Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
74% sure.If Purdy wasn't a huge question mark now, this wouldn't be terrible but as it is, are you sure this is not collusion?
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****OFFICIAL DYNASTY TRADES**** (4 Viewers)
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Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
That makes no sense at all. How are there still Skyy Moore believers out there? Lol. Good work at the negotiating table though.I offered to include him for a modest upgrade on his side, and he declined and countered with Skyy Moore.This feels like you just robbed him. Not sure why he would even consider dropping Lance/Hall and taking Skyy Moore (total bust it looks like so far). 1.01 is worth a lot more than that. Maybe it would be fairer if you had left Lance in the deal so he for sure got the 49ers starting QB. I don't play Dynasty SF personally but this feels like a really bad trade for him. Good trade for you.so here’s a good “ya never know what might happen” deal. I posted the 1st offer in the “worst trade you’ve ever been offered” topic.
I countered, and chatted with the owner via text. Went back & forth for a day+. Now we have an accord that I’m pretty happy with. I think.
Originally rec’d offer of Purdy/Lance/Hall/Swift for his 1.01
Nope!
16 team, PPR, IDP, SF with performance scoring (TFL/SFL = big points)
I gave: Swift/Purdy/Skyy Moore
I get: 1.01
It leaves me with only Fields at QB in a SF format, but I’ve found in performance IDP where a sack for a loss can be 26 points, that’s not all that bad. I like Purdy, but he’s about to go through a significant surgery, and I’m not sure what his upside is. I suspect we’ve seen close to his ceiling, which might be better for RL football than FF. ~15-25 a week at QB isn’t that great.
We had a deal in place for a swift/purdy/6.06 for 1.01, but he decided he wanted Hall. I wouldn’t budge, so he offered this up and I smashed accept.
If Swift becomes the stud 20 touch guy everyone thought he’d be, I may lose this trade. For now I’m very happy to move off of him before the Lions Re-sign Williams or draft a Williams replacement. I also like Skyy Moore more than many here, so that was a dude I didn’t want to part with. But some here feel he’s a ST guy, so maybe that’s a win too before his value craters more.
I’m very tempted to flip the 1.01 for the 1.02 or 1.03 + player(s) and take a QB, but I’m also very tempted to take Bijan and have him in both of my dynasty leagues.
And as a small bonus I got to keep Lance, who I now hope starts or gets traded. That’s kinda crazy - I would have gladly included him for not a lot more.
And I cleared 2 roster spots.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Stevenson was very valuable in ppr leagues last season.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
He’s the reason I made it to the LCG in mine
ghostguy123
Footballguy
FFPC standard.
Mark Andrews.
For.
Jameson Williams, Evan Engram, and pick 1.07
Mark Andrews.
For.
Jameson Williams, Evan Engram, and pick 1.07
He’ll be 25 in 5 days.
For better or worse, the Pats have a well earned RBBC reputation and a constant rotation of horses in their stable. And you have to factor in there is a minefield of Free Agency and a very deep RB draft still looming. His current ADP in startups is the 4th round which is worth more than a future first (I put next to no value on Gibson, maybe a late 2nd at best so I guess cancels the 3rd here) but not ZOMG significantly more, especially if that pick has a shot to be early.
Edit: Just realized it’s FFPC too where roster spots have a lot of value, could see cutting Gibson and gaining a roster spot. Much important for a rebuilding team than a competitive one obviously.
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Boston
Footballguy
This does nothing to change my opinion on this specific deal...now, if you say want to move on from Stevenson due to a history of RRBC I wouldn't blame you at all but it would have to be a better deal...although I would say what RBs in the BB era outside of Dillon and early Antowain deserved to not be in a RBBC?
He’s a YAC machine, should continue to provide a lot of value in PPR for the next two years before his contract is up at age 27.
Does he get more carries? Seems unlikely given the nature of the Pats, even with Harris leaving I would think most are expecting the Pats to bring in someone or someones new. Which is why he doesn’t carry the value some think he does despite his numbers this past year.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Based on what exactly?
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
DropKick
Footballguy
In general, Jamo and company. Might depend on current roster composition.
