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***Official Julius Thomas Hype Train*** (1 Viewer)

Adam Harstad said:
Last year, Denver played about 1,000 offensive snaps, with the RB, outside WRs, and in-line TE getting a full set, while Tamme and Stokley split the last thousand between them 50/50. If Denver had about 1000 offensive snaps again this year, I'd expect Welker to get snaps at about a 2:1 rate compared to the second TE- so about 650 snaps for Welker, 350 for Tamme (or Thomas, if he manages to supplant Tamme).
1069, actually, 3rd in the league :) Although roughly speaking you could say every team played "about" 1,000 snaps last year (except for NE and Det.)

And that was Manning's first year playing football after missing a whole season. Now they've improved at WR and, for the purposes of this thread, TE. Arguably they've downgraded at RB if Ball isn't up to speed, at least to begin the season, as compared to a vet like McGahee. If they go faster on offense, they could very easily push 1,100. So, you might want to make that pie a bit bigger.

Also, this hasn't been said yet... but I think it possible that Thomas has a few monster games with more than his fair share of duds sprinkled in. I don't think he's worthless in re-draft, but it would be a heck of a time trying to figure out when to start him. So he might have better value in a draft-and-go type league where you can make use of his occasional 5-124-1 game, and avoid his 1 for 7 type games. Or, dare I say it... as a $2 TE in a 1.5 TE PPR subscriber contest. :towelwave:

 
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Adam Harstad said:
Last year, Denver played about 1,000 offensive snaps, with the RB, outside WRs, and in-line TE getting a full set, while Tamme and Stokley split the last thousand between them 50/50. If Denver had about 1000 offensive snaps again this year, I'd expect Welker to get snaps at about a 2:1 rate compared to the second TE- so about 650 snaps for Welker, 350 for Tamme (or Thomas, if he manages to supplant Tamme).
1069, actually, 3rd in the league :) Although roughly speaking you could say every team played "about" 1,000 snaps last year (except for NE and Det.)

And that was Manning's first year playing football after missing a whole season. Now they've improved at WR and, for the purposes of this thread, TE. Arguably they've downgraded at RB if Ball isn't up to speed, at least to begin the season, as compared to a vet like McGahee. If they go faster on offense, they could very easily push 1,100. So, you might want to make that pie a bit bigger.

Also, this hasn't been said yet... but I think it possible that Thomas has a few monster games with more than his fair share of duds sprinkled in. I don't think he's worthless in re-draft, but it would be a heck of a time trying to figure out when to start him. So he might have better value in a draft-and-go type league where you can make use of his occasional 5-124-1 game, and avoid his 1 for 7 type games. Or, dare I say it... as a $2 TE in a 1.5 TE PPR subscriber contest. :towelwave:
How many 5-124-1 games do you think he will have? As I already spelled out, Manning-led teams generally do not go 4 receiving options deep. Unless Tamme and Dreessen are completely out of the picture, I don't think there is much hope for Thomas having even one game as you described. IMO, Thomas' ceiling is 35-40 catches for 400-450 if the Big 3 stay healthy.

 
I have a hard time believing that the Broncos are going to forgo Welker and leave him on the sidelines for a player with 1 career reception (who could very easily be the third TE).
Would it make you feel better if they pull Welker for a guy 8" taller and 65 lbs heavier?Eta: guys, that's what we and talking about here. JT is 6'5", 250 lbs and runs like a WR. He makes Demaryius Thomas look small. Its the combination of height, weight, agility, basketball box-out skills, and soft hands that are driving the hype machine. Size-wise, he is a clone of Gonzo, and an inch taller than Gates. Just starting to come into his own, skill-wise.
If he were so superhuman, then why has he had one catch in two seasons? I still think he is getting more playing time and some buzz because Tamme and Dreessen are banged up. As far as Welker goes, I also don't think they paid him $6 million a year to take 1/3 or more of the plays off. So unless DEN is going to use a lot of 3 WR/1TE/1RB formations, I don't see them using the TE spot much this year.
He struggled through ankle injuries - high ankle sprain requiring surgery and then re-agrivated it last year. Also, he is one of these basketball guys, trying to learn the position. Its not that he has super- human measurables, he isn't Vernon Davis. His measurables are on par with the modern dynamic TE's - Gronk, Graham, Gates, Gonzo, etc. I'm not saying he's at the skill-level of those guys, it took a couple of years for most of those guys to come into their own and I'm not sure JT has had the reps to get to get to that level. But, we should recognize the upside and potential here. Imo he has top 12 upside for 2013.

