simmonjm
Footballguy
In total agreement with this.Just going on the record here...
Loved the Martin pick
HATED the trade up to waste a 3rd in a deep draft. I am also not a Lawrence fan.
Liked the rest of the draft.
In total agreement with this.Just going on the record here...
Loved the Martin pick
HATED the trade up to waste a 3rd in a deep draft. I am also not a Lawrence fan.
Liked the rest of the draft.
I understand not liking the trade itself but as someone who doesn't watch much college football whats the concern with Lawrence? Most Cowboys writers seem to want to assume hell step in and start day 1 (perhaps by default). Did he just not wow you guys?In total agreement with this.Just going on the record here...
Loved the Martin pick
HATED the trade up to waste a 3rd in a deep draft. I am also not a Lawrence fan.
Liked the rest of the draft.
For me, seems far too reliant on speed and finesse moves. Is not a physical player and I really think he is going to struggle in the pro game. He tackles poorly with bad technique. He lacks hand battling skills or seem to have counter moves. I am admittedly no scout, but that is what I see.I understand not liking the trade itself but as someone who doesn't watch much college football whats the concern with Lawrence? Most Cowboys writers seem to want to assume hell step in and start day 1 (perhaps by default). Did he just not wow you guys?In total agreement with this.Just going on the record here...
Loved the Martin pick
HATED the trade up to waste a 3rd in a deep draft. I am also not a Lawrence fan.
Liked the rest of the draft.
Who knows, but I agree with this somewhat. He's a good ballplayer. He makes plays. But it felt like a twofold reach to me. First they reached to fill a need. Some like the approach. I have disdain for it. Then they reached by coughing up a 3rd for someone who seemed to be in a tier still three deep. He is probably, but not definitely, the best of the three (Attaochu, Ealy). I'd prefer one of the other two + another solid OL to just Lawrence, because loaded teams with potential deep playoff runs need to address specific needs, whereas depleted rosters like the one in Dallas need bodies.For me, seems far too reliant on speed and finesse moves. Is not a physical player and I really think he is going to struggle in the pro game. He tackles poorly with bad technique. He lacks hand battling skills or seem to have counter moves. I am admittedly no scout, but that is what I see.I understand not liking the trade itself but as someone who doesn't watch much college football whats the concern with Lawrence? Most Cowboys writers seem to want to assume hell step in and start day 1 (perhaps by default). Did he just not wow you guys?In total agreement with this.Just going on the record here...
Loved the Martin pick
HATED the trade up to waste a 3rd in a deep draft. I am also not a Lawrence fan.
Liked the rest of the draft.
Ridgelake, let's look at this another way.Ridgelake said:In reading the post-draft quotes, Dallas had Lawrence in the tier with Barr as a weakside passrush DE. According to them, there was a significant drop off in that skill after him. They believed Atlanta would take him at 37, which is likely correct. If you look at their roster, the one spot without much depth is the weakside DE. They had bodies (of varying quality) at every other spot. So they overpaid by their own admission to move up to get him to fill this need.
I don't study college tape, so I can't assess if their grading of him is reasonable or not. I can't assess if someone like an Attaochou or Murphy or some other edge rushers are truly a tier below. What I do know is that Stephen Jones said that if they didn't trade up, they'd have taken Kony Ealy at 47 and Trai Turner at 78. I'll be watching to see if those two have better careers than DLaw. For the Cowboys' sake, I hope not. I hope that they got their grading right. But somehow, I have my doubts.
Yep. I had many of the same thoughts. I know that Dallas tried to trade down before picking Martin but did not get a deal that they wanted.Ridgelake, let's look at this another way.Ridgelake said:In reading the post-draft quotes, Dallas had Lawrence in the tier with Barr as a weakside passrush DE. According to them, there was a significant drop off in that skill after him. They believed Atlanta would take him at 37, which is likely correct. If you look at their roster, the one spot without much depth is the weakside DE. They had bodies (of varying quality) at every other spot. So they overpaid by their own admission to move up to get him to fill this need.
I don't study college tape, so I can't assess if their grading of him is reasonable or not. I can't assess if someone like an Attaochou or Murphy or some other edge rushers are truly a tier below. What I do know is that Stephen Jones said that if they didn't trade up, they'd have taken Kony Ealy at 47 and Trai Turner at 78. I'll be watching to see if those two have better careers than DLaw. For the Cowboys' sake, I hope not. I hope that they got their grading right. But somehow, I have my doubts.
Let's say the Boys traded back in round one and took Lawrence late first round.
Everyone would say that was a reach, similar to Fredrick last year. Only time
will tell if Lawrence works out giving up a 3rd rounder. (I hated this move)
IMO, I would have been OK reaching for Lawrence end of first.
