*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (8 Viewers)

[culdeus]

I also agree back to covid stuff... Question for you guys.

My son tested positive yesterday. He lives with us. My wife is being tested as I type this. Assuming she is negative and I do not develop symptoms, what is the proper protocol for quarantine length?  My wife asked the urgent care and they said if she is positive, 10 days from today. If she is negative, 10 days from yesterday because that was when my son was positive. But aren't we potentially exposed to him for the next 9 days as well? 

The part I'm stumbling on is this:  He is in day 2 of being positive. He clears symptoms in say day 5. But on day 4 I was exposed to the virus and it takes up to 10 days for me to show symptoms. Shouldn't I be quarantining for 10 days AFTER he stops showing symptoms or something? 

It is confusing.

This is more or less the guidelines my kids school uses:

Day 0: Exposure 1: Patient 0 is positive later

• Patient 0 can test positive +4 days without symptoms and +2 days with symptoms.  
  
• Patient 0 infectious window (can infect you) is +2 to +14 days without symptoms with a positive test.
  
• Patient 0 infectious window closes as soon as +10 days from a positive test with two negative tests (Controversial, proceed with caution)
  
• Where Exposure 1 is not known it is best to assume Day 0 is 5 days prior to first positive test.  (Controversial)
  

Exposure 2: Patient 1 (Contact of patient 0 and has yet to test +)

• Patient 1 can test positive +6 days without symptoms and +4 days with symptoms.  Earlier testing is not recommended (caveat for Dr. orders and all that)
  
• Recommendation is to test Patient 1 +5 days after first exposure to patient 0's Exposure 1, and again at +10 days if not 100% completely isolated from Patient 0.  
  
• 100% isolated is not sharing same HVAC system.  
  

You are in the clear once your Patient 1 is negative with a test +5 days after Patient 0 tests negative twice or is 10 days from fever or symptoms.  

 

[beer 30]

Why is the headline about travelling when the story is about large gatherings?

Because you questioned it, consider yourself in quarantine for the next 14 days 

I don't know. I think we're getting a little out there with this. Yes, there will definitely be a spike, and probably a pretty big one, from the Thanksgiving travel. Are 50 million people infected because of it? No.

 

[Doug B]

Seems to be a little dehumanizing to make it ok. "Well they brought it on themselves so If I want to cut corners on safety and bad things happen its not on me its on them." 

 

 

[top dog]

This is more or less the guidelines my kids school uses:

Day 0: Exposure 1: Patient 0 is positive later

• Patient 0 can test positive +4 days without symptoms and +2 days with symptoms.  
  
• Patient 0 infectious window (can infect you) is +2 to +14 days without symptoms with a positive test.
  
• Patient 0 infectious window closes as soon as +10 days from a positive test with two negative tests (Controversial, proceed with caution)
  
• Where Exposure 1 is not known it is best to assume Day 0 is 5 days prior to first positive test.  (Controversial)
  

Exposure 2: Patient 1 (Contact of patient 0 and has yet to test +)

• Patient 1 can test positive +6 days without symptoms and +4 days with symptoms.  Earlier testing is not recommended (caveat for Dr. orders and all that)
  
• Recommendation is to test Patient 1 +5 days after first exposure to patient 0's Exposure 1, and again at +10 days if not 100% completely isolated from Patient 0.  
  
• 100% isolated is not sharing same HVAC system.  
  

You are in the clear once your Patient 1 is negative with a test +5 days after Patient 0 tests negative twice or is 10 days from fever or symptoms.  

 

I've read that a few times and am really not sure what that all means.

 

[jamny]

Because you questioned it, consider yourself in quarantine for the next 14 days 

I don't know. I think we're getting a little out there with this. Yes, there will definitely be a spike, and probably a pretty big one, from the Thanksgiving travel. Are 50 million people infected because of it? No.

We travelled the day before Thanksgiving and as per NY's newest rule, we got tested a second time yesterday in hopes of avoiding the 14 day quarantine.

 

[MAC_32]

It is a piece of the puzzle, and I get what Mac is saying (even if I think he doesn't get how his posts are coming off).   

IMO our problem currently isn't on that end, it's on the spreading it too quickly end.    Yes, I agree that things like being healthy and taking Vitamin D might slightly increase your chances once you get it, but the trouble is that doesn't mitigate the spread - it's just helps you combat it.  Our trouble is we can't seem to mask up and stay away from each other to begin with.  

