vinwinephans
Footballguy
You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.Too much WIP melts your brains
Says the guy sounding very much like a clear cut 'McNabb-hater'...
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*** Official 2010 Philadelphia Eagles Thread *** (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Jason Wood
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Says the guy sounding very much like a clear cut 'McNabb-hater'...
Zoomanji
Footballguy
You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.
You don't read many of my posts do you?I'm one of the 4 Eagles fans who wants to keep McNabb. We should trade Kevin "Great WHITE hope" for anything we can get.vinwinephans
Footballguy
I am, but your dots are not connecting for me. Perhaps you exagerate for effect, but I don't see how anyone who makes the argument that the Eagles should keep McNabb would argue he would fetch less than Kold OR Vick in a trade. That does not make sense.If Reid thinks McNabb is the better of the two QB's then I want them to keep McNabb. I don't know more than these guys. So I will defer to them. However, if they think Kolb has upside equal to or greater than McNabb, then I think they should trade McNabb and move forward with Kolb.What I do know is that Kolb showed enough in his two starts to justifiably, imo, enable this debate to take place - Kolb or McNabb. But that is all it is - a debate. And the insiders are reporting what they are being told, which no one really knows what to believe regarding their purpose/motivation.Zoomanji said:vinwinephans said:Zoomanji said:You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.Too much WIP melts your brains
Slider
Footballguy
McNabb has been in a great system, had a great OLine. had a top 3 D, great RB play, very good TE''s and stud WR's a few years....He couldn't get it done. It's over. Nobody has anything but a guess of what Kolb is but I can guarantee you McNabb is a choke artist who has all but folded since New England exposed him in the Superbowl (check out his record since). he's never been particularly great at anything but running and hitting RB's and TE's with short passes. DJax changed things but McNabb became McNabb again when it mattered. If yoiu saw the Pro Bowl you saw 2 WCO QB's light it up and one look like a RB who couldn't throw.
Slider
Footballguy
You kind of lose credibility and bring the thread down with the race talk.Zoomanji said:vinwinephans said:Zoomanji said:You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.Too much WIP melts your brains
Says the guy sounding very much like a clear cut 'McNabb-hater'...
You don't read many of my posts do you?I'm one of the 4 Eagles fans who wants to keep McNabb. We should trade Kevin "Great WHITE hope" for anything we can get.
Zoomanji
Footballguy
delusional
Footballguy
Len P knows as much as we do. You can watch im on daily news live and he says one thing then goes off and says the complete opposite. I really pay the least attention to phills media. They drum up and start more undeserved crap just for the sake of ratings then anything. I can wait to hear the next big thing....McNabb uses plastic instead of paper! Trade him!Which is why he's not getting traded. BTW, for every "insider" on either side of this debate, there's another "insider" who says differently. Len P from ESPN in his latest column (I would quote it but it's Insider so I don't feel right about that) says that a very high ranking senior official within the Eagles organization said that all the trade talk is noise and said that "the odds are pretty good he isn't going anywhere, it's just all talk."Zoomanji said:You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.
delusional
Footballguy
Make that 5 fans. People seem to forget the Bobby Hoying experiment. Some even want Jeff Garcia back. Id rather see Reid completely ousted from the offensive side of things.Zoomanji said:
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vinwinephans
Footballguy
Reid, ousted? If that's what you really want, then you need Reid to do something wrong. For instance, picking Kolb over McNabb and have it not work...Make that 5 fans. People seem to forget the Bobby Hoying experiment. Some even want Jeff Garcia back. Id rather see Reid completely ousted from the offensive side of things.
vinwinephans
Footballguy
There's some time before the QB thing plays out to whatever it plays out to.
More speculation, different position/side of the ball.
Would people like the Eagles to add Julius Peppers or at 30 is he Freak 2.0 waiting to happen?
Personally, with the uncapped year coming up, I'd take the chance provided he wanted to be an Eagle. Adding a guy like that opposite Trent Cole would really open things up for the defense, imo. This isn't really news - it's the same thought process we want through as fans when Freak 1.0 was added...
More speculation, different position/side of the ball.
Would people like the Eagles to add Julius Peppers or at 30 is he Freak 2.0 waiting to happen?