Boston
Footballguy
Like most teams the Pats will have some form of RBBC, it is just the reality of today's NFL...there is one major difference between Stevenson and pretty much every other quality RB they have had since Dillon...he is very good running and receiving...if you look at most Patriot backs they are usually either a runner (ex. Blount, Green-Ellis, Ridley, Michel, Harris) or a receiver (ex. Vereen, White...Woodhead and Faulk go here as well but they did run it well but were definite RBBC guys...pre-injury Dion Lewis was trending towards being a potential outlier like Stevenson is)...Stevenson's skill set has not been seen in a Patriot uniform since Dillon...due to that I would be real careful applying past history with how he will be used.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Almost every team uses some form of RBBC, so if it’s a concern with Stevenson it should be a concern with almost every back.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
When Harris came back healthy last season, he had trouble getting snaps because Stevenson was dominating. He doesn’t require being replaced on third downs, either, like some of the past RBs they’ve had.
I just think it’s easy to rely on platitudes but sometimes you have to dive deeper.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
….or, this.Like most teams the Pats will have some form of RBBC, it is just the reality of today's NFL...there is one major difference between Stevenson and pretty much every other quality RB they have had since Dillon...he is very good running and receiving...if you look at most Patriot backs they are usually either a runner (ex. Blount, Green-Ellis, Ridley, Michel, Harris) or a receiver (ex. Vereen, White...Woodhead and Faulk go here as well but they did run it well but were definite RBBC guys...pre-injury Dion Lewis was trending towards being a potential outlier like Stevenson is)...Stevenson's skill set has not been seen in a Patriot uniform since Dillon...due to that I would be real careful applying past history with how he will be used.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
Boston
Footballguy
Almost every team uses some form of RBBC, so if it’s a concern with Stevenson it should be a concern with almost every back.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
When Harris came back healthy last season, he had trouble getting snaps because Stevenson was dominating. He doesn’t require being replaced on their downs like some of the past RBs they’ve had.
I just think it’s easy to rely on platitudes but sometimes you have to delete very deeper.
You just hit on my biggest pet peeve in fantasy these days...the search for the holy grail that is a bell-cow back like Eddie George or Emmit back in the dark ages...there is just not going to be many of these guys anymore and when you find one not named Derrick Henry they probably won't last long (which is why I would flip them pretty quickly before they hit a cliff)...the key for me is are they used a good amount in both the rushing and receiving game...I tend to stay away from guys who are not involved in the passing game because they tend to be TD dependent...70 yards rushing is a good day in the NFL but with no TDs or receptions it's not in fantasy.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
How could you leave Rex Burkhead off of your otherwise comprehensive post?Like most teams the Pats will have some form of RBBC, it is just the reality of today's NFL...there is one major difference between Stevenson and pretty much every other quality RB they have had since Dillon...he is very good running and receiving...if you look at most Patriot backs they are usually either a runner (ex. Blount, Green-Ellis, Ridley, Michel, Harris) or a receiver (ex. Vereen, White...Woodhead and Faulk go here as well but they did run it well but were definite RBBC guys...pre-injury Dion Lewis was trending towards being a potential outlier like Stevenson is)...Stevenson's skill set has not been seen in a Patriot uniform since Dillon...due to that I would be real careful applying past history with how he will be used.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
Jokes aside, I’m with you on Stevenson. He’s the best back they’ve had since Corey Dillon. Maybe even better with his receiving skills. (Though IIRC Dillon was a capable receiver in CIN, but for whatever reason NEP just didn’t throw to him much)
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
This is something @menobrown and I were discussing in the Gibbs topic. Given the current landscape of the NFL, it’s better to get the 50+ reception or more RB in PPR formats.Almost every team uses some form of RBBC, so if it’s a concern with Stevenson it should be a concern with almost every back.
A long history of RBBC and constantly rotating names at runningback. They have had 11 different leading rushers in 16 years, no one name has been their feature back for more than 2 seasons. There are definitely things to like about Stevenson and to think he bucks this trend, and don’t get me wrong as I own him in some leagues too. But the offers I get from people looking to acquire definitely take this history into mind.
Maybe they have their next Dillon though
When Harris came back healthy last season, he had trouble getting snaps because Stevenson was dominating. He doesn’t require being replaced on their downs like some of the past RBs they’ve had.
I just think it’s easy to rely on platitudes but sometimes you have to delete very deeper.