We currently have an issue at our restaurant.  We are on our 3rd positive case in the last few weeks, and these are young people - 2 are in good health.   Imagine that - 1 was from a wedding, the current one was bragging about going to 3 Thanksgivings, and one was at the bars (his entire dart team got it, and the "healthy" one in the group is currently on a ventilator).   Again, I get what people are saying in here about staying healthy, but this is why it's a hot topic for people and anger levels rise.  

There are certain subjects I've decided not to be nice about anymore. I had forgotten what event influenced my decision making when it came to health and @Jackstraw unintentionally reminded me. Michelle Obama being taken to the cleaners for making healthy lunches a priority was the straw that broke the camel's back. 

I don't care that my directness about this subject will rub some the wrong way. I actually think it's a feature; not a bug. From my perspective resistance and misinterpretation of the message whether overtly or accidentally is a cost of doing business. It is an engagement opportunity though. Our society needs smacked across the jaw when it comes to our health. The more blows from more people the the better. The psychological and economic influences @parasaurolophus mentioned are all too real and must be fought in order to adequately combat. Being nice about it and finding reasons to justify not making it a priority unintentionally enables the behavior to sustain. Demanding healthy behavioral decisions in 2020 isn't about just eating well and exercising; masking up and keeping your distance from others among many others things are baked into the message too.  

I don't know if my messaging or actions will have a meaningful impact, but I think it's the right thing to do in our current environment. 

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I also agree back to covid stuff... Question for you guys.

My son tested positive yesterday. He lives with us. My wife is being tested as I type this. Assuming she is negative and I do not develop symptoms, what is the proper protocol for quarantine length?  My wife asked the urgent care and they said if she is positive, 10 days from today. If she is negative, 10 days from yesterday because that was when my son was positive. But aren't we potentially exposed to him for the next 9 days as well? 

The part I'm stumbling on is this:  He is in day 2 of being positive. He clears symptoms in say day 5. But on day 4 I was exposed to the virus and it takes up to 10 days for me to show symptoms. Shouldn't I be quarantining for 10 days AFTER he stops showing symptoms or something? 

It is confusing.

You should be confining him to his room and everyone wear masks when interacting probably.  

 

[parasaurolophus]

The verbal game of "I'm not touching you, I'm not touching you" is little better.

I dont really understand this post. I didnt dance around anything. If you want clarification on something just ask. I am not shy. 

 

[Payne]

I also agree back to covid stuff... Question for you guys.

My son tested positive yesterday. He lives with us. My wife is being tested as I type this. Assuming she is negative and I do not develop symptoms, what is the proper protocol for quarantine length?  My wife asked the urgent care and they said if she is positive, 10 days from today. If she is negative, 10 days from yesterday because that was when my son was positive. But aren't we potentially exposed to him for the next 9 days as well? 

The part I'm stumbling on is this:  He is in day 2 of being positive. He clears symptoms in say day 5. But on day 4 I was exposed to the virus and it takes up to 10 days for me to show symptoms. Shouldn't I be quarantining for 10 days AFTER he stops showing symptoms or something? 

It is confusing.

My youngest daughter tested positive on November 3rd. I was in the car with her the two days previous with no masks on. I sat in line with her and comforted her as she was pretty scared. That evening, my wife and oldest daughter went for testing. I assumed I had it. Wife tested positive. Older daughter negative. WTH? So I went that evening as well. Negative. Youngest daughter was told quarantine for 10 days from last contact....which was already 4 days earlier. Wife was told 10 days from positive test. Two different hospitals.

My wife and two daughters stayed in their rooms. I vacated to the basement. My wife had a headache for maybe two days. Daughter never skipped a beat. 

My oldest daughter was swimming at the time for high school. She was notified if she tested negative a second time, she could swim. She tested negative two days later.

We remained distant for two full weeks and finally just slowly getting back to normal. Eating separate was awful for my kids. 

Point is, it's not a forgone conclusion you will get it. Good luck and take care.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

My youngest daughter tested positive on November 3rd. I was in the car with her the two days previous with no masks on. I sat in line with her and comforted her as she was pretty scared. That evening, my wife and oldest daughter went for testing. I assumed I had it. Wife tested positive. Older daughter negative. WTH? So I went that evening as well. Negative. Youngest daughter was told quarantine for 10 days from last contact....which was already 4 days earlier. Wife was told 10 days from positive test. Two different hospitals.

