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Official Hillary Clinton 2016 thread (8 Viewers)

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Tim Kaine               4/1

John Hickenlooper 14/1

Joe Biden              16/1
These are the top three IMO, with Hickenlooper at the top of the list.  Kaine is solid but risks losing a Senate seat. 

Biden would be an easy pick if he was younger, still think he would good a good choice for her first term. The more I think about it a known quantity like Biden would alleviate some of the concern in people's minds about a woman President.

 
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From a Daily Kos diary:

Hillary deserves credit for a superb campaign

By DiesIrae   

With the primary season coming to an end, I’ve seen a lot of valedictory praise for Bernie Sanders’ campaign. Most of that praise is well-earned. He used an impressive grassroots fundraising model that we haven’t seen before, leveraging social media and extremely passionate supporters into $200 million. As a result, he was able to offer Hillary Clinton a real challenge. This is not an achievement that can be easily dismissed, nor should it.

At the same time, I can’t help but think that Clinton deserves far more credit than she has received for her own brilliant campaign.

Here are just a few of the obstacles she overcame:

- She was outspent, often 2-to-1, in the primary states. She was saving cash for a general election throughout, which Sanders never did.

- She got crushed on social media. Supporting Sanders was cool, edgy, hip. Supporting Clinton? Not so much. It was considered boring, stodgy, et cetera (and that’s on a good day; on a bad day it was “evil”, “corrupt”, or “ignorant”.)

- She had to fight a two-front war, taking all of the Republican fire as well as fire from the Sanders campaign. This was especially true in the last two months, after Trump became the presumptive Republican nominee.

- She couldn’t return any significant fire against Sanders, for fear of alienating his supporters. She threw a few jabs on policy, usually gun control, but never brought out the big guns the way she did on Trump last week.

- She faced an extraordinarily negative and skeptical press throughout, always looking to wound the front-runner. She got far more negative media coverage, and less positive media coverage, than Sanders or even Trump.

- She had to contend with Republicans in Congress launching multiple “investigations” whose sole purpose was to destroy her. 

- Most importantly, she faced literally millennia of sexism and cultural conditioning that still leaves us far more skeptical of women in leadership positions than their male counterparts. This manifested in many different ways, including the obsessive focus on her vocal volume and “shouting” and the gendered insults and threats against her and her supporters (from a tiny but vocal fringe). And the combination of her gender and her age made it even more difficult — our society treats older women terribly when they are on the national stage.

In short, Hillary Clinton had to fight this entire primary season with about one and a half hands tied behind her back. Nevertheless, in the face of all sorts of headwinds, she held firm and won the nomination handily. Her tenacity will serve her well against Donald Trump this fall, and it will continue to do so when she is the 45th President of the United States.

 
She needs someone that will appeal to blue collar union working white males. That is the group Trump will try to steal.
This election will come down to OH and PA. There are a lot more blue collar union working white males in those two states than Hispanics or Socialists. Hillary will pick her VP accordingly if she want to win.

Warren is just bait to reel in all of the moderate Bernie supporters between now and the convention.

There is also no need for another woman on the ticket. Any woman that is voting on gender is already supporting Hillary.

 
From a Daily Kos diary:

Hillary deserves credit for a superb campaign

By DiesIrae   

With the primary season coming to an end, I’ve seen a lot of valedictory praise for Bernie Sanders’ campaign. Most of that praise is well-earned. He used an impressive grassroots fundraising model that we haven’t seen before, leveraging social media and extremely passionate supporters into $200 million. As a result, he was able to offer Hillary Clinton a real challenge. This is not an achievement that can be easily dismissed, nor should it.

At the same time, I can’t help but think that Clinton deserves far more credit than she has received for her own brilliant campaign.

Here are just a few of the obstacles she overcame:

- She was outspent, often 2-to-1, in the primary states. She was saving cash for a general election throughout, which Sanders never did.

- She got crushed on social media. Supporting Sanders was cool, edgy, hip. Supporting Clinton? Not so much. It was considered boring, stodgy, et cetera (and that’s on a good day; on a bad day it was “evil”, “corrupt”, or “ignorant”.)

