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*Official 2016 Philadelphia Eagles* - The year of Change (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Deamon
- Start date
Porkchop Express
Footballguy
How predictable of a post from you. Think you already used that one.
But yes, was just surprised as he's the 2nd or 3rd qb at risk of his job. I'm assuming he'll be cut anyways. Really like Mannion and hope he makes that team.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I feel like my conception of "leverage" must have been inaccurate my whole life.
Ash
Footballguy
I'd be surprised if they didn't keep 4, since Mathews is practically guaranteed to miss 4 games or so and none of the others seem capable of playing full time. I'd keep 4 and rotate them something like Mathews - 40% with Sproles, Smallwood, Barner, 20% each.Well it's been a pretty slow Eagles news week, this is all we've got
I still am really interested in the Sproles situation and how that pans out. Anyone think we keep 4 or which one of Sproles, Barner, Smallwood gets the boot?
That seems like a split that we've never seen a team do though. Can't see all of them getting touches each game but maybe you mean those percentages in terms of total for the year.
Would like to see on a per game basis something like:
Mathews: 60%
Sproles: 20% (along with a few receptions)
Smallwood and/or Barner: 20%
Next year I would think Sproles is for sure gone and in that case Smallwood/Barner should be nice backups. All might be capable of stepping into the starter role if/when Mathews goes down, so Pederson may have himself in a similar situation to what he was in last year in KC.
Was on our practice squad all year so not really sure too much on him. I'm assuming he's just depth for you guys if not a camp body, so I wouldn't put too much stock into it.Boyko? anyone have insight? Good or bad signing for SD?
from what I've read not so hot....figures... :(
Ash
Footballguy
Correct, yes, there'd only be 3 active for any given game obviously. Smallwood in particular might start out as #4 but could get into the rotation for the 2nd half of the year. I was also talking about snaps, not carries. Sproles and Smallwood in particular I see more as utility players with Mathews getting the bulk of the carries as long as he's healthy.
jon007
Footballguy
Wow. man I sometimes really wonder what the mental state of our fan base really is.
So does this lineup still qualify for AARP?
Sproles will be gone before the season starts.
Your lead back for 2016 will be......Keynon Barner. Yay. Unless we sign Jamal Charles which I still believe we have chance, and that chance only increases with Sproles being traded.
Mathews is the same role as change a pace.
Smallwood I just don't know. If he is our lead back then get ready to give Cleveland the #1 pick in the 2017 draft.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
our OL was pretty weak last year (mostly interior, but there was a chance for a T with Peters' injuries) and he never got a sniff as far as I know.Boyko? anyone have insight? Good or bad signing for SD?
from what I've read not so hot....figures... :(
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
that's not the case. I get that it seems Bradford like as presented, but Foles and Fisher have also discussed the likelihood he won't be on the team.Deamon said:
This is more like some 15 year veteran chatting with a coach who says "thanks for the memories, but you're probably not making it this year. You gotta prepare yourself for that."
Foles isn't a 15 year veteran. He is still young enough to have a shot in the NFL.
Notice Fisher speaking in past tense, notice Fisher saying they have trouble finding work for 3 QBs nevermind four or somesuch like that...most importantly notice how understanding Fish is. You don't get that with a normal holdout or guy missing OTAs to go to vegas or somesuch.
All the Rams reports are quite favorable, this is not people angry Sam isn't there. It's not Sam wanting the team behind him as he's the #1 QB-instead the team has about admitted they don't want him.
What the hell?!jon007 said:
Mathews is 28 and I'm pretty sure he'll be the starter this year. I don't think he's a change of pace, he had like 5 yards per game less then Murray last year. And Sproles seems to be ageless... everytime he's counted out he shows up. I think he'll be on our team this year but that's it.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Yeah cause everyone knows what RB's will be good from year to year. I mean last year we ALL knew that the top 10 rushers would include Doug Martin, Darren McFadden, Chris Ivory, Latavious Murray, Devonta Freeman, Jonathan Stewart, Frank Gore and Deangelo Williams, right?jon007 said:
The last position anyone should be certain how good/ bad a guy is would be RB.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
sign Charles? Didn't even realize he was still available.jon007 said:
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
If you want to worry about a position, this is the one IMO. Those are some scary names to run with every Sunday in a passing league. I hope Wentz doesn't see the field until we get at least one WR we can count on
I don't think Nelson/Givins will be THAT bad given that we have 2 receivers in the middle of the field capable of 1000 yards receiving each.
