backers.

Elzanaty said that while he supports the building of a 13-story Islamic center on the property he helped buy, he needs to turn a profit.

He said one of the buildings is worth millions of dollars if it is redeveloped, and he intends to seize the opportunity. He said he would like to see the other building turned into a mosque, but if backers don't come forward with enough cash for him to break even, he will turn it over to someone else.

"I'm a businessman. This was a mere business transaction for me," said Elzanaty, a U.S. citizen who has lived on New York's Long Island for decades, owns medical clinics in New York City and invests in real estate on the side.

Representatives of some of the project's backers said they have just started trying to raise the estimated $100 million needed to build the center and the millions more required to run it.

Elzanaty said his real estate partnership, which paid $4.8 million for half the site last year, has already received offers of three times that much to sell that parcel.

"Develop it, raze it, sell it," he said. "If someone wants to give me 18 or 20 million dollars today, it's all theirs." LINK

Trump Offers To Buy Property, But Is Flatly Rejected

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK (CBS 2) – Moments after real estate mogul Donald Trump offered to put up the cash to stop the mosque near ground zero from being built, the leader of a small Florida church that espouses anti-Islam philosophy said he is canceling plans to burn copies of the Koran on Sept. 11.

The Muslim cleric behind the proposed downtown Islamic center says it may be too late to move his mosque further away from ground zero.

In a letter faxed out late Thursday, Trump said he’ll end the mosque controversy with his checkbook, but it appears the investors are not interested in “The Donald’s” money.

In a debate with more heat than light, demonstrators on Thursday were arguing over why the downtown mosque should be either expanded or moved.

Then came the offer to buy the place and a crazy twist involving Florida Pastor Terry Jones.

Trump wrote a letter to investor Hisham Elzanaty making an “offer to purchase your site,” meaning the location at 45 Park Place “for what you paid plus 25 percent.” LINK

I'm not sure what caused Mr. Elzanaty to change his mind so quickly. Unless, of course, he didn't actually mean what he said in the first place.

 

[BobbyLayne]

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK – The backers of a proposed Islamic center near ground zero are expressing regrets about creating a firestorm with a plan they thought would be simple and noncontroversial.

Hisham Elzanaty, an Egyptian-born businessman who says he provided a majority of the financing to gain control over the two buildings where the center would be built, told The Associated Press that he has always viewed the project primarily as an investment opportunity, and would sell some of the site if the price is right.

Elzanaty said his real estate partnership, which paid $4.8 million for half the site last year, has already received offers of three times that much to sell that parcel.

"Develop it, raze it, sell it," he said. "If someone wants to give me 18 or 20 million dollars today, it's all theirs." LINK

Trump Offers To Buy Property, But Is Flatly Rejected

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK (CBS 2) – Moments after real estate mogul Donald Trump offered to put up the cash to stop the mosque near ground zero from being built, the leader of a small Florida church that espouses anti-Islam philosophy said he is canceling plans to burn copies of the Koran on Sept. 11.

In a letter faxed out late Thursday, Trump said he’ll end the mosque controversy with his checkbook, but it appears the investors are not interested in “The Donald’s” money.

Then came the offer to buy the place and a crazy twist involving Florida Pastor Terry Jones.

Trump wrote a letter to investor Hisham Elzanaty making an “offer to purchase your site,” meaning the location at 45 Park Place “for what you paid plus 25 percent.” LINK

I'm not sure what caused Mr. Elzanaty to change his mind so quickly. Unless, of course, he didn't actually mean what he said in the first place.

Did I miss something? Or did you just not do the math?He bought his parcel for $4.8M.

He has been offered three times that (presumably, that would be 4.8 x 3 = $14.4M)

He rejected Trump's offer of purchase price ($4.8) plus 25% (1.2).

SUMMARY - Jewell with breaking news! Having previously rejected offers of $14.4M, the developer has rejected an offer of $6.0M from Donald Trump!!!!!

 

[Christo]

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK – The backers of a proposed Islamic center near ground zero are expressing regrets about creating a firestorm with a plan they thought would be simple and noncontroversial.