- She had to fight a two-front war, taking all of the Republican fire as well as fire from the Sanders campaign. This was especially true in the last two months, after Trump became the presumptive Republican nominee.

- She couldn’t return any significant fire against Sanders, for fear of alienating his supporters. She threw a few jabs on policy, usually gun control, but never brought out the big guns the way she did on Trump last week.

- She faced an extraordinarily negative and skeptical press throughout, always looking to wound the front-runner. She got far more negative media coverage, and less positive media coverage, than Sanders or even Trump.

- She had to contend with Republicans in Congress launching multiple “investigations” whose sole purpose was to destroy her. 

- Most importantly, she faced literally millennia of sexism and cultural conditioning that still leaves us far more skeptical of women in leadership positions than their male counterparts. This manifested in many different ways, including the obsessive focus on her vocal volume and “shouting” and the gendered insults and threats against her and her supporters (from a tiny but vocal fringe). And the combination of her gender and her age made it even more difficult — our society treats older women terribly when they are on the national stage.

In short, Hillary Clinton had to fight this entire primary season with about one and a half hands tied behind her back. Nevertheless, in the face of all sorts of headwinds, she held firm and won the nomination handily. Her tenacity will serve her well against Donald Trump this fall, and it will continue to do so when she is the 45th President of the United States.
All nonsense, of course, but aren't you the guy who complains about other members posting from biased sites?  And yet here you are, posting from the Daily Kos.  It doesn't get much more far left than that.

I would think if you're going to talk the talk, you would walk the walk.  Maybe it's my fault for expecting too much from you.

 
All nonsense, of course, but aren't you the guy who complains about other members posting from biased sites?  And yet here you are, posting from the Daily Kos.  It doesn't get much more far left than that.

I would think if you're going to talk the talk, you would walk the walk.  Maybe it's my fault for expecting too much from you.
I noted that it was a diary. Not a news article. When people post from Breitbart they are holding it out as a legitimate news source. This was an opinion piece from Kos, which was why I noted at the beginning it was a diary.

 
It doesn't matter how much sense it makes, it is not going to happen. Again, Warren is simply not up to national campaign.
Plus, having TWO known and compulsive liars on the ticket probably isn't the greatest idea in the world.  Not to mention Clinton is the complete antithesis of Warren so I don't know how Warren would even be able to swallow standing with HRC.

 
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But it is true.
I really beg to differ on 'everyone', which is almost a stereotype. I agree on your general point about turnout, but as for the specific claim that every hispanic is related to or knows someone who could be deported maybe in CA that's closer to the truth, I don't know.

 
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Hispanics will be voting in record numbers. Everyone in the Hispanic community has a relative, friend, co-worker or acquaintance who will be deported if Trump is elected and that gives them a personal connection and motivation to go to the polls in November.
No they don't.

In states like CA, AZ, NM, TX, and FL there are 3rd, 4th, 5th generation Hispanics who have no more of a connection to illegals than all of the white people in this thread.

 
No they don't.

In states like CA, AZ, NM, TX, and FL there are 3rd, 4th, 5th generation Hispanics who have no more of a connection to illegals than all of the white people in this thread.
Which is a very small percentage of the overall Hispanic community.

You don't think there will be record turn out in the Latino community, fine. Believe it and run with it and see what happens in November.

 
These are the top three IMO, with Hickenlooper at the top of the list.  Kaine is solid but risks losing a Senate seat. 

Biden would be an easy pick if he was younger, still think he would good a good choice for her first term. The more I think about it a known quantity like Biden would alleviate some of the concern in people's minds about a woman President.
I really don't think there is much concern about a woman President but plenty about a Hillary Clinton as President. Does Biden help with that? Not sure.

 
This election will come down to OH and PA. There are a lot more blue collar union working white males in those two states than Hispanics or Socialists. Hillary will pick her VP accordingly if she want to win.

