*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (3 Viewers)

[Cliff Clavin]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

The difference last night was unreal. Wade left in the 3rd with the Heat down 75-63. Comes back in when the Heat are up 87-84 and they almost blow it.

Fantastic game. Glad to see Spol took Haslem out and put the Birdman back in.

 

[got_nugs]

Tim Duncan entered the game illegally for the final possession of regulation after the referees reviewed Ray Allen's game-tying three-pointer in Game 6.

Reviews aren't technically a dead ball situation, meaning substitutions cannot be made without a timeout. The San Antonio Spurs were out of timeouts, meaning they couldn't make a substitution or advance the ball.

Hmmmm

 

[got_nugs]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

The difference last night was unreal. Wade left in the 3rd with the Heat down 75-63. Comes back in when the Heat are up 87-84 and they almost blow it.

Fantastic game. Glad to see Spol took Haslem out and put the Birdman back in.

Haslem was in to guard Duncan which he does better than anyone else on the heat.

Haslem out-Duncan 25 1st half points.

 

[sho nuff]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

I was pretty indifferent to Lebron, but his constant whining has put me into the hater camper. If you're going to throw your hands in the air and jump up and down like a little girl, it better be a clear foul. The one close to end where he was on the break and Green stripped the ball and the ball went off his body is a common example.

Lebron's behavior on the court is a disgrace for someone with his size and talent. Has to make even the most die-hard Heat fan cringe to see a 250-pound man acting like he's been shot by a sniper when a point guard brushes past him.

I dunno..not a Heat fan but on that play it looked to me as though Green used his hand to keep Lebron's left hand from stabilizing the ball after Green had stripped it from his right hand, which usually is a foul. It wasn't called, just like the non call on the foul after the Manu crab dribble afterwards and the Bosh block. I felt the reffing was horrendous but overall the bad calls were fairly evenly distributed.

Agreed...and growing up playing basketball...what is one of the fundamentals they teach you...don't slap down at the ball...because 9 times out of 10, even if you get the ball, they will call you for the foul.

I think it ended up being a good no-call, just as it was a good no-call on the ball being taken from Manu.

 

[NutterButter]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

Yeah, although in fairness Duncan does the same thing. For some reason, it appears Lebron doesn't quite get the "Jordan" treatment. It's as if the refs still are in that "earn it" stage. And you wonder if they will ever give him that kind of respect if he keeps whining all the time. I'm as big of a Lebron fan as there is, but I think his antics every time he doesn't get a foul called are a little ridiculous.

Not sure I've ever seen Duncan sprint down the court b/c he didn't get a call like Lebron did during the Indiana series.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

The difference last night was unreal. Wade left in the 3rd with the Heat down 75-63. Comes back in when the Heat are up 87-84 and they almost blow it.

Fantastic game. Glad to see Spol took Haslem out and put the Birdman back in.

Haslem was in to guard Duncan which he does better than anyone else on the heat.

Haslem out-Duncan 25 1st half points.

Only 5 of those 1st half points came when Andersen was on the floor.

 

[Jayrod]

My thoughts from the game last night:

-Pop said it was a game of mistakes and that is dead on in my opinion. Those late missed FT's were killers.

-The Spurs wasted a great game by Timmy because Parker struggled to get going, Green couldn't get going, Splitter just sucks and Manu absolutely killed them.

-That said, Miami should have lost. It took two miracle 2nd chance 3's just to force overtime. LeBron had fallen apart and was saved when Miller shoveled that rebound to him. I give him credit to take that 3, but he had just missed a good look at a 3 after committing a big turnover.

-I cringe every time Splitter is on the floor. He is made of paper on both ends and does not belong out there with the Heat's athleticism.

-Boris Diow, WTF?!? Who is this guy and why is he the teams 6 man? Unreal for a man of his girth.

-Ray Allen is a gamer and was a huge pickup for the Heat this offseason. He is the epitome of success begats success. If they aren't the clear cut favorite in the preseason, he doesn't sign with them and they don't win that game last night.