 
Adam Harstad said:
Last year, Denver played about 1,000 offensive snaps, with the RB, outside WRs, and in-line TE getting a full set, while Tamme and Stokley split the last thousand between them 50/50. If Denver had about 1000 offensive snaps again this year, I'd expect Welker to get snaps at about a 2:1 rate compared to the second TE- so about 650 snaps for Welker, 350 for Tamme (or Thomas, if he manages to supplant Tamme).
1069, actually, 3rd in the league :) Although roughly speaking you could say every team played "about" 1,000 snaps last year (except for NE and Det.)

And that was Manning's first year playing football after missing a whole season. Now they've improved at WR and, for the purposes of this thread, TE. Arguably they've downgraded at RB if Ball isn't up to speed, at least to begin the season, as compared to a vet like McGahee. If they go faster on offense, they could very easily push 1,100. So, you might want to make that pie a bit bigger.

Also, this hasn't been said yet... but I think it possible that Thomas has a few monster games with more than his fair share of duds sprinkled in. I don't think he's worthless in re-draft, but it would be a heck of a time trying to figure out when to start him. So he might have better value in a draft-and-go type league where you can make use of his occasional 5-124-1 game, and avoid his 1 for 7 type games. Or, dare I say it... as a $2 TE in a 1.5 TE PPR subscriber contest. :towelwave:
How many 5-124-1 games do you think he will have? As I already spelled out, Manning-led teams generally do not go 4 receiving options deep. Unless Tamme and Dreessen are completely out of the picture, I don't think there is much hope for Thomas having even one game as you described. IMO, Thomas' ceiling is 35-40 catches for 400-450 if the Big 3 stay healthy.
Maybe 1 or 2. Or, 4-85-2 type game might be possible. And then 13-14 useless 1 catch games, more than a couple complete zero-burgers. My point wasn't to argue his season totals (which I agree are limited by the situation this year), but that kind of athleticism in a Manning offense screams possibility. Also, the chances at least one of DT, Decker, and Welker misses at least one game has to be very high. Add in Dressen and Tamme and its basically a certainty.

Take a look at Jared Cook's crummy 2010 year with a 29-361-1 line for the season, and note his 5-96-1 type game. Completely different offense, but a similarly athletic TE with crappy numbers for the season.

Or Greg Olsen's rookie 2009 with 39-391-2, featuring a 4-57-1 and a 6-59-1.

Or Coby Fleener's 2012 with a 26-282-2, but starting off with 6-82 (17.2 points in TE premium).

 
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If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.

 
Here's my two-cents:

If you're on the field with Peyton Manning, you're going to be given the chance to produce. There are going to be many opportunities to go around and if Julius Thomas stays healthy, there's no reason to believe he can't be a TE2.

He's on a team with Peyton Manning, Demaryius Thomas, Eric Decker (who may have been a product of circumstance), and Wes Welker. He'll be an afterthought and be able to make HUGE PLAYS in the seam. Former basketball player, blah, blah, blah...

If Peyton goes for 40TD, why can't this guy catch 8?

 
If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.
Don't forget Edgerrin James, who had 51 receptions. 2013 Broncos don't have anyone like that on their roster, highest receiving RB might be Moreno with 20. so, there's 30 additional receptions to divvy up right there.

I would not expect Tamme/JThomas to split, I'd expect it to be a split between Dreessen and JThomas.

Dreessen and Tamme, by the way, combined for 93 receptions last year.

 
If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.
Don't forget Edgerrin James, who had 51 receptions. 2013 Broncos don't have anyone like that on their roster, highest receiving RB might be Moreno with 20. so, there's 30 additional receptions to divvy up right there.

I would not expect Tamme/JThomas to split, I'd expect it to be a split between Dreessen and JThomas.

Dreessen and Tamme, by the way, combined for 93 receptions last year.
And there was no Welker, so I don't really find the TE numbers from last year all that relevant.