Warren is just bait to reel in all of the moderate Bernie supporters between now and the convention.

There is also no need for another woman on the ticket. Any woman that is voting on gender is already supporting Hillary.
Yep.

How about Michael Nutter.

Trump could call them Nutty and Nuttier.

 
I'm down with a Biden nod, an indictment next spring, and Warren or Bernie as Biden's VP. Works for me. Better yet, works for America.

 
Heh. Him "beating back against those who insist on ignoring the data" led to his prediction that Trump had a 1% chance of winning the nomination. Those who ignored his data were by far correct to do so. 

He shouldn't be so cocky for being so badly wrong so recently. 
As I said before, he was pulling from various points of data when making erroneous predictions on Trump and when he looked back on his method, he noticed a bias that systematically made him favor certain indicators that confirmed his bias (against Trump) at the expense of better, more valid indicators that contradicted his bias.  He wrote a really refreshing article about this, I'll try to dig it up.

Nobody got Trump right.  Silver's point is that had he stayed in his lane, he would have picked up on this much earlier and probably well before others.

 
How I Acted Like a Pundit and Screwed Up On Donald Trump

Really great piece by Nate Silver last month.  A lot of great insights, but I found this particularly salient:

Without having a model, I found, I was subject to a lot of the same biases as the pundits I usually criticize. In particular, I got anchored on my initial forecast and was slow to update my priors in the face of new data. And I found myself selectively interpreting the evidence and engaging in some lazy reasoning.
 
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The nice thing about Castro is it puts them in a really nice spot in Fl (win there and its over) and it sets the Dems up nicely in 2024 if Hillary wins.  The latino vote percentage just keeps rising and Castro would lock that up then.

 
latino vote is not as important as you think it is. No matter what-- dems aren't losing CA and reds aren't losing TX. 

only other major state with sizable latino population is FL, where it is a toss-up at this moment. 

 
latino vote is not as important as you think it is. No matter what-- dems aren't losing CA and reds aren't losing TX. 

only other major state with sizable latino population is FL, where it is a toss-up at this moment. 
There are five states with Hispanic populations larger than Florida by percentage, including two swing states, Nevada and New Mexico (#1 by the way), and another that the Dems hope to steal or at least force the GOP to devote huge resources to or spring an upset over a GOP senator (Arizona).  And the state ranked 7th right behind Florida is also a swing state, Colorado.

So five of the top seven states with >20% Hispanic populations have important roles to play in the upcoming election. The two you mentioned are the only two that don't.

I think the Latino vote is a little more important than you think it is.

 
She needs someone that will appeal to blue collar union working white males. That is the group Trump will try to steal.
Isn't Trump pretty anti-union?  I realize that his numbers right now are incredible with non-college-educated white men, but it seems to me like union members might not be so enthusiastic when they hear more about his labor practices.

ETA:  Here's a link from one ultra-left wing site

 
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There are five states with Hispanic populations larger than Florida by percentage, including two swing states, Nevada and New Mexico (#1 by the way), and another that the Dems hope to steal or at least force the GOP to devote huge resources to or spring an upset over a GOP senator (Arizona).  And the state ranked 7th right behind Florida is also a swing state, Colorado.

So five of the top seven states with >20% Hispanic populations have important roles to play in the upcoming election.
Solid analysis. 

 
Ahh, so he learned nothing and is back to his old faults. Back to being a cocky ####. Exactly.
That's not quite the conclusion any reasonable reader could arrive at if they had, you know, actually read the article.

If I had to guess--and I don't know you from anywhere except recognizing e name floating around--I'm guessing you are a Trump supporter.  Do I have that right?

 
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To illustrate the point about the Hispanic vote- go to 270towin.com or some other electoral college simulator and give Clinton all of the states with 20% Hispanic population in addition to the "lock" states.  I started with the "battleground map" which gives candidates only those states thought to be certainties and leaves the rest blank.