-Did I mention that Splitter sucks?

 

[sho nuff]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

I was pretty indifferent to Lebron, but his constant whining has put me into the hater camper. If you're going to throw your hands in the air and jump up and down like a little girl, it better be a clear foul. The one close to end where he was on the break and Green stripped the ball and the ball went off his body is a common example.

Lebron's behavior on the court is a disgrace for someone with his size and talent. Has to make even the most die-hard Heat fan cringe to see a 250-pound man acting like he's been shot by a sniper when a point guard brushes past him.

I dunno..not a Heat fan but on that play it looked to me as though Green used his hand to keep Lebron's left hand from stabilizing the ball after Green had stripped it from his right hand, which usually is a foul. It wasn't called, just like the non call on the foul after the Manu crab dribble afterwards and the Bosh block. I felt the reffing was horrendous but overall the bad calls were fairly evenly distributed.

It didn't matter in the end since the Spurs got the ball on the possession but James clearly fouled Green with the clear out elbow prior to Green being able to do anything defensively.

Umm...no.

 

[NutterButter]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

I was pretty indifferent to Lebron, but his constant whining has put me into the hater camper. If you're going to throw your hands in the air and jump up and down like a little girl, it better be a clear foul. The one close to end where he was on the break and Green stripped the ball and the ball went off his body is a common example.

Lebron's behavior on the court is a disgrace for someone with his size and talent. Has to make even the most die-hard Heat fan cringe to see a 250-pound man acting like he's been shot by a sniper when a point guard brushes past him.

I dunno..not a Heat fan but on that play it looked to me as though Green used his hand to keep Lebron's left hand from stabilizing the ball after Green had stripped it from his right hand, which usually is a foul. It wasn't called, just like the non call on the foul after the Manu crab dribble afterwards and the Bosh block. I felt the reffing was horrendous but overall the bad calls were fairly evenly distributed.

It didn't matter in the end since the Spurs got the ball on the possession but James clearly fouled Green with the clear out elbow prior to Green being able to do anything defensively.

Umm...no.

There should be no foul called any time of the game on a play like that. Lebron initiated any body contact and Green contacted all ball unlike Allen who got a lot of arm. Then Princess James jumps up and down like he was brutally hacked.

 

[bryhamm]

Tim Duncan entered the game illegally for the final possession of regulation after the referees reviewed Ray Allen's game-tying three-pointer in Game 6.

Reviews aren't technically a dead ball situation, meaning substitutions cannot be made without a timeout. The San Antonio Spurs were out of timeouts, meaning they couldn't make a substitution or advance the ball.

Hmmmm

I wondered about this when it was done. I didn't know whether it was allowed or not, but I remember thinking ... well, this will let SA sub Duncan back in.

 

[sho nuff]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

I was pretty indifferent to Lebron, but his constant whining has put me into the hater camper. If you're going to throw your hands in the air and jump up and down like a little girl, it better be a clear foul. The one close to end where he was on the break and Green stripped the ball and the ball went off his body is a common example.

Lebron's behavior on the court is a disgrace for someone with his size and talent. Has to make even the most die-hard Heat fan cringe to see a 250-pound man acting like he's been shot by a sniper when a point guard brushes past him.

I dunno..not a Heat fan but on that play it looked to me as though Green used his hand to keep Lebron's left hand from stabilizing the ball after Green had stripped it from his right hand, which usually is a foul. It wasn't called, just like the non call on the foul after the Manu crab dribble afterwards and the Bosh block. I felt the reffing was horrendous but overall the bad calls were fairly evenly distributed.

It didn't matter in the end since the Spurs got the ball on the possession but James clearly fouled Green with the clear out elbow prior to Green being able to do anything defensively.

Umm...no.

There should be no foul called any time of the game on a play like that. Lebron initiated any body contact and Green contacted all ball unlike Allen who got a lot of arm. Then Princess James jumps up and down like he was brutally hacked.