Hisham Elzanaty, an Egyptian-born businessman who says he provided a majority of the financing to gain control over the two buildings where the center would be built, told The Associated Press that he has always viewed the project primarily as an investment opportunity, and would sell some of the site if the price is right.

And the imam slated to lead the spiritual component of the center told CNN that if he had realized how some Americans would react to the location, he would have picked some other spot.

"If I knew this would happen, if it would cause this kind of pain, I wouldn't have done it," Feisal Abdul Rauf said.

Both men, though, said they strongly support the center going forward. Rauf said moving it now would create the perception that "Islam is under attack" in America and would strengthen the ability of radicals to attract recruits.

The challenges facing the project extend far beyond the debate over its location, and include conflicting interests among the key backers.

Elzanaty said that while he supports the building of a 13-story Islamic center on the property he helped buy, he needs to turn a profit.

He said one of the buildings is worth millions of dollars if it is redeveloped, and he intends to seize the opportunity. He said he would like to see the other building turned into a mosque, but if backers don't come forward with enough cash for him to break even, he will turn it over to someone else.

"I'm a businessman. This was a mere business transaction for me," said Elzanaty, a U.S. citizen who has lived on New York's Long Island for decades, owns medical clinics in New York City and invests in real estate on the side.

Representatives of some of the project's backers said they have just started trying to raise the estimated $100 million needed to build the center and the millions more required to run it.

Elzanaty said his real estate partnership, which paid $4.8 million for half the site last year, has already received offers of three times that much to sell that parcel.

"Develop it, raze it, sell it," he said. "If someone wants to give me 18 or 20 million dollars today, it's all theirs." LINK

Trump Offers To Buy Property, But Is Flatly Rejected

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK (CBS 2) – Moments after real estate mogul Donald Trump offered to put up the cash to stop the mosque near ground zero from being built, the leader of a small Florida church that espouses anti-Islam philosophy said he is canceling plans to burn copies of the Koran on Sept. 11.

The Muslim cleric behind the proposed downtown Islamic center says it may be too late to move his mosque further away from ground zero.

In a letter faxed out late Thursday, Trump said he’ll end the mosque controversy with his checkbook, but it appears the investors are not interested in “The Donald’s” money.

In a debate with more heat than light, demonstrators on Thursday were arguing over why the downtown mosque should be either expanded or moved.

Then came the offer to buy the place and a crazy twist involving Florida Pastor Terry Jones.

Trump wrote a letter to investor Hisham Elzanaty making an “offer to purchase your site,” meaning the location at 45 Park Place “for what you paid plus 25 percent.” LINK

I'm not sure what caused Mr. Elzanaty to change his mind so quickly. Unless, of course, he didn't actually mean what he said in the first place.

Here's a hint: $6 million is a LOT less than $18 to $20 million.

 

[jon_mx]

I'm not sure what caused Mr. Elzanaty to change his mind so quickly. Unless, of course, he didn't actually mean what he said in the first place.

It is a Muslim vs. America thing now. The Cordoba goal of cultivating a bridge between Islam and the West has been quite the success. No contradiction here between their words and actions.

 

[jon_mx]

Here's a hint: $6 million is a LOT less than $18 to $20 million.

According to the above, he was offered nearly $15 million. I guess tripling his money was not enough.

 

[Christo]

Here's a hint: $6 million is a LOT less than $18 to $20 million.

According to the above, he was offered nearly $15 million. I guess tripling his money was not enough.

What part of "If someone wants to give me 18 or 20 million dollars today, it's all theirs" don't you understand.

 

[Jewell]

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK – The backers of a proposed Islamic center near ground zero are expressing regrets about creating a firestorm with a plan they thought would be simple and noncontroversial.

Hisham Elzanaty, an Egyptian-born businessman who says he provided a majority of the financing to gain control over the two buildings where the center would be built, told The Associated Press that he has always viewed the project primarily as an investment opportunity, and would sell some of the site if the price is right.

Elzanaty said his real estate partnership, which paid $4.8 million for half the site last year, has already received offers of three times that much to sell that parcel.