Riversco
Footballguy
This is a special summer for the silver and green. The drafting of Carson Wentz assures it is a dawning of an Eagle Empire. Pax Philadelphia. It could have been Los Angeles. It could have been Cleveland. But fate smiled here. Its a very rare thing. Eagle fans really should treasure this time.
Mathews is absolutely a lead back, when healthy. His problem has never been talent. Barner might well lead the Eagles in carries in 2016, but it won't be because he relegated Mathews to back-up duty.
Ash
Footballguy
Ash
Footballguy
I think Pederson will be a lot more creative in the short passing game than Chip was. Seemed like the backs ran screens, swings and wheels with Kelly and that was about it. Andy has a long history of using RBs well in the passing game and KC did the same thing and I think Doug will bring that here. That's where I think Sproles will see more time. Payton in NO used him well too. I see Smallwood in the same kind of role, I think he will get a shot to be used in the same kind of way if his pass pro improves.
Barner is not a lock to make the team IMO, I could see the team wanting to bring in a more steady, experienced guy they can use for Mathews inevitable mid/late season injury absence and to be used to split the carries, since I don't see Sproles or Smallwood as more than changeup runners. Barner's been error prone and mostly uninspiring so far so he has work to do to show his value.
Ya I'm not sure how he'll divy them up in comparison to Chip. Just went through Chiefs game logs from last year and they had a lot of RB injuries obviously. But here's how he divided up the carries by RB:
W1: 16-6
W2: 21-3
W3: 11-1
W4: 11-5
W5: 12-7-2(The game Charles got hurt so tried a bunch of guys out)
W6: 9-5-1
W7: 22-2-1 (Leaned heavy on West)
W8: 20-2-4
W9: 24-2
W10: 11-11-1
W11: 19-1
W12: 9-7
W13: 10-8
W14: 16-5
W15: 14-5
W16: 16-13
P1: 16-8-4
P2: 17-6
He seems a bit all over the place and likes to try a lot of different RB's out in the rotation each game and simply ride the hot hand. Once a RB gets hot he's not afraid to give them the ball over and over and barely give anyone else any touches at all. It seems by the end of the season he got in a nice routine of 70/30 mix. I could see him trying to go for a similar mix, but not using all 4 rbs each game. Almost never gives 3 rbs carries in the same game.
Something like:
15 Mathews
6 Sproles
3 Barner/Smallwood (other gets none)
Ash
Footballguy
Only 3 at a time would ever be active I'd think and I'd expect the roles to be a bit more defined as options stand right now. Mathews runs a lot better than any of the other options but has two cement blocks for hands. Different things will work in different games vs. different opponents though but it's encouraging the way KC could still get production from the position without great talent after Charles went down.
I could see Sproles being used in the passing game in a similar way to how Andy used Westbrook and also Duce, to a lesser degree. Payton was also quite creative with Sproles, he spent a decent amount of time lined up out wide with NO. He and Brees looked like they had a "check with me" thing going a lot. If there was cushion they'd just take the easy 5 yards and see if he could make someone miss, then it's 15. That was the kind of thing I expected Kelly to do since it seemed to fit so well with the RPO stuff they used a fair bit in 2013, but it just never happened.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Chip, for whatever reason, got more and more stubborn. After seeing what KC has done the past 2 seasons given what they have had to work with on offense (same with SD and Reich to some extent as well) I feel confident we'll see much more creative play calling and match ups on offense.Ash said:
Sounds so crazy to say/think that one of Chip's DOWNFALLS was his creative play calling.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I had a few games on DVR from his first season still and a couple from just this past season and the play calling is night and day. Outside of the no-huddle (which was even different last season) you wouldn't be able to tell these were the same HC's
Hmmm wonder why that is. Was it just trying to hit left when everyone expected you and prepared for you to hit right? Or was it the theory that his GM role became too much a focus and he simply didn't have the time to be Chip Kelly the creative playbook guy?