My wife and two daughters stayed in their rooms. I vacated to the basement. My wife had a headache for maybe two days. Daughter never skipped a beat. 

My oldest daughter was swimming at the time for high school. She was notified if she tested negative a second time, she could swim. She tested negative two days later.

We remained distant for two full weeks and finally just slowly getting back to normal. Eating separate was awful for my kids. 

Point is, it's not a forgone conclusion you will get it. Good luck and take care.

My friend's niece has it -- positive last week sometime.  The mom tested positive yesterday with symptoms.  The other 3 members of the household are waiting on results.

 

[Pipes]

So we know we aren't going to magically make the nation more fit in the next 4-5 months so what's the point of the argument? 

Seems to be a little dehumanizing to make it ok. "Well they brought it on themselves so If I want to cut corners on safety and bad things happen its not on me its on them." 

The level of rationalization this country is using to do want they want and not what they should is astounding. I'm not talking about about shutting down schools and businesses. I'm talking about doing the easy (or at least easier) stuff. And this is happening in my life, with my friends, my family, who I think should know better. Patriots. Flag wavers. Just cannot do it.  

My point of the argument is to take some steps, personally to help combat the virus.  Since this country is filled with so many irresponsible, selfish people who wont wear mask, continue to go to parties, etc.  Ultimately we can't count on others for our own well being.  So wear a mask, social distance when out in public and do your best to limit contact with those outside your household.  Also dropping a few lbs (if needed), exercise more and supplement your diet with vitamins, if deficient, is all part of a good plan to help battle the disease.

 

[KarmaPolice]

My point of the argument is to take some steps, personally to help combat the virus.  Since this country is filled with so many irresponsible, selfish people who wont wear mask, continue to go to parties, etc.  Ultimately we can't count on others for our own well being.  So wear a mask, social distance when out in public and do your best to limit contact with those outside your household.  Also dropping a few lbs (if needed), exercise more and supplement your diet with vitamins, if deficient, is all part of a good plan to help battle the disease.

Agreed, but this is different than saying that everyone can do this, and that they made their bed so they need to lay in it when it comes to what we are going through with this pandemic.  

 

[top dog]

You should be confining him to his room and everyone wear masks when interacting probably.  

He is confined to his room and has exclusive access to the upstairs bathroom. He wears a KN95 mask when leaving his room to go to the bathroom. If he needs food or something I put it outside his door, knock and then run away like a little girl. It's about the best we can do I guess.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

He is confined to his room and has exclusive access to the upstairs bathroom. He wears a KN95 mask when leaving his room to go to the bathroom. If he needs food or something I put it outside his door, knock and then run away like a little girl. It's about the best we can do I guess.

Probably best you can ask for. 

 

[The Z Machine]

We have a nanny that comes in to make sure my 7 year twins are online for their classes.  She also makes them lunch, then leaves after that.  My MIL takes over in the afternoon.  This allows my wife and I to have work calls, and actually be productive.

After 2 weeks of mask usage by all in the house while the nanny is here, we made it through an outdoor Thanksgiving meal with some friends.  Precautorios seemed to be working out.  Nanny was here yesterday and we said she didn't need the mask because we weren't planning on any meet-up events until around Christmas.

This morning she tells us she's got a fever and other symptoms...  So, she is obviously going to get tested ASAP.  No one else has any symptoms.  My MIL is nearing 80, has high BP, and is not in great shape, which is why we are trying to protect her as much as possible.

I don't even want to think about having to handle childcare all day over these next 3 stressful weeks, let alone if one of us catches this from the nanny.  Ugh.

 

[Bamboo Bill]

We have a nanny that comes in to make sure my 7 year twins are online for their classes.  She also makes them lunch, then leaves after that.  My MIL takes over in the afternoon.  This allows my wife and I to have work calls, and actually be productive.

After 2 weeks of mask usage by all in the house while the nanny is here, we made it through an outdoor Thanksgiving meal with some friends.  Precautorios seemed to be working out.  Nanny was here yesterday and we said she didn't need the mask because we weren't planning on any meet-up events until around Christmas.