Then, I have an extra 3rd round pick as well as my own 3rd still left.
In this case, is Martin worth a #47, #78 and another 3rd???
How would we have looked in camp with Lawrence, Jernigan, Schofield or Turner and K. Martin?
I've thought about Big Dave's desire to trade down quite a bit. No doubt this was likely a good year for it. My issue is if Dallas has the right personnel evaluation to trust them. I see ZMartin as one of a dozen sure things in this draft. Dallas needs that. BADLY. As enticing a more bodies sound, for me the sacrifice of passing on one of those dozen is too much.Yep. I had many of the same thoughts. I know that Dallas tried to trade down before picking Martin but did not get a deal that they wanted.Ridgelake, let's look at this another way.Ridgelake said:In reading the post-draft quotes, Dallas had Lawrence in the tier with Barr as a weakside passrush DE. According to them, there was a significant drop off in that skill after him. They believed Atlanta would take him at 37, which is likely correct. If you look at their roster, the one spot without much depth is the weakside DE. They had bodies (of varying quality) at every other spot. So they overpaid by their own admission to move up to get him to fill this need.
I don't study college tape, so I can't assess if their grading of him is reasonable or not. I can't assess if someone like an Attaochou or Murphy or some other edge rushers are truly a tier below. What I do know is that Stephen Jones said that if they didn't trade up, they'd have taken Kony Ealy at 47 and Trai Turner at 78. I'll be watching to see if those two have better careers than DLaw. For the Cowboys' sake, I hope not. I hope that they got their grading right. But somehow, I have my doubts.
Let's say the Boys traded back in round one and took Lawrence late first round.
Everyone would say that was a reach, similar to Fredrick last year. Only time
will tell if Lawrence works out giving up a 3rd rounder. (I hated this move)
IMO, I would have been OK reaching for Lawrence end of first.
Then, I have an extra 3rd round pick as well as my own 3rd still left.
In this case, is Martin worth a #47, #78 and another 3rd???
How would we have looked in camp with Lawrence, Jernigan, Schofield or Turner and K. Martin?
Though Dallas wasn't the only team wanting Martin. The Rams stated that they had a deal lined up with the Ravens at 17 to trade their 2nd and 3rd this year and next year's 2nd. That's roughly the same currency that you listed in the trade down scenario. It indicates that Martin's market value was that level. Not just 1 team overpaying to fill a need.
Again - I love the kids brain/ instincts but we have to find his replacement. .Sean Lee carried off field by 2 trainers. Coukdnt put any weight on one leg (not sure which). Wife just texted me that.
Awesome. :(
My bet is Angerer. Sigh.Sounds like a torn ACL- done for the year....
Wonder if they will pursue Vilma? Veteran leader.
They signed Lee to a long term contract with bonuses for playing time. They did the right thing in how they structured the contract. You can argue about their assessment of the likelihood of him playing, but you can't argue about how they structured the contract. It was favorable for the team. Lee's deal was not a stupid, kick-the-can-down-the road deal. They wanted him to be a key cog on the team going forward. They paid him like that but also put in protections for playing time. It was a market rate contract.Once again the flaw of Jerry's plan to keep deferring salary by signing long extensions and converting base salary to signing bonuses: Sean Lee can't be cut until after the 2016 season without the Cowboys incurring a bigger cap hit by cutting him then they would by keeping him on the roster.
The likely candidates are Carter, Holloman (6th rounder last year who looked good in limited snaps at MLB), and Hitchens (this year's 4th rounded taken specifically to back up Lee). This assumes they don't sign a vet like Angerer, Vilma, or Urlacher. But those guys would likely be considered progress stoppers and most realize this team isn't Super Bowl ready.Could Bruce Carter handle MLB? He looked a lot better at ILB in 2012 than he did at WLB in 2013.
Except that they also deferred salary of $4.75 million for him this off-season to get under the cap. I don't think it is smart to do that with your most injury prone player. You could also argue that the huge extension was not necessarily a smart move with his history of injuries. See Gosselin's article below.They signed Lee to a long term contract with bonuses for playing time. They did the right thing in how they structured the contract. You can argue about their assessment of the likelihood of him playing, but you can't argue about how they structured the contract. It was favorable for the team. Lee's deal was not a stupid, kick-the-can-down-the road deal. They wanted him to be a key cog on the team going forward. They paid him like that but also put in protections for playing time. It was a market rate contract.Once again the flaw of Jerry's plan to keep deferring salary by signing long extensions and converting base salary to signing bonuses: Sean Lee can't be cut until after the 2016 season without the Cowboys incurring a bigger cap hit by cutting him then they would by keeping him on the roster.
Any top player on their 2nd contract is going to take time to work off the signing bonus and guaranteed salaries. That's life in the NFL.