"Develop it, raze it, sell it," he said. "If someone wants to give me 18 or 20 million dollars today, it's all theirs." LINK

Trump Offers To Buy Property, But Is Flatly Rejected

September 9, 2010 NEW YORK (CBS 2) – Moments after real estate mogul Donald Trump offered to put up the cash to stop the mosque near ground zero from being built, the leader of a small Florida church that espouses anti-Islam philosophy said he is canceling plans to burn copies of the Koran on Sept. 11.

In a letter faxed out late Thursday, Trump said he’ll end the mosque controversy with his checkbook, but it appears the investors are not interested in “The Donald’s” money.

Then came the offer to buy the place and a crazy twist involving Florida Pastor Terry Jones.

Trump wrote a letter to investor Hisham Elzanaty making an “offer to purchase your site,” meaning the location at 45 Park Place “for what you paid plus 25 percent.” LINK

I'm not sure what caused Mr. Elzanaty to change his mind so quickly. Unless, of course, he didn't actually mean what he said in the first place.

Did I miss something? Or did you just not do the math?He bought his parcel for $4.8M.

He has been offered three times that (presumably, that would be 4.8 x 3 = $14.4M)

He rejected Trump's offer of purchase price ($4.8) plus 25% (1.2).

SUMMARY - Jewell with breaking news! Having previously rejected offers of $14.4M, the developer has rejected an offer of $6.0M from Donald Trump!!!!!

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.

If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.

What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

 

[the moops]

What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Good.There is zero reason for him to compromise because a mess-load of you folks have your panties in a bunch.

 

[Jewell]

What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Good.There is zero reason for him to compromise because a mess-load of you folks have your panties in a bunch.

That's your opinion and that's fine.Sincerely,Guy who always differentiates between Radical Islam and Moderate Islam but somehow gets lumped into "you folks".

 

[gary mexico]

What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Good.There is zero reason for him to compromise because a mess-load of you folks have your panties in a bunch.

I hope they do build it. Keeps the tensions going.

 

[Christo]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Seems to me $18 to $20 million will buy a lot of compromise. The real ##### here is Trump. Elzanhty named his price and Trump decided he'd grab some headlines by making an offer that didn't come close.

 

[Jewell]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Seems to me $18 to $20 million will buy a lot of compromise. The real ##### here is Trump. Elzanhty named his price and Trump decided he'd grab some headlines by making an offer that didn't come close.

Trump is always an ### and a whore for headlines. That's not in question.

 

[jon_mx]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Seems to me $18 to $20 million will buy a lot of compromise. The real ##### here is Trump. Elzanhty named his price and Trump decided he'd grab some headlines by making an offer that didn't come close.

25% return on a several month investment ain't bad. You don't just make 400% profit like that. That is a ridiculous position.

 

[Christo]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

Seems to me $18 to $20 million will buy a lot of compromise. The real ##### here is Trump. Elzanhty named his price and Trump decided he'd grab some headlines by making an offer that didn't come close.

25% return on a several month investment ain't bad. You don't just make 400% profit like that. That is a ridiculous position.

No, what's ridiculous is you looking at this like some run of the mill real estate transaction. This guy knows that whoever buys it is going to make a killing. Why shouldn't this guy get in on the action?

 

[jon_mx]

No, what's ridiculous is you looking at this like some run of the mill real estate transaction. This guy knows that whoever buys it is going to make a killing. Why shouldn't this guy get in on the action?

There was supposedly a better offer already. Any investor would have jumped on a $14 million offer for a $4.8 million purchase.

 

[Christo]

No, what's ridiculous is you looking at this like some run of the mill real estate transaction. This guy knows that whoever buys it is going to make a killing. Why shouldn't this guy get in on the action?

There was supposedly a better offer already. Any investor would have jumped on a $14 million offer for a $4.8 million purchase.

That's right. I forgot I'm talking to a real estate mogul.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

 

[Radio Free Homer]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

They'll stop burning Korans?

 

[Radio Free Homer]

No, what's ridiculous is you looking at this like some run of the mill real estate transaction. This guy knows that whoever buys it is going to make a killing. Why shouldn't this guy get in on the action?

There was supposedly a better offer already. Any investor would have jumped on a $14 million offer for a $4.8 million purchase.