Personally, with the uncapped year coming up, I'd take the chance provided he wanted to be an Eagle. Adding a guy like that opposite Trent Cole would really open things up for the defense, imo. This isn't really news - it's the same thought process we want through as fans when Freak 1.0 was added...
CaptainHook
Footballguy
i would love to see julius peppers on the team. Peppers + cole would be unreal.
delusional
Footballguy
Peppers is going to be asking for a haynesworth type contract. We got too many holes to be putting that much money into one player imho,
No idea what they are going to do with Roseman back there this year full time. In all the yeas of getting DEs, they found 1 in Trent Cole. They tossed 20m at Clemons....everyone was like who? Parker? Meh, Victor? meh.
Hell I am at the point where they should find a LB in the draft or FA, move Gocong back to DE.
Their track record on DEs is kinda...crap. Why not give Gocong a shot at his original position? Hell Babin played better in his limited time then half the DEs they groomed.
Yes its rare to have 2 great DEs. Thing is, our DTs are just plugs. They don't get the pressure, just there to sure up the run. If we got a pass rushing DT, that would move things in the right direction, which I think would make the other cornicopia of DEs we have play better.
edit: Man, reading the eagles forum....its amazing the amount of unwarranted hate McNabb gets from "fans".
No idea what they are going to do with Roseman back there this year full time. In all the yeas of getting DEs, they found 1 in Trent Cole. They tossed 20m at Clemons....everyone was like who? Parker? Meh, Victor? meh.
Hell I am at the point where they should find a LB in the draft or FA, move Gocong back to DE.
Their track record on DEs is kinda...crap. Why not give Gocong a shot at his original position? Hell Babin played better in his limited time then half the DEs they groomed.
Yes its rare to have 2 great DEs. Thing is, our DTs are just plugs. They don't get the pressure, just there to sure up the run. If we got a pass rushing DT, that would move things in the right direction, which I think would make the other cornicopia of DEs we have play better.
edit: Man, reading the eagles forum....its amazing the amount of unwarranted hate McNabb gets from "fans".
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Buddy Ball 2K3
Footballguy
Most people on that board are Eagles "fans" first.
delusional
Footballguy
yea im seeing people post things along the lines of "mcnabb never carried a team like elway" arguements lol. its like, ya, pinkston, thrash, na brown were the real threats back then
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Buddy Ball 2K3
Footballguy
To say McNabb did not do a ton for the Eagles and this town is just insane. But I also believe I have seen his limits and IMO a regression of his abilities. Thats why I believe its time to move on and see what Kolb can do. I just do not see McNabb getting any better.
CaptainHook
Footballguy
reid and banner did a ton for the eagles and this town. not mcnabb
dhockster
Footballguy
This is pretty much where I am. Based on what Dallas's Defense did against the Eagles at the end of the year, I think good defenses can shutdown McNabb. I want to see if we have the future QB on our team already or find out if we need to go somewhere else to get one. Let's see what Kolb can do.
delusional
Footballguy
any defense can do this when you do not run the ball at all. the eagles had what? thats why its not something i put all on mcnabb and alot of the blame on the scheme/gameplanning.This is pretty much where I am. Based on what Dallas's Defense did against the Eagles at the end of the year, I think good defenses can shutdown McNabb. I want to see if we have the future QB on our team already or find out if we need to go somewhere else to get one. Let's see what Kolb can do.
delusional
Footballguy
http://www.mcall.com/sports/football/eagle...0,2313392.story
Wow talk about hammer meet nail head.
IMHO this needs to be addressed more in the media when talking about the eagles and the whole mcnabb kolb debate
Wow talk about hammer meet nail head.
IMHO this needs to be addressed more in the media when talking about the eagles and the whole mcnabb kolb debate
ReggieHammond
Footballguy
Nothing that most Eagle fans haven't been saying for the past 10 years. What would make anyone believe that Reid will change his philosophy? He's been trying to fit a square peg in a round hole with McNabb for years, I doubt he changes now.I disagree with the idea that Kolb will get killed behind that OL, McNabb causes a lot of the pressure by holding on to the ball forever. I think Kolb has shown the ability to make a quick read and pass and can actually throw a slant which McNabb sucks at.