This morning she tells us she's got a fever and other symptoms...  So, she is obviously going to get tested ASAP.  No one else has any symptoms.  My MIL is nearing 80, has high BP, and is not in great shape, which is why we are trying to protect her as much as possible.

I don't even want to think about having to handle childcare all day over these next 3 stressful weeks, let alone if one of us catches this from the nanny.  Ugh.

Yikes.  Good luck Z.  :(

 

[parasaurolophus]

He is confined to his room and has exclusive access to the upstairs bathroom. He wears a KN95 mask when leaving his room to go to the bathroom. If he needs food or something I put it outside his door, knock and then run away like a little girl. It's about the best we can do I guess.

at this visual. 

Everybody should have a plan in place for how they will handle an infected family member. 

I hear so many people that think it is a foregone conclusion that if one family member gets it everybody gets it. The data does not support that. Over half of the people that get this do not give it to a single other person. 

Even if you determine there is a minimum level of codependency needed and isolation in the home isnt possible, there are still precautions that can be taken. 

 

[[icon]]

Thanks for the positive vibes ol' buddy! 

Sorry Gb just frustrated and seeing it spread like wildfire in households where it hits. You know I'm rooting for you guys. Hope you caught it in time, Gb. 

 

[The Z Machine]

at this visual. 

Everybody should have a plan in place for how they will handle an infected family member. 

I hear so many people that think it is a foregone conclusion that if one family member gets it everybody gets it. The data does not support that. Over half of the people that get this do not give it to a single other person. 

Even if you determine there is a minimum level of codependency needed and isolation in the home isnt possible, there are still precautions that can be taken. 

Agreed.  If you haven't talked about an individual plan for each family member or combinations of family members do so now. 

 

[KarmaPolice]

There are certain subjects I've decided not to be nice about anymore. I had forgotten what event influenced my decision making when it came to health and @Jackstraw unintentionally reminded me. Michelle Obama being taken to the cleaners for making healthy lunches a priority was the straw that broke the camel's back. 

I don't care that my directness about this subject will rub some the wrong way. I actually think it's a feature; not a bug. From my perspective resistance and misinterpretation of the message whether overtly or accidentally is a cost of doing business. It is an engagement opportunity though. Our society needs smacked across the jaw when it comes to our health. The more blows from more people the the better. The psychological and economic influences @parasaurolophus mentioned are all too real and must be fought in order to adequately combat. Being nice about it and finding reasons to justify not making it a priority unintentionally enables the behavior to sustain. Demanding healthy behavioral decisions in 2020 isn't about just eating well and exercising; masking up and keeping your distance from others among many others things are baked into the message too.  

I don't know if my messaging or actions will have a meaningful impact, but I think it's the right thing to do in our current environment. 

Cool.  I will just stop interacting with you after this about this topic then.    I get your stance, and honestly don't disagree with it in principle, i've just found that I don't have much patience anymore for people that display a lack of empathy.    Especially since you went through this, maybe be more of a leader and coach and less coming across as saying that anybody that doesn't do what you did is a lazy POS?    I guess I am just not big on the whole "tough love" thing and thinking we need to smack people in the mouth about this.  

 

[parasaurolophus]

Agreed.  If you haven't talked about an individual plan for each family member or combinations of family members do so now. 

@KarmaPolice I think you asked me a question about air purifiers previously and where to run them and why. This is exactly the kind of situation i have them for.

I have them running so that if we get a call that somebody that was in our house(or lives here) tested positive at least we already had them running and they could have possibly helped us. You dont find out until after the contact. 

 

[KarmaPolice]

@KarmaPolice I think you asked me a question about air purifiers previously and where to run them and why. This is exactly the kind of situation i have them for.

I have them running so that if we get a call that somebody that was in our house(or lives here) tested positive at least we already had them running and they could have possibly helped us. You dont find out until after the contact. 

I might have missed it if there were recommendations on which ones were decent for home use.  

I will fully admit - when talking about it, we didn't include this as a part of the plan and should.  

 

[The Z Machine]

I might have missed it if there were recommendations on which ones were decent for home use.  

I will fully admit - when talking about it, we didn't include this as a part of the plan and should.  

I think I may make my own with a MERV-13 and a box fan.