 
Sharing is caring for Broncos offense

By Jeff Legwold | ESPN.com

Quote

ENGLEWOOD, Colo. -- There are times when the quarterback is like a parent with a car full of kids.

Somebody wants to sit by the window. Somebody wants what somebody else has.

Such is life on a cross-country drive or in your typical high-end NFL passing attack when everybody always believes he’s open.

Everybody might be right, too. Demaryius Thomas had 1,434 yards receiving last season, and Eric Decker had 1,064.

Offseason acquisition Wes Welker has lived over the 100-catch, 1,000-yard mark in five of the past six seasons.

But at last report there is still just one ball, which will be thrown by Peyton Manning. So when trying to add up how many passes the Broncos receivers could, or should, catch, consider, too, Manning and offensive coordinator Adam Gase have each said they'd like to add a sturdier run component to the offense, one that stresses defenses sideline to sideline and can create more impact plays.

While many in the league want to see if Manning/Gase will really run the ball more than last season, Welker's addition as well as the prospect of some additional run plays mean everybody involved in the Broncos' passing attack is going to need some perspective along the way.

Or as Brandon Stokley, a longtime teammate of Manning's in both Denver and Indianapolis as well as a friend, has put it:

"The best way to think about it is, if you do what you're supposed to do, every time, be where you're supposed to be, every time, he'll get you the ball. You'll get your opportunities when he makes the read that you're the best option against the defense he sees. But if you're not in the right spot and he can't trust you to be there, he won't throw you the ball. It's that simple. If everybody does what they're supposed to and he feels comfortable he knows how you're going to run certain routes in certain situations, he'll get the ball to everybody. You always have to remember if you do what you're supposed to every time, your time will always come.''

"I think we don't think about catches, as a group,'' Thomas said. "We know what this offense can do. I think we have a bunch of guys who just want to win no matter how many catches they have or whatever.''

And that's what it will take for all of it to work, in belief and action.

Manning has had one season in his storied career -- 2004 -- when the Colts finished a season with three 1,000-yard receivers (Stokley, 1,077 yards; Marvin Harrison, 1,113; and Reggie Wayne, 1,210). And Indianapolis still managed to hand the ball to Edgerrin James 334 times on the way to a 12-4 finish.

James was fourth in the league in rushing that year with 1,548 yards.

That's almost unheard of efficiency, especially since the Colts put up three 1,000-yard receivers with Manning closing out the year with 336 completions -- the fourth-lowest completion total of his career. What it also means is the marquee players were healthy and always had the ball -- there wasn't much room for anybody else.

The role players had very small roles. James was the team's fourth-leading receiver, with 51 catches, and as a result neither of the Colts' tight ends that season topped 30 catches -- Marcus Pollard had 29 and Dallas Clark had 25. And after the big three no other wide receiver on the Colts roster had more than four receptions that year. And behind James, Dominic Rhodes had 53 carries.

Now, certainly a season that was played a decade ago is not the end-all, be-all template to place over what the Broncos will do in 2013. But it does show how things looked in an offense with three top-shelf pass catchers and how one quarterback divvied up the work without sacrificing a rushing component.

The Colts topped 30 points 10 times that season. They opped 40 points five times, including a stretch of four consecutive games when they scored 49, 41, 41 and 51.

"Its always execution,'' Manning said. "No matter what you do, how you do it, whether you huddle, don't huddle, go fast or slow, I've always felt like it was the execution that made the difference, that you dealt with the defense in front of you with the best play you could run in that situation.''

For these Broncos, they still figure to divide the majority of the carries in the run game between Ronnie Hillman and Montee Ball. The part to watch will be how defenses align themselves against the Broncos' three-receiver set, which will be their base formation.

In short, defenses simply play smaller far more often now than they did in 2004.

Teams have elected to go smaller and lighter with more cornerbacks and 205-pound coverage safeties working in the nickel and dime packages -- the Broncos often play a safety at weakside linebacker in some of their specialty packages -- so the immediate matchup win is the tight end. Especially a tight end with some size and speed to overpower a defensive back when the ball is in the air and to run by a linebacker.

Running Welker out of one slot position with a tight end to his outside shoulder is a grouping, for example, that should quickly clear the middle of the field and suddenly you have what many running backs coaches call "a friendly box'' to run against between the guards.