To claim that Green contacted all ball is not quite true either.

There was contact on the body and James' arm.

Allen got some arm and mostly ball as well.

Both were good non-calls.

 

[tommyGunZ]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

 

[Ghost Rider]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

Green was moving sideways and would have fallen to the ground the way he did either way. Bosh's block made him fall harder, that's it.

 

[sho nuff]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

Manu being stripped was not a clear foul.

And how can you say he did not let Green come down? He was falling away from the court and Bosh did nothing to stop that. That rule would not apply there.

And if we want to get picky...check the screen that freed up Green.

 

[Vykng]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

And if we want to get picky...check the screen that freed up Green.

Was just about to post this.

 

[sho nuff]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

And if we want to get picky...check the screen that freed up Green.

Was just about to post this.

That said..there are a few calls I just don't see NBA refs making anymore.

Over the back...so many times a guy comes in to crash the boards right on top of others with nothing.

Terrible screens (as seen in that play)

And guys hanging on the rim when there is no danger in coming down (James is especially guilty of that one)

 

[Vykng]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

And if we want to get picky...check the screen that freed up Green.

Was just about to post this.

That said..there are a few calls I just don't see NBA refs making anymore.

Over the back...so many times a guy comes in to crash the boards right on top of others with nothing.

Terrible screens (as seen in that play)

And guys hanging on the rim when there is no danger in coming down (James is especially guilty of that one)

I think the moving screen is still called often but the other two I agree with. Very rarely do I see "over the back" being called and I never see hanging on the rim anymore.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Tim Duncan entered the game illegally for the final possession of regulation after the referees reviewed Ray Allen's game-tying three-pointer in Game 6.

Reviews aren't technically a dead ball situation, meaning substitutions cannot be made without a timeout. The San Antonio Spurs were out of timeouts, meaning they couldn't make a substitution or advance the ball.

Hmmmm

I was thinking that last night but figured I was wrong.

 

[sho nuff]

Over the back is one that kills me. Though, probably because I was never the tallest guy...but had enough back to get in good position and would hate the bigger guys or people crashing coming over on my shoulders and neck at times.

Now, part of the non-calls also seem to be that nobody really boxes out much anymore either.

 

[sho nuff]

Tim Duncan entered the game illegally for the final possession of regulation after the referees reviewed Ray Allen's game-tying three-pointer in Game 6.

Reviews aren't technically a dead ball situation, meaning substitutions cannot be made without a timeout. The San Antonio Spurs were out of timeouts, meaning they couldn't make a substitution or advance the ball.

Hmmmm

Neal came in too I think.

 

[Vykng]

Over the back is one that kills me. Though, probably because I was never the tallest guy...but had enough back to get in good position and would hate the bigger guys or people crashing coming over on my shoulders and neck at times.

Now, part of the non-calls also seem to be that nobody really boxes out much anymore either.

Being 6'8" I was one of the guys that just took the ball over the guy boxing me out. Rarely called for over the back as I had a long reach and could stay straight up. Pretty unfair though.

 

[Abraham]

I don't understand the whole "no way San Antonio recovers from that!" These guys are professionals. They aren't playing 2 games a day in a Rec league. Wow, I can't believe the heat recovered in games 2, 4, and 6 after such devastating losses. Can't believe the spurs recovered in games 3 and 5 either. Wow!

 

[hxperson]

I don't understand the whole "no way San Antonio recovers from that!" These guys are professionals. They aren't playing 2 games a day in a Rec league. Wow, I can't believe the heat recovered in games 2, 4, and 6 after such devastating losses. Can't believe the spurs recovered in games 3 and 5 either. Wow!

I'm actually having a hard time seeing the Spurs lose game 7 given the way things played out. They had the Heat on the ropes and made a few mistakes that let the Heat back in. They know they can beat the Heat on their home turf in a close out game, and have the intelligence and discipline to fix their mistakes.

