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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (15 Viewers)

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Nathan R. Jessep said:
there's a lot to ingest in this twitter thread, but if you've been paying attention to the CDC's latest guideline changes and may have been a bit perplexed, you will probably find this useful, and perhaps a tad disconcerting: https://twitter.com/sleepyknave/status/1497340222333411344
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Disconcerting about what? This #### is over.

Some few stragglers still holding on. Like NYC schools who said kids don't have to wear masks outdoors anymore but still indoors. Meanwhile cdc said kids don't need to wear masks anymore in schools.

 
James Daulton said:
Our hospitals are still low on covid but jammed packed with other patients.  The one area that we're not crushed is the ICU with unvaccinated covid patients.  That's a very very good thing.

We do need a break from the crush of patients, but at least we're able to bill surgeries again.  Although the average cost of nursing labor has gone up 25% since last year so we're still losing money. 
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Thank you baby jesus for this.

Time to get on with it.

 
An occurrence I've ran into twice in the last month which is so sadly hilarious.

In several facilities, I have to jump through so many hoops to participate in a case (surgery) with a COVID patient that I don't even bother.

For the second time in the last few weeks, I have walked right into cases where I had no idea the patient was HIV+.  Yesterday afternoon, I was helping a new surgeon in a procedure and as I leaned over to assess the anastomosis - he asks me to step back several feet.  "Matt this is an HIV patient, apparently not nearly the threat of a covid patient.. but still, please watch yourself"

He and I both laughed so hard he had to scoot back and catch his breath.

 
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matuski said:
An occurrence I've ran into twice in the last month which is so sadly hilarious.

In several facilities, I have to jump through so many hoops to participate in a case (surgery) with a COVID patient that I don't even bother.

For the second time in the last few weeks, I have walked right into cases where I had no idea the patient was HIV+.  Yesterday afternoon, I was helping a new surgeon in a procedure and as I leaned over to assess the anastomosis - he asks me to step back several feet.  "Matt this is an HIV patient, apparently not nearly the threat of a covid patient.. but still, please watch yourself"

He and I both laughed so hard he had to scoot back and catch his breath.
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What are you trying to say? There are no special accommodations for operating on HIV infected individuals - standard precautions apply. Just like HIV negative people.

The same can't be said for a patient with active Covid.

 
jobarules said:
IFYP
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pssst... 

Anyone with a basic physiological understanding of how this works knows it's  fairly certain that IF any new long term issue surfaces from the vaccine (it's been a year and a half), that issue will be orders of magnitude worse with people infected with the actual virus.... just like all the current incredibly rare effects. 

Thankfully 95% of the thread understands this very simple fact. :thumbup:  

 
jobarules said:
Disconcerting about what? This #### is over.

Some few stragglers still holding on. Like NYC schools who said kids don't have to wear masks outdoors anymore but still indoors. Meanwhile cdc said kids don't need to wear masks anymore in schools.
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matuski said:
:lmao:

Disconcerting?

Like anyone who has paid ANY attention to their data from day 1 might have been suggesting to you this entire time?
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Clearly neither of you read the thread bc both of you missed the point completely.  But It's cool. Glad it's all over. 

Also it's interesting that both of you chose that path of response without me even saying anything about what I thought of the information. Again, cool. 

 
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matuski said:
An occurrence I've ran into twice in the last month which is so sadly hilarious.

In several facilities, I have to jump through so many hoops to participate in a case (surgery) with a COVID patient that I don't even bother.

For the second time in the last few weeks, I have walked right into cases where I had no idea the patient was HIV+.  Yesterday afternoon, I was helping a new surgeon in a procedure and as I leaned over to assess the anastomosis - he asks me to step back several feet.  "Matt this is an HIV patient, apparently not nearly the threat of a covid patient.. but still, please watch yourself"

He and I both laughed so hard he had to scoot back and catch his breath.
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Is it common practice to disrespect a patient on the table like this, or just in your circle?

 
Nathan R. Jessep said:
Anyone have access to the NYT? I can't get this to pull up. I'm interested in seeing what study they are referring to if anyone could grab the link and post it?