So the opportunity to run more will be there if the Broncos truly want to take it.

In the end, though, if the Broncos really don't care about the numbers, there should be plenty to go around.
 
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If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.
Don't forget Edgerrin James, who had 51 receptions. 2013 Broncos don't have anyone like that on their roster, highest receiving RB might be Moreno with 20. so, there's 30 additional receptions to divvy up right there.I would not expect Tamme/JThomas to split, I'd expect it to be a split between Dreessen and JThomas.

Dreessen and Tamme, by the way, combined for 93 receptions last year.
Has Thomas clearly beaten out Tamme at this point though? He's obviously more physically gifted, but Tamme has been a reliable Manning favorite for years, going back to their time in Indy.

I also expect Welker to take a big bite out of those 93 TE receptions this year -- if that number goes down to say 70, and those 70 are split between Dreesen, Tamme, and JT, it's going to be really hard for Thomas to make any noise at all.

 
If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.
Don't forget Edgerrin James, who had 51 receptions. 2013 Broncos don't have anyone like that on their roster, highest receiving RB might be Moreno with 20. so, there's 30 additional receptions to divvy up right there.I would not expect Tamme/JThomas to split, I'd expect it to be a split between Dreessen and JThomas.

Dreessen and Tamme, by the way, combined for 93 receptions last year.
Has Thomas clearly beaten out Tamme at this point though? He's obviously more physically gifted, but Tamme has been a reliable Manning favorite for years, going back to their time in Indy.I also expect Welker to take a big bite out of those 93 TE receptions this year -- if that number goes down to say 70, and those 70 are split between Dreesen, Tamme, and JT, it's going to be really hard for Thomas to make any noise at all.
Re:Tamme - tough to say. As far as I can tell, he's not fully practicing yet. Julius has been with the first team nearly all camp, so take from that what you will. Re: Welker taking from TE - I disagree, as noted previously. Its very possible I'm wrong; I'm just an idiot with a keyboard so take my opinion for what its worth.

 
Or instead of looking at the 2004 Colts you could look at the 2009 Colts with Wayne Garcon & Collie. Clark put up 100 receptions on 132 targets for 1100 yards & 10 TDs. So spin it any way you like. One thing about Manning is he doesn't lock on to a receiver, he hits the open guy. The questions are whether JT beats out Tamme and how many 2 TE sets they run.

For redrafts he's a late round flier, but if you are not in a shallow dynasty league JT should be rostered.

 
Or instead of looking at the 2004 Colts you could look at the 2009 Colts with Wayne Garcon & Collie. Clark put up 100 receptions on 132 targets for 1100 yards & 10 TDs. So spin it any way you like. One thing about Manning is he doesn't lock on to a receiver, he hits the open guy. The questions are whether JT beats out Tamme and how many 2 TE sets they run.

For redrafts he's a late round flier, but if you are not in a shallow dynasty league JT should be rostered.
Even on that team, the #4 receiver, Addai, had 51 receptions and the #5, Garcon, had 47/765/4TD.There are enough balls to go around such that the #4 option can get enough production to be fantasy relevant as a TE.

 
I have a hard time believing that the Broncos are going to forgo Welker and leave him on the sidelines for a player with 1 career reception (who could very easily be the third TE).
Would it make you feel better if they pull Welker for a guy 8" taller and 65 lbs heavier?Eta: guys, that's what we and talking about here. JT is 6'5", 250 lbs and runs like a WR. He makes Demaryius Thomas look small. Its the combination of height, weight, agility, basketball box-out skills, and soft hands that are driving the hype machine. Size-wise, he is a clone of Gonzo, and an inch taller than Gates. Just starting to come into his own, skill-wise.
If he were so superhuman, then why has he had one catch in two seasons? I still think he is getting more playing time and some buzz because Tamme and Dreessen are banged up. As far as Welker goes, I also don't think they paid him $6 million a year to take 1/3 or more of the plays off. So unless DEN is going to use a lot of 3 WR/1TE/1RB formations, I don't see them using the TE spot much this year.
He was a college basketball player who had a year of eligibility left at the end of his career, so he switched to football for a season. He was as raw as raw gets coming in, and unsuprisingly didn't contribute much as a rookie. He was injured on his one catch, and delayed surgery hoping that it wouldn't prove necessary, but ultimately had to get it, anyway. By the time he had the surgery, it was so late in the offseason that he wasn't around for the installation of the offense and didn't have much of a chance to get reps with Manning. His lack of production to date is far from unreasonable or unexpected. The fact that Denver has continued to carry him on their roster despite all the issues and setbacks (and despite already having solid depth at the position) shows how much Denver liked him, whether he was producing or not.