Most Kolb backers probably think he will fit Reid's system better than McNabb. Change is needed and if Reid won't change the system then he needs a QB that can run it better. Obviously the jury is out on whether Kolb is the answer but when you use a high pick on a player how long are you going to wait to find out?
babydemon90
Footballguy
I think most people think the Eagles need to run the ball more - really irrelevant to the QB debate.
Buddy Ball 2K3
Footballguy
Look its very simple. AR loves to pass the ball, its that simple. The problem is that McNabb's accuracy has gotten worse and not better. We have all seen the numerous worm balls, balls behind or above his target etc etc. A QB playing with this sort of accuracy problem just wont work in AR's offense. McNabb has a very hard time leading his receivers and playing with any sort of consistency and to deny that is just putting your head in the sand.
dhockster
Footballguy
I agree 100% about running the ball more no matter who is QB. For whatever reason, Andy Reid only runs a more balanced offense when someone other than McNabb is QB (Feeley, Garcia, Kolb). I don't see Reid changing at this point so the only alternative to get more balanced is to bring in another QB. I also think one of the biggest weapons the Eagles can have with DeSean and Maclin is the quick slant that can turn into a TD very quickly. Donovan has never thrown this ball very well and has a hard time leading his young fast receivers. I think Kolb will do a better job in this area (McNabb probably throws a better deep ball, but if Kolb can start hitting on the slants and force the defense to play the receivers more honestly, then the deep passes should be wide open).any defense can do this when you do not run the ball at all. the eagles had what? thats why its not something i put all on mcnabb and alot of the blame on the scheme/gameplanning.This is pretty much where I am. Based on what Dallas's Defense did against the Eagles at the end of the year, I think good defenses can shutdown McNabb. I want to see if we have the future QB on our team already or find out if we need to go somewhere else to get one. Let's see what Kolb can do.
babydemon90
Footballguy
Just saw the Eagles hired **** Jauron as secondary coach... I think I like that hire.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
MIAMI - An Eagles spokesman did not respond to requests for comment last night as reports circulated that the Birds are hiring ex-Bills and Bears head coach **** Jauron to coach their defensive backs.NFL.com, an arm of the league that rarely reports anything teams haven't authorized, was among those saying Jauron would replace Brian Stewart. Stewart is the former Cowboys defensive coordinator who spent one season with the Eagles before recently becoming defensive coordinator at the University of Houston.
Jauron, 59, crossed paths with Eagles coach Andy Reid on Mike Holmgren's Green Bay staff in the 1990s.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...acks_coach.html
delusional
Footballguy
i find it odd they hired **** as a DB coach. Going from a head coach to a DB coach?
Then again its another one of andys "friends".
Hopefully he has more of a role on the defensive side of things then use a DB coach
This may actually be what i sorta envisioned would happen. **** will replace Andy as HC when Andys contract is over.
Then again its another one of andys "friends".
Hopefully he has more of a role on the defensive side of things then use a DB coach
This may actually be what i sorta envisioned would happen. **** will replace Andy as HC when Andys contract is over.
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I sincerely hope not. While it may soon be time to let Andy waddle off into the pasture, I do not want **** Jauron as our next head coach. He has done nothing really as a head coach that I can think of. I'd rather Jauron stick to things on the defensive side of the ball as that is where he excels. If he has more responsibility than just as the DB's coach, that's okay with me, as long as he sticks to defense. I think he helps make this defense better.
ReggieHammond
Footballguy
Surely there's no way Jauron will ever be a HC again, he's 59 and did nothing both times he was a HC. I'd say it puts McDermott on the hot seat more than anything, another poor showing on D and his replacement is all ready on staff.
loose circuits
Footballguy
you're looking at the wrong way IMO. Gives McDermott support to improve on a decent showing last year considering they had 7 different MLB's or whatever. He can now focus all his attention on the overall unit as well.
ReggieHammond
Footballguy
I'll give him some slack due to the LB problems but I wouldn't go as far as saying he had a decent showing last year. JJ's defenses didn't give up points like they did last year no matter what personell he had, the D got absolutely shredded by decent offenses last season. I know Stewart and Dawk were key loses to the D from the previous season but they went from being a top 5 D in 08 to below average last season. There was a big drop off so the jury is well and truly out on him IMO.
cr8f
Footballguy
Yes but you still started Aaron Rodgers over him in the playoffs.You guys who think the Eagles are going to get a 1st or even a 2nd round pick for McNabb are nuts.You don't read many of my posts do you?I'm one of the 4 Eagles fans who wants to keep McNabb. We should trade Kevin "Great WHITE hope" for anything we can get.