 

[Abraham]

I don't understand the whole "no way San Antonio recovers from that!" These guys are professionals. They aren't playing 2 games a day in a Rec league. Wow, I can't believe the heat recovered in games 2, 4, and 6 after such devastating losses. Can't believe the spurs recovered in games 3 and 5 either. Wow!

I think would have been awesome shtick if Pop had left Duncan, Parker, Ginobili, and Leonard in San Antonio for a couple extra days and didn't fly them in until Game 7.

. That would have been a hoot. I think fans make up the whole "lingering loss" thing and everytone it plays out that way they say "see, told you!" But it's overblown. As soon as the game starts these guys aren't thinking "man, I wish we had covered ray Allen better...we are about to get our heads bashed in" any more than the heat are thinking "it's in the bag!"

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

I don't understand the whole "no way San Antonio recovers from that!" These guys are professionals. They aren't playing 2 games a day in a Rec league. Wow, I can't believe the heat recovered in games 2, 4, and 6 after such devastating losses. Can't believe the spurs recovered in games 3 and 5 either. Wow!

I think would have been awesome shtick if Pop had left Duncan, Parker, Ginobili, and Leonard in San Antonio for a couple extra days and didn't fly them in until Game 7.

. That would have been a hoot.I think fans make up the whole "lingering loss" thing and everytone it plays out that way they say "see, told you!" But it's overblown. As soon as the game starts these guys aren't thinking "man, I wish we had covered ray Allen better...we are about to get our heads bashed in" any more than the heat are thinking "it's in the bag!"

Disagree Abe. I don't think they can pretend that was just any other game or loss. The yellow ropes were brought out. 25 seconds away from another title and then it gets choked/ripped away. Hell I feel crushed sitting at my stupid desk job today. Would much rather they had lost by 25 last night.

"I have no clue how we're going to be re-energized. I'm devastated." Manu Ginobili

 

[Abraham]

Maybe the reenergizing can begin with Manu being sent home. Some of the spurs fans I know are so angry with him today that it doesn't even matter how long he has been good for them.

 

[Gr00vus]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

Those stats are amazing.

Wade has seemed pretty lazy on defense at times. I have noticed a few occasions where he just doesn't get set on defense fast enough.

Wade has been awful on defense most of these playoffs. I've been watching him a bit off the ball and he just sort of wanders around, half the time I don't think he knows where his man is - or even who his man is. The rest of the guards for the Heat haven't been much better.

 

[Gr00vus]

Am I missing something? What was the purpose of having Splitter on the court and Parker on the bench?

3 on 5 against MIA isn't going to work very often.

Parker's not particularly effective with 1.9 seconds down 3. He generally creates all his own shots, not really a catch-and-shoot guy.

Splitter isn't especially useful either, but he is a bit of a roadblock around the free-throw line and might've been able to screen someone free for a good look.

Yeah that was the idea as far as I could tell, get a couple of big bodies in to set picks to free up Green. It almost worked if not for a great play by Bosh. Bosh had a fantastic game last night even if the stats don't scream it.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

 

[Gr00vus]

Too bad TNT didn't have this game. Could you imagine Kenny Smith's incoherent babbling right now?

I'd like to reiterate my promise to FFA: if I win the Powerball before next June, I'm hiring Ernie, Sir Charles, and Jet to do their studio show in my great room during the NBA Finals. And y'all are invited.

Aren't they on the NBATV postgame show/gametime?

 

[NutterButter]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

We don't. Its the only game he played well.

 

[sporthenry]

After watching the replay of the last shot of OT from the camera angle in the corner by the shot about 20 times... I don't think that was a foul. Bosh definitely did not foul with his arms - his left hand was all ball and smothered the shot, and he puled his right arm back to avoid contact. Bosh did make contact with his left hip on Green's waist, but I don't think that affected the shot. That sort of contact goes uncalled all the time on the block.

Green was out of control on the play, which makes the refs reluctant to call a foul regardless of the game situation. Green was running down a long lead pass and didn't square up his torso or get the ball in good shooting position - he kindasorta heaved it from his shoulder.