Research points to a Wuhan market as the origin of the pandemic
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First paragraph:

Scientists released a pair of extensive studies on Saturday that point to a market in Wuhan, China, as the origin of the coronavirus pandemic. Analyzing data from a variety of sources, they concluded that the coronavirus was very likely present in live mammals sold in the Huanan Seafood Wholesale Market in late 2019 and suggested that the virus twice spilled over into people working or shopping there. They said they found no support for an alternate theory that the coronavirus escaped from a laboratory in Wuhan.
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First study (linked in the above paragraph -- the link didn't copy): https://zenodo.org/record/6299116#.YhvmoujMJaR

Second study: https://zenodo.org/record/6291628#.YhvnFejMJaQ

 
Well, my school district, which was about to vote on another set of changes to masking requirements, decided to just lift the masks altogether overnight based on the new cdc guidelines.  The rules they were about to revote on would have lifted the masks in a week or 2 maximum. 
 

I don’t understand how you have a plan voted on by the school board that has triggers based on community spread and positivity rate. Then you want to alter those based on vaccines now — I kind of get that, but the vaccines are already kind of baked into the numbers. But now without a school board vote, you just rip it up?

 
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Leeroy Jenkins said:
Well, my school district, which was about to vote on another set of changes to masking requirements, decided to just lift the masks altogether overnight based on the new cdc guidelines.  The rules they were about to revote on would have lifted the masks in a week or 2 maximum. 
 

I don’t understand how you have a plan voted on by the school board that has triggers based on community spread and positivity rate. Then you want to alter those based on vaccines now — I kind of get that, but the vaccines are already kind of baked into the numbers. But now without a school board vote, you just rip it up?
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School districts (even preschools, a population that is not eligible for the vaccine yet) around here are getting a lot of heat from the anti-masker vocal minority. Vehement, disgusting heat. They need some kind of backing to give them cover to keep the status quo, and the CDC pulled the rug out from under them.

 
Dragons said:
School districts (even preschools, a population that is not eligible for the vaccine yet) around here are getting a lot of heat from the anti-masker vocal minority. Vehement, disgusting heat. They need some kind of backing to give them cover to keep the status quo, and the CDC pulled the rug out from under them.
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The status quo was kind of stupid though.  There's a reason why the districts that still had these policies are all dropping them.

 
Dragons said:
School districts (even preschools, a population that is not eligible for the vaccine yet) around here are getting a lot of heat from the anti-masker vocal minority. Vehement, disgusting heat. They need some kind of backing to give them cover to keep the status quo, and the CDC pulled the rug out from under them.
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Did you expect the status quo to last forever?

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
Well, my school district, which was about to vote on another set of changes to masking requirements, decided to just lift the masks altogether overnight based on the new cdc guidelines.  The rules they were about to revote on would have lifted the masks in a week or 2 maximum. 
 

I don’t understand how you have a plan voted on by the school board that has triggers based on community spread and positivity rate. Then you want to alter those based on vaccines now — I kind of get that, but the vaccines are already kind of baked into the numbers. But now without a school board vote, you just rip it up?
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Just enjoy it.  Congrats!

 
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Dragons said:
School districts (even preschools, a population that is not eligible for the vaccine yet) around here are getting a lot of heat from the anti-masker vocal minority. Vehement, disgusting heat. They need some kind of backing to give them cover to keep the status quo, and the CDC pulled the rug out from under them.
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Oh, I know.  I saw this coming.  Just prefer it to not be via an email at 8pm Saturday night.  The new criteria that the school district was supposed to vote on tonight (which also was only 1 week notice) would have had the masks off as of March 7 anyway. But doing it this way puts a lot of undue stress on the kids/families.

 
IvanKaramazov said:
They did.  Once they get to "but what about immunocompromised people?" you need to realize that they're arguing for permanent mask mandates.  Everybody else is right to say no to that.
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The immunocompromised people should be the ones to wear masks then if they choose.

Before all this pandemic started, there were many Asians that wore masks, and many of us in the US thought it was "weird".   Well the concept is that those who were sick themselves, or needed to take extra measures to avoid getting sick (i.e. immunocompromised), were the ones that chose to wear the masks.   That's exactly how we should all be moving forward.    If you're worried about getting sick then put your mask on...that's up to you, not the government.

 
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IvanKaramazov said:
They did.  Once they get to "but what about immunocompromised people?" you need to realize that they're arguing for permanent mask mandates.  Everybody else is right to say no to that.
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That is simply not true.  But the goalposts keep changing because politically the case rates haven't slowed fast enough.  

 
Dragons said:
School districts (even preschools, a population that is not eligible for the vaccine yet) around here are getting a lot of heat from the anti-masker vocal minority. Vehement, disgusting heat. They need some kind of backing to give them cover to keep the status quo, and the CDC pulled the rug out from under them.
Click to expand...


