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My brother says Neil Peart is the greatest rock drummer ever (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
drummer
Footballguy
Just to bump this because Gergo Borlai needs some love:
With Trio A38
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFdSvOA9k9M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McATFZkz0wo
Playing Allan Hodlsworth's Atavachron:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdUxvKYTvWo
And a little solo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00CUv2id7SA
With Trio A38
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFdSvOA9k9M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McATFZkz0wo
Playing Allan Hodlsworth's Atavachron:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdUxvKYTvWo
And a little solo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00CUv2id7SA
Sarnoff
Footballguy
I think Doug Flutie reads this forum. Or, is Tim's brother. Both are possible I guess.
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
drummer
Footballguy
So Flutie is tim's brother?I think Doug Flutie reads this forum. Or, is Tim's brother. Both are possible I guess.
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
The shortest answer is quite often the correct answer.So Flutie is tim's brother?I think Doug Flutie reads this forum. Or, is Tim's brother. Both are possible I guess.
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
[icon]
Insoxicated
Everyone knows Flutie is a Dungeons and Dragons / Magic the Gathering aficionado. This should come as no surprise.I think Doug Flutie reads this forum. Or, is Tim's brother. Both are possible I guess.
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
Officer Pete Malloy
Footballguy
He also said he is 5'9" and 7/8ths. Total liar.I think Doug Flutie reads this forum. Or, is Tim's brother. Both are possible I guess.
I was listening to AM570 this morning, the Jay Mohr sports show. Doug Flutie was the call-in guest. Since Flutie's a drummer, Jay asked him who his favorite drummers were. No hesitation, #1, top of the list, Flutie says "Neal Peart".
drummer
Footballguy
Here is a great track by Kazumi Watanabe. I forget who the drummer is, but his playing is stellar.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWc8nIguM7k
I love the section starting at 3:42. Kazumi's guitar sounds are killer. The drumming is as well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWc8nIguM7k
I love the section starting at 3:42. Kazumi's guitar sounds are killer. The drumming is as well.
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dickey moe
Fingerpicker
drummer
Footballguy
Yeah, while not knocking ?uestlove due to the usual horrid RS listings, I would put the old "Late Night with David Letterman" drummer Steve Jordan over him. Not because of the Late Night parallel. Jordan still is pretty huge. He's part of that New York clique of drummers who brought in hip grooves like Gadd did in the 70's when he was with Stuff.
I bought this album after reading about it, and Jordan kills on it. It's totally something different than what you heard on Late Night. It's a live recording of Steve Khan's Eyewitness band in Japan:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrVxPokaI1E
There is an even better track that I can't find on YouTube, with an opening duet between Jordan and the great Anthony Jackson on contrabass (Rush geeks, sorry. Geddy Lee pales in comparison to Jackson. Lee pales in comparison to a lot of bassists, but of course this thread is about drummers, and we have established Peart's "greatness" while deconstructing it at the same time, which I'll point out in a minute).
The funny thing is that Jordan's all time hero is Ringo Starr. Jordan also recorded Keith Richards' solo album and toured with him. He even copped Charlie Watts' signature drum beat, with the hi hat 'lifted' on the snare backbeats on the 2 and 4. In other words, Watts didn't play the hi-hat in unison with the snare on the 2 and 4. A drum teacher of mine in the Bay Area (who taught David Garibaldi and Terry Bozzio) made fun of that "lack" of technique. Yet Jordan explained that Richards loved it because his style worked with that simple little thing. So what did Jordan do with Richards? He did what Watts did for years, lifting the hi-hat on the 2 and 4.
Of course you don't hear Jordan do that on the Kahn track. Then again, he wasn't displacing beats with Richards like he did with Kahn either.
I want to take this opportunity to give a shout out to a very underrated drummer in Russ Kunkel. Kunkel has a career that is beyond a career. He contributed to the laid back "California style" of drumming in the 70's (along with Jim Keltner and Jeff Porcaro) in the 70's and 80's. Kunkel is an avid surfer, and his style is just flat out cool. He has played with the "Whose who?" of great artists, like James Taylor, Jackson Browne, Carly Simon, etc. His "pocket" is stellar. Here is one example of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mp0rBHhXMs
Note: Somebody thought that a whole lot of Rush geeks "air drumming" to Peart live was cool. Kunkel gets a whole lotta white folk to clap on the 2 and 4 on a classic rock shuffle while singing the lyric. That's doing your job and doing it well. Still not as weird as seeing Rush geek try to sing "The Trees" live. But that's why Dave Matthews has Carter Beauford. You don't care about the crappy lyrics when you have a drummer that can help you forget them.