ETA: And Bosh's block of Parker's jumper with 0:31 left in OT was fantastic. Bad switch leaving Bosh on Parker, lots of open space, but Bosh was patient, waited until Parker launched for his shot, and blocked it clean.

The bold is completely irrelevant, as you are well aware that far more contact is allowed down low than on jump shooters around the arc. I only rewound it a couple of times, and while I agree that Bosh got all ball up top, that still doesn't mean he can essentially tackle Green below. Bosh didn't give Green space to come down. It was clearly a foul.

Manu getting stripped with ~ 3+ seconds left was also a clear foul. Overall, the calls balanced out on the stat sheet, but those two were monster, game deciding non-calls. San Antonio can't blame the refs entirely IMO since Kawhi and Manu choked at the line late, but they definitely have beef.

Agree regarding Bosh's fantastic block on Parker.

I brought up the post contact stuff because my newest critic, sporthenry, is one of those dodes who will look up the rulebook and cut-and-paste a section of it to argue their side. I was attempting to preemptively shift the context of the discussion to the far more relevant what does/doesn't get called in that situation versus what the rulebook says.

Green wasn't squared up for the shot, and he didn't jump straight up. He was running down a lead pass and he went sideways, launching an awkward shot. He was heading towards the baseline and wasn't going to land where he jumped whether Bosh was all over him or if Bosh fell down and left him unguarded. Hard to say Bosh didn't give Green a chance to land since Bosh wasn't occupying Green's landing area.

If Green had been able to gather himself and push straight up on his jump, he might have gotten the foul call. Not faulting Green too much here - it was actually pretty remarkable that he ran down the pass and executed a shot attempt. Duncan saw no one was open so he threw it to the only open space where a 3PT shot could have been taken from, and Green almost got it. But Bosh made a great recovery on that play, too.

That pesky rulebook. I forgot the 4Q edition. Or the one that says if the shooter isn't straight up, he loses the protection.

There were tons of missed calls both ways. If the refs didn't miss the calls against LeBron, the Heat might win in regulation. But don't act like it wasn't a foul.

 

[NutterButter]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

Pretty sad when you can only bring up one game he has been good in (he was actually decent in game 5 as well). Wade is nothing more than a glorified role player at this point. Still trying to figure out what that role is though.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

Those stats are amazing.

Wade has seemed pretty lazy on defense at times. I have noticed a few occasions where he just doesn't get set on defense fast enough.

Remember when the LeBron narrative was that he "makes everyone around him better"?

 

[Gr00vus]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

LeBron had a great game overall, but that last 2 minutes or so of the 4th was pretty ragged for him. If Allen doesn't hit that three I wonder what people are talking about today.

And can Ray Allen shoot or what? Talk about under appreciated - I think people have totally forgotten what that guy did in Milwaukee and Seattle, before he decided to play a supporting character. It's almost a shame that Wade is there, because Allen could do a lot of damage on offense getting fed by LeBron if he got more minutes. Probably would make the offense work a bit better overall too.

 

[ArbyMelt]

I can't believe people think Bosh fouled Green. I'm watching the replay over and over. He jumps straight up and gets all ball, hardly any body contact. Watch at 0:40 on this video. Both players are entitled to their space jumping straight up.

Oh and that moving pick was 10 times worse than what they called on Lebron in a prior series to foul him out

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/chris-bosh-blocks-danny-green-game-tying-three-051815607.html

 

[TobiasFunke]

Agreed. Lebron is a much much different player when wade isn't on the floor these days.

Heat have been outscored by 56 in the Finals with LeBron and Wade on the court together. With LeBron and no Wade Miami is +48

Welcome back!

This Wade thing is a real problem for the Heat and Spoelstra for Game 7 and for next year, although obviously they care much more about the former than the latter at the moment. Here's the numbers in ORTG/DRTG form for the series:

O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/Wade: 100.8/112.7 ... O-Rtg/D-Rtg with LBJ/NO Wade: 131.7/89.5

Wade's presence on the floor is killing the Heat's spacing. That much seems clear. But it also seems to be creating problems on the defensive end, which I can't explain. Anyone have any thoughts

Those stats are amazing.