As for Welker... $6 million a season is a pittance. That's what Brian Hartline is making. If teams saw Welker as an every-down player, he would have made a lot more this offseason. After last season, I feel pretty confident in my knowledge of this offense, how it operates, and what it's trying to do. 12 personnel will still play a very prominent role. I feel very comfortable with my snaps projections. If you know of somewhere that has snap data, I'd be willing to bet you that Brandon Stokley spent at least a third of the 2004 season standing on the sidelines, too. That's just how the offense works. Everything's 11 or 12 personnel, the outside receivers and in-line TE stay on the field at all times, the move TE swaps in and out with the slot receiver.

 
I like Thomas as an upside dynasty stash, but totally agree with David and Adam that barring injury, he's not going to be worth rostering in redrafts.

My question is this: how is his blocking? If Dreesen's knee acts up again, and if Thomas can block, he might have a path to more snaps as the in line guy. If he's strictly a move type receiver, it'll be much harder to move past both Welker and Tamme to grab some PT this year.
Thomas has shown big improvements in blocking since his rookie season, but I doubt he's pushing Dreessen out of the way any time soon. He has been lining up as the in-line TE ahead of Virgil Green, though, which is a positive sign.

 
Here's my two-cents:

If you're on the field with Peyton Manning, you're going to be given the chance to produce. There are going to be many opportunities to go around and if Julius Thomas stays healthy, there's no reason to believe he can't be a TE2.

He's on a team with Peyton Manning, Demaryius Thomas, Eric Decker (who may have been a product of circumstance), and Wes Welker. He'll be an afterthought and be able to make HUGE PLAYS in the seam. Former basketball player, blah, blah, blah...

If Peyton goes for 40TD, why can't this guy catch 8?
Because this guy won't be on the field for half of those TD passes, and expecting him to catch 40% of the TDs he's on the field for is a bit much as long as Denver still has Decker and Demaryius.

 
If people are willing to say DThomas, Welker, and Decker are going to be the three biggest threats in the passing game (and I would be shocked if many people would try to argue against that), I think the 2004 season for Manning in IND should be used as a guide.

The Colts had three 1000 yard receivers that year, but Clark (25-423-5) and Pollard (29-309-7) essentially split the work at TE. I could similar numbers for Tamme and JThomas this year. The TD numbers might be lower, as I am not sure Manning will make a run at 50 TD passes this time around.
Don't forget Edgerrin James, who had 51 receptions. 2013 Broncos don't have anyone like that on their roster, highest receiving RB might be Moreno with 20. so, there's 30 additional receptions to divvy up right there.I would not expect Tamme/JThomas to split, I'd expect it to be a split between Dreessen and JThomas.

Dreessen and Tamme, by the way, combined for 93 receptions last year.
Has Thomas clearly beaten out Tamme at this point though? He's obviously more physically gifted, but Tamme has been a reliable Manning favorite for years, going back to their time in Indy.I also expect Welker to take a big bite out of those 93 TE receptions this year -- if that number goes down to say 70, and those 70 are split between Dreesen, Tamme, and JT, it's going to be really hard for Thomas to make any noise at all.
Re:Tamme - tough to say. As far as I can tell, he's not fully practicing yet. Julius has been with the first team nearly all camp, so take from that what you will.
You could also say that Thomas is yet to receive a first-team rep when Tamme was healthy. Tamme's also still listed ahead of Thomas on the depth chart, for what it's worth.

 
Here's my two-cents:

If you're on the field with Peyton Manning, you're going to be given the chance to produce. There are going to be many opportunities to go around and if Julius Thomas stays healthy, there's no reason to believe he can't be a TE2.