 

[top dog]

at this visual. 

Everybody should have a plan in place for how they will handle an infected family member. 

I hear so many people that think it is a foregone conclusion that if one family member gets it everybody gets it. The data does not support that. Over half of the people that get this do not give it to a single other person. 

Even if you determine there is a minimum level of codependency needed and isolation in the home isnt possible, there are still precautions that can be taken. 

I've thought about this quite a bit over the last few months. Isolation into one room and seperate bathrooms was the best we really could do. I talked with my wife last week about purchasing an air purifier for the furnace. Wish I had thought of that months ago. It is what it is at the moment. The wife and I are both good and will do what we can to stay that way. She fought and beat cancer. Can't be this BS that takes her out.

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

This isnt true. Happens all the time where people dont spread it within the house. In fact I bet it is 50/50. 

I've heard plenty of similar anecdotal stories personally as well. I'd be willing to bet it's way more than 50/50. I say that because I think the others ARE most likely infected, they are just asymptomatic. And THAT is the huge difference in why this virus is such a problem. IMHO. Without multiple negative tests, it's hard to believe that this thing is not spreading to others who live in the same household without extreme measures being taken to protect said others. IDK, maybe that's just my thinking. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

I've heard plenty of similar anecdotal stories personally as well. I'd be willing to bet it's way more than 50/50. I say that because I think the others ARE most likely infected, they are just asymptomatic. And THAT is the huge difference in why this virus is such a problem. IMHO. Without multiple negative tests, it's hard to believe that this thing is not spreading to others who live in the same household without extreme measures being taken to protect said others. IDK, maybe that's just my thinking. 

I am not going by anecdotal stories. From Atlantic article by Zeynep.

 A recent paper found that in Hong Kong, which had extensive testing and contact tracing, about 19 percent of cases were responsible for 80 percent of transmission, while 69 percent of cases did not infect another person. This finding is not rare: Multiple studies from the beginning have suggested that as few as 10 to 20 percent of infected people may be responsible for as much as 80 to 90 percent of transmission, and that many people barely transmit it.

 

[parasaurolophus]

I think I may make my own with a MERV-13 and a box fan.

I made some of these early on. Mentioned this to biff in this thread. Even with making the cube design,  I still found that this moved far more air. You can make your own replacement filters using merv 13s to make them far cheaper.  

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

I am not going by anecdotal stories. From Atlantic article by Zeynep.

sorry, I didn't mean to imply you were, I worded that poorly

Just looking at the overall picture of worldwide infections (and particularly in the US), I'm skeptical of those living in close quarters not getting infected (again, perhaps without showing symptoms). I don't know that others are even getting tested if they aren't showing symptoms. I probably would not, myself. I don't have time to read the whole thing you posted, but I did skim, and near the bottom it gets at what was the gist of my thoughts. Testing. We (again, the US in particular) have failed miserably in just about all aspects of testing. Availability, accuracy, timing of getting tested and timing of getting results. All those things are part of what makes me skeptical about the "same household" statistics, which I have read as well as my aforementioned anecdotal personal stories.

 

[parasaurolophus]

sorry, I didn't mean to imply you were, I worded that poorly

Just looking at the overall picture of worldwide infections (and particularly in the US), I'm skeptical of those living in close quarters not getting infected (again, perhaps without showing symptoms). I don't know that others are even getting tested if they aren't showing symptoms. I probably would not, myself. I don't have time to read the whole thing you posted, but I did skim, and near the bottom it gets at what was the gist of my thoughts. Testing. We (again, the US in particular) have failed miserably in just about all aspects of testing. Availability, accuracy, timing of getting tested and timing of getting results. All those things are part of what makes me skeptical about the "same household" statistics, which I have read as well as my aforementioned anecdotal personal stories.

Some of those studies are from countries where they test quite frequently. And if people are most contagious right before showing symptoms (not sure I believe this yet) then it isn't like they would have been able to avoid exposure by testing. Plus testing here is plenty available for direct exposures to positive cases.

To add some anecdotal stories too though... One of my friends had 4 people in house infected by index case. He was only one with no exposure to patient zero. He was in the house with his family the whole time. He never got it. Has tested 4 times now. All negative. 

Wife's friend from work had her twin sons infected at a graduation party. No other family members got it.