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
It didn't look like he was trying to out think everyone. It looked like we literally ran the same 5-6 plays all game, every game last season. I think Shah or Ash posted a link one time last season with the charting of our plays and it showed something similar.
I know I have mentioned it here before but the more I look at what KC did under Reid/ Pederson on offense since they have been there I cant believe how they were able to win so many games with so little on that side of the ball. It gives me hope for our offense this season.
Yes, for Chip's creativity praise, and Doug's 'vanilla' criticism, it may end up turning out the opposite. He DID have Jamaal Charles though, who seems to be a bit more of a playmaker then Matthews or Barner.
Insein
Footballguy
Chip tailored the offense to his QB. He probably realized early on that reaching for Bradford was a mistake because he had to change everything his offense was good at. He watered it down as much as possible to make it effective enough for Bradford to use.
It's really the only explanation because like BB said, the offense was not this stagnant in year 1 and 2. The play calling was night and day different. I guess some could say Shady was light years better than Murray and Mathews. Because I know no one wants to hear that Foles and Sanchez had a better handle on the offense faster than Bradford did.
It's really the only explanation because like BB said, the offense was not this stagnant in year 1 and 2. The play calling was night and day different. I guess some could say Shady was light years better than Murray and Mathews. Because I know no one wants to hear that Foles and Sanchez had a better handle on the offense faster than Bradford did.
So we're just throwing out the possibilities that it was because a) Chip's offense got figured out/adjusted to, b) that it was too much to run personnel and come up with plays being a coach, c) that Shady/Desean/Maclin/etc were faster and better fits for his system then Matthews/Mathews/Aghalor, or d) that he just became stubborn, lazy, a bad coach etc, and going to say it's because of Bradford. Of course it is.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
modogg
Footballguy
I think a lot of it had to do with Sam not being comfortable in the game planning and also wanting to start him out slowly. He also took the first 4-5 games to get in game shape and they maybe weren't pushing the pace too much thinking they had enough to get by (and they weren't wrong if they had a healthy kicker for the 1st 5 games of the season)Bigboy10182000 said:
modogg
Footballguy
I think we can cancel out a few of these. I think with (B), coming up with plays is either something you have or you don't. I don't know that it takes a ton of effort to come up with additional plays if you are a creative coach. Combine this with (D), where we could say he was stubborn or bad, but I think most would disagree with lazy. they would talk about how he was watching film and in the facility all the time. Might be a combo of some of the other things, but there are plenty of offenses that can be "figured out" and the offense still wins. You think teams were surprised with what Denver or Carolina did on offense?
Ash
Footballguy
I think the disappearance of creative, calculated-risk-taking Chip was as big a part of his downfall as the disastrous personnel moves, even before he had official control.
The first year, when all the players were new to it, he went all out, he used DeSean really well and manufactured touches for him, we had Foles running triple run/pass choice plays, mid season adjustments like the split zone to add some muscle to the run game and it looked like the hype was totally justified.
2014 was a slight step back but it felt more like a hiccup than anything serious, due to the OL injuries etc. 2015 was just so totally unexpected
Ash
Footballguy
I just don't buy wanting to start him out slowly, whatever the reason I can't see it being Chip wanting to pull back from putting it on Bradford. He went flat out with everything in 2013 when Vick and Foles were competing for the job and all the players were new.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
unckeyherb
Footballguy
Nelson Agholor accused of raping a dancer at Cheerleaders per Mikey Miss show....
http://www.phillymag.com/news/2016/06/10/nelson-agholor-rape-cheerleaders/
http://www.phillymag.com/news/2016/06/10/nelson-agholor-rape-cheerleaders/
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Insein
Footballguy
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I didn't read the article but you'd have to think there would be camera's everywhere in that place.
Insein
Footballguy
Haven't been there in like 6 or 7 years but they did then. In the rooms as well but that's for the common folk. Who knows what VIP has. I don't have Arizona Ron money to get back there.
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