He's on a team with Peyton Manning, Demaryius Thomas, Eric Decker (who may have been a product of circumstance), and Wes Welker. He'll be an afterthought and be able to make HUGE PLAYS in the seam. Former basketball player, blah, blah, blah...

If Peyton goes for 40TD, why can't this guy catch 8?
Because this guy won't be on the field for half of those TD passes, and expecting him to catch 40% of the TDs he's on the field for is a bit much as long as Denver still has Decker and Demaryius.
True but assuming we're doubling Demaryius, Peyton will have three other options in the redzone:

1.) Thomas against a linebacker / safety (is he effective in the redzone?).

2.) Decker single covered against a corner.

3.) Welker in the slot who has never "dominated" in the redzone.

If I was coaching, I would be pulling Welker in the redzone. I don't need to move the chains, I need to score.

 
Wouldn't doubling Demaryius in the red zone being defensive suicide? That'll make it awfully easy for Decker (with his size) or a TE to get open for an easy score.

 
Wouldn't doubling Demaryius in the red zone being defensive suicide? That'll make it awfully easy for Decker (with his size) or a TE to get open for an easy score.
yyeah, it wouldn't be a great idea. Decker's a load in the red zone and has a nose for the end zone as evidenced by his TD production last year

 
Wouldn't doubling Demaryius in the red zone being defensive suicide? That'll make it awfully easy for Decker (with his size) or a TE to get open for an easy score.
So who is Peyton's first read? Decker?
what is the play that's called and what coverage is the d playing in this scenario?
Right. There is no set "this guy is Peyton's first read in the red zone no matter what" play. His first read is based on the play and how the defense plays what they are showing. That is Football 101.

 
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Very small sample size, but I can't say I was too impressed by these clips...

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000228123/Pre-Week-1-Broncos-vs-49ers-highlights

He looked slow and lethargic, and wasn't able to release from defenders well on a couple occasions.
I guess I'm not seeing what you are from that game. I've watched it a bit since they played and he looked more than fine in the passing game. gotta work on the run blocking though

 
Gates always looked slow and lathargic too. Not comparing the two, just saying slow, athletic guys can make solid TE's.

 
Gates always looked slow and lathargic too. Not comparing the two, just saying slow, athletic guys can make solid TE's.
You know, that did come to mind... My initial reaction was "Hmm, kinda slow." I watched the plays again and again several times. Then watched some Vernon Davis plays to get a gauge of a fast TE, with great burst. Watched Thomas again - still thought he was a bit slow moving and slow to react. Then I thought, he reminds me of Gates, who, like you said, always seems to get open enough to make plays.

Looking forward to Saturday's game...

 
Gates always looked slow and lathargic too. Not comparing the two, just saying slow, athletic guys can make solid TE's.
You know, that did come to mind... My initial reaction was "Hmm, kinda slow." I watched the plays again and again several times. Then watched some Vernon Davis plays to get a gauge of a fast TE, with great burst. Watched Thomas again - still thought he was a bit slow moving and slow to react. Then I thought, he reminds me of Gates, who, like you said, always seems to get open enough to make plays.

Looking forward to Saturday's game...
Vernon Davis is not a fair comparison. Vernon Davis is one of the 5 biggest athletic freaks of nature to enter the league in the last decade. Vernon Davis ran a sub-4.4 at 250+ pounds, then tacked on a 42" vertical and 33 reps on the bench press just in case that wasn't impressive enough.

For comparison purposes, Jonathan Stewart was one of the most impressive combos of size and speed we've seen at RB. Vernon Davis weighed in at 17 pounds heavier and still ran nearly a tenth faster. His vertical leap was 3" higher than Randy Moss's coming into the league, and just an inch less than Calvin Johnson's. He did 6 more reps on the bench press than this year's #1 draft pick, OT Eric Fisher, despite Fisher having 53 pounds on him.

In other words, Vernon Davis should never be used as a basis of comparison for anyone, ever. He's a freak among freaks, multiple standard deviations above even the NFL norm. It's like comparing a receiver to Calvin or a DE to Peppers- of course you're going to come away unimpressed by the other guy's athleticism.

 
Yes preseason stats are overrated and blah blah blah

Still, 8 catches on 8 targets for JT. 5 of those with Peyton. Denver's leader in targets and catches.

any insight Denver homers? Is it JT's job to lose?