Gosselin's article is a good read. They took a calculated risk and it backfired. It is worth noting that the $42 million deal that he signed included $9 million of bonuses based on play time. Almost 25% of the contract.dhockster said:Except that they also deferred salary of $4.75 million for him this off-season to get under the cap. I don't think it is smart to do that with your most injury prone player. You could also argue that the huge extension was not necessarily a smart move with his history of injuries. See Gosselin's article below.
http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/columnists/rick-gosselin/20140527-gosselin-cowboys-knew-sean-lee-s-injury-history-they-took-the-risk-and-are-paying-for-it.ece
I am not bashing Jerry just to bash him. He is a smart man. I think he based his big contract signings in the last 3 or 4 years on the fact that he thought the salary cap would rise a lot more quickly than it has due to the new TV deal. He also decided to defer a lot of salary to keep the Cowboys competitive while they were assessed their cap penalties rather than take his punishment at the time. All that deferred money is killing the Cowboys flexibility to do much for the next year or two. He has succeeded big in life because he is willing to take risks. Sometimes he will also fail big. I think this is one of those times in how he has decided to manage the Cowboys salary cap.Gosselin's article is a good read. They took a calculated risk and it backfired. It is worth noting that the $42 million deal that he signed included $9 million of bonuses based on play time. Almost 25% of the contract.dhockster said:Except that they also deferred salary of $4.75 million for him this off-season to get under the cap. I don't think it is smart to do that with your most injury prone player. You could also argue that the huge extension was not necessarily a smart move with his history of injuries. See Gosselin's article below.
http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/columnists/rick-gosselin/20140527-gosselin-cowboys-knew-sean-lee-s-injury-history-they-took-the-risk-and-are-paying-for-it.ece
Feel free to bash away on Jerry. Its the popular thing to do. And for many good reasons. But I know from following this team closely that the last year or so has seen a much better long term plan than previous. I can't claim that everything they are doing now is perfect. I have significant doubts about the wisdom of the trade up for Demarcus Lawrence, among other issues. But their actions clearly have materially more long-term thought. As a non-homer, it may not be apparent. That's fine.
Again, they specifically drafted Hitchens with the realization that they needed a Lee backup. It was part of their post-draft commentary on him.
I really don't see much more than they could realistically do. They structured the contract to have a lot of play time incentive understanding the risk. They value him to a level that they want to keep him around for years and had to pay a realistic rate to do so. They further made specific draft moves to help contingency plan for the injury. Also don't forget that they were about to draft Shazier when Pittsburgh surprisingly took him at 15, one pick before Dallas.
Now we'll see how those contingency plans work.
I agree with your comments of the last 3 to 4 years. But that is where I think we may diverge. The organization has changed in the last year or so. Is it Garrett? Is it Stephen? Is it both of them together balancing out Jerry to a degree? Their decisions regarding Ratliff, Ware, Hatcher, Spencer, Austin and others in the last year leads me to this conclusion.I am not bashing Jerry just to bash him. He is a smart man. I think he based his big contract signings in the last 3 or 4 years on the fact that he thought the salary cap would rise a lot more quickly than it has due to the new TV deal. He also decided to defer a lot of salary to keep the Cowboys competitive while they were assessed their cap penalties rather than take his punishment at the time. All that deferred money is killing the Cowboys flexibility to do much for the next year or two. He has succeeded big in life because he is willing to take risks. Sometimes he will also fail big. I think this is one of those times in how he has decided to manage the Cowboys salary cap.
I do agree with your point that they seem to be heading in the right direction. The salary deferrals they did this off season they did because there was no other way to get under the cap, not to go out and sign a flashy free agent. For Cowboy fans I hope Jerry can resist doing this for another couple of years until they get out from under the Romo contract.I agree with your comments of the last 3 to 4 years. But that is where I think we may diverge. The organization has changed in the last year or so. Is it Garrett? Is it Stephen? Is it both of them together balancing out Jerry to a degree? Their decisions regarding Ratliff, Ware, Hatcher, Spencer, Austin and others in the last year leads me to this conclusion.I am not bashing Jerry just to bash him. He is a smart man. I think he based his big contract signings in the last 3 or 4 years on the fact that he thought the salary cap would rise a lot more quickly than it has due to the new TV deal. He also decided to defer a lot of salary to keep the Cowboys competitive while they were assessed their cap penalties rather than take his punishment at the time. All that deferred money is killing the Cowboys flexibility to do much for the next year or two. He has succeeded big in life because he is willing to take risks. Sometimes he will also fail big. I think this is one of those times in how he has decided to manage the Cowboys salary cap.