Wade has seemed pretty lazy on defense at times. I have noticed a few occasions where he just doesn't get set on defense fast enough.

Remember when the LeBron narrative was that he "makes everyone around him better"?

Trying a little too hard there, Gunz.

All of those numbers come with LeBron on the floor, so they don't say anything one way or another about LeBron's overall impact on his teammates. It's not like when Wade is on the bench they only run four guys out there.

 

[tommyGunZ]

At least Game 6 crushed the Danny Green for Finals MVP nonsense.

I'll stick with my LeBron MVP prediction.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

LeBron had a great game overall, but that last 2 minutes or so of the 4th was pretty ragged for him. If Allen doesn't hit that three I wonder what people are talking about today.

I know exactly what we'd be talking about. And it was OH SO CLOSE!

 

[got_nugs]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

LeBron had a great game overall, but that last 2 minutes or so of the 4th was pretty ragged for him. If Allen doesn't hit that three I wonder what people are talking about today.

And can Ray Allen shoot or what? Talk about under appreciated - I think people have totally forgotten what that guy did in Milwaukee and Seattle, before he decided to play a supporting character. It's almost a shame that Wade is there, because Allen could do a lot of damage on offense getting fed by LeBron if he got more minutes. Probably would make the offense work a bit better overall too.

It's AMAZING to me how the dialog changes with the bounce of 1 ball. If the LeBron 3 missed shot bounces further away from Bosh, maybe he doesn't get the board, maybe Ray doesn't make the shot. Your commentary would be getting much more traction in what otherwise would be the exact same game up to that point.

But hey, that's sport.

 

[sporthenry]

That pesky rulebook. I forgot the 4Q edition. Or the one that says if the shooter isn't straight up, he loses the protection.

There were tons of missed calls both ways. If the refs didn't miss the calls against LeBron, the Heat might win in regulation. But don't act like it wasn't a foul.

I'm not acting. It's a judgement call, and a difficult one. I had to watch it about 20 times from an ideal replay angle to decide. Your judgement is different from mine. But it had nothing to do with when in the game the play happened, and I'm giving my honest answer.If you're going to make up #### and accuse me of being disingenuous because I disagree with your interpretation of a foul call, that's on you.

What did I make up?

 

[Ghost Rider]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

Because for the money he is making (see: the same as Lebron), it is more than reasonable to expect him to play really well in more than one out of six Finals games.

 

[Gr00vus]

At least Game 6 crushed the Danny Green for Finals MVP nonsense.

I'll stick with my LeBron MVP prediction.

I figure he and Duncan are the only two left you could pin it on unless someone else goes infinitely nuts in game 7.

 

[Gr00vus]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

LeBron had a great game overall, but that last 2 minutes or so of the 4th was pretty ragged for him. If Allen doesn't hit that three I wonder what people are talking about today.

And can Ray Allen shoot or what? Talk about under appreciated - I think people have totally forgotten what that guy did in Milwaukee and Seattle, before he decided to play a supporting character. It's almost a shame that Wade is there, because Allen could do a lot of damage on offense getting fed by LeBron if he got more minutes. Probably would make the offense work a bit better overall too.

It's AMAZING to me how the dialog changes with the bounce of 1 ball. If the LeBron 3 missed shot bounces further away from Bosh, maybe he doesn't get the board, maybe Ray doesn't make the shot. Your commentary would be getting much more traction in what otherwise would be the exact same game up to that point.

But hey, that's sport.