 
Yes preseason stats are overrated and blah blah blah

Still, 8 catches on 8 targets for JT. 5 of those with Peyton. Denver's leader in targets and catches.

any insight Denver homers? Is it JT's job to lose?
Looking good but I'd like to see how the playing time will be divided up when Dreesen and Tamme are healthy.

 
traded Polk and Bryce Brown to the McCoy owner for this guy. I see him starting and playing well while destroying safeties or LB's in single coverage.

Dressen and Tamme should not pose a threat IMO as long as Julius can show adequate blocking in the run game

 
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traded Polk and Bryce Brown to the McCoy owner for this guy. I see him starting and playing well while destroying safeties or LB's in single coverage.

Dressen and Tamme should not pose a threat IMO as long as Julius can show adequate blocking in the run game
I love Thomas, but that was a bold move. TE premium league I assume?
nope, but it might as well be. Couldn't get a TE from anyone after Pitta & the Dickson's injury then when Ausberry went down I wanted to make sure I had.a TE2. I have confidence in Julius. I also realize that both Pollard & Clark had value during indy's glory days
 
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Denver homers are projecting a Jimmy Graham type breakout.
???haven't seen this from Bronco fans or media members this year
Me neither. Im not calling you out, i would like the source if you have one however. With wlker banged up, i have a serious gut feeling his adp is going to rise after the 3rd preseason game
You can basically find homers excited about any player somewhere on the internet.

A quick visit to the broncos message board shows posts like

"And people think Antonio Gates is/was hard to stop. Just wait..."

" Seems like he could be in for a Jimmy Graham type breakout season."

 
Yes preseason stats are overrated and blah blah blah

Still, 8 catches on 8 targets for JT. 5 of those with Peyton. Denver's leader in targets and catches.

any insight Denver homers? Is it JT's job to lose?
Looking good but I'd like to see how the playing time will be divided up when Dreesen and Tamme are healthy.
Both of those guys are in the "just a guy" category. Dreesen will be entering his 8th year in the league, and his peak season was in 2010 with 36 catches for 556 yards. Tamme is similar, just younger. Topped out in Indy a couple of years ago with 67 catches for 631.

I think the only guy in Thomas's way at TE is Thomas. And he seems to be getting out of his own way quite well.

 
I still think at this point Thomas is preseason hype that will become more of an afterthought in the regular season. Welker, Decker, and DThomas will play all the time instead of only a few snaps in the preseason. Tamme and Dreessen will be back instead of sitting things out in the preseason. And JThomas will become a part timer in a TEBC . . . which will be an afterthought position in the DEN offense anyway after the Big 3 receivers. I've already showed that in IND that typically resulted in so-so fantasy production, ESPECIALLY when split among multiple players.

 
I still think at this point Thomas is preseason hype that will become more of an afterthought in the regular season. Welker, Decker, and DThomas will play all the time instead of only a few snaps in the preseason. Tamme and Dreessen will be back instead of sitting things out in the preseason. And JThomas will become a part timer in a TEBC . . . which will be an afterthought position in the DEN offense anyway after the Big 3 receivers. I've already showed that in IND that typically resulted in so-so fantasy production, ESPECIALLY when split among multiple players.
This is my concern. I have JThomas in a dynasty and have to decide in the next couple of weeks how big a contract to give him on my team that is having possible contract issues. I think it will take a WR leaving town to make JThomas a dependable fantasy asset... and that may not happen until Welker's 2 year contract is up. I don't think I can let him sit on my bench soaking up contract space until then... but I hate to give up talent to other teams.

 
It should be noted that JT was on the field for every snap Manning was in on, and once again led all receivers in catches and yards (plus one fumble). he is getting all of the first team reps in both 11 and 12 personnel.

 
Yes preseason stats are overrated and blah blah blah

Still, 8 catches on 8 targets for JT. 5 of those with Peyton. Denver's leader in targets and catches.

any insight Denver homers? Is it JT's job to lose?
Looking good but I'd like to see how the playing time will be divided up when Dreesen and Tamme are healthy.
I think the only guy in Thomas's way at TE is Thomas. And he seems to be getting out of his own way quite well.
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PS: Clifford also has the best avatar in the history of earth.

 

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