You just hit on my biggest pet peeve in fantasy these days...the search for the holy grail that is a bell-cow back like Eddie George or Emmit back in the dark ages...there is just not going to be many of these guys anymore and when you find one not named Derrick Henry they probably won't last long (which is why I would flip them pretty quickly before they hit a cliff)...the key for me is are they used a good amount in both the rushing and receiving game...I tend to stay away from guys who are not involved in the passing game because they tend to be TD dependent...70 yards rushing is a good day in the NFL but with no TDs or receptions it's not in fantasy.
Those are a bit rare as well, but if you can hit on an elite receiving back, they’re likely to have more longevity at a volatile position.
That said, I’m as guilty of wanting those holy grail backs as anyone. I’ll be drafting Bijan in both of my dynasty leagues (one by trade, one earned) and I’m certainly hoping he’s the next LT2. That said, if I get 70% of LT2 in some sort of committee that’s probably as good as it gets for 2023 FF.
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On that note I sort of reverse scout RB's which is to say I focus on pass catching ability first, running ability second.
That's a starting point. I'm not trying to use a first round pick on a pure passing down back but this method is for sure why I've always been light to non-existent on Derrick Henry ownership for an example.
Top 2 fantasy RB's last year in PPG, 3 of the top 8 and 4 of the top 11 all got more fantasy points in the receiving game. That of course means 7 of the top 11 got more points in the rushing game so of course that's a big part of the equation but I just find the backs that work well in the passing game hold up better in RBBC's, are not as TD or matchup dependent and have better odds at longevity.
As for Bijan what makes him special is he projects extremely strong as an all around RB. The passing game numbers were not special but that's a usage issue and there are several wow plays he made catching the ball.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Autocorrect will be the dearth of me. 
“Volatile” is a word, you stupid phone.
“Volatile” is a word, you stupid phone.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Big boy trade FFPC SuperFlex not involved
Team A gives Kelce, Kittle, Chubb, A Jones, 5.04
Team B gives Pollard, Schultz, Love, 1.09, 2.10
I'd call it robbery the more I look at it. Even if Rodgers leaves and Love ascends. Pretty old on the other side, though. IDK.
Team A gives Kelce, Kittle, Chubb, A Jones, 5.04
Team B gives Pollard, Schultz, Love, 1.09, 2.10
I'd call it robbery the more I look at it. Even if Rodgers leaves and Love ascends. Pretty old on the other side, though. IDK.
I've got a 1QB FFPC league that had some bizarre deals go down.
Team A traded Tua for Jaylen Warren in one deal and traded Russ Wilson for Jerome Ford in another deal. I get that QBs aren't worth much in 1QB leagues, but neither are the RBs he got.
Team B gave: Mike Gesicki, Donovan Peoples-Jones, 2024 1st, 5.06
Team B got: Alvin Kamara, 5.01
This trade was completed the day after the news of Kamara's indictment. Giving up a '24 1st plus change for an aging RB who could be suspended for a significant part of 2023 is certainly a strategy.
Team A traded Tua for Jaylen Warren in one deal and traded Russ Wilson for Jerome Ford in another deal. I get that QBs aren't worth much in 1QB leagues, but neither are the RBs he got.
Team B gave: Mike Gesicki, Donovan Peoples-Jones, 2024 1st, 5.06
Team B got: Alvin Kamara, 5.01
This trade was completed the day after the news of Kamara's indictment. Giving up a '24 1st plus change for an aging RB who could be suspended for a significant part of 2023 is certainly a strategy.
eighsse2
Footballguy
Interesting. Definitely feel like I want the first group.
eighsse2
Footballguy
The team A deals are definite puzzlers. The team B situation is not totally crazy, to me. But not good either. The landing spot of that 1st means everything. 1.12, I'm happy with that. 1.01, atrocious.
You said it right
Marauder
Footballguy
I usually don't like making big trades where my team gets older but in this case, if I'm a contender, I would take the old guys pretty easily.
Yeah I’ll take the old guys over the never were and might bes.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Team A got robbed
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Same.
The Future Champs
Footballguy
Who trades for both Kelce and Kittle? And wtf can deal both of them?
ghostguy123
Footballguy
A builder.