Don't get me wrong, that was a fantastic game by James - they don't get to the point where they have the lead inside of 3 minutes (to subsequently blow and then regain) without him. It's like he just had a 2 minute brain cramp there. If it had ended that way he'd be getting skewered right now. Instead we're talking about the Spurs abandoning their execution, missing free throws, mental exhaustion and questionable decisions by Pop, who has overall orchestrated a magnificent game plan and made great adjustments for the bulk of the series.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

Pretty sad when you can only bring up one game he has been good in (he was actually decent in game 5 as well). Wade is nothing more than a glorified role player at this point. Still trying to figure out what that role is though.

He was excellent the majority of the season. This knee that got injured towards the end of the streak is a problem. Plus he banged his knee and missed the beginning of the 3rd last night as well. He probably shouldn't have been out there in the 4th/ot at all though with how the other unit was playing. I expect him to get some treatment and have 3 -5 steals and 18-25 tomorrow night. His dribble around pull up 2 without lebron touching the ball in ot was inexcusable though.

 

[got_nugs]

Anyone listen to Cowherd regularly? Has he always been this much of a Lebron homer? I usually like him but this is a little unbearable.

LeBron had a great game overall, but that last 2 minutes or so of the 4th was pretty ragged for him. If Allen doesn't hit that three I wonder what people are talking about today.

And can Ray Allen shoot or what? Talk about under appreciated - I think people have totally forgotten what that guy did in Milwaukee and Seattle, before he decided to play a supporting character. It's almost a shame that Wade is there, because Allen could do a lot of damage on offense getting fed by LeBron if he got more minutes. Probably would make the offense work a bit better overall too.

It's AMAZING to me how the dialog changes with the bounce of 1 ball. If the LeBron 3 missed shot bounces further away from Bosh, maybe he doesn't get the board, maybe Ray doesn't make the shot. Your commentary would be getting much more traction in what otherwise would be the exact same game up to that point.

But hey, that's sport.

Don't get me wrong, that was a fantastic game by James - they don't get to the point where they have the lead inside of 3 minutes (to subsequently blow and then regain) without him. It's like he just had a 2 minute brain cramp there. If it had ended that way he'd be getting skewered right now. Instead we're talking about the Spurs abandoning their execution, missing free throws, mental exhaustion and questionable decisions by Pop, who has overall orchestrated a magnificent game plan and made great adjustments for the bulk of the series.

 

[got_nugs]

Wade played pretty well on both ends of the court in game 4. Why do we forget that already?

Pretty sad when you can only bring up one game he has been good in (he was actually decent in game 5 as well). Wade is nothing more than a glorified role player at this point. Still trying to figure out what that role is though.

He was excellent the majority of the season. This knee that got injured towards the end of the streak is a problem. Plus he banged his knee and missed the beginning of the 3rd last night as well. He probably shouldn't have been out there in the 4th/ot at all though with how the other unit was playing. I expect him to get some treatment and have 3 -5 steals and 18-25 tomorrow night. His dribble around pull up 2 without lebron touching the ball in ot was inexcusable though.

This. I watched every game this season....the guy had an elite season.

I'm sure it's hard to be THAT good at something to defer when you're entire life has been around you doing that thing in that spot even when you're injured.

 

[tdoss]

Manu was playing like he had money on the Heat--9 points, 8 TO and a big missed FT. He was terrible and probably one of the big reasons SA lost that game.

I liked that the refs let them play. To me, that was a good no call on Bosh at the end there. That being said, Lebron needs to stop acting like a little girl every time he doesn't get a call. It is almost every play that he is complaining to the refs about a no call.

Should be a fun game 7.

I thought it was ridiculous of him to do all that theatrics over the block that Green put on his breakaway...hoping the ref would bail him out.

LeBron should've been called for the foul...he elbowed Green away and Green still got fingertips on the ball to force LeBron to bobble it out of bounds.

 

[Jayrod]

At least Game 6 crushed the Danny Green for Finals MVP nonsense.

I'll stick with my LeBron MVP prediction.

No it didn't. They lost and he had a bad game. If he has another great game in game 7, its his. If he doesn't its Duncan's unless Parker goes bananas in game 7. This of course depends on a SA win. Obviously a Heat win and its LeBrons.