Why would they want to keep the status quo?  

 
IvanKaramazov said:
The status quo was kind of stupid though.  There's a reason why the districts that still had these policies are all dropping them.
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Yes, they have been phasing them out with notice. Ours were eliminated today, but it was planned for 3+ weeks. Dropping at the spur of the moment is poor form, but necessary due to the behavior of a small segment of the population.

 
offdee said:
The immunocompromised people should be the ones to wear masks then if they choose.

Before all this pandemic started, there were many Asians that wore masks, and many of us in the US thought it was "weird".   Well the concept is that those who were sick themselves, or needed to take extra measures to avoid getting sick (i.e. immunocompromised), were the ones that chose to wear the masks.   That's exactly how we should all be moving forward.    If you're worried about getting sick then put your mask on...that's up to you, not the government.
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LOL at this concept working in the US.

 
Dragons said:
LOL at this concept working in the US.
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The idea that Americans would wear masks when they were sick is a pipe dream, yes.  But the main point is for the immunocompromised segment...if you're worried about getting sick then either stay home or put a mask on yourself.      

 
Dragons said:
Yes, they have been phasing them out with notice. Ours were eliminated today, but it was planned for 3+ weeks. Dropping at the spur of the moment is poor form, but necessary due to the behavior of a small segment of the population.
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Consider the possibility that the small segment of the population driving bad policy choices is you.

 
IvanKaramazov said:
Consider the possibility that the small segment of the population driving bad policy choices is you.
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I would hope those engaging in death threats and public harassment is a small segment of the population, but I suppose I am fine with being in the minority if it's not.

 
I think it was time to re-tool the metrics the CDC was using, but I am very dismayed that 2 of the 3 indicators they're now using are trailing indicators. If another variant kicks up worse than Omicron, these metrics won't react until it is way past too late.

 
(HULK) said:
I think it was time to re-tool the metrics the CDC was using, but I am very dismayed that 2 of the 3 indicators they're now using are trailing indicators. If another variant kicks up worse than Omicron, these metrics won't react until it is way past too late.
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CDC has failed at almost every turn.

 
Dragons said:
Yes, they have been phasing them out with notice. Ours were eliminated today, but it was planned for 3+ weeks. Dropping at the spur of the moment is poor form, but necessary due to the behavior of a small segment of the population.
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Why is removing the requirement poor form on a short notice?  If someone doesn't like that then they are free to keep wearing the masks.   I just don't understand why removing the requirement quickly is poor form?  What does saying that you have to keep wearing for 2 more weeks then it's not required any better?

 
The high school where I work and the high school where my kid goes both still have mask requirements even though both counties have low Covid rates.  I think it will be a few more weeks.

 
Curious to thoughts from yuse guys regarding vax passports for music and sporting venues. I'm going to some concerts this year and the venue I am attending has a mandatory vax+booster protocol for entrance. You have to show vax status(card or digital) and your id. This will preclude a buddy of mine from going as he chose not to get the vaccine. This also made another friend opt out of going to any concerts even though she is vaxxed because she feels like this is an over reach by the facility. Her position is similar to IK's re: masks in that by now if you've chosen to be unvaxxed then let the chips fall where they may as our area is at  85% vaxxed and most government mandates have been lifted. 

As for me, I don't care if you attend and are unvaxxed because you can't hurt me anymore than the other 40,000 folks on site, most of whom are also vaxxed. Not sure the venue needs this level of caution to carry on a covid safe show so don't believe the mandate is necessary. That is not going to stop me from going to shows however.

??Would you if you had the authority continue with the protocols in place or would you rescind them?

 
Gally said:
Why is removing the requirement poor form on a short notice?  If someone doesn't like that then they are free to keep wearing the masks.   I just don't understand why removing the requirement quickly is poor form?  What does saying that you have to keep wearing for 2 more weeks then it's not required any better?
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To give time for the immunocompromised to adjust?

 
Gally said:
Wouldn't the adjustment for them to just continue to wear masks?
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I'm not getting bogged down in a discussion on the efficacy of masks, however is it unreasonable to believe that an immunocompromised person has some degree of better protection if everyone is wearing masks, vs. they are the only one wearing masks?

 
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Dragons said:
I'm not getting bogged down in a discussion on the efficacy of masks, however is it unreasonable to believe that an immunocompromised person is better protected if everyone is wearing masks, vs. they are the only one wearing masks?
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If you're properly wearing a N95 mask you are as safe as you can get without moving up to a higher grade respirator.  