Our friends dad got it, they think from the hospital when he had a surgery performed since he had to get tested before surgery and was quarantined for a whole week before and after that as was his wife. Several days after surgery he got sick. Ends up testing positive for covid. His wife isn't fully functional so our friend had to go to the house to care for him and her mom. Neither got infected. 

 

[Ksquared]

I know last spring there was an outbreak on a cruise ship that was headed to Antartica.  The country that finally allowed them into port would not allow anyone off the ship until they had a negative test result.  The passengers were forced to stay in their rooms for over a week.  Many spouses cohabitating in the same berth (which if you have been on a cruise you know are small) had one positive and one negative after a week of exposure.  In fact in several cases the spouse that tested positive died.  There were a lot of deaths for a small cruise ship.  Some articles on this  were linked in this thread last spring. 

After this incident I started to look at Covid a little differently, you could be in close contact with some for extensive time and not get it.  I have read several medical articles in the last couple of months about this phenomenon and the medical communities efforts to identify what seems to make some people fairly resistant to getting it (just like many are asymptomatic) rather than becoming seriously ill.

 

[the rover]

Over half of the people that get this do not give it to a single other person. 

I hadn't seen this explained in the way the article you posted explained it.   Thanks.

 

[Biff84]

This isnt true. Happens all the time where people dont spread it within the house. In fact I bet it is 50/50. 

A lot of things to consider. I do believe you can successfully quarantine yourself from the rest of your family if taking the proper precautions. I think the spread during ‘home quarantine’ is likely less if properly done with a majority of spread happening prior to the family member testing positive. The other family members likely were exposed and just were too early to show symptoms or test positive. Similar to the people claiming that the flu shot gave them the flu.

I also think that the cases of family spread could be underreported because they don’t always get follow-up tests, especially children. Family members are assumed to be exposed and if they show symptoms they don’t see a point in getting tested because it won’t change their treatment.

Personally I’ve resigned to the fact that if I get it, I will pass it onto the rest of my immediate family. Early in the pandemic, I did everything I could to separate from my family - sleeping in another room, immediately showering and washing clothes when I get home, wiping everything down in the garage before entering, etc. I still do many of those things but as more was learned about COVID, I realized that I would never be able to do enough to completely protect them if I become infected. It’s something that’s always in the back of my mind and helps me make responsible decisions knowing that my decisions become their consequences. But I couldn’t continue to constantly quarantine from them with my frequent exposure to people with COVID.

 

[culdeus]

at this visual. 

Everybody should have a plan in place for how they will handle an infected family member. 

I hear so many people that think it is a foregone conclusion that if one family member gets it everybody gets it. The data does not support that. Over half of the people that get this do not give it to a single other person. 

Even if you determine there is a minimum level of codependency needed and isolation in the home isnt possible, there are still precautions that can be taken. 

I think the contact guidelines are pretty good at this point.  They seem to be working in a school context insofar as time in window and things.  Having rapid tests helps a lot w it

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

I know last spring there was an outbreak on a cruise ship that was headed to Antartica.  The country that finally allowed them into port would not allow anyone off the ship until they had a negative test result.  The passengers were forced to stay in their rooms for over a week.  Many spouses cohabitating in the same berth (which if you have been on a cruise you know are small) had one positive and one negative after a week of exposure.  In fact in several cases the spouse that tested positive died.  There were a lot of deaths for a small cruise ship.  Some articles on this  were linked in this thread last spring. 

After this incident I started to look at Covid a little differently, you could be in close contact with some for extensive time and not get it.  I have read several medical articles in the last couple of months about this phenomenon and the medical communities efforts to identify what seems to make some people fairly resistant to getting it (just like many are asymptomatic) rather than becoming seriously ill.

I don't know if you saw the one I linked to a few pages back (last week sometime) about interferon deficiency, but guessing that may be one of the things you read about. I'd be interested to read any others that you may have run across. 

 

[culdeus]

 

I've read that a few times and am really not sure what that all means.

This really applies for where you have secondary contact to a positive person in same house only.  

 

[Dr_Zaius]

 A recent paper found that in Hong Kong, which had extensive testing and contact tracing, about 19 percent of cases were responsible for 80 percent of transmission, while 69 percent of cases did not infect another person. This finding is not rare: Multiple studies from the beginning have suggested that as few as 10 to 20 percent of infected people may be responsible for as much as 80 to 90 percent of transmission, and that many people barely transmit it.

