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Official 2016 GOP thread: Is it really going to be Donald Trump?? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
satch
Footballguy
Trumps's "blood comment" about Megyn Kelly has created an interesting dynamic. The media is really trying to nail him on it and force him to apologize. When I first read the blood comment I couldn't believe he'd say something THAT offensive. He's said inflammatory things many times before but that one seemed way over the line. Then I heard Trump clarify and defend his remark, and it made sense. In the context of the original quote I find it more believable that when he said "and wherever" he was thinking "eyes, ears, nose" but he cut it short by saying "wherever" simply to move on.
But what's interesting is that either way, this plays right into Trump's hands. Possibly the biggest reason Trump is leading the polls is that people love his anti-pc stance. And here he is, with the pc policing media trying to put words in his mouth, insisting that they know what he really meant even though he never said it, and trying to force him to apologize.
This is precisely what Trump and his supporters are sick and tired of. Overly sensitive people wasting time on things like this instead of focusing on bigger issues. One reporter grilling Trump said to him that "some people took your comment another way" and Trump cut him off saying "they shouldn't have taken it another way" and repeated himself. He's absolutely right. People shouldn't have taken it upon themselves to assume he was about to say X, then persecute him for it and force him to apologize for something he never said or even intended to say.
I applaud Trump for sticking to his guns and refusing to apologize if he believes did nothing wrong. Some people have ridiculed Trump for saying he "doesn't have tome to be politically correct" and this is a perfect example. The guy is in the middle of a Presidential campaign, leading the polls, and all the media wants to ask him about is this kind of stuff? Trump is right, it's a waste of his, and all of our time.
The irony is, those trying desperately to nail him on this "politically incorrect" comment are essentially proving his point about the waste of time that is political correctness.
But what's interesting is that either way, this plays right into Trump's hands. Possibly the biggest reason Trump is leading the polls is that people love his anti-pc stance. And here he is, with the pc policing media trying to put words in his mouth, insisting that they know what he really meant even though he never said it, and trying to force him to apologize.
This is precisely what Trump and his supporters are sick and tired of. Overly sensitive people wasting time on things like this instead of focusing on bigger issues. One reporter grilling Trump said to him that "some people took your comment another way" and Trump cut him off saying "they shouldn't have taken it another way" and repeated himself. He's absolutely right. People shouldn't have taken it upon themselves to assume he was about to say X, then persecute him for it and force him to apologize for something he never said or even intended to say.
I applaud Trump for sticking to his guns and refusing to apologize if he believes did nothing wrong. Some people have ridiculed Trump for saying he "doesn't have tome to be politically correct" and this is a perfect example. The guy is in the middle of a Presidential campaign, leading the polls, and all the media wants to ask him about is this kind of stuff? Trump is right, it's a waste of his, and all of our time.
The irony is, those trying desperately to nail him on this "politically incorrect" comment are essentially proving his point about the waste of time that is political correctness.
the moops
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Unless something remarkable happens, this is not going to end well for the GOP. It's not about yet another pseudo OMG controversy about Trump's blood comment, it's just that he is not a professional, he's like those crappy tea party candidates who, aside from their policy positions (ok there was/is legitimate grassroots concern over federal power), was led by non-professional who were inartful about what they said and got caught up in the popular approval and notoriety. Angle, Aiken, O'Donnell and maybe even Palin, I count at least one lost Senate term for the GOP and a seriously damaged presidential race in just those four names.
And this is not good stuff. This is demagoguery, this is populism. It's not limited to the right either but the GOP which had pretty much successfully kept the team party out of its national campaigns now has this lulu of a wordsmith mucking things up. And while I can't blame Democrats for laughing it's not good for the country.
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timschochet
Footballguy
Saints I agree Drms shouldn't laugh. It's not good for the country at all.
(But it IS OK to laugh at Eminence right?)
(But it IS OK to laugh at Eminence right?)
rockaction
Footballguy
Clay Aiken or Todd Akin? I kid, Saints.
But these guys and women were no worse than some of the establishment candidates. George Allen and macacas? He lost the Senate for the Republicans in '06, way before the Tea Party could do any damage.
timschochet
Footballguy
that would be discriminatory to those who have been allegedly accepted into such schools, but have yet to take a class.