JaxBill
Footballguy
Plus I'm sure he's still getting paid by the Bills. He's just taking this job to stay in the game.
He's getting 6 million to be precise. Pretty good for a defensive coaching assistant.
dhockster
Footballguy
The other aspect that was a strike against the defense was that the offense, while prolific, was very much a fast break offense scoring very quickly. That meant the defense had to be on the field a lot. With the injuries they had, this certainly had an effect on how they played overall. I agree the jury is out on McDermott, but he had a lot of things going against him last year, and the defense did okay (not good, just okay). If the Eagles get better luck this year, and the defense still isn't performing, then yes, McDermott's job may be in jeopardy.
zadok
Footballguy
Agreed.
delusional
Footballguy
Hot seat? No way. The guy took over for a D Cord who was sick/died. It was his first year as D Cord plus the immense amount of injuries the D side dealt with, to say he is on the hot seat is foolish. Jauron has two titles....db coach & senior assistantIf anything is is to give some experience in coaching on the D side of the ball. Plus give a friend a job ( he is friends with andy )
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Amused to Death
Footballguy
I was thinking "Secondary Coach/Assistant DC", but yeah that's about it. I don't think McDermott's on the hot seat. Just an experienced defensive guy to help mentor him. I like it.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
I think, much like with Marty M replacing Childress, it gives Reid a logical replacement for McDermott if he leaves for a HC job in the next year or two. It's far more likely McDermott will be plucked away given his age, and then Jauron -- who is probably done getting NFL head coaching offers -- could step in.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
This article speculates the promotion of Roseman to GM may signal a reduction in Reid's overall power in personnel decisions. This is the second such article I've seen on this, btw. And it does fall in line with Banner's previous reminder of the definition of insanity. From the article:
The weight on the seesaw - and we'll leave alone the observation of what it takes to offset Reid's side - was redistributed when general manager Tom Heckert Jr. decamped for Cleveland and was replaced by Howie Roseman, a Joe Banner protege who began his career here as a salary cap wonk.
<snip>
In Philadelphia, Reid has held all the real power, but as the seasons without championships pile one upon the other, there is room for other voices in the front office to be heard. With an alignment of team president Banner and Roseman, the critical mass needed to influence decisions has probably been reached.
<snip>
Picking apart the differences between the Eagles and the Cowboys, for instance, Banner noted that Dallas might have done a better job putting together its roster, which gets back to the whole player-personnel business. If the president wasn't satisfied with how that side of the operation worked, from draft day to free agent scouting to formulating trades, then it's no surprise the Eagles have a new general manager.
<snip>
One thing is certain, however. When the franchise powers assemble at that meeting table, Reid can look around and know he doesn't have as many votes in his pocket as he once did.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...hierarchy_.html
The weight on the seesaw - and we'll leave alone the observation of what it takes to offset Reid's side - was redistributed when general manager Tom Heckert Jr. decamped for Cleveland and was replaced by Howie Roseman, a Joe Banner protege who began his career here as a salary cap wonk.
<snip>
In Philadelphia, Reid has held all the real power, but as the seasons without championships pile one upon the other, there is room for other voices in the front office to be heard. With an alignment of team president Banner and Roseman, the critical mass needed to influence decisions has probably been reached.
<snip>
Picking apart the differences between the Eagles and the Cowboys, for instance, Banner noted that Dallas might have done a better job putting together its roster, which gets back to the whole player-personnel business. If the president wasn't satisfied with how that side of the operation worked, from draft day to free agent scouting to formulating trades, then it's no surprise the Eagles have a new general manager.