When you turn all of the "battleground states" with >20% Hispanic populations blue (there's four of them), Clinton is already at 239 electoral college votes. All of a sudden she can afford losses all over the place.  She could lose all of the midwest states whose blue collar white voters are supposedly the key to the election, including heavily blue-leaning Minnesota and Trump-hating Wisconsin, and still win by winning Virginia (large African-American population, lots of federal workers who don't want to be Trump employees) and Pennsylvania.  Or she could win with just Virginia, Oregon and Minnesota.  Basically, if Trump loses those four Hispanic-heavy battleground states he has to throw the election equivalent of a perfect game to win.

 
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Isn't Trump pretty anti-union?  I realize that his numbers right now are incredible with non-college-educated white men, but it seems to me like union members might not be so enthusiastic when they hear more about his labor practices.

ETA:  Here's a link from one ultra-left wing site
I'm just going by his campaign rhetoric where he is to the left of Hillary on trade deals. That affects unions and manufacturing. Of course no one really knows what this clown believes.

 
Tobias your analysis about the Latino vote is dead on accurate, and it should be because it comes straight from the GOP "obituary" report after 2012, in which Romney received 27% of the overall Latino vote. They knew they had to get that number to 40% or they were screwed. 

Now the Trump supporters, starting with Ann Coulter, believes it doesn't matter because of all the extra white votes Trump is going to win. But a close analysis of the polls thus far indicates that this is not happening. For all of Trump's talk about bringing in new voters, he only brought them in for the primaries- these are not people who didn't vote in the general last time around. And for all his gains with white men who didn't go to college, he's losing just as many white men who did go to college. 

 
Oddsmakers have it 72/28 for Clinton H2H.  Roughly 4% and 1% chance respectively that Hillary and Trump don't make the general election.

 
Tobias your analysis about the Latino vote is dead on accurate, and it should be because it comes straight from the GOP "obituary" report after 2012, in which Romney received 27% of the overall Latino vote. They knew they had to get that number to 40% or they were screwed. 

Now the Trump supporters, starting with Ann Coulter, believes it doesn't matter because of all the extra white votes Trump is going to win. But a close analysis of the polls thus far indicates that this is not happening. For all of Trump's talk about bringing in new voters, he only brought them in for the primaries- these are not people who didn't vote in the general last time around. And for all his gains with white men who didn't go to college, he's losing just as many white men who did go to college. 
If Trump holds onto Florida (and the Cuban votes) it is a whole different ball game. He might still need Ohio and Virginia though.

 
 


Obama to offer a formal endorsement of Clinton; president also meets with Sanders


President Obama will offer his formal endorsement of Hillary Clinton with a video to be released later on Thursday and plans to campaign with the former secretary of state in Wisconsin next week, according to two sources familiar with the plans.

The swift endorsement comes after the president met with Sen. Bernie Sanders at the White House earlier Thursday as the Vermont senator indicated he is preparing to exit the Democratic nominating battle.

Sanders is under pressure to stand down and help unify the party after a long and contentious battle with Clinton for the nomination. Obama’s endorsement will add to that pressure, although most party leaders, including the president, have urged that he be allowed to decide his future plans on his own timetable.

A an afternoon meeting with Vice President Biden was also added to Sanders’s schedule for Thursday. The two are set to meet at the vice president’s residence at the Naval Observatory, said Sanders spokesman Michael Briggs.

“He seeking out the counsel of people he admires and respects,” Briggs said of Sanders.

The president’s decision to move quickly to give his public support to Clinton indicates his desire to begin to play a more active role in making the case against presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump as unqualified to be president and to try to rally those who have backed Sanders behind Clinton’s candidacy.

After meeting with Obama, Sanders said he looks forward to working with Clinton to defeat Trump in the fall.

“Needless to say, I’m going to do everything in my power, and I’m going to work as hard as I can, to make sure that Donald Trump does not become president of the United States,” the senator from Vermont told reporters, as his wife, Jane, stood behind him.

Sanders said he still plans to compete in Tuesday’s final Democratic primary in the District, but he added that “in the near future” he hopes to meet with Clinton — who this week clinched the Democratic nomination — to talk about ways they can work together.