Sweet J
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
I seem to recall that after 2012, the GOP performed an autopsy, and they came to two conclusions: they were losing women and they were losing Latinos. Therefore the goal, prior to the next national election, was to take steps to become much more attractive to these two vital voting blocs.
Whatever steps they may have taken have been blown up by Donald Trump. The fact that he is leading with twice as many points as any other candidate AFTER insulting women and AFTER offending Latinos- that's not really a good sign...
Whatever steps they may have taken have been blown up by Donald Trump. The fact that he is leading with twice as many points as any other candidate AFTER insulting women and AFTER offending Latinos- that's not really a good sign...
culdeus
Footballguy
I don't understand why, as a country, we let the election cycle start so early and run so long? The GOP in this cycle has way more to lose because there are 7 months to blow up an otherwise decent candidate. The 15 or so of them all basically agree on being anti-gay, anti-immigrant, anti-abortion, anti-taxes, anti-obama. the rest are just tiny details and require doing the Romney right pivot and then lean back left. It's just a bear trap. They should really prevent this type of crap until November at the earliest.
culdeus
Footballguy
Anyone know this off hand? I'm having a hard time coming up with more than one or two that I can remember at all.
lod01
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Looks like the Donald is reconsidering that No 3rd Party pledge after all...
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/donald-trump-taking-pledge-run-party/story?id=32987615#.VcidqCuQ7q8.twitter
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/donald-trump-taking-pledge-run-party/story?id=32987615#.VcidqCuQ7q8.twitter
Eephus
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
Ilov80s
Footballguy
"is now seriously considering promising not to run as an independent if he does not win the Republican nomination, the adviser said."
This is like training camp talk we hear every year. "Jonathan Baldwin is fantastic in camp so far and I think if he keeps developing like this, he might end up having a chance to become the featured wide receiver in what just may be a very good offense." said NFL beat reporter.
Don Quixote
Footballguy
Blaming media distractions as the reason Trump does not talk about bigger issues and policy enough is pretty good schtick.
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Biden. Edwards. George H.W. Bush. LBJ. Kefauver
In fact Lieberman was the last Democrat to NOT have been a primary loser when he was nominated in 2000.
If you expand criteria to people who previously ran in the presidential primaries (in a different year) you get a number more.
-QG
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
When you hear the quote, I think it is pretty clear he meant she was on her period.
I don't think somebody this bombastic and unhinged can be an effective president.
I don't think somebody this bombastic and unhinged can be an effective president.
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
He shouldn't take the pledge, btw. At least one (if not more) of his opponents have said it'd be better for the Democrats to win than have Trump in the party (I know Graham said as much). And the truth is a number of them wouldn't support him if he won the nomination. He should not back down here.Ilov80s said:
Right, Em?
-QG
rockaction
Footballguy
I thought you wanted everybody to bypass the media. How the hell you going to straighten them out, mang?
eta* Look, these are the hard questions you'll have to answer.
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What does blood coming out of her eyes have to do with her period?
Saying nose there makes much more sense. Hyperbole for how she was out to get him. Only a deviant would think otherwise.
timschochet
Footballguy
I want to discuss Carly Fiorina's dramatic rise in the polls for a moment, without discussing Fiorina herself. Somebody brought this up earlier, but I'm very curious how many people that now support Fiorina (she went from below 1% to around 8%) actually watched her performance Thursday afternoon- I can't imagine that many. Much more likely, they have been influenced by the number of political pundits who raved about her, and also by the brief snippet of her in the Thursday night debate. (A note about that snippet- it was almost perfectly set up- the Fox guy said "We're going to hear from two candidates from earlier today." The first guy is Rick Perry, who says how he wishes Fiorina had been the Secretary of State, and the second is Fiorina.)
What's interesting to me is how much we are still influenced by these pundits, even though so many people say otherwise. In Fiorina's case, she was lauded on FOX, on MSNBC, and on CNN. Now if there had been disagreement about her on these networks, that might have been less influential. But when all 3 networks agree, it's generally accepted into the public mindset as true.
Now someone is surely going to point out that all 3 of these networks have been trying to tear down Trump's candidacy, with far less success than they have had in building up Fiorina's. While that is true to an extent, I would argue that Trump is a special case, and somewhat immune to the ups and downs of more standard political candidates. For the latter, the public is probably more influenced by what these networks say about the candidate as what the candidate says about him or herself.