 

[jon_mx]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

Some people really don't get.

 

[jon_mx]

No, what's ridiculous is you looking at this like some run of the mill real estate transaction. This guy knows that whoever buys it is going to make a killing. Why shouldn't this guy get in on the action?

There was supposedly a better offer already. Any investor would have jumped on a $14 million offer for a $4.8 million purchase.

That's right. I forgot I'm talking to a real estate mogul.

Really? You don't think 300% return on investment when you have made zero improvements is a good deal.....that is like a once in a lifetime sweetheart deal especially at a time when commercial real estate absolutely sucks.

 

[Radio Free Homer]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

Some people really don't get.

I admit I don't. What is the compromise?

 

[Jewell]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work.

The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.

If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.

What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

I don't know if it's a compromise as much as it is a show of faith. And we just saw a show of faith from the overwhelming majority of Americans who raised up and spoke out against the Koran burning stupidity. The stupidity of National Draw Mohammed Day also fell flat. And mentions of Islam have been redacted from our national briefings. Good faith efforts have certainly been shown.

 

[jon_mx]

I already figured out the math, but thanks for showing your work. The thing is I have no proof that those other offers existed. I have proof that this offer exists. I'm merely offering the two stories to show that there has been no attempt by the community center organizers to compromise throughout this entire ordeal. None. Zero.If Mr. Elzanhty is truly that bent out of shape about how hurt people are by the location choice, then why not accept one of those offers that are three times your investment and just wash your hands with it? If you're worried that your good gesture won't get the press it deserves, then accept The Donald's very public offer and do the press circuit after. If Mr. Elzenaty truly cared how others feel and truly wants to come across as a moderate who's willing to compromise, then why is he holding out for four times the amount? I understand that more money is always better, but he's missing a golden opportunity to show his compassionate statements aren't just lip service, and he's missing a golden opportunity to show that there can be compromise on this particular issue and compromise between moderate Muslims and America.What I'm reading from him, though, and what I'm reading from Rauf is that this particular location is not open for compromise.

I don't understand what there is to compromise. Moving the center isn't a compromise, it's giving in. What are those who want the center moved compromising if the center is built at another site?

Some people really don't get.

I admit I don't. What is the compromise?

You really don't understand the outrage and the symbolism this center at this location represents to millions of Americans. It is HIGHLY inflammatory and offensive to most people in this country. The compromise is everyone is happy. When you offend someone, you compromise to make peace. There are plenty of offers with people bending over backwards to make it worth their while and in reality be a much better location. But they will not listen to anything. This is gonna blow up into something where there is dead people on both sides, there is that much outrage over this. If this group is what they claim (and I know they are not), they would be willing to engage in talks and come to some kind of agreement.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Perhaps I can help.

Jon_Mx - please fill in the blank:

The Park 51 developers would be compromising by moving the site of the proposed cultural center.

The opponents of the proposed cultural center would be compromising by ____________________.

 

[jon_mx]

Perhaps I can help.

Jon_Mx - please fill in the blank:

The Park 51 developers would be compromising by moving the site of the proposed cultural center.

The opponents of the proposed cultural center would be compromising by ____________________.

They get peace and respect. Right now Muslims are pissing off about 70% of the population. It is called public relations.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Perhaps I can help.

Jon_Mx - please fill in the blank:

The Park 51 developers would be compromising by moving the site of the proposed cultural center.

The opponents of the proposed cultural center would be compromising by ____________________.

They get peace and respect. Right now Muslims are pissing off about 70% of the population. It is called public relations.

I'm tempted to keep trying - maybe I could type slower just for you - but somehow I still think you wouldn't be able to realize what you are saying.

Have a good night, pard.

 

[Joe Summer]

Perhaps I can help.

Jon_Mx - please fill in the blank:

The Park 51 developers would be compromising by moving the site of the proposed cultural center.

The opponents of the proposed cultural center would be compromising by ____________________.

They get peace and respect. Right now Muslims are pissing off about 70% of the population. It is called public relations.

Fundamentalist Christianity could use some good public relations right now, too. What ideas have they proposed to earn the respect of Americans?