A rebuilder.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Well, he didn’t get a whole lot for rebuilding
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Nope. And he went after the wrong building blocks
ghostguy123
Footballguy
FFPC
Pick 2.05 and Jamaal Williams.
For.
Brian Robinson, Trey McBride, Desmond Ridder
Pick 2.05 and Jamaal Williams.
For.
Brian Robinson, Trey McBride, Desmond Ridder
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I probably take Robinson/Ridder/McBeide side.
Williams is getting old/due for regression & I like the 2.05, but it’s at the part of the draft that starts to get a little iffy.
That said I’m sure FFPC means clearing a roster spot is valuable? I’m not sure how much that’s worth.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
A roster spot is definitely valuable.
The team getting the pick would have had some tough cuts to make.
The team getting Robinson and McBride has plenty of room before cuts to add useful guys
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
I know age matters but no way I give up Kelce, Kittle, Chubb, and Jones and get that light of a package back. I feel like you could split them up and get way more than that.
Jonesin For Some Football
Footballguy
1 QB, .5 PPR, 12 team league, not involved.
Tyreek Hill
for
Garrett Wilson
Tyreek Hill
for
Garrett Wilson
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I'm goin with Wilson, and Wilson by a landslide if I need to rebuild
I would even go with Wilson on a win now type team.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
I guess I wasn't clear enough. Yes, I also go with Wilson with a win now team
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Wilson in any dynasty format.
This was a new one.
In an FFPC dynasty (1QB, although not sure it matters), Team A traded the 5.04 pick to Team B for the 1.01. I figured this was one of those "what would you want for the 1.01?" fake offers that the other guy accidentally accepted. Nope! Team A (who took over an orphan team in January) said he offered to pay the buy-in and deposit of Team B (brand new to the league) in exchange for the 1.01, and the deal was accepted. FFPC commish reversed it and said this was obviously illegal and warned the teams they'd be out if they ever tried anything like that again. (Team A apologized and claimed he received a similar offer in another FFPC league and supposedly had no idea it wasn't allowed. I have no idea how anyone would think one team could just pay cash for another team's draft pick.)
In an FFPC dynasty (1QB, although not sure it matters), Team A traded the 5.04 pick to Team B for the 1.01. I figured this was one of those "what would you want for the 1.01?" fake offers that the other guy accidentally accepted. Nope! Team A (who took over an orphan team in January) said he offered to pay the buy-in and deposit of Team B (brand new to the league) in exchange for the 1.01, and the deal was accepted. FFPC commish reversed it and said this was obviously illegal and warned the teams they'd be out if they ever tried anything like that again. (Team A apologized and claimed he received a similar offer in another FFPC league and supposedly had no idea it wasn't allowed. I have no idea how anyone would think one team could just pay cash for another team's draft pick.)
ghostguy123
Footballguy
This exact thing is why the FFPC needs to rethink their trade protest process so that it doesn't need to be so mind bottlingly crazy unfair value to get overturned.
I can buy one of the $1 teams right now, trade my friend the only one or two valuable pieces for peanuts, then turn around and sell the team for free on dynasty depot.
Hmmm, I mighta just given myself an idea.......
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I can’t believe it was a warning, and not an immediate expulsion from the league for both teams. Such obvious collusion. Also so abundantly illegal from any standpoint.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Yeah, seems obviously bad for the competitive balance of the league.
I've offered money to swap draft positions in a startup. Not quite the same thing though
This was the response from the FFPC commish: "The prior post about selling the 1.01 for some sort team acquisition is a 100% illegal move in the FFPC and not even close to being permitted. Whatever deal was done was not through us so you had better figure it out with that other party but don't try to do this type of thing ever again in our leagues."
Every future deal between these two teams that is the least bit suspect is going to be questioned, and rightfully so.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Still too lenient, IMO.
Good to see a critical response, but yeah - I still think they should have been booted/banned for trying.
rockaction
Footballguy
One thing, though. Admitting it on its face and copping to it lets you know that some people just don't know the rules. They probably didn't. What worries me is that stuff like this lets me know exactly how easily the system can be abused in other ways that are less obvious. That's one of the reasons why I'm wary of money leagues with strangers in a general sense. So much more clandestine and knowing malfeasance on a smaller scale could be going on and that's all it takes to throw outcomes.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!