 
Joe Schmo said:
Curious to thoughts from yuse guys regarding vax passports for music and sporting venues. I'm going to some concerts this year and the venue I am attending has a mandatory vax+booster protocol for entrance. You have to show vax status(card or digital) and your id. This will preclude a buddy of mine from going as he chose not to get the vaccine. This also made another friend opt out of going to any concerts even though she is vaxxed because she feels like this is an over reach by the facility. Her position is similar to IK's re: masks in that by now if you've chosen to be unvaxxed then let the chips fall where they may as our area is at  85% vaxxed and most government mandates have been lifted. 

As for me, I don't care if you attend and are unvaxxed because you can't hurt me anymore than the other 40,000 folks on site, most of whom are also vaxxed. Not sure the venue needs this level of caution to carry on a covid safe show so don't believe the mandate is necessary. That is not going to stop me from going to shows however.

??Would you if you had the authority continue with the protocols in place or would you rescind them?
Click to expand...


Honest answer for most businesses? Depends on what the market analysis shows me. 

 
Joe Schmo said:
Curious to thoughts from yuse guys regarding vax passports for music and sporting venues. I'm going to some concerts this year and the venue I am attending has a mandatory vax+booster protocol for entrance. You have to show vax status(card or digital) and your id. This will preclude a buddy of mine from going as he chose not to get the vaccine. This also made another friend opt out of going to any concerts even though she is vaxxed because she feels like this is an over reach by the facility. Her position is similar to IK's re: masks in that by now if you've chosen to be unvaxxed then let the chips fall where they may as our area is at  85% vaxxed and most government mandates have been lifted. 

As for me, I don't care if you attend and are unvaxxed because you can't hurt me anymore than the other 40,000 folks on site, most of whom are also vaxxed. Not sure the venue needs this level of caution to carry on a covid safe show so don't believe the mandate is necessary. That is not going to stop me from going to shows however.

??Would you if you had the authority continue with the protocols in place or would you rescind them?
Click to expand...


I'm choosing to not answer your final question, however I would expect most venues to drop the requirement very soon. As far as I can tell, the requirement is currently on paper only. I was at a concert Saturday and the vaccination check-in was a joke. I barely flashed my cell phone displaying my vax pre-check and my whole group was waved past.

ETA - I will say that it sounded intimidating approaching, "Have your vaccination cards and ID's ready!" 

 
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Dragons said:
I'm not getting bogged down in a discussion on the efficacy of masks, however is it unreasonable to believe that an immunocompromised person has some degree of better protection if everyone is wearing masks, vs. they are the only one wearing masks?
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But if the mandate is going away at some point is there really a difference between tomorrow and a week from tomorrow?  There really isn't a significant "protection" that can be implemented in that time and it should be assumed that eventually there won't be a mandate to wear masks so they should already have a plan to some extent.

 
Gally said:
But if the mandate is going away at some point is there really a difference between tomorrow and a week from tomorrow?  There really isn't a significant "protection" that can be implemented in that time and it should be assumed that eventually there won't be a mandate to wear masks so they should already have a plan to some extent.
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Maybe they scheduled a booster around the original plan?

Maybe they're pulling their kid to home school, but need time to get their work situation arranged?

Maybe they're fine with in class, but need to make other arrangements for drop off and pick up?

Maybe they're getting fitted for an N95 mask?

Maybe community spread will be lower?

On the other hand, is there really any harm with waiting an extra week and giving people notice?

 
Dragons said:
Maybe they scheduled a booster around the original plan?

Maybe they're pulling their kid to home school, but need time to get their work situation arranged?

Maybe they're fine with in class, but need to make other arrangements for drop off and pick up?

Maybe they're getting fitted for an N95 mask?

Maybe community spread will be lower?

On the other hand, is there really any harm with waiting an extra week and giving people notice?
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If you are in the group that is that concerned about other people not wearing masks I would venture a guess to say all of those things have already been done.  But to your point, I have no problem with giving a week's notice but I don't think it's a big deal of it doesn't happen.  

 
Jackstraw said:
7 day rolling average of deaths is at 1,900 or so. I will never get over how easily the pain and even deaths of others was/is treated so casually. 
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Yeah, I'd say callously. It's one thing to say we/society must find a way to tolerate the ongoing deaths for the sake of other important goals. Calling it over is just absurd.

 
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