His comments suggested that Sanders is preparing to exit the long and grueling presidential race, as long as leading Democrats make a genuine effort to incorporate his policy ideas into their broader agenda.

...
Sounds like Sanders is gonna back out after the DC primary next week if I had to guess.

I'll be curious to see how the polls look in a week or two, once they've had time to absorb Trump's latest fiascoes, Clinton's big wins on Tuesday and the Obama endorsement.  Would be nice to see her up 8-10 points again.

 
 


Sounds like Sanders is gonna back out after the DC primary next week if I had to guess.

I'll be curious to see how the polls look in a week or two, once they've had time to absorb Trump's latest fiascoes, Clinton's big wins on Tuesday and the Obama endorsement.  Would be nice to see her up 8-10 points again.
I'd say 8% would be disappointing and concerning.  I'd be more comfortable with--and expect--12-15 point advantage in two weeks.

 
I'd say 8% would be disappointing and concerning.  I'd be more comfortable with--and expect--12-15 point advantage in two weeks.
Yeah I guess, but it seems like there's a 38-40% floor for any Dem or GOP candidate, which means once you add in the undecideds it's hard to have more than 10-12 point lead.  Obviously anything showing it remotely close is concerning though, considering what we're dealing with.

Here's the Obama endorsement BTW.  He's still got net positive approval ratings, unlike the two presumptive nominees, so you gotta think this helps a little. Same will obviously be true of the Sanders endorsement.

 
 


Sounds like Sanders is gonna back out after the DC primary next week if I had to guess.

I'll be curious to see how the polls look in a week or two, once they've had time to absorb Trump's latest fiascoes, Clinton's big wins on Tuesday and the Obama endorsement.  Would be nice to see her up 8-10 points again.
8-10 is a big ask, but Rasmussen's poll today already has her up 4 with Hispanics split 50-50 (Reuters is already at 8 points, but that one has been a Dem lean this entire cycle).  Together that's probably a 6 point or so advantage.  At that spread, the Republicans get swamped everywhere. 

If that sort of spread holds for another couple of weeks, Trump may not make it out of the convention.  To put this in some perspective, Obama's biggest lead in 2012 was 4.5 points in the poll of polls.  With just these two results, Clinton is already up 3.1, so I won't be surprised if she's up by more than Obama ever was at some point next week. 

Rasmussen does this weekly and it's gone from:

+2 Trump

+5 Trump

+1 Clinton

+1 Clinton

+4 Clinton

So you've had a 9 point swing even with him in a month even considering his funky Hispanic numbers. 

 
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Without having a model, I found, I was subject to a lot of the same biases as the pundits I usually criticize. In particular, I got anchored on my initial forecast and was slow to update my priors in the face of new data. And I found myself selectively interpreting the evidence and engaging in some lazy reasoning.
Lazy Reasoning is the band playing at this year's Republican Convention.

 
Also, for whatever it's worth, I'm not buying for a second that Obama was trying to broker any peace between Bernie and Hillary today, as it has been suggested.  I suspect it was a meeting initiated by Obama out of respect for Bernie to congratulate him on a great campaign and to tell him to his face that he's going to announce his support for Hillary the moment he stepped out the door.  Probably covered some common ground about how much of a dirtbag Trump is and Obama saying he hopes Bernie will continue to be a strong voice in this election against Trump--with all the implications that might have for Bernie, should he think it all through to its logical conclusion.  But, in no way will Obama or Hillary cede much to Bernie right now.  

I say this as someone who respects the hell out of Obama and Bernie, loathes Hillary, and loathes Trump 1000x more than that (just to be transparent about my biases).

 
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Yeah I guess, but it seems like there's a 38-40% floor for any Dem or GOP candidate, which means once you add in the undecideds it's hard to have more than 10-12 point lead.  Obviously anything showing it remotely close is concerning though, considering what we're dealing with.