I had read something similar, but can't remember if it was based on the same study or not.  To me, it's a very compelling piece of evidence in that it could potentially explain some of the oddities about where this spreads.  It would suggest that it's ultimately the behavior of superspreaders (whether they are essential workers, people who don't know they're sick, people who dgaf, etc.) and the number of people they expose that drives the pandemic.  The behavior of the rest of the people is probably almost in the noise.  Of course, unless you can identify who the superspreaders are and how they are spreading it, you're right back to square one.

 

[beer 30]

Not using this platform as a sales point just offering some advice on air purifiers. The units my company settled on for sale to the general public are these Medify Air units. They're as good as any out there but really, any unit that utilizes HEPA filtration works the same. If I was looking to buy one the first thing I'd look at is the dB rating because you don't want a loud, rattle trap in house running 24/7. If it utilizes HEPA filtration they are all the same so you don't have to worry about one HEPA filter being better than another. The next thing I'd look at is air flow/movement. Ideally you want it around 400 cfm. That allows the air to move but not so fast that it won't contact the filter (you're not blowing the bad stuff through the filter). It won't catch everything in one pass but over time, the more the air passes over the filter, the more bad stuff drops out, the cleaner your air. HEPA >>> MERV

I can say from experience these Medify units are quiet and good for home use. The smallest one we get, the MA-25 is good for a small bedroom. the MA-40 is probably good for a kitchen area and the biggest one, the MA-112 I'd use in a large bedroom or living room. They are light weight, easy to move around and the filters last for 2000 hours I think. In order to effectively clean the air in your house, you'd need multiple units unless you invested some real money in a whole home filtration system.

Also, you see a lot of stuff advertising UV light technology. UV works but a lot of the stuff being sold now is using UV LED lights which are orders of magnitude less effective than UV lamps. Not saying they are all bad just buyer beware. If you see an air purifier that has a pretty blue light, advertises UV light disinfection and sells for $30, it's probably a cheap UV LED that isn't really doing much. It's still doing something more than nothing but don't expect it to kill every virus in your house the minute you turn it on.

 

[parasaurolophus]

I hadn't seen this explained in the way the article you posted explained it.   Thanks.

Not sure if you are on twitter, but she is a great follow if you are. So many great articles since the start of the pandemic. 

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Work as RN for the state on weekends at a home for those with developmental disabilities. The home is basically set up as 3 separate apartments divided by double doors with 3-4 individuals per apartments. 

Apparently (at least) one of them tested positive yesterday. Heard news from a co-worker yesterday. As disorganized as management at this home is, wouldn't be surprised if I heard nothing about from them before this weekend. Undecided what I'm going to do. I'm thinking the worst just knowing how disorganized things are there.

The one that tested positive has his own bedroom.... separated MAYBE 5 foot from the rooms of 70+ year old man and a 50 year old male. To make matters worse, my co-worker/friend was in direct contact with the individual yesterday (then pulled a double....working at a completely different state home for an eight hour shift). Unbeknownst to him, the individual from first home would test positive later in day. I never understood the rationale, in general, allowing employees to work different homes.... and now here we are. I was asked on a couple occasions (due to shortages) but refused.

Now up to 2 clients and 1 staff positive. Have a feeling gonna spread to all soon. Facility is basically 3 apartments separated by double doors...2 clients affected were in apartments on opposite ends and had no direct contact to my knowledge....doesn't mean a support worker/nurse (possible the covid+ one) didn't work with them both at some point. 

Got tested last Friday. Getting tested again tomorrow. 

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Talked  to a friend recently who had Covid a couple of months ago. Her infection wasn't bad, she didn't even go to the doctor. But she knew she had it because she works in a health care related profession so has constant risk of exposure despite taking all the possible precautions, and at first it was just normal very mild cold symptoms but then when she completely lost the ability to taste and smell she knew what she had.  I asked her if she noticed any lingering effects. She said she had JUST gotten her senses of taste and smell back (almost two months later). She said she gets tingly sensations in her extremities sometimes. She said she has a sensation occasionally, best way she could describe it, like her head was in a tunnel. But the most annoying thing she said, was annoying leg cramps daily, despite drinking tons of water and wearing compression stockings to try and alleviate the cramping.