Here is Kunkel years later with Taylor and Carly Simon live.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3LpikM5TE4&list=PL6E66AAF3DCBEE5F9
BTW, as soon as I hear Peart play a ballad with brushes as lyrical as Kunkel or anybody, he then may get into the conversation as "great".
Small except from Drummerworld on Kunkel:
He also co-wrote this song with Danny "Kooch" Kortchmar and Jackson Browne:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZU-9KoGp8w
The pocket is so huge on this track that you can fit an Android Phablet, George Constanza's exploding wallet, and smuggle an Central American immigrant with room to spare.
Plus he was also was one of Spinal Tap's doomed drummers. His real Rock and Roll life pales even to that.
To call Peart the "Greatest drummer in Rock" is placating guys like Kunkel, Keltner, Hal Blaine, Nigel Olssen, and a great deal of others who play songs. You give Keltner a maraca in one hand and a drumstick in the other, and he can still play his stuff with John Lennon. "YYZ" isn't as classic a drum track as Bernard Purdie's "Rock Steady" with Aretha Franklin. Greg Errico on Sly and the Family Stone's "Hot Fun in the Summertime" groove is what Porcaro used on Toto's "Hold the Line", which Porcaro always credited.
Other FBG guys here have there passions about certain things. Cliff Clavin, although I have given grief to, has my respect for his passion of the NBA. Tim has a plethora of interests that should really be narrowed down into a few, but he sticks his neck out for the FBG swords to hack off. There are a host of others who use this forum to express themselves, and I rarely use it for that. This is the one opportunity to share my passion, and I hope to continue with this in this thread.
This being said, Peart is my Kobe as Kobe is to Cliff.
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drummer
Footballguy
BTW, how can we leave Roger Taylor of Queen out of this conversation?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkekgF8gZpE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkekgF8gZpE
Rove!
Footballguy
what's weird is that I like DT, but can never really get into Rush, despite how similar the band are....
maybe having that extra dynamic of 5 guys instead of 3, or that Lee's musical voice is too dominant ...
timschochet
Footballguy
I went to see Carole King/James Taylor in their "Troubador Reunion" tour a couple of years back, and I believe Kunkel was the drummer. Leland Sklar was the bass player, and Danny Kortchmsr the lead guitarist. A very famous band.
timschochet
Footballguy
Also, now that you mentioned soft rock, you made me think of Steve Gadd and "50 Ways to Leave Your Lover". Where does he rank?
Apple Jack
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
agreed, technically speaking they might be the two best rock drummers. bruford is extremely underrated.in jazz, miles had tony williams and billy cobbham, and they were both powerhouses. they both played with john mclaughlin, in some of the more seminal and interesting (before becoming formulaicly spent) fusion music.
also agree that ringo is taken for granted, he supposedly never missed a beat in the studio. mitch mitchell might have been underrated, just due to being a hendrix sideman, but he had some great big band fills that gave the power trio a much bigger sound than it would have had otherwise.
bernard purdie was a legendary soul, funk, jazz drummer. steely dan could have their pick of the cream of the crop of east coast and west coast studio musicians, and you can youtube a nice bit from the VH1 classic album series, making of aja doc.
elvin jones was a polyrhythm monster and a force of nature with a sound that was the perfect complement to john cotrane's classic, signature "sheets of sound" style.
maybe the greatest rhythm section ever was count basie's, and the engine that drove it was "papa" jo jones (not to be confused with miles regular "philly" joe jones), he was a pioneer and innovator of the drum kit, and keeping time with cymbals, which sonically had the advantage of overall having a very transparent sound so there was no clutter to impede hearing all the other instruments (he used the bass drum for "dropping bombs", as he called them
).the late al jackson, jr. of booker t and MGs is probably criminally underappreciated and not very well known despite being so influential (partly a function of their being the house band for the many soul acts on the memphis-based stax-volt label).
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Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Taylor was good, but one of rock's best? Nah. He cannot touch Peart, Moon, Bonham, Bruford, etc.
DT's music is far busier than Rush's has ever been. Plus, even though a lot of DT songs have catchy melodies, Rush's music is far catchier and instantly likable, so long as Geddy's voice doesn't have you running for the hills.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Kazumi used the Sly & Robbie rythym section sometimes, not sure if that is them though.