They could have very easily converted some of Ware's contract to bonus to get under the cap, thereby pushing his money down the road. They could have re-signed the over-30 Hatcher. But they let both go. They chose this year to take lumps and clean up some sins from 3-4 years ago. They've clearly decided against giving larger contracts to over-30 players except for Romo. And QBs have shown the ability to play well into their mid-to-late 30s. Romo's guaranteed money takes him to about age 34 or 35.
This team made many mistakes several years ago. They are making strides to get away from that. And learn from those mistakes. Now if they can learn to not throw away top 100 draft picks like they have so many, many, many times in the last 10 years, then they may really be on to a long-term successful plan.
Not going to happen imoSTEADYMOBBIN 22 said:So Urlacher and Vilma. Better then a 4th Rd rookie, I suppose.
I don't think its a secret that the Cowboys had intended to give him a second chance when everything resolved. Still faces a suspension from the league which I am guessing is going to be for an entire year.So...does this mean anything?
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 1h
Former Cowboy Josh Brent, convicted of intoxication manslaughter for Dec. 2012 crash that killed Jerry Brown, was released from jail today.
With the victims mothers blessing, I don't really see the problem with it. Im all for giving Brent a second chance. If he ever drinks and drives again Ill be the first in line to toss him out but the guy lives with the memory of being responsibly for taking the like of his GB. I think he deserved a second chance.I don't think its a secret that the Cowboys had intended to give him a second chance when everything resolved. Still faces a suspension from the league which I am guessing is going to be for an entire year.So...does this mean anything?
Adam Schefter @AdamSchefter 1h
Former Cowboy Josh Brent, convicted of intoxication manslaughter for Dec. 2012 crash that killed Jerry Brown, was released from jail today.
I would be absolutely shocked if he made the roster to open the season even with the lack of LB talent. This guy is a mental midget and has quit numerous times in his short career. I just don't see him suddenly gaining the mental fortitude and dedication to make a difference.Routilla said:Dallas gets Rolando McClain and a 7th for their 6th. Not expecting a miracle but if he is ready to play he could help. A 6th is not much if a risk IMO.
Yes he was.RIP, Robert Newhouse. :(
He was a rock-solid player.
Well, it now puts the Cowboys at about $142 million against next years cap. This years cap is around $133 million and is anticipated to go up another $10 million next year. The Cowboys could also unload about $15 million next year by cutting Free and Melton. In addition the Cowboys are about $9 million under the cap now so they may actually carryforward some cap room from this year. I think the Cowboys will have plenty of room to sign him. I think they will wait though until the off season to extend him to see how Romo's back holds up this season. If Romo were done this year due to his back, the Cowboys would take a big cap hit and this might affect what they want to do with Dez.Well, looks like they've locked up Smith:
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/cowboys-sign-left-tackle-tyron-smith-to-jaw-dropping-contract-extension-182507304.html
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What's this going to do to the Bryant negotiations?
it is certainly possibleIs it possible this Dal D can be worse than lays years unit? No Lee already, no Ware and now they lost Lawrence as well. Oh my!
I'm thinking this is a team you want to start players against if you have the chance.
I think a big question about Jason Garrett's development as a coach this year is can he stick to the running game. With the offensive line the Cowboys have built they should be able to run effectively against most teams. Last yearOverall, not a great outing. There were a few positives which I will highlight, but other then that it was pretty rough. Here are a few of my observations from the first pre-season game:
Positives
-First and even second team was able to run the ball efectively.
-Randle looks more decisive and finding his spots with more ease.
-Martin was moving his guy consistently in the run game.
-For the first time I believe we are going to be able to really run the ball. Like them knowing we are going to run and still being able to get 4 or 5 yards.
-We had good showings from many of our rookie's from this year's draft class. I was most imprerssed with Dixon who brought the wood on several plays. Hitchens shot a gap nicely during a goal line stance. Streets continues to be impressive with excellent hands and a nose for the ball
-Weeden was certainly servicable and made a great throw for our only score. He also stood in to take a hell of a hit while Hanna got open.
Negatives
-I get that we only started 4 or 5 D starters, but what I saw was scary. It's what we all expected but wow. No pass rush or presser what so ever.
-The running lanes were massive and ball carriers were running 5-7 yards before first contact.
-Mutiple plays over 20 yards
-Hayden at DT was getting destroyed.
-Carter still looks lost to me.
-Our LB's in general seem pedestrian and oh so painfully slow. Simple passes to backs are going for huge chunks of yardage.
-Caleb Haney is in his what 5 or 6 year I believe. He is a deer in head lights and it's time to move on. There is nothing there other then a camp arm.
-Hanna got blown past in protection causing a sack fumble. Terrible.
-What I came away most with was that there were a lot of players with no business wearing an NFL uniform let alone a Cowboys uniform. We need to continue to churn this roster.
They might give up 200 in the first 4 gamesAs if the defense wasn't going to be bad already...oof.![]()