Has anyone else who's had it (or knows someone who has) experienced the leg cramping or the Head TunnelTM or tingly sensations? Just curious. 

 

[Jackstraw]

I know last spring there was an outbreak on a cruise ship that was headed to Antartica.  The country that finally allowed them into port would not allow anyone off the ship until they had a negative test result.  The passengers were forced to stay in their rooms for over a week.  Many spouses cohabitating in the same berth (which if you have been on a cruise you know are small) had one positive and one negative after a week of exposure.  In fact in several cases the spouse that tested positive died.  There were a lot of deaths for a small cruise ship.  Some articles on this  were linked in this thread last spring. 

After this incident I started to look at Covid a little differently, you could be in close contact with some for extensive time and not get it.  I have read several medical articles in the last couple of months about this phenomenon and the medical communities efforts to identify what seems to make some people fairly resistant to getting it (just like many are asymptomatic) rather than becoming seriously ill.

Like The Stand. Some just don't get it I guess.  

 

[Peak]

Has anyone else who's had it (or knows someone who has) experienced the leg cramping or the Head TunnelTM or tingly sensations? Just curious. 

It's been almost a month since I've had it.  I am starting to be able to smell things again, but just like a brief scent.  Sense of taste is still gone.  I understand the Head Tunnel thing.  I get that from time to time.  Honestly, I thought it was allergies and never equated it to Covid.  But now that you mention it, I guess it makes sense.  It's an odd sensation.  I would put it more as being underwater.  Leg cramping, and just body cramps/aches still occur as well.  

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Talked  to a friend recently who had Covid a couple of months ago. Her infection wasn't bad, she didn't even go to the doctor. But she knew she had it because she works in a health care related profession so has constant risk of exposure despite taking all the possible precautions, and at first it was just normal very mild cold symptoms but then when she completely lost the ability to taste and smell she knew what she had.  I asked her if she noticed any lingering effects. She said she had JUST gotten her senses of taste and smell back (almost two months later). She said she gets tingly sensations in her extremities sometimes. She said she has a sensation occasionally, best way she could describe it, like her head was in a tunnel. But the most annoying thing she said, was annoying leg cramps daily, despite drinking tons of water and wearing compression stockings to try and alleviate the cramping.

Has anyone else who's had it (or knows someone who has) experienced the leg cramping or the Head TunnelTM or tingly sensations? Just curious. 

found this while researching... pretty interesting survey results (although fairly small sample size, which may be even more telling I suppose) on "Long Haul" symptoms:

COVID-19 “Long Hauler” Symptoms Survey Report

 

[gianmarco]

found this while researching... pretty interesting survey results (although fairly small sample size, which may be even more telling I suppose) on "Long Haul" symptoms:

COVID-19 “Long Hauler” Symptoms Survey Report

Did you watch the 60 minutes episode on this?

 

[culdeus]

Did you watch the 60 minutes episode on this?

The link someone posted a few days ago about starbucks getting upset about longhaul non tasters was eye opening too.

 

[gianmarco]

The link someone posted a few days ago about starbucks getting upset about longhaul non tasters was eye opening too.

I missed it.  Have the link?

 

[parasaurolophus]

The link someone posted a few days ago about starbucks getting upset about longhaul non tasters was eye opening too.

Reminds me of something i read about reviews of scented candles online. How the ratings had taken a hit. 

 

[Penguin]

I missed it.  Have the link?

link

 

[gianmarco]

link

Heh...I just posted that link a few posts above.  I was wondering about the Starbucks link.  Thanks, though.

 

[Nathan R. Jessep]

Did you watch the 60 minutes episode on this?

Damn. 

A few things that stuck out to me from that:

• Specialists seeing a large number of these patients and saying "we don't know what's causing their symptoms"
  
• They think the immune system might still be in overdrive months after the infection
  
• Autopsy results showing damage to heart, brain, liver, kidneys, lungs and unprecedented blood clotting in major organs
  
• NONE of the patients they've seen have have recovered fully yet; some are 90-95%
  

Jeeeeez. Would be interesting to see the numbers of long haul symptoms vs the total number of cases as a percentage.  Either way, other than maybe some lagging fatigue, I don't recall ever hearing anything like that for, well, just the flu.