Bass – Robbie Shakespeare, Drums – Sly Dunbar
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drummer
Footballguy
If you have read through this thread, you would had seen links to Gadd and "50 Ways" all over it, as well as his rank from other posters than I.
timschochet
Footballguy
I DID see Gadd, but I didn't make the connection to "50 Ways"- I knew there was supposed to be a great drummer on that song, but I didn't remember his name, so I looked it up.
drummer
Footballguy
Queen to me what big rock is all about. Epic, operatic, glam, and bombastic with a huge drum sound. Taylor has chops. You just don't hear them much on the album tracks. Live, he is right there with Mercury who some consider one of the greatest rock frontmen (if not THE greatest) playing through all the changes and dynamics of Queen's music.Taylor was good, but one of rock's best? Nah. He cannot touch Peart, Moon, Bonham, Bruford, etc.
DT's music is far busier than Rush's has ever been. Plus, even though a lot of DT songs have catchy melodies, Rush's music is far catchier and instantly likable, so long as Geddy's voice doesn't have you running for the hills.
But again, we're talking about a drummer who known for playing in only one band. That band just happens to be Queen. Where Queen slots on a list we'll leave up to others than Rolling Stone.
LarryAllen'sJockstrap
Footballguy
My personal fav of all time is Jimmy Chamberlin. He grew up playing jazz and was clasically trained. When he joined the SP, he brought a complexity and wide range of technique to a genre where most drummers were straight ahead 2/4 rock sitting quietly underneath layers of screaming, feedback laced guitar rythms and solos.
Another truly great and underrated drummer is Peter Erskine. He's jazz and swing, having played with the Weather Report and now mostly teaching.
My opinion on Peart is this. He is a great drummer. A true monster behind the kit; mad chops, perfect timing and is extremely complex. The only negative thing I have to say is that while both he and Geddy Lee are savants on their instruments, I'm not sure their blend and direction of style were meant to go together. It's like having Joe Montana and Jerry Rice, but the two not always being on the same page. Sometimes I get the feeling watching Rush you see Geddy and Alex trying to "jam", whereas Peart always feels like this antiseptic machine back there just killing it, but not soo much playing with the other two.
Another truly great and underrated drummer is Peter Erskine. He's jazz and swing, having played with the Weather Report and now mostly teaching.
My opinion on Peart is this. He is a great drummer. A true monster behind the kit; mad chops, perfect timing and is extremely complex. The only negative thing I have to say is that while both he and Geddy Lee are savants on their instruments, I'm not sure their blend and direction of style were meant to go together. It's like having Joe Montana and Jerry Rice, but the two not always being on the same page. Sometimes I get the feeling watching Rush you see Geddy and Alex trying to "jam", whereas Peart always feels like this antiseptic machine back there just killing it, but not soo much playing with the other two.
LarryAllen'sJockstrap
Footballguy
I highly recomend you YouTube "Booker T and the MGs - Time is Tight". The first video should be a version of the song live from 1970. Jackson and their bassist, Donald "Duck" Dunn just jam through some sections like I;ve never seen a rythm duo work,agreed, technically speaking they might be the two best rock drummers. bruford is extremely underrated.in jazz, miles had tony williams and billy cobbham, and they were both powerhouses. they both played with john mclaughlin, in some of the more seminal and interesting (before becoming formulaicly spent) fusion music.
also agree that ringo is taken for granted, he supposedly never missed a beat in the studio. mitch mitchell might have been underrated, just due to being a hendrix sideman, but he had some great big band fills that gave the power trio a much bigger sound than it would have had otherwise.
bernard purdie was a legendary soul, funk, jazz drummer. steely dan could have their pick of the cream of the crop of east coast and west coast studio musicians, and you can youtube a nice bit from the VH1 classic album series, making of aja doc.
elvin jones was a polyrhythm monster and a force of nature with a sound that was the perfect complement to john cotrane's classic, signature "sheets of sound" style.
maybe the greatest rhythm section ever was count basie's, and the engine that drove it was "papa" jo jones (not to be confused with miles regular "philly" joe jones), he was a pioneer and innovator of the drum kit, and keeping time with cymbals, which sonically had the advantage of overall having a very transparent sound so there was no clutter to impede hearing all the other instruments (he used the bass drum for "dropping bombs", as he called them
the late al jackson, jr. of booker t and MGs is probably criminally underappreciated and not very well known despite being so influential (partly a function of their being the house band for the many soul acts on the memphis-based stax-volt label).
drummer
Footballguy
That drum part a was mimicked by a lot of older drummers I knew when I was a kid, but some of them really didn't play it properly, and neither did I lol. It sounds easy but it can be a bit tricky. That's the beauty of it. It was really innovative at the time, and still is.timschochet said:
Now there is a key word when it comes to establishing "Great": innovation. To me, that's where it lies, how innovative a musician is when it comes to music. Going back to Peart, yes he was very innovative with Rush. It gets harder to innovate with one band your entire career though. At one point I just stopped hearing anything new from him.