What's interesting to me is how much we are still influenced by these pundits, even though so many people say otherwise. In Fiorina's case, she was lauded on FOX, on MSNBC, and on CNN. Now if there had been disagreement about her on these networks, that might have been less influential. But when all 3 networks agree, it's generally accepted into the public mindset as true.
Now someone is surely going to point out that all 3 of these networks have been trying to tear down Trump's candidacy, with far less success than they have had in building up Fiorina's. While that is true to an extent, I would argue that Trump is a special case, and somewhat immune to the ups and downs of more standard political candidates. For the latter, the public is probably more influenced by what these networks say about the candidate as what the candidate says about him or herself.
rockaction
Footballguy
Nice point. It was Walking Boot, and people criticized him for saying it. Fiorina's rise is something that I can't attest to. I'm rambling on, but I could not watch the first debate earlier in the day.
Walking Boot should comment more -- his takes on policy and politics writ large are always well-done, even though he's not very nice to you.
eta* Punditry is also a wild thing. To imagine that political pundits' general knowledge of things supersede those that study the issues closely is nuts.
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
He also called her a bimbo after the debate.... and he did it again this morning on the Today show.
There's also a rumor afoot that his advisor Roger Stone who quit on him, because he told Trump to focus on issues and not personal attacks, is saying that Trump is indeed unhinged.
I know, I know, Trump is so fantastic this is all orchestrated to bring him down.
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timschochet
Footballguy
I didn't remember that it was Walking Boot.
I don't care that he's not nice to me (actually, I have to give him credit for continually quoting a character from one of my novels whenever he criticized me on immigration- that was funny, and brilliant, and he made a real fool out of me for a couple of years by doing it.) But if he predicted this would happen, that makes him pretty smart.
rockaction
Footballguy
He actually said Trump would lose the debates due to media reportage, and alluded/cited the numbers of people who actually watch the debate and those that get media interpretations of it.
In Fiorina's case, it was true. In Trump's case, not so much, due to ratings. He was half-right, which is better than anybody can hope for at times, really.
So what about ratings?
timschochet
Footballguy
Also want to comment on the bolded: I agree that this is largely true. And yet it seems pretty obvious that we let them do it. Again in the case of Fiorina, we had Chris Matthews and all of his guests saying how impressed they were, and we had George Will and all the guys on FOX saying how impressed THEY were. Typically when there is agreement like that, it affects a certain percentage of the public.
rockaction
Footballguy
It might be simply that we trust the disseminators of information too much. You wouldn't believe the research assistants they employ to help them along, and what role certain contacts play in their shaping of information. You'd (the public) would nowhere near trust the expertise nor claims to it as much as has been done. It's sausage, and silly.
They're pretty good for the most part, but there's no way to ascribe the weight the public, and even those of us that follow it a bit, place on it.
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
I wouldn't doubt it. I think it's just a matter of time before he uses a racial or female epithet. "Bimbo" is already pretty close.
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fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
I watched (most) of the first debate and was active in this thread while it was going on. I don't remember anyone saying "Fiorina is crushing it" or anything like that. In fact, I remember posting something about how none of them were doing that great, and I think people largely agreed with me.
I'm not a Republican though, maybe her appeal is limited.
I'm not a Republican though, maybe her appeal is limited.
skol asylum
Footballguy
The POTUS represents and leads the greatest country on earth. A candidate's demeanor and they way they conduct themselves is extremely important. I would say it's more important even than any specific agenda. Trump is a pompous, arrogant, loudmouthed jackass. Of course it matters not only what he says but how he says it. Anyone else who says otherwise is delusional.
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Capella
Footballguy
Nobody actually likes her. If the tunnels to hell rightfully opened up and swallowed her during during the debate people would probably cheer.
timschochet
Footballguy
She also bears a rather striking resemblance to Cruella De Ville. If I had puppies, I'd be nervous...
When Obama appointed Kagen to the Supreme Court, I started a thread suggesting Obama appointed Barney Rubble to the Supreme Court and you along with several others were offended and complained and my thread was pulled.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Well Fiorina would be the first female president. As we know that's important.
Gary Coal Man
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
I don't remember that at all. Are you sure I was offended? I'm rarely offended by things like that.
timschochet
Footballguy
RBM
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
Eephus
Footballguy
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