Here's the Obama endorsement BTW.  He's still got net positive approval ratings, unlike the two presumptive nominees, so you gotta think this helps a little. Same will obviously be true of the Sanders endorsement.
I'm pretty sure this was photoshopped on May 1st when the AP told them that Ted Cruz was dropping out since the AP knew the May 2nd Republican primaries would be rigged to favor Trump :grad:

 
Also, for whatever it's worth, I'm not buying for a second that Obama was trying to broker any peace between Bernie and Hillary today, as it has been suggested.  I suspect it was a meeting initiated by Obama out of respect for Bernie to congratulate him on a great campaign and to tell him to his face that he's going to announce his support for Hillary the moment he stepped out the door.  Probably covered some common ground about how much of a dirtbag Trump is and Obama saying he hopes Bernie will continue to be a strong voice in this election against Trump--with all the implications that might have for Bernie, should he think it all through to its logical conclusion.  But, in no way will Obama or Hillary cede much to Bernie right now.  

I say this as someone who respects the hell out of Obama and Bernie, loathes Hillary, and loathes Trump 1000x more than that (just to be transparent about my biases).
I loathe them all. I am an equal opportunity loather.

 
Yeah I guess, but it seems like there's a 38-40% floor for any Dem or GOP candidate, which means once you add in the undecideds it's hard to have more than 10-12 point lead.  Obviously anything showing it remotely close is concerning though, considering what we're dealing with.

Here's the Obama endorsement BTW.  He's still got net positive approval ratings, unlike the two presumptive nominees, so you gotta think this helps a little. Same will obviously be true of the Sanders endorsement.
This all makes a lot of sense.  Hillary will get a bump for sure, but her ceiling is limited by being...well...Hillary.  By extension, I don't think Trump's floor drops lower than 35% because of the strong anti-Hillary sentiment (which adds a few people who don't like Trump much, but hate Hillary more).

Ok, so if it's ~46-38 with a lot of undecideds right now, I suppose that's the best we can hope for.  

 
When's the last time a sitting President vigorously campaigned for his successor? I can't remember one who did. 

 
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Tobias your analysis about the Latino vote is dead on accurate, and it should be because it comes straight from the GOP "obituary" report after 2012, in which Romney received 27% of the overall Latino vote. They knew they had to get that number to 40% or they were screwed. 

Now the Trump supporters, starting with Ann Coulter, believes it doesn't matter because of all the extra white votes Trump is going to win. But a close analysis of the polls thus far indicates that this is not happening. For all of Trump's talk about bringing in new voters, he only brought them in for the primaries- these are not people who didn't vote in the general last time around. And for all his gains with white men who didn't go to college, he's losing just as many white men who did go to college. 
Interestingly enough- Trump is polling @ 37% with latinos at the moment.

 
Well that does it. No justice, no indictment. He doesn't endorse if he hadn't gotten assurances otherwise.
I might be naive here, but I don't think the FBI is or would tip their hand, especially to the POTUS.  

My best guess is, timing dictates Obama has to endorse Hillary in this moment and to withhold an endorsement would make matters really bad and raise a LOT of questions.  If Hillary gets indicted, it's not Obama's fault she lied to him.

 
Interestingly enough- Trump is polling @ 37% with latinos at the moment.
:lmao:

Here's an article on where he stands with the Hispanic vote discussing why polling is kind of unreliable but also giving his numbers over the 5 most recent polls: 18, 32, 21, 20 and 23.  Four of the five, and obviously the average, have him underperforming Romney's 27% mark that the GOP regarded as fatal.

ETA:  Also important that all of these polls took place before his comments on Curiel.

 
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I might be naive here, but I don't think the FBI is or would tip their hand, especially to the POTUS.  

My best guess is, timing dictates Obama has to endorse Hillary in this moment and to withhold an endorsement would make matters really bad and raise a LOT of questions.  If Hillary gets indicted, it's not Obama's fault she lied to him.
Maybe. But if i'm in his shoes i don't endorse until there is official resolution of the issue. He doesn't owe her anything. I guess he wants to do his part to protect the country from Trump.

 
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