Gadd is one of the most influential drummers due to his innovation. "50 Ways" is a great example of that. A lot of what he does is rudiment based, like taking a simple sticking and expanding it to sound like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcVVTe1Fhvw
Years later, he is still asked about it, even at a drummer's convention lol.
Here is the famous Chick Corea track, "Nite Sprite" with Gadd on it. Dave Weckl was so influenced by Gadd that he was in a band in his early days named Nite Sprite. It's a classic electric jazz (whatever you do, don't say 'Jazz-fusion' at parties. You'll have a whole lotta this
directed at you) track that Gadd is insane on:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NEPqYCkrHM
Note: Anthony Jackson is on contrabass on this too.
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Fiddles
Footballguy
available light off prestoYeah, while not knocking ?uestlove due to the usual horrid RS listings, I would put the old "Late Night with David Letterman" drummer Steve Jordan over him. Not because of the Late Night parallel. Jordan still is pretty huge. He's part of that New York clique of drummers who brought in hip grooves like Gadd did in the 70's when he was with Stuff.
I bought this album after reading about it, and Jordan kills on it. It's totally something different than what you heard on Late Night. It's a live recording of Steve Khan's Eyewitness band in Japan:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrVxPokaI1E
There is an even better track that I can't find on YouTube, with an opening duet between Jordan and the great Anthony Jackson on contrabass (Rush geeks, sorry. Geddy Lee pales in comparison to Jackson. Lee pales in comparison to a lot of bassists, but of course this thread is about drummers, and we have established Peart's "greatness" while deconstructing it at the same time, which I'll point out in a minute).
The funny thing is that Jordan's all time hero is Ringo Starr. Jordan also recorded Keith Richards' solo album and toured with him. He even copped Charlie Watts' signature drum beat, with the hi hat 'lifted' on the snare backbeats on the 2 and 4. In other words, Watts didn't play the hi-hat in unison with the snare on the 2 and 4. A drum teacher of mine in the Bay Area (who taught David Garibaldi and Terry Bozzio) made fun of that "lack" of technique. Yet Jordan explained that Richards loved it because his style worked with that simple little thing. So what did Jordan do with Richards? He did what Watts did for years, lifting the hi-hat on the 2 and 4.
Of course you don't hear Jordan do that on the Kahn track. Then again, he wasn't displacing beats with Richards like he did with Kahn either.
I want to take this opportunity to give a shout out to a very underrated drummer in Russ Kunkel. Kunkel has a career that is beyond a career. He contributed to the laid back "California style" of drumming in the 70's (along with Jim Keltner and Jeff Porcaro) in the 70's and 80's. Kunkel is an avid surfer, and his style is just flat out cool. He has played with the "Whose who?" of great artists, like James Taylor, Jackson Browne, Carly Simon, etc. His "pocket" is stellar. Here is one example of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mp0rBHhXMs
Note: Somebody thought that a whole lot of Rush geeks "air drumming" to Peart live was cool. Kunkel gets a whole lotta white folk to clap on the 2 and 4 on a classic rock shuffle while singing the lyric. That's doing your job and doing it well. Still not as weird as seeing Rush geek try to sing "The Trees" live. But that's why Dave Matthews has Carter Beauford. You don't care about the crappy lyrics when you have a drummer that can help you forget them.
Here is Kunkel years later with Taylor and Carly Simon live.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3LpikM5TE4&list=PL6E66AAF3DCBEE5F9
BTW, as soon as I hear Peart play a ballad with brushes as lyrical as Kunkel or anybody, he then may get into the conversation as "great".
Small except from Drummerworld on Kunkel:
He also co-wrote this song with Danny "Kooch" Kortchmar and Jackson Browne:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZU-9KoGp8w
The pocket is so huge on this track that you can fit an Android Phablet, George Constanza's exploding wallet, and smuggle an Central American immigrant with room to spare.
Plus he was also was one of Spinal Tap's doomed drummers. His real Rock and Roll life pales even to that.