<snip>
One thing is certain, however. When the franchise powers assemble at that meeting table, Reid can look around and know he doesn't have as many votes in his pocket as he once did.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...hierarchy_.html
Billy Bats
Footballguy
So now we're going to leave personnel decisions to two capologists? This Roseman guy sent out letters to all NFL teams trying to get his foot in the door after graqduating from law school. Banner hired him 10 years ago with zero football experience to help with cap and the money side of things. Now all of a sudden he's going to be making decisions on who is the best LB coming out of college? As much as I wanted for Reid to give up some of his power, I don't want these guys overruling him. If it was a pure football guy that knows scouting amd evaluation talent, then great. But this is a bad move IMO.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Well I can't see them extending both so I'd say yes. Will McNabb play as a lame duck QB? And at what point does Kolb become the starter? If this is true, that is.ETA everyone's denying it right now.CentralPA said:
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Deranged Hermit
Not cool & Pissed
Of course it's true, its been the Eagles MO for years to lock up their young players long term before they break out. That being said, I'm told the talk have gone no where.CentralPA said:
Amused to Death
Footballguy
If what you say is true, then you have to wonder why they're keeping it a big secret. What would be the harm in just acknowledging some preliminary contract talks? More reason never to trust what coaches, players or front office types say at face value.DH, since you are aware of discussions with Kolb, are you aware of any with McNabb?
Amused to Death
Footballguy
So what do the Eagles do along the O-line to become Super Bowl contender in '10? They've spent a lot of money on the line and have gotten very little in return from Peters, Shawn & Stacy. Will they be able to fix the line, upgrade at DE, LB, S & RB enough to truly contend for a championship, or are we looking at another above average but not good enough season?
Sources say no Stacy Andrews unless he agrees to restructure deal
While Eagles coach Andy Reid has said he thinks Andrews' lack of production was mainly the result of his slow recovery from the torn ACL, his poor play raised enough doubts within the organization that there is little chance he will be back with the team unless he agrees to restructure his deal, sources close to the situation confirmed to the Daily News.
Andrews is scheduled to receive another $7.6 million this year, including a $4.1 million roster bonus in early April, which he would get only if he still is with the team on the 30th day of the league year (April 4). His $2.956 million salary and $500,000 workout bonus also are not guaranteed. Neither is the remaining $25.37 million in salary and bonuses in the final 4 years of his deal.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...cture_deal.html
Sources say no Stacy Andrews unless he agrees to restructure deal
While Eagles coach Andy Reid has said he thinks Andrews' lack of production was mainly the result of his slow recovery from the torn ACL, his poor play raised enough doubts within the organization that there is little chance he will be back with the team unless he agrees to restructure his deal, sources close to the situation confirmed to the Daily News.
Andrews is scheduled to receive another $7.6 million this year, including a $4.1 million roster bonus in early April, which he would get only if he still is with the team on the 30th day of the league year (April 4). His $2.956 million salary and $500,000 workout bonus also are not guaranteed. Neither is the remaining $25.37 million in salary and bonuses in the final 4 years of his deal.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/eagles...cture_deal.html
Jason Wood
Zoo York
The team has always put a priority on line depth, and I suspect this could be one of those years when many of our draft picks are focused on the OL and that has fans screaming/scratching their heads. But honestly, the offense just set a record for points scored, and the QB situation is already in house (whether it's McNabb, Kolb or a combination of the two), but the OL needs more TLC. The Eagles - to their credit - were able to survive in spite of cutting Tra and letting Runyan walk, and then having Shawn go head case on us, never having Stacy show up, and having Todd Herremans and Jamaal Jackson battle with injuries at points of the season. On the bright side, Winston proved more than capable of holding his own at RT, and is signed long-term. Herremans has a ton left in the tank and Cole is fine at C or guard depending on Jackson's situation.
JaxBill
Footballguy
Tra Thomas is available again. Any chance they offer him a vet minimum contract with some incentives for starts and use him as insurance?
Jason Wood
Zoo York
There's certainly precedent for bringing a veteran back to roost. That said, I'm not sure the team's needs are at backup LT, where Herremans (and King Dunlap as a developmental project) are already on the roster; and I don't think Thomas can be an effective RT.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
I agree they are still good. But this group proved that they are not championship caliber. At best they are 5th in the NFC going into next year and no better than 2nd in their division. I think they are 4 impact players away from being elite (O-line, DE, LB & S). And you can make an argument for veteran depth at RB.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
You realize the Steelers won the Super Bowl two years ago with a horrible offensive line, right?