To call Peart the "Greatest drummer in Rock" is placating guys like Kunkel, Keltner, Hal Blaine, Nigel Olssen, and a great deal of others who play songs. You give Keltner a maraca in one hand and a drumstick in the other, and he can still play his stuff with John Lennon. "YYZ" isn't as classic a drum track as Bernard Purdie's "Rock Steady" with Aretha Franklin. Greg Errico on Sly and the Family Stone's "Hot Fun in the Summertime" groove is what Porcaro used on Toto's "Hold the Line", which Porcaro always credited.
Other FBG guys here have there passions about certain things. Cliff Clavin, although I have given grief to, has my respect for his passion of the NBA. Tim has a plethora of interests that should really be narrowed down into a few, but he sticks his neck out for the FBG swords to hack off. There are a host of others who use this forum to express themselves, and I rarely use it for that. This is the one opportunity to share my passion, and I hope to continue with this in this thread.
This being said, Peart is my Kobe as Kobe is to Cliff.
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
The movie Round Midnight (sax legend Dexter Gordon playing a mash up of jazz giants Lester Young and Bud Powell) has an Oscar winning score by Herbie Hancock, featuring some rare footage in the New York scenes of Tony Williams (the movie also has many night club songs in the Paris scenes with fellow Miles Davis second great quintet in the sixties members Ron Carter and Wayne Shortter, as well as circa In a Silent Way/#####es Brew and Mahavishnu Orchestra leader John McLaughlin, etc.).
Highly recommended.
Highly recommended.
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daddo39
Footballguy
Don't agree with this. A lot of people think Jimi is the best guitarist ever, doesn't mean he played with the best drummer or bassist. 'Best' is very subjective depending on musical taste, hell i saw one poll that had Cobain listed as the 7th best guitarist of all time(and I'm still laughing). That aside, Peart is my favorite rock drummer ever.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Collins to me is a lot like Prince; much better at their instrument than people know because of the vocal fame.
NCCommish
Footballguy
I think the schmaltz of some of his big hits is the problem for him really. Anyone who is more than a casual music fan should know Prince can play the hell out a guitar.
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
That's true. It's a little too "elevator music" so the drum playing ability seems not to match.NCCommish said:
ConstruxBoy
Kate's Daddy
Hell, even Business Insider knows I guess: http://www.businessinsider.com/prince-rock-hall-solo-2013-10NCCommish said:
When you think of the best drummer, the criteria should be most recognizable drumming to the masses. There can only be one choice. It is the endearing cowbell sound created by the Blue Oyster Cult drummer and winner, Albert Buchard. Honorable mention goes to when the levi breaks(zepp).
Todem
Footballguy
Yeah....so?
He writes incredible drum patterns, lines,.....just incredible.
Write them, create them.....then talk about how easy it is.
I too am a fellow musician. Guitarist. Been playing almost my entire life. Also play the drums and bass. But guitar is my main gig. Lifeson is my all time favorite player.....not the best by far....but my favorite in terms of approach, emotion, chords and most importantly.......sound.
It is all subjective. So many incredible players out there in the world.
My all time drummers?
1. Neil Peart
2. Gavin Harrison
3. Carter Beuford
4. John Bonham
5. Mike Portnoy
6. Stuart Copeland
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timschochet
Footballguy
What do you guys think of DJ Bonebrake?
bigbottom
Footballguy
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Phil Collins was great in his heyday. And fan of old school Genesis will testify to that.
And he basically created and popularized that gated drum sound - first hear on Peter Gabriel's Melt record, and then famously used in In the Air Tonight (that super famous drum fill is that gated sound).
And he basically created and popularized that gated drum sound - first hear on Peter Gabriel's Melt record, and then famously used in In the Air Tonight (that super famous drum fill is that gated sound).
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Apple Jack
Footballguy
I can't stand that "gated" sound. Hate it. But Collins was a total badass, and in spite of being a Rush fan, I'd take him over Peart eight days a week. Peart gets unbearable. That tense stranglehold thing is just brutal after awhile. I do love some Rush, but in the pantheon of drummers, he's not in my top 5. He's just wound way too tight for my tastes.
Brand X is a good primer for Phil's playing. And obviously Selling England By the Pound and the '73 live release.
Brand X is a good primer for Phil's playing. And obviously Selling England By the Pound and the '73 live release.
dhockster
Footballguy
I don't know about how great their drumming is, but Phil and Chester Thompson playing drums together on Genesis tours was pretty nice to listen to.
Apple Jack
Footballguy
Warrior
Footballguy
dhockster
Footballguy
Did Bruford tour with Genesis in the 70's? I didn't get into Genesis until the early 80's. I love Bruford.
Apple Jack
Footballguy
There's stuff out there that they did together with Brand X. But yes, Bruford did the first post-PG tour with them.
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